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Discover The Humanity of Homelessness, a podcast from Church at the Park that brings you honest, heartfelt conversations with people experiencing homelessness, community leaders, and staff.
John Marshall | 00:04
You just described A lot. Of infrastructure and services. How do you start to encourage someone who listens to what you just described and go, Holy cow, that's so much. That requires so much funding.
Yeah. That almost feels so impossible of a task. To even be worth it in the first place. Why? Don't we just focus on our own selves? What to you is the value of a community investing in.
Megan Perez | 00:37
All of that? Yeah, I think that as a community member, volunteering is very important because you being able and willing to volunteer is freeing for the providers who are actually able to do the work.
So if you're able to volunteer you know, provide services to an organization, then that can free up the case manager to go and offer these wraparound services. We as a community have to come together to support one another. And like you had said earlier, you know, a lot of our grants are very, they're written very to a point, right?
Like they...
John Marshall | 01:20
There's an objective, there's an outcome that's.
Megan Perez | 01:22
Desired. Yeah. It's the point of the grant.
Yeah, they box us in. And so when we have individuals who willing to volunteer and to give us our time, that actually gives us a lot of leeway into what we can provide.
So when we have organizations that come together so we have a peer support and we have a case manager that's already taken care of you know two of the wraparound services and then you have a cco like pacific source who's able to do transportation there you go there's three of those wraparound supports so while it might feel like an exhaustive list it's actually not so big.
Monica Fiedler | 02:02
Hi, this is Monica. I'm a chaplain with Church of the Park. Thank you for tuning in for this episode of The Humanity of Homelessness, a podcast from Church of the Park in Salem, Oregon. Since 2007, we have created a community with our neighbors living outside. Today, we get to offer collaborative navigation, emergency sheltering, workforce development, and supported housing for our neighbors in need. In each episode, we hear from a member of our community who has or is experiencing homelessness. We invite them to share their own story in their own words so that they and we might remember their goodness, their courage, and their humanity. We hope you enjoy the conversation.
John Marshall | 02:51
Hey everyone, it's Jon. I'm so grateful you joined us for another episode of the humanity of homelessness. My guest today is my good friend, Megan Perez. I met Megan in 2021 when we hired her and about 60 others as staff for our very first managed camping experiment at the Oregon State Fairgrounds Pavilion. I had the privilege to see Megan's work both as a colleague during her time with Church at the Park and as she's gone on to lead other projects in the area. And one thing I've noticed to be consistent about her is that she has a deep and natural intuition about the systems of care in the world, as well intentioned as they may be. But whether their designs actually elevate the humanity of our most vulnerable or unintentionally make the journey of stability more challenging for those who are seeking and trusting the mechanisms of aid. In other words, I think Megan is wise. And she adds humanizing insight to our collective project to make the world better and make the world work better for those who really need it. I'm grateful she said yes to being a guest on our podcast, and I hope you enjoy our conversation. Thanks for being with us. I always start interviews the same way, which is to ask the interviewee, "Where's the first place you called home?" to hear about what childhood was like, the good and the bad.
So. You want to start there? Sure. Just share where you grew up, where was home, what was family life like? What do you remember as being good and positive and hard and challenging about being a.
Megan Perez | 04:24
Kid? Yeah, absolutely.
So originally born Los Angeles, California... I, So Los Angeles is kind of, you know, it's one of those places where it's a huge county.
So saying Los Angeles, like people like to think of it as just like the downtown area. But, you know, I was actually born in Los Angeles.
You know, I wasn't necessarily born in the city area. I was born in Mission Hills. Which if you ask me to point that out on the map, I have no idea where that is.
You know, I was raised in Hawthorne, California. So that is southern California. California area, about 15 minutes from the beach. But it's not like the nicest neighborhood, I would say. I bounced between there and Torrance, California, between my grandma's house and my mom and dad when they were together.
And then my mom and her boyfriend, they stayed in the Torrance area. Yeah. I like to think of my grandma's house as really my home and the hub because that's the only like staple home. And that was in Hawthorne.
So I spent my first 16 years of my life in Hawthorne. California, in that area, Hawthorne. Good parts of my childhood. I have a really solid foundation when it comes to my grandma. My aunt was, you know, really raised with my cousins. I consider them as my siblings.
And then my brother. We're five years apart, but we've always been very close. And so just thanks to my grandma, she's always had a really good job and always been kind. Stable in my life. And so because of her, I was able to have like a lot of really great experiences.
So, you know, every time she would go on vacation, she would always make sure to include my brother and myself. My mom was always extremely poor. And so, You know, a lot of my childhood memories, you know, my dad, he had an affair when I was like five.
So right when my brother was born. And so he abandoned our family. And so there wasn't really a lot of relationship there. And my mom was in and out of different relationships. And there wasn't really a lot of stability. She did the best that she could with what she had, but not a lot of stability, not a lot of money and so she ended up moving in with Her boyfriend, and I remember she lived in, honestly, it was like a shack.
You know, it was this hand-built house where I think if a building inspector actually came through, they wouldn't even qualify it as a home. We didn't have hot water in that house.
So I remember like if I wanted to take a shower there, I'd have to take a really quick freezing cold shower. How this point, I was nine.
John Marshall | 07:46
Old were you at this point? At And did you realize as a nine year old that like this wasn't made for human habitation?
So you were aware.
