Welcome to Inside Marketing with MarketSurge — your front-row seat to the boldest business insights, marketing breakthroughs, and entrepreneurial real talk.
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Speaker: Welcome to Inside
Marketing With Market Surge.
Your front row seat to the
boldest ideas and smartest
strategies in the marketing game.
Your host is Reed Hansen, chief
Growth Officer at Market Surge.
Reed Hansen, MarketSurge: Hello,
and welcome back to Inside
Marketing with Market Surge.
I'm joined by Kirsten Graham, a
business growth strategist, co-founder
of Six Figure Business Coaching, and a
leader in helping entrepreneurs scale
their businesses by working smarter.
has worked many years spent helping
business owners grow their bottom
line through smart outsourcing.
Especially when it comes to hiring
and leveraging marketing VAs, she
believes that too many entrepreneurs
get stuck doing everything themselves,
when in reality, freedom and growth
come from building systems and a team
that can take work off your plate.
She's here today to share
insights on how to double your
income by using a marketing va.
The mistakes that entrepreneurs make
when they try to scale and what it
really takes to build a business
that supports the life you want,
not the other way you are around.
Thank you for joining us, Kirsten.
Kirsten Graham: Thank you
so much for having me.
I could talk for hours about
outsourcing, although I won't.
Reed Hansen, MarketSurge: Perfect.
Well, yeah, I'll have to cut you off at
20 to 25 minutes 'cause that's, that's
about all my audience will sit for.
So Kirsten, before we dive into
outsourcing and marketing VAs, can you
tell us a little bit about your journey
and what led you into coaching and helping
entrepreneurs overall with their business?
Kirsten Graham: Sure.
So my background is actually real estate.
I started selling real estate.
I eventually moved to the mortgage side.
I went on to own a mortgage
company and a title company.
I was very active in networking, and I did
a lot of loans for self-employed people.
So I would see their business tax
returns and their personal tax returns,
and inevitably they would say, can I
take you to lunch and pick your brain?
So I mentored other business owners for
a little over a decade before I actually
turned that into a coaching business.
So I'm kind of accidentally
here, is the way I would say it.
And so that's really how I
ended up in business coaching.
And then the way I ended up in outsourcing
was my now business partner, Jeannie
Wilson, was scaling her agency at the time
and I was mentoring and coaching her and.
She got really busy very
quickly and I said, I've read
about outsourcing overseas.
Would you want to try that?
And she said, sure, if you'll help me.
And that was 17 years ago.
So we went on this really interesting.
Kinda a wild ride in outsourcing
because it was before Zoom, it
was before WhatsApp, you know, so
It was a lot different back then and we've
outsourced to six different countries
and literally have hired hundreds of
virtual assistants as a business coach.
I went on to then help other
clients outsource and just kind
of fell in love with the whole.
The whole concept that, you know,
smaller business owners can get
the support that they need, very
affordably, but also these fabulous
people halfway around the world end up
working for awesome business owners.
And so it really is this incredible
win-win for everyone involved.
And so I just have a desire to
help business owners free up
their time by delegating tasks,
marketing, bookkeeping, software.
You know, those things that
need to be done, but they
don't need to be done by us.
Reed Hansen, MarketSurge: so I
know a lot of business owners you
know, I've worked with many and my
my wife is another business owner.
They often struggle to
let go of certain tasks.
They struggle with the delegation.
You know, feeling like it's
seeding some control or maybe not.
They, they can't expect as
high quality or as reliable.
When, when they delegate.
What would you say to a
business owner in that mindset?
Kirsten Graham: Well, first of all, did
you start a business to have a job or did
you start a business to grow a business?
Because a business is
something outside of us.
So that's one thing.
The other thing is, you know, it's
like a skill, like so many others,
we weren't necessarily taught how to
create standard operating procedures
or how to write job descriptions or how
to onboard a virtual assistant, right?
So it's a whole different skillset
and it, it's like anything else.
You can learn that skillset.
And I believe, and I know it to be
true, that if you hire the right
person for the right job, they
can often do it better than you.
And that causes a different
problem for a lot of people.
Because I think their self-worth
is tied up in doing everything.
So, and we see that a lot with
people who spend hours in Canva
creating social media posts.
Sometimes that's because they don't wanna
go out and have the hard conversations,
you know, following up with that
person that you talk to the other day.
You know, getting out there,
networking and meeting people to
have those sales conversations.
So there's a lot of reasons
why I think small business
owners hesitate to outsource.
