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“Research Ethics Reimagined” is a podcast created by Public Responsibility in Medicine and Research (PRIM&R), hosted by Ivy R. Tillman, PRIM&R's executive director. Here, we talk with scientists, researchers, bioethicists and some of the leading minds exploring new frontiers of science. This season, we are going examine research ethics in the 21st century -- and learn why it matters to you.
Welcome to Research Ethics Reimagined. And I want to thank our guests who are joining us today. Tiffany, Bianca, Doctor. Malcolm Bevel as Doctor. B, as he prefers to be called and Mr.
Ivy TIllman:Corey Rogers. We're so pleased to have each of you here with us today. And as I believe you all know, as well as our listeners, I reside near Augusta, Georgia and have worked at Augusta University for a few decades before coming to PRIM&R. I'm so excited about the conversation we are getting ready to have because here at PRIM&R, we want to advance these types of conversations where we see models that involve involve the research ethics and oversight community, the public, researchers and community partners. And so I had the privilege of attending a few of these community lunch and learn or seminar series that we'll be talking about a little bit later on that were held at the Lucy Kraft Lanning Museum of Black History in Augusta.
Ivy TIllman:And I was most intrigued by this exemplary model. It is a model for our listeners that you all have developed that I believe others can replicate. We see this model of academic partner, community partner, the public. We see these models in other sectors. We've not seen this model consistently and sustainably in research ethics and oversight until recently.
Ivy TIllman:We recognize that there are other institutions doing similar type work. And so we began, I really want us to shine a light on this, to learn from you all, to hear the story of how this was developed, but also as our title indicates, reimagining, right? So imagining what the future could look like for these and other types of community engagement. This program really has grown into be a staple within the Augusta community. And it features this unique partnership and model.
Ivy TIllman:So as we begin, I want to thank you again for joining us. I want to start with, if you can, each of you, give us just a brief introduction of who you are and your background and what got you to this work. And I know that's a lot, but pretty quickly, but most importantly, why you believe the work of community engagement of this nature around science and research is so important. So we'll start with Corey, if you can give us, if you can start us off.
Corey Rogers:Sure. Well, thank you for providing this platform and thank you for having all of us on. The funny thing is I've gotten so used to seeing Bianca, Tiffany, other partners that are sort of connected through these two individuals and through IRB. Doctor. Bevel has been to the museum twice now, once on a panel and once individually.
Corey Rogers:So they're starting to become a part of the museum's extended family, if you will. And they're really starting to, I guess, show the community what a true partnership looks like. So, to kind of go back, Ivy, to start a little bit about myself. My name is Corey Rogers, executive director of the Lucy Kraft Laney Museum of Black History. I've been the director now for a little over three years, but I've been here at the museum for twenty two years.
Corey Rogers:as I often like to say, I worked at an institution, but I am the institution right now. And one of the things that I can honestly say, people obviously see us as a museum, but we're much more than just a museum. We are a community resource. And so through our various programming initiatives, we provide the community an outlet that they can understand and have access to a variety of topics, things that might be important in their lives from healthcare to political forums, you name it. So we try to provide that opportunity for them.
Corey Rogers:Our monthly community luncheon is one of the easiest ways to gain access to the community because we have anywhere from 45 to 80 people that might come out to one of these luncheons every month. And so when Doctor. Daryl Nettles introduced me to the team, the IRB team, and kind of told me in what direction we wanted to go in, I thought this was a no brainer and it was a win win for everyone involved. The other thing I'll quickly say, and then I'll let the others, I won't monopolize the next forty five minutes, but I can, I can? The other thing I will honestly say that was always in the back of my mind when meeting with and planning and strategizing with Tiffany and Bianca and the team is that people sometimes forget that Lucy Kraft Laney made as one of the cornerstones of her legacy healthcare in the community.
Corey Rogers:With the founding of the Lamar Nursing School in the 1890s, her mission beyond just education was quality healthcare for African Americans in Augusta. And so with that being said, and with that in mind, it's one thing for us to study the life of Ms. Laney, it's another thing for us to put it into practice some of the things that she practiced. And so we see this, we see our relationship with the IRB team as an opportunity to keep Ms. Laney's legacy alive.
Corey Rogers:And we've always had that in mind.
Ivy TIllman:Amazing. Oh, wow. So Doctor. B, thank you, Corey, for that introduction. Doctor.
