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My name is Jeff, and I'd like to welcome you on a journey of reflection and insight into the tolls and triumphs of a career in automotive repair.
After more than 20 years of skinned knuckles and tool debt, I want to share my perspective and hear other people's thoughts about our industry.
So pour yourself a strong coffee or grab a cold Canadian beer and get ready for some great conversation.
Jeff Barnes [00:00:04]:
You know, in order for us to get better, we're going to have to get more proficient at things and being able to do things in the independent world anyway. I mean, we're not at dealerships. You know, in order for us to charge more and to do better for our customers and stuff, we've got to do it ourselves. We can't rely on sending it somewhere else. And, you know, as long as we're trying, that's all that we can do.
Jeff Compton [00:00:27]:
Yeah. So that's part of being professional is, is being there. When you say you're gonna be there right now, we know we were talking. It's not in a perfect world. Sometimes you're supposed to be there for three. You get there at ten, after half an hour, whatever. But for the most part, you guys are pretty good about being professional and saying, you know, this is my window, that I'm gonna be there. You don't have, like, it's expected, I guess, that when you guys are going to go out on a call that the car that you need to program flash diag, whatever is there.
Jeff Compton [00:01:01]:
Right, right.
Jeff Barnes [00:01:04]:
Very rarely, is it not there. Yeah, you know, there's instances where you've got, like, a used car lot. There's some major used car lots down here that use some of these automotive shops to, um, install transmissions or do work for them and stuff like that. And what will happen then is they will say, um, you know, our vehicle is over at Al's auto repair. Okay, so, so I'm working for a car lot, but I'm at another automotive shop and that's, that's fine. I mean, so long as we're at an automotive shop, we're good, you know, but the vehicle's there, it's stable, you know, and we have to have that. I mean, that's part of protecting our customers vehicle. Because when you're programming, there's a lot of things that go on and, you know, sometimes, sometimes things don't go well and the vehicle ends up inoperable and it can be fixed.
Jeff Barnes [00:02:07]:
But, you know, part of having the vehicle there and not doing a waiter programming is, you know, it's gonna be okay. We're not gonna inconvenience people as much as if they were sitting in the waiting room waiting for their module to be programmed, you know? And I notice it a lot that a lot of shops, because this is new for Oklahoma City, but a lot of shops are trying to get the transmission in and get it done at three, and then get me in there at four, and then it's I've seen it. I have had to hand the keys to the customer when I'm done with what I'm doing. And it's not right. No, because I'm like, you guys sure you don't want to go drive this and make sure that everything's good? Like, you know, and I see it a lot. Like, I get done and they back it out and the customer's been sitting in the waiting room. They don't tell me, you know, I'm like, man, I'm glad that didn't brick, because that happens every once in a while. And, you know, right now we're having problems with servers and getting the wrong files.
Jeff Barnes [00:03:12]:
You know, Ford's doing it. You know, Nissan, sometimes you look it up and it gives you a file and it's incorrect for the vehicle. I mean, we've run into it. So.
Jeff Compton [00:03:20]:
Yeah. So how does. It's kind of like putting you guys in the last link of the quality control chain, and yet that's not how it should be. You know, there's so many other things after the thing is programmed and it needs to be driven. And, yeah, you're going to drive it, but you, like, do you get in some of these cars, say, for instance, we're on the transmission subject, and you drive it and the brakes are shot or, you know, the. It's got rattles in the suspension or something. You're like, was that there before? I don't know. Right.
Jeff Compton [00:03:53]:
Like, do I let the customer know about this? Or do I think that the shop that's actually, you know, in charge of the transmission is going to be, you know, so many variables. Right? Like, that's not a good look for the shop. That's done. Right.
Jeff Barnes [00:04:09]:
Right. And we can't. We cannot control what the shop does. That's not our place, you know?
Jeff Compton [00:04:14]:
Yeah.
Jeff Barnes [00:04:16]:
And so let's see how I can put this here. I normally don't test drive.
Jeff Compton [00:04:27]:
Right. Okay.
Jeff Barnes [00:04:28]:
Because I never know if the fluids full on the transmission. I never know if they have other work they need to do to the vehicle. Like, I just program the module, we get a screenshot of everything that we've done. We prove that it's been programmed, and then we just, you know, let them know, hey, the vehicle's ready for you to, you know, finish up. But it that you just asked me a question about that. Have I gotten into unsafe vehicles? Yeah, you bet your ass. I've been in some where the. Where that feels like the tires are about to pop.
Jeff Barnes [00:05:03]:
It's. It's kind of scary, you know, and it. Sometimes they've been working on it and they haven't driven it yet, you know, and they want me to go drive it. And, you know, luckily, I haven't been the one who got to pump the brakes while I was backing the vehicle out of the shop right after a brake job, you know, that would be scary.
Jeff Compton [00:05:23]:
Yeah, we saw that happen at my shop just about a month ago. The same thing. Somebody, you know, ten to five the night before, does a brake inspection, slash safety inspection on a car, you know, pushes all the calipers back to be sure that, you know, they'll go back, reassembles all the brakes and everything, puts the wheels back on the car, torques the wheels. He goes home, he comes in at eight in the morning, the apprentice comes in at seven in the morning with me. And, you know, first task is, you know, that vehicle is done, the customer's going to pick it up here and, you know, 09:00 this morning, we need it out of the bay because we're going to use the bay. And this is, again, like you and I have talked a lot, right, about processes and procedures and stuff. So the young apprentice, he has no idea what he gets in the vehicle and, you know, he turns, turns it on, he makes sure the hoist legs are clear and the shop doors open. He goes to put it in reverse, starts the back end of the parking lot, touches the brakes.
Jeff Compton [00:06:20]:
Car doesn't slow down right now, he immediately, he's like panicking, what do I do? Right? And luckily he panicked enough that he just kept pumping the brakes and eventually he got a little bit of pedal and he got it to stop. But it scared the bejesus out of him because, I mean, it's not, we don't have a particularly wide parking lot, and we're lucky that there was nobody coming behind them at the same time, right? So it's just little things like that that we now implement the procedure that if you put the wheels back on before you torque anything, you get in, pump the brake pedal, you know, like, that's just what you do. I mean, I did that for years on my own accord, just because, again, working in a dealership with like 18 guys, you do watch stuff happen, and that's how you kind of learn some of the lessons yourself. You don't have to learn everything. The hard day people, you learn by watching other people do, you know, funny stuff. You can take that as your lesson. It's okay. You don't get, you know, nobody's got a copyright on dumb stuff you can, you can learn from other people's mistakes.
Jeff Compton [00:07:19]:
So that's how we implemented that process and it, you know, so far, knock on what has been good. But yeah, there's some scary stuff.
Jeff Barnes [00:07:29]:
Well, you know, we, so I, but I work for l one, I don't work for all these shops. They all have their own rules, their own procedures. You know, I've started working at a big auto auction out here for all the dealerships and stuff. And it's different there too. Everything is different at that place, you know, than a normal automotive shop. And the way they do things and the red tape you have to go through and the things that they want you to do, you know, and I'll respect that to a point. But when it starts getting into how we do our business, there's just, we're not a one size fits all, you know, but at the same time.
Jeff Compton [00:08:15]:
You.
Jeff Barnes [00:08:16]:
Know, there's certain lines that we won't cross and you know, part of that is, is that when we, when we make an appointment, you know, yes, it may be from eight to five on a certain day, but you know, I know if I'm not going to be there by about eleven or twelve, I know, like I can tell, you know, and barring traffic, which in Oklahoma City, you know, I've been here my whole life, I can tell you in the last five years until about ten in the morning, you're just gridlocked a lot of times on the highways and then you better be getting somewhere around 3330 because that's when the wrecks start happening. And then once the wrecks start happening with the new Google maps and Waze and all these different programs and stuff, they start sending everybody down these hidden, you know, you know, avenues that I used to use to get around, you know, traffic jams and stuff. Now everybody knows about them. So you're pretty much just gridlocked everywhere you go. We're just growing. So there's a lot of factors that go into that too. And you know, once we press program on a vehicle, it's not like I can go, well, I have to be at this other shop by 01:00 so I'm just gonna yank the DLC out and I'll see you guys tomorrow. Like that's not gonna happen.
