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Every Tuesday on the CosmoFactory podcast: Discover the latest innovations along the cosmetics and personal care supply chain. Hear thought-provoking conversations with top beauty industry experts from around the world. Learn about next-level solutions and find inspiration to turn your own ideas into industry-changing innovations.
A PRODUCTION OF Cosmoprof Worldwide Bologna
CosmoFactory is the first podcast from Cosmoprof Worldwide Bologna—the most important beauty trade show in the world. Dedicated to all sectors of the industry, Cosmoprof Worldwide Bologna welcomes over 250,000 visitors from 150 countries and regions and nearly 3,000 exhibitors to Bologna, Italy, each year. It’s where our diverse and international industry comes together to build business relationships and to discover the best brands and newest innovations across consumer beauty, professional beauty, and the entire supply chain. The trade show includes a robust program of exclusive educational content, featuring executives and key opinion leaders from every sector of the cosmetics, fragrance, and personal care industry. Cosmoprof Worldwide Bologna is the most important event of the Cosmoprof international network, with exhibitions in Asia (Hong Kong), the US (Las Vegas and Miami), India (Mumbai) and Thailand (Bangkok). Thanks to its global exhibitions Cosmoprof connects a community of more than 500,000 beauty stakeholders and 10,000 companies from 190 countries and regions. Learn more today at Cosmoprof.com
CosmoFactory was co-developed in collaboration with supply-side expert Deanna Utroske, Host of the CosmoFactory podcast and Editor of the Beauty Insights newsletter.
This transcript is automatically generated.
[00:00:00]
Deanna: Welcome to CosmoFactory. A podcast by Cosmoprof Worldwide Bologna, where we explore the entire cosmetics, personal care, and fragrance industry supply chain. I'm your host, Deanna Utroske. And here at CosmoFactory, we look beyond the trends to discover the ideas, initiatives, and innovations that are truly advancing beauty.
Deanna: Let's get started.
Deanna: On this episode, we're talking about Nordic beauty, about cultural awareness, local and regional beauty brands, and the global beauty economy. Joining me today on the CosmoFactory podcast is Johanna Rönkkö, founder of a brand called NOBE and CEO at Nordic Beauty Inc. Welcome.
Johanna: Thank you very much.
Johanna: Great to be here. I'm very exciting week.
Deanna: Indeed. Um, so I was thinking about, you know, global beauty trends. And I would say [00:01:00] that of all the regional or maybe country specific beauty movements, I'm going to say that Korean beauty, right, K beauty, the most well branded, if we can use that expression. But I would call you an expert in, in a different region.
Deanna: And that's Nordic beauty. So I'm hoping you can start us off by talking about the characteristics of a Nordic beauty brand. What, what is Nordic beauty? What makes it distinctive? So
Johanna: I think, um, Nordic is, uh, Nordic beauty, we've, 10 years ago, for example, They were not that many Nordic beauty brands or, oh, they have always been, but now it seems that like the cosmetics is coming more and more because it's actually the whole ecosystem of Nordic cosmetics and Nordic beauty is getting bigger and bigger.
Johanna: But what are the values behind the Nordic beauty? It's more like we are like in the Nordics. We're talking about beauty. When we talk about Nordics, we talk about Sweden, Denmark, Iceland, Norway, Finland. Sometimes we always calculate the [00:02:00] Baltics, also to the Nordics region, so Estonia and Latvia and Lithuania.
Johanna: But anyway, so the northern part of Europe. And there I think we all have like, We share the same values when it comes to sustainability and like clean ingredients and clean beauty and also like we all love to go to forest. It's really like quite close to the nature. We have a lot of forest. Only Finland has 150, 000 lakes and you can almost drink the water from the lake.
Johanna: It's so clean. It's so clean. So all that clean water. Um, and also like the whole, um, Um, as I say, like equality, all these type of things, and it's super important in Nordics and all. It sounds
Deanna: like, if I may, it sounds like it has a lot to do with the environmental situations or conditions, but also something ethical as well.
Johanna: Yes. I think we are really like, uh, with, yeah, I think when we put all those [00:03:00] values together. And then really good innovations that we have in the Nordics. We are really also really engineer countries. Nokia came from Finland and you know, we are full of engineers and researchers in the Nordics. So when you put all that technology, this innovation, but at the same time, all those good values together.
Johanna: You create amazing products, amazing products and amazing brands. Um, so I think, I think, I, I think that the world will hear a lot more about the Nordic beauty brands in the future.
