Questions in the Empty Nest

Show Notes

You know, as we enter the empty nest—and we sort of have been feeling this as our kids become teenagers—but our relationships are changing.  Our marriages are in different places.  My marriage was very different as we approached the empty nest than it was when we began our marriage.  We were two very different people after twenty-five, thirty years than we were when we started.

What is The Barbara Rainey Podcast?

Barbara Rainey mentors women in their most important relationships. She loves encouraging women to believe God and experience Him in every area of their lives.

Samantha Loucks: Coming up, on the Barbara Rainey Podcast:

Susan Yates: The empty nest is messy, and sometimes, in order to figure out who we are and what we are to do in this season, we need to take a break.

Barbara Rainey: What do we want to do with the rest of our lives? What do we want the rest of our lives to look like?

Susan: And on the floor of the closet, I saw a rumpled old, blue prom dress. It was not needed anymore. I thought, “That’s just how I feel.”

Barbara: So it’s a wonderful opportunity for us in this season of life to look forward to the empty nest.

We intend to use our lives for God’s purposes for as long as He gives us breath.
Samantha: Welcome to the Barbara Rainey Podcast! We want to help you be transformed by Jesus which will, in turn, transform your home. Thanks for listening!

Every mom understands that part of her job as a mom is to help her child or children prepare for adulthood. But as we’ll hear today, the transition to the empty nest can be an emotional one.

Barbara is the co-author, along with her friend Susan Yates, of a book called Barbara & Susan's Guide to the Empty Nest. They wrote it to help parents view this time not as something to dread but as the beginning of the next big adventure.

Barbara, we’re going to be hearing a message that you and Susan Yates gave, talking about some of those empty nest issues.

But first, let me read this note from a woman who wrote to say,

“I’ve been reading Barbara’s empty nest book. I was encouraged to hear about your daughter who had wandered from the faith, to find out that we are not alone. Barbara is so right, we just need to choose our words carefully and to pray, pray, pray. God is faithful, and He cares about our children more than we do. Thank you.”

So I imagine you’ve heard from a lot of folks who’ve read the book, who have written you personally to say, “Thanks for capturing, in this book, what we’ve been living through and couldn’t put words to.”

Barbara: Yeah, especially when we speak. We get immediate feedback when Susan and I speak to groups of women. They come up and say, “Wow, this is exactly what I’ve been thinking and feeling, and I’m so glad to hear somebody else is talking about it. It’s a phase of life that we don’t celebrate the same way we celebrate weddings and new babies and going off to school and all of that. Moms just kind of fade off the radar screen. There’s no big bang. There’s no hoopla to celebrate the end of parenting. And I think it leaves a lot of women feeling lost, not sure what to do with themselves. We’ve had great feedback from women who’ve read the book because they understand, by reading it, that we get it because we’ve been there and we’ve felt those things and we’re trying to help them know that they’re not alone.

Samantha: I’ll let our listeners know how they can get a copy of that book later in this podcast.

Now, you raised six children for more than a quarter-century. You have 26 grandchildren. And Barbara, your co-author, Susan Alexander Yates, is the mother of five, including a set of twins. She and her husband, John, live in Falls Church, Virginia, and they’re the grandparents of 21, including a set of quadruplets!

Barbara: That’s right.

Samantha: Wow!

Barbara and Susan spoke on the subject of the empty nest to a group of women in Dallas. This was a number of months ago, but we’re going to give our listeners an opportunity to hear what they shared with those women. Here are Barbara Rainey and Susan Yates, talking about issues women experience as they face the empty nest.

Barbara: Susan and I have discovered, on this journey, that all of us are asking the same questions; and they boil down to four questions. The first one is,

1. Am I the only one who feels this way?

I remember thinking that and feeling that after my youngest left. It’s a very common emotion for us, in the empty nest. Most empty nesters feel that they are the only one. One of the big ones for us—for both of us—was loneliness because the house is empty and it’s quiet, and we’re not used to that.

Susan: I remember when it hit me—I have a vivid picture. Our kids all married young—they graduated from college in a period of seven years, and most of them got married right after college. So, I never had a chance to really adjust to the empty nest because as our third child was graduating from high school to go off to the university, our first child was getting married within a week’s period of time. I was overwhelmed. So, it wasn’t, for me, until our last daughter, one of the twins, got married. Our twins got married within six weeks of each other. So that was a crazy summer!

