Subscribe
Share
Share
Embed
This podcast offers business solutions to help listeners develop and implement action plans for lean process improvement and implement continuous improvement projects, cost reductions, product quality enhancements, and process effectiveness improvement. Listeners come from many industries in both manufacturing and office applications.
Kathy Miller 0:00
Helping people see that they matter, their work matters, you know, making things meaningful to them. When I ran a rubber division, we were measuring them on how many pieces per heat they got out that were good, you know, and these abstract numbers, but when we showed them where these seals were being used all over the world, it gave a new sense of energy and purpose to the organization where they wanted to really put in their discretionary effort.
Catherine McDonald 0:41
Hello, and welcome to this episode of the Lean Solutions Podcast. My name is Catherine McDonald, and I am your host for today. I'm flying solo today. My, my co-hosts are, as the kids would say, AFK, away from keyboard. We won't ask what they're doing, but we have a great guest for you today. I am joined today by Kathy Miller, and the title of this episode is Leading with More. So, stick around to find out what Cathy is going to tell us. First of all, I'd just like to actually introduce Kathy, and hi Kathy, you're over there, the other side of me, and just give you a little bit of insight into Cathy's background. She's a wonderful guest. She has a wonderful bio, and I was just telling her earlier I had to really figure out how to cut it down, because it was just so amazing. So, Kathy has led successful business transformations in multiple industries, including aerospace and automotive. She has a passion for developing organizational cultures that get results based on inclusivity, trust, accountability, and continuous improvement, Kathy was most recently the global vice president of Verteb Operating System, responsible for development and global implementation of the newly created operating system. Prior to that, she also served as global director of manufacturing, assembly, and test for Rolls Royce defense. Prior to that, she worked for Parker Hannifin, where she was GM of the Engineered Seals Division, and so much more. Cathy most recently graduated from the University of Pennsylvania with a master's in applied positive psychology, which is amazing. She, in the past, authored a book, which I love the name of Steel Toes and Stilettos, a true story of women manufacturing leaders and lean transformation success. And she also has a new book out called More is Better, which we really want to find out more about today. She's been published numerous times in multiple journals and articles. And Kathy, I think you can probably tell us a little bit more about that yourself, so you're very welcome to the show.
Kathy Miller 2:43
Thank you, Catherine. It's so great to be here.
Catherine McDonald 2:45
Great, we are delighted to have you. So, Cathy, as I said, that was an impressive bio, and it was really only a fraction of your story. So, I was looking at your bio, I was looking at your website, I was looking at all the different things you do, and you really, it's amazing how you have led all of these massive operational transformations, and I wonder to myself as I was looking at it, when you look back on what you've done in terms of leading all of these transformations, what, what, what comes to mind when you do actually have time to sit back and reflect and think, which I'm sure isn't often what comes to mind. What do you, what do you think about in terms of your, your accomplishments, and these companies' accomplishments?
Kathy Miller 3:28
I'm so proud of the teams that I led at all of these organizations. You know, when you're the leader, you're just one person, and you can do a lot of things, build trust and involve people in the organization, and I think that it's you can also destroy it, depending on your behaviors as well. So, as I look back, my tenure in these leadership roles, which were challenging and wonderful, and all that, you know, one on one. I think that the issue is I was really strong about creating trust in organizations. I did not have a lot of tolerance for silos or inter functional arguments, and those sorts of things, and so there were really a number of principles that facilitated our lean transformations, and just our transformations from sometimes very command and control cultures to very inclusive environments. So it was to me about the things that I'm really reflecting in, more is better, right? Helping people see that they matter, their work matters, you know, making things meaningful to them. When I ran a rubber division, super hard for people to connect with how they were making the world a better place when they were working at, you know, the presses, and we were measuring them on how many pieces. Or heat, they got out that were good, you know, and these abstract numbers, but when we showed them where these seals were being used all over the world, it gave a new sense of energy and purpose to the organization, where they wanted to really put in their discretionary effort, so I think that was important optimism when I look back, was really important. I would not have called it optimism before I went back for positive psychology. I would have called it problem solving, which is a part of it, but optimism from the organizational psychologist Dr. Marty Seligman, the father of positive psychology is all about the stories you tell yourself when things go wrong, and as you know, in operations every day multiple things go wrong, and if you can look at those as not pervasive, not permanent, and not personal, you can help lead an organization to what's the next step, not this, it's always going to be this way, woe is me, sort of thing, you know, and that learned helplessness. So, before positive psychology, I would just call it continuous improvement and rigorous problem solving, but those are the tools behind that mental capacity for optimism, which is something you can actually develop, and I think that's fascinating. And, of course, those relationships, right? That's the R in M O R of E, you know, those moments where you can build trust through small things, small gestures that you do
