Subscribe
Share
Share
Embed
Welcome to "Bean There, Done That!" your essential podcast for mastering the world of hospitality. Hosted by industry expert, Phillip Di Bella, we cut through the noise to deliver straightforward, actionable insights and strategies.
Each episode explores the powerful interplay of knowledge and connections, presenting real-life case studies from Australia's thriving hospitality scene. We feature thought leaders who share their experiences, ensuring you have the answers you need when facing a business challenge.
Whether you're a budding cafe owner or a seasoned hospitality professional, "Bean There, Done That!" is your hub for insights, inspiration, and industry connections. We're here to help you turn hurdles into opportunities for growth and success.
Join our growing community with the hashtags #BeanThereDoneThat, #HospitalityHub, #CafeInsights, and #CoffeeCommune. With "Bean There and Done That," your roadmap to hospitality success is just a listen away.
[TRANSCRIPT]
0:00:02 - (A): You are listening to Been There, Done that, we present some of the smartest people connected to the business of coffee. People who've succeeded in the tough grind of hospitality by staying ahead of the rest. So join us as we explore the secrets to their success and help you accelerate your business. This show is brought to you by The Coffee Commune, where the coffee community comes to collaborate. Enjoy the show.
0:00:34 - (Philip): Hi, I'm Philip DeBella, the founder and managing director of the Coffee Commune and on our Been There and Done that podcast, today I welcome Alan Bonsel, one of Australia's number one strategist and branding experts. Alan, welcome to the show.
0:00:48 - (Alan): Thanks, Philip. Great to be here.
0:00:50 - (Philip): Fantastic. Now, today we're going to talk about standing up from a crowd. And before I hit you with your first question, the audience, I just want to give you a bit of a framework that I talk about, a template. In building your business, I get asked all the time, a quick snap of a framework, and here it is. Firstly, why do your customers choose you? Secondly, what problem are you solving? Three, what is your compelling story? And we're going to explore that very much in detail with Alan as his area of expertise.
0:01:15 - (Philip): And finally, go and be the best you can be. Do the work. No one else can do it for you. So today, really want to hone in on what is your compelling story, how can we get you to stand out from a crowd? And so, Alan, tell me, what does it mean to stand out in a crowd as a cafe operator? And why is it so important for building a successful business?
0:01:34 - (Alan): Well, I think the starting point there is to recognize that the competition in this space and the competition in all business these days is just getting it's massive. So what we've got to recognize is that when you're playing in a very, very competitive market space, if you're not different, you're not going to be there. You're not going to, in fact, be.
0:01:56 - (D): Competitive at any point.
0:01:59 - (Alan): So if you think about where this.
0:02:01 - (D): Is coming from, once upon a time.
0:02:05 - (Alan): The seller was very much in control of what happened in the marketplace. The seller controlled the retail space, they controlled the advertising, they controlled the messaging, and it was very much a seller operation. What's happened since the Internet is that has changed completely.
0:02:25 - (D): And what we've now got is a customer control.
0:02:29 - (Alan): We have absolute domination by customers. Forget the seller. It's what the customer wants and it's what the customer needs that is the most critical thing we need to understand. So when you think about what has changed since the Internet, what we now can do is we can educate ourselves, we can understand everything we want to know about the competition. Because all you got to do is go to a computer, go to a keyboard, you can Google any amount of information and all of a sudden, you are in control of testimonials, you are.
0:03:06 - (D): In control of comparisons with other cafes.
0:03:11 - (Alan): You can actually see everything that that cafe puts out, what their competitors are putting out. You can make a decision before you even walk down the street and it's that information and knowledge that really then makes the difference. If you get any part of that right, you're in good space. If you get any part of it wrong, then you're in really bad space. And you can do this for any number of products. But when we're talking in cafe operators, when we're talking restaurants, we are talking about a massive number of competitors, people on every corner, people along the street.
0:03:52 - (D): Three or four cafes in one section of a road.
0:03:57 - (Alan): All of a sudden what we have is this smorgasbord for anybody who is looking for a choice. So why should they come to you if you cannot differentiate, if you cannot stand up from the crowd somehow and it's going to be different.
