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What if your company culture wasn’t just an HR buzzword but the secret weapon to scaling your business?
Welcome to Kan Talk Kulture, the podcast that dives deep into how remarkable company cultures are intentionally built and how they can transform your team, your business, and your bottom line.
Hosted by Kylie Anne Neal, founder of Kan Kulture and a passionate expert in people, culture, and leadership, this show is designed for business owners, CEOs, HR professionals, and anyone who believes that empowered people are the key to long-term success.
Each episode features real conversations with inspiring CEOs, business leaders, and culture champions who share how they’ve shaped their team environments alongside case studies, practical tips, and bold questions that challenge the status quo.
Whether you're looking to boost employee engagement, create a high-performance team, or align your people with your vision, this podcast will help you connect the dots between culture and growth.
At Kan Kulture, we believe in Kindness, Understanding, Learning, Trust, Uniqueness, Respect, and Evolving, and this podcast brings those values to life.
If you're ready to turn your team into your biggest brand ambassadors and create a workplace people love, this is the podcast for you.
Find out more at www.kankulture.com
Hi, I'm Kylie Anne Neal, founder of Kan Kulture and welcome to Kan Talk Kulture In this podcast, I sit down with some of Australia's most progressive founders and CEOs to explore the heart of their company cultures. What drives them, what they value, and what it's really like to work for the companies they lead.
You'll also find occasional episodes packed with practical HR insights to help you build safer, stronger, and more trusted workplaces. So whether you're a new team member, getting to know your workplace, curious about. Creating remarkable company cultures or just wanting to know more about implementing HR best practice.
You are in the right place. Let's dive in.
Welcome to today's episode of Kan Talk Kulture My name's Kylie Neal. I'm your host, and today joining me is Nathan Wrobel of Shark Group. Welcome, Nathan. Thanks Kyl. Thanks for having me. Thank you. It's an absolute pleasure to have you here today. So Nathan, as a young adult, went through a few different roles.
There was retail, hospitality, fitness, and property management. Um, spent some time in the UK as I think, um, a lot of us did back in those days. Maybe not so much anymore, but great opportunity to be able to live abroad for a few years. And when he returned, he got into insurance, Brok. That's right. So after a few years in insurance broking, Nathan did what all entrepreneurs do and actually went into business, had a business called Acquire Insurance Brokers, did that for a few years, and then started Shark Plumbing in 2021 and sold the insurance broking business in 2022.
Nathan, you have always been your whole life a sports fan. You've played a lot of sport. You've done a lot of sport, and in your Clifton strength profile that we recently did, your main strength was competitiveness. All of those, those are the ingredients that you have bought with you to how you build the foundations of Shark Plumbing.
Can you talk us through the transition from your sports mind and your competitive nature and how that translates into the culture at Shark?
Yeah. I've always been competitive as far back as I can remember, very sporty as well. Um, played soccer all my life. Um. I, I always wanted to be a professional athlete.
That was my goal. I remember, um, every time I'd take a wish chip, you know, the chips that fold over and touch each other, I'd eat a wish chip and wish to be a professional athlete when I grow up. And I, I probably still do that now just outta habit, but, so businesses become sort of like my professional athlete, athlete, you know, professional at business.
Yes. So, um, I, I try and make shark. Like a team, like a sports team as much as I can. Um, we've created the leaderboard that gets sent to the entire team that comes out daily and it tracks their daily performance, their weekly performance, monthly and annual performance. There's about 15 metrics that they're tracked on, um, which drives a little bit of competition, friendly competition within the team.
Yep.
Um, we also give out plenty of awards, so we do a monthly big dog award. Um, we do an annual expert of the year award. We do monthly recognition, recognition at toolbox meetings for everyone that's had outstanding performance. Yeah, we have a group chat going where, um, good reviews are shared with the team.
Um, we, um, the, the competitiveness sort of, I guess it probably comes from me, some, some of the people in the team. Organically are probably attracted to that. So we probably attract people that have that similar sort of mindset.
Yep.
Um, but we all get all types, um, especially in the office, um, but also in the field.
Yeah. Fantastic. And when I hear about that with the leaderboard and the initiatives that you have within the team, it really does say, if we look at it from a culture perspective, trust and clarity are two of the biggest things that. Uh, enable successful growth in a business. And for you being so transparent around the metrics and where people are at, it really provides that clarity.
