#171 - SupplySide West Recap with Doss

In this episode of the Startup CPG podcast, Daniel Scharff explores the world of SupplySide West with Wiley Jones, Founder and CEO of Doss, who sponsored 2 lucky brands to attend SupplySide West this year - Paul and Barbara Logan from Uncle’s Ice Cream; and Mark Collis, CEO of Scout Organic.

At Doss they're building tools for teams that work in the Real World. Manage your operations from PO to POS all within one platform. DossARP is a lightweight ERP and Data Platform, whether you need a total overhaul or want to unify fragmented systems, visit them at doss.com

Listen in as they discuss:

• Doss
• SupplySide West
• Preparation and Networking Tips
• General Impressions of Supply Side West
• Networking and Supply Chain Connections
• Social and Emotional Benefits
• Who Should Attend
• Key Trends and Focus Areas at the Show
• Insights for Startups and Brands
• Challenges and Lessons Shared

Episode Links:

Wiley Jones
Website: doss.com
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/wileycwjones/ 
Mark Collis
Instagram Handle: @skoutorganic

Website: https://www.skoutorganic.com/

Paul and Barbara Logan
Website: https://www.unclesicecream.com/
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/unclesicecream/

Don't forget to leave a five-star review on Apple Podcasts or Spotify if you enjoyed this episode. For potential sponsorship opportunities or to join the Startup CPG community, visit http://www.startupcpg.com


Show Links:

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• Questions or comments about the episode? Email Daniel at [e-mail]
  Episode music by Super Fantastics

Creators & Guests

Host

Daniel Scharff

Founder/CEO, Startup CPG

What is The Startup CPG Podcast?

The top CPG podcast in the world, highlighting stories from founders, buyer spotlights, highly practical industry insights - all to give you a better chance at success.

Wiley Jones
Small shows are awesome when you get to have like a lot of like really great intimate conversations. But I think the thing that's really awesome about massive shows is the serendipity of just bumping into who knows who, talking to vendors, talking to suppliers, whether you're a brand, both sides, you know, vendor to vendor, things like that. I always try to look at this as like a tourist and you know, we work with so many different types of industries. We just try to stay really keen and try to just get the lay of the land.

00:35
Daniel Scharff
Hey CPGers, have I got a Vegas story for you. It's about going to Supply side West for the first time ever. I was always curious about it, but I just never quite found the time. I wasn't sure what I would get out of it and I think a lot of brands are in that boat if they haven't been before. So we are really excited to bring you a bit of a recap here. You're going to hear about my experience as I chat with Wiley, who's the founder of dos. It's one of our partners who actually sponsored two lucky brands who got to go to Vegas for a Supply side west for the first time. We're going to hear from both of those brands about their experiences.

01:08
Daniel Scharff
I think you'll really enjoy getting to live the show vicariously through them and you can think about maybe whether it's worth you going in the future. Thank you so much to our partners at dos. They are building some very cool modern stuff. They're building tools for teams that work in the real world. So they have an ARP that means Adaptive Resource Platform. It's a system of record. It's an interface builder and workflow editor all in one. They want you to get that big time ERP power without having to go through all the pains of integrators and implementations and just making everything much easier. So you can discover how DOS can help you manage your operations all the way from POS to POS. You can check them [e-mail] the link's in the show notes. Enjoy. All right, Wiley from dos.

02:00
Daniel Scharff
You guys were kind enough to sponsor a few brands to go to Supply side West this year to try to make their products better and cheaper. So first off, Wiley, can you introduce yourself, please?

02:10
Wiley Jones
Yeah. Thanks. Founder and CEO of dos. We're a ERP company. Hopefully our customers like us more than a lot of their maybe previous relationships with their ERP providers. But you know, we love doing stuff with the startup CPG community.

02:25
Daniel Scharff
You guys are a Blast in the ERP space. I don't often hear people saying, I love my erp.

02:32
Wiley Jones
Yeah, yeah, we don't hear that pretty much ever until we start, until after we work with people. But, you know, that's a. That's a whole different conversation.

02:40
Daniel Scharff
The one I enjoy the most is when people talk about NetSuite and call it not suite, which, come on, it's just good. It's too easy. They set us up for that one.

02:50
Wiley Jones
You know, funny thing, I actually bought that domain. I have that domain. I have notsuite. And it. Yeah, so that'll be a fun marketing thing. One day I'll be like, I have notsuite and not suite AI, which is a whole.

03:07
Daniel Scharff
Anyway, that'll be cold. Ice cold.

03:11
Wiley Jones
Yeah, ice cold.

03:15
Daniel Scharff
But. All right, well, when we're not tearing down the existing ERP infrastructure, we're sending brands on a dream trip to supply. So, Wiley, I don't think you've actually been to supply side, and I hadn't before this year. Based on what you've heard now after the show, what is your impression of it?

03:32
Wiley Jones
Well, for starters, I've heard it's a massive show, which is great. I think the small shows are awesome when you get to have, like, a lot of, like, really great, intimate conversations. But I think the thing that's really awesome about massive shows is the serendipity of just bumping into who knows who, talking to vendors, talking to suppliers, whether you're a brand, both sides, you know, vendor to vendor, things like that. My expectations were, you know, I always try to look at this as like a tourist. And, you know, we work with so many different types of industries. We just try to stay really curious and try to just get the lay of the land and meet as many people from different parts of the industry.

