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They say when life gives you lemons you should make lemonade. Making lemonade is not always easy or possible. For us, we found ourselves single in our 40's with kids at home and starting life over again. Luckily we found each other, online no doubt. When we began blending families, schedules, traditions, and laundry, we discovered lots of lemons. Our podcast is a reflection on how we get through the hard times and enjoy the good times on our new journey together, all with ten kids in tow. Sometimes when life gives you lemons, you make lemon squares. Lemonade might come later.
Our fabulous
research department
came up with a great topic for this week.
Oh, our research department is so good.
She is wonderful.
Yes. So
are we saying the wrong things
to our kids about the divorce?
I we did yell when I read this article.
I was like, Huh?
Now, doesn't mean like we've
destroyed our kids
irreversibly destroyed our children.
But I think the point of talking about
this is we can do better.
We can help our kids even more.
Like I think we did
the best we could, the best we knew how.
I think we did an okay job.
We can always improve,
but if you're going through this,
you know somebody's going through this.
I think that some of these things that
I researched are would just can just help
your children
get through the divorce
a little bit better.
Well, I'm glad you brought up.
It's not just the parents
that need to be careful what they say.
It's friends of the family.
Grandma and grandpa, aunts and uncles.
It's anyone you know,
These are dumb things you can say to
kids are going through a divorce.
Yes, that makes sense.
Yes, exactly. So.
All right. Should we dive right in?
You want to dive right in?
All right.
Let's let's get right to how we can not
traumatize our children as much.
This first one I find very interesting.
It says your dad or your mom,
That tiny edition of the word
your creates otherness.
Create creates separation of family or.
Yeah. Part of that other group. Yes.
So yes So Theba
so when you say instead of so
obviously when you're married
you say, hey, mom is going to pick you up
today, Dad's going to call you later,
Dad's waiting to talk to you.
A lot of people, once they get divorced,
it is now this your mom and
the kids
will say instead of the kids
saying mom is going to pick me up,
they say, my mom
or my dad is going to pick me up.
So we still do this today.
It's been 12, 12 years.
We still do.
I say you think we do.
I say Mel and go
talk to your mom about that.
Yeah.
Instead of just saying, Madeline,
go talk to Mom about that.
All right?
I Well, isn't that interesting?
We destroyed the seven older kids.
I guess we can fix the last three. Yeah.
Yeah, we'll see.
I don't know.
So, yeah, it just says that divorce
does create changes
in the family dynamic, obviously.
But honoring how the child sees the parent
can help keep a sense of cohesion.
So it's still your mom, It's
still your dad.
But adding this your right.
Hey, what does your mom think about this
instead of what does mom think about that?
Because because you got divorced, it
didn't.
That is still there, Mom.
And that is still there, Dad.
But you're adding something that
you never did before because you got to.
Well,
this goes into another strange thing,
and that is
what do you call your stepmother?
Right.
We had this problem when we first
when we first got married.
Yeah.
Because little tiny David,
he was so young.
He was calling you Mom sometimes.
And sometimes he was just for,
like, in his mind,
like someone that's loving me
and taking care of me is mom.
And so he did say mom for a while,
and that can be super
hurtful to the bio parent for sure.
Like, no, I'm mom, you're not.
And but yet it's hard
to say to a little kid.
They're not they don't you know,
you don't want to think
they're doing something wrong.
So, you know, it's very delicate to go,
hey, so don't call me mom.
But it's that's very tricky.
So we came up with funny things.
They called you Storm.
They called you obviously step mom.
So Storm POM pom Paige and Mom?
Yep. POM. Sometimes
some of the kids still call me POM.
You have one or two too?
Yeah, most of them just call me Page now.
But when they're little,
like we never told them to call me
Mom ever.
It just happened.
And then when that naturally occurred,
it's hard to go to them and say,
You need to stop doing that.
But we did correct it
and but this all goes into that.
I like how they said this.
Your you're emphasizing the
your all that's doing is driving a wedge
even further between the kids in their
and their parents.
Yeah.
And when I say parents I mean both sides.
If you're the one always saying your dad
or your mom,
you're actually alienating your kid
from yourself as well.