Deanna: And let's go ahead and put your expertise into context. Talk about your role in the beauty industry and the two companies you're working with.
Deanna: the brand and the and the larger business.
Johanna: Yeah. So, um, I think, uh, I started 10 years ago. Um, I would come from completely different, uh, industry. I was in the IT industry before for Fujitsu Siemens. So Japanese, German, uh, joint [00:04:00] venture. So it was, um, quite, quite different world. Um, then when I started, like, I mean, we've been bringing to the Nordics, until now, it's been super important to us to find the best.
Johanna: Brands in their own categories, bring, bring the best beauty brands from the world to the Nordics.
Deanna: And this is the company called Nordic Beauty Inc., you're importing brands to the region.
Johanna: I'm making them super successful.
Deanna: And help me think about how you've been selecting those brands. What makes someone a good fit for the Nordic market?
Johanna: It's also changed a lot. So when we started, We were looking for internet. We were looking for some of the social media and all. But then we were, of course, following what's, what big, uh, big retailers like Sephora or Ulta. What's happening in U. S. We're looking at a lot of what's happening in U. S. That was always like following the U.
Johanna: S. market. Now it's quite changed. Now we look at a lot of what's happening in Korea. And we also look at a lot of what's [00:05:00] happening in Japan and Australia. So it's, um, it's quite different. gone really global kind of, um, there's a lot of leaders. Everyone is a leader in, in some ways, uh, every region, I w I would say there's a lot of, and of course the market has gotten a lot faster also.
Johanna: So you actually, you actually checking TikTok like daily, like what is, what is hot today? Like, you know, it was 10 years ago that was hot. Like last year, it might come to Finland. Maybe the Nordic people will accept it, like, after one year. Now it's like, it's in TikTok today, they accept it tonight. So it's much faster, but super interesting, super exciting, and, and, um, yeah, growing, growing industry.
Johanna: But I also feel that the beauty brings the whole world together, and it's quite nice.
Deanna: Yeah, it's quite interesting to hear you talk about the pace of adoption, um, speeding up or the, you know, the pace of consumer interest in various brands. [00:06:00] Because it does have to do with what's happening in other markets.
Deanna: But I, I'm also imagining that there's something particular about the Nordic beauty consumer. Am I, am I wrong? We were, you know, initially we mentioned, um, you know, that, that it's a very environmentally conscious region. Um, uh, perhaps we can say a fairly ethical region, um, do those values, impact what sorts of brands you're seeing an interest in what, what folks are buying, or is it more about global beauty trends?
Johanna: No, it's definitely like super important that equality, like positive feminism and all this kind of like, uh, Equality and all this kind of messages are super important and have brands have also really good ethics behind, behind them. Also then obviously vegan, cruelty free, all these, all these topics, of course, are super, super important.
Johanna: And are
Deanna: you able to share any of the brands that Nordic Beauty Inc works with?
Johanna: Yes. Yes, of course. So, so, [00:07:00] um, we've been picking up. We get a lot of friends, like probably 100 per week, to ask to come to our, and we would love to take them all, of course. Really, really, it's really hard for me to say no.
Johanna: Because there's so many amazing brands out there, but we always try to look for something unique, something super unique and kind of the best brands in their own categories. And we have, for example, we have Frank Body from Australia. We find that Frank Body is the best body care brand in the world. And it is.
Johanna: And then we have from Korea, we have Tony Moly, Huxley, which we find one hidden gem, which is like something everyone has to try Huxley, by the way, it's, it's amazing formulation.
Johanna: Also, um, uh, yeah, prior jail from New York haircare. So, and the, there again, we have like Briogeo is kind of a super food for hair. But yeah, a lot of, a lot of brands across the [00:08:00] world that we have been bringing so far.
Deanna: And then you've gone ahead and developed your own brand as well as a, as a
Johanna: result. Yes.
Johanna: So now of course, uh, we love to bring and the Nordic style, of course, all the Nordic and European men and ladies are super happy that we have brought all these amazing friends across the world to the North to Europe. But of course we had always had a dream. almost since the beginning, we would love to also make something amazing to the world from the Nordics, like, uh, with the best Nordic ingredients and with the best chemist and with the best, uh, packaging and, and best story.
Johanna: So that's what we've been now doing last years and now it's all out there and it's super exciting. Yeah. And if
Deanna: someone isn't not yet familiar with the Nobe brand, what's in the, in the portfolio, what's in the product line?