Ivy TIllman:B, just share a little bit about who you are and how you became involved in this particular work.
Malcolm Bevel, PhD:All right. Thank you again for having us today. I gotta follow Corey after that.
Corey Rogers:Listen, as a fellow member of Omega Psi Phi, I know you're about to bring it. So I'm not gonna even trip. I'm not gonna even trip.
Malcolm Bevel, PhD:Right. So my name is Malcolm Bevel. I'm an assistant professor at the Georgia Cancer Center within the Department of Medicine at Augusta University. I also serve as the component director for evidence based medicine at MCG campus in Savannah, Georgia. My work focuses on the food environment and how it relates to obesity related cancers.
Malcolm Bevel, PhD:And then the solutions such as healthy lifestyle interventions, community gardening, indoor and outdoor micro farming to provide resources to the community. So that's essentially how I got into the work. Then in partnering with IRB and the talks that I've done, because a large component of the research that I do does involve community outreach and engagement and sustainable practices. So then people can live longer, healthier lives and so we can cure cancer faster. Now, I guess I'm a cancer researcher and a farmer, so that's who I am.
Ivy TIllman:Oh, fascinating. All right. So the IRB office, Tiffany.
Tiffany M. Coleman, PhD(c):Hey, so I'm Tiffany Coleman, the IRB office director. So I've been in research in different capacities for about twenty years. I was a study coordinator. I've worked lab work all the way to IRB director. So I got into this work.
Tiffany M. Coleman, PhD(c):We started this initiative. It was around 2021. As we know, that was the height of COVID. Everything was going on, stay at home orders, we scared, we had the masks, Operation Warp Speed to get the vaccine. And so we were hearing around in the community and really nationally that there were certain groups that didn't trust it.
Tiffany M. Coleman, PhD(c):So you got this vaccine, you're trying to push it on us. Why are you trying to push on our community? It's not safe. You rush to get it through the FDA. You know, what is the FDA?
Tiffany M. Coleman, PhD(c):We don't know anything about this. So you're using us to be a guinea pig. It's gonna be another Tuskegee Syphilis experiment. And so we felt the role of the IRB at that point is everyone knows about Tuskegee. They know the ins and outs of what happened and the other egregious research that happened.
Tiffany M. Coleman, PhD(c):Henrietta Lacks was recently in the news. But people don't talk about and people don't know what happened after that. So they don't know about the IRB, the Belmont principles, informed consent, justice, risk versus benefit. You can get out of the study if you don't wanna be in it anymore. You have a right to say no.
Tiffany M. Coleman, PhD(c):You don't hear about that. And so we felt as IRB, as a HRPP at Augusta University, we felt it was our obligation to ensure that they didn't just have the Tuskegee over their head, but they also had the education to know, these are safeguards that have been put in place. We always say, just in general, we're not trying to persuade people to be in research, but if someone approaches you, you're able to make a fully educated decision on if you need to be in that. So that's why this interests me. That's our role as the IRB, to ensure that the participants are educated.
Tiffany M. Coleman, PhD(c):We advocate for them. If something don't seem right, we want to be that face in the community and say, Hey, IRB, somebody came up to me and this don't seem, but what do you all think about that?
Ivy TIllman:Wow. Bianca.
Bianca Marsh:Hi. Well, I'm Bianca Marsh. I was born and raised here in Augusta, Georgia. And in 2023, Tiffany really entrusted me when I joined the IRB office to step up and lead these initiatives. And I really hadn't had any community engagement experience truthfully prior to that.
Bianca Marsh:So the HRPP Community Engagement Unit introduced me to this type of work that I have found is I'm deeply connected to. I was born and raised here in Augusta, Georgia. I attended the historic C. T. Walker Middle School, the Academy of Richmond County.
Bianca Marsh:I took field trips to the Lucy Kraft Laney Museum growing up. My mom was the lead engineer at Fort Discovery, and I remember going there as well. And so outside outside of academia, places like Fort Discovery and the Lucy Craft Laney Museum provided education for me growing up and helped shape who I am today. So when Tiffany, like I said, just really entrusted me with this work, I took it very seriously. And when we first started, what we found is that if you don't have those community partners, outreach isn't going to really work.
Bianca Marsh:And so we've had to work very hard over the past few years to develop these community partners. Corey and the Lucy Craft Laney Museum have been so instrumental in our outreach. And I think it's beautiful how we've all been able to come together with our various backgrounds in this community and really make something work.
