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The Debrief Podcast with Matthew Stephen Brown. Author and lead pastor of Sandals Church, Matt Brown debriefs current issues shaping our culture from a spiritual perspective.
Welcome to the debrief podcast with Matthew Steven Brown. This episode contains content about marriage and sex that might not be suitable for some younger listeners. Parental discretion is advised.
Donna Martin:Welcome back to the debrief podcast with pastor Matthew Stephen Brown.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:How are you doing? It is so good to be with you guys.
Donna Martin:Hey. We are so glad to be here, and thank you for sending in questions. We love reading them. We love hearing what pastor Matt has to say about all of these amazing topics. We get stuff about everything.
Donna Martin:Family
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:I know.
Donna Martin:Life, career, theology. I mean, whatever is on your heart, we wanna hear it, and we'd love to hear your perspective on it. Alright. This is Carolina from Montclair, California. How does fasting work?
Donna Martin:What are the guidelines and its purpose?
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Yeah, so let's start with its purpose and then we'll go to its guidelines. So the purpose of fasting is to deny oneself from good things. So as Christians, right, we are always fasting from bad things. So fasting from sin, cutting things off, know, from from you know, sexual sin, you know, maybe if we have an eating problem, maybe if anger, whatever, like we're identifying it, we're cutting off, we're killing it. So fasting is not the elimination of sin.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Mhmm. Fasting is really the acceptance of, okay, I'm gonna be disciplined in this area and I'm gonna say no to good things for the purpose of growing closer to God. So sometimes you fast from sweets, so that's the whole idea of Lent. So forty days leading up to the crucifixion, burial, and resurrection of Jesus, Catholics, Episcopalians, and a lot of Christians around the world fast from something or from some things for a period of forty days in order to say no to themselves so that they can make room to say yes to God. So that's the principle of fasting.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Sometimes in the Old Testament, it's for grieving, sometimes it's for confession, you know, for you know, like for death, like you stop eating, a loved one's died. But really, for us as Christians, the purpose is to say no to self so that we can make more room to say yes to God. Now some Christians, I remember I had one guy tell me where the Lord Jesus never fasted, and he clearly talks He about says you don't fast when the bridegroom is there. Right. Like, basically what he's saying is it's a wedding celebration while he's here, the Messiah has come, and so that's why he did not do that.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:But we immediately see in the book of Acts and in the epistles that fasting is something that Christians do and it's something that is acceptable and great and true. So I was fasting, I was doing the sixteen hour fast for a period of time, so you stop eating at eight at night, you don't eat until noon the next I've since learned that post fifty, that you're not supposed to do that, I need 50 grams of protein in the morning, right, when I wake up, just because as you're older
Donna Martin:Yeah.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:You need more protein, so that's been a hard shift for me, one of the joys of aging, but you know, like I fast from sugar, with the exception of on Sundays. And it's just something that I've learned as I've gotten older, the more money you make, the more free time you have, the more just, more of a lack of self control that you get, and that's why, you know, I think obesity is such an issue in our country, drunkenness, all of these things, and I think it's good to self restrict. Now, here's what you can't do, don't turn yourself into the spiritual prude where you look down and snub your nose on everybody else because then you're missing the point. If fasting is not making you more like Jesus, then I wouldn't Stop. Do Yeah, stop.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:The longest I've ever fasted, I think I did five days and that was rough. So five days, no food, I drank water, so I don't understand the people that don't drink water, it's not calories, hydration is important. And that was very very difficult for me. Some people do it for health benefits, I'm not a doctor, so I'm just gonna say, I thought that was too long for me. So I don't think that I was pleasant to be around, it's not something that I recommend.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:I think it's good to fast if you need clarity on something. If I feel like I've grown disconnected from God or you know, I just, my relationship with God is stale, it's something that I'll do and it's amazing when you fast, you know, you don't think, I wouldn't consider myself a foodie, but if I say I'm not gonna eat for twenty four hours, all I think about for the first hour is food. It's Yeah, amazing absolutely. The control your carnal nature has on you, and so your carnal nature, like your natural desires, your desire for sex, your desire for food, your desire for safety, right? These things are on autopilot all the time, and if you're not checking in to make sure that, you know, those things are in balance with God, you're gonna crash.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:I was talking with a guy in our church who just became a pilot for the seven thirty seven MAX, the new Boeing airplanes, remember they were crashing a And couple of years so what they didn't tell the pilots is they had this automated system that self corrected the plane, but the pilots didn't know about it. And so they didn't know how to turn it off when the plane was doing something whack and it crashed. And so the idea was, right, it's this automated system, like you're not thinking about breathing right now, so you have an automated system Right. In your Yeah. God has designed, you're not telling your heart to beat, you're not telling your blood to move, so there are automated systems that are innocent, so that's what they thought.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:So automated systems are good things but they can become bad things