0:04:14 - (D): Everybody is going to have a different position.
0:04:17 - (Alan): It goes back to the old story about USP and the unique selling proposition. What is your unique selling proposition and how do you actually build that unique selling proposition into you used the word before story. How do you build that into a story that is and again, I'm going to use your words because a story that is so compelling that they cannot not come to you, that's the bottom line. But everything we're now talking about recognizes.
0:04:46 - (D): That the customer is in control, not the seller.
0:04:50 - (Alan): And what that puts on any business is a responsibility and an onus to understand their customers better than anybody else in that marketplace.
0:05:00 - (Philip): Yeah, which is a key point.
0:05:01 - (D): Right.
0:05:01 - (Philip): You've got to understand your customer. And as we say and Alan and I wrote a book and Alan did most of the writing. He's the talented one of 17 rules of game changer thinking. And we talked about the rule of.
0:05:10 - (D): Outside in and Alan's articulated that quite.
0:05:12 - (Philip): Well, that everything has to be built.
0:05:13 - (D): From the outside in.
0:05:15 - (Philip): It's not about what you want in your cafe. It's about what the consumer wants. We're in a consumer world right now. So Alan perfectly said, which flows nicely.
0:05:22 - (D): To the next question.
0:05:23 - (Philip): So you talked about differentiation. Let's bring us and draw us further.
0:05:27 - (D): On that point a couple of ways.
0:05:29 - (Philip): That a cafe owner and we're all customs of cafes or restaurants. Doesn't matter if you're a cafe junkie or not. We all go to cafes and restaurants. So let's draw on that. How can a cafe owner differentiate themselves from the other three and four on the same street from a brand and marketing experts perspective?
0:05:43 - (Alan): Well again you've got to step back and say what do I need to know? What sort of information do I need to be able to determine what that customer wants or what the majority of.
0:05:54 - (D): My customers, potential customers, otherwise will want.
0:05:58 - (Alan): And I was listening to somebody talking the other day about that old book that was written many, many thousands of.
0:06:05 - (D): Years ago, the Art of War. And The Art of War says, you.
0:06:09 - (Alan): Cannot defeat your enemy until you know them better than you know yourself, but most importantly, until you know their weaknesses better than yourself. If you're going to get into a marketplace that is cluttered with so many competitors, if you don't know what your competitors are doing as a starting point, how are you then going to be able to say, this is what my unique place is.
0:06:35 - (D): This is what I can do differently?
0:06:37 - (Alan): So I might be very, very clever at some signature dish, but so might somebody just around the corner, and that signature dish might actually be better than mine. So when you start looking at it from a single point of view, you've got to ask yourself, what is the customer actually looking for that I can differentiate on? So if I differentiate because I have a different brand of coffee, most coffee these days, from an average consumer's point of view, as long as the coffee tastes okay, that's acceptable.
0:07:10 - (D): Correct.
0:07:11 - (Alan): So you walk into a cafe. The first decision you're making is not necessarily what brand of coffee is on that table? Unless and I'm very mindful of your background in terms of DeBella coffee, when you put so much effort into building that as the key plank on which.
0:07:32 - (D): Your business existed, that's not now necessarily.
0:07:36 - (Alan): In the same space.
0:07:37 - (Philip): No, times have changed.
0:07:38 - (Alan): Times have changed. And again, that's the other factor we've got to recognize. Times will continue to change rapidly as we get more and more educated customers, as we get customers who want different things or are looking for a difference. So how do you actually establish what that difference is? The first thing you've got to do is you've got to understand what your competitors are about. If you don't do that, then you're on a pathway to extinction. There's no question.
0:08:07 - (Alan): And let's not forget that 50% of startups, 50% of new businesses will fall over within five years. And why do they fall over? Because they don't do their homework. So the first thing, let's look at what our competitors are doing. Let's look what their weaknesses are. Compare them to what our strengths are. Do we have something that stands out? It's crystal clear. The second thing we have to do to be able to really differentiate ourselves is to understand what the customer is looking for.
0:08:38 - (Alan): Now, I think you can make some generalizations here, and that is to say.
0:08:43 - (D): First and foremost, the consumer is looking.