Ivy TIllman:Wonderful. Thank you all for those introductions. And it's a great segue. So thank you, Bianca, for just framing up this particular initiative. I recognize that you all do at the IRB office that you may do other things within the community, but this one, when you begin to frame up what this can look like, because what's intriguing about how it works and why it works, I want you to talk about what you learned along the way and maybe some challenges that you may have faced and how you've dealt with those is that you have the IRB office, you have the community partner and you also have the researcher.
Ivy TIllman:And the researcher is positioned and Doctor. B, when I heard you talking about educating on food swamps and food deserts are the difference and how that impacts the community, but also the research that you do to support the community. I saw how all of this began to blend. So all of you, if you can kind of begin to talk to me, we can start with the IRB office and move around. How did you frame up this particular model?
Ivy TIllman:And so for our community partner, Corey, and researcher Doctor. B, when you were approached, what were your initial thoughts? What were your priorities for this type of model?
Tiffany M. Coleman, PhD(c):And I'll let Bianca go next because this was her idea that she formulated. But I do want to say that the biggest piece that we see when we started going out in the community was there was this gap with researchers and the community. And so that's why Bianca, like I said, she took the lead of this and she said, you know what, Tiffany, we need to start bringing the research to the community. And so it shouldn't be the first time that they're being approached by a researcher. The first time they meet them is, hey, I got this consent form.
Tiffany M. Coleman, PhD(c):Can y'all be in that study? It needs to be a trusted partnership, a collaboration that they've already built prior to doing this. So that's what kind of led us to say, let's start bringing the researchers down to the communities. Y'all have these individuals in your projects. You need to start building trust.
Tiffany M. Coleman, PhD(c):And I turned it over to Bianca as she started with the researchers being involved.
Bianca Marsh:Absolutely. And so to build off of that, when we talk about this model of the IRB, the researchers and a community partner, you need all three components of that for it to work. So initially when I started with the initiatives here in the office, I had to learn all of this. So I had the IRB support. I even had the researcher support, but didn't have an established community partner.
Bianca Marsh:So some of the first events that I conducted going out into the community, I didn't have great turnout being fully transparent. And it was because I wasn't marketing in the right way. I wasn't going to the right places. I wasn't talking to the right people. And I just thought that I could bring this event and people would come, and that's just not how it works.
Bianca Marsh:A there. There has to be a trusted space there. And we ended up going, I think, to one of the community luncheons at the Lucy Craft Lady Museum and just saw the support and the demand for that event and the turnout that was there. And I approached Corey to kind of say, hey, you know, we have these educational initiatives that we go on, but we haven't had great turnout. Would you be interested in us maybe doing an educational seminar here for one of the luncheons since it's already established and you guys already have those workflows in place?
Bianca Marsh:And he was just so supportive. So one thing I learned is you have to go to the community. You cannot expect them. They're not going to come to you.
Tiffany M. Coleman, PhD(c):They're not going to come to you. Right. And we shouldn't expect them to.
Bianca Marsh:You can't. Even when you look at taking it a step deeper, when you look at research, those are the same barriers that researchers will encounter, right? Expecting people to come to them and you can't, you have to go to the community. You have to go to that population. And so even something that we learned from a community engagement perspective and taking the time to network, go to health fairs, go to other community events and support them and meet people.
Bianca Marsh:This year, both Cory, Tiffany and I are on the Golden Blocks Planning Committee for the Golden Blocks Block Party Health Resource Fair, which is a big event that they do here every year. And there's been so many community connections and networking from that alone. So you can't do it all on your own. Every component in the IRB researcher community partner model is integral and is important, and you need all three for it to be successful. Thank
Ivy TIllman:you. So I want begin to shift. We talked about the IRB and the institution and I'm going to talk about the word trust in a minute. Keep that in the back of your mind because that's going to be kind of like our golden conversation. But Doctor.
Ivy TIllman:B and Corey, when you were approached, had you heard of an I know Doctor. B, you have, but had you heard of an IRB and had you heard of an IRB engaging in this manner? What were your initial thoughts? Was there skepticism? Was there an immediate connection there?
Ivy TIllman:I'd love to hear from both of you.
Malcolm Bevel, PhD:Corey?