Everybody knows where they stand, and that in effect, uh, creates the trust. Do you see that in the team and the, did the team. Need to ask questions about where they stand or what they do at Shark Plumbing.
Yeah, I've always done it that way. Just being completely transparent. I mean, I've had other people.
Say that they probably wouldn't take that approach, but it seems to have worked out for me.
Yep.
I just feel like pulling the curtain back and letting everyone in is, is the best way to get buy in, um, and get everyone sort of accountable and responsible and have some sort of. Ownership over that direction that we're going and have the same vision.
And you know, you give people a little bit of responsibility and usually they do the right thing.
Yeah. Amazing. And if we bring in that this competitiveness, like if we look at it from when we did your debrief for the Clifton's strengths profile, we identified that being competitive, it is about being number one, but it's not at detriment to everybody else.
It, it does come down to that. Personal energy and that personal motivation that you are determined to be the best that you can possibly be, and for that to have external results. Mm-hmm. So I think that is, and if you are, if you are able to, it might not be everybody's cup of tea to be in an environment like that, and you know, as you've said, you've had people go, that's not really the right way to do it because it might create dysfunctional behaviors within the team.
But because you have that. Purpose and passion and competitiveness yourself, it really is those behaviors that lead from the top. So you enable that really authentically in your business.
Yeah, I think it shows in our values as well. Um, one of our core values is get a little bit better each day.
Yeah.
So everyone that comes into the company, we make sure that they have a growth mindset.
Yeah, over a fixed mindset. Um, and it's reinforced every month through awards and incentives, and everyone recognizes people based on representing the values of the company.
Yep.
So plays a huge part.
Yep. Fantastic. So let's talk about the transition from insurance broking. To a plumbing business. Mm. Yeah.
They're quite different. They are, they are quite different. We'll, we'll, we'll get into what some of the transferable skills may have been. Yeah. But just talk us through how did that actually happen?
Yeah, it happened, um, I was building a house at the time. Um, I, that process is quite stressful and I was finding it hard to get good.
Communication from the trades. Mm. And just, you know, the emails would take a week for them to come back to you or you'd have to follow up the emails or no response to texts or missed calls not returning them. Um, so I just thought. Gee, wouldn't this be a good business to run and take the customer service that I've learned from insurance broking into the construction industry?
Yes. Um, so I, I had that thought and I, I was thinking it for maybe a month or two. It was pretty fresh in my mind. And then my business partner, Brad, um, he came into, who's also my best friend from high school. He came into the office after work one day. We were having a few beers in the office. He was just complaining about his boss and, um, about how he's disrespected and, you know, he's just not a good guy.
Um, and he wanted to go out on his own. And I thought, well, why don't we start a plumbing business together? You can manage the field staff. I'll manage the office staff and the business side. Yeah. Um, and we can implement this. Customer service that I wanted to implement and we can treat our plumbers with respect.
Yes. And sort of create something new with both of those, um, goals that we had in mind. Um, so we did it, we started the business and then it just took off. It, it, it went gang buses.
Amazing. And to do that, um, and I dunno if you looked at it through this lens when you were doing it, but it's actually quite.
Brave to start a business when you, the product that you're dealing with, you are not too. Familiar or competent in, yeah. I dunno what your plumbing skills are like, but it wa it's not your background.
Yeah. They're not great. No. Um, it was tough. Yeah. I, I thought probably that that confidence thing came into a detriment a little bit.
You know, it's kind of like, uh, yeah, I can do it, that it'll be easy. So there was a lot of learning curves and yes, there was a lot of failures, but, um, I like to, you know, just. Have a relentless solution focus, you know? So, yeah. You know, you make a mistake, you change the process, you fix it to ensure it doesn't happen again and move on to the next one.
You fail fast.
Yeah.
That's the way to grow.
Yeah.
Um, so I think having that mindset was a positive and. It's been four and a half years now. I have learned a lot about plumbing and um, and trades in, in general, but definitely not as much as, you know, the people around me. So, yep. You know, we just hire experts.
Yes. That's why we call all our plumbers out in the field. Experts. Yep. Um, we recently brought in Troy, who was our head plumber into the office as our operations manager, and we only did that probably six months ago, but we should have done it a lot sooner because. That's been a game changer. Yeah. You know, when someone calls the office, they've got a question about plumbing.