But inevitably, it really does
empower you to do what you do best
and to grow your business, you
know, to support an incredible
lifestyle for yourself and not work.
24 7.
Reed Hansen, MarketSurge: So, you
know, I think that's really helpful.
Kirsten Graham: Yes.
Reed Hansen, MarketSurge: I'm not
one that struggles with delegation.
I kind of prefer to delegate.
And I've had a few attempts at
outsourcing with mixed success.
You know, I may fall in the opposite
camp where I might be a little overly
trusting of, VAs for somebody in
my mindset, how would you say that
I could more effectively, do this,
and make sure I prevent some of
the pitfalls of, less supervision.
Kirsten Graham: Very much.
Reed Hansen, MarketSurge: you
know, the tasks they take longer.
You know, or they don't check
in as frequently as they should.
how do I prevent those sorts of issues?
Kirsten Graham: I love
the saying, hire slowly.
Fire quickly.
Most entrepreneurs do not invest
enough time in the beginning to hire.
The second thing that caught
me is you said they don't check
in as often as they should.
You should reverse that and say, I don't
set expectations and requirements for them
to check in as often as I want them to.
You're the boss.
They're not checking in.
It's because you're not requiring it.
Right?
So it really is about leadership.
We lead people.
We manage task, and that's where I
think having really clear, documented
standard operating procedures using
project management software and
having incredibly clear expectations.
We meet with every single
person on our team every week.
They know what day that that meeting is.
They know what time that meeting is.
If there's a typhoon, there was a
big typhoon there Monday, and so
we have a couple of VAs that are in
the northern part of the country,
so we got messages early on saying,
we're getting hit by a typhoon.
We may or may not be there, which
is what we expect from them.
And then the people that were further
south, they were on our calls.
I live in Florida, so we
call our typhoons hurricanes.
So I understand the concept that
sometimes you just, You don't know.
Is that storm actually gonna hit?
Are you gonna be outta power?
Are you gonna be outta internet?
But I train our team to do what I do.
And for example, if we were getting hit
by a hurricane this week and I had this
interview with you, I would've reached out
to you and said, Hey Reid, you know we've
got a hurricane heading right for us.
And it may or may not do any damage.
So I can reschedule this interview with
you or we can keep it on, but if I don't
show up, please know it's because I don't
have power or I don't have internet.
Now I'm giving you the power to say,
Hey, Kirsten, I'm fine with that.
Let's, let's just see how it goes.
If, if I don't see you, we'll reschedule,
or it gives you the power to say,
no, Kirsten, let's go and reschedule.
I'll get someone else into that slot.
So it's about communication.
So you need to have very
clear expectations for
communication with your team.
Reed Hansen, MarketSurge: Okay.
that's helpful now.
I know there's several categories or
specializations among the VA population.
You know, there's some generalists
and there are like marketing VAs.
what would
Kirsten Graham: Mm-hmm.
Reed Hansen, MarketSurge: how would you
categorize these different types of VAs?
Kirsten Graham: So first of all, you'll
have a lot of people who want to hire.
A marketing virtual assistant, and what
they want that person to do is to come
in, basically read their mind and be able
to create content that is in their tone
of voice, using their sense of humor,
which is never gonna happen, right?
So instead of having, a virtual
assistant, trying to figure out how
to write your voice, which I find is
often hard, even if you're hiring.
A copywriter in the US to somehow
get into your voice and write
exactly the way you want it done.
We work with a strategy with our
clients around either starting a YouTube
channel, talking HeadStyle, or a podcast.
Our clients then create great
content every week, and then
their virtual assistant takes
care of their video editing.
Audio editing, uploading to all of the
platforms, YouTube, creating social
media posts and scheduling those and
setting up that email to go out by having
a structure where the client creates
great content with a strategy and a
plan, and the virtual assistant does the
same steps week after week after week.
So that makes it easy because again,
there's clear expectations, there's
checklist, everything is documented,
everything is done the same way.
Once you have something like that
working really well for you, then
you can start to work with your
assistant and say, Hey, I've got
this great idea for a lead magnet.
I've got all the content for it.
Would you please lay it out and
design it using my brand colors?
And then they come back with that
and you coach them on what you
like and dislike and make changes.
So once someone understands your voice and
what you like and dislike when it comes
to video editing or the graphic design
that they're creating for you, then they
can go on and do other projects for you.
But at the beginning we really focus on
having our marketing virtual assistants
have clear expectations around that one
original piece of content each week.
Reed Hansen, MarketSurge: makes sense.
Now that being one of the early.
