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Interviews with entrepreneurs and business leaders who’ve “made it” in Thailand. Real stories of ambition, setbacks, and strategic wins on the path to success. Built for founders and operators who want to win in Thailand.
Guests from the US, UK, Australia, and Thailand. Honest journeys and cross-cultural lessons. Inspiration for anyone building in the Thai market.
Apply to be a guest:
https://madeitinthailand.com/apply
Hosted by Scott Pressimone, a US expat based in Thailand for 13+ years and owner of Fractiond, a Thailand-based strategy consultancy.
#ThailandBusiness #ExpatSuccess #ThaiExpat
I think the biggest misconception
is that you open an online store and
you will get orders from day one.
Unfortunately, it doesn't work like that.
They make it very easy to join the
platform, which is very beneficial
for Shopee and Lazada because
they will have more active users.
They don't really care so much about you.
They just care about the product
that brings them conversions.
So you really have to not only
work for yourself, you also
have to work for the platforms.
And you get zero love
back if you don't do that.
All right, welcome.
Today I have the pleasure of
speaking with Kelly Hazemans.
Now we met a few months prior, and
since Kelly has a lot of, great
experiences and we had a lot of
great discussions, I thought she'd
be a great guest on the podcast.
So, Kelly, thank you
so much for joining me.
Yes.
Thank you so much for having me, Scott.
Of course.
Maybe to get started, I'd love
if you could share a little bit
about your background, Kelly.
What it is you're doing in Thailand,
maybe how long ago you came here.
So I'm Kelly.
I'm from the Netherlands.
I'm a data analyst and
also e-commerce manager.
I've been working in e-commerce
for the last 10 years working on,
creating e-commerce strategies
for international companies, and
I've been in Thailand since 2021.
Oh, excellent.
What made you move from China to Thailand?
In China, I was working in a corporate
business and I felt I was kind of
reaching my maximum there in terms
of personal and career development.
And then I met my current
husband and COVID happened.
So all these things
together, we decided to move.
Take a new adventure or go on a
new adventure and move to Thailand.
Well obviously what we're gonna
be talking about a lot today is
e-commerce in Thailand specifically.
But I'm curious when you made that
transition from China to Thailand,
was there anything surprising to you
about the Thai e-commerce market?
Yes, because China is a
really big e-commerce market.
It's very high speed.
People are ordering a lot.
really a lot online in the sense
that it can go, your revenue from
online can be almost up to 50%.
So it's a really big
share of the business.
And then when I moved here, I saw, of
course, people are ordering online, but
not as much as in China in that sense.
I don't think you can really compare
because China's such a big country.
Right.
And they, they are very fast
in adopting new technologies.
But I, so yeah, the big surprise was
just like, okay, e-commerce is there,
it's growing, but it's not as fast
and contributing that much in terms of
revenue for a business, I would say.
Going into then your
motivation for starting iBoost.
It sounds like you kind of saw
an opportunity here in Thailand
where like, can you maybe.
Be explained where you saw that
opportunity, maybe the challenges
that some businesses might have
here and who you typically help
on in the e-commerce space.
Yeah, so of course if you are new in
the country, either you're like an
international brand, the biggest challenge
is always to adapt to the culture locally.
So if you're an international
company and you think you can
just copy paste what you're doing,
let's say in Europe or in America.
That doesn't work in Asia.
People really like to see local faces,
local models, local influencers, and
also in Asia and also in Thailand.
There are a lot of, new technologies
popping up all the time.
So as a brand, you really have to catch
on with these new trends and really adapt.
Adapt and on a very fast pace.
so that is often the challenge for brands.
It doesn't matter
internationally, but also locally.
And I saw opportunity because
I was working in China and
it's such a big fast market.
I saw there's still a lot of, room
for growth and how to adjust as a
company in terms of, operations,
which is my strong point.
And also analytically how to just
use the data to really yeah, use
it for making smart decisions
and yeah, skill your business.
Something this reminds me of is
I, sometimes talk to people that
underestimate what it takes to either
make the adaptations that you're talking
about or just start selling online.
Because they don't maybe
know what they don't know.
And I think I. There's an over
simplistic view to say, I'm just
gonna start an online shop, or I'm
just gonna start expanding this area.
So is that something
that you've come across?
Yeah, for sure.
I think the biggest misconception
is that you open a store and
people just walk in, right?