04:07
Wiley Jones
We know, wherever they sit in the value chain, where if they sit in their relationships to end consumers and, you know, people who are operating the, you know, down to the intellectual property on ingredients, all the way up to, you know, the retailers who are going and scouting out new cool stuff. So it's always fun for us to just kind of just observe.

04:25
Daniel Scharff
Yeah, And I actually, that's one of my favorite parts is just kind of the wandering around at a big show and seeing who you run into. For some reason, you end up having really productive conversations with them in a way you might not on LinkedIn or when you see them at even certain kinds of shows. But I love just bumping into a few people and just had some super productive discussions.

04:45
Wiley Jones
What did you know, expect from the show and, you know, what was it actually like for you when you ended up showing up there? And, you know, whoa, it's huge. That's what we heard from our team.

04:54
Daniel Scharff
Yeah, that. Yeah. So that definitely is the first thing, is just the sheer size of it, and it was a little bit overwhelming. But I started at the puppy area, so that made it all really manageable. They had a bunch of foster puppies there. It was a very beautiful entryway into a pretty serious show. So I think beforehand what I understood is this is a supply chain show. There's a lot of stuff that goes on there. There's ingredients, there's some command stuff going on, but I really didn't know. I hadn't been there. I hadn't looked around and felt it the same way. You just can't explain Expo west to somebody who hasn't been. You can't. It's very hard to really understand what it's like to walk around at Supply side West. So, yeah, going in. Yes. Just the size of it.

05:35
Daniel Scharff
So the first day I really just started walking around, just trying to observe a lot what was going on. Was really excited to run into a lot of people that I knew who would help me understand the layout a bit. And, you know, I think the first thing that I started to piece together is like, really, what's getting done here? Who are the kind of brands that are here? What are they looking for? What are the kind of people from those brands that are here? And what are just some of the most valuable things that they can get done from the show? And, you know, for me, a couple trends really dominated. I will say, number one, just ingredients. Right. All kinds of ingredients. The show is sponsored by an ashwagandha company. There was that there. There was like, just all sorts of flavors.

06:20
Daniel Scharff
Sweeteners. I learned about a really cool new sweetener that I had never heard about while I was judging this ingredient Idol panel. Colors for stuff. So, you know, I think it was just really interesting to see 20 different ingredient companies that all had their samples out. You could go by and actually, like, see what the samples look like. Because if you're, let's say you're a beverage brand and you have different kinds of sweeteners and ingredients in your product, you may have never actually seen what those ingredients look like. And it is so visual to get to actually see them and talk to people who make them. That, for me, was extremely stimulating. And then just supplements as far as the eye can see. Right. A sea of supplements.

07:05
Daniel Scharff
And whether it's the people who are making obviously the ingredients and flavors for things like gummies, the gummy manufacturers, a lot of machinery also that could make things like gummies. I think pretty safe to say. If you're in the supplement industry in any way, this is probably a show that you would want to be at.

07:23
Wiley Jones
That's interesting. So when you know quite a smattering of like different types of companies that are going to be there, either on the brand side, on the supplier side, you know, supplement side, what were, what do you think people were really getting done? You know, in conversations, meeting new people, like, what do you think the output was? And especially for, like relevant for, you know, which startup CPG community type teams would be. This would be a good fit for.

07:47
Daniel Scharff
Yeah, that's the most important stuff for me to understand. So I asked a lot of the brands that I ran into, what are you doing here and what are you actually getting out of the show? And yeah, okay. One of the brands that I talked to found a new supplier for three of the ingredients that they work with. And you could see they'd come with a hit list. Like these are three where we need a primary or a backup supplier or maybe one that just has better cogs. And they were just checking those things off and it was their ops lead who was there and so it seemed extremely productive for them. Another brand that I talked to, they actually ended up finding a coman.

08:25
Daniel Scharff
This is a much newer brand and I think they've had a lot of challenges finding somebody who could make the product the way that they've envisioned it in the packaging that they're going for. You know, not that it's like some crazy new piece of IP that's never existed in the world. It's just, you know, you're a founder, you have your vision for the product. Maybe you can find a way to make it on the bench. You're like, well, I want to get close to this. And so I think they found a co man who was like, yeah, I can't make it exactly that way, but I can make it a pretty close way. And for them that's the closest that they've gotten so far. It wasn't my impression that there was like every coman out there.

08:57
Daniel Scharff
I didn't see the biggest ones around the country there for commands. Like, I don't think you're going to be walking around just like talking to thousands of different small co mans who are out there. There are a lot of supplement ones there, but there's a Good network of people and there are comans walking around. And so I do think people I know are finding comans there for sure. And yeah, I mean for sure. I think just the variety of sweeteners there. I talked to another brand that was pretty specifically considering which ways to go on sweeteners and I think they were pretty excited to just, I think learn more about them. I don't think they were ready to make a decision on it, but just to talk to the people, learn a little bit better the pros and cons.

09:39
Daniel Scharff
Because that's a hard thing to know when you're an early brand. You just kind of have to rely on a formulator otherwise to give you the one one.

09:46
Wiley Jones
Yeah, I actually, I think it was actually at the last conference that I was at a new topia. I ran into a formulator and man, the level of specificity he was able to go into. I was like, okay, this makes a ton of sense why you do what you do. But it's like how you actually get in front of these people with your product, with your ideas and have those in depth conversations. It seems like that's something that'd be pretty awesome to find at supply side. Kind of like down to the again the nuts and bolts of the startup CPG community. Individual, single person team, all the way up to the biggest companies in the community.