0:08:45 - (Alan): For a place where they can meet or greet or be involved with friends.
0:08:52 - (D): Be involved with company.
0:08:54 - (Alan): So what are you doing to actually make them feel that they are part of your operation, that they can consider this home that they can consider their space.
0:09:04 - (Philip): Not just a transaction.
0:09:06 - (Alan): Not just a transaction. So firstly, what is the competition doing? Secondly, what are the consumers doing? What are the consumers needs? Is their need a signature dish? Probably not. Is there need a different brand of coffee? Possibly. But if you put that into a mix of what is going to attract people to my cafe, is that going to be the number one?
0:09:31 - (D): I'm probably thinking no, it won't be.
0:09:34 - (Alan): And if you think about this from a brand perspective I don't want to just talk about brand, but if you.
0:09:40 - (D): Think about this from a brand perspective.
0:09:42 - (Alan): The development of a brand is not one isolated factor. A brand is so complex, it has.
0:09:50 - (D): So many parts to it.
0:09:52 - (Alan): So what you're actually developing is something that is a bunch of experiences that there's an old statement that says brand is a bunch of experiences and satisfactions delivered. That's not exactly word for word, but it's in that space. What are those? Satisfactions. It's a collective. You've got to get each one of those into that mix. So, yes, the coffee is going to taste okay. Yes, you might have some very attractive food options.
0:10:25 - (Alan): Yes, you might have a price consideration, but the only way you're going to know if those factors are really the primary factors is by talking to your customers. It's by understanding your customers.
0:10:36 - (D): Yeah.
0:10:36 - (Philip): And some great points in there. Right. Not only know your customers, but know your competitors and what they're offering. And I see it screams opportunity. Where is the need in the marketplace for me to come in? Whether it's paleo, whether it's vegetarian, whether it's vegan, whether it's offering every different milk you can, it's looking for that opportunity to come into the market. And you mentioned about relevance, you mentioned about knowing competitors, and they're all points that come together. And you started on the discussion, obviously, of brand. So let's explore that further and how people can create memorable moments so that it actually creates an emotional engagement to a brand. Because brand for me, is what people say about you when they leave a room. It's a real marketer's, strategic marketer's point of view because what they're saying about you when they leave the room, they then go and talk about you to others. So it's third party endorsement. So let's explore that further. Alan, from your position, how do we create a unique brand? Well, not even so much unique, right? Because that's a difficult but how do you create a memorable brand as a cafe owner? And you might answer it from that perspective, a clinical or you might answer it from a customer's perspective, as a customer of a cafe or restaurant, what's a memorable brand look like to you and how can we create one?
0:11:43 - (Alan): Well, your starting point is something you touched on earlier, and that's the outside in versus inside out. So outside in fundamentally is about how you plan from a customer perspective rather than from a product perspective. So let's just put that out there. Product is about selling. If you've got a product, you have to find ways to sell it. If you've got a brand in the marketplace, it's because the customer wants that brand, that it fulfills a need.
0:12:08 - (D): So what is that need?
0:12:10 - (Alan): But I think the underpinning thing there is this whole concept of emotion. If we're going to build a brand, what we have to realize is that a huge part of the decision making around that brand is emotionally driven. It's not pragmatic, it's not practical, it's emotion. And as you know, within the book, there's a little story about a tear is 1% water and 99% emotion. Now, you can rationalize the moisture, the water of a tear, you can almost rationalize why that has occurred, but you cannot rationalize, you cannot really understand the emotion that is behind that tier.
0:12:56 - (Alan): Now, if you want to build a strong brand, if you want to build a brand that is really going to differentiate you in the market, what you've firstly got to understand is that the customer has an expectation of you which is emotional as well as practical. Yes, they're expecting coffee, yes, they're expecting food. Yes, they're expecting a table and chair to sit at. But what is the emotion that really drives all of those components?
0:13:24 - (Alan): If I want to sit down in a cafe, am I looking around and thinking to myself, wow, this is just amazing, this really makes me feel comfortable. I really feel relaxed in this environment. Is that what I'm feeling? Or am I feeling as if I'm.
0:13:38 - (D): Sitting at a counter and nobody's really.