Johanna: So Nobe is Inspired by the Nordic nature. If you look at it, uh, it's super beautiful.
Johanna: It has like every, it's gotten the inspiration from the Northern Lights. So [00:09:00] every bottle is actually different color. And when you put them to your bathroom or on the shelf, uh, at the, at the retailer, they make the colors of the Northern Lights. It's quite beautiful. And also in the packaging, you have that, um, we have three lines.
Johanna: Uh, it's kind of, we wanted to bring the clean that. Natural ingredients, but mix them with the Nordic innovation and Nordic innovative ingredients and so on. So we have three lines. We have forest, um, forest elixir line, which is based in this. We talk about it more in a minute, probably, but the based the forest microbial extract, which is something super innovating and super exciting.
Johanna: Um, then there is a cooling care line. You know, in the Nordics, we do all these crazy things. We roll in the snow and do ice swimming. And we actually feel that the cold is good for us, good for our skin and it activates the skin. So the cooling care line is for that kind of depuffing and so on. And then we have the Oat Wonder line.
Johanna: And there, oat has been like in our heritage, [00:10:00] like our grandmas and grandpas in the Nordics, and there was a war, we actually put oat in into our wounds, how do you say it? Wounds. Wounds. Yeah. and, uh, and um, and the ladies, my grandma used to put oat on her face. Yes. And, uh, so, and then we've been eating always like, porridge, oat porridge.
Johanna: That's like the thing in, in the Nordics, like every morning. So, uh, it's really good. inside for us oat, but also it's a miracle ingredient also for the skin. It's really E vitamin rich. So anyway, so that's the oat wonder is the third line, but it's all inspired by the Northern heritage. Yeah.
Deanna: That's lovely.
Deanna: As I, as I keep asking you questions, you've mentioned the oats and I know you have an interesting ingredient partnership regarding oats. Can you talk a little bit about that?
Johanna: I don't know how many of you know, but Fazer is one of the biggest food producers, or biggest bakeries in the Nordics. So they produce chocolate and bread and have a [00:11:00] really big bakery.
Johanna: And they have started to also create now Cosmetic ingredients, uh, as side streams from the food production, which is, which is of course, super, super smart. Um, and, uh, and there we have found two amazing ingredients like this oat xylitol that we use in the cooling care line, it's, um, um, cooling and hydrating and healing, and then we have the, uh, oat oil, which, uh, Fazer found this really innovative way to extract.
Johanna: oil for cosmetics from the, of the oat and, uh, and it's really E vitamin rich and yeah, super ingredient.
Deanna: No, that's excellent to think about not only the ingredient benefits, um, but regional sourcing. You're talking about upcycling from the food industry. Um, yeah, it sounds, it sounds very smart. You, you already used that word, but I, I think that's accurate.
Johanna: Yeah, yeah, we are. We and the products are, you have to, yeah, we are at the Cosmoprof here. So you have to come to [00:12:00] the Hall 14 and try them out.
Deanna: Absolutely. Um, and you mentioned the forest line within NOBE Beauty as well. And I, I believe there's a regional ingredient partnership that's informing that.
Johanna: Yes. So that's something super innovative. So Uute Scientific, um, small, uh, ingredient, uh, company from the, from, from the Nordics have created together with the Helsinki and Tampere University from Finland. Uh, this ingredient, which has like 600 different forest microbes, the microbes from the forest.
Johanna: Uh, uh, in it, um, it's really like forest microbial extract. That's how we call it. So, so it actually like. Nature, you know, nature,
Deanna: I think it's very important because when we talk about microbiome skin care, there is a sector of that conversation that is very focused on, what has happened or changed as [00:13:00] people live in a much more built environment and are not spending as much time in the forest or in direct contact with nature.
Deanna: And I think this ingredient is, is working to, to bridge that gap that the built environment or urban life has, has created.
Johanna: Yeah. It's been really scientifically proven, uh, by the That we are kind of too clean, you know, think about the COVID times we were, we were washing our hands with alcohol gel, like killing all the good bacteria.
Johanna: So, so it, our immunity goes away and that's people get sick. Then after COVID people were super sick and super many skin problems, a lot of eczema and stuff like this. So, um, it's now proven that actually we should have this good microbes, this good dirt, so to say, on our skin, because it's really actually strengthening our skin barrier.
Johanna: And it's really, um, they've made this test, um, at the Helsinki University, where it all actually started was that they made this that they put for the [00:14:00] kids. They had two sand, two sandboxes, one sandbox with only sand and the other sandbox, it was with this forest humus.
