Subscribe
Share
Share
Embed
Market like a Fintech is a podcast by Mint Studios and the Fintech Marketing Hub, on a mission to find out what marketing strategies and tactics the top fintech companies in the industry use to acquire real customers, build a brand and grow revenue.
When people think of B2B marketing,
usually they think of the boring
stuff, the white papers, the corporate
videos, the super long reports.
But great B2B marketing
doesn't have to be like that.
And as we explore in this episode, there's
a lot actually that we can learn from
the entertainment industry specifically
on how to grab attention quickly.
Today's guest, Jeremiah Glove.
SVP Head of Marketing and Communications
at Neum says that a lot of us in FinTech
marketing often get too bogged down
into the details of how compliant our
product is or how fast the technology is.
Instead, we should focus on the
core pain points to grab attention
and use that to then tell a story.
For example, say you're
targeting a payments manager.
The first and the 15th of the month are
super stressful times for payment managers
who need to ensure all payments go out on
time, are accurate, and all accounted for.
Instead of focusing your messaging
on how great your platform uptime
is, you could choose to focus on how
your platform helps make those dates
of the month a lot less stressful.
Anyway, super interesting, and
that's just the tip of the iceberg
of what we talk about with Jeremiah.
Jeremiah himself has extensive
experience in marketing.
He previously worked in the
entertainment industry and then went
on to work in large tech companies,
most notably early warning, where
he helped develop the marketing for
Zelle, the payments network in the us.
He's now at Nium, a global leader in real
time cross-border payments that supports a
hundred currencies across 220 markets, and
is currently valued at over $1 billion.
So yeah, he really knows FinTech.
In this episode, we talk
about what FinTech marketing
can learn from entertainment.
How Nium grow grew to over
220,000 followers on LinkedIn and
leveraged it for brand growth.
How the role of the marketer is changing
and is more focused on revenue and
why that's actually a good thing.
Why the best marketers today are those who
know how to make the most of technology.
I thoroughly enjoyed this
chat, and I hope you do too.
You are listening to the
market like a FinTech podcast.
My name is Ara Minta, MD admin studios
and partner at the FinTech Marketing Hub.
And with this podcast, my aim is to
explore the strategies and tactics
that top marketers around the world
use to grow FinTech companies.
We have discussions about how to navigate
compliance, the intricacies of marketing
technical products, and targeting
hard to reach ideal customers, all of
that while living the startup life.
I hope you enjoy this episode.
Araminta: I'd like to start with my
first question, which is, um, I know
that you have quite a lot of experience
in the entertainment industry, uh, so
I'd love to hear from you, tell us a
bit about what it was like, working in
the entertainment industry and what you
did, and then also what do you think
like FinTech B2B marketing can learn from
the film and the entertainment industry?
And what have you seen works there?
Jeremiah: Yeah.
Yeah.
No, it's a, it's a good question.
So my experience.
comes from years back.
I was involved at Microsoft in the last,
physical media format, war for those
old enough to, remember, pre streaming
days, you know, before, you actually
were able to stream shows and films.
You actually got packaged media
typically from a location and I
worked on a competitor to what?
Was the last format
standard, which was Blu-ray.
I worked on a product called HDVD, which
is, in the Annals of time as, one of
the failed experiments in technology.
But it allowed me to really work
closely with, the studios that
were, minting and creating content
because in any format, war.
what really matters is the content that's
being produced and a close partnership
with the entertainment industry in
terms of, how they market their films.
and what's really interesting and what I
learned from entertainment is just, it's
about grabbing attention fast, right?
Watch any film that, you particularly
enjoy, particularly like an
action film or even a drama.
There's something that gets you
hooked immediately, whether it's a
scene or it's a piece of the script.
the attention is grabbed
fast and then they keep it.
There, there are
moments where ebbs and flows in
the story, but they grab your
attention fast and they keep it.
And I think that that's
something that FinTech marketers
typically struggle with, right?
Like, we get so mired in the speeds
and the feeds or the legal leads
associated with the regulation that
we have to comply with, that we forget
that at the end of the day, we've gotta
create these emotional connections.
Tell stories that are built on tension and
arcs and all those things that you learn,
not even in entertainment, but in basic,
writing classes when you're in school.
