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Circling The Drain is a show about the current state of the music and radio businesses as well as culture in general!
Hosted by John E. Bozeman and Jay Harper along with Jim McCarthy as Co-Host/Executive Producer.
John has had a storied career in music and talk radio, most notably as the Executive Producer for the late and legendary Phil Valentine.
Jay also has has a long career in radio as Announcer, Play-by-Play, Voice and On-Camera Actor. He was also an Artist Rep for MCA records.
Jim McCarthy ALSO has had a tremendous career in radio since 1996 and has since brought his consulting/producing skillset to the podcast world.
Circling the Drain is produced by ItsYourShow.co
Unknown: Off here. Recording
going this side, recording in
progress. I like that. Are you
ready? Hey, welcome back to
circling the drain. Of course,
you know me. John E Bozeman or
John Johnny B, most people know
me as this guy right here. You
know him. Jay Harper, Hey,
Johnny B, we're finally in close
proximity. Yes, we are. Yeah,
well, I'm normally gazing into
your eyes from across the room.
It's nice to be up close and
personal. That starts rumors.
And over there is Jim McCarthy,
the guy that holds us together.
Yes, sir. And we decided to
seriously dilute the ugly in
this room by bringing on
somebody that is beautiful in a
lot of ways. And a lot of you
know her as she used to be
married to William Lee golden of
the Oak Ridge Boys, but she has
started a new life in Austin,
Texas, and Brenda golden has
joined us, and she has a new
book too, by the way, which, you
know, Brenda. It speaks to me,
because I've said this many
times now, what?
So what inspired you to do this
book?
Well, actually, I started this
book eight years ago, yeah, and
it was, it has been very good
therapy for me. And I would
write, and then I would put it
down, yeah, and I'd put it down
for maybe six months or a year,
and think I'm not, I'm not going
to finish this. And then I would
pick it back up, reread it. But
I knew if I was going to write
this book at the very beginning.
I knew the title, I knew all the
chapters. I knew what kind of
illustrations I wanted, and I
knew that I wanted to ask some
of my friends to give words of
encouragement on the chapter. So
I really had a vision for it
from the very beginning, and I
had asked some of my friends who
had been through major change in
the middle of their life, in
their golden years, for advice
or words of encouragement for
someone who's facing that,
because they certainly helped me
when I was faced. You know, I
had turned 50, and I had to
totally my whole life was, you
know, turned upside down, and I
had to reinvent myself,
professionally, personally, I
ended up relocating from
Nashville to Austin, and so it
was a Major change.
Well, how is Austin been as far
as because I that's one town
I've kind of always wondered if
I'd want to live there, because
it seemed like it was a pretty
cool town as far as music and
and lifestyle.
Yes, it's a it's a community
that loves the arts and respects
the arts, and that's what drew
me to Austin, because, you know,
I have worked in and have loved
music and the in the
entertainment world all my life,
and I've worked in entertainment
since I was 21 and so I was
traveling, as I speak, about a
little bit In the book. I was
traveling back and forth from
Nashville to Austin, conducting
business at least once a month
for a client, and I happened to
mention to a friend of mine how
much I loved Austin, and I was
going through some terminal and
major changes at that time. And
so it was suggested, Why don't
you just move there? And I
really didn't give it another
thought, and I speak about that
in one, one of the chapters,
very good. I ended up,
well the Hey, Brenda, this Jay
Harper, a nice to Nice to meet
you, even though, digitally
here, you know, the last time
I've been to Austin was for
South by Southwest, the big, you
know, event that takes place
there, I'm guessing you've
probably been involved in that
to some degree, Right?
Some degree, when I was working
with different entertainers, as
far as them appearing there, but
I haven't worked as far as
representing South by Southwest,
but being involved from
representing different artists
that have been involved.
Yeah, I mean that event pretty,
pretty well takes over the town
there. When that goes on, and
it's such a cool event in terms
of such a diversity of music and
events that go on,
music, film, television, it
really covers the spectrum of
entertainment, right?
Well, you know, a lot of people,
I. May not be aware of, you
know, the work you've done in
the music business here. You did
a lot of work with different
people, such as Reba McIntyre.
