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What is the best supplement for me? What potency is right? What does the research show? Is it worth the money? These and all of your other supplement questions are answered here. Jared St. Clair brings well researched information so that you can make more informed decisions regarding your health, specifically focused on how to effectively use natural supplements to optimize your health and Vitality. Of course supplement and food choices aren't the only factors in optimal health. Jared also shares a regular series of Emotional Vitality episodes that will help you release the negativity that may be holding you back and embrace your full potential. Vitality Radio is not JUST about health, it is about HEALTH FREEDOM. Jared provides needed insight into the current threats to your health as well as the threats coming from government agencies, pharmaceutical companies and modern medicine as a whole. With over 35 years of experience in the natural products world, and a hearty dose of wit and sarcasm, Vitality Radio isn't just educational but entertaining and enlightening.
Your Bones, Your Brain, Your Gut
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Jared: [00:00:00] Today on Vitality Radio, we're gonna talk about something that I'm really excited to dig into that is brand new that I bet you've never heard of. I had never heard of it, and every time I think I've heard of all the things and natural health and wellness. There's another thing to learn, and that's what today's show is all about.
And I'm frankly really excited to present it to you. I've interviewed a fantastic guest and, uh, we're gonna talk about, uh, bone health in ways that you've never probably thought about before. And, uh, we're also gonna talk about the critical nature of the gut and the brain and how it impacts the bones. So that'll be the topic for today.
But there's a few things. then I wanna share with you, uh, regarding what we're gonna talk about and there'll be some after the interview and some right now. The first thing is I want you to use this episode in tandem with episode 2 [00:01:00] 59 of the Vitality Radio podcast, the two together. Stand much stronger than either of them, independent of each other.
And once you hear the interview, and especially if you go back to 2 59, if you haven't already heard it, you'll understand exactly what I'm talking about. So make a note of that. Uh, we will link it in the show description as well, but you're gonna want to hear both. And then, uh, if you are on the radio, And you have not heard, uh, the podcast yet, or haven't, uh, you know, logged it in on Apple Podcast or Spotify or whatever.
Uh, I did an episode all about osteoporosis, about, um, boy, I don't even know, three months ago or something like that. I'm trying to think how far back 2 59 would be. And, uh, people have really, really responded well to that episode. Told me. Information was very useful. Um, I think you'll love it, but unfortunately the only way you can hear it at this point would be to jump on the podcast.
So, uh, any podcast app or vitality radio.com will give you that [00:02:00] information. The last thing I wanna mention, of course, is that the Vitality Radio and the Podcast Vitality Radio are both sponsored by Vitality, nutrition and Vitality nutrition.com. Vitality Nutrition are family owned and operated. Health, the Nutrition Store for 45 years in Bountiful, Utah.
If you're local, we'd love to meet you. Give us a call at (801) 292-6662, wherever you are. But if you're local, come see us at 1 0 7 South 500 West in Bountiful. We would love to have you there. And we are running our annual clearance sale, and it's a big one. Tons of stuff that we're moving out. Great stuff that I think.
Probably actually, uh, find something that you'd be interested in if you rummage through, but that is for locals only, cuz you'll need to actually come in and check it out. And then one more announcement that I'm really excited to make that I think a lot of you will be excited about as well, I was able to guest once again on Carlin [00:03:00] call.
Sorry, Carlin Calls podcast, the Just Ingredients podcast. If you're familiar with Carl Lynn, and that's how you found me, which a lot of people did. Then, uh, here's another opportunity to check out, uh, our conversation. I think it was really, really interesting and fun. I love doing her show that is supposed to drop on Monday on the Just Ingredients podcast, and so you can check that out there and, uh, I'll promote it.
Facebook and Instagram and inside the Facebook listeners community and all that kind of stuff. So check that out. Just two days after this podcast airs. That podcast should air as well. Okay? Without further ado, I'm gonna introduce you to my guests. So I'm excited to introduce to you a guest that, uh, on Vitality Radio, he'll be here for the first time, but I've listened to him speak many, many times at a variety of different events that, uh, we've both attended over the years in the [00:04:00] natural products industry.
And he's a guy that I've actually talked about getting on the show. Several times. Uh, but we finally made it happen. We were just in Florida, uh, about a month ago at what's called the Soho Expo. And, uh, I stepped into a breakfast, uh, seminar, uh, that this gentleman was uh, doing, but I was a little late. I came in maybe 15, 20 minutes, something like that after it started.
And I was really, It, it was interesting because the first three or four minutes that I heard, I thought, okay, so this is, you know, pretty familiar territory, uh, that he's talking about. And then all of a sudden he started to shift gears into something that I thought, okay, I gotta no more excuses. I gotta get this man and this topic on Vitality radio.
So I'd like to welcome, uh, Carl Gier. Carl Germano is a board certified clinical nutritionist. Uh, he has over 43 years in the supplement [00:05:00] industry as a, uh, product formulator and educator. He's written nine books and he is a consultant for what I consider to be one of the most, uh, high integrity supplement brands in the industry.