Jeff Barnes [00:09:43]:
And I'm not leaving my equipment at your shop, you know, and coming back for it. I have to have it. So that's why we just tell people, you know, the vehicle needs to be here and be stable. It needs to have a charged battery, you need to have both keys. When we program, like, we have all of these things set in place and we try really hard to stick with these certain things, you know. And where we run into problems is when we have shops that do not have their procedures in order. Yeah, they're the ones that drop the ball and they try and roll it back on us and say, well, you should have done this, you should have done that. And, you know, I work for somebody who is very, like I say, he's by the book.
Jeff Barnes [00:10:37]:
I don't want to say that. I don't want to call him bullheaded, but it's his way or the highway, you know, and, you know, it's different working for somebody that will back you up. And, you know, I had to fire a customer this week and I was nervous about it. I did not end the, I did not end the conversation with the customer. I felt like they were trying to make an example out of me in front of one of their customers. So, you know, as I'm stepping aside, stepping aside, I've stepped my way to the end of the desk by this point, and I'm waving their customer up there who had just walked in the door. They were not in the conversation. So I just got in my van and drove off.
Jeff Compton [00:11:27]:
Yeah. Not very professional, is it, when they're sitting there trying to browbeat you, I think as if to try and make an example of you in front of a cus. A customer in, in line, essentially, to speak to the, to the shop owner, because you messaged me about it and I'm listening to that going like, who does that kind of stuff? Like, it's. I mean, I know who does it. People in this industry do it every day. But I mean, we keep talking all the time about changing the industry and being better. And here we are, you know, with this kind of pig headed attitude of, I'm gonna dress down this, you know, mobile guy in my shop and in front of my customer. Cause I really don't care.
Jeff Compton [00:12:05]:
He's gonna see that it's my business and he's, you know, screwing me over it. That's when I heard you talk. It seemed like that was the message that they were trying to get across was like, watch me be the big man and be in charge. And that, that's, that stuff for me always makes me laugh because, I mean, especially. Cause from a standpoint of like, well, we're a shop that has to call in somebody to do something for us because we can't do it ourselves, but watch me play the heavy role. Like, get over yourself. You know, those of us in the know that really know, like, we're not impressed by that. We're not intimidated by it.
Jeff Compton [00:12:42]:
Like, you know, you're trying to appear to your customer that standing behind me is something that you're truly not. But anyway, right?
Jeff Barnes [00:12:51]:
And our intent is not to. Our intent is not to, you know, schedule our way. Our intent is to get to everybody the same day. I mean, that's our intent. But there's only so much that we can control. But our, our main focus is doing the job correctly, not wrecking someone's module, you know, not, not leaving them empty handed sitting there. Our intentions are, well, our intentions are to, to do the best that we can in our time slot, you know, and provide you with a properly programmed or properly diagnosed, you know, or properly cut key, you know, that type of thing. And some people just don't, they don't accept that.
Jeff Barnes [00:13:42]:
And so, you know, I mean, I feel like that if I, if I continue to do business with a place like this and there's multiple, this isn't the only one. This is probably the third time I've had to do this. I feel like if I continue to do business with them, they're going to try and get us to mold our business around their way of doing things. And that would put off every other customer that I have because this shop is the minority. Everybody else we don't have issues with. Everybody else is happy, you know, we're fixing cars every day. And so, you know, it's different working for somebody who will just back you up. You know, I was very, a small amount of me was nervous about driving off, but at the same time, I have to think about what I would have said had I stayed, you know, and so it was just for years, you know, I would work on anything.
Jeff Barnes [00:14:49]:
I would do anything, you know, shops would say, hey, we need to, we need, you know, the customer can't afford this. We need to put this value craft alternator on. You know, we need to, they want to supply their own part or, you know, the, their warranty, extended warranty company wants us to install this used salvage yard part. You know, I got to the point where I felt like I should be the one making the decision since I was the professional who was working on the vehicle. And I got to the point where I would say no. And, you know, I've worked at only two shops, so I don't have a whole ton of experience. You know, a lot of techs have worked at a lot of shops, but, you know, I feel like, I feel like I've hit the lottery on three different shops, really. I mean, the two, what I consider the two best shops in Oklahoma City as far as policy and procedure and doing what's right for the customer.
Jeff Barnes [00:15:49]:
I've worked there, and then now I work for l one. So I don't, I haven't worked at any of these shops where they're putting their percentage numbers over what's right for the, for the customer.
Jeff Compton [00:16:01]:
Yeah. And that's a tough thing, right. Because, I mean, you've heard us now for a couple months. We've been having kind of those conversations about, you know, there should be a pretty substantial markup on parts. Right. That should be a big factor in your profits is your margin. We don't want to be, you know, 5% above or given the customer the parts at, you know, our costs, and not because it's. There's a reason that the margin has to be there.
Jeff Compton [00:16:29]:
Right. Profits, not a dirty word, as Chris says. You know, we put the margin there so that we can operate so that we can grow, so we can, you know, take care of our customers if the part fails. You know, that's why all that stuff is there. But, like, you and I were just talking, you know, sometimes I see some shop owners that are looking at it and they're running their margins, say it's a $100 100% markup. So it takes, well, you know, a $70 part and puts it at 140. And then they look at their, they've got their diet charged in there. They've got their little bit of labor maybe to do the part.
Jeff Compton [00:17:04]:
Example, an alternator or something like that. And all of a sudden now it's like an $800 bill, and they go, a customer is not going to pay that. Maybe they know about the customer situation or something like that, you know, blah. All the kind of stuff that I try not to get involved in because I'm not cut that way. I'm not empathetic. I really am not. From a customer standpoint, it's just very good and easy for me to always separate it. It's just business.
Jeff Compton [00:17:29]:
But we see then is that first thing that always they do is they go to a next line down of part. Right. And you and I were talking and that, like, you know, that's not good. And, and we were talking about how we talked about an ignition coil situation that I saw happen where, you know, we, we made the assumption that the customer probably wouldn't afford the oe one, we probably wouldn't get the job if you bought the OE, you know, Toyota ignition coil. So we went to probably making too many judgments on the age of the car, what the customer's intended use of the car is, how much longer they intend to drive it, yada, yada, yada. Make all these assumptions. Go and get the cheapest coil we can put it in. It lasts four days.
Jeff Compton [00:18:18]:
Comes back, go through the diag process again, warranty that part in, get another one. It lasts four days. Finally, now we're having to eat the difference of the coil to get a better quality part to put in. Great. We looked after the customer. We took care air quotes of the customer. But what do you think that customers confidence is in us at that point? Pretty poor, eh?
Jeff Barnes [00:18:45]:
Yeah.
Jeff Compton [00:18:47]:
You know, that for me is not advocating for the customer. That's if it's advocating for the customer, it's advocating for the customer at my expense. I look, either the customer can either look like I can think I'm really foolish, and you don't know what I'm doing. Incompetent. Or they can look and think that I'm really trying to rip them off by installing some pretty crappy parts. Because that's the other thing, right? The whole parts thing I hate. Because it doesn't matter when you talk to somebody that's selling you the part, nobody's ever really forthcoming and says, oh, yeah, this is a great part. That's all they ever say.
Jeff Compton [00:19:22]:
It's a great part. Well, it's a great part. Define great. What's the best part? Is that brand the best? No. Then how great is it? You know, like, I see all the time we put on stuff that, like, we know I had a fuel pump driver module in a Ford. That one. That one cranked me up. It cranked me up pretty bad.
Jeff Compton [00:19:50]:
I was reaching out to some friends, and I was frustrated. I was, you know, you've gotten my phone call rants that I light up your messenger with like a three minute, you know, profanity laced, you know, epic rundown of. Of. Because, you know, we knew what was wrong. The code is telling you, hey, fuel pump driver module goals offline. And you look at it, and it's like, first of all, it's not even bolted back in the spot that it's supposed to be on. We're talking on a Ford Explorer sport track, right? And then second of all, it's, well, why is it. Okay, it needs people.