And you open an online store and
you will get orders from day one.
Unfortunately, it doesn't work like
that because you are in such a big
marketplace with so many products and
you, and the only way to, to stand out
is to reach the top of the ranking.
So you really have to make an effort
to, to make yourself visible, to
really stand out and to, be there
at the top of the search engine.
Otherwise, it's going to be
very tough to be discovered.
They make it very easy to join the
platform, which is very beneficial for
Shopee and Lazada because they will
have more active users, which looks very
good to their shareholders, but as a
merchant you have your own challenges,
which are different from, let's say,
the company Lazada and Company Shopee.
Whoa there.
Hold up for just one second.
I'm sorry to interrupt, but if you are
struggling with business operations,
cultural challenges, or growing your
business in Thailand, you are not alone.
This market is really tough to navigate.
I know because I've been here
since 2012 and I've experienced
a lot of these challenges myself.
That's why I founded Fractiond, a
Thailand-based consulting firm aimed at
helping businesses succeed in Thailand.
My Accenture experience from the US,
and our community of top consultants
from around the world, allow us
to deliver top tier strategy and
execution to businesses in Thailand.
If you wanna learn more, you can book
a free 15 minute discovery call to
see how we can help your business.
You can email us at podcast@fractiond.io.
Alright, back to the show.
It reminds me a lot just being I've
worked a lot in the marketing space
and it's something like Google, right?
Google, sure, let's say in the past had
a ton of the market share when it came
to search, which is very attractive.
But then when you start
to advertise on Google.
Or you start to try to publish a lot
so that you get showing, you show up
higher in the organic search results in
Google, well then it's different, right?
Because now every business owner
wants to be at the top of the list
or wants to bid for those keywords.
And then guess what?
You're competing against everyone else
trying to get those top spots and Google's
winning with all that competition, right?
They're selling the
keywords, the pay per click.
They're getting the best search
results to their users, but
everyone's trying to get those spots.
And so the volume of searchers
it diminishes the further
you go down the list.
And so it is a zero sum game
is really what I'm saying.
And it sounds like it's the same with
these e-commerce platforms, is that right?
Yeah, that's totally right.
It is, so it is a search engine, right?
So especially, and that's also
a big difference here in Asia.
People use apps for searching and
discovering, rather than going to
Google or any browser, or search engine.
They use applications to discover
and to search for products.
And indeed, if you are ranked number
one, you'll get 50% of the clicks
and the first 10 will get 80%.
So after that if you're lower than
that, you won't get a lot of traffic.
So, and then, so you're in this
crowded marketplace, everybody
wants to be in the top 10.
And organically, probably as
well, that takes a very long
time to rank high organically.
so these companies, like the platforms
they don't really care about.
They don't really care so much about you.
They just care about, the product that
brings them conversions because they
get paid on every sale that you make.
You have to pay commission.
So for them.
for the platforms, the logic is if you
can guarantee conversion, I will push you
higher, I will give you more visibility.
So you really have to not only
work for yourself, you also
have to work for the platforms.
And you get zero love
back if you don't do that.
And it takes a long time before you
get Yeah, you get there to the top.
Yeah.
So you, definitely need some marketing
budget there to, to rank high.
So this sounds like something
you shouldn't dabble in.
It's not this level of, Hey, I just,
let me just throw my product up on
Lazada and Shopee and cross my fingers.
Hope for the best.
It sounds like starting
with a bit of strategy,
Yes.
Might be beneficial.
Right.
Which is obviously where you come in.
So I thought something that we could
talk through are a few scenarios
or a couple scenarios common
situations that maybe I've seen
and I'm sure you've seen as well.
The first of which would be, let's say
that there's an established business that
already has their product in Thailand.
On Thai shelves.
Maybe they're in the local supermarket
or they're on, you know, in Central
and all these nice malls here.
So they have a product and like
I said, they've been successful.
And let's say that they now see
the opportunity to expand online.
Could you maybe walk us through some
of the steps that would make sense
for that type of company or product
to, to do, or maybe some of the
mistakes you often see that they make.
Yeah, so for those that are already
physically in Thailand and have a
physical presence, unfortunately that's
no guarantee for success on online.
What I often see is that these
business owners, they think that
when they open the store online,
they immediately see success.
But they don't understand that
you start from zero again.