No, I have Reba and our friends,
okay? And we're the same
community, and we're certainly
friends, but I've never, well, I
don't know, years ago, I was the
the Nashville responsible agent
for a restaurant, restaurant
called country star restaurants,
yeah, and they start one in Los
Angeles, in Las Vegas, and they
had reps in Los Angeles, I was
their Nashville rep, and Reba
and Vince Gill were our
spokesperson. And so that even
though I knew Reba before, that
is when I really got to know her
better from spending time with
her recording things for one of
the kiosks for the restaurant,
and then she built a home out in
the Gallatin area, and we were
then joined the same country
club, and so we would run into
each other quite often, but I
never represented Reba i or
worked with her in other
capacities. I represented
Charlie pride, the Osmonds boy
howdy, just the Buddy Holly Hall
of Performing Arts and Science,
the Andy Williams theater. A lot
of different a variety of
different people over the years.
How'd you meet? How'd you end up
meeting William Lee Goldman?
I moved from West Tennessee back
to Nashville, and a friend of
mine, Ed Harper, who I knew when
I was living in West Tennessee.
He He owns the Harper agency,
and he is a agent for gospel
music, but at the time, I didn't
know his history Other than
that, and I told him I wanted to
get start working into the music
business. I was a music major at
Middle Tennessee State
University, and so Music has
always been a part of my life.
And I asked him if he knew of
any openings, and he said, yes,
there's an opening at the Oak
Ridge Boys office. And he said,
it's a great place to begin with
and to learn the business, and
there's a slow turnover. And so
he opened the door for an
interview, and Ted hacker at the
time, who later went on to
manage diamond, Rio was the
office manager at the time. And
so I interviewed with Ted six or
seven times, and and so I
started working for the oaks,
and I was 21 at the time.
Wow, yeah, yeah. So that's and
so that's how you met William
Lee, and I saw, I saw an
interview as an old interview
with lorianne Crook. And you
were just cute as can be. I
mean, I mean, I Well, you were
and, and I was, I love the story
about how you guys had your
first kiss. That was very that
was a great story.
Yeah, it kind of took me by
surprise. I'm to this day. I'm
the last to pick up or know if
someone is attracted to me. I
don't know why, but I just don't
pick up on that. And so I didn't
have any idea that he was
attracted to me, none
whatsoever, until that night.
Yeah, then that full moon did it
didn't for him. You guys were
married for quite a while, were
you not till 2014 wasn't it?
Yes, sir, just a few months shy
of our 25th anniversary. Oh,
man, a long time, but we have a
son who's wonderful, Solomon
took us Yes, Solomon and we were
married 11 and a half years
before Solomon came in our
lives. So he's quite a blessing
to us both
well, and too, he's getting
involved in what's I was reading
about him the other day, and you
have to he's in, is he, is it?
EMT? Is that what he's trying to
do, is doing well.
He's been an EMT, and he's been
an advanced EMT. He's finished
up his health science degree and
emergency medicine, and he's
finished, finished up his
paramedics degree certification.
I should say he's finalizing. He
has to put in 500 hours of
clinical hours. Hours. And so
he's doing that now, 24 hour
shifts. But ultimately, and he's
had this goal since middle
school, and it has not changed,
he would love to pair his
respect for law enforcement and
his love and passion for
medicine together. And so his
goal, ultimately, for now, is to
be an FBI hostage rescue medic,
and so he's on that path to do
that.
Well, that was very cool. He's
not taking after the other boys
of doing music or anything like
that.
No, now he has music abilities.
I mean, he started, he was
playing violin at the age of
two, and he was a part of the
Nashville Suzuki players for
years, up until we moved to
Austin, and they performed
everywhere, including Disney
World and Orlando and all over
and he plays drums, but that's
not his passion. I speak a
little bit about it in the book
that his father really wanted
him to get into the music,
really, any aspect of the music
business, not just performing,
but even sound engineering, you
name it. But as he expressed to
both of us that was not his
passion. And then, you know, I
spoke to him when he graduated
high school in the year of 2020,
the year of clear visions and
nightmares sometimes. But I
said, Now, if you aren't sure of
what you want to do that's okay
because you're still young, and
a lot of people don't have that
vision. And he said, Mother,
I've spoken I've thought about
it a long time, and if someone
told me I couldn't do this, I'd
get very depressed. And I said,
well, then it's your calling. So
it really is a calling,
definitely, definitely,
definitely. And are you still
close with it seems like you may
still be close with the Oak
Ridge Boys. Some of the I you
know Richard sturban is really
been having some struggles with
his health recently, and I
noticed that you were, you were
talking about it on social
media, that you were basically
asking folks to pray and keep
them in your
his wife, well, you know, I met
all of them when I was 21 Yeah,
and so they are very much. Them
and their families, their
children and now their
grandchildren are very much
there's a family unit for years.