Donna Martin:Yeah.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Because if you don't know how to shut something off, and that's what addiction is. Guys that are addicted to porn, masturbation and sex, it it's an automated response that you've just given into. Mhmm. Self control is learning to say no to those things and and I believe becoming a mature Christian is learning to say no to self. Mhmm.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Natural desires. The spiritual life is always opposed to the natural life, always. So we we gotta make sure that we're tapping into that. So I would just say, I think it's a good way to check yourself and to connect with God and I like to get away, I like to because I'm not great when I'm around Tammy, like when she was when I would fast when the kids were little, know, she's making spaghetti and I'm in the other room dying. But now I'm able to just get away and do it, and I try not to make a big deal.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:I like to do it when Tammy's gone, cause then it's just me. Mhmm. And I'm able to do that, and if I'm miserable or grouchy, she's But not experiencing I think it's a good thing. It is something that's challenging. I don't think it's for everybody, but I would encourage everybody to at least try it.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Mhmm. And so, maybe start with not eating till lunch one day, then the next time see if you can not make it to dinner. And then if you can do that, make it to breakfast the next day, that's a twenty four hour fast, and I would say that's a great win. Yeah, that's a great win. And then I would say for some people, maybe you do two days, maybe three days max, and then I would really be careful.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:We had a young man in our church that did, he tried to do forty days like Moses, and I think he got to like eighteen days and he got really sick.
Donna Martin:Yeah.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:And so, and you can't just go eat, your intestines go flat, there's a lot of things that happen in your body and you can't just go eat a burger. Yeah. Like he had to start with like bone broth Yeah. To like get his system working again, and that was really hard to watch because I loved him a great deal. So be really really careful.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Mhmm. You're not Moses, you're not Jesus, so just chill out. So, but I think it's a good thing just to really really, restricting myself has been a blessing. You know, the Apostle Paul says I will not be a slave to anything, and anything that has a hold on you that's greater than God is a problem.
Donna Martin:That's right.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:So fasting is the ability to cut that, and so so great question. I'll Yeah, be praying that's for you. I would encourage you to try it, like I said, start with a meal, then do two meals, and then if you can work your way up to three meals, I think that's great. You know, but a lot of weight loss issues and stuff are spiritual issues. I remember a couple years ago, my mom was reading a book called Crave.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Mhmm. And so a lot of people, like, know, when my mom grew up, when she would hurt her knee or whatever, her mom would say, want a cookie? Mhmm. And so sugar Yeah. Became the way that she self soothed.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Well, the Lord Jesus needs to be the way that we self soothe, and so we, don't put something in our mouth, we say something with our mouth, Lord, I need you. Lord, help me in this situation. Lord, you know, give me peace, or Lord, you know, heal this wound. And so rather than turning to food or sex or alcohol, you know, turn to the Lord because I just, you know, to be a Christian, you cannot be a slave to anything.
Donna Martin:Mhmm.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:And a lot a lot of people are, and if you don't believe me, try to give up something you like.
Donna Martin:Absolutely. For a day or two? Yeah. Yeah. Absolutely.
Donna Martin:My husband actually fasted for forty days before we got married, but Wow. He did one meal a day
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Okay.
Donna Martin:For
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Yeah.
Donna Martin:Fifteen days. I think it was forty five days. Yeah. And then smart he did one bowl of soup a day, and then he did for the last part, he did, like, just fruits and vegetables or something.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Okay. But he
Donna Martin:was skinny rail. Yeah. Yeah. When I came back home, and he actually it was before we got married, and he took a leave of absence from work and lived in his parents' church, like, did not go home Wow. Seek the lord for forty days.