You have to stand out in the marketplace.
You have to assign marketing budget to
this new shop because across the whole
Southeast Asian reg region Lazada has
1 million products on their platform.
So if you then come with your
products, it's very hard to to stand
out and to be found if people don't
know that you are on the platform.
So the good thing is that you
probably already have a following.
You have people know about your brand.
You have brand recognition.
So for them it's more about announcing,
look, we are also available here.
We are also you know, we make
it, available for you online so
you can shop anytime of the day.
So it's more about raising awareness
inside your following and yeah, and
then try to overcome your own personal
hurdle that you need marketing,
budget to create awareness that
you are available on the platform.
Yeah, again, it's not, the fact that
you are, in a lot of places, in a lot of
shops doesn't make it that your online
store will immediately be a success.
Yeah, I can imagine that being a
really difficult pill to swallow.
'cause if you've already been
successful and if you already have
brand recognition, I can imagine it
being like, oh, well I already have
customers that are gonna buy from me.
Put it on the platform.
They will just come to me.
And to your point, I guess if you
have those platforms are already
selling to existing sellers there, or
already recommending other products,
and they're not necessarily, the
platform is not necessarily gonna make
more money, off you than the other
ones that they're already promoting.
So now you're playing their game.
And so maybe you went from a big
fish in a small pond to a small
fish in a big pond when you're going
onto these, really large platforms,
yeah, exactly.
So the algorithm works in a way that
we already discussed, SEO on keywords.
Those are, I think the most critical.
And the other part is that.
they will look at your sales records.
So ironically, when you're a new shop,
you don't have any sales records, you
don't have any sales revenue, but the
algorithm looks at who had the most
sales in the last seven days, or who
had the most sales in the last 30 days.
And based on that, they will divide
their traffic, amongst their sellers.
So when you already have a presence,
you will be able to, work on this,
KPI, let's say faster because if you
do a little bit of marketing people
like, oh, okay, I know this brand.
Oh, I can buy it here.
So it's easier to build a sales record.
Whereas if you don't.
Have any presence yet in Thailand
at all, that will take longer.
But yeah, you have to first prove
that you are worth it to the platform
that you can sell, and then they
will, give you more attention.
Yeah, understood.
Now, one question.
This is getting a little bit tactical,
but let's say that I do have.
Established brand.
Maybe I've been selling some level
of my product on my own website
and I'm on physical shelves in
Thailand and I decide to go online.
You mentioned that the benefit they have
is they already have those followers.
They already have probably
some level of an email list.
I'm curious whether or not it makes
sense that a company like that might
point at their existing subscribers or
followers that are already purchasing
from their website, for instance, onto
Lazada, for instance, to try to get
some sales through that platform and
get some reviews through that platform.
So maybe it's a case of, Hey,
we're now launching on Lazada.
We're offering a discount or this
special package now on Lazada that
you wouldn't otherwise be able to get.
Go on there and buy it
through that platform.
Would that maybe make sense, even
if they're losing a portion of
their margin by funneling some
of their existing crowd to that?
Yeah, definitely.
Like I said, it's just about making,
so if you go to the marketplaces is
because it's the convenience, right?
You want to offer this convenience
to, your shoppers because you can
maybe have already your own online
shop, but, the marketplaces offer
even more visitors, more customers.
So it's first to scale your business,
but also just making it more
convenient because a lot of people
use these applications to shop.
So then communicating to them that you're
also available on Shopee and Lazada for.
As a business, of course you have
to pay commission to the platform.
So it's not as beneficial than
maybe having your own website,
but it's a convenience, it's
a big potential for growth.
So yeah, announcing it among
your following is definitely
something I would recommend.
Got it.
So it's maybe not a zero sum game because
if people are already going on your site.
Sure you're making more margin on that,
but you don't have the same exposure.
And maybe they're not purchasing as
frequently because they have to now
go on and go to a bookmark and then go
to your site and then make a purchase.
Whereas if they're constantly seeing,
do you wanna order this again?
Would you like another
one of these things?
Maybe you're actually getting
more frequent purchases from
those same buyers, even if the
margin per sale might be lower.
Yeah, potentially.
Because of course you, you
also like the comp, the company
Shopee Lazada, they, make it.
They make it that you keep buying, right?
You keep seeing advertisements also
outside the platform, let's say.