Corey Rogers:Sure. So full disclosure, no, I, I, I never, well, let me say this. I'm, obviously familiar with research and, the work that medical institutions do in communities, but I guess never to the extent of an entire organization coming in and approaching me about said research. So this was in many respects, very eyeopening for me, very educational for me in terms of my knowledge of these types of institutes and these types of organizations relative to medical institutions. Ivy, you mentioned a word, I think Tiffany mentioned it as well.
Corey Rogers:Probably Bianca as well. And I was actually going to bring up this word again, because I think this is where it all starts to fall in place, and that's trust. And so the Laney Museum had already established a rapport with Doctor. Darrell Nettles. We had already had this rapport because Darrell's been integral in working with us on a variety of initiatives.
Corey Rogers:So when he approached me and made the connection, his word was already good. If he's bringing this group to me, then I know that these people must be on the level. And so as we met the few initial times, and then we started building sort of a plan, a strategy for, and Tiffany and Bianca, correct me if I'm wrong, we've had three or four gatherings.
Bianca Marsh:I wanna say four. We did the initial Tuskegee one. We did a panel on barriers to research participation. We did a breast cancer research event. And then most recently Doctor.
Bianca Marsh:B's food for Thaw on food deserts and food swamps in the CSRA.
Corey Rogers:So with these different initiatives, number one, I was really excited to partner with them. First and foremost, they got this stuff together. I mean, Bianca, Tiffany and the crew, they bring it, the I's are dotted and the T's are crossed. And so, you know, you're dealing with professionals of the highest grade and that was very obvious from day one, from the first meeting. The other thing that I have really enjoyed in terms of this partnership are the topics, the subjects that we cover.
Corey Rogers:And that is because there are not these sort of obscure kind of that high minded maybe only exist in academia. These are very relevant topics.
Tiffany M. Coleman, PhD(c):It's what the communities are currently going through. Right,
Corey Rogers:yeah. Mean, food deserts, oh my goodness. I mean, we're right back in the middle, right And here on Lainie so when our folks here at the museum see the topics and they see what goes into the planning and preparation for these events, I think they're eager to come out and be a part of it. Currently we have, I guess, about 2,000 people that we reach on a consistent basis through email and through social media. We have about four to 5,000 that come through the museum for a variety of things, tours, luncheons, whatever the case is.
Corey Rogers:So we have sort of this built in audience, thirty five years worth. We're just really happy to share that audience with the IRB team and the researchers.
Ivy TIllman:So Doctor. B, when you were approached by the IRB office in this manner, what was your initial reaction? And have you worked with an IRB with this type of relationship in the past?
Malcolm Bevel, PhD:So I'm gonna answer the second question first. And it's not that, well, I'll be quite frank. I've been at several institutions. My dad always called me the professional student of the family. And since being in research for my time at Mary Medical College, University of South Carolina, working at various institutions, I really cannot recall an initiative in a model like this that really emphasized community outreach and engagement.
Malcolm Bevel, PhD:We always talk about Tuskegee. We always talk about Henrietta Lacks. We talk about other issues within public health and especially in underserved communities. I just don't recall. So not to say that there isn't any, that's why I didn't name no institutions, but I can't recall a model like this, but it is necessary.
Malcolm Bevel, PhD:Initial reaction was that this is so necessary and I'm so on board it. I can't do the work that I do. And and it's funny because we obviously need to go through IRB approval for the protections, not only for ourselves as researchers, more importantly, the communities that we serve. Mhmm. And so I can't do what I do without IRB's assistance.
Malcolm Bevel, PhD:I can't do what I do without the community members. So this is all mutually beneficial for all of us to do. And so if was a means in a way for me to be able to give back, then I was going to be on board off rip. And so I've I've thoroughly enjoyed this. This is really necessary.
Malcolm Bevel, PhD:I'll share kind of an anecdotal story. When I first got here, I did some just basic interviews with the people. And I don't know who I spoke to at IRB, but there was such a quick turnaround even for me just asking a simple question like, hey, I just want to do interviews. I just want to do quick qualitative interviews. I've thought of other means to compensate the individuals.
Malcolm Bevel, PhD:Like, do I need to go through your process or not? And it's almost like we even have a pre check. And I don't know that many institutions that will even allow you a pre check that has such a quick turnaround. And yes, we're technically a smaller university, but IRB is swamped with thousands research projects daily and requesting questions. So their quick turnaround is something that we wouldn't be able to do what we do without it.