So I do think that, B2B marketing,
particularly in FinTech, we've
forgotten and lost some of our way.
and instead of, talking about the
characters or talking about, the
customers in this regard, we talk
about the technology and we don't
ever step out of the impact that that
technology has on our customer bases.
Araminta: Yeah.
So the crux of that is really like
hooking people and telling stories.
And I was gonna get to storytelling
later, but I think we could talk about
it now, which is, yes, storytelling
is more important now than ever.
what would you say is
a good example of that?
'cause I always find that.
You know, storytelling is important, but
it's hard to kind of see that in practice.
Like, I don't know if you have an
example of maybe a a B2B company.
It doesn't have to be FinTech
that does storytelling quite well.
Like, what, what does
that mean in marketing?
Jeremiah: I think that, the example
I'm thinking about is, maybe less
B2B, but, they used a consumer
approach, in a B2B setting.
So, for example, the company was, Zelle.
Which is the payments network,
here in the United States.
a company that I had the privilege of
working for prior to my role here at Nium.
And what they really, sought
to achieve was, more awareness
around, fraud and scams.
and they wanted to tell in a
relatable way the impact of
falling victim to a fraud or scam.
scheme.
and so what they did, on a podcast similar
to this, they took, the format of a
true crime, podcast, basically, right?
and if you think of any of the Great
True Crime podcast, whether it be
Serial Or otherwise, you really get
invested in the characters, right?
and they looked at, not murders,
but a financial crime, right?
Like that was perpetrated
on, an individual, whether
it be, a elder abuse scam or.
you know, someone being, taken in
a Ponzi scheme of some sort, but
they really took a deep dive into
some of these financial crimes.
They introduced the characters,
they showed the criminals
and their motivations.
They talked about the victims and,
what was going on in their heads.
In a fun and entertaining way.
I thought that that was a great example
of, storytelling, applied in our
space that, you typically don't see.
Araminta: so just to clarify, is that,
so they set up a podcast and were these
stories real or are they fictional?
Jeremiah: No, They were real.
stories.
They were real stories.
So the stories featured interviews.
And, I listened to some episodes
about, you know, a puppy scam.
Right?
So they went into, the story about
the daughter and why she wanted, the
puppy that she always wanted, and the
lengths that the parents were taking
to try to find, a legitimate breeder
and then their explorations online
as they found, different sources
and then the interactions between
the scammer and the target and what
those look like and how it looked
legitimate in terms of the conversation.
So, much like these true crime podcasts
do on, different types of crimes, they
really took that financial crime angle and
did, some amazing storytelling, around it.
Araminta: Yeah.
And so that, that's really cool.
So were they doing that to raise awareness
of fraud amongst like just regular
consumers like you and I or, yeah.
Jeremiah: Yeah.
I, and because it's a topic
that, banks and credit unions
issue tons of warnings about,
Araminta: Yeah.
Jeremiah: about scams and fraud and tips
and tricks for not falling victim to it.
But it doesn't hit home for many people
until they A, either hear that it's
impacted a family member, or they read or
Araminta: Mm.
Jeremiah: to a real
life story about somebody potentially
losing their life savings.
Araminta: Yeah, it becomes more tangible.
So if, if, say we've got a head of
marketing listening to this and they
work at a payment company and they're
like, or maybe, you know, I'm thinking
maybe not even a payment company could
be like a identity verification company.
and they wanted to do a podcast like this.
'cause this could be a good, I mean,
I don't know, you're targeting.
what compliance professionals probably,
and I know you've said on another
piece of content, another podcast
you've been on, it's it's about making
the sure that your ICP is, the hero.
You wanna make them the hero.
So in this hypothetical example,
if you worked for an identity
verification company, what, how
could you kind of do a podcast?
Maybe that's a similar kind of story.
I know I'm putting you on the spot,
Jeremiah: Yeah.
if you're at a identity
verification company, say, right.
I think these podcasts that do a good job
tell stories from, the different aspects.
a different perspective, sorry.
Right.
Where, it could be the decision
maker, that ultimately is,
evaluating sort of the risk signals.
Or it could be the data scientist
who is telling the story about, okay,
here's what we're looking at and,
here's how we're keeping you safe.
Right.
It could be ultimately the end user who
has to then make a risk-based decision,
or kind of reading those data sets.