So they have a very strong drive
to make you buy on the platform,
so you will be chased by them.
And you can just reach so
many people, let's say.
Whereas on your own website yeah,
you have to use different tactics
to build that type of, or that
number of, visitors and customers.
Yeah.
Now you mentioned Shopee and Lazada,
so again, in the same scenario
of an established company that's
already been operating in Thailand.
If they are to launch on these
two platforms and they are to
do it simultaneously, would
it have a benefit to them?
Would there almost be an I dunno, just
some, sort of efficiency or benefit
to where, hey, we're launching on
two platforms, we can spread that
budget across those two platforms.
Or are these platforms operating kind
of independently from one another?
Well, yeah, if you can of course launch
simultaneously and, I see that a lot.
The, well, and then you have to keep
in mind you need two budgets, right?
You need to promote
yourself in both platforms.
Then both of them have promotional
calendar, so you have to discount.
It's, almost in sync these
calendars, but could be that.
If you count all the days, you'll have
a lot of days that you're on promotion.
If that's your strategy, right?
If, you're like entirely new, I always
say just go for one channel for one
platform, and then build from there.
And then it's also, then you already know
you've tested it a lot, you have a lot of
data, you have a lot of insights, and then
it's easier to copy to the second one.
And that makes it a bit more
manageable in the beginning.
I'm not saying don't, you know, don't
be on two platforms at the same time.
It's just a matter of how
can you manage that yourself.
And also each platform has its own rules.
Lazada is not always
that merchant friendly.
I would say shop is a bit easier, but.
You know, also the cost for marketing
differs between the two platforms.
So yeah, I would say just go for
one and then within a short time
you can expand to the next one.
Let's say.
Got it.
So I get your point that some
things are gonna be similar.
Like here in Thailand, it's very common
to have the sales on the, seventh month.
Seventh day of the seventh month, right?
So 7, 7, 8, 8.
The double digits are really big
for sales, and I totally get that.
That would be on both platforms, but
these still are different platforms.
So you have to go in with eyes
wide open and say, if you want
two platforms simultaneously,
make sure you have two budgets.
If you have a limited budget, maybe
don't launch to at the same time and
just spread it across the two because
you know, again, there's gonna be
different learning curves, I suppose.
Now let's maybe jump over
to the second scenario.
So let's imagine there is a new business,
or let's say that they're established
outside of Thailand, but they are now
trying to enter the Thai market and,
but they're not on physical shelves.
They don't have the
brand recognition here.
Are there any different recommendations
you'd give to a company like that?
Yeah, for those that are like very,
like new, to Thailand and then also
new to the online for them it's the
advice I have is that you have to
build your brand awareness, which
often you do outside the platform.
So I would say as you launch
on the platforms, try also to
like work on your social media.
Try to get a following.
So your advertising budget also
goes to social media platforms
to raise awareness to generate
followers so people actually know.
And then so they know that you
exist and that you are in Thailand.
And in that sense, you'll also need
to work on reviews because if no
one knows about you, probably no
one has ever tested your products.
They don't know what's, you know,
what, will be the experience.
So you have to work more on
trust so people trust you
and then they will convert.
Whereas if you already have a presence,
they already know your products.
And so conversion is faster, let's say,
and higher because they already know your
product and they know what you stand for.
But as a new brand, as a new
company, work on your trust, which
is more outside the platform.
and, but also inside the platform you
have to work on, getting those first
reviews, making sure you have conversion
and then slowly build your, sales records.
Got it.
So the platforms, and maybe we start
with what the platforms have in common.
It sounds like they care about
number of reviews, right?
Positive reviews.
I assume.
They, they probably
care about sales, right?
'cause they don't wanna point people to
a page that aren't converting, right?
Yes
Do they care about any promotions
when it comes to shipping?
Because I purchase a lot of things
and they always say free shipping.
is that a big deal for them that
you offer something like that
or the time in which you ship?
Does that matter?
Yes.
So you have different perspectives.
So from a merchant, you each
platform has their, set of
rules, which are very similar.
You need to ship on time.
So within 48 hours, you have to
ship out the package 48 or 72.
You have to make sure that
you reply within 10 minutes
to chats that are coming in.
And of course you have to
make sure that you're not.
that your listing is correct your
stock is accurate, et cetera.
So from a merchant perspective, these
are the rules that you have to work on or
you have to work with for both platforms.