Donna Martin:And so some amazing things came out of that. And he was like, I don't know if I'd do that again, obviously, because churches are scary at night. But, yeah, just it has to be the Lord leading you into that, and then also just be really wise with how you fast and what you put your body through, because I think three days is a good
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Yeah. Yeah.
Donna Martin:A good
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:And it's something to be very private about. Yeah. When Jesus says don't make a big deal about it.
Donna Martin:Right. Or that's your reward. Right there. Yeah. Awesome.
Donna Martin:Thank you so much, Carolina. Okay. This is Cesar from Moreno Valley, California. Are tattoos a sin? I don't have any nor desire any.
Donna Martin:I've been taught that they are not what God wants for you, Leviticus nineteen twenty eight, but I have heard active church members and goers get new ones. And I'm thinking, I understand having them before knowing God, but actively getting a new one seems strange after getting to know the word of God.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Yeah, yeah. So I think it's important to understand the difference between preference and reverence, right? So my preference is I'm not into tattoos, I don't like needles, I don't like getting a shot, I don't like being poked prodded in any way. I cannot imagine sitting down and paying someone to poke me with a needle Over and over. For hours to have a piece of artwork on my body.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Now, you know, having said that, you know, I could see maybe doing scripture or something like that, or if I lost my wife or one of my kids, you know, I might do something like that to commemorate them, to have them always with me. So I just think, so in Leviticus, the understanding there is that people are marking them selves in devotion to other gods, and so that's the purpose of it. And we see this, right? You know, someone will get a tattoo and it Hell's Angels, or you know, they're part of a motorcycle gang, or they're a crip, or they're blood, nobody even knows what those are anymore. Right.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Was talking to a young young guy in our church was wearing a blue bandana, I was like, man, when I was a kid, that'd get you shot. Yep. And he's like, yeah, now it just means I go to the Gap. So you know, so things change, but, you know, we had a guy, you know, that, you know, had like pornographic stuff, a naked woman on his thigh and stuff like that, and he's like, man, I'm really struggling with this, and I encourage, I was like, you know, tattoo over it, because it was too big to, and too expensive to get rid of. So so I think, know, there's a guy that had it on his neck, and I actually worked with a dermatologist to help him get that removed, because he didn't have the money and it was a satanic tattoo, a satanic marking on him.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:But what I really encouraged him was, look, is a part of your testimony. Mhmm. Like, can be delivered even from what's permanently been placed in your body.
Donna Martin:Mhmm.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:And that's the goodness of God, right? The Lord loves you whether you're tatted or not. So so I just would say, as a preference, I don't like them, I have a son-in-law that has a lot of tattoos, he likes them, they have deep meaning to him. I have some health concerns, know, there's a, seems to be about a thirty three percent cancer increase in your lymph nodes if you're tatted up and they find that ink, so a lot of people don't realize, I think a lot of young people think, oh, it's fading because of the sun, that's part of it, but your body's actually eating it, they take the ink into your lymph nodes. And so I don't know what chemicals or toxins or compounds are in that ink, I'm guessing it's not great.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:It's not great for you. So for me, for health reasons, would have some concern, but I just think, you know, there are people in our church, we have a guy on staff, he is tatted like everywhere on his body, he loves it, that's his thing. Man, God bless him, I love him, I don't think the Lord cares, I think the Lord loves him, you know, that's he and his wife's thing, I think it's great, they're on staff, I don't care. You know, I just love people how they are, and man, if your face is tatted up, then I love your beautiful face Would with its I recommend it? No, but I'm also a 53 year old dude, so you know, my mom's generation when you got tattooed, you were either in the military or drunk or in prison.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:So that's what it meant back then. And my grandpa had a naked lady on his arm, so he was in Hawaii and he got a naked hula, Yeah. What do call she was topless and when he would do his his biceps, her breasts would move. Well, my grandmother would lose her mind. But, you know, and he was embarrassed by it.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Yeah. But because it was right on the sleeve, but you know, whatever. So so I I just think it's a non issue. I think you need to pray about it personally, ask the Lord if he's okay about it. The big thing that I have with young people is there's always young people that can't pay rent, they don't have money, and then they go drop a couple $100 and a day they could be working to So get a not only did it cost you money to get, you didn't work a day to get it.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:And so really, it's it's cost you twice as much as you think you And so, you know, the guy that I'm thinking of on staff, you know, they have money, they have discretionary income, he's at a place in his life where he can afford a tattoo, and that's fine, but you know, if if you don't have the money, that's not something that I would be investing in. So do have any Yeah.
