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Beyond The Message is a weekly podcast that dives deeper into the weekend’s teaching. Released after each Sunday service, it offers thoughtful conversation, added insight, and practical reflection to help our community process and apply what they heard. Whether you're revisiting the message or catching up, this podcast is designed to help you go deeper throughout the week.
Welcome to Beyond the Message, the podcast at Christ Community Chapel, where we take the weekly teaching from the weekend service and we apply it to our lives, talk about what it means for us. I'm Jimmy Kozy. I'm here with my friends Brooks Montgomery. How you doing, Jimmy? Sara Koons. Hey. Lana Chilton. And we are really excited to be together today. I'm gonna start though with a little, uh, icebreaker. So I told them that this was coming. So, uh, but I wanna know two things. Your first job, first job you ever had, and then the worst job that you ever had. Let's hear about it. What's going on in your lives today? Okay, I'll start. Yeah, you should. Great. Uh, first job was I did food delivery on my bicycle. Specifically Uber downtown Chicago. Uh, it was Postmates. It was a career. I think it was the right technical term. Had a little milk carton on the back of my bicycle. And that could be dangerous. It was, couple accidents. I've got a lot of questions and maybe it's a different podcast. So I wanna know though, what is the most bizarre order that you ever delivered to downtown Chicago via Postmates? That's a great question. Uh, immediately, that one that comes to mind was there was a guy who ordered like eight packs or like eight massive boxes of band aids to his apartment, which just was like one of those things where you're, as you're going up the elevator, you're like, huh, a little. This is like, you know, 8,000 band aid. Seems a little weird for just a dude on a Saturday night. So that was probably, that was my first job, uh, worst job, uh, I remember. So I was interning, uh, for a pastor here at the church and. This church? This church. Yeah, this one. And he asked if I would, I know this guy, get an oil change. And I was, are you serious? So I went to Valvoline. I got his oil change. Uh, that was hard. But, uh, you know, it taught me a lot of it. Seems like that's a really good opportunity to grow and learn as a human being. It's someone I still up to to this day. So I'm thankful for him. J. So just everybody knows that was me that Brooks was interning for. I thought when he started talking, what I thought Brooks was, was gonna say was something totally different. I think the worst job I ever gave Brooks when he was my intern was, uh. So at one point in time we had accrued a bunch of like, books, just resources and stuff. Cause we used to have a Bookstore at the church. That would be up in the atrium. Uh, and so we just had a big closet full of books. And so I told Brooks he had all summer. Cause it was a summer internship. To get rid of those books. Somehow he could sell them, he could get them to. And I told him he could take, like, 1% of whatever he was able to generate. Percent in terms of. I felt like that was a pretty good deal. Jimmy. Still waiting on that percent. But it was a very formative summer, very form. I will just say you never submitted an invoice. You never submitted an invoice. It was a great internship. Okay. So my first job was I nannied for a family of three kids. Um, and that was fine. That was like a high school summer job. Um, my worst job was I worked at Zepbe S & Hudson. Okay. What was so bad about that? Um, I think most of it was the fact that there, uh, that was, uh, a crowd a lot of times of students. And they did not tip well. But it would always be a big group and they would always ask for a lot of things. And I remember specifically, at one point, there were just coins on the table. Just. That's what they paid in. No, that was my tip. Uh, and it was a pretty large bill. And a server friend of mine ran out in the parking lot after them and was like, I can't believe. And I mean, it's not like they had any money to give him, but it was nice that he was. Had my back in that. It affirmed me in like, oh, continue, uh, your education. Keep going to school. Keep going. Yeah. Yeah, Good. So. So my first job. In the moments that you were talking, Sarah, I remembered what it was. I was struggling. You were. I was struggling in the fourth grade. I came home. Oh, but you were working in the fourth grade. No. Here's what happened. I think it's a job. I got paid. Um, I came home. I think the law might have told my mom. I had signed up for a paper route with the Vindicator Youngstown, Ohio newspaper. What that looked like was my'of the historic Great American and I piece of journalism. Yeah, it was great. And we collectively, my mom, my sister and I did that paper out for a month. It was miserable. And my mom m. Made me quit, But I think. So is that both first job and worst job? Okay, it's worst job. Worst job was Little Caesars. I. I just know that that