Megan Perez | 07:55
Yes. Yeah. There was a lot of domestic violence at this time.
And then my mom got pregnant with my other brother. So at this point, we're going to be nine years difference. And so she's pregnant and I'm seeing the domestic violence. And the violence actually started with me.
So her boyfriend started being extremely violent toward me. And so because of the conflict, I would stay with my grandma as much as I could. But, you know, she worked full time. And so... I needed to go to school. I needed to have parental supervision. And so because of this, I would have to go and stay with my mom.
And then there was this other component of when I was home with my mom... He wouldn't be as violent and he wouldn't hit her as often.
So I had this responsibility as a nine and ten-year-old of, you know, if I'm home, then my young brother doesn't have to see as much violence. My mom doesn't have to get hit as much. And I kind of act as a shield for them.
So I kind of started bearing this weight. And my middle school years were I was kind of in and out of school. I tried doing homeschooling, but realistically that was not I wasn't actually present in homeschooling. I just said I was homeschooling.
So I'm kind of in and out of school already in middle school. And then we hit high school at this point. My mom, so I'll say I was 14. My mom has had two other children.
So now I have two brothers and a younger sister. And the violence has just really amped up.
I mean, we're... Having the cops at our house constantly. There's drug use all the time. I'm aware that my mom's boyfriend's an addict. And I'm aware that he has no problem drinking. Hitting me pushing you. And just being completely violent with my mom. I'm aware that by going to school and by hanging out with my friends, It puts my mom at risk. And every single time I go to school or go stay with my grandmom, There is...
Something that happens where my grandma's called and we're having to rush over to my mom's house because he has attempted to kill her. And these incidents just become greater. And so it gets to the point where I am almost 15 and I have to choose every time a friend calls to go to the movies or to hang out. I have to decide if it's worth it to leave my mom, And risk not being able to see her again.
Yeah. You know, something that my brother who's five years younger and I talk about around the holidays. And, you know, and so... We laugh about it now. It's not funny, but it's just our way of coping, I think, is that, you know, one of the years around Christmas, my brother was trying to, you know... Ate himself trying to detour my mom's boyfriend from choking her.
So he rushes in the room to try to get him off of her. And he actually threw him into the Christmas tree. And it's something that we kind of laugh about now. But realistically, it's just it's so horrific, you know, but I think that that's just a way that I even see people The population that we serve kind of use that same humor is kind of like it's... It's a survival. Exactly. It's like it's so unbelievable that but sometimes you just have to make it into like, wow.
John Marshall | 11:59
You... Use the language of coping. As you introduced that story. And as I'm listening, you describe growing up I The phrase that comes into my brain is like emotional whiplash to be... Constantly moving between... Incredibly destabilizing and violent environments to the stability of grandma and aunt and cousins to be both in school but not present because your brain is thinking about what is happening at home, to be home, and then be thinking of where else could I be but here, to be a nine-year-old and have... This. Awareness that your life, is not what it should be to be growing up as a kid and be forced to almost parent your own parent. And so I'm really curious how you coped as an adolescent human being, In the midst of... All of that.
I mean, what, how did you even, how did you survive?
Megan Perez | 13:19
Yeah, you know, I think that I... Dealt with a lot of anxiety, a lot of fear. I... I think that what really... Pushed me through was knowing that I almost had this sense of responsibility for, keeping my mom and my siblings alive.
So it almost felt as though that burden transferred from my mom to myself. And I felt like if it wasn't for me, who else was going to do it?
So, I feel as though, you know, this is another reason why I wasn't able to actually graduate high school was because, you know, that sense of responsibility and like if it's... And my mom placed that burden on me of like, if you're not here... Who's going to take care of it? Who's going to take care of the responsibility of the financial burden? Who's going to be here?
So Yeah, exactly.
John Marshall | 14:25
There's a necessity to reality that just requires you to step up.
Megan Perez | 14:30
And you kind of do it.
John Marshall | 14:32
You... Inevitably, then... Have to grow up faster. Yeah. I'm curious if you have been able to process that. I don't know if it's to call it a psychological journey or what, but like, I'm just so curious if you are able to look back at that necessity to grow it fast, And if you look at your life today, Can you trace lines of impact to the way that you inhabit the world today?
Megan Perez | 15:07
Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. And I think that the older I get, the more I'm able to embrace some more childlike tendencies because I feel safer in my adulthood.
And then the way that I... The work and the way that I'm able to give back I think allows me some safety in that.
So I think that it took me a very long time to feel safe enough to kind of let that guard down. Because I was required to be responsible at such a young age and it's taken me a long time to really break down those barriers.
John Marshall | 15:54
So you mentioned not being able to graduate. Yeah. What's the transition from late adolescence into early adulthood? What was life like in that season and period?
Megan Perez | 16:06
Yeah. So at 15, just about 16 years old, we actually were able to grab the clothes on our back, hop on a train and move from Los Angeles here to Salem, Oregon. It was me, my mom, and then my siblings.
So my two younger brothers and my, sorry, my three younger brothers and my younger sister. And then we stayed at the Center for Hope and Safety safe house. And that was kind of our first transition into Oregon.
John Marshall | 16:42
When you hopped on the train, did you know you were coming for Center for Hope and Safety? Did you know you were coming to say, like, was it just let's get out of Los Angeles? Or was there an endpoint destination that you had settled on?