Now in Thailand, and I guess this is a
common, common thing that a lot of a lot
of shoppers are very price sensitive,
so of course for, of course, they want
you to offer free shipping because
it looks very good on the platform.
And if you, as Lazada can say,
okay, most of our products are
free for shipping, then okay.
You know, that attracts
new users for them as well.
So they have, let's say, this
incubation time where they say, okay,
at least you need to have at least 10
products, join at least one promotion
and, you need to offer free shipping.
Of course for a customer.
This is very nice.
And, yes, I want to buy, of course, I want
have a coupon for free shipping, but as
a merchant it can be quite tough on you.
And then, yeah, you have to
see if you can manage that.
Yeah, it's back to you're
playing their rules and
Yes.
They want as many people
to follow their promotions.
And just a tip for maybe
individuals who are not merchants.
It's hard to say this is probably an,
against the merchant, but for those.
Who don't know in Thailand, if you do
purchase from a company like Lazada, the
mobile promotions are really quite good.
So I only make purchases on my phone
nowadays because there's constantly
15% offs and all these additional
coupons that you can take advantage of.
But I do have to feel a little bit
for the merchants because I assume
that they're taking a big part
of that hit when I'm getting my,
my, my big coupons on my phone.
Yeah, some is sponsored by the
merchant, but, a lot of the, it is
also sponsored by the company Lazada.
So the, but the thing is they
don't, they won't tell you.
Okay this like we are offering these
coupons to the entire platform.
So you will still see that, you will
have your normal, income, let's say.
So you will get the price
that you are, selling it for.
You will get that income, but the person
who buys it, they will see a discount.
But as a merchant, you don't know how
much you're being discounted by the
platform or how much are these coupons?
Interesting.
Yeah, I know with Lazada it's called
Lazada subsidy sometimes, right.
And I sometimes will get the
package, open it up, and I'll see
the full price on the package.
On the invoice.
On the tax invoice, everything.
But it's maybe subsidized
by Lazada in some cases, so,
Yes.
Sometimes for the
promotions it's often 50 50.
It, you know, there, there
are always a lot of rules and.
Things you have to read,
when you join the promotions.
But in the end, customers don't care.
You know, they, see discount.
They're like, okay, let's go for it.
But yeah, as a merchant, it's, it
can be a bit, mind blowing, like
all the different rules and, yeah,
what's happening on the platform.
So sometimes it, they overcomplicate
it a little bit, I feel.
Yeah, I suppose you still just need
to make sure you have the resources,
whether it be the budget or the
team to actually be managing this.
Because to your point, it's like it.
To be able to respond to someone quite
quickly in chat within 10 minutes,
or, answer all these questions.
And sometimes they can be silly
questions, and sometimes you can deal
with reviews that are like people
complaining about the shipping or
the, versus the product, right?
There's all these little challenges you
have to deal with, and you have to make
sure that you have at least a team member
that's able to respond to these things.
Otherwise, I suppose you get
burned a little bit, right?
Yeah, no, that's true.
And that's also one of the, mistakes
I see is that companies will assign
someone or, someone with a little bit
of experience to manage the day-to-day
activities, but you really need devoted
people who have experience and knowledge
and who are like jumping on things
when, you know, might be the order was
shipped wrong or you have a refund.
you know, how do you recover from that?
How do you make sure people are satisfied?
Yeah.
And how do you navigate all these
different promotions all the time.
Well, now, when you started out,
I understand your background in
analytics, you seem like a very
analytics focused individual.
Where it's not, let me just
throw throw something at the
wall and just hope it works.
You're gonna be looking at the
numbers to make sure that these
products are successful online.
So I'm curious if there's any trends that
you see or common mistakes, let's say.
That owners or leaders that are selling
products online make may be looking at the
wrong metric or metrics that they don't
look at that they should be looking at.
Yeah.
It starts by looking at the data itself
and then, really understanding it.
So one mistake is that they're
like, oh, there's all this data.
I dunno what it means.
I just don't look at it anymore.
That's not the way to go, of course.
So there are some, some good
metrics that you can can observe.
So especially in the beginning,
you need to understand which
products work, which don't work.
So when you turn on the advertisements,
you can quickly see, which
products bring in the most traffic.
And for example, also add to
cart because add to cart means
people are interested in it.