Catherine McDonald 6:42
excellent, excellent, so your book is really based on around this whole idea, is it of how you approach large scale transformation with not just, which is what you see a lot of books focusing on, not just the process by which you do that and the tools, but also the leadership, the attitude, the approach, almost the self leadership that's required. Yes,
Kathy Miller 7:07
absolutely. It's, you know, positive psychology translated to what it looks like on a factory floor, you know, because these brilliant researchers who, who put the science together, mainly focus on what I call people who work on the carpet and not necessarily lead on the on the concrete as well, and so the principles all apply. That's what I found when I was studying this after 30 years of running these large high-stress organizations, but they don't always look in a factory like they might look in a service organization or an insurance organization or those sorts of things, so the book is about those pillars of meaning, optimism, and relationships, how to, how they might look for those who lead on concrete as well, and you know the interventions you can do to build those pillars, so that you achieve excellence.
Catherine McDonald 8:08
Brilliant, I love it. Okay, and is so more is better, that that's your acronym. Yeah, and so brilliant, that's good to know. So, obviously, that's what the book is structured around. We'll come back to the book in a moment. I just.. I'm so fascinated by what you've done, what you've achieved within these organizations you've worked in, as well. And I said to you earlier, it is lovely to have somebody on the show who knows the background to, and the theory behind organizational psychology, behind lean, even, but somebody who has gone out and put these concepts and theories into practice and actually I suppose worked in practice in the way that we're always being advised to work, but also in the way that we see so many places not working too. So I'm just so excited to have you on the show to be able to talk to us more. Can you tell me a little bit, because I am so fascinated. You said you went into some organizations and they were very much command and control. They didn't think the way that you thought in terms of what needed to be done, and they most certainly didn't work in thinking originally about how they were shaping things or not shaping things. So, how do you approach that when maybe other people don't see what you see, and it's your job to help the whole organization see what you see and shape their behaviors and their habits. How do you do that?
Kathy Miller 9:31
Well, first of all, consistency, right? When you go into an organization that you need to transform, you need to help paint that vision for people of what it can look like, and you're painting it for people who haven't experienced it before, you know. And at first, you get this whole skepticism thing, where you know people like, okay, here's the latest leader, here's the thing, you know, perhaps we can just do the. Minimum until she leaves and the next guy comes around with his program, right. So, there's a lot of skepticism. So, I think it involves a lot of communication, a lot of painting the vision, and a lot of active listening. What are the areas of resistance, and instead of just dictating this is how it's going to be, you ease them into it by helping them become part of the process, and using more than their hands, but using their hearts and their heads as well, and when they feel like they can contribute to progress in and you create a situation and a culture where people have the opportunity to master things that they weren't exposed to before, and they're rewarded for bringing up issues that need to be resolved, instead of being afraid to bring them up, it takes on a life of its own, and it becomes the system. You teach people the tools, but you allow them to adapt them to the individual situation. You know, when I was the global vice president of the Parker Lean system, and in 24 countries, and 250 plants, every general manager I met, without doubt, was like, Kathy, this stuff is great for everybody else, but our division is unique and special and different, you know, and I want to honor that. I wouldn't fight with them, you know. I wouldn't say, well, this is the operating system, you know, that the company is going to use and get on board or get out. I, I was like, what are you concerned about? What are the differences, you know? And what if you asked, you know, Joe on line A, how you know we could create less scrap and start there. What would that look like? Because everybody can understand that scrap is waste, and you know you can multiply it by three in terms of cost, and and that sort of thing. So it's just, and it's about consistency, a consistent message. It's not like, okay, this month we're going to work on scrap reduction, and next month we're going to work on bottlenecks, and then the, you know, just having that whole system being consistent, and let people get involved, and then they learn it, and they own it, and that's ultimately where the best transformations take place. Yeah,
Catherine McDonald 12:44