Megan Perez | 16:53
Yeah, so it was kind of... It was kind of in between. We were kind of balancing between either... My mom had actually told me, because I was completely opposed to the idea.
Like, my entire life was in California. And so my mom had kind of said, if you don't come with me, I'm moving to Vegas, and I will do this on my own, which I knew that she couldn't. And so the responsibility was placed on me that if she were to move to Oregon... There was a place that was willing to take us and to keep us safe.
So I didn't necessarily know that what that would look like. So I knew that there was a place that was going to keep us safe, but I didn't know the details of it, which I will admit I was extremely frustrated when I got here. We were placed in a safe house, which was a single room with bunk beds.
And then me and my brother slept in the closet on a twin size mattress, you know, foot to head. And so and that was in a small room. Closet space. And so, you know, as a 16-year-old, I'm frustrated. I just left my entire support system behind. I just left all of my friends, everything behind. And so, yeah. It was extremely destabilizing for me. I had nobody, and my mom at this point was an alcoholic, and so I felt like I was really Holding everything together. And, you know, as a 16 year old, that was it was so much to deal with.
John Marshall | 18:30
Did you have any sense of hope that this would lead to stability or was it just like we got out of Dodge? We're out of Los Angeles. Who knows what's next?
Megan Perez | 18:45
Yeah, my hope was that I was going to stabilize my family here. And then within a three-month time span, I would move back down to California with my grandma. But I needed to make sure that, you know, my mom and my siblings were stable here. And because of Center for Hope and Safety, we were able to get like a housing voucher and we were able to kind of get into placement.
And then I did. I did go back to California for... For a brief time.
John Marshall | 19:15
How long was it within the three months that you had planned.
Megan Perez | 19:18
For? It wasn't. Okay.
Yeah. I assumed.
Yeah. I was actually able to get my GED.
So I was able to do that. And then so it was about six months.
So not too far off. So about six-ish months.
And then I went back down to California. And then I decided that I wanted to come back here and support my family and see what all Oregon had to offer.
John Marshall | 19:50
How old were you at that.
Megan Perez | 19:51
Point? I was just shy of turning 17. Okay. At that point.
John Marshall | 20:00
Had your family moved into stable housing at that point? Were they still...
Megan Perez | 20:04
Yeah. We had a little house that was two bedrooms. But yeah, it was definitely, you know, more than what we had. And we were on a public housing list at that point. And so we were coming up on the top.
So we were, you know... Working toward that stability again. At this point, my mom was still, you know, in her alcohol addiction.
So, you know, that was another reason why I wanted to come back to support my siblings because they still felt that sense of responsibility. Yeah.
John Marshall | 20:43
- So you're 17 when you moved back? Yes. Are you in Salem for good at that point, or is there... More travel and.
Megan Perez | 20:52
Relocation.
You know, I learned that... This is actually where I learned that even though my brother, I believe he was 12 at this time, maybe 13, something along those lines. I found out that even though we were considered unsheltered, he wasn't going to be able to move into the same shelters as us because he was male. And so this was something that I've held in the back of my head now as an adult in the service provider industry. And So we... At this point, end up moving into a very small one-bedroom apartment until my mom's able to, you know, really stabilize again.
And then by the time I am 22, I move back down to Santa Monica, California, and I start working at a hospital down there for, I want to say, a year before I officially move back up to Oregon and then up here for good. Okay.
John Marshall | 22:11
Once you're up here for good. Is that the checkpoint where stability finally hits?
Megan Perez | 22:17
Yeah. I'd say that's when it really started kind of going up. My grandma actually purchased a house for us to live in.
So I moved back in with my mom and I'm able to find employment and then I'm able to move out on my own. And so I'm able to actually be stable and not have to transition so often.
John Marshall | 22:44
You said you were 22.
Megan Perez | 22:46
Yeah. So about 23 is when it actually started to even out.
John Marshall | 22:50
Yeah. Do you remember what year that was?
Megan Perez | 22:53
20... Okay.
John Marshall | 22:56
- And then... I think we met when you joined Church of the Park in 2021. Yep. What's important Because I... I really want to move the conversation to like what you've learned on the other side of the helping dynamic.
Yeah. But what's important in that six to seven year process? Period that helps you make sense of your own self? What are the additional pieces that can inform your entry into homeless services?
Megan Perez | 23:29
Yeah. I think it's really funny, actually, because so I actually was a youth pastor for several years.
So 2015, 2016, I became a youth pastor because of, you know, my own experience with my own adolescence and how that just played out. I just really had a passion for working with youth and helping youth. That ended up not being the right path for me.
And then from that point on, you know, I went into the health industry. I went into the insurance industry. And I could never quite find something that I was passionate for and that really fit for me. But I never...
Thought that homeless services would be what fit for me. You know, I think it's because I didn't realize that I had ever been homeless. And something I think that's really important is prior to hopping on the train, we were living in parks. You know, part of that was, my mom and I taking turns, in a park in Los Angeles, ensuring that, you know, when one of us were sleeping in a two-door car, you know, the other one was standing outside and making sure that nobody was messing with us, you know, and staying in hotels when we could. And, you know, we were unsheltered. And I think that I didn't come to terms with that fact. And so for me, I... Didn't think that my passion was working in homeless services.
