Subscribe
Share
Share
Embed
Sagi Shrieber interviews mega-successful creative entrepreneurs about the strategies, tactics, and mindset needed in order to flourish in all areas in life.
The deep and diverse interviews here offer practical tips and strategies, from entrepreneurship to health and wellness, personal development, and spirituality.
Episode 133: Best Selling Author & Mosaic Founder, Erwin McManus on Spirituality, Entrepreneurship & Relationships
Sagi: Everybody, what's up? Welcome to the Commit First podcast! Today on the show, we have Erwin McManus. And Erwin McManus is an amazing spiritual thought leader and creative who's creating businesses, but also wrote books with over a million copies sold. I have two of them right here that is freaking amazing. I have seen 'em talk at the Summit of Greatness, which is an amazing conference, which only a handful of amazing, inspiring people get to talk to every year, and Erwin was one of the speakers.
He blew me away, I reached out, and I got him to come on the podcast and talk to you all about the things that actually, are connected to our being, which are communication, spirituality, desires, how to overcome challenges, how to find your passion and work on what you love, how to live a happier life, how to make sense of life.
This guy is just an amazing, inspiring, wise human being, a philosopher, but also a spiritual teacher, and also a coach for billion-dollar earning entrepreneurs. So everything brings together this amazing human being called Erwin McManus. Guys, enjoy the show, and don't forget to share it if you like what you heard.
And again, just saying sharing is one of the most important things that you can do for us here at Commit First to get this podcast into the hands of more people that can benefit more entrepreneurs, more creatives, more people who are high achievers, and want to achieve the true purpose and potential in life.
This show is for you guys and for everybody like that. So please share the show. That would mean the world to me, and thank you again, and let's begin.
All right everybody, what's up? And welcome to another episode of the Commit First podcast. Today on the show I have someone that I've waited a long time to get on here and his name is Erwin McManis. And Erwin you are such a legend, man. So first I'll tell like them, kinda like the story of how I met you and it was last September. I attended the Summit of Greatness by Lewis Howes, which is a huge event in Columbus, Ohio.
And you went on stage and you gave this amazing talk. And by the way, just before you, you even went on stage, you kinda I went into the book area where they're selling all the, where they sell all the books. And I saw those two books over there just, standing there.
And I was like, this is like the way of the warrior really connected to me. Being like coming from everybody here does the army. I'm like a, and like pass IDF and I've done martial arts all my life. I'm like, interesting. And then like next to it is like the genius of Jesus, which is again even me as a Jew and coming to getting closer to spirituality in the past kind of year and so. I got back close to spirituality through my Christian friend. It's always interesting to me. And I was like, okay, I gotta check this out because yeah, Jesus was a genius and I think the most amazing thing is like keys, like a personal development guru. It's the most amazing Tony Robbins ever that ever existed, right? I hope I'm not like, I'm saying anything I shouldn't, but basically
Erwin: No, it's great.
Sagi: When you give a talk about how we need to be connected more to our imagination and how our imagination is basically too, what we got from God. I was like, man, like I gotta have you on the podcast right now. And that's what got me to really connect with you and so thank you so much for coming on the show, man.
Erwin: Yeah, it's so good to be here with you. I'm so excited. I wish I was live with you there outside of Tel Aviv, but I'm here in Los Angeles and it's amazing how the world has become so small because we can have a conversation across the planet. It's just a beautiful time We live in.
Sagi: Amazing time living man. And yeah, this is also like flight wise, I was just in San Diego last week and kinda even flights are becoming so, easy to it's harder with Covid now but still. Alright let's get right into it.
There are so many things I would love to discuss with you, man. But before we start to it, maybe we can get a brief overview. There's one thing that I love hearing you say, which was about us humans and how we and our purpose is to design futurists. Can you speak to us about that for a sec?
Erwin: Yeah, you know, probably most of your listeners have never met me before, and this is the first time we're ever entering into a conversation together. So let me just give just a little bit of background to lead you to that statement.
Sagi: All right, sounds good.
Erwin: Because really most of the things that we believe in life and our convictions, our perspectives are the sum total of what we've experienced in our life and how we react to them.
I'm actually an immigrant from a small country called El Salvador, and I was born in the capital San Salvador and Spanish was my first language. Migrates to the states when I was a small child and went back and forth. And so I always knew what it was like to be cross-cultural. I knew what it was like to be an outsider, and I knew what it was like to be the person who spoke the wrong language, and who was the wrong shader brown or whatever it may be.
And it made me an observer of human relationships of interpersonal dynamics. And I grew up irreligious. In my family though, everyone in El Salvador seems to be Roman Catholic. We really didn't have any practice of religion and so we would call ourselves Roman Catholic, but we never went to mass.
And I went maybe, three or four times in my whole lifetime. And then I remember my mom brought a Buddha home and we became Buddhist for a season of our life. And then I remember we were reading rabbi Kushner on why bad things happened to good people. And my mom decided that we were Jewish and that became a part of our journey.
And then, by the way, when I was in college at the University of North Carolina Chapel Hill, I studied Hebrew. And so I took Ph.D. level courses on the Hebrew language and was incredibly just fascinated by not just the culture, but what I would consider the mindsets. Every culture has a different structure, a mental structure a mindset that, it gets inherently passed on from generation to generation. And I was really intrigued by studying which cultures had the mindsets that actually allowed them to face adversity, obstacles, challenges, difficulties, and rise above them.
And so that kind of led me into a lot of journeys. And I became a philosopher, began studying philosophy, and began looking for any meaning in life.
Sagi: Amazing.
Erwin: Just trying to see if our existence had any real significance or whether we're just specks of dust and our sense of meaning was just an illusion. And I wasn't sure which one I would end up agreeing with where I would come and hadn't really considered the possibility of a personal God, because that seemed too far outside of my own experience. But what I began to really dive into is why humans have such an ability to imagine and create and I became a part of the TED community, if you're familiar with TED
Sagi: Yeah.
Erwin: That stands for Technology, Entertainment, Design and, been to probably 20, 25 TED conferences around the world and became one of the early like investors in TED
Sagi: Wow!
Erwin: One of the donors. And I realized that most of the speakers had incredible respect for every species on the planet except for humans.
And whenever I would hear speakers talk about it could be bees or flowers or reptiles or, the oceans or the atmosphere. There was an incredible level of, almost like sacredness. In talking about nature and any species. But when it came to humans, there was a, a real lack of regard in terms of human value. It's almost like humans are the ones destroying everything. We're destroying the climate, we're destroying the earth, we're destroying the oceans, the end of the atmosphere. And so if we just get rid of humans, we'd have a really perfect planet. And that really led me to some significant questions like what makes humans unique?