Blue Bonnet. Carl, I'd like to welcome you to Vitality Radio.
Carl Germano: Jared, it's a pleasure to be here. Thank you so much.
Jared: So when we were in. Orlando and I stepped into that little, uh, breakfast seminar that you were conducting. You started off talking a little bit about, or at least what I heard, you were talking a little bit about the H p a axis, uh, the hypoth hypothalamus pituitary adrenals, which we talk a lot about when we're talking about stress and anxiety and depression.
And then you started getting into some other things that I thought were really, really fascinating. Give us a little bit of background on. Maybe just some of the interconnection of these different areas of the body and how different glands and organs and things like that can work in concert.
Carl Germano: Right. Well, [00:06:00] you know it, it is interesting because we've been focusing on a couple of these.
Important and intimate interconnections. I mean, the gut brain immune connection has been written about and spoken about for the past couple of decades, and we know that there is organ systems like the liver connected to regulating blood sugar, your pancreas and, and cardiovascular system. Blood pressure.
I mean, the list goes on and on. Speaks to a very important topic, and that is when we learn about physiology in the body, we always learn about these compartmentalized systems, the nervous system, the digestive system, the uh, uh, cardiovascular system, respiratory, as if they were separated, and if we've learned anything.
From Eastern Medicine is that we are very, very interconnected. And so while we've been focusing on gut brain immune connection over the past decade or two, uh, I've unraveled this [00:07:00] brain. Gut bone connection because substantial clinical investigations and D demonstrate that there is this directional crosstalk on very different levels linking all these organ systems to keep bones healthy.
So, We go above and beyond just providing calcium, magnesium, vitamin D, quinone seven, to keep bones healthy. And we must now address the health of the brain and the health of the gut because they are all interconnected in keeping bones healthy
Jared: and they so, Yep. Sorry. Uh, that's what was so fascinating to me is of course I've talked about bone health.
I did a show on osteoporosis just a few months ago, and I talked about those four things that you mentioned. You know, the magnesium, the calcium, uh, the k2 and the D three. and that it's interesting to me, Carl, over the last [00:08:00] several years, we've really started to put a heavier focus on things other than just calcium.
When it comes to bone health. Uh, it used to be just calcium, then it was calcium, magnesium, and then we started talking about vitamin D and now re more recently, we've started talking about the critical. Uh, nature of vitamin K2 and how it interacts with D three and magnesium and calcium and the bones and all this.
So we keep kind of adding to the puzzle, I guess more pieces to the puzzle to make a more complete picture of bone health. But I had never heard until I heard you talking about it. Uh, anybody talk about the gut and the brain and how those two systems relate to healthy bones. So I really want to dig into.
Sure.
Carl Germano: And before we dig into it, it's important to understand that those nutrients that both of us have mentioned are critically important to keep bones mineralized. Uh, but it doesn't stop there because from the day you are born [00:09:00] to the day you die, there are two groups of cells. That are involved in this restructuring of bone throughout our entire lives, and they're, they're called osteoclasts and osteoblasts.
Osteoclasts are like the brick layers. They go in and they pave new bone. because osteoblasts, all the demolishes, they go in and they break down bone. But this is a normal process from the day we're born to the day we die, we have bone that breaks down. And then why osteoblasts? And then the osteoclast starts to rebuild it, and there's this constant rebuilding and breakdown that occurs, which is the target.
For bone building in especially postmenopausal women because as estrogen levels decline, estrogen we know has an influence on osteoclast and osteoblasts. So it's not so much just focusing on [00:10:00] mineralization, it's now focusing on the groups of cells that have a direct role in building and breaking down bone throughout our life.
And so we look at pharmaceutical. Applications of drugs that affect osteoclast and osteoblasts as opposed to just mineralizing bone with, you know, magnesium, calcium, vitamin D and Quin on seven. But we have to then now look at the fact that. Bone is not just sitting there by itself doing nothing. It is communicating.
We know bone formation is orchestrated by the brain through chemical messengers. This remodeling that I spoke of, of breaking down and building up by osteoclasts and osteoblasts is what we call skeletal homeostasis balance. , it's controlled by hormones and neurotransmitters in the brain. [00:11:00] Uh, and so we know that the brain talks to the bone.
Even when we look at simple things like the sympathetic nervous system, which prepares the body for like, fight or flight. In doing so, uh, it, it regulates certain messengers that break down bone or. Build up bone because it's preparing the body for more important things, this fight and flight response.
Now, we're not gonna be chased by lions all day, but we talk about this and its relationship to the H P A access because when you're under a lot of stress that sympathetic nervous system is chronically pushing out its messengers and does nothing for the building of above. . On the other hand, the parasympathetic nervous system helps to restore the body to a composed state after you get into a stressful condition, and that results in enhanced.