But my point in, the example on the
podcast side and on this identity
verification side is that, we
typically use, single spokespeople
to explain sort of a case, right?
Like if you, even if you watch some
of the typical case studies, it's, one
person in the department, and Nium is
guilty of this too, speaking about their
experience with, a product what I would
be suggesting here is when you start
to think about these case studies, to
think about them, incorporating more
than one perspective from the department,
Uh, end user perspective, and others
so that, you round out and have sort
of some of this creative tension like.
You know, we've talked about
like, how do you make the target
or the customer, the hero.
Right.
And the example that I was thinking
about going into, it's not for a podcast,
but was, you know, we don't really
surface what the day-to-day job is
like for the people that
are using our products.
Right.
Like, you know, what Nium is
doing, is enabling, you know.
Who are at a payroll company ensure that,
employees and contractors around the world
get paid on time on the first or the 15th.
Right, right.
And you know, the story I was thinking
about was like, you tend to think
about, The first and the 15th as
being really exciting times from
an employee perspective.
I'm gonna get paid today.
that's super exciting, but when you
take it from the other perspective
of the person sending the payment,
Like that can be some of the most
stressful, days, in the month, right?
Like if there's a failure, it's on
you , and if that payment fails, then
the, the impact on, that employee
or that contractor and the ripple
effects of not being able to get
that paycheck, are, are far reaching.
Right?
And we don't necessarily kind of
highlight, you know, that, that,
That part of the story, right?
We talk about the mission
critical nature of
payments, but we don't necessarily
talk about, okay, what does
exactly, does that mean?
What goes through that person's
head as they're about to, hit
send and then who's enabling them?
To live more stress free.
Oh, that's us as the,
as the, as the partner.
Right?
So I think that there's room there, even
in sort of the, rigidity of, B2B marketing
to actually use similar tactics, but just
explore different, applications, within
the tactics that we use in the day to day.
Araminta: Yeah, I really
love that example.
so if we continue on that example, the
head of payments who's very stressed
on the first and the 15th, how would
you then put that in your marketing?
Like at new, like how would you run a
campaign where the campaign says something
like, don't be stressed on those two days?
Something like that.
how does that translate into marketing
Jeremiah: yeah.
I think for us, you know, obviously
static forms like copy and in,
email nurture campaigns, et cetera.
but I've been talking to our team
about and some of these things will
come to light over the course of the
next few weeks, is to diversify the
content types that we tend to use, right?
Like, we are taking more cues
from the consumer side, right?
Araminta: Hmm.
Jeremiah: um, shorter form
video, um, uh, you know, quote
cards, slideshow, carousels.
and then even, longer form pieces
that we're actually able to
cut up, particularly in video.
and so when, I'm instructing sort of my
team to do these case study interviews
with various stakeholders at a company.
We're asking these, more, emotional
questions, versus not just like, oh.
What was the return on investment
on the service we're providing?
how many hours did you
save, blah, blah, blah.
I mean, that will come out in the
story, but like, how did you solve this
problem Without us, How did you feel?
were you nervous?
what helped alleviate some of that stress?
we asked some of those questions to try
to get the customer more comfortable
talking about their experience in
their own words and how it, plays out.
Araminta: Yeah.
And I think, if we now follow on to
talking about how Noom does a good
job of standing out, I think one
good example of storytelling is your
LinkedIn, your company LinkedIn,
you went from, I heard this from
another podcast that you were on.
You went from 10,000 to a hundred thousand
followers in like 18 months and then now
you're at over 220,000, which is amazing.
what do you think
contributed to that growth?
And I'm also curious, 'cause
everyone always says personal
LinkedIn has better engagement.
But I'm curious, what have you
seen is the impact of having one
of the biggest, FinTech LinkedIn
Jeremiah: it's one of
the biggest Thank you.
And, we're particularly
proud of it, right?
and I think that a couple of things,
have led to that sizable growth right?
over time.
It did not happen overnight.
Let's be clear.
First, I would say it was content,
from a content perspective, what
I mean by that was a variety of
content pieces distributed on a
fairly aggressive cadence, right?
So valuable content delivered frequently,
and with value, measured by the level of
engagement that we were driving, whether
it be, shares, likes, or, downloads.
so that was sort of core.
I wanted to
make sure that, this wasn't just,
Not just announcements, right?
even though that is
part of what we do, and
that's certainly, but then the second
piece would be amplification, right?