What makes a human being different than every other species? Because you can see human attributes in other species. You can see intelligence and purpose. You can see, a level of affection in dogs and indifference in cats. And you can see organization in ants, that you can see communication with birds and so a lot of things we think are uniquely human are not, we just do them maybe at a more advanced level.
Yeah.
But what really struck me was the one thing that humans can do that no other species can do is humans can materialize the invisible human beings can actually have an idea and translate that idea into reality. And one of the things we talked about the at the Summit of Greatness was that humans create futures.
In the same way that silkworms create silk. And beavers naturally intrinsically create dams and ants create colonies, and bees create beehives and honey, humans create futures. But it's so intrinsic to who we are that we do not realize that's our unique contribution to all the species on the planet.
And so then what I made one of my life missions was to help humans realize that this is our unique capacity. And that when you do not take responsibility for creating a future, you create a future based on passivity and reaction rather than proactivity and intention.
Sagi: Wow, that statement. And that's kinda like the lack of, to create the future, you need the imagination, right? And that's where it connects to spirituality and to what God gave us. Can you speak to that for a sec?
Erwin: Yeah, absolutely. If you want me to talk about God, okay, I will.
Sagi: Definitely, man. Yeah.
Erwin: One of the books I love and I've built my entire life on is the book of Genesis. And I think the first book of Moses is perhaps the most informative book about human existence that I've ever read.
And one of the interesting things in the creation narrative is that God creates man and woman in this garden, in this paradise. And the singular responsibility they had was to choose. God placed in that garden a tree of life and the tree of knowledge, good and evil. And everyone thinks there were just two good two choices, a good choice, and a bad choice.
But you have to go back and read Genesis and realize that's not the case, that what God actually said was that you can eat from any tree. You're free to eat freely of anything in the garden. Just don't eat from this one. And one of the things I realized is that we have this reverse view of God. We think that every choice is bad, and then there's only one good choice that God wants for us, it's the exact opposite.
God wants to give us incredible freedom, so we can choose anything we want. Just don't make the one stupid destructive choice. And one of the most powerful things I saw in Genesis is how the story tells us that God told man to name all the animals. And when he names all the animals, two things came to my mind.
One, is the level of memory. The mental capacity to remember the name of every animal is a part of the sub-story of this narrative. But also the human imagination to be able to creatively think of the name of every animal. This would seem to be a job that only God can handle, but it's a job he gave to humans.
And I'm absolutely convinced that if you want to find proof of God, look at human nature. Human beings were created to dream and to imagine and to create. It's one of the things I love telling people is, look you were born in the imagination of God. God imagined you before you existed. In that sense, God dreamed about you before you ever had your first dream.
And but you were, imagined to imagine, and you were created to create. And that every human being is both a work of art and an artist at work. And I just love the fact that the best reflection of the image of God is when a human being creates good in the world.
Sagi: Man, that is so powerful. Thinking about creating good. Why do you think people create bad?
Erwin: Yeah. I, I could give you a long answer or a short answer, but I would say that it's easier to do bad than it is to do good.
Sagi: Got it. Okay.
Erwin: Think about your brain. When you don't take control of your thoughts, you move toward negative thoughts
Sagi: Right
Erwin: When you don't take care, take control of your thoughts, you start thinking, and you become bitter, you become depressed, you become anxious, you become stressed, right? You become sad. And positive thoughts like hope, positive thoughts like forgiveness, positive thoughts like compassion, and generosity, they actually take work
Sagi: Right
Erwin: And so there's some sense where the lazier we become, the more we move toward a moral evil, and the more passion we have, the more we move toward the good. If good was easy, everyone would do it.
Sagi: Oh man, and this is so true, man. Amazing.
Erwin: Right?
Sagi: Yeah.
Erwin: It's easier to tell a lie, to try to get yourself outta trouble than it is, to tell the truth, and take responsibility for your life and actions.
Sagi: Yeah, man.
Erwin: And that's why I think that we have to call one another to our highest self. And that and by the way, it's one of the reasons I wrote The Genius of Jesus is that I think that one thing, Jesus, who was one of the most extraordinary human beings, he was in the lineage of all the brilliant Jews who have ever lived.
Without being disproportionately biased, a huge number of the world's geniuses, of recorded geniuses are Jewish people. And so it shouldn't surprise us that Jesus was also a genius. And the difference is that his genius was about elevating human capacity, about moving us to the highest expression of ourselves.
And it's easier to get depressed than to have hope. It's easier to hate than it is to love. It is easier to be bitter than it is to forgive. It is easier to have fear than to have faith or courage. And so Jesus didn't call us to an easier life. He actually called us to a life of higher nobility.
And that's one of the reasons I wanted to write the book was because I wanted people to not get bogged down to I don't believe in God, or I don't believe Jesus is God. I want people just to be able to look at Jesus and hear the genius that he's trying to transfer into your life.
Sagi: Man, I love that. It's so true. It makes so much sense. It's so much work to do good. And then it's so default, just like your default to evil in a way, or to the negative side of things. I think nowadays we are bombarded with such negativity and, external negativity, it's everything.
It's like the recession, it's worse. It's here in Israel, it's like earthquakes. It's everything like now is like every, everyone has their own kind of reason. Like to be to default to the negative, not only to default. It's so hard to rise to positive.
So, man, it's like how. And now and thinking about that, I think it kinda connects to something that I wanna talk to you about, which is like your new course because obviously what you're doing in the world right now, is so many great things.
Your books have been bestsellers and the becoming coming from writing books about The Way of the Warrior, The Genius of Jesus, your other books and speaking all over the world, and about faith, spirituality, and relationships. And then now it's like your new course is all about communications and how it fits with what you just said because if we communicate properly then we can do, we can get more positive outputs out to other people, maybe in effect other people positively.
Erwin: Yeah. So when I began developing the art of communication, one of the basic constructs I wanted to deal with is the fact that I would say 90% of all of our conflicts, of all of our failures, of all of our limitations are based on our ability to communicate, or a lack of ability to communicate. This is true in your relationships. You will not have sustained meaningful relationships if you don't learn how to communicate. You will not have business partners that you can trust or they trust you to move action to a level of confidence where you can succeed. If you don't learn how to commit effectively.
You will have a personal ceiling in your own life no matter how gifted or talented or intelligent you are if you do not master the art of communication. And so I wanted to solve what I felt was the principle problem that people have when they're trying to break the ceiling in their own life or break down walls or limitations in their life.
And the art of communication really is a lifetime journey of learning how human beings communicate in the most powerful and effective way. And a part of the art of communication, and I think I mentioned this at the Summit of Greatness is what we call The Seven Frequencies of Communication. That I broke down human communication into seven signature frequencies that human beings actually relate to and communicate on frequencies.