Bone [00:12:00] formation, and we see this as all regulated by signaling in the brain. We could talk, uh, uh, for, for the next literally hour are things like serotonin and glutamate and, uh, dopamine and the hormones like f, s, h and Ts, H and prolactin and even melatonin is involved in, uh, keeping bones regulated in terms of breakdown and buildup.
So we know the. Talks to bone. Uh, there's a great, uh, article in molecular medicine reports in 2021, neuromodulation of Bone, the role of different peptide in their interactions, and they talk all about brain regulation, of how bone differentiates, how it remodels all occurring through the use of neuro transmit.
That are coming out of the brain to help remodel bone, so we know that the brain has an intimate part to play. We also see neural [00:13:00] pathways from the brain to bone that have been identified. One of the most interesting ones is a compound cool neuro peptide Y or N P Y, which directly controls osteo. Class and osteoblast.
The osteoblasts that buildup bone, the osteoclast, that breakdown bone. So there is a link, and these have been reported in a number of articles in current osteoporosis reports in 2016, how Osteoblast action is controlled by neuropeptide. and, and in another one called Neuropeptides in 2019, an article, uh, published on, uh, neuropeptide y regulating bone remodeling.
So we need to keep the, the health of the brain. As a primary target if we want to keep the bones healthy. Now, don't get me wrong, it's important that we look at compounds to help mineralize bone because in [00:14:00] the absence of those things like what we discussed, the vitamin D, calcium, magnesium, quinone seven, uh, we, we can't also have healthy bones as well.
and there's plenty of data on these compounds. I mean, I can rattle off a number of interesting, uh, uh, uh, articles, but one of the things that have been ignored is the role of collagen. in bone health, we know the importance and I can spend hours talking about the data published on calcium, magnesium, quinone seven and and uh, uh, and vitamin D that we all understand right now.
But what's coming out is really the role of collagen because outside of the. Exterior of bone, which is hard mineralized, uh, uh, tissue Inside bone is soft tissue and part of that soft tissue, a good portion of it is collagen. So when we look at the data there, we see that there are, uh, important. Uh, [00:15:00] contributions of collagen to keep bones healthy for as, for example, in the journal nutrients in 2018 is that, uh, an article published a, uh, uh, study on specific collagen peptides, improving bone mineral density and bone markers.
In post-menopausal woman, this was a randomized double blind placebo control trial. It went on for a good year or 12 months, uh, and, and over 130 women were in this study. And what they found out after a year that the collagen peptides increased. Bone ma mass density in postmenopausal woman, um, with favorable shifts in bone markers.
The bone markers being osteoclast, that breakdown bone osteoblast, that buildup bone, and there was indications of an increased bone formation and reduced bone degradation. I mean, the list goes on and. Uh, in the Journal of Musculoskeletal [00:16:00] Neuronal interactions in 20 20th of March, uh, the effect of calcium and vitamin D with or without collagen on bone turnover in post-menopausal women, make a long story short.
The group that received the collagen with the calcium and vitamin D had greater bone mass density than those who did not use collagen. So that I would add to the list of nutrients that you find in. Things like, uh, uh, blue bonnets osteo bone formula or their bone support liquid that has the necessary nutrients.
But then I would add to that, obviously they're, uh, in their, uh, beautiful, the collagen products that they have out the powdered collagen, uh, as an overall nutrient protocol, uh, to play. But we get back to this association of brain health. [00:17:00] Uh, stress, anxiety, depression, that not only do does the brain talk to bone, but the bone talks to brains in a variety of ways, and we see interesting aspects of what happens in the brain and how it affects.
Bone, for example, there's an interesting article in the Journal of Bone and Mineral Research in 2021 that talks about cognitive decline is associated with accelerated rate of bone loss. An increased fracture risk in women. And this was a big study over 1700 women and over 600 men, uh, over the age of 65 participated in the study that went from 1997 to 2013.
So it was a long-term study cuz bone takes a while to remodel and build. There was a significant association between cognitive decline and bone loss fracture. [00:18:00] Independent of aging. So we see that the state of one's health in their brain is affecting the bone as well. And this has been reported in other papers that looked at comorbidity of osteoporosis, even in people who have.
Alzheimer's disease, and we know that there is a significant relationship there in several journal articles. There is a direct relationship on people with Alzheimer's disease that have this excessive amyloid plaques in the brain that. You know, prevents, uh, uh, neurotransmission and memory that patients with osteoporosis, uh, may have vitamin D deficiency, which, which protects against this amyloid aggregation or amyloid plaque, uh, buildup.
Uh, thus linking this, you know, uh, brain and, and, and bone, uh, uh, aspect. So when we look at all of the data, On keeping our brains optimally functioning. [00:19:00] It's important that in addition to the nutrients we talked about, which are important for. Bones, we look at nutrients important for brains, and I know that, uh, blue Bonnet has a product called Brain Power in their targeted nutrition line, which has bacopa lions main sine fight, uh, five dihydro, uh, um, uh, phosphocoline, rather phosphine, mild blueberry.