Donna Martin:I went to a previous church that taught this, that tattoos were a sin, and they were dogmatic about it. Yeah. I mean, very very dogmatic about it. And I would encourage this person, Caesar, to go back and read Leviticus 19 and specifically read that verse, because the Lord, like you said Yeah. Was specifically talking to a people because of a culture that they were in where they were getting I'm pretty sure this verse says, as unto the dead or unto idols.
Donna Martin:And so they're tattooing dead relatives. It's it was a type of idol worship. If you get Jesus loves me, that is not idol worship. And so and then there's other things in Leviticus 19, like, you know, don't wear cotton or mixed blends. You know?
Donna Martin:You can't wear polyester and all of those things. And so I think you just like pastor Matt said, take it to the Lord in prayer. If you have a conviction and it's not your preference, then that's one thing. But to call it sin, I would I would disagree
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:with that. Yeah. And it's not mentioned at all in the New Testament. At all. So Yeah.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:The apostle
Donna Martin:Paul I mean, except Jesus has you tattooed on his thigh.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Yeah. Well, that's that's a that's a revelation. I forgot that. I can't believe I forgot that. Yeah.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:So in Revelations, it does seem like the Lord Jesus has a tattoo on his thigh. So, you know, so but it's pretty hardcore because it's tatted in blood.
Donna Martin:Yeah. It's totally.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:But yeah, it's not it's not mentioned at all. And as the church is expanding and growing in Corinth, they're going to encounter cultures where tattooing is a part of everyday life. And for Paul, was just a non issue.
Donna Martin:Yeah.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:And I would say the exception would be unless it was in dedication to a false god Yeah. Or a demon.
Donna Martin:Or demon.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Or something else or some kind of, you know, commitment to something that would subjugate you to that. And then Paul would say, know, that's why, you know, gang tattoos I think are are problematic because it's a subjection. You're subjecting yourself to their rule and reign, and I and I have a problem with that, you know, or some kind of satanic tattoo or something like that, you know.
Donna Martin:Yeah. I agree. Yeah.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Alright. Great question, Cesar.
Donna Martin:Great question. Thank you so much. Okay. This is Laura from Riverside, California. My husband and I have been married for thirty six years.
Donna Martin:We enjoy getting away together and driving to Vegas to play poker. I have read the Bible in full a few times and continue to read it every morning and do not recall reading anything that specifically addresses gambling, but I've heard people say it's a sin. Please advise, is gambling a sin if done in moderation? Thank you for Sandals Church. I have learned so much and am blessed to be there each week for several years now.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Yeah. So I don't think that gambling is a sin. I think the intoxication and addiction to the potential of making income quickly is. And so the Bible repeatedly talks about, you know, don't make money too quickly, don't become You a know, Paul writes to Timothy that some people have pierced themselves as they've fallen in love with money and wealth. So those are the real issues.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:So why has the church historically been against gambling? And it's because of what occurred. So, you know, in the West, you know, we're all here in California, right, you would go to a bar, you would drink, there were prostitutes, and you would gamble your money away. So, you know, that's kind of why the church said, hey, those things that occur in a saloon are not godly. And I would say, yes.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Like, that's Right. There's nothing godly happening in the saloon. And so, know, a lot of the church, those ideas, but there's also been wives, know, you think about, you know, in the nineteen forties, fifties, twenties, your husband goes goes to Vegas or whatever and gambles away all your money and now you can't feed your kids, you can't clothe your kids. And there are people that get intoxicated with that. It's funny, know, I went to the casino that's in San Bernardino, what is it?
Donna Martin:San Manuel.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:San Manuel. And the former tribe leader was walking through and I said, do you gamble? And he's like, no, we just own it. You know, he's like, no. And so, you know, it's it's done really well for them because people lose more than they make.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Yeah. So they don't big, they don't
Donna Martin:And he gives the central structure.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Yeah, he gives, no, he's great. He's a family. He's very generous, he's a very, very good guy. He's awesome. But so here's what I would say is, if it's recreational and it's not addictive and you're not putting your family in any kind of financial harm, fine.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Go play. For me, I got all into playing poker and I loved it, and it brought out an unhealthy competitiveness in me. And I couldn't walk away when I lose. It bothered me. I would what's the word when you get stuck on something?