So, we really encourage our, colleagues
to participate in the conversation, right?
and to be an active participant
in the marketing of their company.
and so we encourage them to share
the content to their networks.
and so we created this network effect,
which, every brand aspires to, right?
So where it is now almost routine
that front facing, client teams are
sharing content on a regular basis.
Then I think that we also finally
had the benefit of, an executive
team with high following, that, also,
believes in the power of, LinkedIn and
would be part of that amplification.
process, but again, really important that
we started foundationally with producing
great, valuable content, on the platform
Araminta: Yeah.
And, what kind of benefits
have you seen from it?
do you feel like it really helps with
recruitment, for example, or what do you
Jeremiah: for sure.
Araminta: the most?
Jeremiah: and I think that, I would say.
Next to, sort of organic search,
most of our, inbound traffic to the
website comes from social media.
So, when we talk about
social media, LinkedIn,
and to some degree X are, the
channels that we participate
in, but it's LinkedIn primarily.
I would say that that's been, Benefit.
And then I think there's the,
the, the benefit also of just
a general awareness, right?
Like, anecdotally we hear when we
go to events that yes, we know you
and you know, how do you know us?
it's through LinkedIn
'cause our content has, surfaced
through the algorithm to some
of the more important decision
makers around the world.
Araminta: Wow, that's amazing.
would you mind sharing a
bit, what is your, setup?
Do you have like a team internally
that who are dedicated only to
social or because, I mean, it's a
lot of, you're creating carousels,
you're creating high quality content.
Like how do you do it?
Jeremiah: yeah, I'm afraid to
kind of share the secret sauce,
but like people think that behind
the scenes at Nium, there are large
Araminta: Mm.
Jeremiah: And I would tell you that my
marketing team is probably less than 10
to cover, a global entity, you
know, with annual revenue, over
a hundred million dollars, right?
Like this is a fraction of the
size of most organizations.
but we do a good job of,
creating great, templates.
And so when we do invest in a content
piece, we're able to ensure that we
get more than one use out of that
content piece.
So there's a lot of, adaptive reuse.
of our content pieces I, I'm proud
to say I have a, a very talented,
dedicated, internal team as well as,
a small supporting cast of agencies
that help us produce great stuff.
Araminta: Yeah.
Jeremiah: Tiny but mighty for sure.
Araminta: so what are a few other
things that Noom does that you would say
helps you stand out as a brand and not
be like the boring payment companies?
I know you've sponsored Cricket, and, you
also, maybe we can talk about this later,
but you've separated two brands, so I'd
be curious to learn a bit more about that.
But yeah, let's focus on the.
standing out and not being
the boring payment company.
Jeremiah: Yeah, let's talk a little, I'll
talk about maybe events and then I'll talk
about sponsorships in a second, right.
I think events is one way that
I think we've stood out, right?
And, you know, part of my
philosophy here comes from, my
background in, consumer marketing,
particularly in the telco
Araminta: mm-hmm.
Jeremiah: So early on in my career.
I had this realization where I was looking
at the advertising from Verizon and at
the time, sprint and T-Mobile and at t the
biggest carriers in the, in the country.
we were sitting around in a
marketing meeting with all of the
ads for these companies laid out,
and they all looked the same.
Like, smiling, youngish, individuals
looking at their phones, in delight
Araminta: Yeah, exactly.
Jeremiah: the phone.
Right.
and this was pre selfie,
right?
So they were just enamored with
the quality of the device, I guess.
we used to call it shiny
happy people, right?
like the REM reference, right?
What I swore, was that even industries
that I would work in, that looked,
on the surface the same, that I
would do my best to stand out,
Araminta: Hmm.
Jeremiah: it was in the look
and feel, or the experiences.
And my background is primarily
on the experience side.
Like I did some pretty exciting things,
at Microsoft with, experiential marketing.
And so with Niem, we took that
approach with, um, events.
For example, like everybody shows up
at Money 2020, which is sort of the
seminal event in FinTech, as you guys
know, especially the event in Vegas.
everybody does a happy hour.
Everybody does a dinner, but
nobody really paid attention to
the experience within the event.
Araminta: Hmm.
Jeremiah: and how do you deliver content
that's interesting, engaging and,
at the end of the day, fun that you
would wanna step away from,
the seafood platter at, a JP
Morgan event and go, attend.