was. I had a lot of really wonderful jobs I enjoyed after this. But the newspaper job, and I know Brooks is A big Little Caesar guy. Are you? I hated the job and I hated it. I was dialoguing with Sarah about this after he give us the question and I think I hated it. Number one, it was hot. It was just pizza ovens. It was real hot. That's half of their whole thing. Hot piza, hot pizza. Well, it was hot and then there were no people to talk to. It was just, take a phone call, make a pizza. Take a phone call, make a pizza. Aren't you talking to a person only about what they want on their pizza? There was no, like, no getting around face to face. Why did you choo. But why did you choose pepperoni? Yeah. Is what you want. Yeah. Like, let's talk about that. Have you considered mushroom? Yeah, it was an awful job. I have not considered mushroom, actually. I'OUT uh, okay. My first job was as a bank teller. Um, so I didn't. That I didn't actually. Were you. I was 19. I didn't work in high school. Not the fourth grade. What's that? They didn't let me handle cash as a fourth grader. My first job was as a bank teller. Uh, it was the summer after my first year of college. Um, and actually I think I would say that was my worst job. To me it's like, oh, you would be living your best life doing that. Uh, no, I think because it's a lot of customer service. Yes, that's what. And it's a lot of like, ah, you know, arguing. Not. Maybe arguing is the wrong word, but. But when you are a bank teller and you're processing all of those transactions, you like, people handle their money really weird and you find out about that and it's like I remember having conversations with customers at the desk when they were saying, I want to withdraw X dollars. And I'm looking their account and I'm like, you don't have it. And uh, they're like, no, I want it. I'm like, well, I can't. I can't give you more money than you have in your bank account. And as you guys know me well enough to know that customer service maybe isn't that, yeah, priority one for me. And so that was challenging because I just wanted to be like, look, you're not very smart. Great opportunity to educate though. It seems like you'd be passionate about that. Everybody loves being told about their life by a 19 year old. That's what I've learned. I do wanna confess that from the time my sister wanted me to play Barbies with her, I wanted to Work as a bank teller. And I still. You would be a great bank teller. I Lana, uh, you would blow. Blow the world away. She'd be a very good bank. Tell'd be amazing. You make the pizzas a little season. I ll go, I'll be the. I'll go to the pizza sweatshop. Uh, you go hand out all the things. Ye. That's good. Yeah. All right. So this week's teaching is from 1 Peter 2, uh, 4 through 12. So Joe had three points. Great message by the super powerful. Just an incredible, uh, message. First is what Jesus is for us. And so he talked about how, uh, Jesus is the cornerstone. And he gave the analogy. He showed the glass that kind of turned on its side and talked about how everybody has a cornerstone. It's just a matter of what it is. And even sometimes you don't know what your cornerstone is until you run into a storm that, that shakes it. So that was the first thing. His second point was what we are for Jesus. He talked a little bit about how, uh, in that time period, you know, Christians were very different culturally than the surrounding area. And he talked about how, you know, we kind of are both. He talked about this prophet and priest role that Christians play and how that plays out, uh, in culture. And then finally he talked about what it means. And there were a couple things I wrote down here. I think the first is, uh, I just remember him saying everyone is scared of storms. And I think that's absolutely true of my own life. You know, you think about all the different quote unquote cornerstones that are there and what the storm is that could impact them. Then he also talked about something that I thought was cool, just, uh, this idea of, in the passage, it talks about people proclaiming the Excellencies Jesus. And I thought that was, you know, the fact that God invites us in, uh, to that opportunity to proclaim, uh, the excellencies of Jesus. But we're going to start with a clip from the message. This is a section that I really liked. So, uh, we're going to go ahead and roll that clip now. I think it's so easy sometimes when we become Christians to say the way, the whole thing about being a Christian is that you have put your trust in Jesus instead of your own goodness. And it's through Jesus, life and death and resurrection, that actually connects you with God and God's love. And that's true. That's true. But Jesus is more than just your savior. Jesus is your cornerstone. And the first thing Peter does with this group of Christians who are living in a hostile culture is he reminds them of, uh, what Jesus is for them and what he tells them is, Jesus is your cornerstone, lean on him. Something that was really powerful about that is I think Jesus