Jeff Compton [00:20:22]:
Driver module. Oh, look, it's got those. That one symbol that we love to see in this industry, like the, the infamous black wings, right, on the, on the electrical components, like, okay, well, that just confirmed my diag even better, right? I don't have to second guess my diag at all. We've all been there. We all know that that's a part that you might put on to sell the truck. It's not a part you'd put on to get the truck, you know, for the customer. That. And it, for all intents and purposes, is maybe going to drive that truck three more years.
Jeff Compton [00:20:53]:
Is that the part to put on? No, it's not. So why do we do it?
Jeff Barnes [00:20:59]:
There's no, you know, and there's more than that. There's more than just parts. It's more than just programming. You know, you. If you don't find out your customers intent with their vehicle, you could really be doing them a disservice. Because, you know, if you are into the whole scare tactic on selling people things, and they don't intend on keeping this vehicle for more than two or three years, and you don't ask them, now you've gone and said, oh, man, you need, you need struts and ball joints and brakes and tires. You need all this stuff. This vehicle is gonna, you know, this is, this is dangerous.
Jeff Barnes [00:21:39]:
You know, whether it is or not, you know, you might be doing them a disservice because you didn't ask them their intent, you know, because if you ask them to say, you write up. Because we believe in the 300% rule, right? You know, that's what everybody's preaching. I've got pictures of it. I see it at shops now in Oklahoma. It's a good thing. It's a very good thing to see. And I've been taking. Every time I see it, I take a picture of it.
Jeff Barnes [00:22:03]:
I see it on the board. I go. And then, you know what I do? I go and I talk to the technicians, I say, do you guys like that? And they go, hell, yeah. That's the greatest thing that's ever happened. Because. Because, one, we don't sell things that we don't sell things without knowing that there's going to be a catastrophic failure, you know, or that we could have caught something, you know? So now we're inspecting the vehicle instead of just churning through vehicles every day. So we're prepared for that. You know, our comebacks are less, because we can go back on our ticket and go, hey, now we.
Jeff Barnes [00:22:40]:
Because. Because in a week or two, you may forget that you even worked on the car. So now you can go back through records and go, no, no, no, we knew about this. We talked to you about this, you know, and then, yes, you sell more work, so, you know, they're making more money. And so it's a win win for everybody, really, if you follow it the correct way. But, you know, without. Without knowing an intent, you need to look at a ticket and go. And you just said it, you know, you're.
Jeff Barnes [00:23:06]:
You're. You're looking at it going, man, you're. You're emotional about it. I don't know if I would spend, you know, $6,000 on a. To what, a 2015 sport track. You know, this thing's where you're at is a rotten ball of rust. You know, that's not for you to decide, you know? And so without finding out intent, you know, if you go and talk to the customer and go, you know, what's your intent with this vehicle? And they go, I'm gonna. I'm trading this thing off.
Jeff Barnes [00:23:36]:
You know, I just need it to last six months. Okay? Here's where. Here's where a lot of shops fall victim to that, okay? Because I've seen it before. They say, I'm getting rid of this car. I'm getting rid of this car. I'm getting rid of this car. And so you go, all right, then we're not going to put on these high, high dollar parts. We're going to put on these.
Jeff Barnes [00:23:55]:
These cheap parts. And guess what. Guess what? Things change in their life. And two years down the road, now they got to fill the fuel pump again. And guess who looks like the bad guy, you know, and you thought you were doing what was right, you know? And so to me and the shop that I worked at and to Keith and Liz and everybody that I've built my whole entire career around to me, is we're going to do it right. We're going to put on the best thing that we know that we can buy. We're going to do the process the right way. We're going to program with the correct files.
Jeff Barnes [00:24:30]:
We're going to do everything we can the best way we can. And if you're not willing to do that, then we don't want to do the repair because things change. So I don't want to. Here you say, I'm going to trade this off and I'm getting rid of it. And I go, okay, well, then we don't need to put on the top line part. We don't need to do the entire procedure. You know, we can bend brackets out of the way and pull parts off. And we're not going to chase these threads before we put the bolts in.
Jeff Barnes [00:25:05]:
Hell, why are we doing that? Don't waste your time. He's getting rid of the car, right? And then his life changes. Or they sell the car and the car shows back up. Somebody bought it and said, hey, we knew that they were taking this vehicle here. They recommended you and you go through and go, crap, we put that water pump on last year. But I thought they were going to sell this.
Jeff Compton [00:25:25]:
And great point, because what do you do at that point? Because, I mean, some shops would not even maybe fess up to them being the ones that put the water pump on, right? That new customers got that new car. They're back because they used to go to, you know, your shop and then they liked that car when they bought it used. And they maybe they went through the glovebox and found a business card in there, you know, some from work invoices from there. They're like, well, they know the car. I'm taking the car back there. And then all of a sudden, just like you said, that water pump that you put on, that was a $60 water pump instead of $140 water pump is now nine months old and it's leaking. They don't know that it was replaced, right? So you could give them an estimate for a water pump and they would just be like, okay, cool, I'm paying for a water pump. This is what old cars do.
Jeff Compton [00:26:17]:
The reality is, is that like, the right thing to do is to take care of that customer. Warranty the part out. But now you're in a situation where you're putting another subpar part on, right? Another one year water pump because maybe this customer is intending to keep that car three years and it should get the three year water pump, but because you only have a warranty for a one year water pump, one year being quality, right? Everybody understand? What I'm speaking of is now we've got that customer into a cycle of, oh, I had this car and I could not get a water pump to last more than a year. I don't know what was going on. Reality is because we kept putting on crap parts that started from the beginning and we never saw it through because we didn't bite the bullet and do the right thing and go, okay, I'm going to get some warranty paid out for this. I'm going to have to bite the bullet, spend the other $100 out of my profits now and put on the water pump. That should have been put on the first time. Why do we not do that in this industry? Why is it so, when we say it out loud, it makes so much sense.
Jeff Compton [00:27:19]:
But, yeah, we make that decision every day. I've seen it at least a hundred times in my career. If I've seen it once, that's a bit of an exaggeration, but it's more than ten, less than 100. Customer says, I'm going to trade the car, I'm getting rid of the car. Then guess who's driving the car? Customer's son, customer's daughter. Because maybe, right, they didn't get what they wanted on trade in maybe the son or daughter. You know, it's a good first car for them, but just like you said, now it's got something that, you know, we're having to do a tie rod again. Like, we, we, we should just stop.
Jeff Compton [00:27:55]:
You know, we would, we all complain in this industry about subpar parts, but the reality is, is that we drive the market for the subpar parts. We would have it fixed in no time if we stopped buying them, but we don't, because every time we call up half of the parts we buy every day, we know our substandard. We know it. It's terrible.
Jeff Barnes [00:28:18]:
We have, we have another layer here that we didn't have, you know, 1520 years ago. It's called Carfax. So you have to be careful. You can say they're just going to sell the car. Guess what? Everything is logged on Carfax. I mean, if you're using, basically, if you're using one of these, these shop management systems, unless you tell them not to, they are sharing with carfax, you know, it can be a good thing. It can work in your favor. People can go through that and go, man, this car's got 300,000 miles on it.
Jeff Barnes [00:28:51]:
But I'm looking through the carfax and it's had all these services done at this certain shop, you know, and so that's where I'm taking it. I'm taking it back there. They didn't even have. Maybe they bought it from a car lot, you know, that they can go to the Carfax and go, you know, I'm taking it back there. This place has been really good for this vehicle. So, you know, but I would think that if they, if they went through that and saw water pump, and then six months later, water pump and, and then nine months later, water pump, and then five months later, coolant flush water pump, it's like, okay, maybe we shouldn't take it back to that place, you know, maybe they're doing something wrong. That's probably in their mind. What they're gonna think is that that shop's just screwing it up.
Jeff Barnes [00:29:29]:
And it may not be. They may have just put on a cheap part because they were trying to save their customer money. They felt bad for them, or they were, you know, well, this customer's gonna get rid of this car. You know, this thing's. It's got 300,000 miles on it, whatever. So, you know, you're gonna lose. You're gonna lose some sales, you know, and you're gonna lose some on your. I mean, you're gonna have to lose some on your.