So, 20, 20, a couple of years
ago we did, a comedy night.
Right.
And, not just your standard comedy night.
we found, a few founders that were
willing to take a risk and, we had
them roasted by a comedian, right?
And, had them just all vulnerable on
stage, like talking about their stories,
which are important lessons, et cetera.
But in the context of, uh, you know,
And just the amount of laughter
from that session was just amazing.
And we followed that up with,
a well-known, Netflix comedian.
and so it's delivering, and we started
to brand these experiences, these
evening experiences, mem at night, right?
Like, it was really an attempt to,
share with the FinTech community.
Like after you've had a long day,
the last thing you wanna do is sit
around and watch a presentation
and get the hard sell,
right?
Like, so how can you engage,
in a networking environment?
you know, discuss topics at
your leisure and be entertained
in a fun and exciting way.
And so we've kind of taken
that neem at night concept and,
delivered it in markets, around
the world to, a ton of success.
So that would be one way that we've
kind of been working on standing out.
The other way that, you asked about
was just sponsorship in general, right?
I, I'm not going to, claim that we're the
first to, explore sponsorship as a tool.
Many brands do.
But we were one of the first kind
of FinTech brands to look at cricket
as
Araminta: Mm.
Jeremiah: as a sponsorship vehicle, right?
Like, little known fact that behind,
football, cricket is the most, watched
and played, sport in the world,
Araminta: Wow.
Jeremiah: right.
you know, particularly due to,
the popularity of the game in
countries like India and Pakistan.
, but you know, sponsorship was more than
just placing a logo, on signage boards
and, it being about, broadcast eyeballs.
although certainly that was part of
it, it was about the experiences that
we could deliver in partnership with,
with the game that tied back to our
kind of, corporate and, brand values.
So, for example, we really stand
for innovation and, championing,
the FinTech community, and
particularly the payments community.
So we sponsored a hackathon,
the first ever for, the
international cricket community.
and from that, hackathon came a bunch
of viable, technology ideas that would
advance the game in areas of ai, in areas
of virtual reality, et cetera, that are
actually being, commercialized, today.
so it was really about how do we leverage
the game, as a brand awareness vehicle,
but also as a tool to really highlight,
some of our, brand and corporate values.
Araminta: Yeah, and I've also, heard
from other people that it's actually
smarter to go sponsor events where
there's not tons of payment companies.
So like, not another money 2020
and instead sponsor, where there
might still be, heads of payments
who like to go to cricket matches.
but there's no other payment company,
so you're gonna stand out and it'll
hopefully be cheaper than money 2020,
Or the ROI will be maybe greater.
Jeremiah: Yeah.
And it's a captive audience too, right?
Like you would be surprised
how many bankers and heads of
payments and, vendors are
big fans of the game, right?
and and cricket is one of those
things where you can get really
immersed, in the sport, right?
Like you can get onto the field
with some of these experiences.
You don't necessarily get that type of
treatment.
I would
say from a, you know, an F1, let's
say as, as an example, right?
As different type of sport.
Araminta: Yeah, no, really good point.
I'd like to shift gears to
talk a bit more about branding.
So, you mentioned in another interview
that you were on another podcast
that, there's an interesting kind of,
change where marketers have shifted
from just taking care of the brand to
taking care of both brand and revenue.
And I think, I mean, we've all seen
this, everything is becoming more.
Financially oriented, the CFOs are more in
charge, which means that, yeah, marketers
are being held accountable for revenue.
So I'd love to hear your thoughts on, you
know, what does that mean for marketers?
Is that a good thing?
What do you think?
And do you think, where's
it gonna go from here?
Is it just gonna become more pronounced?
Or do you think things
will change with ai?
What are your thoughts
Jeremiah: Okay, so.
A hundred percent a good thing.
Araminta: Okay.
Jeremiah: because I come from the
days where, you know, marketing had
this perception that it was just
the make things pretty function,
Araminta: Yeah.
Jeremiah: Like, which was unfortunate
given the level of talent and
ability, in the field, right?
And, I had come from a background
in communications and in product.
so that stigma always offended me,
right?
Like, in terms of, hey, you know, I,
sure I can make a PowerPoint, amazing,
or I can, make a great ad, but I too have
the same business degree that, Most of
the C-suite hold, that my talents are
probably being underutilized, right?