So I knew that I wanted to work with youth and I knew that another passion that I had was working with survivors of domestic violence. But I was a high school dropout, so I didn't think that path was even open for me. And, you know, getting into what led me to Church of the Park, was truly seeing, a post for, looking for help for, a pilot project. And I was like, okay, like maybe I can do it, you know? And so applying for that and then, Then I find out that I'm going to be a host at the pavilion for Church of the Park.
John Marshall | 26:04
So pause for just a moment because I want to make sure that people know what it is that you're about to describe. Sure, yeah.
So in 2021, after... 12 years of Church of the Park being this really small grassroots volunteer-led organization, the city of Salem comes to us and asks if we would Pilot this. Project called Managed Camping.
So between January and March of 2021, we hosted up to, I think, 75 individuals inside tents at the Oregon State Pavilion building, and then another 20 vehicles out in the parking lot. We went from a team of five of us to 60 in the span of three weeks. Do you remember, were you the Part of that first round of- Yes, I was. Okay.
Yeah. So you were there- And you were in like the icebox training sessions where there was no heat in the building. Yes. We were... Trying to build the bike as we were riding it. Yep.
So you were hired... Well.
Megan Perez | 27:13
No. I was hired to be a volunteer coordinator. Copy that.
Yeah. But so what happened was I was hired to be a volunteer coordinator and I'm like, OK, I can do this show up at the pavilion.
And then we did this fun like reveal where everybody's jobs were revealed on post-it notes like giant fascinating. Yeah.
You know. Totally brand new to the to everything it's fine and i'm like what's a host and they're like well you're gonna be like down like you know in the pavilion you're gonna be like down there and i was like i cannot do this like there's no way that i can do this i'm not going to be able to interact with those people literally my mindset And I'm just like trying to I remember I literally went up to DJ and I said, is there any way that I could work at your woman's shelter? And he was like, I just want you to give it a chance. And I was like, OK, yeah, definitely.
Totally. And the whole time I'm like, I'm going to last, you know, a week here. This isn't going to work.
You know, and as we're training and as we're going through the outward mindset training, the more I'm like, wait, like this actually is fitting what I'm under, like what I've gone through in my life. Maybe I can give this a chance. Day before... We open. I am down. They're taping off sections. We're building tents. I'd never built a tent before.
So I'm just, you know, saying like, hey, can somebody help me? I've never set up a tent in my life. I don't know what to do.
And then I remember first day, you know, individuals are coming in and I have the opportunity to speak to people. And I remember the first conversations that I have with these individuals and thinking, my gosh, like, wow. These are people that I've known my entire life. These are the support systems that my mom has always had around me. And for so long, I've othered these individuals when realistically, these have always been my neighbors and the people that have been there when my mom's like, I'm going to go to the store or I'm, you know, unable to. Take your siblings to school. And I remember it was in those moments that I was like, I can never do anything else in my life. And it was within that first hour that it kind of washed over me. There's this epiphany. It was, yeah. I found my spot. Yep. And I was like, there's nothing else for me. And it was so beautiful. Truly.
John Marshall | 30:06
I wasn't fully aware that was your experience and your journey into our community. Yeah. I'm so glad to know it now. The part that I do feel aware of is... Your time with Church of the Park, I think included how many different job titles?
Megan Perez | 30:25
I think like every single one.
John Marshall | 30:27
Right. Which... You could probably ask any one of us on staff and we could say the same thing. It's just the reality of Yeah.
Yeah. Were there any.
Megan Perez | 30:46
Highlights? Yeah, absolutely. I think that every single role had its own beauty to it.
So I was a host for maybe a week. And then from that point, I went into the shift lead role.
Yeah. Which, you know, with that, I was responsible for like if any, you know, police or EMS shows up on site, like I'm the point person.
And then just being there as a support for, you know, the host and staff. And security and whoever else.
John Marshall | 31:20
Yeah. Shift supervisor. Exactly. Making sure everything runs well.
Megan Perez | 31:23
And then at this point, you know, we find out that we're going to be funded for our village of hope. You know, it didn't even have a name at this point, but we find out that we're going to be funded for it. Moving over there.
Yeah. I, you know, had taken an interest in case management, never did it before, but I really had an interest in it. And so was moved over to the Turner Road Day Center location at that time. And that's where you and I got to work together. And I was the case manager slash site leader assistant manager over there. I say that the biggest highlight there was really my introduction into case management and being able to really intentionally work with the clients.
So many of them would come to me and tell me like, you saved my life still to this day. You saved my life. And it would be something just as simple as helping them renew their food stamps. And it's like to them, that is so life saving. And, you know, I have. I have a gentleman that still to this day, every Thanksgiving, he'll reach out to me and tell me how much I impacted and saved his life. And that's because I asked the question if he was a veteran and he was able to get housing and he's still in housing. And, I appreciate him so much. He's such a lovely guy. And so just being able to, you know, intentionally know them.
And then getting the aspect of just like being on that site where, you know, every person there, like, it truly was, like, crisis response. And... Just getting to know the people there and reacting to that and really taking time intentionally as you're aware, you know, I think there was so much beauty in that.
John Marshall | 33:22
You.
Megan Perez | 33:29
And then from there, I was the navigation services assistant manager, which is, you know, just fancy words for I was the assistant manager of the case managers at all of our sites. And, you know, I think that the beauty in that was really just being able to, one, work intentionally with our case management team.