Deanna: Okay.
Johanna: And then after that, they, they took the best out of the baby's poop or whatever, and uh, their immunity system, or they, uh, They were healthier and their skin was in a better shape.
Johanna: So it was really amazing. The kids who had been playing in this sandbox with the forest humus inside. And then that's all like, uh, started that there is a relation between nature and the autoimmunity diseases and all that. So it's quite interesting. And that's of course, um, Completely different story.
Johanna: They are even talking about medicine creation. I don't even know, uh, all what's happening there on that side,
Deanna: right? But it certainly has applications in industries outside of beauty as well. Yeah,
Johanna: exactly. Exactly. So it's super, super interesting and amazing result. And we see now we launched this, this forest, um, line [00:15:00] about a year ago, actually here at Cosmoprof.
Johanna: We had the first sneak preview last year. And, um, and now we hear these results that before and after that, you know, I've had the red spots. I've, I didn't know what it is and I've been trying to eat antibiotic and whatever. And then in one week it was gone after using the forest [elixir line]. So it's really like, um, it's, I really do, um, believe in this and also, Yeah,
Deanna: it is always, I think, very reassuring that we, um, in the industry, we are very focused on clinical data as we should be, right?
Deanna: You mentioned the testing that Uute Scientific has done, but then to get anecdotal consumer feedback, I think is often very rewarding, especially for brand owners. I can see it in your face. Like you want to, you want to read that email. It's. It's, um, it's, it's almost just as fulfilling as having created the product.
Johanna: It's so fulfilling. I'm so happy. It makes me so happy to hear that. And of course, I'm also super happy about the Uute Scientific, because they've been doing this work for many, many years and, [00:16:00] and now it's really like making many people, it's such a great solution for many people. Yeah. Yeah. Also, we're thankful for them.
Deanna: Of course, you know, and and so we're talking about brands coming out of the Nordic region. Now we've talked about ingredients coming out of the Nordic region informing this Nordic beauty trend. Um, and I know there are some other interesting companies maybe working adjacent to the beauty industry. Um, that it might be relevant to mention.
Deanna: Can you speak to what else you're seeing in the Nordic area? Maybe in terms of
Johanna: Yeah, I think it's really amazing that, you know, as said 10 years ago, they were not that much, the industry wasn't that big in the Nordics, but now it's, we have such amazing ecosystem. Like when you think about Sulapac, for example.
Johanna: Yes, the most sustainable, like, you know, um, uh, ingredients to make packaging, um, or Reieve the beauty tech [platform]. Uh, the beauty ai, uh, yes, one of the, one of the best companies in the world. I think in this, in this area. Um, coming from [00:17:00] Finland. Uh, also all these ingredient companies like Uute Scientific or Fazer and so on.
Johanna: Plus all the brands and factories. There are a lot of amazing, really, really good, uh, beauty factories in Sweden and in Finland. And, and really, really conscious. Everything is really like, uh, you know, really see through. You can, you can go to the factory any given day. You just walk in and But remember to put also hat on and you have to put the white clothes on and white clothes on everything, but really, uh, really good quality, um, and innovation, a lot of innovation, a lot of innovation.
Deanna: Yeah, it's interesting to hear that because it is about innovation, um, and about cultural standards, if you will, but you're also mentioning transparency, um, throughout the industry that's developing in the Nordic region. And I think that's. That's very important.
Johanna: You put it as a see through. I like
Deanna: see through.
Deanna: I like it. [00:18:00]
Johanna: That's the word I want. Part of my English. It's not the best that I sometimes make up these words.
Deanna: I like
Johanna: it. I like it. Oh dear.
Deanna: It's very nice. I'm wondering if you can talk a little bit more about, um, sort of cultural awareness or cultural exchange. What has the response to Nordic beauty been?
Deanna: Is the global market ready for NOBE and these other innovations?
Johanna: Yes, I think so. Like yesterday, we were so busy at the booth. It's more than last year. People have seen NOBE. They are super excited. I mean, really, really, it's, we see the increase and, but it's funny to see that, you know, for example, What is Mexico?
Johanna: They are like, Nordic beauty is so much growing at the moment here. We are super interested in the Nordic or, or Middle East also. And there's different, certain regions that are, and also I feel Germany is super excited about everything coming from the Nordics. And so it's [00:19:00] growing, but then again, I feel that, for example, obviously Korea is at the moment really in the Korea boom and, and so on.