Tasks that you'd assigned to a
marketing va, when they're first
starting with you do, are there other
tasks that you'd recommend a business
owner should start to outsource?
Kirsten Graham: So we,
everything that we've created
has really come from just need.
So one of the biggest mistakes in
my opinion is that business owners
don't take care of their bookkeeping.
They intend to, but it always
gets pushed to the back burner.
That stack of receipts is haunting them.
Tax time comes around and they're stressed
out and they're, you know, putting it off.
They're filing that extension
and they're freaking out again,
in October to get it done.
So.
We really help our clients understand
the importance of bookkeeping.
And it's not just for tax time.
It's so that you can really
understand your profit margins.
You know, which of your offers
are bringing in great money?
Do you need to increase your prices?
Where are you overspending?
Are there things that you could stop
spending money on and maybe invest it
in a different way in your business?
So bookkeeping is another area we find
a lot of business owners struggle in.
So we do have bookkeeping,
virtual assistants for that.
The other thing is I'm not super
tech savvy, my business partner is,
but we attract a lot of people that
are more like me, not tech savvy.
So having someone who can, set up
your lead magnets, who can build
out all of your funnels and all of
your automations and test those.
You wanna have a quiz funnel.
You've got the idea, you've got
the content, but then having
a software virtual assistant
who can take care of all that.
So those are the things we really
focus on because those are the
challenges that we see our clients
have, the most difficult time with.
Reed Hansen, MarketSurge: right.
That makes sense.
So, I noted that you have a resource,
double your income with a marketing va.
Can you tell us a little bit
about what's in there and maybe
Kirsten Graham: Sure.
Reed Hansen, MarketSurge:
people can get it?
I've got a few more questions, but I
think this is a pretty interesting area.
Kirsten Graham: yeah, you can grab
it at outsourcing for bosses.com.
And actually we're in the middle
of updating that lead magnet.
I'm excited about that.
But yeah, our goal is to help
people understand the importance of
ongoing and consistent marketing.
I don't know if you know this
re you've got a great podcast.
I've watched a lot of episodes of it.
It's awesome, but do you realize that in
24 months, only seven and a half percent
of people will still be podcasting?
Very few people.
Yeah.
Yeah.
So, and we all know when it comes to
marketing, it really is about having
a strategy and then tweaking it and
improving it and growing it over time.
So with our clients, you know, the goal
is to help them create the strategy and
figure out the best platforms for them to
be on, and then how to leverage everything
that they're doing within their marketing.
And by having a marketing virtual
assistant who takes care of the video
editing and audio editing, and uploads it.
That means all I have to do
is show up for my interviews.
I show up, I interview and I often
book coffee chats with our guests
because there's often ways that
we can collaborate with them.
So I feel like podcasting and podcast
guesting is about relationships.
I wouldn't have time to do
that if I was doing, spending
all of my time on the backend.
So that's what we really help our clients
understand that you're making money.
I always joke that sales
is a contact sport.
He, we need to help you come in
contact with more people consistently
and have those great conversations.
And you can't always do that when you're
doing all the busy work on the backend.
And again, a lot of times when we are
doing the busy work on the backend, it's
not because you can't afford five bucks an
hour, it's because it's safer than doing
what you need to do to grow your business.
Reed Hansen, MarketSurge: So
tell us a little bit about
like, engaging with, with you.
You obviously have a great process and
have done this for a long time, even pre
Kirsten Graham: Sure.
Reed Hansen, MarketSurge: you mentioned.
So first question is, what
should a business be considering?
Like is there a certain milestone they
should cross before they hire a va?
Or is there something that signals
like, ah, you know, I've got so
much on my plate time for the va,
Kirsten Graham: We actually have a lot
of people who are starting businesses
who know going into it, they wanna
build a business bigger than themselves.
A lot of times if they're retired,
and again, they may be more like me
and they don't have tech skills, they
go into their business understanding
that I'm going to delegate the
things I don't wanna learn how to do.
So I don't think it's a
certain time in your business.
I can tell you the worst time though,
the worst time is when you're maxed out.
You have zero time and
then you decide to hire.
So you spend very little effort
in the interviewing process.
You don't have the structure in place
and it always fails epically usually.
Anytime that you can delegate a
task early on, sooner than you think
you need to, I think is the better.
So for example, if you don't love
bookkeeping, it's not your jam.
You don't absolutely get
excited to sit down and do your
QuickBooks or your Zoho books.
Why not outsource that?
It's on average, it's probably
gonna cost you 20 to 30 bucks a
month to have a VA do that for you.