You know, some of our case managers had been case managing a lot longer than I have. And then some were new and I got to really instill knowledge into them and let them learn how to really do person centered and person first case management, which is so vital to the community that we serve.
And then on top of that, I got to sit in meetings and anytime leadership would say, well, what's going on with, you know, pod, whatever at this site, I would be able to rattle off what's going on with them. So, you know, just being able to really know what was going on with our clients.
So I think that was the beauty in that.
John Marshall | 34:30
Yeah. I think that's often the challenge of social services work, and in my experience, work that can be so heavily directed by grants and grant outcomes. It can be easy to become so results and programmatically focused. And what I hear in your description is this position within the ecosystem that allowed you to sit in the in-between and to still maintain relationship and, a proximity to the human beings we were serving that actually allowed you to respond in relevant and appropriate and actually helpful ways to know a reality that wasn't just what is it that I need to get done as a staff member. But then to sit in the places where your own awareness of the system, so to speak, has probably expanded, deepened. And I imagine that gave you insight and wisdom for the stops after Church of the Park.
Yeah. So first, what are the places that you've served after Church of the Park up to today?
Megan Perez | 35:35
Yeah. So from Church of the Park, I actually was able to go to Yamhill Community Action Partnerships, which is located in Yamhill County. They had never had a program manager over their turnkey project, and so I was their first one there. And that is a turnkey project is essentially it's a hotel or a motel that is turned into an emergency shelter. And so they had a Motel 6 located in McMinnville and that we turned into a sheltering location.
So I got to oversee that program. You know, from there, I was able to really implement policy procedure and, you know, really work with them on positive outcomes. And, you know, the cool thing about McMinnville and their housing authority over there and that program specifically was that all of their participants had a housing voucher. And so that was something that I wasn't used to because, you know, working here in Salem, it was near impossible to get a housing voucher for a Going to that program and working with those individuals and seeing, hey, like most of these individuals have, you know, of housing vouchers, then my, focus turned into, okay, how do I, how do I work with my case management team on really working toward those positive outcomes and getting them into their own stable home? But, you know, that is, I think that what's really important to say is that a housing voucher and a Moving somebody into an apartment or a house isn't always the outcome that they're looking for. Right. And that's really important. I think that when we're working with individuals in a case management lens, a lot of times we think, we need to move them into a house. That's a housing first approach. But that's not technically true.
Some of these individuals, they were elderly and they needed a foster home. They needed a care facility. I had an individual who had end-stage cancer and she needed help. Hospice care. And so I think that those cases are very important. Did they have a voucher? Yes. But was there a positive outcome to place them into housing? No. And so I think that those success stories are very important. And I think that a lot of times the public and news articles look at positive placements and the data and they say, okay, well, where did they go? Did they go into housing? But we don't look at those nuances and that's really important. And so...
You know, I had a couple stories like that where I really worked with the case manager to work with Northwest Senior and Disability Services and get them connected to the right levels of care and ensure true wraparound services. Because, you know, when we're looking at a housing first model, we're not just looking at housing. Moving an individual into their own placement, we're looking at the care that comes with that. Because especially if we're working with a chronically homeless individual, what supports are going to be in place for this individual after they move into their own place? Because You know, if they're utilizing our services, they have access to case management, they have access to medical care, they have access to transportation most of these times. And so once they get into their own place, they lose that sense of community, they lose access to these things. And that's why we oftentimes see these individuals recirculating the system.
So they may exit and then come back again. So that's kind of what I did there.
And then from there. You know, I was there for a short period because I had the opportunity to go over to Mid-Willamette Valley Community Action Agency. They had received the YHDP, which is the Youth Homelessness Demonstration Program, grant to start a transitional youth program.
And then on top of that, a youth and young adult rural folk outreach program. And so both of these programs were located in Monmouth. And I got to be the program manager for both of these and really got to be the developer of these programs.
You know, starting with knocking on the doors of the neighbors who had been living in their homes for, I mean, decades. 20 plus years and saying, hey, like, this is what we're going to this is what we're going to do here. We're going to host 14 to 18 year olds in this home. This is going to be their home all the way to writing the first words on paper for policy and procedure and allowing the first youth to walk into that home.
So I did that for the last two and a half years.
John Marshall | 41:13
What sticks out in your brain? As particular highlights and essential lessons that you learned specifically because you were serving 14 to 18 year.
Megan Perez | 41:25
Olds who okay you know what i would say transparency Youth can sniff that out.
John Marshall | 41:38
There's a high BS.
Megan Perez | 41:39
Meter. My gosh.
Yeah. And so I'd say that, you know, working with adults. I have a tendency to really lower my voice and put on a lot of that, okay, and how's that doing? You cannot do that with youth. They will, first of all, make fun of you. And you have to have... There's no masking.
Yeah, no, there's no way. And so just really, you know, learning how to communicate in a very honest way. And so for the last few years, just really learning how to... Almost over-communicate what I can. And as a program manager, obviously I have to have you know, some there's some level of confidentiality, right?
Like, there's always going to be some things that I can't share. But being honest and open about that, because the one thing when it comes to youth is that if I'm just coming to them and being like, well, it is what it is, then they're going to say, nope, that's not good enough for me.
John Marshall | 42:41
Kiss As you name that program as specifically transitional housing. Did you notice... Any more ease or challenge connecting 14 to 18 year olds with long-term.