0:13:40 - (Alan): Paying any attention to me and somebody's just shoved a cup of coffee in front of me and I'm probably going to get the same treatment with the.
0:13:47 - (D): Piece of toast that I ordered for breakfast?
0:13:50 - (Alan): Where is the emotional engagement? And that's the problem with 90%, I believe, of business. We don't really understand and value the emotional component of that brand. Now, that doesn't tell you how to build a brand. The building of a brand is a very complex thing. It's about what are the attributes that you can turn into benefits, what are the features that you can put in that you can actually describe as a benefit to the customer. So we go back to that outside in planning function.
0:14:23 - (Alan): If you're planning from the outside in, you're saying, what does my customer want?
0:14:27 - (D): You're not saying what do I want?
0:14:29 - (Alan): If you're saying what the customer wants, then you are building a brand around that customer's needs and that customer's emotions. So if I'm going to sell a motor car and that motor car has a rear view mirror, that rear view mirror is a feature which I can turn into a benefit of safety. I'm not going to buy the motor car because of the rear view mirror, but it's one component that factors into my decision making process.
0:14:55 - (Alan): So, as I said before, if I'm sitting in a cafe and I can't look around and feel as relaxed as I would in my own lounge room, or if I can't look around and think to myself, gee, I'm glad I chose this place because I know my friends will like it, that's the emotional connection. Now, how do you drive that emotional connection? It's not easy, but you have to look at it from a customer's perspective. You have to sit in that chair and say to yourself, would I really want to sit here and drink a cup of coffee, or am I just keen to get out of here?
0:15:29 - (D): Yeah.
0:15:29 - (Philip): And it's a good point, because in a world where everything's becoming transaction based, it's actually easier to stand out from a crowd by delivering emotional connection.
0:15:37 - (D): And I've been giving a lot of.
0:15:38 - (Philip): Workshops lately and a lot of interviews on different platforms, but I keep coming back to in a world where everything's going transactional based, we have an opportunity by just going back to basics and becoming emotive based. And that's a key takeaway for the listeners right there. And what you've said and the why.
0:15:52 - (D): You'Ve said it because people do business with people.
0:15:55 - (Philip): They don't do business with things, and people don't want to be treated like a transaction.
0:15:59 - (D): And I'll give you an example. My boy's, 13 years old, Ali, and.
0:16:03 - (Philip): Coming back from Toowoomba the other day for his soccer game. And we stopped in a McDonald's. And don't kill me, Jana. It's okay. He was as healthy as he could be. But we stopped in a McDonald's, and it became one of the best learning experiences you can imagine.
0:16:14 - (D): And let me tell you why.
0:16:15 - (Philip): So we went to the first talk through a machine, and I got asked what I wanted. We went to the next window to pay for what we ordered, and then we went to the next window to.
0:16:23 - (D): Pick up the order, three different touch points.
0:16:26 - (Philip): And my 13 year old boy turns.
0:16:28 - (D): Around and says, dad, I noticed that.
0:16:30 - (Philip): You said please and thank you five times, and they did not say it once.
0:16:33 - (D): Now, think about that.
0:16:35 - (Philip): Now, haven't we got a problem in this industry when McDonald's is becoming transaction based? When McDonald's used to be the number one learning platform for the industry because you'd go there at 14 and a half years old, get taught amazing systems, processes, and customer engagement, and then US. Cafes would come along and entice you to come and work with us. And my nieces, who are now lawyers in their 30s, started at McDonald's and then worked for me at DeBella. The point I make here is one can see it as a detriment that McDonald's has gone down to transaction based.
0:17:02 - (D): Versus the emotive based.
0:17:04 - (Philip): Or one could see that as an opportunity that I'm going to run a business, a cafe so engaged with emotional connection. Remembering my customers names, remembering their orders, remembering little Johnny or Billy or Jillian that comes in with them and how old they are and when their birthdays that we can put strategies and platforms and procedures in place without it being transactional that help us be emotive based.
0:17:26 - (D): So to me, sharing that story, the.
0:17:28 - (Philip): Purpose of is to submit your point, Alan. We need to be moving away from transaction, which is where everyone else is.
0:17:34 - (D): Going, and to emotion based.