10:20
Wiley Jones
Where do you feel a lot of the fit would come down to with people coming in and like the things that they can get out of either, you know, coming in as a brand, walking the floor or even like being participating in the show to some extent.

10:32
Daniel Scharff
Okay, so I feel like for some companies this is a no brainer to go. If you're a supplement company, you should be there. You're going to find all kinds of stuff that can up your game or help you make things better or cheaper. Right. I think also for a functional beverage or functional food, there's a ton of benefit because you have functional ingredients. And there were so many functional ingredients. I didn't see a lot of like one brand was like hey, I was looking for like pistachios. I didn't see that here. Yeah, I don't know like how to vocalize what that kind of an ingredient is. But like yeah, there was not a lot of that there. There was not a lot of like sugar providers or flour kind of like more commodity type stuff. I didn't, I didn't see as much of that.

11:11
Daniel Scharff
But interesting functional stuff. Yes, high, like highly relevant there. I think you have flavors which are so important for so many companies finding the right flavor house people who can work with you. I think anybody who's looking for something interesting or a best fit on like packaging technology, maybe they have something that's a little bit different. So like, I think a brand that is scaling up fast has a lot to gain in terms of cogs or needs to diversify its supplier list a little bit better or they want to do a little bit more like higher level stuff around testing. Like plenty of regulatory companies there and labs that you could test with things that you probably haven't even thought of that you could test about your product, maybe to use as claims.

11:55
Daniel Scharff
So I think for any of those kind of brands that are, you know, scaling up or having trouble getting started because they haven't found the right partners, it could make sense. I think, you know, who maybe shouldn't go or use that time in a different way. Maybe if you're just doing something very basic and you need a vanilla coman, you're early on, you don't have a lot of ingredients and those should be pretty able to source elsewhere. You have a standard process or maybe you already have your comb in, you're kind of on your way.

12:25
Daniel Scharff
Like overall, if maybe more of the magic for your product is in the branding rather than how you'll make it, then it might not be as good of a use of your time as some of the other shows because I think you can probably get a lot more done from your desk if you're one of those kinds of brands. Rather than wandering around this show that I would say is maybe going to be more relevant for like more complicated or bigger brands or those that really just have challenges that they haven't figured out how to overcome yet where, you know, and just size a prize a little bit bigger.

12:57
Daniel Scharff
But I don't think that anybody that I talked to regretted going at all because I think it was even like if they're just getting one thing out of it, I think it gave them a lot to think about. And yeah, I don't know, I think it's also really important to prep for that show. And so what I really liked seeing is the brands who came with a notebook and they had a list of things that they were looking for, you know.

13:22
Wiley Jones
Yep. Like a checkout cart going to. It's the most sophisticated grocery store where they're gonna go pick out all the ingredients. What did you do to prep?

13:29
Daniel Scharff
So yeah, I did a bunch and obviously I have a little bit of a different objective there. Supporting our community, building partnerships. But I think it's the same thing that a brand would do first. I'm looking overall at the list of exhibitors and that gives you a little bit of a lay of the land there. And you'll notice some like, oh, like I actually know somebody there and I would maybe like to talk to them. So, you know, starting to do that and making your list for who you're going to stop by when you're there. I think I also hit LinkedIn pretty hard.

13:58
Daniel Scharff
I was paying attention to who was posting things about the show because it's good and you can like see when someone posts like a party or something and who they tag and you can add those people, find out other things that are going on at the show because I think everybody gets there but you also, you want to go to the nightlife and the happy hours that are happening just because there's business that happens at those things and they're socializing and it is going to. That show is a lot about building your network and these people can help you in many ways. And so it's nice to just get in, I would say. And LinkedIn can help you do that ahead of the show. So I did a lot of my work there.

14:34
Daniel Scharff
I signed up for all of the events that I could find, most of which I was able to hit. It's at the Mandalay Bay in Las Vegas. And just for a lot of people who haven't been, you know, in Vegas you have these huge hotels that have almost like convention centers inside of them. So you basically, I pretty much never left the Mandalay Bay, which is this complex. You know, there's like the trade show floor, there's the hotel, there are a couple lounges, there's a casino where I lost a fair amount of money very quickly just for fun, but it wasn't so fun. And you just, it's just like you're on a college campus and you're not going to really leave that campus and get out into Vegas much the whole time.

15:12
Daniel Scharff
And man, just as always, have some comfy shoes because you're just going to walk the whole day and be on your feet and it's painful. Even if you're somebody who works out a lot, you're out there, you're doing the squats, whatever. It's going to be painful. So make sure you've got I like some fresh out of the box sneakers for a trade show. It really helps.

15:32
Wiley Jones
That is the best functional advice I've ever heard about trade shows is like the okay, prep your insoles and your checklist for who you go talk to and find the actual events where you can get in front of people who you really want to be spending time around. That's an easy set of succinct wins right there.

15:51
Daniel Scharff
Yeah. So Viola, you guys work with a lot of brands on the ERP side. What is your perception of the kind of things that most brands really struggle with on supply and how much of that could they address at a place like supply side?