And by the way, this is true even beyond communication, that everything in the universe is interconnected through frequencies. It's all energy, everything moves in frequency. And in fact, if I could just go back a little bit to when you talked about God, I think a lot of people don't believe in God, not because God doesn't make sense, but the frequency actually violated their consciousness.
Because what happens when you have a frequency is that every frequency has a shadow frequency. And so when you hear someone communicate from a shadow frequency, your soul tells you not to trust it. And unfortunately, God has been used like a commodity, as a commodity like money or product and, selling God, has been like selling vacuuming cleaners or selling used cars and I think the reason people reject God is legitimate reasons because they're hearing about God from a negative frequency.
But it's also in this, it can happen in the same way with business. If you're trying to make a sale, if you're trying to develop a partnership and you're communicating from a shadow frequency, a negative frequency, you're gonna lose opportunities that you don't even know why.
And here's the powerful thing, you can actually be right and be using the wrong frequency and lose. And so what I did is I began to break down the seven frequencies of communication. And some of them are more common and some of 'em are more rare. But they're the seven frequencies that are more timely used in human communication.
And not only do we learn how we communicate, but we can also learn how others listen and hear. Because you may have one communication style, but you have a different one in the way you receive communication. Like there, there is this interesting kind of millennial dynamic, which I don't know if that's also true in Israel, but we have a generational divide where people in their twenties here, they use a frequency that I would call commander and they feel it's their right to tell you whatever they're thinking and they say it bluntly and harshly regardless of your emotion,
Sagi: That's basically almost every Israeli.
Erwin: But here's a funny thing. That's the frequency from which they speak, but it's not the frequency they want to be spoken in
Sagi: Right
Erwin: So speak to you as a commander, but you seek back as a commander, all you have is conflict. Yeah. And so you have to learn that just because a person speaks, let's say from a commander frequency, and they come from a source of authority. They tell people what to do. They believe in their right to lead and to impose their will on you.
They may actually respond better to what would be called a motivator frequency. And so if they come at you as commander, your natural reaction will be, I'm gonna command back. But rather, you should use a motivator frequency and go, no, I'm gonna inspire this person. I'm gonna encourage them. I'm gonna elevate them, and I'm gonna infuse hope in them, and they're not even gonna know what to do because I'm coming at them from a different frequency.
And, so I'm just gonna lay 'em out real quick. There's a frequency called MOTIVATOR, which inspires and encourages. There's a frequency called CHALLENGER that calls people out and calls people up. There's a frequency called COMMANDER that tells people what to do and takes authority and control. There's a frequency called HEALER that sees everyone as broken and they want to bring healing and care. There's a frequency called the PROFESSOR. They think all that matters is the information and the facts, and all they want to do is create a transference of knowledge.
Yeah. There's a frequency called SEER, and they're vision casters. They're visionaries and they elevate the room by helping people see a different picture of the future, a bigger picture of their life and of the world. And then there's a frequency called the MAVEN, and a maven is a psychological mental disruptor. They change paradigms, they change the way you see reality. Those are the seven frequencies.
And as you work through those frequencies, you can learn the shadow frequencies for each one. And one of the things that I find to be so exciting is that a lot of times if you look at like personality tasks or personality assessments
Sagi: Yeah
Erwin: They're very static. They're based on a fixed mindset. This is what you are and you can't change.
Sagi: Okay.
Erwin: But the seven frequencies are based on a growth mindset, that whatever your core frequency is, that's where you begin. But your lifelong journey should be to pick up all the frequencies so that you can actually communicate from all seven frequencies whenever it's needed.
Sagi: Right, first of all, it's super fascinating and I think I see how it can apply to just, all, any relationship but also, sales and negotiations and whatnot. So it's super interesting really reminds me a bit of Oren Klaff's work with frames in sales. Do you know Oren Klaff?
Erwin: I'm not familiar with him
Sagi: No. Anyways, he's amazing.
Erwin: With who?
Sagi: Oren Klaff, he has a bestselling book called Pitch Anything.
Erwin: Oh wow.
Sagi: Another one is called the Flip the Script. And he's talking about frames when you talk to someone, he has that frame, meaning like you should know what frame to, so there's the expert frame and like all kinds of like frames that you can use the sales.
But this is kinda like the personality type, which reminds me a bit of like also storytelling and the different kind of avatars there, but it's not really. So it's kind of really interesting to think about it. In terms of how to apply it. And frequencies also remind me of the book Levels of Energy. Have you read it?
Erwin: I haven't read that one either. I got some books to catch up on,
Sagi: So, yeah, no, I'm just like I'm trying to understand like where this fits in my world, but in my knowledge right now. So it says that people are on different frequencies, like from zero to 1000 and when you get into a room of a 200 frequency, you cannot talk to them in 400 frequency, right? So you gotta go down to a frequency of 200 in your different frequencies. Is there one better than the other or are just all of them parallel?
Erwin: No, there's not one that's better than the other, but there's one that is more appropriate for a particular context than the other. Let me give you an example.
If you're a natural commander and you always lead, you use authority you tell, you don't ask. That's a great frequency if you're the chief fireman going to fight a fire in a building you don't necessarily want a motivator. You don't really want a healer. You want a commander who knows how to get everyone out of the fire.
If you're at war and you're in a ship, you want a commander who knows exactly what that ship needs to do and what everyone needs to do to get the job done so everybody lives. But if, when you go home and your five-year-old daughter only hears you speak from a commander frequency, you're gonna destroy her esteem and just crush her soul.
When you go home and you're talking to your wife and you use a commander frequency, it's going to destroy the intimacy in your relationship. And on the flip side, if you understand, they're commander, my wife's number one frequency is Commander. And we've been married almost 40 years, so you can be married to a commander for 40 years. And one thing that helped me is, I realize that she doesn't even know she's speaking from a commander frequency. And she's almost always communicating to me something she needs to be done.
Sagi: Yeah. That sounds like my wife as well, by the way. . .
Erwin: I thought your wife was as well.
Sagi: Yeah, I think so.
Erwin: And I would tell my wife, I said, you're so utilitarian, you don't go through, I love you, it's good to have you home. It's good to see you. How are you doing? It's, "Can you take out the garbage, can you do this?" Yeah. And I always joke about when she gives me a command that I have to retranslate into, I really love you, honey. I'm so happy you're home and I really need your help.
So I add the story to her command and it diffuses it for me. And my son he's a combination of what's called SEER Commander. So he's a visionary commander. And once he understood his frequency, he became so much more aware. One day he called me up and he said, dad, I've got a bunch of ideas, and a bunch of suggestions, and a few recommendations, and they're all going to sound like commands. But I want you to know they're not commands. I'm not even sure if they're right. I just wanna run them by you and get your feedback. And, once he was able to realize that he just naturally speaks from command.