I agree with you wholeheartedly. And I sometimes think so. What you're describing to me almost feels like a pull system, where, and I would apply that concept to people as well as processes and systems in operations, and I think what most people do is it's this push system with people where we push people into a change and we tell them here's what we want to achieve and here's what we want you to do and here's what you have to do, whereas what you're describing is very much come along, you know, talk to me, tell me, tell me what you think, tell me what your concerns are so you are handing over the control to others to get almost involved and have their concerns heard, which I think has to be the way we cannot push people into something and expect more and different from them when there is something already on their mind that they're not happy about, so we have to pull that from people initially to, in order for them down the line to be able to have the head space and the physical ability to get involved in what we would like them to get involved in. So, I love that approach, and it is very much in line with, you know, what you talked about in your book, which is the importance of relationships, the importance of building relationships with the people we work with, and it is all about the relationship. It's not about us versus them, you know. It is a relationship, it's us working together. So, I love that. I think it's amazing. I also wondered, when you walk into a company, and I'm sure, or into a role in a company, I'm sure that there, there are struggles, and there are some efforts that haven't always been smooth sailing, and I wondered, what is the difference between a department or a company who succeeds in transformation and let's say change, and one who doesn't? What's the first thing you notice about a company who simply doesn't or can't do right now the things that they need to do to be able to change,
Kathy Miller 14:43
well, quite honestly, there are sometimes casualties of an implementation, and I think that it's really important that you, as the leader, are able to understand it and embrace it and understand where you're trying to go with it. Not every leader is going to. Have the benefit of being the global leader of the transformation system. Right, so first you have to educate people on what the tools are, what they provide, what's possible, and if they can, you know, really internalize that and get people involved. It's great. There are other people who give you the, you know, yes, I'm going to do it, and then they don't, and I have had.. I always give everybody a chance to have the seat on the bus, but every once in a while, people have to go on a different bus, so that the others can actually succeed, and it doesn't take a lot of people exiting that bus for people to get the message that, oh, we're serious about improving our business, you know. For me, I was always so passionate about lean because I just saw, I mean, the results are phenomenal if you do it right. They're not instant, they're not instant. Sometimes you have to put a lot of infrastructure before you hit that tipping point, where it starts to, you know, come out in the results, but I, a couple things really drove me, and I was very honest and open about those things. One was when I, you know, we didn't talk about my background, but I literally started working in a vehicle assembly plant when I was 17 years old as an industrial engineering co-op student, and after five years of being in that environment, the plant closed down after being in operation for 50 years, and I followed the last car down the line with these like big burly men, you know, who are super loud and larger than life, and many of them were reduced to tears because, you know, they had so much of their life and their identity tied up in their role that I saw as time went on watching that the people from that operation, you know, the personal impact it had on them, their families, the community, and, you know, very early in life I was like, if I ever get a chance to lead, I don't want things like that to happen on my watch, you know, I want to create the best businesses, yeah. in, in the world, so that if my team members' kids or grandchildren want to work there, they would have the opportunity to do that. I'm just so passionate about manufacturing being this inclusive place where there's a place for everybody, from a tech diploma to a PhD, you know, you can add value, you can have a great living for your family. So I was highly motivated by that from that significant emotional event early in my career, but I also had people invest in me. I got to learn from some of the people that wrote the books, you know, John Shook, Rick Harris, Jim Womack, and so I really valued what was poured into me to learn these systems and see how they really worked in some of my very initial transformations in UAW plants were so eye opening. I just became this huge, huge believer in it. So, you know, so I think that that's important in turn to pour into your people. Why are we doing this? Because maybe your kids want to work here someday, you know, and you haven't seen this right, you haven't seen it before, but here's what I've seen and done with teams that we educated and involved, and it's tremendous, and it's quite honestly a better way to live once you get a taste of it,
Catherine McDonald 18:55
100% Oh, when you, we spend so much of our time and work, there has to be that meaning and purpose, and something bigger than just doing the job every day, and I think if we had more people who understood that, and who felt that, I mean, work would be so different in the world for everybody, there would be a lot less stress as well. So, yeah, I do understand where you're coming from, and I see the need for it in so many places, as well, especially manufacturing, it's had a tough ride, I think. Manufacturing has over the years, and there's still a lot of work to do in that sector. But look, hopefully you know, I would love more people to read your books. I know your first book, was it, was it targeted towards women in, or was that just part of the story?