I converse with Donna on a
regular basis, and sometimes
about our kids, and sometimes,
and a lot the last year about
Richard, because we're all
concerned he just had his last
chemo, and so we're hoping this
will put him in remission, and
he will be back on the road
soon, and I know he's looking
forward to that as well, but I I
think there's a bond there when
you've been together for that
long. So some of the family
members I certainly still stay
in contact with, and they do
with me
and Brenda, I would think, you
know, the passing of Joe Bonsall
had to be just really, really
tough,
very tough, because he was such
an active, vibrant person and so
positive. And, I mean, he would
be on stage. He was the one, you
know, jumping all over the place
and active, and he that's how he
was off stage, too. And so I
think it took everyone by
surprise. And I was close with
Joe. I'm the one who got him his
facilitated his first book deal
and made him a published author,
and so I became very close with
him, working with him one on one
about that, you know, during
that time and his
excitement Well, you know, years
ago, I was at MCA Records. I was
a promotion guy for MCA back in
the 80s, and had quite a bit of
dealings with the Oaks way back
when. When were you with the Oak
Ridge Boys? You said you were a
young woman. But what time
period was that
I start? I began working for the
Oaks in 1985
okay, 21 all right, well, I was
24 in 1985 and when I came, I
came to MCA in 1985
and I'm, you know, we probably,
yeah, American vagabond, yeah,
yes, we probably have had some
dealings with one another way
back when, and didn't realize
it. But so yeah, we hit the town
at the same time.
Yes, and I. Guess I started. I
was William's personal
assistant, and he came out with
a solo album on MCA,
yes, I recall that, yep, yep,
yeah. From where, yeah, we
worked that record, you bet,
yeah.
And that's during that time, is
when I met Pam Lewis, oh yeah.
They're really alive
professionally. And it was
during that time that I met her,
yeah, all right, cool.
Did you work with Pam Lewis in
any way?
Very much so. And I speak about
that in the book a little bit. I
met her working with, you know,
American vagabond, helping do
that. But when I met Pam, I was
pretty much a gopher and a
secretary for her during
American Vagabond and just
observing her as a publicist,
and I was very impressed with
her work and ideas and marketing
people and publicize,
publicizing people out of using
unique ways. She was a bohemian
Yankee and I was a pre southern
girl, and for some reason, we
really hit it off during that
time. And after American
Vagabond and after the Oaks
parted ways, I would run into
Pam at different events, usually
award shows or in the ladies
room at different gatherings.
And every time she'd come out,
she'd hit me up. She'd say, I'm
going to start managing someone.
Bob Dole and I are going to
manage someone, and he, we're
going to make him bigger than
country. That's what she kept
saying, the phrase she kept
saying over and over again. And
at the time, I thought, What do
you mean bigger than country? I
didn't say anything, but that,
it struck me that she would say
that. And she always had
cassette tapes at that time all
over her, in her bag, in her
pockets, and she would hand me
the latest cassette on him, and
I would ask her, Well, what
record label Do you have him on?
And she says, We haven't secured
one yet, but we will. And I
wouldn't see her for six or
eight months later, and she
would go through the same spiel,
and I would once again say, what
record label Have you secured?
And we haven't yet, but we will.
He's going to be bigger than
country. And sure enough,
they've secured a deal for him,
and he became bigger than
country, and that was Garth
Brooks. And so when my husband
and I were going through some
very serious financial strain
because he was no longer an Oak
Ridge boy, it changed overnight,
overnight, and we were in a
serious shape. So I hit Music
Row in my high heels and
business suit, looking for a
job. And I speak about this a
little bit about how this
changed my direction forever. To
this day, I happened to see
Doyle Lewis management as I was
knocking on many doors, and I
hadn't seen Pam in about a
little over a year. And Garth
was Garth, and this was in the
early 90s, very early 90s. And I
thought, What do I have to lose?
I didn't even know if she was in
town, because they traveled so
much. And so I went in, I asked
for PAM. She graciously gave me
some time, and I went into her
office, and she closed the door,
and she's she's very cut to the
chase, and she said, what's
going on? And I said, Pam, I
need a job. And I said, I don't
care what you have available,
I'll take any job. And she said,
she reached under her desk, she
got her purse out and got her
checkbook out, and she asked me
how much we owed on our home.