These are all important key components, uh, that, that keep the brain healthy in terms of thinking, learning memory. Um, we look at many studies where they also help to reduce inflammation and, and other biological markers of things like Alzheimer's disease. Uh, we look at compounds in this formula that also are novel nutrients that have a broad spectrum of benefit for conditions associated with neurological dysfunction because we know that when there's neurological brain dysfunction, [00:20:00] there's a tie in.
Uh, displaced bone health. So we have to consider keeping our brains very healthy in order, uh, to keep our bones healthy as well. Now on the flip side of this, the bones talk as well. The skeleton is a very versatile conversationalist. Uh, when you look at all the, the messengers that can come from bone, that.
Uh, the brain, uh, they are significant. And this all talks, uh, and was beautifully put together in a paper in orthopedic nursing back in 2017, uh, was it was titled The Cure That Lies Within the Mind Body Connection to Orthopedics. And after decades of tradit. Musculoskeletal practice, uh, in orthopedics. Uh, th there have been tremendous [00:21:00] benefits as well as limitations.
And the framework that in illustrates how the mind will predictably create objective, observable phenomena in the body. And the role of the nervous system, uh, was all laid out for us. And so that started the whole, uh, uh, process of investigating now. The health of the brain and what it does. And in particular, when you walked into the, the, uh, presentation we talked about, does stress, anxiety and depression affect bones?
Well, we know the bone brainin connection is absolutely affected by our emotional state as our bone mass decrease. Memory loss, anxiety, depression also becomes more common. The rate of dementia is over 40% higher in people. Uh, elderly people who have suffered bone fractures. So you're seeing [00:22:00] both sides of the equation here.
And obviously, you know, exercise and other modalities are very important, but we have to be aware of this. Mind Body connection. We've talked about this for decades in the trade, and there's a lot of data that's out there in the Journal Immunology. In 2014, there was a beautiful paper called As Above, so Below, examining the Interplay between Emotions and the Immune System, which talked about how what goes on in your brain, your emotional state will affect your immunity.
Well, what does this now have to do? Bone health. We look at a, a paper in medicine, uh, 2016, the incidence and risk of osteoporosis in patients with anxiety disorders. And this was a population-based retrospective, uh, study and looked over 7,000 patients in both [00:23:00] anxiety and an a nonie cohorts that were matched according to age and sex between.
2000 and 2013, again, another long-term study, patients with Alzheimer's disease were almost two times more likely to get osteoporosis than those without. Anxiety, the risk ratios are the highest for osteoporosis within a year of when anxiety diagnosis is laid out. So we see that stress, anxiety, uh, depression, all have a role.
Uh, in the journal science reports, the relationship between osteoporosis and depression went on to talk about how the majority of people with osteoporosis suffer from mild to moderate depression. and all of this kind of goes into this issue of addressing the H P A pathway. And that is, you know, we look at modulating, uh, the gut, uh, uh, uh, uh, the gut brainin [00:24:00] immune connection, but also we look to modulate the.
Hypothalamus pituitary adrenal connection. That is the connection of these organ systems that address stress. And we have to look at reducing stress in patients or consumers who walk into a store and say, I have low bone meta density, I have osteoporosis. I've asked osteopenia. I have a family history of osteoporosis.
What do I do? Yes, we gotta get them on the calcium, magnesium, vitamin D, Quin on seven. We got that laid. The data is clear. We also have to look at maintaining a healthy brain, and we took a look at nutrients that were in something like the, the brain power, uh, product. But a simple question, are you under a lot of stress, anxiety, or depression?
And if the answer is yes, , you have to help these people with that because their, their bones will suffer as well. And we look [00:25:00] at compounds in the targeted choice like stress relief, things like ashwaganda, athero, uh, passionflower rodeo, holy basal, lemon bomb. There is a tremendous amount of literature showing how these nutrients.
Play key, important roles in alleviating stress conditions, not just in the body as a whole, but also what's going on in the brain in terms of what gets released and what can have damage to bones. And so we look at those particular, uh, compounds. And then finally, the other connection to this bone brain.
Connection would be the gut. You know, the gut, interestingly enough, not only is our largest immune organ, but if you dig deeper inside the walls of the tissue of the gut, you [00:26:00] see it's littered with hundreds of millions of neurons. That's right. Brain cells, your gut is your second brain. As a matter of fact, during fetal development, the cells that build the brain branch.