So, absolutely.
I think that marketing can be a revenue
engine if the leadership team and
the board, give it the room to run.
Right?
and I think like the best CMOs
today actually think like CROs,
Araminta: Hmm.
Jeremiah: Report into a CRO or
they've, been one previously.
because CROs, they don't
care about impressions.
they care about pipeline
and conversion rates, right?
And ultimately deals one and attri and
whether or not the work that you, Were
doing actually had a contribution,
to some of those wins, right?
They think about competitors and,
competitive differentiation So I
do think that this move towards
more of a quantitative approach to
marketing is a good thing, right?
Because then you combine the science
side of it with the art side, which
we've always been great at, and you
can really start to drive, a focus,
on more than just acquisition, but
you can start to look at things like
expansion, retention, loyalty, right?
Like, and so this line between
sales and marketing, I think is
blurring, significantly in, in
fact, even my KPIs are shared.
the sales team, right?
Like it isn't a handoff anymore where I
can say, oh, well, you know, 20 to 25%
of inbound leads are being shipped over.
I can kind of wash my hands and
be done at the end of the day.
Like, you know, the ROI of the marketing
program is based on revenue generated.
and so I really need to partner
closely with the sales team to
convert and actually get, these
clients transacting, so that we
can increase, revenue accordingly.
Araminta: Yeah, I think I agree and
it's also very rewarding to be able
to go to work every day and see the
hard impact that you're making with
numbers you can see and you know, it's
because of the work that you're doing.
And this is why my agency specializes
in the lead gen side of things
because we can prove that it's
working and also it's more exciting.
It's like, wow, look, we're
helping grow this company.
it is a balance as well as you
said, because they, you also
need to give marketing the room.
It's not like, you're not
gonna get leads immediately.
It's gonna take a while.
And this is the balance that needs to be
Jeremiah: Yeah, and I think
previously the, the functions were
speaking different languages, right?
Like, and , the level of marketing jargon,
which, you know, I see some of my team
speaking at a sales kickoff, right?
Like, it's not what the
business cares about, right?
Like, nobody cares about, you
know, how many form completes.
they wanna know, okay, who, and ultimately
like, are they gonna buy my stuff?
Right?
And, And so some of those next
level insights, need to be thought
through and we need to start
speaking common vernacular, right?
Which, is the language of numbers.
and so I do, particularly when I'm
hiring folks, I tend to gravitate towards
those that have, a business mindset.
because they're kind of well
versed in, Speaking to not only
the tactics that they're driving,
but also the quantifiable impacts.
Araminta: Yeah.
Well, this was the next
question I was gonna ask you.
You know, say we've got a marketing
manager who's listening to this and
they're aspiring to be A-A-C-M-O or
a senior marketer, you know, what do
you think are the skills that they
have to build in order to be able to
speak that language, to be more like
the CCRO or to be able to communicate
better with the sales team and the CRO?
What, what are the skills
that they should be focusing
Jeremiah: I think that, the soft skill
that they should, develop is empathy.
Araminta: Hmm.
Jeremiah: and what I mean by that
is, how do you develop that, right?
Like I think it's really spending a
lot of time with stakeholders outside
of the marketing function, right?
Like, how many marketers truly
spend time with customers,
Araminta: Yeah.
Jeremiah: Or prospects Have you pitched.
In front of them, have you actually
listened to what they care about?
Similarly, like with the sales function,
you know, have you shadowed a salesperson
and what they go through, right?
Like how do they prep for calls?
How do they follow up?
what triggers, do they pay attention to?
so, I think foundationally as a marketer,
if you start there, you know, the other
skills around, how to read a p and l
statement and a balance sheet, all of
that, that's useful to some degree.
But I think that the most useful thing
is, and the value that you can bring as
a marketer or you're supposed to bring
as a marketer, is do you understand,
the market, and the customer, right?
And, I do think that empathy is
one of those skills that needs to
be developed and strong listening
skills are a big part of that.
Araminta: I really like the
idea of shadowing for like,
maybe a few months or something.
Each, each department, someone
in each department, and then
you'd understand a lot better.
Definitely.
Sales would probably,
you'd learn so much, just
Jeremiah: account
management would be another
Araminta: Mm.