Megan Perez | 42:58
Housing? Yeah. I would say... A little bit of both. And reason being...
You know, that. It's very difficult. They don't have a rental history, which can...
You know, work in their favor because they don't have the barriers going into like, you know, they have evictions, they have a poor credit score, but they don't have any credit score or they don't have any of these things. And then you run into the situation where you have a 17-year-old who's already graduated and they're ready to go.
You know, they have a job, but they're 17. And so then they don't have a place that's willing to rent to them. And so you run into situations unique barriers because you have youth who are Really, like they've been self-sufficient for a long time. They're ready to go. But then you have, you know, these barriers of like, well, they are still minors.
So... There isn't a place for them to go.
And then on top of that, if, you know, my house is full. Where do they go?
You know, so it's just, it's a really unique Yeah.
John Marshall | 44:18
It's meeting or it's filling a gap within the system and exposing ways in which the system isn't nuanced enough to actually work. Exactly. Meet the human need that's present in the world. On that point, you made a comment a few minutes ago kind of comparing and contrasting the capacity of the system in a context like Salem with... A rural system, and you said it's almost impossible to get a voucher in Salem, and that stands in contrast to your experience at YCAP where almost everyone had a voucher. I can imagine someone listening to the conversation going, But wait, why is it impossible in Salem? My assumption from my place in our ecosystem is just it's because there's so many people here.
Yeah. And the infrastructure of care and education. Companionship for someone who's housing insecure to navigate all of the hoops and jumps like that infrastructure for help and companionship doesn't meet the amount of need that exists in Salem. Exactly. Would you add anything to that assessment about why it's so impossible or so hard to get housing vouchers in.
Megan Perez | 45:27
Salem. Yeah.
I mean, I agree with that. I think that a lot of times, you know, there just isn't enough to go around. And it really just boils down to as simple as that. You know, we don't have enough... Funding for our, for our need here. And I, you know, I hear oftentimes that, people are coming from different locations, into Salem and that's why. But in my experience, working with the unsheltered population, They want to stay where their support systems are, you know, which was a really big push as to why I wanted to work in Polk County with the individuals that I did was because, especially with the youth, you know, their supports are there. That's where they're at. That's where they're from. And it's the same for the adults that I've worked with here in Salem.
Like, they have a community, and actually, the unsheltered community, is a very strong and beautiful and thriving community. They want to help one another. They would give the shirt off their back for one another. They would give the shirt off their back for me. They're such a helpful and beautiful community. And Even suggesting the idea of relocating to them is unfathomable. They do not...
Like that idea, even if opportunity was greater. So I think that there's just a lot of misunderstanding with that and we just have too great of a need here in Salem, to really meet what we already have.
John Marshall | 47:17
I'm resonating with And that my own experience would confirm what you've just said, that these humans that I have encountered... I've been fortunate enough to even begin to call friends.
Like, their experience of survival mode. Increases their capacity to recognize someone else in survival mode. Their experience of suffering compels them to empathetically connect and alleviate suffering as often as they can. Not just to the human being who's at their campsite, but to someone like you and myself who... For all extents and purposes. Aren't in survival mode. To them, we might be the other. And certainly survival mode can produce behaviors on the other end of the spectrum. That's what happens when you are competing for survival with the people around you is that inevitably out of competition for scarce resources, people can become easily threats and enemies. But what I have experienced and what I think he just named is that's the exception, not the rule. One of the other things I'm aware of is that most individuals will want to settle and the zip code where they graduated high school, the place where they have the strongest connections from those formative years of their life. And it's so interesting to encounter the perception in the world that people will gravitate to where the resources are I think sometimes... If there's an actual spark of hope that going to where resources is going to end up with. Movement into a better life. You Sure, I've encountered those stories. Most often people are going to go find where their relationship's the strongest.
Yeah. You raise the point of housing not always being. The right goal for someone.
Yeah. You realize raise the point that when someone does move into housing, what it Yes. You mentioned the way in which the infrastructure and the systems and the resources in particularly urban contexts like Salem. Your own story. Is not linear. We just talked about how when individuals We'll move and relocate. It's a very often, for the sake of relationship, now resource. That creates in my own brain a really cool complex and confused ecosystem of a Humanity.
Yeah. And I'm so curious what your experience is, both as someone who has lived it And as someone who is now in the role of helper. Who's in the system often representing the system, trying to make the system better, very aware of the system's gaps and needs. When someone, if someone were to come to you and say, Megan, what's the solution to homelessness? How do you put all of those layers together? In a meaningful way that actually gives you some sense of hope and like future trajectory that someday we might get to a world where people are actually safe. And housed. And have a relationship that's meaningful and supportive.
So they don't end up in parks in the first place.
Megan Perez | 51:21
Yeah. Well, I don't think that there is one single solution. I think that, number one, there's... I think that it's really important to have different layers to this.
So I think that having... Having systems in place and having shelters in place that have varying layers of access, right?
So you have low barrier shelters, you have medium barrier shelters, and then higher barrier shelters. Those all serve their own purpose and they're all important in their own ways. And I've, you know, I've heard and I've seen people, you know, really against having low barrier shelters or whatever the case. And I think that they all serve a purpose and they all serve varying needs and varying levels of care for individuals. I think that, You know, it's very important to, one, have options for people. But I think it's very important to, you know have preventative care I think it's important to be able to really meet people where they are and actually listen to what the needs are.