Everyone in our office aren't plumbers. Yeah. They're, um, you know, the scheduler, the operations manager, all sorts of general manager myself, BDM, not plumbers. Yeah. So, um, having Troy come in and having that, um, expertise in the service that we're actually offering. Yeah. It was a massive help.
Yeah. Yep. And I've worked with a few trades businesses before and there often is a real disconnect between the office staff.
Mm. In the Ivory Castle sitting behind their computers and the field staff. How, what do you do at Shark that breaks down those barriers?
Yeah, I did find that tough. Yeah. To, to keep, um, to sort of maintain that one company culture. Yes. When there clearly is two divisions. Yes. There's the field staff who. Go to their first job from home and then go home after their last job.
There's no central place where they're, they're meeting the office staff are getting together every day. I'm close to them. It's very easy to implement that culture or sort of promote that culture when you're seeing and speaking to people every day. Yeah. But the field staff, it's a little bit different.
So we do. We do try and go above and beyond to, to meet our purpose of being the best place to work. Yeah. That obviously includes, or is a big part, the field staff. So we do a lot of incentives. We do a lot of social events. We make sure that we get together on a monthly basis even though we've got a large service area.
We'll pick a spot that's central and we'll mix it up each time and make sure we all get together.
Yeah. Fantastic. And you have, uh, quite a. Entrepreneurial mind, I would say, you know, and I feel that that would really serve you well in your business and the way that you show up for the team every day when you strip back what your, what your skills are from a business perspective and what your strengths are.
Mm-hmm. What, what are the most. Important things. If you talk about, not the values of the business, but you talk about your own personal values, what's important to you that enables you to get out of bed and show up every day for your business? Yeah,
definitely that growth mindset, so getting a little bit better each day.
That's a hundred percent. I think that's one of the. You know, key drivers in life is to have that purpose to get better each day. We're always learning, we're always getting better. It never stops. Yeah. Um, I've also been lucky that I'm quite an optimistic person. My favorite saying is, everything always works out.
I even got shirts made up with that logo on it, so that, but that just came naturally to me. So everything that. Happens to me, whether it was a good result or not. I look at it as if it was a good result. Always see the positive in it. Yeah. Um, I also have a, um, a high risk tolerance, so that has helped me hugely to have massive wins and help with, um, rapid growth.
Yes. There's also been failures along the way. Yes. Like I remember when we first started the business about. Two years in, um, we took on a, a big civil project, which was a little bit of, out of our wheelhouse, but my motto was, try everything, see where, what fits, see what we're good at, and then lean into that.
So this was along that process of trying to figure out what our strategy was gonna be. Mm-hmm. We took on this massive project, um, it was a half a million dollar contract. Um, we didn't have the expertise in the team to deliver on it or even to quote it, so I went. Outsourced that to went to a third party to get a professional estimator to estimate it up, it ended up costing us about 950,000.
Wow. So we took almost a half a million dollar loss on that.
Wow.
So that was a hugely stressful time. Um, I had to front up the money personally, so that was very stressful time. And the period of actually managing that project when I have no experience in plumbing
yes,
was huge. And I didn't have the support at that time within the team to, um, to take the ownership of that.
So that was, I was in the deep end trying to figure that out.
Yep.
But again, at the end of that, I think that everything always works out. Mentality kicked in and I said, okay, well this is a positive. Now we've learned that that's not the area that we're going to go into and we are gonna focus 100% on real estate.
Yeah. Property managers.
Yeah. So that, that learning, 'cause that's a pretty, um. Expensive lesson to learn and, you know, expensive lessons like that would affect you personally as well as professionally. Mm-hmm. But your ethos when you got through that was, will take the learnings. Did it, did it impact your.
Risk aversion from that point.
Yeah. Not really enough. That's well done. It's crazy, isn't it? Well done. That's what I was wanting to hear. It probably should have, but um, I guess we've never been in a position since there where there was so much writing on it. Yeah. Because of the work that we do now, our, um, average job value, if you.
Talk, the smaller maintenance stuff is about $300. Yep. If you took all of the jobs that we do altogether over the 1200 jobs we do per month, it's a $500 average. Wow. So, um, you know, any one customer, the maximum we might be dealing with is 20,000 in income per month. So there's not. In our debtors, you know, it's a quite a nice spread.