Johanna: So, um, yeah, so it's, it's. Kind of different levels, but I think that's that's what's happening. Like, um, we see it also, um, that that's why what I was saying that like for the for 10 years ago, for example, we thought that it's like two years takes that it was hot in. US became hot here. So it takes always time.
Johanna: Now. It's definitely faster. Yes, because of social media because of TikTok and everything The the word got out there earlier and I think more and more people are for example yesterday. We had the Cosmoprof after-party. Yeah, we had over hundred people at them. We had some akiyoto and there was our one of our Um, distribution partners from Indonesia.
Johanna: And they said that the Nordic, Nordic, uh, values and the female empowerment and all that you got there, like we so like look up to [00:20:00] you guys and we love everything what's coming there and the Northern lights and the happiest countries in the world. And that, uh, so I was, I was really like. And hold on, Indonesia, how many people are living, 280 million people are living in Indonesia.
Johanna: So like, how much do I know about Indonesia? We like, uh, that they know all that and, and, and so, and they were super, they are really eager on our, the Nordic brands. So it, it really depends. It's funny that, but all in all, I think the world has changed that. Again, if we go 10 years ago, it was really the global players that were the biggest, you know, I would say, I don't know exactly the numbers, but let's say 80 percent of the cosmetics were from the global players.
Johanna: And then K beauty, we started to bring K beauty to Nordics already eight years ago. So Kocostar, Tonymoly, so on. And that time it was booming also, but then it kind of came down a bit. And many people were saying that. Yeah, it's going to faint away. No, no, no, no. [00:21:00] It's there to stay. Like, K beauty is, they're so good what they're doing.
Johanna: There's more and more brands coming, and of course, not all the brands survive. That's always the story. But again, it's going to stay and to stay. So, so is J beauty, the Japanese brands growing constantly, Australian brands, you know, and as well as the Nordic brands. I'm looking forward to what's coming from the, you know, South America and Africa and like.
Johanna: You know, it's, it's the, these, these regions will, will create amazing brands and this will be the future. You know, that, that, uh, it's not only like, um, global, global players that can survive.
Deanna: Yeah. It's, it's interesting. It's really interesting because it's, it's about sharing, but it's also. You know, I think there was a concern when we started moving into a real global economy and moving into the digital age that everything was going to really [00:22:00] become very similar, that we were going to blur the lines between, you know, countries and regions and identities.
Deanna: And what have you, and, and what you're describing is almost the opposite of that.
Johanna: Yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly. Yeah, I agree completely that, you know, global, word global means like, okay, everyone's going to be the same, but no, no, no, it's completely opposite. And we're
Deanna: all excited about it, you know, we're excited about Nordic Beauty, we're excited about what's coming out of the countries in Africa, and we're excited, yeah, we're excited to see what, what Latin American brands are bringing.
Deanna: It's um, yeah, it's, it's exciting. The global beauty economy is a very thrilling place. Yeah, definitely.
Johanna: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Deanna: I'm curious, is there, is there anything else you think we should cover in terms of the Nordic Beauty trends or the companies you're leading?
Johanna: At the moment, no, but we are also, okay, we have one more sneak preview here.
Johanna: Oh, do tell. So we're also launching a new brand called Scandy, Scandinavian skin candy. Nice. Um, but it's also [00:23:00] like, um, we have created it for thinking about the Gen Z. That really, again, with really Nordic values, but, but also with really like the Gen Z attitude, positive feminism, everyone can be exactly who they are and you don't have to always smile in all the photos you can also be sometimes angry and show your feelings and all the but at the same time we wanted to make something, um, which is, uh, of course our values, cruelty free.
Johanna: We got all that, what the, what the Gen Z likes, but also that there is no bad, bad ingredients that is really ingredients, which are like sunflower oil and ingredients that are really for teenager skin that really like giving hydration glow and maybe supporting the skin barrier, but not like anti aging or anything like this.
Johanna: So, so I really liked trying to make the ingredients also, uh, So the, to the Tennessee and then a little thing because it's Scandy. Yes. So every product has a candy scent. Ah, yes. So there's [00:24:00] different, so they smell so good. I could eat them all.
Deanna: How many products are in that collection?
Johanna: At the moment, 10. Okay.
Johanna: So we start with 10. And, uh, and they are also, um, mostly made in Finland. And then. few of the products, masks and pimple patches made in Korea because they do them the best.
Deanna: Yes. Yes. Excellent. Well, that's very exciting. Thank you for sharing that.