To build the intestinal tract, the gut, all connected by the vagus nerve. Now, what does this have to do with bones? Well, there are several really good papers that have been published looking at the gut bone. Brain access as well. We know that the microbiome, this, this massive, uh, amount of healthy bacteria, uh, the prebiotics, the probiotics, the postbiotics, all regulate.
the bone homeostasis through its effects on immune function, on hormone secretion, and also have been effective in preventing bone loss. Uh, there's a number of interesting papers [00:27:00] here in s as a matter of fact. Uh, in February of, of of 2022, there was a good paper published in the journal cells, the role of dietary supplements and probiotics in modulating the microbiome and bone.
The gut bone access, and it talked all about how if you alter the intestinal homeostasis, if you alter the microbiome in the gut, it has direct influences on. Osteoclast that breakdown bone and osteoblasts that build up bone. So we now know that the microbiome alters the function of these osteoclasts, uh, that reduce bone strength and quality.
And so when we look at papers after this one, uh, like in in, in the journal of, uh, microbiological Spectrum, the potential of probiotics as a therapy for osteoporosis, this was published. In, in [00:28:00] 2017, how probiotics influence the process of bone remodeling and the pathology of general bone health. And we know that probiotic supplementation can both increase bone density in healthy individuals and protect against primary estrogen deficiency as well as secondary osteoporosis.
So we look at. and prebiotics being essential in the final connection of nutritional support for bone, brain, and gut health that ultimately involve our regulation and homeostasis of good bone health.
Jared: All right, so then all of that is super fascinating, but the connection I think that's the most fascinating to me is.
Is, is that mental, uh, connection [00:29:00] to bone health? Because I think by now most people, at least, that are, you know, paying attention to this kind of thing. Reading some of these articles, listening to podcasts like this one are pretty familiar with the fact that the gut. Plays a role in everything. Mm-hmm. on some level, right?
Yes. But what's interesting is we, and, and we know the gut brain connection. We talk about the second brain, like you mentioned, and we talk about the critical nature of gut health when it comes to things like anxiety and depression and that kind of thing. But the missing link for me was, oh, taking those two pieces and adding into that, into that bones and bone health and bone density and how that might play a role.
It makes perfect sense to me now, Carl. I mean, perfect sense, but it just had never occurred to me before. So when you were speaking about it, I thought, oh my gosh, this is awesome. Because again, it's very holistic thinking, right? We're looking at the entire body and saying, okay, all of these pieces aren't [00:30:00] independent of each other.
They're all working in some level of harmony and concert, or at least they ought to be, uh, for optimal health. So when you talk about the neurons in the gut, Which are brain cells. That always fascinates people. I hear that all the time when I, when I talk about this, that they say what we have brain cells in our gut.
Uh, we have brain cells in your gut, you have brain cells in the brain, and of course there's kind of this, uh, chicken of the egg kind of a thing where it's like, okay, is it because I don't have a healthy gut that I also struggle with depression or anxiety? Or is my depression or anxiety actually impacting my gut help?
I, I'd be curious your opinion on that. I think it's, it kind of goes both ways. What do you think? Y
Carl Germano: yeah, and, and, and you're right. When you make the analogy, you know, the chicken and the egg, what came first here? Uh, as a clinician, I can't, uh, you know, worry too much about what came first. What I have to worry about is how best to address the [00:31:00] issue.
And with that said, I always implement, uh, uh, you know, any type of brain. because when we're talking about bone health and osteoporosis, we're talking about elderly people primarily, not all the time, but primarily, uh, people over the age of 60 who are addressing, you know, bone health issues. Right. And with that said, you know, the next thing you see in the elderly, which starts to decline is.
You know, brain health. Mm-hmm. , memory, what have you. Things of that nature. As well as what we see commonly is poor response or resilience to stress conditions. So what we got away with in our younger years, Exposed to stress that now takes a tremendous toll on people as they get older. So a couple of simple questions, whether you're standing in the vitamin aisle in the store, or a patient across the desk, okay.
We [00:32:00] are, we now e established the fact that you have poor bone density. You could do dense optometry tests or whatever it may be, and so we now know what the key critical players are. Now tell me about the health of your mind, and are you forgetful? Are you, or tell me the health of your emotional state or you were under a lot of.
Uh, do you, are you depressed? Uh, d do you, do you have anxiety? Uh, if so, then I have to look at adding now additional nutrients that address stress conditions, as I mentioned, like in the stress relief product, the mm-hmm. , things like Ashwaganda Thin, a LiRo, passionflower, rodeo, lo Holy Basil. All, all key players that have tremendous data on their ability to address.
Stress both in the mind and through the support of the h p a access that that is responsive to stress. So it's more responsive. And, uh, and then, uh, you know, a simple question. Uh, you [00:33:00] know, if you're forgetful, if you're, you're, you know, if you're, you know, you're, uh, have a family history of, of, uh, Uh, Alzheimer's or a cognitive decline has been a, uh, assessed.
Uh, then we look at nutrients in that category to add to the standard tried and true bone health nutrients and things like bacopa lines main and C five P and phosphate and blube. These are all very important in helping to increase certain brain chemicals that are involved in thinking learning. memory, so one's emotional.