Yeah. Like our, our biggest client only makes up 8% of our turnover.
Yep. Beautiful. Beautiful. And has that, you know, that's obviously been something that has grown kind of incrementally over the last four and a half years to get where it's was, was that purposeful to keep that at, you know, the smaller jobs of more of them rather than.
Going for the big jobs.
Well, that is just the nature of the work. So the strategy around property managers was created because we were good at it. Yeah. So that customer experience background that I had. Yes. And the focus on customer service and communication. Property managers love it. Yeah. They just, they just want more communication and they want things done quickly.
Yes.
So, um, that. That gives a huge competitive edge over all our competitors. Mm. So I saw that because we were bringing on so many new customers, so many new agencies, work orders were flowing in. So I just thought, let's lean into this and become the property manager's tradie and just be the specialized, um.
Trades group.
Yeah.
For property managers.
Yeah.
Um, and just the nature of the work, they tend to be smaller jobs. You know, you've got a, a leaking toilet, you've got, um, you know, a light not working, no hot water, um, blocked drain, things of that nature. They're, they're pretty low cost to complete, but in saying that.
The odd, larger job does come up where, um, you know, we'll put a camera down the pipe, find that tree roots have infiltrated the pipe system and we need to get the excavator in, dig that up and repair the entire drainage. Mm-hmm. So, um, you know, those jobs are large value. They could be, you know, between three and $10,000.
Um, so that. Does bump up our average job value.
Yep.
Um, but out of those 1200 jobs, if you look at our top 10 services, they make up about 70% of our turnover. Yeah. And they're, that's top 10 services by volume. Yeah. So mix of tap replacements, tap services, toilet services.
Yep. And if you think about that high risk mindset, how have you found that?
That's been really helpful to encourage that. In your team members.
Mm-hmm.
And have you had experiences where team members have maybe made an error or made a mistake and you've been able to really step in and give them the confidence that the stakes are okay? 'cause there is a high risk, you win some, you lose some.
Yeah, a hundred percent. Um, but I'm always trying to promote. Ideas from the team because that, that is, even though that is one of my strengths is creating, you know, coming up with ideas, um, it does become a burden when you are the only one in the company Yes. Of 37 people that are coming up with ideas.
Yes. So I have to try and promote that to everyone. So anytime someone comes to me with an idea. Most of the time we'll give it a try. Yeah. And I'll get them to be accountable for it, implement it, give feedback to the team. Um, or if I decide that it's not appropriate, it's just away from our vision or our strategy or our values.
Yes. Then give them reasons why, you know, don't just sort of take the idea and, and leave it at that, because then they'll be less enticed to give you an idea next time.
Yeah.
So I think it's really important. Um, and we need to. You know, the more ideas coming from within the team and the more that they take ownership and accountability over the strategy.
Yep. The better that we're we're gonna be. Because as you scale, I can't be the one that scales every idea.
Yes, yes. And let's talk about scaling. Mm-hmm. Because you are now shark group mm-hmm. Rather than just shark plumbing. Talk us through what your. Strategy is and where you're looking for growth at Shark?
Sure. So just recently, um, started the renovations division three months ago and, um, we're starting an electrical division next week. Um, so now we'll be able to serve all of our property managers on a wider range of services. So, um, the growth strategy. Was we expanded quite rapidly geographically. So we went from, we go from Pottsville up to Caboolture, out to Ipswich, and we sort of had that service area from about two years in, which was hard to maintain because it's such a wide service area.
You need so many experts in those locations because if you get a job that's two hours away, um, and the closest plumber is an hour away, it, it really affects the efficiency. Yeah. So. We had to expand that quickly because we had the opportunities and we didn't wanna let them go. 'cause we took it. We brought on an agency that might be in Brisbane, but they had properties in North Brisbane, but they wanted to do everything.
So our mindset was just take it on board. But that sort of, we, we found that having such a wide service area was hard to keep that culture. Mm-hmm. You know, of getting everyone together and everything just became harder. So I decided that I wanted to sort of keep that service area. Um, but expand through different surfaces.