Ivy TIllman:Oh, wow. Thank Absolutely, you all for kind you only could take a bow on that one. But you all touched on some words that I just wanna circle back to. So you talked about the institutional trust that had to be established. Corey talked about the fact that there was an institutional connection that was like the door, and that's doctor Nettles, that opened the door to even beginning to connect with the community partner.
Ivy TIllman:I think that's really important for if you're taking notes, a listener, and thinking about how you would do this type of work, you have to have that institution to institution trust, institution to community partnership already built. You all also touched on relevance, that the work that this model does is relevant to the needs of the community, which I think is really And then you talked about impact. Not only the impact to the public, but I hear impact to you as individuals and this level of engagement and partnership. So I want to stay on that word impact for a minute. And I want you to think about with this engagement, what type of feedback have you received from the community?
Ivy TIllman:How do you know it's working? Are you seeing the needle move in a different way?
Bianca Marsh:I'll take a little stab at that. So a few things that we've done, I think for me that I've noticed the impact. One of the first events that we did at museum, and I think that this ties to the word impact, but also to the word trust, We did a huge educational session on the Tuskegee syphilis study. We knew that this was something that we needed to address going into the community. We didn't want to shy away from those conversations.
Bianca Marsh:I think that was a very impactful event that we did, allowing those community members to come forward and share their perspectives. And what we found is that after we've had those conversations, we had people say, you know what? Research doesn't seem so bad or you know what, I would be interested in doing a research study now that I know that there are research protections in place in IRBs and ethics Committees. So I thought that was very impactful. And again, also tying into the word trust, I think it helped us build trust in the community that we didn't try to go in there and pretend that these things didn't happen.
Bianca Marsh:We addressed them and had those conversations and then talked about progress since then. I think that's very important and something that maybe the listeners can take away as well. Don't be afraid to have those difficult conversations because sometimes those do create the most impactful experiences. And then also, I think I know it's working just because, as you mentioned, we start to just get this recognition in the community that when we go out to other events, people recognize us. And so that means so much to us.
Bianca Marsh:Or when we do events at the Lucy Kraft Laney Museum, I now have people who come up and give me hugs and say, I remember you from last time. And they may not remember my name, but they remember my face and they remember my purpose and what it is that I do. And so I think that that's really impactful. That's what makes the hair on my arm stand up. And so I'll let someone else speak a little bit to impact.
Tiffany M. Coleman, PhD(c):Yeah, and I was gonna say the same thing. When we go into these spaces and people come up to us, oh y'all the IRB, y'all here to protect us, we do research. That's all I need. If it's just one that we've touched and they know, and that feels good to me. That, to me, that's impactful to have that one person come up to you and say, I know who y'all are.
Tiffany M. Coleman, PhD(c):I like what y'all are doing. Keep it up.
Bianca Marsh:And something that I could add, and I'm sorry to take over again, I just thought about this from when we did the Tuskegee education, I had a mother approach me and say, you know, my son does research and I always kind of turn my nose up at it, but now I think I might be interested in doing a research study. And I thought that was so crazy because I'm like, wow, her own son doing research, you know, he still had her reservations. But being able to go into this trusted community space, meet the researchers, meet the IRB, have those conversations, tilted her even more to say, well, this is something I might do. And so I thought that was so impactful as well.
Tiffany M. Coleman, PhD(c):It's a wall that's been built up for decades. I'm sorry, Doctor. Beth. I was gonna say it's a wall that's been built up for decades, and we're trying to just take down brick by brick. So even though her son is in it, decades and decades of her hearing the negativities about it, she was So that puts us in a different space.
Tiffany M. Coleman, PhD(c):That way we're changing these people's opinions. Yes.
Malcolm Bevel, PhD:It's funny you mentioned that because so then I did call my brother out, but it's okay. He just had his birthday. So I'm a chronic disease and cancer epidemiologist by training. So I focus on population health. I know the basics basics of infectious disease epidemiology, therefore vaccinations, vaccine rates, the importance of them, certain trials, things of that nature.
Malcolm Bevel, PhD:Now my brother's known me as being the professional student all our life. He knows I've been in research for the better part of ten, fifteen years now.