16:06
Wiley Jones
So I try to think of the value chain in kind of like its abstract form which is like you think about these inputs to your business and you can go, you know, arbitrarily deep backwards, which is like, you know, sometimes you're buying finished goods from a co man, sometimes you're going down to like I know the grower of these coffee beans and like we're friends and they send you and like we have a very deep relationship with the people that are actually growing are, you know, we're talking this one brand they actually know and are like very connected in with the bamboo growers that grow the bamboo for their product right in China. And so you can go infinitely far backwards in the value chain.

16:44
Wiley Jones
And the question I think for most of you know, our companies that we work with is like, well, what do you care about as you look backwards in your value chain, as you complete and you create the end good that gets into your customers hands? You know, for some brands it's like they're like 50. We care about our finished goods, making sure it's at a high quality and then having amazing packaging and having good pricing on packaging because we want premium packaging.

17:05
Wiley Jones
And so I'm like, okay, so then you should be splitting your effort pretty evenly across maintaining those two things versus like if you're a company that is really focused on differentiated quality, taste, flavors, all that ip, you should be scouring the earth to go and find the best flavor house specifically for the thing that you do which is like again, back to the conversation I had at Nootopia. So interesting he was like, oh, you know, when we work with ice cream companies that are using like artificial sweeteners, there's the right blend of different ways to use coconut creams, different types of fats and different types of artificial sweeteners and monk fruit to give it that amazing mouthfeel that you expect from good ice cream but you can't do with the stevias.

17:45
Wiley Jones
And I'm like, okay, if you're an ice cream company and there is a Slew of very competitive ice cream companies out there that are making low sweetener ice cream. You need to go find the best flavor house that's going to give you that competitive advantage because likely, you know, you can make them the coolest packaging in the world and so can a lot of other people, you know, and so where we advise it, you know, in our relationship as a. Just as a technology partner is like, we just tell people, go and focus where the thing that matters most in your company is, and go and spend a lot of time getting deep in those systems.

18:14
Daniel Scharff
Yeah, yeah. Interesting point about the flavor house. I also, I just was reflecting also on, like, it's so hard to be objective when you're a founder about the quality of your product because you make it and it's your baby and it's so beautiful to you. But I've had stuff that I worked on forever and then stepped away from it, and then I went back and tried it a year later. I'm like, oh, that wasn't that good. Actually. There are a lot of problems with this and you just can't see that when you're in the midst of it. It's so important to have a good partner. And then also, I think just be open to feedback about stuff and, you know, otherwise you can waste a lot more time than you would have otherwise.

18:48
Daniel Scharff
But on that flavor house piece, I was really lucky one of my projects to get to work with two flavor houses. And, you know, sometimes you pay a flavor house to go and do the formulation for you. Great. Other ones will work for you for free while they develop the product and then you're hooked and then you buy the ingredients from them. And, you know, one thing that wouldn't have occurred to me is we actually ended up working with two at the same time without really telling them that were doing that. And one of them gave us something terrible, One of them gave us something amazing. And, you know, if you, I, I mean, can you imagine how much time we would have wasted with. And just like, if we'd only worked with the one that did not give us such a good result?

19:27
Daniel Scharff
Yeah. I mean, we may never have gotten to market or we just would have had a product that was substandard and we wouldn't have known how much better it could because we didn't have the other option. So I kind of like that option for brands. Meet a bunch of flavor houses and just, you know, see what you can get going with them. And, you know, I think were being. It's not like you can't do that. You definitely can. And they probably are used to people doing it. And we did let the other one know as quickly as possible, like, hey, this is far from the target that we're looking for. We think we have a better option, so we're going to go with that path. And they weren't offended or anything.

19:56
Daniel Scharff
They weren't sad or mad that we had been working with them and didn't end up taking them to the dance. But yeah. All right, Wiley, this has been super cool to talk to you a little bit about the show and debrief with you. Hopefully you'll be there with us next year. And now we're going to hear it directly from some of the brands that went. So without further ado, let's dive in. All right, we've got Paul and Barbara from Uncle's Ice Cream. First of all, do you mind just introducing yourselves and your brand?

20:26
Barbara Logan
Aloha.

20:27
Mark Collis
Yeah.

20:28
Paul Logan
Hi, I'm Paul Logan.

20:29
Daniel Scharff
Barbara.

20:30
Paul Logan
And we founded uncle's ice cream 11 years ago in Hawaii.

20:35
Daniel Scharff
All right, perfect. And what were you hoping to find at Supply side West?

20:40
Paul Logan
Yes, for us, as a wholesale manufacturer, we do very traditional, high quality ice cream and artisanal cookies. So were looking at initially butter, flour, vanilla, chocolates, you know, things that just good ice cream has. And that's what got us interested in going and seeing what's available.

21:05
Daniel Scharff
Okay, and how did you find out about the show? For a lot of people, you know, they come across it different ways. What got you initially interested?

21:13
Paul Logan
Right. A podcast by a podcaster named Daniel who's talking about Start. Yeah. So your podcast on. On the supply side was just, you know, an hour of, oh, my God, this is awesome. We got to go.

21:32
Daniel Scharff
Yeah, okay, cool. And, you know, when I recorded that, I hadn't been either, so it was really eye opening for me to there. You can hear about it, but it just doesn't mean anything until you're there and experience it. So what was it like for you to be there and experience it?