Barbara: And they’re girls. [Laughter]

Susan: Yes. I remember the day after Libby’s wedding—she was the last to marry—going up to the girls’ room that they’d grown up in, that they’d shared their whole life. Susie and her husband, who had been married for six weeks, were packing up the U-Haul to empty everything else that was left in the room.

As I stood in the room, I looked around at the walls and there were lines where the pictures had hung, there were pieces of little scraps of paper; but otherwise, the room was bare. As that truck pulled out of the driveway, with my last child off to her new life, I just sort of dissolved into tears and crumpled on the floor. As I looked at these bare walls, I noticed the closet door was ajar. On the floor of the closet, I saw a rumpled old, blue prom dress. It seemed out of place. It was all alone. It was not needed anymore; it, in a way, was out of style. As I looked at that prom dress, I thought, “That’s just how I feel. I’m not needed anymore. I’m a little out of style.”

I remember just sobbing. So, for me, that was a real, “Oh me! This really is the empty nest,” as all of my children were finally married. Well, all of us will experience different things as we hit the empty nest. As Barbara and Dennis experienced the beginnings of the empty nest, they experienced it with some real heartache.

Barbara: Yes. We did. As we began the empty nest season, we were in a season of suffering as parents. One of our daughters, when she hit her senior year, things really began to unravel in some pretty serious, life-altering ways. We had sort of been dealing with some of her issues through high school and we were doing everything that we could think of to help her.

It seemed like, at times, things were working; but we found ourselves in a really difficult season as that year progressed, dealing with an eating disorder, and she began to experiment with alcohol and drugs. Our lives, as a family, just began to spiral. It really affected us and our marriage. Here we are—approaching the empty nest—we weren’t there yet, but this was the way we entered our empty nest.

We spent her senior year watching other families do proms, and graduation ceremonies, and all these wonderful senior activities; and we were wondering where our daughter was. Where was she spending the night? It was such a time of heartache and loss for us—when it should be a joyous, wonderful season of life.

We were in a very vulnerable place in our marriage and in our family because of this great suffering that we were experiencing. We went through that season, and there were two things that were very important for us. One was a small group of friends, and it was just really a couple of couples who stood with us and prayed for us. Even when we didn’t know what they were praying—there were many times that we didn’t even see them—but they had committed to pray for us through this difficult time in our lives.

The second thing that really got me through that season of life was God’s Word. I remember I had the verses James 1:2-8 written out on a card, and I taped that card to my steering wheel. It must have been there for two or three months. When I would get in my car and something dramatic had happened, or something was really weighing on my heart for my daughter, I remember driving down the street saying that out loud, over and over again, because there was nothing else that I could hang on to. Nothing else seemed stable in my life, except God’s Word. Those two things really got us through.

We’ve learned that the empty nest is a season of great change. One of the most important things for navigating the season of the empty nest is friendships. We’ve learned a lot about friendships in the last few years, as we’ve worked on this, and how important it is for us, as women, to have some good friends who can stand with us in the journey.

The second question that is on your outline is,

2. What is happening to my relationships?

You know, as we enter the empty nest—and we sort of have been feeling this as our kids become teenagers—but our relationships are changing. We’ve learned that our marriages are in different places. My marriage was very different as we approached the empty nest than it was when we began our marriage. We were two very different people after twenty-five, thirty years than we were when we started.

Susan: (reading from book) Bess and Gary couldn’t wait for the empty nest. Raising their kids had been tough. They’d had different approaches to discipline, they had struggled on a tight budget, and they postponed many of their dreams in order to be with their kids. Now, the last one was leaving and they felt they’d done the best they could. Finally, they were about to be free from the daily stresses of parenting. They were excited! They couldn’t wait for it to be “Just us,” again.

Shelly’s situation was just the opposite. She poured her life into her kids. They had come first. Now, as the last child got ready to leave, she was scared—really scared. “I don’t even feel like I know my husband. I haven’t been alone with him since I was 26.” [Laughter] “Our whole life has revolved around the kids. Now, what will we talk about at the dinner table? What will do on weekends? I don’t even know if I have the energy left to put into this relationship, and I don’t know if I want to.”