Tiffany M. Coleman, PhD(c):And he
Malcolm Bevel, PhD:still questioned the COVID vaccine based in part on issues within our community, misinformation that was being spread around and just the general overall curiosity. While he has the privilege of being able to come and call me directly and be like, hey, should I take this vaccine? Yes, no, maybe. Not everybody underserved communities can do that. And so that's why these initiatives are important.
Malcolm Bevel, PhD:We have to reach more persons because especially speaking to somebody with my doctorate and only less than 10% of African Americans and less than 10%, even less than that of African American males have a PhD, especially in my field. The need is dire in terms of being able to get the correct information out there, to also build and build that trust and break down those walls, as you said, miss Coleman, brickbart.
Corey Rogers:You know, what's sort of interesting is most of the patrons or most of the people that participate in our community luncheon, they grew up in the era of the Tuskegee experiment or that was sort of the cornerstone of their upbringing. A matter of fact, I don't know if my fellow panelists realize this or not, but up until about two years ago, it wasn't called the community luncheon, it was called the senior luncheon. And we rebranded it because we wanted to ensure that we could get a younger population into that luncheon space. The museum sort of percentage wise tends to skew older. So there are more older individuals that come to the museum relative to boomers.
Corey Rogers:Well, let's say my generation and younger folks, but we decided that we wanted to rebrand that so we could capture a wider audience. But most of the people that come to the luncheons always in the back of their mind was Tuskegee, Tuskegee, Tuskegee. Then you take that element, it's now exacerbated by an online presence.
Tiffany M. Coleman, PhD(c):The world
Corey Rogers:that we live in today, you now have everybody with a platform who is either uninformed or does not have the credentials. And so what we wanna do is we wanna provide that access to the professionals. I couldn't ask for a better group of people than Malcolm, Bianca, Tiffany, the other researchers and members of the IRB team, because they're gonna bring the knowledge and expertise that my patrons are looking for. They're gonna bring that every time. And so we are happy to provide that space, but here's something else, Ivy, we've been using these watch words for the past forty minutes, like trust, but there's something else with the IRB team that's been kind of, well, it's been on front of mind for me and that is sustainability.
Tiffany M. Coleman, PhD(c):It's one
Corey Rogers:thing. Oftentimes you have people who will approach you with ideas and they kind of come and go, or it's a one off. There seems to be a level of sustainability with this partnership that the foundation was laid, but it continues to grow. So I'm looking forward to other opportunities to partner with these amazing individuals.
Ivy TIllman:Wow, you all, I mean, this is just great because these are the conversations that we need to be having and the way and the perspectives that you bring. Our vision at PRIM&R is that everybody who contributes to research, but also everybody who benefits from research centers trust central to science and medicine. We're reframing that conversation a bit because there's this burden that we place on the public to trust. And we're reframing it to address the need to advance trustworthiness of our systems. And you all are the model.
Ivy TIllman:You are actually walking out the model
Tiffany M. Coleman, PhD(c):of I love our that reframe. I love that.
Ivy TIllman:No, I loved hearing about the sustainability piece, the accountability that you've built into it, the partnership and the collaboration, and the transparency. You all are modeling what it looks like to be a trustworthy system as a whole, the research enterprise, the researcher part of the enterprise, and the community. And so just kudos to you. I want us to take the next couple of minutes and think about what the future could look like. So if you had that crystal ball and unlimited funding, what would you suggest to do next?
Ivy TIllman:Yeah, I love that, right? To increase impact?
Bianca Marsh:Well, go, I'll say a little something. Me personally, if we had the funding, I would love to do more frequent events. I would love to do something monthly, especially here in the CSRA. I would want each month to be focused on a different health theme or disparity. Augusta, Georgia, is a food swamp.
Bianca Marsh:It's a food desert. An article just came out. We are one of the fattest cities is how they coined it. One of the fattest cities in The United States Of America. Our particulate matter in the air is top 25 worst cities in The US.
Bianca Marsh:When you look at the factories and the different things that are being built around here, Augusta, Georgia is affected by a lot of different health issues, health disparities. In my ideal world, I would be able to address those on an ongoing basis and consistently provide those resources. I do just want to say something really quick and then I'm going to be quiet. One thing that if anyone can take away, the first time that a researcher is engaging with the community should not be when they're asking something from those community members or when they're recruiting. They should be in there and engaging them prior to that.
Ivy TIllman:All right. Anyone else? Crystal Ball, how do you see this growing?