says Savior is something that we all understand. Jesus says cornerstone. I have questions about, um, I'm curious, you know, to hear from you. This is maybe the first question I'd like us to discuss together. Um, when Joe, at the end of that, he says, jesus, not just your Savior, he says he's also your cornerstone. And then he says to lean on him. Sometimes I feel like that's one of those things that in Christian circles we say, and everybody has a different definition of what it actually looks like to do that. But I'm curious to hear from your perspective. If I'm a Christian and I'm hearing that and you're telling me, okay, lean on Jesus as your cornerstone. Huh? What does that actually look like in my life, practically? How does that change? So on Monday when I go to work, what does it mean to lean on Jesus as my cornerstone? I'll jump in. Jimmy. What came to my mind, um, was honestly, this time of year when we lived in Savannah, we were there 12 years. We were pretty glued to the weather. It's hurricane season, and you knew storms were coming. You just didn't know if they were coming right for you or not. In the Savannah area. And where we lived, right outside of Savannah proper, we were not in a flood zone, which was really good for us. Um, but we knew that we could still get tornadoes, still get wind. And so when you watched the weather, you were regularly locating yourself. Look at where they think the storm'going to go. Where are they predicting the flooding? Where are they predicting and where am I? And constantly remembering where you were in relation to the storm and in relation to the damage. I say all that to say that when Pastor Jo was speaking about this particular point, when I read your question about this, I thought, I think that's what the opportunity is for a Christian. He is our Savior. But then for the rest of our relationship with him, we can locate ourselves, remind ourselves of our location. He says throughout the scripture, storms arenna come this book. Um, in the first couple of verses, you're gonna encounter various trials. Jesus said, you're gonna have all kinds of tribulations, locate yourself. If you are on the cornerstone, there will be winds, there will be rain, but you are secure. And I think for me, that's what it looks like practically, is tomorrow morning when we get a phone call or we get an email or we get some windy situation coming going. Um, this rests on his shoulders too. I don't know what he's gonna do, but he's still the cornerstone. Yeah. And I think, to your point, lna, I think you have to identify what those things are that you're resting on. You mean what the cornerstones are then. Yeah. That you don't maybe even realize are the cornerstones in your life. Cause I think, um, he had a really valid point. They said often we don't know that until the storm hits. Right. And so I think if we haven't experienced yet something like that yet, we are maybe we feel self assured that, oh, yeah, Jesus is my rock, he's my cornerstone. So I think we need to maybe even ask the Holy Spirit to identify those things ourselves to say, like, hey, am I truly relying on you? Is there a way of. This is something I'm really curious about because I would prefer to avoid storms if possible. Sure. Is there a way of identifying your cornerstones that are not Jesus independent of a storm, I mean, battling them? I think so, yes. Because I think it goes back to, you know, the bicycle wheel that Joe often talks about. That if there's something in my life that's taking more time, that's capturing my attention more than Jesus, then that's probably something I'm leaning on more heavily. I, uh, think oftentimes we also take something that's really good, but create that to become something more than it is intended or created to be. I think another danger that we have as Christians is we even hide behind a person or something that has really good things to say. What do you mean by that? I'm curious for more. Um, I think that there are. Whether there's, you know, Christian figures or people that we align with, whether that's politically or biblically or theologically. And we tend to say, like, oh, we really are, like, leaning heavily into what this person is saying or teaching. And then if something were to happen, like with that person. Yes. Then it's like, oh, my gosh, my foundation is unsettled or insecure. But it's like, well, no, we have the Bible and Jesus and that's, uh, where we should be focused. Does that make sense? Yeah. Okay. That's, uh, one thing that Joe said and one of the most, I think, compelling virtues, uh, is perseverance. Like to see someone who sets out a huge, lofty goal. Right. And to see them kind of stay true and complete that. To see a team persevere through hard times with you know, and accomplish a goal. There's something really attractive and compelling about that. And Joe even said to your point that, uh, to persevere in hostility, Jesus must be both your savior and cornerstone. And I keep as profound because I think savior language, right? To understand our