And one's health of the brain, uh, are two things that I ask a couple of simple questions to whether or not I have to add to calcium, magnesium, vitamin D and quinone seven. And then finally, gut health. Are they, uh, moving the bowels regularly? Do they have, uh, uh, you know, digestive issues? [00:34:00] Um, uh, you know, adding in a good probiotic as we have, uh, seen in some of the studies that I've rattled off before have, has important roles in not only addressing.
Uh, bone health, we know that since the gut is the second brain, uh, then the health of the gut is important to keep our brains healthy, which is important to keep our bones healthy. And so you need those probiotics, those healthy bacteria, uh, to be play a part and role in both addressing bone health and brain health as well.
So again, a couple of simple questions Can redirect your protocol. Uh, for truly addressing osteoporosis, low bone density, people who just fracture their bones, uh, and need to heal. Uh, these are the same questions I would ask, uh, young or old and, and whether or not I have to add to the protocol [00:35:00] above and beyond just the bone mineralization nutrients.
Jared: Well, I'm really glad you clarified all that cuz I think for people listening to this show trying to figure out, okay, well I do have. Bone density issues, whether it's osteoporosis or osteopenia, or maybe it's just a family history or whatever it is, they always, one of the, one of the big challenges I think from the consumer seat is trying to figure out, you know, what to do with this new information that they're, that they're learning.
And I think you laid it out really well. Basically, if you already know you've got bone loss, , then the questions are, okay, what's going on in my brain on the mental emotional side as well as the cognitive side, and then what's going on in my gut? And you know, asking yourself simple questions like what you mentioned, uh, how do I feel after I eat?
Uh, am I experiencing gassiness and bloating? Am I experiencing constipation, diarrhea? You know, those types of things. Uh, would then indicate whether or not you. Start there. Uh, as well as giving the raw materials for building the [00:36:00] bones. And I think that maybe is, is one of the things that I want to clarify really quickly too.
Essentially what you're saying, and tell me if I'm wrong, Carl, but I think I'm reading you right here. We have these four things. We have the calcium, the magnesium, the vitamin D, and the the k2, which is the mimic. Seven. I can never say that , but that particular form of k2, which is the one that has the best evidence behind it, those would be the building materials for the bone structure itself.
But if we're not getting the proper signaling from the brain and from the gut where we have all these other brain cells, then even having the raw materials on board, it's, it's like, uh, putting all the materials that you need to build a house, but nobody to. No foreman to push everybody around and say, go do this.
Go do that. Right?
Carl Germano: 100%. Um, so, you know, you could provide all the building blocks you want, but if your brain and your gut are not working, Properly [00:37:00] and are not influencing the osteoclast, that breakdown bone. You could provide all the building blocks you want. If the osteoclasts are con, are, are overpowering off, osteoblasts, uh, or outnumbering them, then it's gonna constantly be breaking down bone.
And, you know, those nutrients, uh, are not gonna have as much of an effect as it. When you're addressing the other organ systems involved in keeping bones,
Jared: Yeah, I, I love that. I think this is really, really powerful information because one thing that I've had happen over the years at Vitality Nutrition is people come into me.
One of the challenges with bone density, as it as it is, it's not like blood pressure where you can measure it every single day or every single hour if you want. Uh, with bone density, most people are getting a scan every couple of years, and so they get it. They go in, they get. , uh, a scan, they're told that they are, you know, maybe in the early stages of bone loss, maybe they're [00:38:00] at osteopenia or maybe they're more advanced and they're in osteoporosis, and then they do whatever protocol they do.
Um, some people that are, you know, paying a little bit more attention and, and listening to things like this may be doing all the right things from a. Raw material standpoint, maybe they have those four nutrients on board, but then two years later they haven't had the progress that they had hoped. Maybe they're actually worse off than they were.
Uh, and then the question is, well, why I'm doing all of this stuff? And yet, if they've got issues in the background with their gut, with their brain, with their mental emotional state, then that could be an answer for people like that. And I have people routinely that. Frustrated because they don't seem to be able to get there just with the bone nutrients and this connection, these connections make all kinds of sense.
So like I said, I mean this isn't uh, you know, blowing smoke or trying or anything [00:39:00] else cuz you're here on the program. It just really clicked and it's so cool because, you know, you've been doing this 43 years. My store's been in business 45 years. I've been working there since I was seven, which is, 43 years, interestingly enough.
Um, and yet I can still go to these trade shows and a guy like you who's putting in the time on the research can lift the curtain off of something that I should have seen a long time ago. So I'm really, really grateful that A, I got up early to go to that breakfast , and b, that you chose this topic and that you're willing to, uh, come on Vitality radio and talk about it.
I appreciate it very, very.
Carl Germano: It's been my pleasure. And then you, you serve a very important, uh, function for people out there because we know that education is everything. And, uh, you know, th this is a young science, you know, nutritional sciences compared to physics and chemistry and whatever that date back thousands of years.