0:17:36 - (Philip): So let's go and delve in further on, therefore our target audience and how that links directly to brand. Because obviously without an audience, you don't have a brand.
0:17:45 - (D): So how do we get the right.
0:17:47 - (Philip): Audience for the right business? Where's the tips around that?
0:17:51 - (Alan): I think the problem we have is a reluctance on the part of many business owners to actually do the hard.
0:17:59 - (D): Yards in understanding their target audience within.
0:18:03 - (Alan): The marketplace in which they're operating. Now, you can do this from a demographic point of view to a point so you can actually sit in your cafe and you can say, well, here is the potential radius of my market. I can do a demographic review of that and recognize that there's a fairly affluent, fairly well to do area. I can actually utilize that thinking when.
0:18:28 - (D): I start to look at product. But that's not enough.
0:18:32 - (Alan): You then have to start thinking, well, what is it that they actually want?
0:18:36 - (D): What is it that they actually need?
0:18:38 - (Alan): You then start looking at it not from a demographic point of view, but from a psychographic point of view. And we talk about this in the book.
0:18:45 - (D): And I think anybody who's really looking.
0:18:47 - (Alan): To understand psychographics, it's just simply instead of worrying about the numbers, you worry about what's in people's heads, what is in their hearts, what are they thinking, why are they thinking it? So the numbers can tell you. There's a lot of people in this.
0:19:01 - (D): Market that will give me a potential.
0:19:05 - (Alan): To develop a certain menu, to develop a certain quality of coffee, et cetera, et cetera.
0:19:11 - (D): So I can do that. But when I look at that audience.
0:19:14 - (Alan): And I break them down, is it male, is it female, is it family? What are the feelings within those groups? What are the sorts of opportunities that they present to me when it comes to developing a product line or developing whatever it might be that I want.
0:19:31 - (D): To see as my point of difference?
0:19:33 - (Alan): But again, I just come back to this thought. Unless we understand that it is now a customer driven market, unless we understand that if we think that we're still in a place where the seller rules and the seller has every opportunity to make a dollar, you're going to make.
0:19:53 - (D): Mistakes, you are going to be in the wrong place.
0:19:56 - (Alan): So what we've got to try and get people to understand is that the more they understand their customers, the more they understand the way those customers think.
0:20:05 - (D): And emote, the more we are going.
0:20:08 - (Alan): To be able to develop a product, develop an ambiance in that cafe, a look and a feel that actually reflects what is in that person's head.
0:20:18 - (Philip): Yeah, well said.
0:20:19 - (D): We see data.
0:20:20 - (Philip): I can tell you now, cafes are still doing the same number of customers.
0:20:24 - (D): But the average of spend is down.
0:20:25 - (Philip): This is not a time to be trying to sell $30 breakfast in the morning when people just want the ham and cheese croissant. And I've asked many a cafe what their number one selling item right now is, and it's a ham and cheese croissant for anywhere from 750 to 950. And because it becomes a $1213 transaction with coffee versus a 30 $35 transaction. So target audience is important to bring.
0:20:45 - (D): Into, like you said, into the timing and the environment and what's happening from.
0:20:49 - (Philip): A psychology point of view. So that was a real standout there for me is that psychology, it's not getting clinical about yesterday's marketing, it's about game changer of now and the future by understanding the psychology of human behavior.
0:21:00 - (D): Right.
0:21:01 - (Alan): All you've got to do is be aware of what's going on around you. Because as you rightly say, if it is transactional, then the cost of living, which is going through the roof, is.
0:21:10 - (D): Impacting everybody, no matter whether they're affluent.
0:21:13 - (Alan): Whether they're on the breadline, it is impacting on everybody. It therefore changes the way that we.
0:21:20 - (D): Do business, the way we purchase now.
0:21:23 - (Alan): It will have more impact in certain areas than it will others. But you've got to factor that in.
0:21:28 - (Philip): You do. Yeah.
0:21:29 - (Alan): I think this is one of the.
0:21:30 - (D): Things about the internet.
0:21:31 - (Alan): I keep on hearing everybody saying AI is the next big thing.
0:21:36 - (D): I disagree because to me, the Internet.