Jeremiah: and then also
the product team, right?
Because then you can start with,
once you get, pretty advanced
in your skillset, you can.
share the inputs that you're
hearing from customers and
sales back to the product team.
And then, it's a bi-directional,
conversation, and exchange of value.
but I really, urge marketers to
spend a ton of time with all of
these key functions outside of their
own, to round out their experience.
Araminta: On another podcast I
heard you saying that the difference
between a good and a bad marketer
is how they harness technology.
so the one that is on everyone's
mind at the moment is obviously ai.
I would love to hear what are some
examples of how, maybe a good marketer
who wants to be a great marketer can
use ai, but it could be any technology
really to become that great marketer.
what do you mean by that and
what are some examples of it?
Jeremiah: Yeah, I mean, so I think good
marketers, can adopt technology, right?
Like I.
use, chat, GPT and write
a basic prompt, right?
Like, but great market is figure
out how to take technology and,
in a way that creates leverage,
whether it's, and enables them to
do something that they could not
do, without said technology, right?
In the case of ai, Whether it's automation
or hyper-personalization or some sort
of predictive analytical behavior,
that's where the difference is, so
let's use AI as an example in terms
of, you know, how can marketers use ai.
To be better at their jobs.
Right?
Like, and in prepping for this, kind
of wrote down, three things, right?
AI is gonna help you, do things faster.
So speed,
Araminta: Mm-hmm.
Jeremiah: AI can write, it can design, it
can analyze faster than any human right.
The quality of which we can, debate you
and I are, very much fans of the written
word and we can, debate the quality.
But great marketers know
what to feed AI engines
so that they can get faster, speed, Like,
prompts, high quality inputs, et cetera.
Right?
The second thing that AI can help
with, is scale, my team was working
on nurture track emails, for example,
Like, we were able to write prompts
that, had us produce, a five email
nurture based on, key verticals
that, we're pursuing, right?
even though those first drafts
weren't perfect, they were developed
in seconds versus a first draft
that would've taken, weeks.
so, and then you can then spend
the time, scaling the program in
terms of hyper-personalization.
You can write a prompt that's, more
directed and you can even use tools,
that look at, signals in the public
sphere to, map a specific email
to the signals that you're seeing.
For example, I see from the
hires that you're making in,
your payments organization
that you're looking to expand.
Your, business relationships
in the Philippines, right?
making that level of
connections, manually just
isn't possible, right?
scale I think is, and personalization
is the other thing, smarts
would be the other one, right?
I think it helps marketers
be more strategic.
I do think that, Some of the
latest, findings coming out of
deep research is, if I worked at
a consultancy, I'd be worried, it
helps us be more strategic, right?
on a smaller scale, we can start to
look at, how we use AI to build reports.
How do we use AI to
spot trends, et cetera.
But what AI I don't think will replace
is the fourth s, which is style,
Araminta: Hmm.
Jeremiah: is that, many of us as
marketers have some of the best
intuition when it comes to what looks
and sounds good and human and will
make that deep emotional connection.
Right.
So I think that that's where you
can, there's room in a AI world for
us as marketers to still, add value,
and add some style to the substance
that we know that AI will help us,
achieve with speed, scale, and, smarts.
Araminta: Yeah.
What a comprehensive answer.
Thank you.
I very much agree and I like what
you just said there that, it's about
style and I think you've said this as
well, where you'll only be able to get
that if you're really well connected.
To who you're targeting the customer.
because that, I don't see how ai,
like, yeah, you can feed the ai,
your sales transcripts and you can
feed it like lots of the interactions
you're having with customers.
But that deep human understanding what
that human, your ideal customer persona,
that as a person, what their fears are.
Only another human I feel.
Well, so far only another human
can really understand that.
And like what you said about the first
and the 15th of the month being really
stressful, could an AI understand that?
and really, I mean, they could create
the copy for it, but the input will
still have to come from that other
person, the marketer, understanding
that that head of payments is really
stressed out on the first and 15th.
So it's about understanding
those triggers and those worries.
Jeremiah: Yeah, it's hard for an AI to
understand what the concept of stress is
Araminta: yeah.
Jeremiah: And that's where
I think storytelling is,
is the way to, to do that.
Like stress for me as a payment manager
is I can't sleep the night before.
because I'm thinking about whether or
not the payment's going to go through.