You may not have the conversion yet,
but at least you get some insights
on, which products can in the future
generate the most revenue, let's say.
So these will be your star players that
you really have to, start focusing on.
so if you have a lot of products,
you kind of have to, then you already
have a more like narrow, yeah,
parameter that you can work on.
so that is, so that's one.
Other ones of course.
Yeah, you have to think about, the
click-through rate of your keywords
and conversion rate of your products.
And those are the smart, smart, data
points that you have to look at.
It's also good to look at when
do people buy, because there is a
certain trend in the marketplace.
So around 12, around noon, when
people go for lunch, that's
when people start shopping.
So if you want to run a limited
time offer, make sure you do
it when they come to your shop.
And also a lot of action
is happening from 9:00 PM.
So nine in the evening till midnight.
somehow people, a lot of people
are then buying and shopping.
So make sure that if you have an offer
or yeah, if messages are coming in
that you are aware that, after working
hours, there is also activity happening.
So make sure that you're
aligned with that.
Yeah, great point.
I think sometimes people can just
look at the very last point, which
might be sales, and you sometimes
have to look at those leading things
that come before the sale, right?
So if you're just saying, oh
look, my sales are high, or my
sales are low, that's one thing.
But compared to what.
And I think to your point
the fact that there are.
There might be seasonality, there
might be, as you said the time
that people are making purchases.
These are details that
someone should be looking at.
Because if you're just kind of
hoping for the best and saying, my
sales are up, my sales are down.
It has to be, is it
compared to last month?
Is it compared to last year?
You know, what are you
actually looking at?
'cause you have to look at
some of these other metrics,
otherwise you're missing out.
Yeah.
And yeah, and it's also just to add,
it's the same with the promotions.
You definitely see a lot of, sales
happening at the end of the month.
It's when people get their salary and
then at the beginning of the month, so
they still have budget to spend and then
it kind of quiets down a little bit.
And then, so mid mid month, your
sales are probably a bit lower.
and then at the end you'll
see an uplift again.
So, and then you, and that also
affects your, marketing performance.
So suddenly you have less
traffic to your store just
because people are shopping less.
I think that was surprising to me.
I'm from the US and we were
used to the biweekly or every
other week getting a paycheck.
Whereas here in Thailand, I'm not sure
what the percentage is, but I think a lot
of people are paid on a monthly basis.
And so you'll notice that the
shops and the traffic will
get really hectic on payday.
Yeah.
The one time, right.
And that always blew my mind.
I was like, why are these,
why is this Saturday so busy?
when I'm just trying to get my groceries
and it's because of payday, right?
So, very interesting.
It doesn't surprise me that
it happens online as well.
Now, do you have any other
tips that you'd share?
I, guess let me just first
start out with something simple.
If you were to choose one platform over
the other, between Lazada and Shopee,
which one would you, and again, I, get
that this is depending on the product
and all this other stuff, there's
nuance here, but if you just had to
pick one, which one would you pick
between selling on Shopee versus Lazada?
I think, yeah, I know that Shopee
still has the biggest market share.
So I would say go for Shopee because, you
know, it's just the biggest one out there.
And I said for as from emergent
perspective, it's also user friendly.
Let's say they are not so strict
and tough in terms of, how you
can join the promotions or, yeah.
how they treat you as a merchant.
They're a bit more friendlier
than Lazada, let's say.
Good to know.
I haven't used Shopee myself.
I'll admit I'm a bit of a
Lazada ag addict to these days.
But, but good to know as a merchant that
might be a good one to start with, right?
Personally, I also, as a consumer, I
think Lazada is much easier, and to use.
Because they also have this
English, translation and, I think
the interface just, much better.
But from a merchant perspective
no, it's quite tough.
Right now, you've already gone through a
several different tips or recommendations
about shipping, about number of products,
about things like this, but is there
anything that we didn't didn't touch
on that are maybe operational tips or
recommendations that you can share.
Yeah, so operational, I would say.
So if you are on two platforms
at the same time, make sure
that you can manage your stock.
Make sure that, you can use a third
party tool for this, for example,
to manage, your stock across two
platforms or multiple platforms.
So in that sense, you, make sure
that you always communicate the
right stock to your customers.
Now what about the future?
What do you, see for the future in this?
Are there any sort of trends that
you're catching in the e-commerce space
that you think will either become more
or less popular in the coming years?