Yeah. So anyway, so how to fix that?
Stop saying your just say
mom is going to pick you up today
or dad is going to give you a call later
today.
Get rid of the your asking me hard.
It's going to be really hard.
Yeah, but I can totally see.
I will try it. Yeah. We'll give it a shot.
Yeah, I can see where that's coming from.
All right, next one. Bus situation.
It wasn't that a guy.
Wasn't that a band in the eighties?
The situation. Yeah.
Or some rapper called The Situation
or something.
I don't know.
I don't know.
Well, in this case,
it does not mean that guy or gal
or a group, someone's going to someone's
going to call me or
send me an email and tell me who
the situation was, this situation.
But when you're talking to your friend,
a lot of times
you want to obfuscate the conversation.
When you're talking about the divorce
or the
the child support arrangements
or whatever, anything to do with the new
and the new family dynamics,
whatever the case may be.
When you use obfuscated words
like the situation,
the kids know what you're talking about.
They do.
And the more you are talking in code
right in their mind
and we've talked to our kids about this
when they don't have the full picture,
they think usually they're thinking
something much worse than it really.
They are very creative.
Yeah, it gets very much worse
than what the real situation.
So obviously,
if you're talking with your friend,
maybe beforehand
you should tell your friend,
I don't want to talk about the divorce
and what if my kids are in the room
So just you can do that.
But if it does come up,
you can go ahead and say like,
how are things going with the divorce?
And obviously,
if the kids are in the room, you know,
you should probably say, you know what,
you know, we'll talk about this later.
But yeah, talking in code not good.
And I think it's so funny.
So you haven't really
looked at this right, though?
I had to look up what the word was.
How do you say obfuscate?
Yes, I had to look that up.
Oh, and use the computer to say your.
Yeah.
You're using that
like an everyday term right now.
I had to look it up. So.
Which means that
when you tried to obfuscate,
which means like to hide, hide, conceal.
Right, SEAL.
Yes. So yeah, I had to look that word up.
Well, we use it in computers all the time.
That's the only reason I know it.
Well, another thing
it said interesting here is, don't there
there's ways to explain the divorce
that are not abstract,
something they can understa.
And remember, you're
dealing with children here
and maybe even adolescents or teenagers.
Still, they will
they will take on their own perception
and they'll be very creative.
So be very simple and direct and use
use the word divorce
instead of the situation around the kids.
Otherwise they'll create something new.
Yeah, don't talk in code
and you can explain to them
when you're talking about it,
you can maybe point out like, Oh,
well, you know, these people who you're,
you know and love,
they're divorced, right?
Like, so that they you can point them to
a situation
that is, you know,
they don't think is awful.
They're like, oh, wow,
I didn't know that they recognized. Yes.
That they recognize.
So it's sad
when you're trying to explain divorce,
maybe
try and use someone that they already know
and love. So, yeah.
So no talking in code either.
Don't talk about it in front of them
or use the correct terms, but be
be careful what you say
in front of the children for sure.
Okay.
The next thing that we should not say
that we have said, it's not about you.
What in the world does this mean?
It's not about you?
So like, you know,
why are you guys getting divorced?
You know,
it was something I did. Or was it?
You know, and you say it's not it?
No, no, it's not.
You're not saying that in a mean way
or a bad way. It's not about you.
It's a no, no, no, sweetie.
It's not about you, right?
It's about Dad and I.
They're saying this.
I colleges are saying,
don't do that.
It's not specific enough.
You need to be more specific
on what caused the divorce
just by saying it's not about you.
It's a grown up issue.
Now, I guess what?
The kids are going to go hog wild, crazy
with that one.
Well,
it says like it's it's your instinct,
right, to keep your children
from thinking they're to blame.
So it's instinctive to say, no, no,
it wasn't you.
It says this.
This feels logical, right?
A logical response.
But yes, like you said,
it isn't specific enough to cause the.
Well, then what caused it if it wasn't me?
And you're not telling me exactly,
then it's causing them anxiety. And.
Well, it's interesting because Dr.
Rubinstein said here, I love this.
He says it's not about
you also negates the fact
that the divorce very much involves
the kids.