So we've got 150 agencies currently. We feel that in that service area will probably cap out at about 500. Um, so eventually if we just kept with the plumbing, we would. Reach a ceiling. Yep. So now with these different divisions, we can see the kind of growth that we are looking at in the plumbing within these other divisions because the electrical is probably about the same size as the plumbing from a property manager's perspective.
Um, and renovations. There's less work orders, but they're larger job values. Yeah. So the strategy is now to, um, to those 150 agencies show a really good service on the plumbing side. We've just hired a BDM to go out and promote that we've got these new divisions and sign them up to start setting some work orders for the different divisions.
Yeah. Amazing.
So the, the five year goal is, um, we're currently at 8 million turnover. We want to get to 50 million turnover in five years. Wow.
Fantastic. Fantastic. That's, that's a pretty aggressive strategy. Well, it's, it's well done. Well done. Yeah, well done. And I think from a trades industry perspective, you know, customer service is something that seems so simple, but it's not because it's not easy to translate that to trades based, uh, workers who don't.
It's not, I don't think it's that they understand, but they don't necessarily have the background or, or the training to have the customer service front of mind. So what do you do at Shark that's, you think different to your competitors? If you look at that customer service lens?
Yeah. Getting the right people on board was tougher than I anticipated.
Mm.
Um, and I. I found earlier on that it was probably the major bottleneck that we would have for growth. Yeah. Is finding good tradespeople. Yeah. Um, that represented the values that we have. Yes. So that's been a huge focus. Like our, our company purpose is to be the best place to work so that we can attract and retain the best people.
And all of our social media is all around. Trying to showcase that purpose. So, um, we are trying to build a reputation of, you know, you come work here and you know it's the best place that you've ever worked. So that has helped us because. We've found with that recruitment process, we're getting better quality candidates.
Amazing.
And we've also dialed in the recruitment process in, in the way of how we're choosing because sometimes you don't get it right. And if they're not a good culture fit Yes. Or they don't have the service standards that we're looking for
Yes.
Then it can cause reputational damage. Yes. And that's, um, it's just a too higher cost.
Yeah. So now, yeah. With the scale that we are looking at, we constantly have to be recruiting and onboarding and promoting our values.
Fantastic. And it does add that complexity of you've got your values that are, um, struck such a strong set internally, but you've got a field, you've got field team that don't come to the office every day.
So being able to instill those values in people that are out on the field makes it. A lot harder than somebody that you work past that you can have, that you can almost give that energy to, you know, just by your, your, your presence and you know, the value that you bring to the organization if everyone's living them authentically in the same space.
But if the guys are out in the field. On their own, perhaps all day, all day, every day, but still living those values. Mm-hmm. It is a pretty, it is a pretty complex thing to, um, to address. And, you know, I would think from a managing performance, you've got all the leaderboards and everything in play that's really, really transparent.
But also, um, sometimes being able to make the call and have those tricky conversations if people are not working out. Mm-hmm.
Yeah, definitely. Um, you know, we, we never wanna let someone go, but if they're not meeting the company values, like if they got a complaint from a property manager, for example, that.
You know, it was something that we couldn't overcome then they wouldn't pass their probation period. Yeah. So we've created an environment where people want to come work. Yes. But also we have standards that we have to uphold. So if they're not meeting those standards, it's um, too much damage within the culture if, if the A players see that we're bending the rules for C players or D players.
Yes. Yeah. Um. It's, it's way too detrimental. And you Absolutely. It took me a while to learn that too. Yeah. 'cause I didn't want to, firing people sucks. Like Yeah. I don't want to do that.
Yeah.
Yeah. And having difficult conversations is not my strength.
Yep.
But I'm fortunate now that I've built the company to a size where I've got a leadership team underneath me.
So that delegation can happen now to someone who is more suited. We've got a HR person, for example, so. Um, I don't have to be the one that does that. I just sort of say, okay, well if you think, you know, I just approve it. Yeah. So, yeah.
Yeah. And it is the tricky thing, but if you've got high standards and you wanna have high standards in your business and it is, you know, just to get bit HR for the moment, it is the other side where.
It's sometimes not the impact of the person that you have to have those conversations with. It's the impact of the team around them and the tolerances mm-hmm. That they're seeing, which really impact those standards that you're upholding.
A hundred percent. Yeah. If they see that we are allowing this.