Right.
And then you could describe
that in human terms, right?
Like, instead of getting up at
my regular, you know, 7:00 AM I'm
getting up at 4:00 AM nervously
staring at this screen, wondering if
the payment is going to go through.
I don't do that anymore because, I have
the peace of mind that the payment will go
through because of the vendor that I've,
I've chosen and here's why, why they
enabled, me to sleep better at night.
Right.
Like, you know, AI's not going to
deliver that, emotive prose yet, right?
Araminta: Not yet anyway.
And I think it's good news for those of
us who got into marketing because we're
obsessed with kind of psychology and, what
gets me excited is understanding what made
someone click that and not another thing.
What made someone pick
that vendor over another.
And that's kind of consumer psychology
or bio-psychology I know we're close
to time, so I just wanted to end on
one last question, which is, you did
a LinkedIn post recently about, a
new habit that you've been building
where at the end of every week
you share an update with everyone,
and I thought it was really cool.
So I'd love it if you could
share what that new habit is and
how have you been finding it?
Is it useful?
Has it helped with alignment?
Jeremiah: Yeah, yeah.
we're recording this on a Friday, so I
have to actually produce this update
that I've been, talking about.
But like, I call it the four P update,
which, Not intentionally modeled after,
you know, the four Ps in, marketing.
But, I really wanted, and maybe
to talk about the genesis of it.
Like it, I feel that, we don't do
a good job of marketing ourselves.
Araminta: Mm.
Jeremiah: and, it's maybe the modesty
or just the service oriented, mindset
that we have that we typically
don't, keep our peers, informed
about the values that we're bringing,
each week, I would say, right?
Like, because there's so much output.
And
I was telling people that my function is.
the only one that has probably a
day-to-day public record of output
because of the prolific nature of what
we publish on, platforms like LinkedIn.
So I, this four p update, the first p
stands for, projects I've summarized,
the two to three, achievements for the
week in terms of completed, outcomes.
the second P would be progress.
longer term, initiatives that we
made progress on, and what some
of those key milestones were.
the third P is performance.
This is where, the quantitative side of,
marketing comes through, not only how
many leads, but sort of more the full
funnel metrics and how we're ultimately
converting into, opportunities and wins.
and the fourth one is, around people.
I spent time, talking about the
team, how they're feeling, what's
top of mind for them, et cetera.
So, nearly eight weeks into the year,
still on top of it, and it's being
read, which I think I get questions
on, line items within the report.
So, you know, I found it a
good organizing construct to.
track the work that's being done
on the team, but then also market
that activity internally, to
stakeholders, across the board.
Araminta: So just to clarify,
you're sending this to the whole
company, not just the marketing
Jeremiah: Yeah, I send it to,
an executive leadership team
made up of cross-functional,
folks.
I send it to this, select group
of, individuals also, because I'm
just mindful about not spamming,
the entire organization.
but I do publish a summary quarterly
of the achievements of the team
to the, broader company audience.
And that's working out pretty well.
Araminta: Yeah.
I love that because I think, you know, any
marketers listening to this who struggle
with what you just said, like showcasing
what they're doing and the value of it.
This is a good framework
potentially for doing that.
So thank you for sharing that.
Jeremiah: And it's a good framework
too for I think, one-on-ones,
right?
Like that you have either with your team
or you know, your, your manager, right?
'cause I also found like, one-on-ones tend
to meander on different topics without
structure.
So this is a forcing function
for, documenting, a productive
one-on-one conversation.
Araminta: Yeah.
Makes
Thank you for listening.
You can find show notes and information
about guests@fintechmarketinghub.com
slash podcast.
And finally, huge thanks to orama
TV for producing this podcast.
We look forward to having
you on our next episode.
sense.
Amazing.
Well, thank you so much,
Jeremiah, for coming on.
This was really interesting.
I know there's so many more things
that we could have talked about,
but, let, let's edit it at that.
thanks again for coming on and, yeah,
hopefully see you at Money 2020 Vegas.
Jeremiah: Always love talking to you.
Thanks so much.
Speaker 3: Thank you for listening.
You can find show notes and information
about guests at fintechmarketinghub.
com forward slash podcast.
And finally, huge thanks to Orama.
tv for producing this podcast.
We look forward to having
you on our next episode.