Isn't that interesting?
Very much involves
the kids, Yeah. Yes. So,
yeah, it can wind up complicating.
Right.
Your children's feelings and experiences
and maybe what
they're willing to share with you. So.
So what do I stay in that?
I mean, you don't want the kid to know
it's their fault
if even if it is, it's
not the kid's fault.
It actually never is the kid's fault.
It says you can exploit.
Like if you don't want to be specific,
if you think maybe they're too young
and not able to handle the actual reasons
why you're getting divorced,
you can explain that
mom and dad aren't getting along
and they don't feel
like they can resolve it.
And you can say that
grownups have adult issues that sometimes
cannot be resolved
even as hard as they might try.
So something like that. So, yeah.
What do you think about that?
I don't know.
You don't like that?
Well, I kind of do, but then it's almost.
Are you giving your kids permission
to just give up when things get hard?
No, no, I don't think so.
Well, because,
I mean, you're kind of saying,
well, Mommy,
mommy and daddy can't get along.
So well
and they don't feel they can resolve it.
So what do you think you should say?
I don't know.
It's not your fault.
That's be You want to go back to that?
I think so. It's just not your fault.
Let's move on. Well,
this is a really hard one.
I mean, when you talk about the divorce,
our younger kids have no idea.
I don't think I have no idea
what why they they are younger kids.
Our younger kids were so young
when we got divorced
that they probably had no concept
of what was really going on.
Our older kids understand what happened
with the divorce, but are younger kids.
I don't think it even clues into them now.
Yeah, this is just been their life.
It's been their life.
So are separate.
So maybe this is for the kids that
went through the divorce that remember
going through that that time.
Yeah.
Yeah. Okay.
So it's a that's a tough one.
That is a tough one.
It's a really tough one.
And maybe it just per different kids.
You say different things
to write different personalities.
You feel like
you can say different things too.
So I would add to that
make sure that you're not throwing
your ex under the bus
when you talk to the kids
about the divorce.
Absolutely not.
That is the wrong thing to do.
All that will actually really do
is alienate you with your own children.
Yeah.
Now, if they're old enough,
you can share some facts with them,
but make sure it's facts and not
your opinion or how you're
feeling or right or your emotions.
So if you want to share some facts,
you can if they're old enough.
But be careful.
Yeah. Be careful to be careful.
So, yeah, it's tough on.
All right.
This next one,
I think is is really horrible.
And I'm glad that they said
don't say this once again.
I think people say this because they're
they're trying to soften the blow.
They're trying to soften the blow.
So this phrase that they say to stop
saying is this is a good thing.
So I think some people say that
because they're like, you know what,
Mommy and daddy
haven't been happy for a long time
and our family hasn't been happy.
And so this is a good thing.
It is not a good thing.
Maybe in the long term
it would be, right? Yes.
And some like maybe if there was abuse, of
course, it's going to be a better thing.
Right.
We're not talking about those situations.
But but in that from the child's
perspective
and I thought this was very interesting
and I truly believe believe this myself,
anyone going through a divorce,
it is a heart wrenching,
horrible thing to go through.
Yeah, it is.
And even if you're leaving
because there's abuse,
you're getting divorced
because there's abuse, that
that's a bad thing that you had
that you had to go through that.
Right.
So from the child's perspective,
in the short term, this
this is devastating for them.
So for you to come and say, oh,
it's a good thing you're actually negating
their feeling of pain that they're having
and you're sweeping it under the rug.
Yes. Right.
When they're like, oh, my gosh,
this is awful.
Oh, no, honey, it's a good thing.
Once again, I know people are saying that
with the good intentions,
but it is sweeping
the pain under the rug, like you're
not allowed to have your feelings,
You're not allowed to be sad.
You're not allowed to come and talk to me.
Because when you come and talk to me
to share, I'm just going to say
it's a good thing.
And mom and dad don't want to hear
what I have to say about this right now.
One thing that one thing
that the article said, they said
almost every child wants their parents
to be together under one roof. Yep.
And that's even with
even if one parent is addicted to drugs,
has anger issues, is abusive,
they have found that most children
still believe in a fairy tale ending,
that somehow things are going to work out
and get better.