Jeff Barnes [00:29:53]:
Your parts percentage, you know? But what is the. What is the real cost? That's what I look at. You know what? And that's what you should be acting as a. As a consumer. You should be acting like that and saying, what is the real cost? You know? There's a real cost in everything. You know? You eat cheap. Guess what. Guess what? You eat cheap.
Jeff Barnes [00:30:17]:
And I'm. I'm right here. I eat cheap, okay? Guess what? In the end, it's gonna cost.
Jeff Compton [00:30:24]:
Yeah.
Jeff Barnes [00:30:25]:
At some point, you know, you know, you. You go and you buy a cheap car. I mean, I've had good luck with some, but there's some brands out there that you're like. You just know, walking into it, you're like, this thing, this piece of crap's not going to last 100,000 miles. It's going to need a motor. Fill in the blank. Everybody knows who I'm talking about.
Jeff Compton [00:30:45]:
So I. Yeah, I have a friend that messaged me about that one this week, and she's like, uh, what about Ikea? And I'm like, nope. Then she's like, what about a Nissan rogue? Nope. Like, you know, and it's like you feel bad because this is somebody that, you know, for all intents purposes, they want. They're trying to look at something 2019, because their financial situation is saying, financial institute is saying, if it's newer than 2020, you need a cosigner. And that sucks, right? Because you and I know now even rust isn't the factor. You're looking at a lot of these cars when they're five, six years old. What's left for them? Usable life? Not always a lot.
Jeff Compton [00:31:37]:
You know, it used to be we could say up here, it's like, okay, well, you're going to get one that's going to have a little bit of rust on the fenders and stuff, but, you know, it's eight years old, but those transmissions are great. You know, those engines are bulletproof now. Like, the market is flooded with Toyota. You know, I almost said Toyota's high endais and kias, that it's like the force, the four cylinders got a recall in the engine. The six cylinders, I just had one. I reached out to a friend of mine, Brandon Dills, about. We had one that was like when you would drive it down the road, and then if you slowly let off the throttle real quick, all of a sudden the heat in the dash would drop from, like, 100 degrees fahrenheit to, like, 60 in the time that it took you to do a smoke u turn. And I'm like, there has to be air getting in this.
Jeff Compton [00:32:22]:
In this cooling system. There's no other way. And I, you know, like, we're like, what the hell? Like, it doesn't, but it doesn't overheat, it doesn't run bad, you know, none of that kind of stuff that would point you to say there's a head gasket problem. So we do a block test on it. When, you know, when it's hot, there's a head gasket opening up. Well, like, there's something that. That poor lady just bought that six months ago, and now she's getting rid of it again because, like, she wants heat. And who can blame her? Like, you know, of course she wants heat.
Jeff Compton [00:32:54]:
She lives in Canada. It's wintertime. I don't want to be driving in stop and go traffic and having to think that I've got to accelerate the heck out of this thing, you know, to get some heat again. Because when I sit at every stoplight, I'm freezing. So there's a whole car line right there that can't even. You can't even recommend to somebody because their engines are such trash. And then it's like the Nissan thing, like I say, at the same time, if you can't buy one that's a stick shift, don't buy one. Because to me now they're supposedly better.
Jeff Compton [00:33:22]:
And you're going to get somebody that's just like, going to go on there and go, hey, Nissans are not all that bad. How many Nissans do you guys go out and program for CVT's?
Jeff Barnes [00:33:33]:
All of them.
Jeff Compton [00:33:35]:
All of them, right.
Jeff Barnes [00:33:37]:
Everyone.
Jeff Compton [00:33:38]:
Because they all need a transmission. All of them.
Jeff Barnes [00:33:40]:
One of them has.
Jeff Compton [00:33:41]:
Yeah.
Jeff Barnes [00:33:42]:
So, you know, that's an absolute. You know, they say, don't. Don't live life with absolutes, but I can guarantee you that's one absolute. It's either gonna need. It's either had a transmission or it's gonna need a transmission. If it's had a transmission, it's gonna need a transmission. Again, that's just an absolute. But, yeah, yeah.
Jeff Barnes [00:34:00]:
I mean, you know, it comes down to even just more than that, too. I mean, you know, you. There's. There's shops out there that'll put head gaskets on. I get it. I've done it. You know, and then there's those that they say, you know, we don't know how hot this thing got. We don't know what condition it was in before you overheated it.
Jeff Barnes [00:34:23]:
And so you're getting a long block, you know, I mean, the shop I worked at, we were down to not even doing cam and lifters on Hemis. Yeah, because you're taking too much of a risk. I don't want to charge you all this money. And then we don't know where the metal went, you know, and we had a couple of them that come back blown up. So, you know, and then you look at it and go, crap, I'm gonna lose this job. That was a $4,000 ticket I could have had, you know, and I think a lot of shops will go, well, I need that. So we're just gonna sell it, you know, and it's a. I get it.
Jeff Barnes [00:35:02]:
It's tough. And, no, I'm not a business owner. I've never, you know, I've never been a business owner or anything like that. But I see the successes from doing what's right more than I see the successes of, you know, from doing what's right for your bottom dollar. I see way more successful shops that will say no, and we're one of them, you know, so there's things that we will not. There's lines that we will not cross. You know, it's. I mean, you could take it like this.
Jeff Barnes [00:35:33]:
We get called out to program a key supplying the key, and I could go out and they say, I've already got this transponder key that I bought off of online or whatever, and that key may cost us dollar 25, and we charge $120 for it. Right, okay. And so let's say they've already bought the key. We could save ourselves $25, make 25 more dollars in profit, but it may not start their car in a week because we didn't supply it. We don't know where it came from. And then the other. But is. So I.
Jeff Barnes [00:36:06]:
So the first point is, we were trying to protect our client from from possibly having issues with the key. The second, though, is protecting our machine because you put in a cheap key in there and it will break your cutter blade. Those are like 50, $60.
Jeff Compton [00:36:26]:
Yeah, see, I didn't know about that. What? Um, on the key thing, not to kind of skirt, you know, change channels, but do a lateral move. The whole thing with Nastiff this week that you saw some people, you know, share some memes about and, you know, so on and so forth, is that, like, I can't think that you guys are stressed about that at all, right? Like, it'll have no effect on you guys.
Jeff Barnes [00:36:54]:
No, no, it will not have an effect on us. Every one of us that works at l one has a VSP. I mean, Keith sits on the board. Why would he not, though? I mean, why would. Why would he not? We're a legit business. You know, we. We all have them. That's.
Jeff Barnes [00:37:17]:
That's a. Man. There's going to be a lot of podcast episodes on that. That's a major thing right now.
Jeff Compton [00:37:24]:
Yeah, but do you feel for the guys that are gonna be locked out? Because, I mean, we know of a couple guys that are. Have. Have not been able to get a BSP and are smart technicians, really good, you know, smart guys, but they maybe have some stuff in their background. You know, that everybody gets young and stupid sometimes, right? And they're. They're. They're not getting clearance. Like, what. How do you feel for them? Do you think it's overreach at that point that's keeping them out?
Jeff Barnes [00:37:58]:
You know, it's a good question when you live by rules. Yeah, some people, and it's the same thing with this. This shop I had to fire. You know, we live by rules and, you know, I. How. How are they going to handle each one? I don't know. I've heard that you can petition. You know, they're going to have to figure that out if they're going to require people to get them.
Jeff Barnes [00:38:30]:
But right now, you know, that's not a requirement. They say it's voluntary. I know Autel is on board, though. Autel wants to get off of the fed's radar, you know, but there's going to be. There's other avenues. You know, it's not going to stop them from repairing vehicles. You know, they can. They can get with some mobile guy that has a VSP.
Jeff Barnes [00:38:50]:
I mean, there's a lot of shops out there that are not going to have a VSP. They're going to use us or they're going to use somebody else, you know, I mean, it's, it's not an end all. It's really not. And how much, I mean, honestly, how much. How much a mobilizer are most shops doing right now? You know, not a whole lot.