21:48
Barbara Logan
Wow. It was huge. That was very cool. It was even bigger than we expected and it was really eye opening. We were thrilled to find that there were elements of. There were things about co man commands that you could go look for co packers. There were seminars. Next time we would go to seminars, I think more than we did this time. And definitely looking at high quality ingredients from all over the world. That was very cool. It was a lot that we had to choose from.

22:18
Daniel Scharff
What kind of ingredients did you come across there?

22:20
Paul Logan
Yeah, for Us, the vanilla and chocolate were probably, you know, some of our biggest usage is in that we get asked a lot for a lower sugar products and which we've never developed, but there we're able to have conversations with just, oh my God, dozens of sugar substitute from stevia, monk fruits, allulose, etc. Etc. And so not only were you getting information about the use of these products from people who knew how to integrate them into things like what we do, but multiple sources of that. So, you know, you can line up a lot of people quickly.

23:03
Daniel Scharff
That's cool. I actually was a judge on Ingredient Idol at the show and the product, the ingredient that was actually the most interesting to me is a new kind of sweetener. It's by a company called Titan Sweet that won the section for this. And it's a sweetener which is very sweet. I tasted it. For me, it's almost as sweet as something like a sucralose. But it would be categorized on a label as a natural flavor.

23:29
Daniel Scharff
And I don't know all of the science behind it, but it was so interesting for me to see that just, you know, given a lot of different sweeteners and the pros and the consumer perception of them, that you would could have a sweetener like that wouldn't even be labeled as a sweetener on the back of the label and one that actually they say can be used to modulate things like the amount of stevia or monk fruit that you have to use. So pretty high performance, it seemed like. But I'd be super interested to hear from some formulators. But they did mention it's already being used by Smoothie King in one of their low.

24:02
Barbara Logan
One of the things I thought was cool is that at a number of the booths there were actually food recipe formulators there or available for us to talk to. That was impressive. Not just salespeople of the product, but people who had experimented with it in different recipes and so on. So that was very useful.

24:19
Daniel Scharff
So there are probably a lot of suppliers there for vanilla, for chocolate. What are you doing when you go to the booth to talk to them? What are you asking them? What are you trying to understand to know if their vanilla or their chocolate could be a good fit for uncles.

24:33
Paul Logan
Right? So there's. For the vanilla, there's a many different countries that make vanilla, not just Madagascar. So when people said they had it from Tanzania or something, we're like, okay, well why should I be interested in this? And you know, obviously the sample comes in Handy when they have that, but. And then they also have a lot of given. You're always looking at price consciousness. Some of them had natural vanillas, but they weren't directly from a source. So you're getting blends in that and how do they stack up and how would that look on your label and then it becomes a quality issue. Can you use it maybe in a place where it's not so far? Like you might want a little bit of vanilla in your chocolate cookie, but you're mostly tasting chocolate so it's not as important as your vanilla ice cream.

25:22
Paul Logan
Where you better have, you know that vanilla is your top note and then it has to be fantastic.

25:28
Barbara Logan
I think where it's sourced from too was. It was also important to ask, you know, how much do they know about where it's coming from.

25:34
Paul Logan
And the growers, yeah, we're really a lot of them. They had direct contact with the growers, with the actual farmers and they were very integrated with the supply chain. And so they knew where the stuff was coming from. Sometimes they worked in the villages, you know, and so you had this, you know, kind of sustainable and farm friendly environment that you really want to support as wherever you can. And so it's good.

26:01
Daniel Scharff
It is very special to hear those stories and often it gives you a lot of ideas from a branding and marketing perspective to be able to communicate your products out to your consumers. And it also is, it's interesting because sometimes you meet brokers or distributors for ingredients and sometimes you meet the actual manufacturers and there is a big difference. Right. You kind of know which one you're talking to based on how much of that info they can actually give you. Right? Oh, nice. If you can go to the source and learn those stories and get a little bit more reliability. And I think it's cool that Supply side West lets you do that because there are so many of them there.

26:34
Daniel Scharff
But it's also, it's cool for me because you just don't always get to like see the ingredients and taste them because, okay, I formulated beverage that we brought out to market. I worked with the formulator, but were just getting finished product to sample and then all the ingredients went to the co man. I never actually saw in person most of the ingredients, never got to try the raw ingredients. And getting to do that at Supply side West for the first time was really cool. Just like getting a little taste of a bunch of the different sweeteners and flavors. I think just the more you can learn about product development and your ingredients as a founder or, you know, CEO. It really helps you have a good dialogue with your formulator, but your just supply chain in general. What do you think?

27:19
Paul Logan
Yeah, I think definitely. I think also right now we're in a lot more consciousness of the functionality of the foods we're eating. So to have better nutrients in it or have something that is not traditional, but it's for a progressive reason of like, this will reduce your fat or reduce the sugar amounts or, you know, and so, my goodness, the amount of functional additives that were there for. I mean, I couldn't imagine you coming with a blank sheet and wanting to do a new product without being there to see what's available because it was mind boggling.

28:01
Daniel Scharff
Yeah. New product ideation. I could see like, hey, let's just look. I want to start a CPG product. All right, Walk around there and see. It'll get your wheels turning. Like, oh, I can do this. I know. It made me like half inspired just to start a supplement brand. You know, all the stuff goes out.

28:18
Barbara Logan
There for every function.