Kathy Miller 19:43
That's a great, that's a great question. Yes, and no is the answer. So I co-wrote it with a colleague and friend, Shannon Carls. I, this was at the Rubber Plants, I was the general manager, she was the head of improvement for. The whole division, both in the plants and in the business processes, and you know the results we got over three years from deploying the tools, involving the team, just creating this inclusive environment, and you know, providing them with support were phenomenal. Now you don't feel it when you're going through it, because you're really judged by, like, your last quarters, you know, earnings when you are a public company, and some are better than others because of a lot of variables, but we wrote the book as a lean road map for anybody who wants to implement the process? Someone actually described the book as this generation's version of the goal, so although we didn't express expressly write out the roadmap, we did. There is a roadmap, right? And and the tools that you implement in what order, what goes wrong, how you have to take one step forward, two steps back, all the things. It's very realistic, but the so it's for anybody who wants to go through that transformation. It also has the roadmap of sort of the positive psychology aspects of making that cultural transformation again. There's no visual on it, but you can see how we go through and win the team over, and where things go wrong. It's such a fun book, because it's a, you know, I'm a little biased, but it's my, you know, it's, it's a business book, but it's written like a story, and it is a true story, and it's funny because you get two perspectives. So, I'm the general manager, I'm like, oh my gosh, we had Office 5s Day, it's my favorite day, I buy pizza, I go around and audit everybody, I'm putting stickers on their badges, you know, like a 55 year old people, like they're five years old in kindergarten, but everybody loved the sticker thing, like I'm just like it's the greatest day. And then Shannon's like, I hate Office 5s day more than anything in the world, you know, I'm like, people are mad that the dumpsters overflowing, they're just like this is stupid. Why do we do this, and that, Shannon, blah blah blah, you know. So it's a very realistic.. it's almost like two books and one for that. Yeah, other piece of it, Catherine, that is sort of a side, but it's so.. it's for, you know, all the genders, anybody who's going through that transformation. Yes, but we also wanted to put out an example in the world of women being kind and supporting each other in the workplace, because that's not always the way it is. When I was growing up, I did not have any female mentors, everybody that helped me along were male, male allies, male mentors, and so I don't like to go come across as being like anti-male in any way, because I would not have had, you know, the success I had had these wonderful men not poured into me and mentored me and been an ally when I wasn't in the room, but we do want to be like, look, good things can happen when you don't feel like there's only one seat at the table that we're going to lift each other up, and so that's the women part of
Catherine McDonald 23:30
it,
Kathy Miller 23:30
that that really meant something to us.
Catherine McDonald 23:32
Okay, amazing, that sounds like a fantastic book. Not everyone can have a Kathy Miller come into their organization, so it sounds like something that would really help anybody who wants to understand what you've been through and how you've approached it. I think it sounds great, but just to finish up the last few minutes on your most recent book, More Is Better. Why did you write? Why did you decide? Well, we will. I need to do another book.