Sagi: Yeah.
Erwin: But he's actually really asking or suggesting, or inquiring or just considering that in his mind, it isn't as much a command as the way it's being communicated. It helps tremendously. And even when you have someone who's, I dunno if you have a friend or anyone you know that they have a healer frequency, sometimes they can move the healer too fast with people they don't know.
Have you ever been with someone for the first time to meet with you? They go, how are you? And you go, I'm doing great. No, how are you really? I am so uncomfortable right now. That's how I am.
Sagi: I love that.
Erwin: What makes you think I wanna do a deep emotional dive with you five minutes after we met while we're just getting dinner?
Sagi: Love that.
Erwin: And so you have to help people realize if your primary frequency is healer, that you might wanna mitigate that when you're first relating to someone. And that, a person needs to give you permission to heal. And so I think self-awareness helps tremendously.
So there isn't one that's more important than another, but motivators are more common. And then challengers would be less common motivators but are still more common. And then healers are more common. I think commanders are less common.
Sagi: Commanders are less common?
Erwin: But depends on the culture. See Israelis, it might become, it might be very common in Israeli culture. And it would probably be uncommon in Brazilian culture because you're raised to identify a frequency that fits into your culture. That's how I know you can learn all the frequencies. Because the frequencies, they're, if they're 20%, genetic, they're 80% environmental.
Sagi: Yeah.
Erwin: It's the frequency you've learned, works for you. And if you realize, oh, this frequency doesn't always work with everyone, then you begin to expand yourself and realize there are other frequencies involved. At the Summit of Greatness, and when you were there, I right before I walked on the platform, I had this thought, I need to use my healer frequency because as I walked around the room and I interact with people, I sense that many people at that conference are there for therapeutic purposes. There are people who really need to be healed, and Lewis creates a safe environment for people who feel broken and wounded.
And so I usually begin with a different frequency, my more natural frequency when called the Maven. So I'm usually disrupting the way people see reality. I'm usually creating mental chaos in people's souls going, is that true? Is that right? I've never heard that before. I don't know if you know what he's saying is accurate, but I'm really intrigued.
But right before I get on stage, I thought I need to use the healer frequency, at least somewhere in my talk. But I was so nervous, I would forget that I told myself to open with the healer frequency. And I did something I'd never done. I began my talk from a healer. And then I moved very quickly into a Maven and afterward at the book signing that lasted, I don't know, a couple of hours.
People just kept coming and weeping and weeping, saying they don't know what happened. But in the first few minutes of the talk, they felt like they were being healed. And what is really beautiful is when you tap into that frequency in an authentic way, in your own core, in your own soul, it actually translates to people, no matter how many thousands of people are in the room.
Sagi: Man, I love that man. I love that. And so this is like a new course. It's out on your website, right? It's the art of communication
Erwin: You can go to theartofcommunication.org
Sagi: Okay. So the art of communication, I'll definitely, first of all, I already signed up for that. First, you can sign up on the website for the first kind of like session. And I already went through part of it, it's like amazing.
Erwin: Yeah. We offer everyone a free session there, on turning language into an art. And then for many people, I would say if you can either buy the whole package or you can go and buy the seven frequencies of communication, which is a great place to start. And then after you work through that, come back to the rest of The Art of Communication.
Sagi: Yeah, yeah definitely. I think it's such an important course that I hope everybody would go through it. Do you have, by the way, an assessment? I haven't seen an assessment over there
Erwin: The assessment is coming. We've been in development on this episode for the past year. I wanna make it really helpful, really accurate. We're working with quite a few, algorithms and designers. And so yeah, it should be out, I would say in the next six months.
Sagi: That's amazing, awesome. Definitely exciting, man. Definitely exciting. All right. Yep. So thinking about like communication and you're doing this, you have this like this course out, The Art of Communication. You're still giving public speaking. Amazing talks about like spirituality, faith, and all those things. You have your books, which you are still promoting. You have a clothing line, basically like a fashion brand, fashion designer as well. By the way, I'm coming from design as well. I've been a designer for 15 years. So
Erwin: Wow. What do you design?
Sagi: So applications, user experience, like that's what I do.
Erwin: Wow!
Sagi: I have an agency for user experience design. That's my main business right now. So yeah,
Erwin: Oh, that's fantastic.
Sagi: So yeah. So like I'm also a creative, right? I think when you do all these things right, how do you understand, and that's something that also on the Summit of the Greatness, I heard so many people that are lacking clarity of vision and how do you tap into your clarity of vision to know what to act upon? Because there's so many opportunities, right? And we, creative, as we can get all over the place. How do you find your purpose and know, okay, this project, this is what I'm executing.
Erwin: Yeah. I think one of the great challenges people have is that they keep trying to find their purpose in their career or in their job, or in what they do. And actually, your purpose should be rooted in who you are, and who you're becoming, not what you're doing. Because if your purpose is your job and you lose your job, you've lost your purpose. If your purpose is your career and you've lost your career, you've lost your purpose.
If your purpose is your success and then you have a downturn and you lose that success, you've lost your purpose. And that's why so many people go through a crisis of purpose is because their purpose was externalized in something that was outside of their control. When your purpose is outside of your control, you're in danger of losing your purpose.
The only thing within your control is the person you choose to become. And so I do a lot of things. I've got a graphic novel coming out. I write I've written this, my 11th book coming out in September. I've worked in films. I've worked as an actor and a director and a producer. I have two fashion lines, one's called Ghost Artifacts coming out this year.
You, I lead the spiritual community called Mosaic. None of those things is my purpose. Those are all my projects. And they're an expression of my passion, and hopefully some of my talent and my skills. But my purpose is the person I'm choosing to become.
And so I root my purpose in my personhood, and that way I never lose my purpose. So I woke up one day, I had a business partner who decided to go south on me and I lost six to 10 million in one day. That's not a lot of money for some people, but it's a lot of money for me.
Sagi: It's a lot of money
Erwin: And I had to fly home and tell my wife I lost everything. It was a really difficult day. In fact, I remember sitting in the coffee shop telling my wife, Kim, honey, I've lost everything. And she said to me, I thought I was your everything. It was the most beautiful response. And I didn't know how to, what to say. I said I lost my other, everything that pays the bills. And she said I know you. She said you'll rebuild and you'll create a better future than what you just lost.
Sagi: That sounds like a motivator.
Erwin: Yeah. No, she, it was really beautiful. And one of the things that I had to grapple with is they could take everything, but they couldn't take who I was. And I've sat down with at least two different individuals who made at least a billion dollars, and then they lost an immense amount of money. And I had to sit down with 'em and I was coaching them and oh, and a lot of what I do now is business coaching and CEO coaching and I asked him, I said, alright when you first started your company to make the first billion, what did you have? He goes, oh, no, I didn't have anything. I started from scratch. No one believed in me. No one invested in me. Yeah. I said, all right, so you were able to create a billion dollars from nothing.