Corey Rogers:I think if I can just jump in quickly to piggyback off of Bianca, possibly to have more events. We did have, of the four events that we've hosted, we did one in the evening. So I would love to see that balance for those who possibly can't make it to the luncheon and have it in the evening. Also, why don't we take this show on the road? So let's just say we have a certain segment of our population from a mobility standpoint who may not be able to make it to the museum.
Corey Rogers:Well, we can then go into their community and have the forum or have the event posted to them to give them easier access. One last thing and I'll this is something I think that would just, well, for me, it's fun because it's just what I've been doing for the past half century or quarter century rather. And that is exploring Augusta's African American roots from a healthcare and health perspective, looking at the medical connections. We talked about this mistrust aspect to it. Well, in Augusta, a lot of it was compounded because we were one of the major areas where the resurrection men were very active in the nineteenth century.
Tiffany M. Coleman, PhD(c):I know we ran out of time, but yeah, if we had unlimited money, unlimited staff, we keep leaving out the word staff, we could do these monthly, biweekly, and just increase our collaborations. There's a big community center called The Hub. That's also a central location locally. Collaborate with them, just spread out like Corey said, take it on the road. I mean, the sky would be the limit if we had the money and the staff.
Corey Rogers:Yep.
Ivy TIllman:Well, Doctor. B, did you have anything?
Malcolm Bevel, PhD:I agree with everything. The thing that keeps sticking out of my mind about we've dibble dabbled in various words. And it's funny when I first started working here, I met with a community member of mine who's a partner of mine with my rooftop garden initiative right now. And when we initially met, he had his reservations just because I work at Augusta University, kind of going back to what Cory was talking about regarding the cadaver and the and the grave robbing and everything. And his issue, I very vividly remember this because I still tease him about it to this day is talking about I'm tired of, Augusta University taking and taking and taking.
Malcolm Bevel, PhD:Taking with you. And he was angry and his anger was justified. So I had to kind of get on his level and I said, okay, I hear you. And so I'm a code switch real quick. Like don't let the suit and tie and ID fool you.
Malcolm Bevel, PhD:I know who I am and whose I am. And I'm here to serve the community and I'm gonna put my money where my mouth is. And I actually even remember that first meeting with him. I mentioned the IRB because I told him for anything that I have to do as a researcher, if he were to submit something as research, you have to go through the IRB process. So we're not doing anything illegal, that you're not harming other people, that your science is going to be good.
Malcolm Bevel, PhD:So then eventually do publish it and or you wanna go present at conferences or anything like that, everybody knows that you did this the right way. It's fine with my research data, I found what I found, but if I didn't do it the right way, then is that true science? And I would argue it's not. Unlimited resources, with unlimited staff, definitely taking this on the road because people also forget that institutions like Augusta university service, not just Augusta Georgia, but the CSRA as well. This is great chronic disease hotspots.
Malcolm Bevel, PhD:Unfortunately, as Bianca said, we're one of the fattest cities in the nation and there are multiple thousands of cities in the nation. And so the fact that there were top, that's a problem. But we and we know the solutions. The issue also is getting the information out there.
Tiffany M. Coleman, PhD(c):Making the information out.
Malcolm Bevel, PhD:I will make a charge to, if any of your listeners are also researchers like myself, we need to continue community based participatory research approaches or CBPR approaches. We should not move until the community tells us to move and how to move. Quick example with that, I have indoor micro farm. I talked about that at the luncheon and I don't do anything until I talk to Ebony Tree Farms, Mr. And Mrs.
Malcolm Bevel, PhD:Like Fred today we had extra kale and I said, do we give this to the church or they already got the three pounds last week? Or do you want to it for your cooking demonstrations? Because that was written into my grant and I have to follow that. Why? Because that's good science and I don't want to get in trouble with IRB.
Malcolm Bevel, PhD:So
Tiffany M. Coleman, PhD(c):all of that's
Malcolm Bevel, PhD:important in terms of advancing the science, especially for the underserved. And if we had these unlimited resources, I do see that we would have significant changes in better outcomes for the people that we're supposed to serve.
Ivy TIllman:Thank you all. We could talk for another hour.
Tiffany M. Coleman, PhD(c):Recognize that we don't have that,
Ivy TIllman:but we may revisit this soon. And so thank you for your time And for those listening, thank you for listening. I know that you received some information that you can take back to your institutions or within your communities and apply. So with that, we're done.