You know, right now we have a housing crisis that we're all very aware of. And so...
You know, affordability. And then we have, you know, a statistic I heard was that within the next, I believe it's five years, our seniors are going to double. They're going to...
So I think some prevention work would be important. I think you know, something that I see is that, you know, a lot of our providers, they're not speaking to one another.
So how do we get together? How do we collaborate? How do we get away from this, you know, kind of gatekeeping narrative? I think that that's very important.
You know, a lot of times I'll sit down with directors and managers and say, They won't even be aware of meetings such as the service provider meeting that happens. It's once a month at the Salem Police Department meeting. It's been going on since, I want to say, 2022. And I think that it's important that we're not all siloed as organizations and agencies, that we get together and we actually talk about these same individuals that we're serving and what their needs are. And we don't, you know, put our own... Put our own needs on them i think it's very important that we actually provide true wraparound care to these individuals so that we don't see them especially our chronically homeless individuals we don't see them back into systems right because it's very it's easy for us to get them into housing and it's harder for us as providers to keep them in housing and so So.
John Marshall | 54:49
When you use language of wraparound services, what you're describing is... Continued holistic supportive programs that can remain connected to an individual after they've moved in.
Yeah. To.
Megan Perez | 55:05
Their spot. Yeah, correct.
So, you know, when you move somebody into housing, what support is going to stay into place for them? What support is going to be there after you as the provider who's been providing a shelter, providing whatever you've been providing? What's going to outlast you and your services.
So, you know, a peer support, transportation, you know, like what life skills has this individual adapted in the time and being sure that they have that within their home system before you know, you kind of Walk away.
John Marshall | 55:49
You just described A lot. Of infrastructure and services. How do you start to encourage someone who listens to what you just described and go, Holy cow. That's so much that requires so much funding.
Yeah. That almost feels so impossible of a task. To even be worth it in the first place. Why... Don't we just focus on our own selves what to you is the value of a community investing in.
Megan Perez | 56:22
All of that? Yeah. I think that as a community member, volunteering is very important because you being able and willing to volunteer is freeing for the providers who are actually able to do the work.
So if you're able to volunteer to, you know, provide services to an organization, then that can free up the case manager to go and offer these wraparound services. So while these feel like maybe giant tasks, they're actually not very giant at all. A case manager can handle a lot of these tasks. But we as a community have to come together to support one another. And like you had said earlier, you know, a lot of our grants are very, they're written very to a point, right?
Like they...
John Marshall | 57:19
There's an objective, there's an outcome that's.
Megan Perez | 57:21
Desired. Yeah. It's the point of the grant.
Yeah, they box us in. And so when we have individuals who are willing to volunteer and to give us our time, that actually... Gives us a lot of leeway into what we can provide.
So when we have organizations that come together so we have a peer support and we have a case manager that's already taken care of you know two of the wraparound services and then you have a cco like pacific source who's able to do transportation there you go there's three of those wraparound supports so while it might feel like an exhaustive list it's actually not so big.
John Marshall | 57:58
As you survey the our local ecosystem, Salem, surrounding rural areas. Willamette Valley. Northwest. Like, despite all the places in which it can seem hopeless and like there isn't enough help in the world to meet the need, what do you hang on to as signs of hope that good things are happening and that people are being cared for and served?- What keeps you in the work?
Megan Perez | 58:25
Yeah. You know, I think I go back to... The individuals that I have been able to, Sit with and hear their story.
You know, a big fear that I have that has been expressed to me from a lot of individuals is that their stories will be lost with them. A lot of these individuals don't have family members. And so when they pass away, their fear is that their story, their name dies with them. And so knowing that I have been able to sit with them and hear their story and know their name, And knowing that gets to live with me and that I get to do this work in their name really gives me hope. And it gives me hope to continue to get to know individuals and get to give them the hope that they're You know, if I say that I'm going to show up for them, I am. And so they matter.
John Marshall | 59:28
Yeah. Who are some of those names that you carry as...
Megan Perez | 59:32
Yeah, definitely. So there was Corbett. He was very important to me. And there's Cindy, there's TJ, there's Janet. There's Jesse. Those are... Those are very important individuals to me.
John Marshall | 59:49
Some of those names... I know. And remember well. I'm grateful that their lives that I got to bear witness to their lives. Some of those individuals were really... Gracious in the ways that they offered their own stories and lives to me too so i'm grateful that you named them because they're helping me remember some of the why my work too Well, we're at the end of our conversation. We always end every interview the same way with a set of 10 questions that are sort of silly. You get to answer these however you wish. Question number one, what is the best dessert?
Megan Perez | 01:00:31
Cheesecake.
John Marshall | 01:00:32
Any particular flavor?
Megan Perez | 01:00:34
No, I'll take any cheesecake. Any cheesecake. Okay.
John Marshall | 01:00:39
A genie grants you one wish. What do you wish for?
Megan Perez | 01:00:43
This is going to sound so cheesy, and I promise it's not just because I'm on this podcast for this, but I would love to, like, open a shelter on Skid Row. That's like, that's been my dream. That's been my wish. And so that's Angeles?
John Marshall | 01:00:57
It. Specifically like Skid Row Los Would you rather go back in time and meet your ancestors or travel to the future to meet your descendants?