Jeff Compton [00:39:10]:
Now here's something to mull over. Is this suddenly an opportunity for technicians, as an independent technician to go out and pursue getting that yourself to make yourself more lucrative? And you're in the hiring side of things.
Jeff Barnes [00:39:29]:
So you, you have to carry so much insurance. So I don't know how that works if you're not at an actual shop. So going and getting it with one shop and then going to another shop, you're pretty much gonna have to re register everything again, I assume. I mean, I haven't had to do that. Keith. Keith took care of mine, you know?
Jeff Compton [00:39:52]:
Right.
Jeff Barnes [00:39:52]:
But I assume you would have to prove insurance and all that and re register wherever you're working at. So I, you know, to be honest with you, I don't know too many shops that even know about it. So you could go in there and go, I have a VSP and they're gonna go, great. And they're probably gonna treat it. It's gonna be kind of split 50 50. Kind of like with the ase's, you know, you go in there and say, I have all these ase's and they're gonna go, good job, buddy. Don't give a crap, you know, so. Cuz because we don't do immobilizer here, so why does that help me? You know, so I don't.
Jeff Barnes [00:40:29]:
I don't see it as a. Okay, I don't. I don't see it keeping somebody from getting a job. And I don't see it helping anybody get a job, really. It's just, it's just something that was done to try and make a difference, you know, I mean, that's, that's their intent is to. It might be a whole let's, let's just do it and see how it works type thing. We don't know. I mean, criminals or criminals.
Jeff Compton [00:40:57]:
It's. It's a huge problem up here right now. Like Toronto, for instance. I went two weeks ago and the news was full of like the hotspots in Toronto of where cars are getting stolen. I mean, to the tune of, I think they're getting like a hundred cars stole car thefts a day, which is a lot, you know, and it's. What's scary is it's like we always think of a car that all must be an older car. Like, I'm sure half of them are probably Hyundai, and this is not a pick on Hyundai thing. But we all know, like, the.
Jeff Compton [00:41:28]:
What is it? The Hyundai boys or something, the Kia boys or whatever, that showed how everybody. You can steal them with, like, a USB cable, right? I'm not talking just about that. I'm. I'm. These are higher end cars that I think guys are going around with some of these black market tooling, and they're cloning a key and stealing the car. Right? They're not.
Jeff Barnes [00:41:50]:
Yeah. That's the risk you take. So let's say. Let's say you're at a shop, and there's a guy that comes around and says, I make keys, right? He's not a legit business. He's just a. He's just a guy that can make keys, okay? And so you're like, well, I don't have a mobile guy. Or maybe the mobile guy is too expensive, you know, whatever. Or the locksmith doesn't show up, because around here, the locksmiths don't show up.
Jeff Compton [00:42:13]:
Right?
Jeff Barnes [00:42:13]:
They don't. They. They want certain work. There's certain work that they don't want. So let's say you hire some guy, and you've got a. Let's do a good example here. 2008 Corvette. It has a, like, a rectangular flat key.
Jeff Barnes [00:42:28]:
Okay? It doesn't use a blade. It's a push button start. So let's say you call him out, and he makes you a handy dandy key for $85, and you're like, all right, hooray. He beat the locksmith. He beat the mobile guy. He beat the dealership. All right, good. Guess what? He just made two, and you didn't know it.
Jeff Compton [00:42:45]:
Yeah.
Jeff Barnes [00:42:46]:
And he looked in the glove box and looked at where that person lives, and the next day, he went and took their car. You know, that's where, if the tool required a VSP, there would be a record of that happening. You know, that's where it would help to at least try. And they could get. You know, they could at least stop some of it. You know, you're never going to stop all of it, but you could stop some of it. And. And that would be my fear, you know, using somebody.
Jeff Barnes [00:43:15]:
And so where having a VSP may help is giving confidence to certain places and say, listen, you know, I have a VSP. All this is recorded. We're legit business. We're insured. We don't want to lose our license. We don't want to go to jail. So we're going to do what's right. I think the dog's got a squeak toy.
Jeff Compton [00:43:42]:
I hadn't heard it yet.
Jeff Barnes [00:43:43]:
Okay. All right. As long as you can't hear. I can hear it in my headphones. As long as you can't hear anyway, so. So, you know, we're a legit business. We're going to protect you. You're not going to have the police here knocking on your door in a couple months saying, hey, you know, a key was programmed here at this place that the customer's vehicle got stolen.
Jeff Barnes [00:44:01]:
Tell me about that. You know, so that's their intent, that whole thing, though. I'm a joker. I like to kid. I like to make memes. I like to poke fun at things. I'm never serious. I'm kind of neutral on the whole thing.
Jeff Barnes [00:44:22]:
I don't give a crap whether they do it or not if I have to do it. It's another layer that I still have to go through with putting all this information in, getting driver's licenses, getting insurance, or verification of the vehicle. You know, that's another layer that I have to another hoop. You know, that even I've got some shops that are like, we're not doing that. We're just calling a locksmith. Okay. You can call locksmith, you know, and I've had shops that say, you know, you guys are just real sticklers on that, aren't you? Well, yeah, you know. Yeah, I mean, I don't want to lose that.
Jeff Compton [00:44:57]:
Yeah. Yeah.
Jeff Barnes [00:44:58]:
I mean, they don't realize that. Yeah. Okay. I lose my VSP because you didn't want to call your customer and get the information that is required for me to get a pin code for the vehicle. So every time I come out here, it's going to be five or $600 because I got to pull the instrument cluster out, I got to pull the ignition switch out. I got to pull the body control module out. I got to put them on a bench. I got to risk bricking them with some chinese aftermarket tool in order to learn your keys, you know, I mean, like I said, if.
Jeff Barnes [00:45:26]:
If we have to do it that way because it's a certain brand or make or model or certain, you know, you know, age of vehicle where you just can't get the correct pin code or things have been changed around, you know. Yeah, well, we have other ways of doing it, but we try the legit way first, you know, as much as we can. You know, like I said, it's just another way of protecting, you know, our clients. And so there's been shops that are just like, I'm not doing all that, you know? Okay, that's fine. You know? Sorry.
Jeff Compton [00:46:02]:
Yeah, yeah, you might. And you might just be then the shop that's not gonna get into a lot more electrical or drivability. Right. Or any kind of diag. Because you're gonna become more and more locked out. I mean, it's. I think somebody. I shared Mario's video and a discussion popped up on the jade mechanic Facebook group and somebody's like, chimes in, well, do you not know how frustrating this is to me? I'm just a person that wants to be able to buy my own key and program my own key for my own vehicle.
Jeff Compton [00:46:40]:
And I'm like, because I had said, I don't think it's all, this is all that a terrible thing if it means that some shops are not going to. Because I think that a lot of shops that maybe, and this is where I sometimes probably alienate some people, as I probably say, because a lot of the shops that probably are trying to navigate look for the workarounds and stuff like that, a lot of time they're probably not. They're probably doing some sketchy parts can and stuff anyway. So again, like me, it doesn't really bother me too much if the more people that don't want to invest in training tooling time are locked out. I don't see that as this huge negative in the industry. But he was, like, adamant that you don't understand this is complete overreach. And, like, I just. And I'm thinking, is there that many people out there that really still, uh, wish that, like, they could go out and just buy a ten dollar key at the hardware store and the guy goes behind the glass and cuts it and you go out and you walk out to your 84 Chevy half ton, you put it in and you turn it, you drive away like, yeah, those were the good old days.
Jeff Compton [00:47:44]:
But for God's sakes, man, that's over 20 years ago. Like, we're. Who is still thinking that they can buy a key without having to get involved with some kind of programming? It's just been the reality now for the last ten years that you have to do this. So when he's like, I just want to be able to buy the tool myself, I'm sorry, but unfortunately, some shady people have ruined it. You know, in this reality, this is.
Jeff Barnes [00:48:11]:
You know, well, it's the same for, I mean, anything else like that. I mean, if I could. If I could get on Amazon right now and buy a $250 tool and a $25 key and go over my neighbor's house and cut a key for their house and change the locks on it and claim it as mine.
Jeff Compton [00:48:33]:
That would be a problem, right?