Kathy Miller 23:55
Well, first of all, as an engineer, I'm a little bit of an unusual person, and that I love to write, I you know, I constantly submitting things to journals and industry today, and that, like, I just love that. I think it's a great way to get your message out in the world. And it was really based on my capstone at Penn when I went back for my master's and applied positive psychology. I looked at it and I was like, you know, I've got 118 pages of content here that that that model emerged for me upon reflection of my career and reflection of a year of learning from all the renowned psychologists in the world on organizational behavior, and I was like, I need to be that translator for manufacturing, there were not a ton of people going through the map program that had that industrial executive manufacturing background, so I feel that it's my mission to get this out in the world and just make it so approachable, real talk, real. Tactics and things you can do very easily. One of the things that I love about manufacturing is, particularly in the smaller companies and the medium-sized companies that I work with now, that you know I have my own consulting business and coaching business, is that many times the first line supervisors are people that were the best operator, the best machine repair person, the most dependable, the most likable person. And then they get promoted to first line leadership, they got 24 people reporting to them, and they haven't had the leadership background. So I wanted this to be so approachable and say, hey, do these things. This is how you do it. You know, you don't need a master's in positive psychology to create a wonderful, inclusive culture that gets results. So, it's sort of my mission in life to do that. And one of the things that I put in the book, Katherine, is a QR code to my website, there's the more mentor, and you can ask it questions, and it'll give you an answer from the book. So awesome. So it's just based on my book, which is based on the, you know, my experiences of 30 years leading at all levels in manufacturing, as well as, you know, the renowned psychologists that have studied organizations, and so you can go in and say, "Hey, you know, you're on third shift, like you said, Kathy can't come everywhere, and not that you would want me everywhere, right? But you're on third shift, and two guys aren't getting along, or you know, a tooling situation, you just pull up, you know more for leaders go to the more mentor and like how should I approach this and you get the how to do a little more today from it so kind of like Coach Kathy in your pocket I just want this to be accessible to everybody I want it to be simple for everybody because I want us to have strong manufacturing and provide these jobs for people,
Catherine McDonald 27:02
I love it. I love your enthusiasm. I love your mix of qualifications and interests and experience. It is, it is rare. I agree with you to find somebody who has those kinds of mixes of backgrounds with, you know, positive psychology thrown in there with all the rest, it's quite rare, and I think it's amazing. I think it's exactly what the world needs, never mind a manufacturing organization. And Kathy, just on the last couple of minutes, if someone's listening to this podcast and they think, okay, well, I'm definitely going to buy Kathy's books now, so that's that's a definite, but just let's say we buy the book and just don't get to read it for a couple of weeks, but they really want to start making some changes, and they really want to see that and do the things that you're talking about in terms of working inclusively, engaging people as well as working on maybe the more lean operational side of things, and really changing the way the organization works. Tell me, what's a couple of things they can take away and start doing just even right away today.
Kathy Miller 28:03
Okay. Well, the first thing you can do is go to my website, More Four leaders.com It's the number four, and on there there's a free downloadable guide for frontline supervisors that tells people how you know some actions they can do to do a little more today, and then eventually they're in the book, there's one for middle managers and executives, but I think that the frontline leaders can use it the most, so you can go there and get that and just start following those guidelines, but basically they're very simple things you can do to start shifting norms towards how you want your culture to be. So, for one thing, you could just say, you know, every day I'm going to go on the floor for 15 minutes, no matter what, and instead of just worrying about who came in late, what's the next shipment, that sort of thing, reserving 15 minutes on your calendar to do an observation and have a talk with someone, and say, "Hey, if you could change one thing about it, this this task you're doing to be easier, what would it be? People will know, and if you can help them do that, they're going to be like, "Huh, this person follows up and actually cares about what I'm doing.
Catherine McDonald 29:23
I agree 100% And it's the consistency, as you said earlier, the consistency is everything. And don't worry about perfectionism. Go out and try it, and try it this week. Then reflect, follow your PDCA, check in with yourself, see how that went. Make a small adjustment to next week, but keep going, and get a coach if you need a coach to help you, but don't sit there and do nothing differently. Go out and try to make those small changes to your leadership. Absolutely love that, Kathy. Your advice is just invaluable. It's been an absolute pleasure to talk with you. We've learned so much, and I'm sure our listeners will be listening to this more than once, because there's just so much in. And so I'd like to thank you for your time and all of that great information, and Kathy, we've already called out your website. There are you also on LinkedIn? If people want to connect, I am.
Kathy Miller 30:09
I am Kathy Miller, is a very common name. There's a lot of Kathy Miller's, so it's Kathy with the K Miller, and it's M M A P P, so it's map MBA ACC, that's the right one.
Catherine McDonald 30:25
Yes, excellent. Okay, great. So, hopefully everyone got that, and don't forget, go out and buy Kathy's new book, More Is Better, as well. And Kathy, thanks a million. And listen to everybody else who's listening. Thanks for listening or watching if you're looking at us on YouTube, and we will see you again on the next episode of the Lean Solutions Podcast, and bye for now.
Unknown Speaker 30:46
Bye.