28:20
Daniel Scharff
Yes. A gummy for every tummy. So. All right. Once you got past just the overwhelming enormity of that show and how much there was there and you really got down to business for your brand, if you're putting yourself in the shoes of another brand, like, who is the show good for? Who do you think it might not be a good use of time for? Like, what kind of brands or what kind of founders would you be like, yeah, this person should go. This other person maybe not yet. Or at this point, yeah, I'd say.

28:51
Paul Logan
Anyone who's on the early age and still developing product, you need to know what's out there. Because if you don't know what's there, you don't know what even to ask. And what's really helpful is to go around and describe your product to the people. They help you along the path real quickly of either something that they are doing or, oh, have you heard of this? And they're two aisles down, you might want to talk to them. So the sharing of information is amazing.

29:21
Daniel Scharff
That's really cool. I hear about that happening all the time. And, you know, one of the reasons I wanted to go initially is because I listened to the How I Built this with Guy Raz episode on Magic Spoon and they showed up to that event with a Cheerio walking around saying, who could make this for us? We want to make something like this. And it was. That's what they said. It was like, oh, I can't. But actually, yeah, let Me walk you over to one guy I think could actually make this. And that's how they found their co man. So it's a cool thing. And I mean, so much of that business is based on relationships. So it doesn't surprise me that people would be motivated to help you guys out finding just the right person.

29:56
Daniel Scharff
So lastly, you guys won the trip to supply side west thanks to our friends from dos. What did it feel like to win?

30:06
Paul Logan
Oh, my God, it was so exciting.

30:09
Barbara Logan
It was really. It was really an honor and it was a really sweet kind of just a recognition, I guess. Of what. Of what we're doing. You don't know, you know, you stand out in a sea of. There's so many of us cpgers and it was just really neat to be recognized. We really appreciated it and actually it really felt great for us because otherwise weren't going to be able to go. Both of us go. And that made a big difference. It was a lot more we could cover. There was a lot more we could discuss and we got a lot more value out of it. Plus, it was more fun.

30:39
Daniel Scharff
Everybody who met both of you, I think would have been sad if you both weren't there because people loved meeting both of you so much. I heard from a lot of people that you were their favorite people at the show.

30:51
Wiley Jones
We met every single.

30:54
Barbara Logan
We met a lot of really awesome people and came away with some cards that are pretty special. So, yeah, that was.

31:00
Daniel Scharff
And okay. In my life, I really only remember winning two things. One was at a comic book convention. Somehow I won the raffle. And then when I worked at Mars, I bought a ticket for a charity thing and I won a Kyle Busch signed M&M's race car jacket that I still have. It doesn't fit me, but I'll always cherish it. It's badass. Have you guys ever won anything else?

31:24
Barbara Logan
Well, I want you. I don't know if this is good for your podcast, but when I was five, I won the SPCA prize for the drawing of animal, which was a fish in a fishbowl. And I got a five dollar gift certificate from Captain Satellite, the local celebrity from Morning Te.

31:48
Daniel Scharff
It really, it's just so fun to win stuff and you'll never forget it when you do. So thanks a lot to DOS for helping us make some epic memories.

31:57
Paul Logan
Absolutely. That was really good.

32:00
Barbara Logan
That made a difference to our business, I think. I really appreciate that they did that. Yeah.

32:05
Daniel Scharff
All right. Well, I am so excited to hear that the show went well for you guys. I have a feeling I will see you back there next year. Yes. And we're just really looking forward to staying tuned and seeing all the growth and improved flavors and ingredients that you guys will be putting into your products and making Uncle's ice cream even more delicious and improving your supply chain.

32:28
Barbara Logan
Oh, thank you.

32:29
Paul Logan
Well, thank you. Thank you for all your help. And it was a great event. And one of the things we didn't cover is the social aspects of the event. The CPG party was awesome. And I mean, the connections there were as important as anything from there is Talking to other CPGers and suppliers and everything. And read the fine print before you go, because we saw, oh, there's a first timers party on. So we just showed up to that and only to find out, well, you need reservations. And it was sold out, and so we got there early for it and we couldn't go in. So read. Read the dumb instructions.

33:11
Daniel Scharff
As a first timer, you might not know you need a reservation to go to the first timers.

33:15
Paul Logan
Exact.

33:16
Daniel Scharff
Unfortunately, as you mentioned, we had a really amazing happy hour sponsored by DOS as well at Gatsby's Lounge. And it was special. Everybody there was in the best mood. And you know, an event is special when you just walk around and everybody's having the best conversations and making really meaningful, joyful connections.

33:37
Barbara Logan
Exactly.

33:37
Daniel Scharff
And that absolutely was one of those events for us. Everybody just came by and said, you know, this was one of my favorite events at the show, and I can't believe I got to meet all these great people. And it was really nice to kind of step away from the show for a while and be there in that special place with all of you guys. So thanks a lot for showing up for that.

33:55
Paul Logan
Well, thank you. Thank you. Because you're absolutely right.

33:58
Wiley Jones
Ditto, highlight.

33:59
Paul Logan
Yeah.

34:00
Daniel Scharff
All right, great. Paul and Barbara, thank you so much for joining us.

34:04
Barbara Logan
Thank you again.

34:09
Daniel Scharff
All right, I'm here with Mark Collis of Scout Organics. Mark, do you mind just introducing yourself and your brand a little bit?

34:15
Mark Collis
Yeah, of course. I'm Mark Collis. I'm the CEO at Scout Organic plant based, simple ingredient snack brand. Really focused on better for you snacks for kids. So we've got a line of kids snack bars, soft baked cookies, and protein bars.