Donna Martin:Hyper fixation.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Yeah, I would hyper fixate on it. Rumination. I would ruminate, there's the word I was thinking about, about how I would have played it different, it became very very all encompassing for me and it wasn't fun. Mhmm. So, but the same thing is true with sports.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Like sports became this issue for me where I would ruminate on the loss and I wouldn't be okay and I my my daughter's sitting in here, I would make her cry when she was little because I would yell at the TV, know, because she never heard me yell. But I was screaming at the TV and I go, I'm going, okay, this is a problem. So I think if it's something that you really enjoy and you don't care, you've set aside this money, you don't care if you win or you lose, here's what I encourage you to do, donate your winnings to charity and just say, that way you're really not involved. You say, look, here's our $100, here's our $200, whatever we win, we're gonna donate what's your guys' charity? The Joy Company.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Yeah. We're gonna donate all all of this money to the Joy Company. We're gonna donate all of our winnings to send in someone in our small group who can't afford a vacation, they're gonna go on vacation. Because then you're not in it to win it. And I I think that's where Satan can really get his fingers in there.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:And then you're then you're truly just enjoying it. Mhmm. Like, you know, the competition or whatever. And so, you know, I got into it. Online poker was a big thing and I was, you know, I was was pretty good at it and then, you know, it is gambling and so then you lose and I was like, okay.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:I learned my lesson. So I don't think there's anything wrong with it as long as you've checked your heart.
Donna Martin:Mhmm.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Why am I doing this? So if it's just fun, and that's why I say donate the winnings, it's no different than golf if you're spending a $100 to play golf or you're, you know, spending money on a boat or a cruise or whatever, I think that's fantastic. But the way you can check yourself
Donna Martin:Mhmm.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Is if we win, what do we do with the money? Mhmm. So because then it's just fun. And I think that's really really cool. And what a great thing to say, oh, I won this money and kids in San Bernardino get to go on a field trip.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Right. Then that's great. You know, and if I lose it, man, it's great. We had fun, and I'm getting better at it. Yeah.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:And I've enjoyed the strategy and the camaraderie. I don't like the smoking.
Donna Martin:Was gonna say the environment is I don't like losing money, there's I the first get angry at the machines, and I'm like, I'm not doing this anymore, you know. Yeah. And then I would just say, like you were saying in your first point, the environment that it's in. So if it's in an environment where there's so much smoke and there's like Yeah. All this weird stuff going on, then you just have
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:to go The cement wall is nice. It is so Like, I could not, you guys, I could not believe
Donna Martin:It is so how
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:nice it was. Nice. Had we had a, like, the most incredible steak meal. Yeah. We went and we saw Andrea Bocelli, I cried, and I was like, oh my gosh, we need to go here more often.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Because my my vision of casinos are like the nineties, and you Yes. Smell like your smoker grandma, you know? And I was just
Donna Martin:And there's like a cloud of haze and
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:the Yeah. Was just so Seven was so nice. Really nice. I couldn't believe it. So I think if it's fun and you're not losing money, you can't afford not to lose.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:And then if you're gonna win money, do something for God. Yeah. Do something great. Don't spend it on yourself because here's the thing, if you have money to gamble, the Lord's already blessed you.
Donna Martin:Yeah, absolutely. And there
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:are people in our church that don't have money to eat. They don't have money for their kids to have to have clothes. They don't have money. And so that that just for me is, man, Lord, you know, I went and spoke at the dream center.
Donna Martin:I saw I
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:heard. And you know, Matthew Barnett wanted to pay me, and I'm like, how on earth am I gonna stand before God and get paid by the dream center after I walk through and I'm seeing these, you know, this girl shares her testimony, she's like, my dad started having sex with me when I was nine, I'm like, I am, Madison knows, I'm a crier. I'm watching The Golden Bachelor, I cry every episode. Yeah. Because all of their
Donna Martin:spouses My husband says too.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:All of their spouses are so
Donna Martin:mom's like, I can't watch this, it makes me sad.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:So you know, I'm hearing these stories, I'm hearing this heartache and you know, and so Matthew is so great, he just he's this is what he said, he said, why don't you take the honorarium this time and then next time you can donate it? And I was like, okay, fine. But because I was like, Lord, this feels like guilt money, like I'm like, I don't want this. And and and you need to hear me. I make my living as you do Yeah.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Speaking. Right.