I mean, nutritional science is a little over a hundred years old, and we are constantly learning [00:40:00] and new things are developing literally daily or weekly. And education is a crucial component in understanding the applications of these nutrients. And, uh, we are unraveling new things every day. So thank you for your, your effort and, uh, your participation in, in educating, uh, all of us.
Thank you.
Jared: Absolutely. And, and, uh, to tack onto that, before I let you go, I think the oldest study, you, you, you rattled off a bunch of different studies, uh, during this conversation. I think the oldest one was 2017, if I remember correctly. Oh, yeah. So, you know, you say nutritional science is new, but the science on what you're talking about is very, very new.
This is pretty cutting edge stuff, and it's really, really important. So thank you so much Carl for, uh, your expertise, uh, for spending the time digging into all of these. Uh, publications to understand what the literature's actually telling us about bone health. And brain health. And gut health and that correlation.
And thank you for your time here on Vitality Radio. [00:41:00] My
Carl Germano: pleasure and I appreciate the opportunity. Thank you.
Jared: Excellent. All right, so now that we've had that conversation with Carl, I want to just clarify a couple of things that I thought when I went back and listened to it, maybe needed just a little more clarification and give you some steps that you can take.
Remember, , episode 2 59 of the Vitality Radio Podcast is the companion podcast to this episode. So if you are listening on radio, you'll have to check it out on any podcast app or@vitalityradio.com. And, uh, so they do really stand much better together and give you a lot better idea of what you. Can do. But in this episode where we talked about the gut-brain bone axis, I have now, since I learned this early December, have had the opportunity to work with a couple of clients, specifically dealing with bone loss issues.
You know, they've got the actual bone scan to prove that they're dealing with issues and have been able to ask them some of the questions that [00:42:00] Carl presented. And what was really interesting, I had a one of my just sweet. Customers, I absolutely adore her. Uh, came in to see me on uh, just a few days. Uh, and I, I actually told her she should listen to this show because, uh, we, we go into more detail than what I told her while she was there with me.
But she is experiencing, uh, osteoporosis. Uh, and she, I, and I had not ever talked to her about it because she had never mentioned. The other side of it, but we talked a lot about her bones and we talked about osteoporosis and bone scans and all that kind of stuff, and I gave her a lot of the same information that is in episode 2 59.
But on this, uh, once I had talked to Carl and educated myself on the gut-brain bone axis as we just, uh, all learned about, then I decided. There's more to this for her and frankly for anybody that's experiencing bone loss. So I asked her the questions that Carl presented. I asked her how her [00:43:00] mental health was, how was she with stress, anxiety, depression, things like that.
And she was dealing with, uh, issues in those areas, particularly anxiety. And I asked her also, how's her gut health and what's going on there? And she's got some issues there as well. If you've listened to Vitality Radio much, you know, I believe in a, a, a, uh, concept called psychobiotics, uh, psychobiotics being probiotics that are, have a very heavy, uh, role that they play within the brain.
And so gut and brain connection has never been a question. , but how it relates to bones was very, very, very interesting to me. And as I was discussing this with this wonderful client of mine, I recognized that I had missed the mark frankly, by not asking her those questions a year ago when she came in to ask me about this in the first place.
Now, In my defense, I didn't know that there was a mark I was trying to hit when it came to , the gut-brain bone connection, cuz I didn't understand it yet. [00:44:00] But now that I do, and I think that's the coolest thing about doing this show is I keep learning more and more and more stuff that I get to then share with you.
And, uh, boy, she's, she's actually made progress with the recommendations that I had made, but it was wanting to make even more progress like most of us do. and as we, as I recognize that there were issues in those areas, for her it made perfect sense as to why maybe she had not gotten as far down the road as she wanted to with her bone health.
So I'm just gonna review those questions, uh, a little bit and, and give a little bit of detail about, um, you know, how, why, why they matter, and what you can do about them, that we didn't go into great detail. The epi or on the, uh, interview that I was on with Carl. So the questions are if you're dealing with bone loss, particularly if you're a post-menopausal woman who are, you know, the majority of people that are dealing with bone loss in this country, but it happens with men as well, and it even happens at younger ages in some [00:45:00] cases.
But if you're dealing with bone loss, your doc has told you that, uh, you know, osteopenia or osteoporosis are going on. I want you to ask a couple of questions of yourself and, and the first one would be, what's my mental health like, uh, not just emotion stuff, anxiety, depression, oc, D A D D, those types of things.
But also, and this is really important, uh, memory. And focus and has, has that been slipping? Obviously a lot of us in our older age do struggle with that and a little bit of slippage in those areas, I think, you know, maybe could be considered normal, although not optimal. Um, but are you struggling in those areas?