It goes, yeah. So I said, all right, you've lost that billion dollars, but you've gained a billion dollars worth of experience. You're not the same person you were. You're like exponentially more powerful, and more knowledgeable, and you are bringing so much more to the table now than you did then.
So if you could create a billion dollars from the person you were then, how much can you create with the person you are now? And I've watched all of them rise back up, because it's not about having a million dollars or a billion dollars, it's about the person that makes you, the person you must become, to create that kinda wealth and that kind of future.
Sagi: I love that. I mean, you don't know my story, but my story is like, I left the tech world like being, had a job, and been an amazing startup. I left it though to become an entrepreneur and I've gone broke basically, I am even a bit in debt. And I couldn't monetize it, the regular entrepreneurial story. I flew in a coach from the US with thousands of dollars I didn't have, and he helped me build a vision and start my business, and like eventually, things that I've externalized in a way have manifested. But the thing that I always have been fascinated with this building character.
And kinda again, like the inner work, right? Everybody's talking about the metaverse, everybody's talking about the universe enough. It's like, and you're talking about that, and that's where it really connects to. And recently I just said my first seven-figure here, and I'm looking back and I'm like, it's definitely not exciting to me anything about, the external stuff.
It's definitely just 100% exciting. The feeling that grow, that you know, that I had and that I knew how much I had to overcome, right? And transform inside and do the inner work in order for the external to show up. So it definitely makes sense to find your purpose in who you are. So thank you for clarifying that.
Erwin: Yeah. And then once you put your purpose in your personhood, then you can look with intention at what you're best designed to do. And I think it's an intersection of natural talent skills that come from discipline and passion and things you love because you have more energy and more fuel when you love something.
So when you're fueled, when you're fueled by love, you don't mind the process. You love the process, you know, the failures don't stop because you love it. But if you love something but you don't have the natural talent for it, you're just gonna be always frustrated and being someone else's talent.
You have to find something you love and something that you actually have some intrinsic talent, but also something that you're willing to do the hard work of creating skills and mastery. And so in my life, I realized I love storytelling. And storytelling was a natural, talent I didn't know I had. But I found out that I did and in so many different avenues. So I had a passion, I love creating stories that elevate people. And I love seeing people's lives change. And so when I'm watching life change, I'm just energized. And I realize that if I can help people have a new story, I can literally raise the level of life for them.
And so it, and then I developed a commitment to become a world-class communicator, and to develop the skills and qualities, and craft that craft. And I didn't want to just write on talent and I just didn't wanna just write on passion, I wanted to develop mastery. And when you take those three things, you actually have a pretty high likelihood you're gonna succeed because those are the ingredients that create the success that you long for.
If I was lacking one of them, I don't know if I would have the same level of success. And, but when it's interesting Sagi is because I started this very small private Mastermind for highly successful men at this time. Because every one of them has realized that their inner world is not as strong as their outer world.
They're incredibly successful in the business world, but their inner worlds are falling apart. And so I just basically just sent out a text to a dozen guys that, they're all incredibly successful. And I said I'm just tired of my friends falling apart. And so I, when I create a Mastermind, you have to pay a lot of money cuz I want you to know you have buy-in.
I don't want you to miss a meeting, and then we're gonna invest in your inner world. And it was amazing how fast they started signing up because, once you have success, you realize it didn't fix me. And success gives you the freedom to be more destructive if you're not healthy. And success doesn't give you the freedom to be better. And if you're not better, if you're not healthy, success is not the solution.
Sagi: Yeah. I wonder because in Israel, like so many people are creating monetary success, but are not happy in the startup world. And I know personally, a lot of people that are, like less happy or not working in themselves like they should when they're such a high operating entrepreneur, like CEO of a company.
But I'm also wondering, I also had this thing where at times some friends have advanced beyond anything that I've seen for myself. When I was doing the inner work, they were achieving so much external success and I'm not. And I was like, am I slacking off doing this in inner work? You know what I'm saying?
Because I mean, like everybody's talking about going to the gym, but there's also the spiritual gym, so you have to put in the time, in a spiritual gym and in turn. And all of a sudden you got people like Alex Hormozi coming up on Instagram and saying why you should stop sucking off F morning routines. This is like, just get to work. Just get to work. Wake up, go to work.
And I'm like, no, I can't get to work. I don't want to get to work before I work on myself. Maybe some people are robots, but I'm not. So I don't know. What are your thoughts on this?
Erwin: You mean just that approach where it's just, hardcore get the job done.
Sagi: Get to work! Yeah. Why do you need a morning routine? Like, get to work. That's like the, and a lot of people just what they preach.
Erwin: Yeah. That's what I call challenger frequency. They think everyone just needs to be challenged. They want to call you out, call you up. You've never, you're never good enough. You've never done enough. You're lazy, you're a bum. Get up, you know, get up at five, get up at four in the morning. What's wrong with you? And yeah and you know what? That frequency does work with some guys. It does work with some women. But it doesn't work with most people.
And I think we all need some challenger in us, speaking into our life. But that can't be the only frequency. It's motivating you, frankly, I love life. Like I enjoy life and I have fun. And in fact, I was telling my wife last night, cuz right now I'm running more projects than I maybe have in my entire life. And I'm 64 and I have the energy of being 24 years old and I don't feel tired at all.
And you know why? Because I love my life. And when you love what you're doing, you have more energy. So what I would say is, instead of saying, get outta bed and stop sleeping and stop being a bum and stop being lazy, I go, Hey, stop doing what you hate and find a way to do what you love and you only have one life. If, even if you spend your life making a hundred million dollars if you spent your whole life working, you haven't enjoyed a single day, what did you make?
Sagi: Right
Erwin: And you want to be free to live the life you love and do the work. And when you can do the work you love, like I love coaching high-performers. I just love it. It just energizes me. I love helping people solve problems, it energizes me. I love designing clothes and I love writing books and graphic novels and I don't wake up going, oh no, I gotta write a comic book. Or, oh no, I gotta, work on this movie. I'm going, I cannot believe I get to do this. And so I think the main thing is to move your life toward the life you always imagined, and you'll have all the energy you need.
Sagi: That's such amazing and I love your energy, man. This is such an inspiration, right? To see something like yourself and operating in a world like the creative that you are and building and creating out of imagination, bringing into the world. Cause there are so many I always get this like, Sagi doing too many things. Sagi, you're like, and for me, I always got it right?
And it is there's the book, the One Thing or something like that, and there's like the essentialist and like all these movements of people saying you should do one thing and if you don't do that one thing then you're like, then. And I was always creative, if I don't have a couple of balls in the air at once, I actually get bored.