Donna Martin:I
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:get paid to do this, but if I could work at Sandals for free, I would do it. I love the church. I love being here. I love seeing what God does. So take those winnings and and I don't think the Lord will bless you anymore with your win win I don't know what God will do, but just say, Lord, if we win it, let's let's let's count to something good and make a difference.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:And by the way, that's what the owner of Yama Va does is he's the most generous to Sandals Church. I know he's generous to you. Anything that San Bernardino needs is because he knows he's been given an opportunity and we were watching, oh gosh, we were watching this terrible show, The Perfect Couple, did you guys watch it? No. My wife made me watch it, it's awesome.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:And I just watched them and I thought, I'm so glad we're not rich. Because they just don't care. Like, you know, like, think about it. When you're truly wealthy, nothing's novel, nothing's like and that's why I think you, like P Diddy, you just get weird. Mhmm.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:You just fall in love with weird things. Mhmm. Because, you know, like, I mean, the joy of like your daughter working for that
Donna Martin:thing
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:like But this when you're a billionaire, why?
Donna Martin:Why? Yeah.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:I get a trust fund, you know, and so it robs it from me. So I don't think it's a sin, I think I'm not a big Vegas guy, some people are,
Donna Martin:Mhmm.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:You know, but I would just say enjoy it. The Bible says whatever you do, do unto the Lord. So have a good time, be a good sport, congratulate people, know, sometimes at the poker tables, people, you know, banter and you know, they're mean and cruel. You know, be encouraging, be alight, have joy, win or lose, have joy. And I would say that's great that you and your husband have something that you enjoy, and I think that's fantastic.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Yeah. But again, the addiction of gambling is what I mean, when when I was walking through at YamaVa, they have signs everywhere, if you have a problem, call this number. Yeah. Some people have a problem,
Donna Martin:and And they can't
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:unlike you, I don't like losing money.
Donna Martin:I don't like losing I had a friend who grew up with a mom who was a gambler, and she would leave them for days, sometimes weeks at a time Yeah. Gambling all their money away. So she raised her brothers and sisters because of this. And so, obviously, that's where it gets a little scary. Yeah.
Donna Martin:But, yeah, I don't like losing money, I think it's preference and reverence, I think that was really good
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Yeah.
Donna Martin:Even for this.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Should've used that from this one. So I'm just I here's what I love hearing.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:We've been married thirty six years and we have
Donna Martin:something Yeah. We really enjoy
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:doing together, and I think that's great. And I'm really, really glad that you're still friends. Yeah. And and again, just don't just don't let the money bug get you, because it gets some people and Mhmm. You know you know, he was telling me that they have to banish some people from casino because they have a problem.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Yeah. And they just know, look, this is not
Donna Martin:you. Yeah. This is not good. Yeah. Well, thank you so much, Laura, for that question.
Donna Martin:That was awesome. Thank you, pastor Matt. Well, thank you all for listening. If you like this pod podcast, please share with someone. Comment, subscribe, like it, and also send us questions.
Donna Martin:We'd love to hear from you. Yeah. You can also if this is blessing you, think about giving to this podcast. If you're gambling and you're winning, give to the Right?
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Is for the bebe, baby.
Donna Martin:You can show your support by giving. Go to sandalschurch.com/support, and we'll see you next time. Thanks. Bye, guys. Bye.
Scott Schutte:Thanks for checking out this episode. If you'd like to support this podcast, you can donate at sandalschurch.com/support. This podcast is a way for pastor Matt Brown to answer your questions about topics like the Bible, God, relationships, and culture. Like pastor Matt often says on the show, a podcast is not a pastor. If you'd like prayer or need to speak with someone about a specific situation you were going through, you can email us at help@sandalschurch.com.
Scott Schutte:If you enjoy this podcast, please like, comment, and subscribe. Thanks for being a debrief listener.