kind of position between us and God, Jesus has saved us, forgiven us by his blood being poured out like that is safe and secure. We are justified. But cornerstone language is stability language. Like, you have a cornerstone because you are into all of our points, anticipating a storm will come, and the cornerstone exists to give you stability. Yeah, that's interesting. And that's where Minde goes to say you in everyday life, I mean, everything from whatever storm comes could be job loss, could be. I mean, as serious as death. Right? Like, uh, what is stabilizing you and the way you understand the world and the way you understand your own life. Because if an increased net worth and bottom line, that's not gonna stabilize you at the end of the day. Like fundamentally, cornerstone language, stability language. Um, yeah, that's good. And that was really helpful in Joe's point that that is necessary if you're gonna persevere in. I really like. I think what you're saying is really helpful just in the idea that even the usage of a cornerstone metaphor in this scripture presupposes the storm. And I think one of the biggest mistakes we can make as Christians is believing that trusting in Jesus also means that he is going to care for us materially and physically and whatever the case may be, when in reality, uh, it may be the case that you have to walk through the storms, or maybe I'll say that more strongly, it is the case that you're going to walk through storms. Because at the end of the day, at some point, you know, even if life is smooth sailing all the way until you die, you do die. And so that in and of itself is a storm. So I think the presupposition of the need for a cornerstone is something that's so important for us and that we all have one, whether it's Jesus or Noteah. We're leaning on something. Yah, we're leaning on something. And I think, Brooks, those things you mentioned, you had asked Jimmy, can we know if Christ is our cornerstone apart from the storm? And I don't know about the rest of you, but I think a lot of us ask those what if questions, you know, what if I lose my job? What if this report from the doctors, how we finish that sentence in our hearts is often indicative of, oh, I'm not leaning on Christ as the cornerstone. Um, and that's an opportunity. Yeah. So, uh, I'd like to shift gears a little bit here. There's a section in the Message where Joe talked about the tension between, uh, truth and love. And I think he was talking about how Christians existed in culture and in society. But I'm curious to hear from you how that tension'played out in your life. Whether that's, you know, uh, how have you experienced that in some of the different relationships in your life. And if you're willing even could you share a time where that either you got it right or you got it wrong and what that was like. I think that even goes into just the necessity of, uh, seeking a lot of wisdom to discern truth and love. Cause it can feel like they're at odds with one another. That's why I love. I mean, every single time you look at the person of Jesus Christ and his ministry on earth through the Gospels, like that is incarnate. Fully what is true and fully like what is love. Right. And I think for me, uh, even noticing it seem like Jesus, uh, seems like Jesus is not afraid to be very truthful with people that are very religious. And Jesus is seemingly, you know, making himself more accessible. And even in his heart is described as gentle and lowilyly to those that have no idea or no understanding who Jesus is. And I think that's even. Again, it's not a one size fits all. But even trying to have a conviction of, hey, when there are people that have placed faith in Jesus, that hey, I wanna hold them accountable, right? To living in a way to pursuing obedience to Jesus Christ, like that's often a time where I wanna speak truth. Mhm. But man, that's a form of love. But then when there's people that have perhaps no idea who Jesus is, they have no idea what church means. I think one of the best ways you can speak to them or have them curious about Christ, it's not by giving them a philosophy of Jesus, but it's by being kind to them. Right. By having them over and showing a genuine care for them as friends. So even just kind of identifying perhaps truth and love, it matters who you are. Ye called to be truth or love too. And I think it's really important that we're living that out in our own life. Like to speak truth to someone without love. It reminds me of a lot of uh, the passage in 1 Corinthians 13 that says, if I speak with wisdom of men and angels, but don't have love Then I'm just like uh, a clanging gone, a symbol. And to me I think that we Christians often get it wrong where we're like oh inna, you know, I don't want this person to going to hell. So we give them the truth and it's more like this biblical knowledge. But it isn't us saying like well I don't want you to live and you know, have hell as your destiny. And it just. We get it all messed up and then someone's going wait a minute, like you're not even