Jeff Barnes [00:48:35]:
You know, I'm not saying you can't do it, but there's a reason why the locksmiths, they don't, the locksmiths don't embellish anything. They don't. They won't. They hold everything to the chest. And not because they don't want you taking their jobs. It's because it's crucial information. You know, it's just, I don't know. I don't know why we resist change so much.
Jeff Barnes [00:49:02]:
You know? That's, I feel like a lot of the problems that we have with our industry is just the lack of willing to change and, you know, adapt, you know, and, like, you know, hey, this is 2024, and, you know, auto Auth has been around for what, six, seven years at least. And there are still shops that they feel like they are locked out of Chrysler and that they can't do it. And I'm like, you have a $8,000 snap on scan tool. Do you have an up to date subscription? And they say, yeah. I'm like, why don't you just pay the $50 and use auto auth? I mean, you're not locked out of Chrysler at all.
Jeff Compton [00:49:48]:
My, my very own zeus mine. I have auto auth on it myself. Paid out of pocket, out of myself. So it kind of just chuckle when people go, you know, there was that whole thing on tick tock months ago where somebody was mad because they had to take it to the dealership to get the codes cleared after they repaired it, obviously. And, you know, they were like, I got the scan tool. I just, I'm not set up for auto auth. What's your excuse for not being set up for auto auth? Like, what's your, what's your, what's your thinking? You know, it's, it's not a crippling cost to anybody out there running a legit business to think that they can't afford or to make excuses on why they can't justify the expensive to serve their customer. You want to serve your customer? Get what you need to get.
Jeff Compton [00:50:41]:
Pay for it. Charge them. That's how it works, right? Nobody's holding a gun to your head saying, you can't charge more than $100, you know, for a key programming. Nobody's holding the gun to your head. That's just, you know, if you think that it is. You're. You're crazy. It's.
Jeff Compton [00:50:58]:
You can say all the market dictates, so be the market, set the market, you know, do better. I never understood that method of thinking that I have to be cheap. I never understood it.
Jeff Barnes [00:51:12]:
Yeah, well, but that's the old school mentality, you know. I talked to a shop owner. I mean, he's. He's up there in age, you know, and he's not really running the shop anymore. He does machine work. They do machine work there. Super clean shop.
Jeff Compton [00:51:34]:
Yeah.
Jeff Barnes [00:51:34]:
Out in the middle of. I'm not now middle of nowhere, but kind of probably a good 20 miles from the main city here. There's probably more cows than people. So. And he was telling me, he said, you know, things have changed. He said, you know, he said, because mechanics, he said, when I got into it, you know, we were just coming off of the mechanics being, you know, the poorest of the poor, you know, they didn't make a whole lot of money. Cars didn't cost a whole lot of money, so you couldn't charge a whole lot of money to fix them. And everybody knew how to work on them.
Jeff Barnes [00:52:13]:
I mean, you'd have a mom cook dinner and then go out and set points on her car, you know.
Jeff Compton [00:52:19]:
Yeah.
Jeff Barnes [00:52:20]:
And so people had you do it because. Not because they couldn't, but, you know, because you had to do it a lot. I mean, we had. Filling stations are a thing of the past, but used to get gas and top the fluids off every time. And while you're there, hey, can you check this out? You know, and so, I mean, we're talking about a time where if you wanted to drive your car to Colorado, you would have to stop halfway up the mountain and readjust the carburetor. So, yeah, you know, things have changed from back then to where now, you know, we're not the poorest of the poor. We're doing better. Cars are just getting ridiculously expensive.
Jeff Barnes [00:53:08]:
And back then, people didn't rely on their vehicle as much as we do now. They didn't drive as much. It wasn't as big of a thing. You know, you could pick up a car for three to $500. Back then, that was not a, you know, an abnormal thing to find one cheap. People didn't care as much. They would drive home with squeaks and rattles and wind whistling in, and the AC quit. Oh, well, let's forget that.
Jeff Barnes [00:53:35]:
You know, I mean, my. My grandfather talked about, he had a cousin who basically, when he would lose a wheel cylinder, he would take the line off and shove a pinnail in the line and screw it back on, and he would forget. And so he brought the car over one day, wrecked, and my grandfather said, well, what did you do? You ended up wrecking your car? And he said, yeah. He said, apparently I was running on the right front brake only, and when that wheel cylinder blew out, I put a pitney nail in it and lost my brakes completely. So, you know, but. And he wasn't a mechanic, right? So we're past those days now to where, you know, people are going to have to rely on us a little bit more. Costs are going up for everything. And it, you know, I can't afford it.
Jeff Barnes [00:54:40]:
You know, that's why I drive older cars. I can't. I mean, I drive an zero five escape. You know, what's the most expensive part on that? Another escape. Right? Like, you just go buy another one for $3,500.
Jeff Compton [00:54:55]:
Yeah.
Jeff Barnes [00:54:55]:
So, you know, we're getting into. One of my friends on my. My chat group said that he called. He made a call on a bad steering wheel on a vehicle. I don't remember if it was a Volkswagen or. It was probably something european. He said the cost of that steering wheel was $3,000. $3,000.
Jeff Barnes [00:55:17]:
I just, you know, and I'm like, jesus. You know, like, yeah, what. And what features do you lose? You know, I mean, is it going to be to the point where something like that has a sensor in it? And I think his did, to where you have to fix it? So, you know, I do have empathy for people having to repair these cars. But, you know, people ask me, why all the time, you know, why do you drive such an old car? Don't you make decent money? And I'm like, it's because if it breaks, even though I can fix it, I could not afford a $3,000 steering.
Jeff Compton [00:55:55]:
Wheel, you know, no, I can't even afford it. And I wouldn't justify it in my mind, right, if I drove something that as soon as the steering wheel controls of, whether it be for airbag, cruise control, volume of the radio, whatever, as soon as that stopped working and rendered the car undrivable, I'm getting rid of the car. And I'm trying to then find something older that doesn't have such stupid technology in it, because, call me nuts, call me crazy, the steering wheel is still just about pointing the wheels where the car is supposed to go. That's really what it is in a nutshell. It shouldn't be. It should be illegal to make that car unusable unless you buy a $3,000 wheel just because of some other electronics that go inside of it. And I understand all. There's the airbag, is there? Yeah, I know.
Jeff Compton [00:56:50]:
But I'm also old enough to remember when people used to pull the airbag fuse out because they didn't want it to go off in the accident because they believe that it caused more damage to you than if you didn't have it on. Right. So there's lots of cars that I have worked on in my bike. You know, you got an airbag light on. Yeah, I know. I got the fuse pulled out. And you didn't have the conversation with the guy about how that's really misinformed and not too smart. And, you know, I don't ever want my kids to ride with you because the guy probably just recently started wearing his seatbelt because he got enough tickets that he finally learned, you know what I mean? Like, but the idea that the part all of a sudden renders the car, that part a steering wheel, it's the same as, like, it scares me to death when we see how these cars are going with radios and what essentially is just an entertainment system that, like, I can't even turn my heat on now because it's all going through my screen of my radio.
Jeff Compton [00:57:49]:
And when that screws up, I can't turn my heat on. Take off with that nonsense. That's crazy. I should still be able to so choose that. If I don't, if I want to drive a car without a working radio, I should still have heat, right? But people are like, no, I mean, I got what is. I drove a 2019 Ram Laramie. Like, great big screen in it. Everything is done through the screen.
Jeff Compton [00:58:14]:
That's cool. I know those radios are worth, like eight grand when they screw up and it's out of warranty. Like, there's gonna be all these cars parked at trade in lots and dealership lots and auction lots of, because they've got these high dollar entertainment systems in them that are useless, don't work, and half the functions that are into the car don't work. That, to me, is not progress, but.
Jeff Barnes [00:58:40]:
Right. And then, yeah, what are we going to do when all this stuff starts failing? That's, you know, that is. That's on the horizon. I mean, I'm seeing it right now. I'm like, man, if. If this one module fails on this car, you can't drive it, you can't start it. There's no workaround for it. It's the hub for the networks on the vehicle.