Megan Perez | 01:00:59
Yes. Yeah. Yes, specifically. I hope that wish comes true. Thank you.
I just think that it would be Very interesting and because there's... My grandfather on my dad's side was adopted by his grandparents and his mom, his mom... It's just this weird story where, like, his mom... Had him out of wedlock and so we don't know a lot of history about him.
So like just understanding that part of myself would be Nice. Yeah, you.
John Marshall | 01:01:46
Bet. Cats or dogs? Dogs. Apples or oranges? Oranges. Favorite smell?
Megan Perez | 01:01:53
.. Coconut.
John Marshall | 01:01:56
What is one thing you would add to Salem to make it better?
Megan Perez | 01:01:59
Something like where you can do slam poetry. There's like nowhere to do that.
John Marshall | 01:02:05
I've never heard that answer and I love that. What piece of advice has helped you the most?
Megan Perez | 01:02:11
Not every hill is worth dying on. I'm still learning that. That's fair.
John Marshall | 01:02:19
I'm learning that too. Yeah. What is your favorite thing about Okay, maybe we should reverse roles.
Megan Perez | 01:02:22
Yourself? I ask very weird questions.
John Marshall | 01:02:32
And finally, Biggest hope for your future?
Megan Perez | 01:02:36
I think that my biggest hope is that one day I will be in a seat to make some, you know, real impact and real change.
John Marshall | 01:02:45
I hope that dream comes true. Thank you. I would be remiss to say, or remiss not to say, You have made real impact. Thank you. And you've made real change. I'm grateful to know you and your life. I'm grateful for the way that you humanize others. I'm grateful for the humanity that you bring to this work that we're both part of. The way that you... See the world in front of you and the humans that appear in those places of darkness and pain and need is a balm to me. It helps me believe that there is a future reality that's better than today.
So I do hope that your dream comes true. And I think it already is true.
Megan Perez | 01:03:29
Thank you.
John Marshall | 01:03:34
Hey again, everyone. I hope you enjoyed my conversation with Megan. I'm so grateful for her time and wisdom shared, especially because it's hard-earned wisdom. I was reminded listening to her that so often the very best people for designing the solutions to our broken world are those who are most intimately aware of the pain of the world, Those who are closest to the broken layers must live within the gaps of our systems. I think of the expectations we so often place on those who live within that brokenness to overcome their own reality and the cost of this demand that we place on them. My imagination goes to that gospel story. When Jesus is sitting within the temple and sees many wealthy individuals add large sums of money into the treasury, And then he sees a poor widow. Place two coins in. Mark's account says Jesus summoned his disciples and said, Truly I tell you, this poor widow has put in more than all those who are contributing to the treasury. For all of them have contributed out of their abundance, but she out of her poverty has put in everything she had. All that she had to live on. Jesus may be honoring the widow's contribution here. But I don't think he's celebrating it. In the context of Mark 12 and Luke 20 and 21, where the story shows up again, Jesus' words serve as an indictment on the cultural and religious systems that would even ask a widow to give her last two coins in the first place in order to maintain standing in a community. What's worth celebrating about that? What's worth celebrating about a world that asks a teenage girl to parent her own mother? To be responsible for her siblings. Between being a kid who gets to go to the movies with her friends or stay home to be a barrier to abuse. To drop out of school so that she could give her family a chance at stability. To share a twin mattress inside a closet. To suspend her own dreams to get her family on their feet. Blues out on being a kid when she was a kid. Believe for so long that she had nothing to offer the world Can we see what the systems of our world required of Megan in order to belong? Can we see the proverbial coins that our neighbors who live outside put in the community pot every single day just for a chance to have their own reality taken seriously by the rest of us? And we see what we require of one another. When we are unwilling to listen to the wisdom of people like Megan and others who live in tents and behind bushes and stay awake outside their cars just so the children inside can sleep soundly. And we honor all of that work that it takes to be human.
And then, can we set about the work of redesigning the world into something that doesn't require so much work? I think we can. And I think so because of this good news that is worth celebrating. In the short time since our conversation, Megan has joined the good people over at Center for Hope and Safety as their new shelter supervisor. She manages their domestic violence shelter, helps create environments of safety for survivors of domestic abuse, develops staff and volunteers, and serves on their team of domestic abuse advocates. And I'm so hopeful for the stories that will emerge from that place because someone like Megan is there to honor them. May the rest of us find our courage to go and do likewise.
Monica Fiedler | 01:07:13
Hi, this is Monica again with Church of the Park. Thank you so much for joining us for this episode of The Humanity of Homelessness. We hope that what you heard serves as testimony that there's always good news to celebrate in hard places and that all of our neighbors are worth our time and attention. If you'd like to remain connected with us at Church of the Park, please visit our website at churchatthepark.org. There you can find opportunities to volunteer, subscribe to our newsletter and weekly liturgy reflections, and stay in the know about our current and future projects. We have an online portal for financial giving. If you have questions for us or want to connect over a cup of coffee, we have lots of team members who would love to pay for your cup. Email us at info@churchofthepark.org. Again, that's info, I-N-F-O, at churchatthepark.org. You can find this podcast wherever podcasts are found, and it's helpful to us if you subscribe and share the episodes that inspire you. Thanks to everyone for tuning in and joining us as we celebrate good news in the hardest, most unexpected places.