And so I have two businesses, or actually no three, and I have three kids and a wife. And I'm trying to be the best husband and the best dad, and the best businessman. And I'm following my passion. I just, in the past year created a professional development app. I have an app for affirmations out, and it's in the App Store.
And so there's the thing though, which I would love to ask you because we create things, right? And then there are the hardships that come with it, obviously like anything, right? Also in business, the recession is here. The recession's just, the bump in the universe right now bringing us, whatever hardships we endure. I can say that in my design agency, I got more people saying no in the last three months than I got in the last three years because nobody has VC money anymore.
So it's harder than ever to get new clients while other clients are living. So you get a lot of, frustrations out of those. Again, another day was not working, another day was not working another day, which was not working another day, which was not working. And like another, no, another, no, you get another sales goal full of energy, no you, and then so you, and then you lose a client and then you're like, so you endure so many and then you got the whole other businesses to take care of and then one of your kids is sick.
So you have so many and I think, again, coming back to. And then the news and then an earthquake and then whatever so many things that are like hitting us humans right now. How might we start our journey do you think about getting over those obstacles because you see you love life?
I think I love life in general as well. I don't think, I love life in general. I love living life. But definitely, what would you say to everybody who is like us or like me, at the beginning of the journey of entrepreneurship and drawing all the challenges and having to go?
Although we love life and we love creating and we love it when we win. And also we love the challenge. It's great to say we love the challenge when the challenges really hit hard. What were your, maybe what are some tips?
Erwin: First of all, you talked about not having focus and you said about having a wife and three kids. You go no, I have focus because I have a wife and three kids. I don't have three wives and one kid. I actually got this, right? And I think that's the point, is that doing a lot of things is not evidence of lack of focus. It can be, but it may not be. Because if you're doing the things that are natural to your talent, you're gifting, your skillset, and your passions, then you are doing one thing, you're doing the things you love.
And that becomes the filter. And, some people have the great privilege of having one extraordinary talent that is so rare and so obvious and so pronounced that they build their whole life on that one talent. Whether it's, Lionel Messi, Messi's gonna play soccer. He doesn't need to be a painter or a cook or a plumber. He plays, he's a football player. And you have Picasso and Picasso didn't need to write music he just painted, right?
Sagi: Yeah.
Erwin: And, so when people say you need to focus, some of it is there are people who have been given this rare gift to have one talent, and that one talent becomes the full expression of their life. I happen to not be that talented, so my talents are diversified and my talent is in my diversity. My talent is in the uniqueness of my diversification. And I'm able to express that talent in multiple things. I think where it becomes a problem is when you're doing things that you shouldn't be doing.
The things that you don't have the talent to do or things that you don't have the passion to do or things you don't have the skill to do. And the way of knowing if you're doing too many things is are you having to cheat the process? If you're cheating the process, you shouldn't be doing it.
If you're being true to the process that is necessary to achieve greatness, then I think you can take it on. And so with my graphic novel, I've spent the last three years working on it. I want it done in a year, but because of my time schedule and because of my meticulous need for the art to be right and for things to be at a certain level, it's taken me longer.
And I just accepted the fact that for the process to be at the level that I demand, it's gonna take me longer. And my wife and other people in my life wanted me to create the Art of Com, 20 years ago. They wanted me to create this communication journey, this course, this masterclass 20 years ago. But I said no. I waited until I had a level of mastery that I wanted to pass on to the world. And so sometimes it's about patience. It's not about how many things. It's about, are you respectful of the process and are you doing things where you're cheating the process. Those are the things you need to stop doing. Does that make sense?
Sagi: Yes. Can you give some examples of cheating in the process, like maybe some examples? Things that people are doing?
Erwin: Like with my clothes, like I've been waiting for a year for us to come out with our next collection and come out with this new brand. And the reason it's taken so long is that we've gone through three or four iterations until we have the clothes at the level of quality that I want.
I could have come out with the clothes a year ago. And it wouldn't have been of the same quality. I could have come out with clothes, the stitching wasn't exactly right, the pattern wasn't exactly what I wanted, or the fabrics were not what I wanted. The fabric's good enough. In fact, I've had other designers, incredibly famous, who say, look, we used to use really high-end fabrics. We realized the customer didn't care so we started using cheaper fabrics and charging the same amount of money. And people are buying their clothes across the world. They don't realize they're getting a low-quality fabric for a high-quality price. Because they created a brand and they're willing to circumvent their process.
And so I look at it and go, I want everything to be a reflection of my values. And so when I write a book, I do what it takes for the book to be the best I can write. When I work on, a graphic novel, it's gotta be the best that I'm capable of. If I'm working on clothes, it has to be designed all the way through to production at the quality which I demand.
And so if I'm doing any of those things and I'm just creating something cheap, just throwing the book together or just not worrying about the details of the fabrics or not communicating at the level that I've trained myself to speak at, then I'm not living up to my expectations and I'm circumventing the process.
I don't wanna do anything, or I'm not willing to do the process that the people who are great at it do. And so you should look at something and go, all right, what's the benchmark? Who's great at this? What's the process they use? How much work do they put into this? How much energy does it take? How much focus? Am I willing to try to match that level of a process so that I can have the best outcome possible for me?
Sagi: I understand. Yeah. I'm thinking about the app that I released to the app store, right? A lot of, in the technology world, it's if you release something you're happy with, you're doing something wrong. That's a kind of common term, right? It'sa common phrase. Because you gotta launch fast time to market matters. And so you launch what's called an MLVP and other people launch broken products, right? So it's I know that what I launched is not, I know it's not broken.
Like anything, it has bugs probably here and there, but it's not broken. It has what call I an MLVP, it's like Most Lovable, Viable Product. And then and it's out there, but it's probably not the best, I could work on it for three years, make it amazing in terms of quality, but I miss the kind of, I'm missing the time to market. What do you think about that?
Erwin: Yeah. No, I'm, look, every creator has to live with imperfection. What I'm not saying is don't release something until it's perfect, or you go bankrupt, and you'll never release anything. And so my clothes can always be better. My books could always have been better.
My talk could have always been better. Successful people learn to have an intimate relationship with imperfection. And so the perfectionist does not succeed. What I'm saying is the process, you have to commit to the process, and then you go, okay, we're putting out the best we can do right now.
This is the best product I can release right now. Yeah. If I work on it for three more years, I can carry a greater product, and maybe I will. But this is the best I can do at this time. And, I've never released anything thinking, oh, it's perfect. Not once in my entire life. I've always released things going it could be better. Yeah. But it's the best I can do now, and it's, and now is the right time to release it.
Sagi: So you're proud of that.