coming at me with like a care and concern for who I am. Um, and so I just think we need to make sure that we're living that out in our own life before we're going to others, to other people. Um, and I know that like you. You ask like is there times you've done that wrong? And I think yeah, there's been a lot of times I've done that wrong. Where in my sometimes black and white justice orient itself. I want to explain to someone why they're wrong the truth. And that was not received well. Cause I did not do that with graciousness or really care for the individual person. Yeah, I think something you said there is interesting that uh, I think everybody has an orientation. Uh, they're more comfortable with one of these than the other Y for sure. So I know some people who are probably more comfort comfortable with the love side of the truth and love tension because that comes naturally to them. They're a little bit less comfortable saying hard things. And there are other people who really, really have no problem saying difficult things, maybe to a fault, but then also can be unloving. Um, and I'm curious if you've any of you are able to identify in yourself where you land on that spectrum. Well, I mean I just confessed where I. Yeah, yeah, I think I can land on either side. Uh, so do you think it's a relationally? I think it's relationalualized. I do, absolutely. Cause I think some of you might think that I would error on the side of love depending on your interactions with me. But I think if you ask my son or husband, especially my son, do you know what I mean? And, and even as he's becoming a young adult, um, leaning into the Holy Spirit not just in that relationship, but in any relationship where we think they need Jesus and they do either as their savior, also the to be remed camera of justice, but Jesus, do they need truth, you know, couched is truth or do they need this as love like the discernment that the Holy Spirit can give us. If I will close my mouth long enough to just ask that question. Um, so, yeah, I have found that I've had the Lord's leading in both areas, but also messed it up in both areas, too. But. Ye. Yeah, okay. Um. Another thing that I thought was interesting in this message was, uh, you know, he made the statement that, uh, in this time period, Christians were known more for what they were for than what they were against. That's great. That was interesting. Which was a really good line. Um, I'm curious. I don't know if that's always true today. So I'm curious what you think would. What would it take for Christianity to reclaim that reputation in our modern culture? Nobody wants to answer one'no. I think it's. For me, it's. I mean, I feel like this is really applicable to even, like, what is going on in our culture right now. And for me, it would be a lot less words and talking and a lot more action. What kind. I'm just pressing that a little more. Yeah, no, that. I think even this idea of, like, the truth versus love, like, for me, at least for me personally, it would be a lot more humility in my own life and a, um, expression of love and kindness towards others and really seeking to, like, maybe walk in the shoes of someone else and really see maybe the things that they're going through. And how can I come alongside that person and care for them? Well, despite what I think they need to hear is what I would say. Yeah, it's good. Yeah. It made me immediately when Jo, I'BEEN thinking about that a lot. There's Whole Foods. They're shopping bags right now. Uh, on the outside of them, they say what's not in the bag? And they have a list of you, all the things that, hey, you're not gonna find this in here. The one of them bag. Knowing Whole Foods, it's like the ext. Ceal of the bag is made out of. Well, no, it needs, like, the food. The add. Added, like, things like that. Yeah. And it's interesting. Cause it's like you can look at that bag and you. You have an idea of some things that are potentially not in that bag. But it doesn't tell you what is at the core of in the grocery sitting in there. Just think it's like Jesus, when he says, I'm the good shepherd, he doesn't say, I'm not a bad shepherd. Like, I'm not that. Like, he is very clear and precise on who he is. And I think for Christians sometimes have, uh, we can have more of an identity with what we disassociate rather than at I'drawing the line of this is not who we are. Rather than saying, of course this is who Jesus is. I'm gonna hold him out to you. And that takes boldness, that takes courage, I think to have a very precise language and a precise conviction of saying, like, fundamentally, this is what I'm about, this is what I believe, this is what I hold true. And I think it's easy sometimes to instead speak of the things that you're not without ever having a conviction or precise language to understand what you're about at the core. Um, and that was one thing I think Joe man, even for me, was convicting of. Take some m. Boldness and courage. But I wanna be formed more about what I'm know who Jesus is, not what he's not. So