Johanna: Yes. So yeah, we are really excited and we're going to have a big launch in Finland.
Johanna: Not this fall, this spring, but of course, then launching. Country by country.
Deanna: I'm actually glad you mentioned that the, the in country launches. Um, besides trade shows, I know that, that you and the Nobe brand and the brands you're representing show up at a lot of consumer events or in store events. Can you talk about that and, and the importance of those sorts of, um, activations?
Johanna: Yeah, it's super important. And, and actually when it comes to this global world, well, it's a bit unfair sometimes. Mm hmm. Mm hmm. That [00:25:00] we come from a country with 5 million people and, you know, it's super hard to, to Instagram immediately to be like 100, 000 followers, even you are like the most popular brand in
Deanna: the,
Johanna: in the country.
Johanna: Uh, it's still hard to get. And then again, if you are a U S brand or. And you can immediately, it's much easier and your English language, you do everything in English. So it's much easier to get attention, Instagram, TikTok, everything. And you know, we have to do everything in Finnish in Finland. So it doesn't get that viral.
Johanna: And so, and it's only 5 million people, like half of New York. So it's, it's, it's not easy to like jump from there. But, but, thank god there is the social media, and all that, so it's, it's getting easier and easier, of course, but, but it's super important, exactly. That's why all the influencer, um, and, you know, together with the retailers, we're gonna have, for example, here, like, uh, related to this candy, we're gonna have the two of us.
Johanna: TikTok [00:26:00] artists. We have this huge marketing around it that, that, uh, we invite all the TikTokers, YouTubers, and we have, we have kind of concert with them, with the TikTok artists and that they can, um, and at the end, we also invite the consumers. So, so, but you need to really build the marketing. It's obviously super important, uh, for the brands and especially, yeah, but it's, it's yeah.
Deanna: Yeah. It's just curious. I kind of wanted to hear that so I could, in my imagination. compare the B2B experience that you're having at a show like Cosmoprof with that sort of B2C event experience that you're having.
Johanna: Yeah. It's, it's of course quite different, but then again, same message. Yes. And same, but a bit different.
Johanna: different type of activities. Yes,
Deanna: yes. But Nordic beauty is still Nordic beauty. Yes, exactly.
Johanna: Exactly. Yeah. And the value is always the same. And, and yeah, but, and it's, it's, I think also like, um, now when we started Nordic Beauty Inc as [00:27:00] a distribution, now we have two owned brands, but we have a kind of different theme.
Johanna: For the owned brands. And then we have the other team, bigger team for distributed brands. And, and it doesn't mean that many brands have assets. Like, do you forget us? Like, no, no, no, no. Like it just makes us stronger as a company that we always love our distributed brands and we are constantly looking for more exciting brands.
Johanna: So we always want to bring our customers the best. Best innovations and look for the trends and so on. But then again, we have a team is creating our own brand also, which makes us, I think, uh, also, of course, strongly in that sense that we have, uh, Financial wise, it's of course better margins for us. It's more, um, what's the word?
Johanna: Profitable business in that sense. So it makes us as a company, uh, much stronger, but then it also like, uh, uh, teaches us even more how to make every brand successful. We, we learn a [00:28:00] lot and we see every brand, the uniqueness in every brand and, and so on. So it's, it's really like, um, assets to our company also to have also own brands.
Deanna: Absolutely. I hear that both sides of the company, you're learning from one another and actually supporting one another. You can grow together more effectively.
Johanna: Yes. A hundred percent. So it's, it's now we're so busy. I was stunned. It's everyone is there. Like there's been every retailer I know in the world, I think, at least in Europe, they've been at the stand and they're excited, like about the Nordic brands, but then they're excited about the Korean brands and all that comes together.
Johanna: So I don't know. Yeah. We are really, it's getting public here, but we are kind of on a completely different level now. And I'm so excited about everything. That's terrific. That's terrific. I feel like
Deanna: I should let you get back to your very busy stand. This has been a very wonderful interview, Johanna. I appreciate your time.
Deanna: Really, really, um, I'm glad you could join me today on the Cosmo Factory podcast. Thank you.
Johanna: Thank you so much. Thank you.
Deanna: [00:29:00] Thank you so much for listening.
Deanna: If you find the CosmoFactory podcast useful, please take a moment to leave us a five star review and share your thoughts. So even more cosmetic industry professionals can discover the CosmoFactory. I'm Deanna Utroske. Please join me again next Tuesday for a new episode of the CosmoFactory podcast.