0:21:40 - (Alan): Is the change that we all have to understand. It's the internet that actually facilitates AI. So what we're really recognizing there is that people have access to the information.
0:21:53 - (D): That they didn't have access to.
0:21:55 - (Alan): The fact that we may be able to write a menu using AI or do something in terms of social media by using the AI tool. That's fine, that's all very well and good. But the change, the shift has occurred courtesy of the Internet and courtesy of data and knowledge and information. If we don't take advantage of that, then we're going to go the way of the 50% that fall over within five years.
0:22:24 - (Philip): And you raise a good point. Right. So, AI, let's talk technology. What tips would you give on leveraging technology when it comes to creating your brand? And I'll give you a bit of a precursor for me is Chat GPT is great, but Chat GPT is a transaction, it doesn't have an emotion. So therefore you understand that whatever you put into Chat GPT is relative to what comes out, is based on how much you feed it and what you will feed it, because AI doesn't have an emotion, it has a transaction based operation.
0:22:51 - (Philip): So I bring you back with that in mind. How can you leverage technology today to actually create your brand?
0:22:58 - (Alan): I think the first thing you've got to do is recognize that technology is a tool.
0:23:02 - (D): It's not the solution.
0:23:04 - (Alan): The solution still sits in your brain. The solution still sits in your capacity or ability to strategize what you want.
0:23:12 - (D): To achieve, what your purpose is.
0:23:14 - (Alan): So when we look at technology, and I've seen some amazing technology in the business that you're now involved with, I've seen some amazing technology in some of.
0:23:24 - (D): The people I've come into contact with.
0:23:26 - (Alan): But technology fundamentally is about, firstly data. And data is what gives you the knowledge that you can actually do something with. You can then translate that through whatever piece of technology you're using, whatever software you're using. But if you don't have the capacity to understand how that is going to be advantaging your business, how that is going to benefit your business, forget it's not worth the paper it's written on.
0:23:55 - (Alan): So it's a tool. But the tools that are out there are just amazing. So if we want to save money, what we can do is investigate those tools. What we can't do is give the authority to those tools to run the business. It just won't work.
0:24:13 - (Philip): Well said. Obviously in this podcast series over the next few months, we will be bringing on and honing in on some of the technology that you mentioned. Because from people that know that has customer loyalty programs through to POS systems to give you real life data, to AI around POS systems for you to be able to benchmark what the cafes around Australia are doing yesterday, compared to you, there is some amazing tools. But the real key point there that Alan made for me was that it's a resource, that it's a tool.
0:24:40 - (Philip): It's not the solution. It's part of the journey. So if anyone's looking at technology as the solution, I've got bad news for you because I think you fall into that 50% that won't be around in the next five years. Technology really is a tool for you to be able to grab and help you develop a better story, a better menu, a better blog, whatever it is that you're using that technology for. And understand that technology is not just for marketing purposes. Even though we're talking about brand today, technology is also about customer experience. So I want to draw down to customer experience.
0:25:09 - (Philip): Remember what I said. Brand is what people say about you when you leave the room. To me, it's all around customer experience. So talk us through the importance of customer experience from your point of view.
0:25:18 - (Alan): Well, can I start by just coming back on a point that you were making there, and that is that technology is the tool. Technology is a resource. But if we don't understand the implications of that technology, we make mistakes.
0:25:31 - (Philip): Correct.
0:25:32 - (Alan): And we make more mistakes in customer service in this whole customer excellence space than probably in any other area of using technology and running a business. And that's because you may well think that putting in place an ordering system from the table to the kitchen or to the white staff is going to give you efficiency. But if that creates a negative vibe in the mind of the person who is doing the ordering, you have lost, you haven't gained.
0:26:05 - (Alan): So what we've got to recognize is that technology and use of technology, particularly in developing customer relations, in developing excellence in the whole service space, is so open to being misused and abused unless we really do investigate all of the risks attached to that. And I say that from personal experience because I have had some horrendous customer experiences simply because technology has not been used. Well, coming back to the second part of that, to me customer service is the be all and end all. It is what everything should be built on.
0:26:47 - (Alan): You used memorable moments. In the book we have that rule.
0:26:51 - (D): Which is magic moments.