Subpar person to participate in this awesome team that we've created. Yeah. What message is that sending to the rest of the team? Yeah, it's, um, it, it can kill a business pretty quickly.
Yeah. Yeah. Fantastic. And what, what keeps you up at night?
I do find it hard to get to sleep at night, but that's mainly because I'm just thinking of ideas about business.
So I'm really trying to break that habit at the moment. But, um, they're not bad things. Like they're, they're ideas of how we can improve and like I, I love. Work and the business. I just love going to work like it's my favorite thing to do. Amazing. I get sometimes at night I can't sleep because I'm excited to wake up the next morning to go to work.
Yeah. Sounds wack. But that's, that's, yeah. You know, that's,
that's that true entrepreneurial mindset that I was talking about before. And you do, you, you do have this, uh, you have this presence about you that is very strong, very confident, and that you are a thousand percent. In your business and when I, when I came in and, and, uh, met with you and spoke with the team members as well, it's just so evident throughout the business that there is this energy where the team wanna show up where they're not there because they have to, like, their contribution is discretionary because of the things that you've got that foundational growth and you've got those building blocks and everyone is very obviously in it together.
Yep. I don't think we've got anyone in the team that just rocks up for a paycheck. No. Just a nine to five gig. It's not, it's not like that in our office. Yeah. Or in the field. It's, um, everyone wants to win and like, give great service. Liket our head scheduler. She'll often, if she has. Let a tenant down or let a PM down, she'll show it emotionally.
She'll cry in the office, which obviously I don't want, but it shows how much passion that she has for it and how, how much dedication she's got to giving a good service. Yeah, so I don't know. How we got lucky in, in doing that. But something's working If we are attracting those kind of people.
Yes, yes, yes.
Well, I think people do. Uh, it's like a magnet to the energy that's already in there and you know, the right people will, um, the right people will opt in. The not right. People will opt out. Yeah. You know, it's the way that the words that are written in a job ad or the experience that they get when they speak to somebody about the job opportunity, like it is all those, um, things that are be, that are behind the words, that it's that energy and that vibe that does magnet the right people to a business.
So a hundred
percent. Yeah. And we do that with, um, so we, you know, recruiting the right people, it's a tough gig because. Um, the market is tough in any industry. Yes. But with trades especially. Yes. Um, so attracting those right people. Is difficult. And even if you put a job ad up on Seek, for example, and you get inquiries, they're probably inquiring for other jobs or replying for other jobs and that other company is on the phone within a minute saying You've got the job.
Yes. So unseen. Yes. 'cause they just need bodies. So I had to deal with that, which was, I always almost had to trade it like a sales gig where you're trying to track the applicant. The shortlisted applicant to interview success rate, you know, and you want that to be around 75%. Otherwise, all these missed opportunities that are, are going by the wayside.
So I created a, um, expert candidate presentation and that just show showcases all of our company values. Mm-hmm. Um, our services, our rates, our incentives, our culture, everything that they need to know about the business to get like an idea about us. So. As soon as I get that application, I send it to them and let them know that they, I've sent that across, say, put it back on them.
Hey, do you want to have a look through this presentation? Let me know if you think it's a good fit and if so, let's set up an interview. And then it changes the power dynamic. Fantastic. 'cause they're saying, oh wow, I really want to work for this company now rather than, well, I could work for anyone.
Yes.
Yes. And you, you're giving them, you are putting it back in their court. So they're coming, they're not just like scrolling through, going, tick, tick, apply, apply. You're actually getting their attention.
Yes. And because we want to try and find the right person. We created a, an application form that has a lot of questions on there just so we can get to the bottom of, is this person gonna actually work out?
But no one's gonna fill out an application form if you just, if they apply on Seek Yes. And you send an application form, they're just gonna go, oh, I'll go with the guy where I don't have to fill out an application form. Yes. Yeah. So at least with this process, we've got their buy-in, they're keen now they're willing to fill out an application form 'cause they have to if you want the gig.
Yep. Yep. Fantastic. Fantastic. And. From a team perspective. So how many team members do you have at the moment?
About 37 total.
37. What's, what's the plans for your, for your growth? You've obviously got very aggressive growth targets from a revenue perspective. Yep. What does that look like on the people side?