in that spirit, I think I'd like to maybe finish with this question. Um, one of the things that was in the passage that Joe also referenced in the sermon was this idea that, uh, one of the ways that people come to know Jesus is through Christians who proclaim the excellencies of Jesus, what he's done. And'm just kind of curious in the last three months, let's say, what is something excellent that Jesus has done in your life? I. I like this question because I am a big believer and I do think the most powerful, um, ways for us to see God in our lives is through, like, the testimonies of other people and how God has shown up. I think that's super powerful. So, like, for me personally, um, my daughter Naomi was going like, through some health struggles and I. It was one of those things. I think it's interesting. I think I found myself challenge on some of my leaning, um, with that of where, okay, if this doesn't turn out the way I hope or whatever, how am I gonna react to this? What am I gonna feel? But, uh, I mean, in the way that God provided. I mean, like things that we had seen on a medical test were no longer there the next time. And even talking to the doctor on the phone, she was just like. She just kept going, like, it doesn't make sense. This is just really good news. This is just really good news. And she just kept kind of saying that. I was like, yeah, I wanna tell you why that's really good news. You. And it was just even cool that she was using the word good news, y. You know, which is the gospel. So I mean, I know that that's a really obvious way, but that, man, was that a really cool thing to just be a witness of and a part of and really to see what that did in the life of my daughter as well. That's so good. So. Yeah, that's so good. Yeah. What came to my mind, Jimmy, Isuse. Um, I've had times where I would have a story like Sarah got to share, which I love, love, love. But the last three months have looked differently. I think the last three months for me have been a sustaining daily grace. Um, my husband has traveled the majority of the last three months. My son started college, doesn't live at home anymore. My mom's had some new health things. And just a presence of God and just him being able to. Just the nearness of him, the comfort of him and His Word and His people. And for me, that is also proclaiming the excellencies of him who abides with us through His Spirit. Those are beautiful words that we read in the scriptures, but when they are a daily reality, it's just. It's sweet. Yeah. And I think that's the encouraging thing, even for me, is Excellency. Sometimes their mind can go like, okay, what has been like a big, huge, massive, huge. Sometimes it's just the simple, right, simple faithfulness of Jesus Christ to, with grace, welcome us into his word, welcome us in prayer. And feeling like you're seeing the world differently because of the way that he is abiding in us as we abide in Him. To both your points, like, in the grand moments of life, yes, let us have eyes fixed on Christ, but in the simple everyday obedience, right, Let us see life with such a joy because of the excellency of Jesus Christ and what his blood has done for us. And maybe that's a way to tie it back to the idea of what it means to lean on Jesus as your cornerstone is, as we've said multiple times throughout this episode, you don't know what the storm'gonna be. You don't know when the storm is going to come. It's more about daily taking the time to turn to Jesus, to look to him, to spend time in prayer, to spend time in his wor. It's like basic fundamental things that are. What are indicative of your cornerstoner will help you shift. Cause I think that's what it. That's what it is for me, when I spend time with Jesus is often just realignment. It's like cornerstone realignment. I keep trying to slide off of one cornerstone and go over to another cornerstone. And, uh, independent of that tether coming back to him and spending time with him, I would just continue to move in a certain direction. And I think spending time engaged with him pulls me back to understanding this is where I need to le lean on Jesus as my cornerstone. Y Good. Well, thanks. This has been great. Hey, we're here every week on beyond the Message. Uh, if you grabbe one of the handouts when you were here, there's a little section that's called the Live it Out challenge. I just want to encourage you as a listener and somebody who hears the sermon week in and week out to be thinking practically. How does this apply to my life? What is one way that I can follow Jesus based on what I've learned this week? And we're going toa continue Beyond the Message all the way through the end of this Rise up series. But we're so glad you've joined us. Thanks. We will catch you next time. Thanks for listening to beyond the Message. As always, you can find us on all the platforms where you find podcasts, YouTube, Spotify, Apple Podcasts, and so many more. Uh, we're here every week discussing the teaching at Christ Community Chapel. We hope you'll join us next time.