Don't you think that's fascinating?
It is.
Don't you remember when we got married
even a year or two after
we got married, Madeline wanted us all.
She would be like, Oh, can we just live
next door to each other and can't we?
Like, she wanted to.
She wanted us to make one big house
and have us all live together
because she hated choosing.
She hated, you know, going back and forth.
She didn't like choosing this parent
for this and that parent for that.
And she,
you know, such a cute little thing.
She was just like, can't we just all live
together and be happy like it was?
Okay, so what do you tell your kids?
What do you tell a kid?
You said, oh, this is a good thing.
You say, don't say that.
You say this is really,
really hard on everyone, this situation.
No, no, not the situation.
Does the divorce See, obviously,
we did not followed these rules at all.
But the divorce, It's
okay to say that the divorce is really,
really hard on everyone in our family.
And Yeah, and we've we've made
these very grown up choices
to divorce as a last resort.
As a last resort,
because we want to try and
make our homes right as happy as possible.
So without fighting
or discord in the house.
And I actually like how they phrased that.
Yeah. Yeah.
So this was our decision
was a last resort.
We know it's super hard.
Please come to me and talk to me
whenever you need to.
I'm here for you.
Share your feelings
and we can talk about how hard it is
right.
And softening blow. Yes. Don't worry.
This is, as you're saying,
is is a good thing.
You'll get double everything
you can throw.
Actually, you can.
You can be like, this isn't about you
and it's also a good thing.
And you're going to get double everything.
You can throw all of them
in at the same time.
That's what people do,
all the wrong things.
And once that well, I've even I've even
I was at a conference
this last week and we were talking
and I said,
Yeah, we've gone through a divorce
and we have a podcast about it,
the whole thing, and go,
Oh, but your kids get double
everything. That even came up.
And I was like, Yeah, they actually do.
And people say that all the time.
And we joke with the kids
sometimes when because the kids,
if they are with us Christmas morning
and then they have to go to their moms,
they're like,
Oh, like we're already exhausted.
We have to do it all over again.
And when they come to our house
on the years
that we're the second house
they're going to, they're like,
We're already tired, like, And we're like,
Oh, poor you.
You have done everything.
Yeah, you have to have another Christmas.
But it, it
and we actually talked about the kids.
We talked this through Christmas
this year, what with the
with the kids and said, you know, I can
see how that would be really, you know.
Yeah. Everyone's like, oh, poor you.
It's not
you think
it's going to be this great thing,
but Christmas, you have Christmas morning
is and open your presents
and you got up early and then you have
breakfast and guess what?
Now you get to go to another house
and do it all over again.
And you have to be just as excited
and just as happy.
And, you know, it's just like Groundhog
Day, right?
You got to do it. Do it over again.
And well, one thing they said,
when you say things like this,
you're minimizing the pain
that they're going through at that time.
Yeah.
And their feelings and their feelings.
So even even this last Christmas
when the kids were like,
yeah, we're kind of tired.
Well, maybe we should change, you said,
Well, you know, stop your complaining.
You get double of everything.
We just negated their feelings again now.
And it's been, you know, 12 years.
So this can happen to families like us
that have been blended for a long time,
that have gone through divorce
for a long time.
You can still make these mistakes.
Yeah, of course. Of course. So
kids,
most kids would rather have two parents
in their house.
Right.
Have your family intact
than to get double everything right.
Like, it's not like kids are like,
Oh, yay. I get double everything.
It's they'd rather have their two parents,
so just be aware of that.
So instead of saying
you'll get double everything,
you can emphasize that they're going
to get more quality time with each parent.
Once again, not sugarcoating everything,
like, Oh, you know,
but you're going to have so much time
with your dad now, don't sugarcoat it.
But you can definitely emphasize,
right, that you're going to get
you know, there are going to be some
some new things that they could
do, like, oh, you get to spend
more one on one time with your mom
or one on one time with your dad.
Right.
You get to have decorate a new room.
Yeah,
it you know,
maybe they're sharing a room with someone.
Look, you get you get to,
you know, have a playtime all the time.