200 people. Wow. Five years time. So that'll be Wow. Um. A team of 200 for 50 million turnover in five years time. So if we look at that, I mean, that's daunting if you, if you think those big numbers, but if you lay it out over each year and how many we have to progress. Yeah. You know, and we've got a system now where we're hiring at least two people per month.
So we will just keep that going.
Yep.
And constantly be hiring.
Yeah.
Um. Because we cannot drop the ball on service. And if we are all over capacity yeah, then it, it's definitely gonna be happening. And our ratio at the moment is 20 field staff to 17 office staff. And over time, as we scale. I am, I'm seeing that coming down.
Um, because we're so service driven at the moment. We need those office staff to be able to deliver, but we're working heavily on the automation side,
right? So we're
building these automations in the backend that's allowing us to scale without having to put the office staff members in those positions.
Fantastic. So the people that we have on board at the moment, we can free up their time and they can focus on. Problem solving.
Yep.
And one-on-one customer service with the property managers. Yep.
Fantastic. So you're staying ahead of the, the tech. The tech on the tech side? Yeah. Well, we've
got a few things in the work, some that are already built.
We've got, um, our automated work order upload, so. That's, you know, in the past it was a heavily data entry type manual process where the property manager would send a work order across to our work orders email. Someone would upload that, um, work order to our service mate and then copy and paste all of the data across to that, create a job card, then reach out to a tenant to book it in via text and phone call.
So now all of those are automated, the work order fantastic. Populates the job. Card populates. Yep. Then we've got a, um. AI text bot that automatically triggers a text message conversation with the tenant to book in the job and has the back and forth with no human, um, involvement in that process. And we're now working on the AI voice agent, which will, if the, if they're not replying to text, we'll make a phone call and have an AI conversation to book out.
Book that. And you know, the ones I've heard that have called me for sales calls, they're not. They're not great, but we've got a really good automation team, so I'm hoping that Yeah. Ours can be to a standard that's, um, appropriate.
Yeah.
And declare that it is an AI chat bot we're just looking to book your job in.
Yes. And if, if we could reduce those number of phone calls, we're, we're doing 25,000 a year at the moment. Yeah. So if we can reduce those by 50%
Yep.
That's a massive. Time saver.
Yep.
For our office staff.
Yeah. Fantastic. It does create a real efficiency for a business like yours.
Mm-hmm.
And from a so growth to 200 plus employees in five years time, it's big.
Mm-hmm.
From a culture perspective, if you know you've got a manageable. Culture at the moment. And with that I say you as the leader, the energy that you give to the office, the energy that they all give to each other as the, as the employee base scales up and the number of people increase, the ability to refine what culture means gets more and more important.
What's your biggest concern about culture as it grows?
Yeah. I mean that is gonna be one of the challenges. I mean, what is it? Is it Dunbar's law that people can only remember 150 people in their circle, their inner circle? So if we get to a size of 200 employees, what's that gonna mean? Like, some people don't even know who they're working with.
Yeah. That's pretty crazy to think. So, um, automation's gonna play a huge part in that. So we can keep the numbers down Yeah. As we scale.
Yeah.
But. We, we can't automate the experts in the field. Yeah. That, that, that we need expert plumbers, we need expert electricians. We need expert tilers and builders. Um, that's just the nature of the work that we're in.
Yeah.
Um. But you know, we have these things in place that I think can scale, like the leaderboard, can scale, the group chats can scale the toolbox meetings. We'll continue to host them in one venue, have all the team together. We just finished our first, um, annual shark conference. Oh, fantastic. Fantastic. We went to Tangaloo, so there was 30 of us that went to that.
And we're gonna make that an annual thing and get bigger and better. We wanna do the Philippines. Uh, there's thoughts of a cruise ship. Something of that nature. So that's gonna happen on an annual basis. And the social events, they won't stop.
Yep. Yep. So do, and social events are really, really important.
You know, it's not necessarily about having yoga classes and stuff these days, but that human connection is really, really important. So, you know, as you scale. Keeping a hold of that and being able to, from a values perspective, being able to really be able to articulate and explain what the values are, what they mean to someone coming on board when they are, when there are like different levels in the organization.
And it's kind of, you know, the bandwidth of you becomes smaller and smaller, and the leadership team being really cohesive to live the values so that they can cascade. Cascade down. It's, um, I look forward to hearing where it goes, gets to, because it's gonna be a completely different beast in five years time.