Two very realistic pictures of what we face in this new season.

Well, as Johnny and I walked into the empty nest, I needed to be aware that I could put undue pressure on my husband—that’s one trap I could fall in. On the other end of the spectrum, I could easily fall into this trap— “Well, now that the children are gone, he’s just going to work longer at the office. He’s going to take on more projects. I’ll just get involved in more of the things I’m involved in. We’ll just get busier and busier and we’ll pass in the night when it’s convenient.” I realized that was equally as dangerous because I could become emotionally disengaged. That would only lead to isolation. It was really helpful to me to recognize these two extremes.

You know, not only does our marriage need to be renegotiated, but also our relationship with our adult children is going to change. Picture with me, for a moment, a seesaw. You know, how when you were little, you’d get on a seesaw with a friend. Part of the fun of the seesaw was one of you had to move in—who was a little bit heavier—and the lighter one had to move out so you could balance in mid-air. Keep that picture in mind, for a minute, because I think, as moms, we have two tendencies as we release our adult children. On one end of the seesaw is the helicopter parent and on the other end of the seesaw is the hands-off parent.

Now, the helicopter parent is the parent that is perhaps a little too involved with her child. She’s on the phone, “Did you get to class on time?” “What are you going to wear?” “What are your plans for the weekend?” “Oh, are you eating right?” and, “Tell me who your friends are.” The child may be on the phone, throughout the day, dumping on mom, which gets mom all upset. Five minutes after the child has dumped, she’s fine and mom is leveled for the rest of the day. It’s very easy for us to micromanage our children from a distance. That’s the helicopter parent.

The hands-off parent, on the other hand, is one that says, “Out of sight, out of mind,” —sort of. “I’ve raised this child to be independent. They need to know that I have confidence in them. I am not going to call them,” as a friend of mine, who just sent her first off to college this year said, “We’re not allowed to call them for the first three weeks.” Now, she is a chronic hands-off parent. Doesn’t know his class schedule, doesn’t know who his friends are, and wants to give him space so that he can become his own man.

Let me quickly say that both the helicopter parent and the hands-off parent love their child. They want that child to be secure. So, in our book, we talk in greater detail about these two tendencies and give several practical helps on how you can seek to balance that seesaw.

So, our first two questions are: “What is happening to me? Am I the only one who feels this way?” And secondly, “What is happening to my relationships?”

Barbara: Yes, there are two words that I want you to remember. The first one is, “intentional”. Become intentional in your marriage relationship and in key friendships. The second word—that is key—is “flexible”. Become flexible in your relationship with your children.

Susan: Our third question is

3. Who have I become?

As we all know, the empty nest is a major transition. Transitions are just plain awkward. The reality is that we, whatever season of life we are in, expect stability to be the norm; but in fact, transition is more the norm in daily life.

Just look back at the transitions we have already experienced: leaving home, marriage, a first baby, a new job, a new boss in an old job, financial loss, moves, illnesses, a crisis with a child, a national or international crisis. With each one of these transitions, we keep waiting for life to calm down. But the reality is, life never calms down. It just gets more complicated. We long for a period of predictability and stability. We think that that is the way life should be—predictable, and stable, and calm. It even seems to be for some of our friends.

My sister is very wise. Often, when we look at other women, as you perhaps have done in this room this morning, you see another woman and she looks so perfectly put together. You sit there and imagine her life is all together—her marriage is great, her kids are great, and she is experiencing stability and calm. My sister says, “There is always data missing! [Laughter] You don’t know!” It’s helpful to remember that. We are all much more alike than we give the perception of being.

The empty nest is messy, and sometimes, in order to figure out who we are and what we are to do in this season, we need to take a break. It’s really important to take a break. In all honesty, Barbara was much better at taking a break than I was. I want her to tell you about that.

Barbara: Part of the reason I took a break was because I was sort of forced to because I began the empty nest in a very emotionally-depleted state, I knew I just couldn’t jump into the next thing. I didn’t have the energy to jump into the next thing, but Susan did. I realized I needed some time off.