You know, that's a good way to put it
for the young kids.
They love that. Yes.
For the young kids.
Yeah. Teenagers. Not so. No, no.
But it said to make sure you get
their feedback when you are like, okay,
we're moving to a new house.
We're going to do your room.
Don't just do their room
without their without their opinion,
like they are in control
of not much of their life.
They have little control
over all this stuff happening.
Let them have some control over something,
something and let them.
Like I. I draw certain lines, right?
Like you get to you get to veto things,
but hey, let's work on this.
What are you thinking?
What colors do you like? What do you like?
Talk to them
about what they want their room to be.
And and if there's something
that you really don't want,
then come to a compromise.
But get their feedback.
Get their feedback. Love it.
Okay, Last one.
The biggest lie of all that we tell
kids of divorce, not much will change.
I don't think I ever said this because I.
I don't I don't understand
why I've heard people say yes,
but I don't think I've ever said that
Not much will change.
Everything's changed.
Your entire life
literally just went upside down.
So, yes, that is a lie.
You're now lying to your children.
Well, we can do that, though.
Sometimes we do to try to change
that, Right.
We think we're protecting.
But in essence and I think
this whole article really emphasizes
you are minimal,
losing your children's feelings
and you're ignoring the fact
that if you don't fill in the gaps,
they will with something probably far
worse than what the situation really is.
Right.
And this is this not much will change.
This actually is a lie.
And if you're a child,
which your children can definitely like,
they know that's a lie.
If you say, oh,
not much is going to change.
And so it says if your children know
that you're lying, which you are,
they are less likely to believe you
and trust you in the future.
Right?
Like so try not to say things
that are literally a blatant lie.
That is a blatant lie
that has some blatant lie.
Not much will change.
Yes, it will.
Well, and what you
what you do need to say to them is,
yes, there will be change,
but sometimes changes could. Hmm.
There may be more people involved
in your life now, which would be good.
So you try and emphasize
the good things about the change
and recognize the hard things too,
that are going to change.
Yeah. Yeah.
There might be some.
Yeah, maybe there's going to be
some new fun traditions, right?
That you get to start
in, you know, the different household.
But then yeah, also say like, yeah, I'm
going to be really sad that, you know,
we don't share this with you anymore,
but just be honest, be real.
But kids are resilient.
I don't want you to think you've destroyed
your children.
Kids are resilient, but you have
you have not stopped.
You've not know, you've it's hard.
You have to recognize
that what you're going through is very,
very difficult, not just for you,
but for your children as well.
And guess what?
They need to
they need to know that you understand that
it's difficult without you
sugarcoating everything all the time.
Yeah, but don't get them in the
I mean, you need to point out the positive
that you can write, but also don't
brush under a broad
sweep under the rug.
That's the word. There you go.
Sweep under the rug
what they're going through.
Okay, Eliminate Mommy.
The week is we're only down to three kids
and our traditional
Valentine Valentine's Day auction dinner
was a little scarce with just three kids.
Not nearly as much fun.
Yeah, so to take our lemons
and make lemonade, we.
Well, we've actually for years
now, we've been inviting our friends
down the street,
but only one of their kids could come.
So that still only left four kids.
So we invited a
couple of other neighbor kids
to come partake of our Valentine's Day
auction.
And it was awesome
because these other kids, I wasn't
I wasn't quite sure
they could handle the food auction.
Oh, no, they handled it well.
And I was surprised they were out there
bidding against what we thought
was going to be the sushi rolls,
which we knew Madeleine wanted really bad.
She got outbid and I was shocked.
I was like, Whoa,
what do you mean when you say you didn't
think that they could handle the food
or what did you mean?
Well, because it's pretty ruthless
the way our kids do this.
They've been doing it for years.
So they know. Gotcha.
So you just thought they're going
to be surprised at how the kids are like,
I'm I am going to help you.
I am going to help guide you.
I don't care that you are
that I don't care that you want that
or I'm going to I'm going to bid
you higher.
So you spend your money on something now,
because I know there's better things
coming later.
Yeah. Yeah.
But those kids stepped right in
and gave our kids a run for their money.
Oh, it was good stuff.