34:27
Daniel Scharff
All right. And so you guys were one of the brands that won the DOS giveaway as well. You got the trip to supply side west. Can you tell me first, why did you want to go?

34:36
Mark Collis
Well, first off, yeah, it was an amazing trip. So thank you so much to DOS we really wanted to go because we do a ton of product innovation. So we have kind of our everyday core lineup of flavors, but then we also have what we call our small batch flavors. So We've now launched 21 flavors of kids bars. So a lot of innovation all through our website. And our R and D guy is running out of options, so he's been bothering me to go forever.

35:05
Daniel Scharff
Yeah, man, that's a lot of skus to manage, isn't it?

35:08
Mark Collis
It's fun. We usually have three out of three per season out and then kind of rotate through them and, you know, when they're gone. So, yeah, it's a lot of fun for our customers. They love trying new things and, yeah, there's a ton of variety for us.

35:23
Daniel Scharff
Cool. Okay, so I think your R and D guy, he had been asking to go to supply side west for a while, right?

35:30
Mark Collis
I think five years. And I've been turning them down every year. And it's funny, when I went on the website, they have the letter to your boss. I don't know if you saw that on their website.

35:39
Daniel Scharff
I've seen that, yes. How to convince your boss that this is a good thing to go to.

35:46
Mark Collis
Yeah, I'm a little upset that we didn't go sooner after going. It was an amazing show. I mean, there's so many vendors there and there's so much cool innovation out there, especially for fruit powders and, you know, different essences and all these different flavors. And we're running around looking like we've been trying to do a s'mores flavor forever. And we found some stuff where we might be able to pull that off maybe. So there's a lot of fun flavors that I think can come from this.

36:14
Daniel Scharff
That's cool. Okay, so top things that you got from the show. So maybe being able to do the s'mores flavor. What else?

36:21
Mark Collis
I don't know if I want to give them all away, but potentially two new product lines. So found co packers who can handle two different things that we've kind of floated around in the kids snacking category. One a little bit more savory and one that I think everyone's familiar with from their childhood. So those were the two things that I thought were really exciting.

36:40
Daniel Scharff
Okay, so without stealing the great new product idea, but I might just try to guess out of the blue, but so how does it work with finding co mains there? Because, you know, I think the. Let's say, ingredient suppliers. Incredibly visible everything supplement. Incredibly visible. And I did See some co mains there, but maybe because I wasn't looking for a co man, I didn't see exactly what kinds and who were there. So how did you end up meeting them? Were you just specifically going to their booths or was it just through introductions?

37:09
Mark Collis
A lot of it was kind of ingredient suppliers who have like a little offshoot of. Of a co manufacturing or have capabilities to do that and have found ways to kind of private label their ingredients or private label certain products that they're making. And you know, with a little bit of tweaking and maybe some seasoning or maybe some flavor adjustments, we can get to something that's a little bit more unique and, you know, fits the scalp brand.

37:33
Daniel Scharff
I got it. So like, hey, I was looking for this new product line that uses a lot of pecans and I talked to the pecan provider and they actually do that kind of a pecan bar or something because they've worked with it extensively and a lot of people want that. Something like that.

37:48
Mark Collis
Exactly. Yeah. Yeah.

37:50
Daniel Scharff
Or I make so interesting.

37:51
Mark Collis
But we make something with grains or something like that. And that's as much as I'll get more.

37:57
Daniel Scharff
That's really helpful for me to hear because people always talk about finding comans there, but I just didn't see as many like sitting there advertising themselves as comans. But I think that's actually the story that I'm hearing from a lot of people. So they. A lot there are comans, but they may not be like, they're like hidden in plain sight.

38:14
Mark Collis
Exactly. Cool.

38:15
Daniel Scharff
And then. Yeah. What about. So your R and D guy who was there, I talked to him. He had like a notebook out with a bunch of things he was just checking off. Like, found this. Do you think it's a lot of it's about finding new ingredient suppliers or finding backup suppliers or just finding ones that might actually be a lot more cost effective. What do you expect on the ingredient side?

38:38
Mark Collis
I think you hit kind of all of them. I know I can guarantee the first two we found. So meeting our current suppliers, meeting new suppliers. You know, a big one for us is we use coconut oil in our cookies. And we've always said, okay, there's like four that we can use, but we found 20 that we could use there. So, you know, there was so many people that we're already working with who had ingredients that we've been looking for, but we've never really looked at their full catalog. So there was that. We haven't fully gotten to the price aspect, but hopefully the third thing you said there comes through and we find ways to find a better priced ingredient.

39:14
Daniel Scharff
I will wish it for you as well. And then did you say that you had met some of your current ingredient suppliers there?

39:20
Mark Collis
Yeah. So we met Kim at Micro Dried, who we've been working with for six years, seven years. And yeah, it was kind of amazing to see someone that you've talked to for years and in person. I know David was really excited about that.

39:33
Daniel Scharff
That's so cool. So probably as like, I never even thought about that as a benefit, but people that you do business with a lot as a way to really build the relationship with them even more.

39:43
Mark Collis
Yeah, no, that was a great part of the show, I think. I mean, that was just one example. I think I could probably name another 5 to 10.

39:50
Daniel Scharff
And did they have booths there where you maybe even learned a little bit more about the other stuff that they do and kind of the story about their products?