Erwin: And you have to live with that. You have to live with that horrible sick feeling in your stomach going, ah, it could have been better. And it's just true. In every book you write, you always go, oh, I could have said that better. I could've written that sentence better. I could've been clear, I could've been more poetic. I could've and you could just kill yourself with what you could've. And you just have to do the best you can, put in the work, and then trust that what you created will help people.
The main thing is, does your product help people? Does it serve people? Does it provide them with something special? And so I would never release something where I thought people are gonna pay more than the value of what I put into it. And so I always wanna make sure that what I give to the world has more value than what they pay for it.
Sagi: Yeah. No, that sounds totally making sense. And going back to the initial thing that started as, I think when I asked about like how to overcome challenges and he said like when you're working on something that you were aligned with that you know you're good at or passionate about it really by the way, reminded me of the Ikigai concept. Are you familiar with the Ikigai concept?
Erwin: No. Tell me.
Sagi: No. So it's like a Venn diagram. It's it says on the top, what are you passionate about? And then on one side, it's what are your superpowers? On the other side is, what does the world need right now? And on the bottom is what are people willing to pay for.
So if you find oh four, you got your, your perfect thing to work on. Which is, it's, I think it's a Japanese concept and it's a beautiful Venn diagram that is really relating to what you just mentioned, right? You gotta find something, that you're passionate about, that you're good at, right? That connects to what people actually need. So definitely makes sense
Erwin: You have to realize that most artists don't ever have the fourth circle. They never figure out what will people pay for. And that's why so many artists died, poor. And only after their death that people realized that they were, geniuses. And Tesla died, poor. And because Edison could figure out what people would pay for, but Tesla could not. So you can actually have a unique genius and never really, never figure out how to monetize that genius.
Sagi: So you gotta find a way to monetize it these days, right?
Erwin: Because one of the challenges is that when you have a genius, you don't wanna diminish it. And the moment you try that idea into practicality, it's always less than the ideal. And you have to be real, would Apple ever release anything if it had to be perfect? In fact, I'm convinced Apple releases things on purpose with imperfections so that it can do updates and upgrades, and not allow you to live with the past product. So they basically have turned imperfection into a market strategy.
Sagi: Love it. Yeah, definitely. That makes so much sense. And in terms of again, going back to our and I think that's why we can like have us kinda like the last point of this discussion is, you know what, before I get to that last topic, I want you to you talked about genius and we talked, you mentioned the genius and there's one thing I wanted to maybe have you speak about is that experiment that they've done with kids and they found right that kids
Erwin: Oh yeah. You know it Yeah. It's, I read about it in the Genius of Jesus and it's a fascinating study that was done actually by Nassau, where around 1968 they were trying to create an assessment to identify genius. And then headstart ended up using the same assessment around 1994 or so.
.And what happened was that they tested five-year-olds and about 98% of those five-year-olds, I think it was tested out as geniuses. And then they followed him over the next decade or so when they by the time they turned into adulthood, only 2% still tested at his geniuses. And so what you and I think around the age of 12, it was around 12%.
And the age of 10, it was around 30% or so. And what is amazing what the study showed was that creativity and genius isn't something you learn, it's something you have to hold onto that actually human beings are created intrinsically creative. That every human being has a unique genius to them.
But the ones we identify as geniuses, the Einsteins, the Picassos, the Mozarts, the Stephen Hawkings, the Elon Musk, the geniuses that we identify, were not born rare, they remained rare. I think we're all born rare and most of us die ordinary and that's to me is the tragedy, is that there's intrinsic genius and I feel like that's one of my missions in life is to try to unlock the intrinsic genius inside of every human being.
And to help people first be aware of the fact that there is a genius inside of you. And then to begin to know the process to unlock that genius. Because you were raised, you were conditioned to believe you are average. You're conditioned to work to be ordinary. You're conditioned to fill a job. You're not actually raised to be unique, to be extraordinary, to be a genius.
In fact, your genius was probably punished. Your genius was probably misunderstood. Your genius was probably corrected until they corrected you enough that by the age of 12 you were average.
Sagi: Oh man, I love that. And it connects to kinda going back to something which is not so distant, which is our past, and kinda thinking maybe like when we were kids, I think a lot of us had visions of like who we can become and is that true that it's like still in a conscious, like most of us can remember the genius that we are meant to be? Or does it require a lot of deep work?
Erwin: Well, I don't think there's a single answer for that. I think it depends on where the person is in their life. I think some people fought all their lives to not let go of their genius and they held onto it and they carried it with them to adulthood. I think there are others who held onto as much of it as they could, but they end up being broken or discouraged or inner voices told and they couldn't do it.
And they live in this tension of living the life that they're told they should live. And or, and then struggling to want to live the life they were created to live. I do think that there is a remnant of us inside every person of the ideal version of us. And by the way, that's why I so deeply believe in God is that I believe that when you enter into a relationship with the creator of the universe, you now give him access to unlock all the creative genius inside of you, to awaken all that which is dormant inside of you.
And to bring your best self out of all the rubble of your failures and disappointments and insignificance and fear. And that for me is the transformative journey that I've been on. And why even, why I read the book, the Genius of Jesus
Sagi: Oh man, I know that. So let's talk about that for a sec.
This is really leading me to the kinda last topic I wanted to talk to you about, but it's about, going again back to the spiritual aspect of things. When I was in Buddhism for a long time. I'm a practitioner of martial arts basically since I was a little kid.
And I also flew to China when I was like 22 and practiced with Shaolin Monks in the mountains for a month. And I've been into many different kinds of experiences where I got connected to Buddhism. And after being in China, I flew to Burma, I met this amazing teacher and I saw the people are just amazing people, such good people.
I said, okay, like Buddhism, is it? Right? And then I went to the Vipassana retreat. I think it was like when I was even like 29, like so much so many years after. But basically I went to the Vipassana retreat and I remember sitting there and talking to them about my ambitions. They're like, there are people there, not the teachers, people there like with me you have too many ambitions.
That doesn't work. Like, why did you even have kids? Why would you have, was that actually after 29? So like 30 something? Why did you have kids? I'm like, kids are like, but you're bringing them into the world of suffering. And that's where I kind a disconnected from that. I didn't opt out from Buddism because I think it has a lot to offer, but I definitely saw there's flaws in what I agree with. And I said, okay in the Bible, and my grandfather was a religious kind of not super religious, but a religious guy.
He went to the synagogue every weekend and every Sabbath, and so I went with him every once in a while, on the holidays and stuff, and I read, and in the Bible it's you should always drive or there's always this kind of, we push further and when evil comes, we don't let it in, we fight it. There's always a fighting mentality, I'm like if the Hebrew Bible is about fighting and not giving up, and then Buddhism is about releasing all desires, I'm kind of in between, I feel like I'm in between, because, I don't believe about fighting so hard, but I do, I, fighting and like killing all your enemies and whatnot, whatever I read in the Bible back then.