Yeah. And that leadership team, that's a, that's a massive part. Yeah. Like that was. A huge game changer for me. It was probably about three years in where, um, I was, I was waking up at 3 45 each morning because I was doing so many roles within the company. I would, yeah, get up early so I could still do my ice bath and get my workout in, but then do two hours of sending invoices each morning and then go into the office, do the normal day job, and then try and come home and be.
My best self for my kids and my wife.
Yes.
So it was a huge stress. Yes. At that point it was because I didn't have a management team underneath me, so I just made the decision that I have to hire a couple of key staff members. Yes. And I hired, um, uh, my best friend Ryan, who was living overseas. Um, he was a helicopter pilot.
Very smart guy. Someone I trusted that I knew I could bring in and. Helped me out with strategy and taking over things that I didn't want to give up. Mm. Because I didn't want to lose that role, or I didn't trust anyone enough to give it up.
Mm-hmm. So
I needed to find someone that fit well.
Mm-hmm.
And then I also, at the same time, brought on INE, who was one of my first employees at Acquire.
So had been with me for many years and when I sold the business, she had moved on to a different insurance brokerage. Then one day I sort of, I reached out to her because I was like, geez, that she would be so perfect because she knows me inside out. She was my right hand woman. She does all the, you know, automations, all the services.
Um. Builds all the processes within the, in the team. Uh, and I texted her one day and, um, she, she was also thinking about me at the same time, and it just worked out. We caught up for a coffee and we, and she joined on. So that was a, a massive help as well.
Yeah. Fantastic. So when you bring people into the team, and that's, you know, it kind of comes kind of full circle to what we were talking about at the start.
You and a plumber, Geraldine's come in. She wasn't a plumber. And, uh, you've got a helicopter pilot Yeah. Coming in because you knew that that was a good fit for your business. And the plumbing is the product of, um, and you, you have had such great success over the last four and a half years and such Great success to come.
Okay, Nathan, last question. So you mentioned before that you do an ice bath every morning. Mm-hmm. Um, what temperature is your ice bath?
Three degrees Celsius
every morning. Yes. How long do you go in the ice bath for? Two minutes. Two minutes every morning at three degrees. Mm-hmm. Rain, hail, or shine.
That's right.
Yes. It's a lot harder in winter Yeah. Than it is in summer. Yeah. Found at the moment, even though it's still a struggle. Yeah. Um, when the sun is up and it's hot. Yeah. It's, it's way easier Yeah. Than when it's cold and. Dark.
Yeah.
Sitting in three degrees of water when it's dark is just not right.
Yeah. And I'd say your, your morning routine, does that, does that help you from a mental health capacity?
Mm-hmm. To be able to manage all those thoughts and Yeah. Innovative ideas and that growth mindset and that entrepreneurial mindset that just keeps
ticking, tick, ticking over. Yeah. I've worked out that I need a lot of energy because in the past I would. Get a, become quite lethargic in the afternoon, you know, after lunch, maybe two o'clock, something like that.
And you waste a lot of your time there. So, um, doing things like working out in the morning, having a nice bath just gives you that energy and consistency so. And I just love routine as well. Mm-hmm. Like doing the same thing each morning Yeah. Than before going into the office. Yeah. It just puts you in the right mind frame.
Yeah. I just got back from Fiji, which was great, but then you're outta routine, so it's kind of like, you know, as much as you're relaxing, you sort of feel a bit sluggish and you're eating like shit and you're feeling a bit bloated.
Yep.
Um, so I like that structure. Yeah. Around having a routine.
Yeah. Yeah.
Thank you. And thank you for joining me today.
Thanks for having me. It's
great. Yeah, yeah. Thank you. And thank you everyone for listening to the Kan Talk Kulture podcast, and we'll see you next time. Thanks for joining me on Kan Talk Kulture I'm Kylie Anne Neal. I hope today's episode gave you a clear review into the values driving your workplace.
All sparked new ideas about building a remarkable company culture. If you're a founder or CEO interested in sharing your culture story, or if you are looking to build a safer, stronger, and more trusted workplace, let's connect. Visit Kan Kulture.com That's KA. K-U-L-T-U-R e.com to learn more. Please hit that subscribe button to hear more real conversations with founders and CEOs and hands-on episodes full of people.
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