0:26:53 - (Alan): What are magic moments? Magic moments are those occasions that you cannot wait to tell your friends you can't keep to yourself. You want to share it because they were so good.
0:27:04 - (D): They were so, so good.
0:27:07 - (Alan): And that to me, is what service is all about. It's making sure that people walk out of your business, whether it be a cafe, a restaurant or a retail business or whatever it might be an engineering shop. It's walking out of there with an experience that says, wow, I got to tell my friends about that. That comes back also to the issue.
0:27:27 - (D): Around trust and the issue of brand.
0:27:30 - (Alan): Because what we didn't touch on before when we're talking brand was the whole reason behind brand. It's about trust. We only build brands to create trust. And what trust does is create loyalty. And what we've got to recognize is that a cheaper customer is the one who comes back, not the one you.
0:27:48 - (D): Have to keep on chasing.
0:27:49 - (Alan): But if that means customer experience is going to be the reason why they build that trust, any company, any cafe, any business that's not focused on customer service is doing themselves a disservice.
0:28:03 - (Philip): Yeah, totally agree. I mean, I talk about exceeding a customer's expectation because the ethos of customer service really it's a transaction, but it doesn't have any immeasurables behind it. Whereas if I say to you, go and exceed a customer's expectation, it has.
0:28:16 - (D): An emotion behind it.
0:28:17 - (Philip): You've got to find out what that customer's expectation is, which you've been talking.
0:28:20 - (D): About in the podcast to date, and.
0:28:22 - (Philip): Then you go above and beyond to exceed it. And the rule of magic moments is key. It's only when you create that memorable you've exceeded customers expectation that. It will flow to a magic moment, to when they will go and tell the story for you. Alan, last question for you. Tell me, putting all together what we've spoke about, what's a successful example that stands out for you in the cafe industry of people that have done this well over the years?
0:28:47 - (Alan): The one that comes to mind, and it's probably an old story now, but it's one that really stood out to me, and that was Coffee Club. The Coffee Club deliberately took a position in the marketplace, which was about a meeting place. It wasn't about coffee. It wasn't about food. It was actually saying to people, I'll meet you at the Coffee Club. So their presence was really a critical part of that strategy.
0:29:16 - (Alan): It was well located. It was well signed. It had acceptable coffee, it had acceptable food.
0:29:25 - (Philip): Nothing great.
0:29:26 - (Alan): It wasn't off the Richter scale in terms of quality, but it was good.
0:29:30 - (D): It was okay.
0:29:31 - (Alan): But what people said was, I'll meet you at the Coffee Club. It was easy. It was something that people could do and say to friends, do you know where the Coffee Club is? Over there.
0:29:42 - (D): Meet you at the Coffee club.
0:29:44 - (Alan): That, to me, was a perfect example of understanding the customer need and then translating that into a point of difference. Nobody else was doing it. Nobody else was thinking that, hang on, we're a venue to engage people. Not engage them with us necessarily, but to engage them with their friends, community. Absolutely. And that's always stood out in my mind as a really good strategy. That was much more than just product line, product line, product line.
0:30:18 - (Alan): It's about what does the customer want, how does the customer think? How do we deliver that? And that, to me, is the essence of standing out, of how you will differentiate your business.
0:30:29 - (Philip): Yeah, really well put and a great example because Coffee Club have done amazing things started by three gentlemen who I know quite well, with an amazing concept of where would they meet each other, an amazing business was born, and they've gone on not only nationally, but internationally, to great success. And they are a good example of standing out. They're also a good example that they don't talk about how great their products are and all the rest of it. It's about outside in. It's about community. It's about where will I meet you? And it's an ethos that's followed through right now, which is a great way for me to wrap up. I want to leave listeners with this framework.
0:30:59 - (Philip): Remember that number one is perception. Your first sale is about perception. So today we've talked about that standing out from a crowd. What is that first sale, that first interaction with your cafe? It's going to be if you stand out from a crowd, then people are going to see that through your work you do with brand, with emotional engagement. And that'll be your first sale. But don't forget that for them to keep coming back, the quality has to meet that perception, and then you have to be consistent. So today we've touched on that perception. We've touched on standing out from a crowd. You've heard from Alan Vonsel, who's been there and done that, and to me is one of Australia's number one marketing and branding strategists. So, Alan, thank you for being on the show.