The thing I really love about, Asia and
in this region is that every application
sort of has an e-commerce integration.
So for example, you can go on Facebook,
you do Facebook shop, you can have
Facebook Live, which is quite different
from in Europe this doesn't exist.
And you have Instagram shop, so.
All these technical integrations with
the platforms and with e-commerce
that's really trending right now.
And there are new apps.
for example, Lemon8 is a new one where you
have user-generated content and when you
click on it, you jump straight away to I
think TikTok or to Lazada, one of those.
So there's always a way to shop when
you see something that you like.
So that's definitely a trend.
And TikTok of course, is growing a lot.
it's.
Predicted to overtake Lazada in a sense.
so the trend there is
video live streaming.
Yeah, people love to see, like I
said, they love to see what they buy.
So I think that is going to expand.
Of course, more live streaming.
More video.
You see also Shopee now when you start
promoting your product, your products
also end up in promotional videos that
they broadcast across their platform.
So those are definitely the trends.
Oh and one.
what works also very well
is affiliate marketing.
So you, use other people's followers,
let's say to promote your products.
In return for commission.
And yeah, the amazing thing is that
both platforms, Shopee and Lazada,
and TikTok also, they have this,
entire marketplace of affiliates,
integrated in their platform.
So you can just go to the store backend,
go to the affiliate program, and then
you can select the, affiliates that you
want to work with which makes it very
easy to join, this type of marketing.
Very cool.
You've been very generous with
what you've shared, Kelly.
I'm curious if there's any topic that.
I didn't ask about that you wish
we would've touched on today.
Just as like a final, final thought
is that I've learned from experience
that it, once you start joining the
promotions and you start discounting,
it's very hard to get out of that cycle.
It's very easy to get hooked on all these
different promotions, and of course you'll
get a lot of visibility and you can also
earn a lot of money on those peak days.
But in the end, it's very addictive.
And if you then not join the
next month, you'll see a big
difference, in terms of revenue.
And I also learned that it can,
hurt your margin quite a bit.
So I would say just keep a more long-term
view on things because yeah, the
discounting and the promotions can yeah,
generate very quickly, big wins, but you
can get hooked on it also quite fast.
Yeah, that's a really great point.
You can see that happening with any of
these platforms where as soon as you play
by their rules, you can do a lot better.
But then now you are hooked
into their rules and you're,
you're playing their game.
And I think you've said that
elsewhere, is that you have to
remember that it's their marketplace.
It's not your marketplace.
You're, if you're a merchant, you are.
You could say, okay, they're
providing a service to me.
You know, I'm the customer, but in
reality, they're the big player and
you're going into their walled garden
and you're going into their system.
And this is especially
true if you have partners.
So if you have you sell through a
distribution model or anything, so
let's say you already have that physical
presence and you are constantly,
discounting online, your partners in
physical shop wills at some point say.
look, we are, you know, you're hurting
our business because you keep discounting
the products and we are not getting
the same, margin, or our margins
are too low to join, to do the same.
Yeah.
So you ha really have to maintain
that relationship, of course,
while also you have to maintain the
relationship with Shopee and Lazada.
So, yeah, you have to be a bit smart
about how to, do that, how to balance it.
Yeah, and that goes back to your earlier
recommendation is that if you just
assign a junior marketer marketing
administrator or just some person to say,
Hey, get me on that platform, I think
that's fine, but you really have to be
thinking who's taking responsibility
for the bigger picture of how much is
going to one platform versus another?
What is your strategy behind your
discounts because to your point,
they can have other implications.
So you gotta think the bigger
strategy, I suppose that's a really
important thing to take away from this.
And with that said, what is the
best way for people to either find
out more about you or get in touch?
So if you want to have a fresh
perspective, you can connect
with me on LinkedIn or on my
website, iBoostonline.com.
I'm also a member of the Australian
Chamber, so if you want to meet
me in person, I'm often there
either in Phuket or in Bangkok.
Excellent.
Kelly, thank you so much for
sharing all this with us.
It's been a pleasure and,
I really appreciate it.
Yeah.
Thank you so much for having me.
Yeah, I hope it's, it was useful
and, yeah, strategically it helps you
to, you know, to make up your mind
how to take on these marketplaces.
Absolutely.
Well thank you again and we'll
catch you on the next one.
Thanks so much, Scott.