Susan and I want to give you permission to take a break that first year after your youngest leaves. Don’t feel like you have to jump into the next activity. Don’t feel that you have to sign up— “Now, that I’m free, I can do 100 things that I have been wanting to do.” You may want to do that, but it would be wise if you took a break. It could be as short as a weekend away where you retreat by yourself and do some thinking and evaluating. You may want to take a couple of weeks off. You may want to take a couple of months off, or maybe a whole semester—and not do anything. Pull back and evaluate your life and think about, “What is it that I want to do with the rest of my life?”

As you do that, think about a couple of things—two things in particular. We have other things for you to think about in our book; but two, in particular, are: Look back over your life and say, “What am I thankful for?” Begin to make a list of the things that you are thankful for—the things that God has done—all of the good things. It is so easy to focus on the bad things and the losses. “What are those good things that I can be thankful for?”

Then secondly, you might want to evaluate: “What are the issues, what are the relationships and needs that I have avoided because I have been so busy? What are the gaps in my marriage? What are the gaps in my other relationships? What are things in my life that I have sort of swept aside because I have been so busy raising kids—that I dare not ignore anymore—that now, that I have the time, I can focus on these issues in my life?”

It would also be a good time to spend time with your husband, just thinking ahead. “What do we want to do for the rest of our lives? What do we want the rest of our lives to look like?” As Dennis and I have talked about this, we have made some promises to each other. A couple of them are—one, we have promised each other, “We are not going to become gripey, cynical, old people.” [Laughter] We are already seeing how easy that would be to become that way because things are starting to fall apart, and we don’t like the way we feel some days. We’re creaky, and it would be real easy to gripe about that. We have committed to one another that we are not going to do that.

Secondly, we have promised that we are going to do everything we can to stay healthy, to stay strong mentally, and to stay on the cutting edge.

The third thing that we have decided together, as a couple, is that we intend to use our lives for God’s purposes for as long as He gives us breath. We want to be engaged in Kingdom activities. None of us knows how long we have left. We may only have a couple of years. We may have ten years—but I want my life, and Dennis wants his life, and I know John and Susan feel the same way—we want our lives to be maximized for the Kingdom of God for the years that we have left.

Susan: So far, we’ve looked at three questions: “Does anyone feel this way?” “What is happening to my relationships?” and, “Who have I become?” We have a final question.

Barbara: The fourth question is,

4. What is my new purpose?

One of the benefits of the empty nest is the nature of its transition. It is a turning point in all of our lives as women. Sometimes it is uncomfortable; but nonetheless, it can be a season that is full of benefits and full of opportunities because we can pull back and say, “Why am I here?” In our generation, we are healthier, we have greater resources, and we will probably live longer than previous generations of women. It is a wonderful opportunity for us, in this season of life, to look forward to the empty nest.

Susan: One of the things that Barbara and I have discovered, as we have talked to other women, is how many women, now in the season of the empty nest, are asking spiritual questions. There have been many times of recommitment for both Barbara and me over the years. We’ve had many questions along the way, many doubts. There have been uncomfortable times. There have been hard times. Spiritual growth is much like physical growth. There are growth spurts, and there are really awkward hard times; but the fact is that we are still growing.

Barbara: So, no matter where you are in your own spiritual journey, we really feel like this season is a great time to re-evaluate your life and to re-evaluate your spiritual relationship with God at the same time.

There is a verse in Ephesians—Chapter 2, verse10—that says, “For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works.” As long as we are on this earth, God has a plan for us. He wants to be working in our lives. You can apply that to your life and say, “God has a plan for me.” Each and every one of you—God has a specific plan for you—for how He wants to use you for the rest of your life.

As you transition into the empty nest, or as you are adjusting in your early years of the empty nest, take some time to think, “What am I good at?” Evaluate your life, and evaluate where you can plug in that would make the biggest difference for eternity.

Susan: Let me give you a little snapshot of three friends that we have who started something quite by accident. They live in a small town in Pennsylvania, and they walk every morning. They do the big walk up the hill and then their reward for their exercise—they are all empty nesters—is to meet at Starbucks®.