And so that's why I didn't really opt into Judaism or my grandfather's religion as much. But then I also didn't opt fully into Buddhism because it was like, I don't wanna release my desires, I wanna achieve stuff in life. I wanna be an entrepreneur, right? I wanna tackle that head- on. So what are your thoughts on this? Like where are you, like what do you think? Like, where's God on this?
Erwin: Yeah. I think that there's always truth to be learned from every perspective, every philosophy, and every belief system in the world. And I always love to focus on the truth between us.
And I think one of the interesting challenges with Buddhism is that it's actually incredibly passive. And if you listen to it carefully, it's very self-indulgent in that you are just focused on your own spirituality. And you just leave the rest of the world alone. And so what happens then is you're working for an assumption that someone else or something else will make the world good.
Sagi: When the default is bad?
Erwin: What's that?
Sagi: When the default is bad, right?
Erwin: Yeah. Yeah. And I, and it is also like the end goal of Buddhism is the elimination of all desire. And the ultimate end of Buddhism is nothingness. And so that, once you achieve an ultimate state, you move toward nothingness, you no longer cease to exist. You become a part of universal consciousness.
And so I think the differences in the scriptures and in the teaches of Jesus is that it's not that you become a part of a universal nothingness. That every human being is unique and that the soul is unique, that your soul will actually exist forever, and that human desires are not evil.
Human desires can be turned toward evil intent, but the core of human desire is actually good. That desires like love are good desires. Desires like compassion, desires, like hope, desires, like generosity, desires like compassion. So in Buddhism, even those emotions need to be eliminated.
And in Christianity or in Judaism, the Bible teaches that God actually gives us desire, but that desire then becomes corrupted. And so our desire to grow can actually become a desire to dominate. Our desire to be significant can become a desire to be arrogant and to be worshiped.
And so you, what you don't want to do is eliminate desires. See, when I was younger, I fell in love many times. And people would say things like, there are other fish in the sea, or, time will heal your wounds. And really the only thing that ever got me over an old love was a new love.
And because the only thing that actually heals a passion is a new passion. And the only way you can hit over hate is not nothingness, but love. The only way you're ever gonna get past greed is generosity. And so what the scriptures teach us differently, is no human being should be the proactive, passionate expression of all the good virtues that humans are designed to carry.
And so I'm a passionate person, I could never live my life for the elimination of passion. No. I want to be passionate. I won't be passionate about life and for love, for hope, for freedom. And you have to realize that so much of the Hebrew Bible is written in the context of a world of war.
One time someone asked me, why are there so many wars in the Bible. And my answer was because humans are a species of war. And the story of God is not written outside of us, it's written within us. If we were in God's story, there would've been no wars in the Bible, but God is in our story.
So there are lots of wars because humans are still having wars. And by the way, even without the Bible, humans still have wars. We still live in a world war. And so we know that God's not the creator of the wars. He was actually trying to reveal himself in the midst of a species that's prone towards violence and trying to convince us that love was a better way.
And so I probably have more admiration for the Hebrew scriptures than you do, even though you're Jewish, living in Tel Aviv. And because I've opened up that book and I've read where it says where God says, I have loved you with an everlasting love. And that's actually in the Hebrew scriptures.
It's in the Hebrew scriptures where God says that he actually is the lover of all humanity. And what he said to Abram, who became Abraham was Abraham, I bless you. So that you may be a blessing to all the nations. And so the idea that God would choose one nation and protect all the other nations isn't in the Bible. What it says is God chose one nation to be a blessing to all the nations. And I think it's the same thing with you and me Sagi. When I create wealth, I don't believe that wealth is just for me. I believe that wealth is so that I can do good in the world. I believe that God has blessed me, but I don't think God has blessed me so that I can just be the beneficiary of that.
I'm now to do responsible, to do more good. I'm responsible to alleviate more suffering. I'm responsible to bring more joy and hope to the world. And so every day when I get up to go to work, it's not just about what I can create for me, it's about what kind of world I can create.
And I feel like that, and that's why I wanted to do the podcast with you. Cause I believe you're trying to create a better world. And I think that if all of us could begin to work together to create a better world, we might be surprised what the future has in store.
Sagi: Oh, man, I love that so much. Thank you so much, Erwin. This means the world to me, and I, definitely wrapping up on that note and saying I'll just add and then that can, it create if we become better communicators, like that's the beginning, right? I definitely like your new course. I'm just definitely gonna opt into that.
And I recommend everybody here. And again, I'm not affiliated, I'm not earning from promoting this course, but I definitely would encourage everybody to get this course and start following Erwin. Erwin, where can we find you?
Erwin: I think the easiest place is to go to Instagram and follow me @ErwinMcManus on Instagram. I'm active and that's where you really have direct access to what's going on. And from Instagram, I'll tell you everything else that's going on in the world.
Sagi: Alright. That sounds amazing. Yeah, 100% man
Erwin: Thank you so much.
Sagi: Erwin, thank you so much, man for coming on the show. Really appreciate it. This has been awesome. And I really wanna acknowledge you for all the work that you're doing in the world and for you being an impact in my life and the life of everybody you touch. Thank you.
Erwin: Thank you. God bless. Be well, Shalom
Sagi: Shalom
Erwin: Guys, will this mind blowing or what? Erwin McManus, just an amazing episode guys. I really enjoyed it. I hope you did as well. I wanna tell you guys, so one, definitely go and check out The Art of Communication, which is new course. It's amazing and it is at theartofcommunication.org. Okay, so go there, check it out and get the course.
I'm not affiliated with it. I'm gonna purchase it just like you guys. All right, so that's one thing. Second thing is go follow Erwin McManus on Instagram, because I really believe that this will give you massive value. Be sure to visit there, all the links will be there as well.
Lastly, guys, if you like the show and the show benefited you, please share it. Please rate us. Please let me know you got this. Take a screenshot, share it on your social, send it to someone you love. People need to hear this message and I think it will give a lot of value. Please share the show.
One last thing, I talked about the app on the show. The app is called Affirmations & Co. Go get it. It's on the App Store, it's free!. Affirmations & Co is the app where I have personally my affirmations, but also my gratitude lists and my prayers and my vision and goals, and I follow other people. You can follow me when you sign up. So go to the app store or to Google Play and get Affirmations & Co.
Follow me there so we can connect, so I can follow you back, and then we build up upon each other's affirmations. You can also make your affirmations private, but most of them like the default is public. Sounds good. All right guys. See you on the next episode. Till then, take care and remember, guys, just live your passion.
Live your passion. Love life. All right,
Cheers.