0:31:35 - (D): Oh, pleasure.
0:31:36 - (Alan): I've thoroughly enjoyed myself. I love talking about brand. I love talking about this whole idea of differentiation, but I'm also many times frustrated by a lot of people who just don't see the need to do the hard work in getting that knowledge, getting that information, understanding their customers.
0:31:57 - (D): Yeah, correct.
0:31:58 - (Philip): I think there's a lot to be taken from here. There'll be a good section of key takeaways for you to look at. If not at all, please make sure you do listen to the podcast, but if not, jump onto those key takeaways and share it. The more you share it, the more.
0:32:10 - (D): People we can touch, the more people.
0:32:11 - (Philip): We can help, which is our mission.
0:32:13 - (D): Here at the coffee commune.
0:32:14 - (Philip): Alan Bonsel. Thank you. Been there and done that. Thank you for sharing your wisdom. One of Australia's number one marketing and branding strategists. If people want to know more about Alan Bonsel and the work that you do, tell us a bit about oh.
0:32:26 - (Alan): Well, the work I do, I spent a long time in the ad business, but that seems to be a long time ago. When I was in the advertising game, what I got frustrated about was the failure to understand that it's not just about promotion, it's not just about an ad campaign, it's about the strategy behind it. So I left the advertising business and got involved in a whole range of different strategic planning opportunities with different clients, both government, private enterprise and I worked.
0:32:58 - (D): With you, Phil, for quite some time.
0:33:02 - (Alan): But what I'm really passionate about is the idea that if you can articulate your purpose, then all the rest of it falls into place.
0:33:12 - (D): The outside in thinking then starts to make sense.
0:33:16 - (Alan): So if anybody is interested in talking to me, they can reach me at my email address, which is Alan. Alan at lookingglass. Just one G, two s'slookingglass.
0:33:29 - (D): Com au.
0:33:31 - (Alan): You can check out my website, which is under the same name, lookingglass. But seriously, if you want to hear more of the ideas that Philip and I have been talking about today, suggest you get a copy of 17 Rules of Game Changer Thinking.
0:33:44 - (D): It's available on just about every online bookseller.
0:33:48 - (Alan): We're having some interesting times with the audiobook, but certainly the ebook is out there. The print on demand book is out there. You'll get it through, as I said, just about every online bookseller, coffee commune.
0:34:01 - (Philip): Website'S got it as well. So coffeecommune.com au on our shop there, you'll see a copy of the book as well, if you want a copy.
0:34:08 - (Alan): But what the book talks about is probably the essence of that book, is to try and shift thinking away from.
0:34:16 - (D): The idea of entrepreneurs to the idea of game changers.
0:34:20 - (Alan): That really what we as a country and what we as a business community need are more people who are prepared.
0:34:28 - (D): To change the game, who are prepared.
0:34:31 - (Alan): To not just be innovative, but to recognize that every single change they make requires something else to be destroyed. But that in itself means that we are moving into more efficient, better space. But it can only happen if we are really strategic about what that change should be. It won't happen if we get into the belief that the software, the technology is going to do it for us, because it won't.
0:35:01 - (Philip): Yeah, well said. And as I put it, for me, entrepreneurship is an intelligence that Alan wrote that book back in 2010, entrepreneurial intelligence, which is still available through an ebook if you want to grab it. And today and Tomorrow is about game changer thinking. Those that are going to survive and thrive are those that adopt the principles of game changer thinking. And Alan put together the concept of 17 rules of game changer thinking with me co writing with him, talking, talking about that. So if you want to get a hold of that, you can google it and it'll come up where you can buy it from a bookstore or where you can get it online. But it's all about helping you accelerate your potential, which is what the coffee commune is all about.
0:35:35 - (Philip): That's a wrap for today. Keep listening for more episodes of being there and done that. The coffee commune is here to help accelerate your potential. We want you to be better tomorrow than today. Until next time, you've been listening, phil DeBella. I'm the founder and managing director of the coffee commune, a place where the coffee community comes to collaborate.