Jeff Barnes [00:59:02]:
Right. So if they quit making that part, that's the only part they have to quit making one part on the car and it's done. There's no work.
Jeff Compton [00:59:11]:
That's scary when that's what I was.
Jeff Barnes [00:59:13]:
Talking to this old shop owner about is he said, well, you know, we were talking about, okay, let's say. Let's say your old small Chevy had points. Let's say the points quit working. They quit making any points. Right. We just switch it to hei. Right? Okay. They quit making hei.
Jeff Barnes [00:59:29]:
You can't get hei anymore. Okay, well, somebody else has come out with a regular, you know, another style distributor with a dual pickup coil in it, you know, for digital, you know, timing and stuff, you can. I mean, we're talking about a motor that was. That came out in 1955, and they're still creating parts because it was so simple. Right?
Jeff Compton [00:59:51]:
Yes.
Jeff Barnes [00:59:52]:
Is there going to be somebody who creates a universal, you know, network communication hub for a vehicle? Let's say a 29? You said 2019 Dodge Ram. Let's say that the body control module is the hub for the network on it. Right. It's the gateway. So that goes bad, and Chrysler's out of business. They're gone. Okay. Cuz.
Jeff Barnes [01:00:14]:
Cuz they've already been warned anyway, you know, we might just get rid of you completely. So, yeah, you drive that truck, and then that fails. Okay, you can use a used one, but for how long? You know, and. Or, you know, that we've ran into problems with that, too, where you can't use used parts on certain cars. You know, there's workarounds for it, but not every one of them. So, yeah, I mean, we're. We're gonna have to get really good at, you know, seeing the big picture on a vehicle, and, you know, we're gonna have to say, hey, I. We're gonna have to forget the money that we could have made or that we're gonna make, and we're gonna have to say, hey, I don't think.
Jeff Barnes [01:01:03]:
I don't think you should fix this car unless we're gonna fix it this certain way and use a certain part. And I'm gonna need the vehicle for a week. I know you're gonna be putting out, but I can't rush my technician on this. This can't be a rush process because there may not be too many more of these parts left that are good. And, you know, we've. There's. There's just this one road that we're going to take. We're not taking any other roads, you know, this is a nice two lane, brand new paved road with nice marked lines on it.
Jeff Barnes [01:01:30]:
And I'm not taking the ditch. I'm not taking the gravel road. I'm not going to take the long route. This is just. This is the way we're going with it. And if you don't like it, then I'm sorry, we can't. We can't help you, you know?
Jeff Compton [01:01:45]:
Yeah. I just wish there was more. I just wish the customers always made more, a smarter, more informed decision. You know what I mean? Nothing frustrates me more than when I see somebody call me up and they go, hey, I just bought this used. What do you think? And then I have to be that person that's like, oh, well, you know, here's what I can tell you about a Nissan rogue. Like, that engine is, I've seen more than one of them come in with no oil in it, and you pour oil back in it, and the thing is quiet again. Like, it was like the Honda of the nineties. It was fantastic.
Jeff Compton [01:02:18]:
But, my God, that transmission, man. You might better buy one now and then buy a spare, because, like, they're terrible. And I'm sorry that you have no recall, you know, no recourse. You have no extended warranty. Um, I don't know if that's the original transmission that's in it. I'd be very surprised if it is. If it is called Guinness, because you've got a good one. Um, you know, the world record books might want to hear you them.
Jeff Compton [01:02:45]:
Um, so.
Jeff Barnes [01:02:46]:
Oh.
Jeff Compton [01:02:46]:
But it's more than likely. It's probably got a used one in it that's been, you know, reprogrammed. Um, which I don't know what. And the fluids. What color. Oh, yeah. Okay. Sorry.
Jeff Compton [01:02:56]:
I wish you'd have called me last week. Like, I hate having those conversations with people, right? It just. It tears me up because I used to be able to say, go buy a Honda or go buy a Toyota, right? And you could buy a car that, like, this. This girl that we were speaking of that was called me about this Kia. She drives like a. I don't know, a 2002 Toyota, you know, Camry, right? And it's. It's a high mileage 2002 Toyota Camry. Like, there's some rust and, you know, it's.
Jeff Compton [01:03:29]:
But it's reliable. But it's just. It's. It's at its. It's at its end of life, right? Like, it's just too much. They're not. There's got no air conditioning left. Like, there's no point putting money into this thing.
Jeff Compton [01:03:40]:
But what do you tell these people to buy? Because it used to be, you could say, okay, go get another Toyota. And that was great. There's none left, right? All those good cars, they've all been crushed. They're all gone, right? You try to say, go get a Honda. Well, they're all, you know, that kind of car is gone, too. And so what do you tell them? To go get a Crv. Like, the CRV from, you know, 2010 on is not like the CRV from 2010 and down in terms of reliability. And, you know, they're a different car.
Jeff Compton [01:04:13]:
Even Honda went away from that Toyota, too. It's sad to see because I don't know what to recommend to people anymore. It really sucks. And I hate it because they buy something and they call me, and I got to be the bearer of bad news, and, you know, and they think it's like, what a jerk. I'm not trying to be a jerk. It's just our way of thinking is always, like, we see the worst in every vehicle. You know what I mean? Like, I hate that. That's the part that just kills me because that seems like I'm never giving good news.
Jeff Compton [01:04:40]:
I'm just giving bad news.
Jeff Barnes [01:04:44]:
Well, I'm. Yeah, to a point, yes.
Jeff Compton [01:04:48]:
Yeah. But I'm. I mean, not everybody can drive a jeep. You know what I mean? Like, they. It's. To me, I love that, but to other people is like, what a turd. But it suits me, right? So trying to put my head space on in terms of what is the perfect car for somebody else, I don't really know. And that's what stresses me when it.
Jeff Barnes [01:05:09]:
When.
Jeff Compton [01:05:09]:
When they ask, because they might drive mine and absolutely hate it and hate everything about it and, you know. But then what do you tell people? I don't. I don't know. I don't know what to do anymore. I just. I keep saying, you know, buy a caravan because, like, if you want. If you need room and you got some kids, right? But people go, you're crazy. Yeah, well, but there's a lot of them out there.
Jeff Compton [01:05:36]:
There's still really good parts. Uh, the engine has issues, sir, but show me a v six made by anybody that's overhead cam that doesn't have issues. I'll wait. Thank you. Um, nobody does, you know, uh, you're still better to buy that than just tell somebody, go buy a Ford Escape with a turbo or one that gets coolant intrusion, and you're putting an engine in it. Like, somebody, a friend of mine, she just went through that, you know, she's got one that's like, oh, I had it three months now this misfire. Yeah, I told you that would happen. Like, you know, welcome to Ford.
Jeff Compton [01:06:07]:
And this is not me ripping on any one particular brand. They're all trash. But it goes back to, what do we tell people? You know? I mean, it'd be one thing if it was just the electronics that were screwing up constantly, but the engines are garbage. The electronics are garbage. The suspensions are garbage. The brakes need, like, a scan tool just to be able to service them. Like, it's just. It's gotten ridiculous.
Jeff Barnes [01:06:33]:
Yeah. Yeah, it really has. I mean, it is a changing world and it is. It is. It is hard to not look at it as bleak. You know, a lot. A lot of guys are looking at it and going, I don't know, much longer I can do this, you know, and, yeah, I mean, I see it, but, you know, I mean, for everybody's sake, you know, if we're. If we consider ourselves the best and that we're.
Jeff Barnes [01:07:09]:
We're doing things right for people, you know, we. We have a job to do and it's. It's gonna take a lot. And I feel for a lot of the. I feel for a lot of the guys that are, you know, low, low, flat rate hour having to churn out hours. They don't have the opportunity to spend any energy on training and learning and, and staying on the up and up. They have to get the quick, fast answer, you know? But, you know, we provide them avenues, you know, and I do. I do.