If you could get that done, start learning
to read your profit and loss statement by
meeting with your VA each month, wouldn't
that be better to empower you to make
decisions than you spending the three
to four hours doing that bookkeeping?
When it comes to outsourcing
like marketing, are you strongly
considering starting a YouTube channel?
Do you wanna start a podcast?
Do you wanna have a strategy like that?
That is very time consuming.
And if you do, would it make more sense
to start that with a team supporting
you with a VA on your team so that
you could focus on getting the best
guest, becoming the best host, you
know, having great conversations and
finding collaborations with your guest.
So it's just thinking about how do you
spend most of your time doing what's
gonna bring in money in your business?
Reed Hansen, MarketSurge: I like it.
that makes a lot of sense now.
So when they engage you do,
you do the vetting of the va?
Do you is it mainly a structure and
the business owner does the recruiting
and vetting and interviewing?
How does that work typically?
Kirsten Graham: So we like to say
we're not an outsourcing agency.
We coach our clients and we hire and
train virtual assistants for them.
So for example, with our marketing VAs,
we interview them, vet them, we hire them,
they go through a paid internship with us.
They have to graduate a paid
internship with us before they
can go to work with a client.
With the client, we're helping them with
their strategy, but we're also providing
all of the SOPs that that marketing VA has
already been trained on for production.
So then we're coaching our
client on how do you lead people
and manage task through SOPs.
And project management software.
So our goal is really about helping
the business owner because again,
it's not a skill we all have.
I mean, I didn't have it
something that you learn, right?
So helping them have this great
process for having long-term success.
Our clients keep their VAs
for years and years and years.
So that's, that's the goal.
You get someone good on
your team to keep them.
So once we train that virtual
assistant, the client hires them,
that VA works directly for the client.
So we're not involved.
I mean, our clients are always welcome to
come to the calls and ask questions and
we'll coach them, but we feel like it's
very important for the business owner to
have a real relationship with their team.
And so paying them directly and
managing them directly is how
that happens with bookkeeping.
Virtual assistants, I'm obviously not
training them on bookkeeping because.
they all have degrees in
accounting or finance.
They're QuickBook certified,
sometimes Zoho certified as well.
And they have a minimum of three
years in bookkeeping, experience.
But then they also go through a training
process with us for what we expect from
them to help our clients because we
know who our clients are, our clients,
who are generally the people who.
Don't necessarily love bookkeeping,
and it just, the thought of
it kind of stresses them out.
So we have a process where that bookkeeper
can really just jump in and help the
client get everything up to speed and
really do all the work on the backend
while empowering our clients to understand
where their money's going and to make
smart decisions based on that information.
So again, we spend a lot
of time interviewing those.
Bookkeeping, VAs software.
VAs is the same thing.
My business partner is brilliant
with technology, so we have a white
labeled version of high level.
We call it from leads to sales.
So anyone who comes into that software,
our white labeled version, the first
thing that happens is one of our VAs
actually sets up the software for
them, and that's really their first
experience working with a software va.
And we pay for that.
That's something we give to our clients
for coming on board with us initially.
Then they have access to hire
our software virtual assistant.
As needed because most people don't
need a software VA all the time.
So some of our clients, the VA sets
them up and they're off and running
and they really never use our software.
Other clients want to learn how to
use the software, so they might hire
the VA to meet with them every week
to help them learn the software, kind
of hands-on and help them do things.
And then we have other clients that
are more like me, they just hire for
everything so that they don't have to do
anything on the back end of the software.
So it really just depends on
what support that client wants.
Reed Hansen, MarketSurge: Alright.
that is a great overview.
Well, Kristen, I really appreciate
that you've shared so much and
I think this is a lot of very.
Practical guidance on
how to get started now.
I think people listening to this are
going to wanna work with you now.
Can you give us your links
Kirsten Graham: Thank you.
Reed Hansen, MarketSurge:
where they can find you?
Kirsten Graham: Sure, just go to
six figure business coaching.com
and that's SIX figure
business coaching.com.
At the top of the website, you'll
see links to each of those programs,
so depending on what you feel
like is most important for you to
delegate you can look into that.
There's also links to book a call
with me if you have questions, and
I'm happy to help you figure out, you
know, what would be the right thing
for you to start off delegating.
Reed Hansen, MarketSurge: Well, thank
you so much for joining us, Kirsten.
This was really helpful and I,
Kirsten Graham: Thank you.
Reed Hansen, MarketSurge: you know, I
hope we can send some people your way.
Kirsten Graham: Thank you for having me.
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