One morning, they were at Starbucks, which is sort of the center of town. They were sitting at a table. They had their lattes and they noticed a young mom, in tears, standing in line to get her coffee. My friend, Sue, said to her—she didn’t really know her—but she said, “Hey, come sit with us. You look like you need a hug.” This young mother went and over and sat with my three empty-nest friends. She began to pour out her heart about a situation she had with one of her children. It was a pre-teenager, and she was in the throes of desperation.

Now, my three wise empty-nest friends had been through so much of what she was going through. They could identify with her feelings. They themselves had been through different issues. They were able to listen to her, to comfort her, and, yet also, to give her some very practical advice, simply because they had experience and wisdom. As my friends sat there and visited, after a little while, the young mom got up. As she left, she turned to them and said, “Oh! Thank you so much! This has so encouraged me.”

My friend, Sue, said, “Well, it’s just free advice! You can take it or leave it.” In that moment, was born the “Take It or Leave It Club”. [Laughter] Sue, and Sally and Jackie began to set up a regular table at Starbucks, after their morning walks. Word spread through this community that this was the table where hassled young moms could go and sit and be comforted by older moms. God wants us to be what I call F.A.T. women—faithful, available, and teachable. [Laughter] It’s a great acronym; isn’t it?

Barbara: Yes. Because we know you women have these nurturing skills and mothering skills, we want to challenge you with this “Take It or Leave It Club” idea to encourage young moms.

We, in our generation, need to unite in living second-season lives of great purpose. We don’t want to settle for mediocrity. Time is too short. Why do that? God has great purposes for our lives. We want to challenge you to discover those and not settle for mediocrity, but live for the Kingdom of God.

Samantha: We’ve been listening to Barbara Rainey and Susan Yates, sharing some important questions every mom might be asking as she approaches the time when her nest empties out. Again, those questions are these:
1. “What is happening to me? Am I the only one who feels this way?” (Of course, the answer is No.)
2. “What is happening to my relationships?”
3. “Who have I become?”
4. “What is my new purpose?”

And through the magic of technology, Barbara and Dennis are here today with me. Barbara, solid relationships are key in this time of a woman’s life, aren’t they?

Barbara: Yes, I think they are really important because I think the danger in the empty nest years is to become isolated because our relationships revolved around our kids, and those families, and those parents. I think it’s important, in the empty nest, that we become intentional in developing couple friendships, and woman-to-woman friendships, and man-to-man friendships that are not tied to our children. We need that for the long haul.

Dennis: Usually, it is our friends who mirror back to us answers to questions we are asking as we transition into this season of life. In the back of one of the chapters—I think it is Chapter 9 on “Take a break and evaluate your life”—Barbara and Susan have a number of questions in here. I do think these questions are best answered by your spouse and some of the friends who know you the best. It really can be a satisfying time.

I know there are some of the moms who are listening to us right now or maybe a dad or two—in the early stages of your family—you are listening to us and you are thinking, “This is going to be a long way off.” You know what? It happens in a blink. You need to prepare, and get ready, and you need to do it right.

Samantha: And to have these questions that you’ve put here, at the end of each of the chapters of your book, gives a reader an opportunity to really process some of the same things you pondered through as a mom who was new to the empty-nest season of life and wasn’t exactly sure which direction to go—to be able to think through these questions and be prepared for it—or if you are in the middle of it—to be able to find some help and counsel to navigate your way through it. I think it’s going to be extremely helpful for many of our listeners.

And let me say to our listeners, the book Barbara and Susan’s Guide to the Empty Nest is available from Ever Thine Home. Here’s how you can order a copy. Just head to EverThineHome.com/EmptyNest and make a donation of $30 or more. Your gift not only helps cover the cost of the book and shipping it to you, but it also helps support the ministry of Ever Thine Home. You’ll be able to indicate you’d like to receive the book by Barbara Rainey and Susan Yates. Again, the web address is EverThineHome.com/EmptyNest.

Thanks for listening today! Coming up next time, a closer look at how Barbara encourages her daughters to weather the storms in their marriages. I hope you’ll join us for that.

I’m Samantha Loucks, inviting you back for the Barbara Rainey Podcast, from Ever Thine Home.