Because if you're struggling in any of those areas, then that would indicate that there are some issues in the brain in terms of whether, you know, nourishment, things like magnesium, uh, omega three s that help to nourish the brain and the central nervous. Uh, the methylated B vitamins are another great option in those ar in that area.
A lot of different things that you can do there. But then the [00:46:00] next question is, you know, if I'm struggling in these areas, maybe my memory's not what it once was, or my anxiety levels are, uh, higher than I'd like them to be. I, I don't respond to stress well or, you know, anything in those. Departments or like departments, then I would ask the question, okay, what's going on with my gut?
You know, am I regular? Am I having two or three bowel movements every single day? Uh, and are, do I have to strain when I have those? Am I dealing with any kind of indigestion at all, gassiness or bloating after meals or acid reflux or cramping or any of those types of things that, uh, might indicate that my gut.
Where it ought to be. And if you answer yes to that question as well, well then there's at least reason to believe now with all of this research that your bones might be suffering in large part due to those issues. So as Carl mentioned, magnesium, Vitamin k2. He, he called it minus [00:47:00] seven, which is the technical name for it.
But Vitamin K2 in the MK seven form is my favorite. Uh, that's, um, you know, natural Factors is, uh, a great brand of it. Blue Bonnet has great K2 as well. Um, so these, so you've got options there. And then, um, we mentioned magnesium, and then of course vitamin D, which we can get lots of from the sunshine if we're willing to do it.
But this time of year it's a little tougher. So you can do that supplementally as well. And I would recommend at least about 200 to 300 micrograms of k2. I would recommend at least um, 5,000 units of Vitamin D three, particularly if you have a blood test that shows that you're under 50 on your D three, your vitamin D number, that matters as well.
And then as I talked about, previous, uh, episode 2 59. There are some specific forms of calcium that I'm a, a, a big, big fan of. Uh, what about the anxiety side of things? What can you do naturally to help [00:48:00] with that right away? Well, anxiety release is of course my formula that I absolutely love for that. Uh, and I believe it helps very, very much.
There's also a stress formula, uh, specific, uh, that, that Carl recommends from Blue Bonnet, uh, that, uh, we also have at Vitality. That I think is a cool formula as well. And, and frankly, with formulas like that to a large degree, it, it's really up to you, you know, how your body's gonna respond. So those are good options.
You can also look at for the brain, uh, they have a formula called brain power in the um, In the, uh, blue Bonnet brand that I think is a very cool formula to support the brain, particularly cognitive stuff though. So we're talking memory focus and things like that. And then he mentioned collagen. And I will say that there are, are that.
Carl, the company he represents. Blue Bonnet has a great line of collagen. They're called the collagen refl refreshers. They have one that's kind of an energizing thing. They have one that's more of a calming anti-stress thing. So if you're dealing with [00:49:00] the bone loss and the stress, that one would be an excellent option.
They have a beauty form formula that's designed to be more for like hair, skin and nails and that kind of thing and so on. Those collagen refreshers are excellent. So that's a great, great source for those. So anyway, those. A little more, a little more detail. I wanted to clarify a few things that I thought I might get questions on after the interview with Carl.
I hope this was as fascinating to you as it was to me. I really enjoyed that interview and I very much planned to ask those questions of my clients. Moving forward. Okay. I've got just a minute or so left. I'm gonna remind you of a couple of things. We are doing our annual clearance sale at Vitality Nutrition.
If you're local, you can come in and peruse the deals. They're 50 to 75% off, and a lot of it is just awesome stuff that just hasn't caught on, and we're moving it out for that reason. We also, Are, uh, doing, uh, or, or, sorry. I also did, as I said at the very beginning, a [00:50:00] podcast episode with Carlin Call on the Just Ingredients podcast.
We just recorded it yesterday morning and it's gonna release on. Monday, uh, Monday being the, uh, just so in case you're listening to this after the fact, uh, Monday is the 30th of January, 2023, so that's when that episode's supposed to release. I'm very excited about it. I thought it was a fun episode with a lot of great information that you'll really enjoy.
So check that out. Thank you so much. I appreciate the time you spend listening to me. And, uh, if you like what you hear, go tell somebody. Share it on, uh, social media, share it via text message. Um, if you want to rent one or, or make a sign and stand on the corner like the pizza guys do and say, you know, listen to Vitality Radio.
I would appreciate that as well. Thank you so much for listening to me. Call us if you have questions. 8 0 1 2 9. 66 62 or vitality nutrition.com. I'm Jared St. Clair and this has been [00:51:00] Vitality Radio.
Carl Germano: You've been listening to the Vitality Radio podcast. Enjoy your week. In the meantime, Jared will be feverishly searching for the latest nutrition info to educate you on and waiting into mounds of propaganda to help steer you through. Vitality Radio is researched and written by Jared St. Clair. Our awesome music is by Brian Bob Young, support Vitality Radio by subscribing and giving us a five star review on Apple Podcasts, YouTube, or your favorite podcast source.
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