Jeff Barnes [01:07:44]:
I, you know, speaking of YouTube, people like Mario, you know, do. Do I have a problem with them giving away answers? You know, sometimes, yeah. I mean, my boss does it. I mean, how do you think I feel about being a programmer when. When my boss actually sells the answers on his training channel for $25 a month? You know, I have to look at it like this and say, you know, in order for us to get better, we're going to have to get more proficient at things and being able to do things in the independent world anyway. I mean, we're not at dealerships, and so, you know, in order for us to charge more and to do better for our customers and stuff, we've got to do it ourselves. We can't rely on sending it somewhere else. And so, I mean, there's.
Jeff Barnes [01:08:38]:
There's a lot of avenues that guys have to take. I don't. I don't fault them for that. I mean, we use them, too. I figured out a car today using Google. You know, I found a TSB through Google that I could not find on, you know, our two or three service information platforms that we use. So, you know, as long as we're trying, that's all that we can do. We can't control what the manufacturers are going to do.
Jeff Barnes [01:09:07]:
We really can't control what the government is going to tell us to do. As far as a mobilizer goes, as far as emissions go. I mean, I can't go out and delete trucks anymore. You know, there's just. It's all unfortunate, yes, but we have the, the freedom to drive a vehicle in both of our countries, you know, even though your country has less freedoms than ours. I'm sorry. It's true. If you'd like me to read the news to you, I will.
Jeff Barnes [01:09:43]:
Sorry. Pretty bad.
Jeff Compton [01:09:44]:
When you get interviewed by Ratchet and Wrench magazine and you can't even share a link because Ratchet and Wrench magazine is seen as a news publication in Canada, and I can't even share the link to the article on my Facebook profile because it won't come up to any of my canadian friends. My american friends can see it, but my canadian friends have to go online to Ratchet and wrench magazine.com and find the article and read it. Do you know how. Anyway, it is what it is. We need it. Both countries. Listen, both countries need an election, like tomorrow. I'll say that.
Jeff Barnes [01:10:22]:
Yeah. Yeah.
Jeff Compton [01:10:23]:
And, but it. That's a frustrating thing for me. And, you know, it does it. Is it. Is it stopping what I'm trying to do? No, not at all. Yeah. I won't let it, you know, but it is, you know, going back to the idea of what is government overreach. Right.
Jeff Compton [01:10:41]:
Is this, this key thing in this nastiff and we, we do it to ourselves as consumers of goods, we do it to ourselves because we are never satisfied with the thing that we have. We always want the new, shiny, faster, cooler, louder, you know, more gadgets and, you know, whiz bangs and everything else. We do it to ourselves. So we have to either learn to appreciate what we have that we already have and have already paid for and keep it reliable, or we have to just embrace the fact and accept the fact. Embrace maybe isn't the right word, that it is going to become more costly and we're going to have to shift some of our priorities in life if we want to continue to be part of the motoring public to that. That's going to cost more, you know, I mean, if we're already selling, you know, $100,000 for a Ford truck, you know, or any truck. Like, if you'd have told me ten years ago, you're gonna see pickup trucks sold for a hundred thousand dollars within ten years, that it told you you were nuts. Because I can remember when the most expensive ram didn't go 50, you know, and now it's a hundred.
Jeff Compton [01:11:54]:
And people are just. People are paying it, you know, so the idea that we can't get paid in this industry for something we can't get paid more than a program a key is ridiculous. If they're making the payment on a hundred and a hundred thousand dollar truck, they can certainly find $800 to program two keys for, right? It's not. Don't tell me that it can. All keys loss shouldn't be something that people immediately have to have sympathy for that person. It's gonna sound really braggadocious, but I have never lost a key for a vehicle I own yet in my life, because it's just. I was just trained that, like, they're on you all the time, you know, where they are constantly. Now, I understand sometimes people.
Jeff Compton [01:12:47]:
Marital things happen and, you know, cool, I get it. But I mean, you know, how many times have you had it, got a call from somebody that's like, well, we used to have two, and then we lost one, and now my. Whatever has lost the other key, and the car is sitting there completely useless because we have no keys. I'm sorry, but there's bigger issues at hand in that household than getting keys programmed. Like, what have you. What have you put into society people. Right, right. Yeah, yeah.
Jeff Compton [01:13:27]:
Anyway, I won't keep any more of your time. I appreciate you always coming on here. We had. I appreciate you listening to me rant this week. I am glad that you shared some memes with me, as always. I'm glad that you ranted at me because it got a good conversation happening. You know, it's a situation of, this is just something that we're gonna get through together, all of us, you know, it's. The technology is out there to be able to meet.
Jeff Compton [01:13:57]:
I think any obstacle that we. That we encounter, just continue to. People that are listening, continue to network, you know, continue to do your training. Like, you know, there's so many people out there. You and I were talking before we started recording tonight about tick tock. There's so many sharp, sharp people on all the social media platforms. It's. It's absolutely incredible.
Jeff Compton [01:14:23]:
The stuff that I've just seen on TikTok today alone. The problems guys are solving and the way they're documenting is showing to people. It's unreal. It's. It's unreal. So, you know, as I honestly believe, as long as we have access to information, it's gonna be the key thing, and then we share with each other, network with each other. I don't think this nasty thing is a big obstacle at all. I really don't.
Jeff Compton [01:14:49]:
And, you know, I hurt for people that genuinely are being, you know, are having a hard time what it's going to mean to their business. But I believe, you know, keep doing what you have to do, you know, keep doing what. What it's going to take. You know, it's not, unfortunately, there's going to be casualties. There always is. It's just. That's called progress, I guess. Um, you know, and I wish everybody the best.
Jeff Compton [01:15:19]:
So, what are. Any closing thoughts, Jeff?
Jeff Barnes [01:15:24]:
Um, I don't think so. I mean, I know.
Jeff Compton [01:15:31]:
Yeah.
Jeff Barnes [01:15:31]:
I think we got it all out there.
Jeff Compton [01:15:33]:
Yeah.
Jeff Barnes [01:15:34]:
Oh, yeah. Don't. Don't get offended by what I say about Nastiff.
Jeff Compton [01:15:39]:
No. And listen, people that listen to me every week, I appreciate the fact that even if you sometimes do get offended by what I have to say or think that you still keep tuning in, because, I mean, as much as it might sound, I'm really not trying to offend anybody. It is just. It's the way I talk. It's the way I am. It always has been. I appreciate the people that know me and love me. They just get it.
Jeff Compton [01:16:06]:
Chuck Engine Chuck is like. He's rude as shit, and it's like I'm not, but it's just. It's blunt like a spoon, and it really is. And I appreciate everybody's support. The people that know me, like Jeff here, he knows exactly what I mean. He knows just like, you know, he knows exactly where I'm coming from. He knows the kind of person that we are, what we try to do for each other in this industry, and, you know, there's no better people, I think, in this industry right now than the people that I'm currently aligned with. And, you know, I'm blessed to have them in my life.
Jeff Compton [01:16:41]:
I'm blessed to have the employer that I have. There's. It's just. It's all good. It's heading in a good place. I really believe this industry is headed in a good place now. The pay is incredible. The working conditions are getting better every day.
Jeff Compton [01:16:59]:
Don't dwell on this nasty thing as if it's, like, gonna lock people out. Don't see it as, like that. Just kind of, like, you hear me say, do a lateral move. You know, adapt and overcome. We can all do it. So, anyway, thank you, everybody. Thank you, Jeff, for being with us tonight, and glad to have you on again. You will be on again.
Jeff Compton [01:17:24]:
Uh, it's gonna be. It's gonna be that way here. And, um, I just want to thank everybody for all the support and love. We've got some great changes coming, uh, some great updates in the near future. It's gonna be. It's gonna be awesome. So. And, uh, thank you, everybody.
Jeff Compton [01:17:39]:
We'll talk to you soon. Ciao. Hey, if you could do me a favor real quick and, like, comment on and share this episode, I'd really appreciate it. And please, most importantly, set the podcast to automatically download every Tuesday morning. As always, I'd like to thank our amazing guests for their perspectives and expertise, and I hope that you'll please join us again next week on this journey of change. Thank you to my partners in the Asaw group and to the changing the industry podcast. Remember what I always say, in this industry, you get what you pay for. Here's hoping everyone finds their missing ten.
Jeff Compton [01:18:15]:
Mm. And we'll see you all again next time.