39:58
Mark Collis
Yeah, yeah. So in a couple of places we walked up to the booth and you know, we got the question of like, what else are you guys looking for? And it was like a really nice place to have a dialogue on. These are things that we've been looking for years and just haven't really had that like open face to face conversation where they can say, oh, that's really interesting, that's something we can look at or that's something we actually do that we've never told you because you guys just buy the same four things from us.

40:24
Daniel Scharff
That's cool to hear. How would you compare the vibe to something like Expo West? For me it seemed chill. There was space for nice long conversations and kind of authentic casual interest. Not high pressure type stuff. What do you think?

40:39
Mark Collis
I would agree. Yeah, it was definitely less high pressure sales, more relationship building. And yeah, I didn't feel like I was rushing through the show and, you know, overwhelming vendors. It felt like everyone was there to talk and meet and actually give you more than five seconds.

40:56
Daniel Scharff
Yeah. Awesome. Okay. Anything really unexpected that you found there or got done or just kind of thinking back on the whole experience that you would like to highlight for brands, thinking about going next year.

41:10
Mark Collis
Good question. I feel like it's something that if you're looking at innovation and you're looking for new flavors or you're looking for a co packer, I feel like it's a no brainer. I mean, I, I think that was the biggest benefit is looking at full product catalogs from everybody and being able to see what all is out there? I mean, not everyone has an established website, so being able to get a business card and actually talk to somebody that can help you is just so important.

41:38
Daniel Scharff
So for you didn't go for five years, let's say, do you really think that actually this was just the right time for it to really make sense for you guys, or do you think like, no, you know what, for us, and probably for most brands like us, every year, it would be worth the expense, obviously, of not just the badge for the show, but also getting there and taking time away from your other projects. I'm trying to ask you basically, like, who does this make sense for and at what stage and who might it not?

42:06
Mark Collis
I'd say I don't think you need to go every year, but every other year, I think, because, you know, things change and it really depends on who's going every year. I think it makes sense for brands who are looking for innovation. You know, if you're a four skew brand that is just trying to have four hero skus, it's probably not the right show for you. But if you've. If you're looking to try and innovate and drive fun new flavors and, you know, find better cost ingredients, I think it makes 100% sense for you to go.

42:34
Daniel Scharff
Awesome. All right, Mark, is there anything that you didn't find out there in that big universe at Supply side West that if somebody's listening and knows how to get a handle on something, they should reach out to you guys?

42:45
Mark Collis
Oof. Good question. Nothing comes to mind. I feel like the show kind of had everything. Everything and more. It was. Wasn't overwhelming, but it was overwhelming with how many. How many inseparable there were?

42:59
Daniel Scharff
Yes. I think from looking at your OPS guy at the show, I think the best and only way to describe it is Kid in a candy store.

43:08
Mark Collis
Yeah. Yeah. The thank you he gave me after is like, thank you so much. This is amazing. Don't thank me. Thanks. Startup CPG and dos.

43:19
Daniel Scharff
That's very nice. Well, yeah, thank you so much to dos. We really appreciate the chance to make somebody's wish come true. That's awesome. All right, cool. Well, we'll have to check in maybe a year from now and see what all the impact was and see if you guys are going to take a year off or if you're going right back there and. All right, cool. Thanks so much for sharing the story. And just lastly, how can people support you and Scout Organics your brand?

43:45
Mark Collis
Yep. Visit [e-mail]. Try a sample pack, try a variety pack and send over your feedback and leave us a review.

43:53
Daniel Scharff
All right. I'm looking forward to trying the s'mores.

43:57
Mark Collis
Awesome.

43:57
Mark Collis
Thanks, Daniel.

43:58
Daniel Scharff
Thanks, Mark.

43:59
Mark Collis
Bye.

44:00
Daniel Scharff
All right, everybody. Well, I hope you enjoyed listening to the experiences of Scout organic and Uncle's Ice Cream as much as I did. Thank you again so much to our partners at dos. How cool is it that we got to give away trips to two different brands to go to Supply side West for the first time? They discovered so much stuff. I hope it really helps their businesses in the long run. We also got to do this very cool happy hour at Supply side West with the DOS team and it was just such a great vibe from everybody around. People from the Startup CPG community came together and I think just formed really special connections with each other. So thank you so much for that. And if you do want to check out DOS again, they are just building some very cool modern stuff.

44:41
Daniel Scharff
It's called Adaptive Resource Platform. It's a modern take on an erp. So definitely check them out. You can have them be your system of record and interface builder, workflow editor, all in one. Sort of like all of the good stuff about ERP without all of the pains. So definitely check them out. It's dos.com d o s s.com link in the show notes. Check them out everybody. Thank you. See you next time. All right, everybody, thank you so much for listening to our podcast. If you loved it, I would so appreciate it if you could leave us a review. You could do it right now. If you're an Apple podcast, you can scroll to the bottom of our Startup CPG podcast page and click on Write a review. Leave your company name in there. I will try. Try to read it out.

45:24
Daniel Scharff
If you're in Spotify, you can click on about and then the star rating icon. If you are a service provider that would like to appear on the Startup CPG podcast, you can email us@partners tartupcpg.com lastly, if you found yourself grooving along to the music it is my band, you can visit our website and listen to more. It is super fantastics.com thank you everybody. See you next time.