And that stunned me, and I said,
Pam, I don't want your money. I
just want a job. And she said, I
don't. You can look at this as a
loan. You can pay me back what
you can when you can. And I
said, No, I don't want your
money. I just want a job. And so
she put her checkbook away, and
she's very blunt. I love that
about her. You don't have to
get. That's what she's thinking.
And she said, Do you want a
career, or do you want a
paycheck? Because I don't want
anyone working for me who just
wants a paycheck. And I said,
well, I need a paycheck, but I'd
like a career. And she said,
start tomorrow. And she taught
me everything about PR,
marketing, sponsorships. She
really took the time to explain
things, to show you know, things
to me. And a little over a year
I was a senior publicist and the
director of her sponsorship. And
that forever changed me, being
able to work around the number
one entertainer in the world at
that time, internationally, and
so working with his team,
publicist and team of marketers
who were and still are, the best
of the best in the business
really gave me the ability to
make a good living for myself,
and then later to be able to
make a good living for my son
and I. So it changed my life.
Wow, that says a lot for her and
a lot for you as well.
Well, I'm forever grateful to
Pam for doing that. Yeah.
I mean, she offered you a
mentorship, ultimately, at a
time in your life when you know
you you really, really needed
it.
I did, and you know, there were
a lot of people that you know
y'all both have been in the
business long enough that I'm
sure you've seen this. When
you're on the mountain, you have
everybody wanting to be your
friend. But when you slide down
to a valley, people will turn
their heads so not to make eye
contact with you, and so to have
someone, especially at the
heights she at that time, she
had won Manager of the Year, the
third year in the row
internationally for all genres
of music. I mean, she, pretty
much her and Bob Dole, held the
strongest hand in in the entire
music industry, all genres. And
so she didn't have to help me.
Yeah, I worked around Pam as
well, and I know exactly where
you're coming from. And you
know, she was part of that whole
MTV thing, you know, when MTV
started, you know, in New York.
So she, you know, she'd been
through the branches, you know,
yeah, and Nickelodeon before
that, you know, right out of
college, she started with
Nickelodeon, and then they took
six people to launch a new
network Nickelodeon did, and
that was MTV, and she started
with that, and then from there,
to make it to Nashville, she
went to RCA Records, and it is
my belief that she took a lot of
the contacts and a lot of the
things she learned working for
Nickelodeon and MTV to help
advise and steer Garth's career
to make him bigger than country.
You know, because a lot of
people who would never feature a
country music Act were featured
Garth at the beginning. A lot of
it had to do with the context
that she had made in New York.
You know, where she's from.
So, so now your life is changed
quite a bit. As far as you know,
you did divorce, went through a
divorce, and that is that can be
kind of a life change. Well,
very much a life changer. Where
you do say, now, what do I do?
And plus moving to what I guess
you already told us, but, but
now that you've moved to Austin,
how is your life there, and what
are you doing as far as your
career goes?
Well, it's changed. You know, I
turned 62 next week. You do not
look good so well. Thank you. So
I have my life has changed.
Except I am you still using
things I've learned over the
years? One of the another thing
that I write about in the book,
in the second chapter, which I
titled thank you for being a
friend, is that while I was
going through a divorce, and I
had just turned 50 years old, I
got to a breaking point. I
didn't know what I would do,
professionally, financially,
spiritually and always, I was at
a very confused time. And for
some reason, I. I reached out,
out of the blue on a day I go
into more detail in the book,
but I reached out to LIB
Hatcher, which aka Liz Elizabeth
Travis, and I don't know why I
reached out to her, or what made
me do that at that moment, but I
did. I didn't know what she was
doing at the time, because it
had been about four years since
she and her husband Randy Travis
had divorced. I didn't know
where she was living, what she
was doing at that time, but for
some reason, I just reached out
to her and I call. I had five
numbers on her. I didn't know if
any of them were still
connected, but I picked the
middle number and called, and a
woman answered and said, ETM.
And I thought, I've got the
wrong number. And she said, Who
are you calling for? And I said,
lib Hatcher. And she said, This
is she. And it stunned me.
And that's when I realized I
don't know why I'm calling.
I didn't know. I just had this
feeling, this push to call her,
and so I tried to get myself
together and sound professional,
because I did have, I had
admired her for her business
sense and level head over the
years, and so I tried to get it
together, but I turned out to Be
a blubbering idiot and just
crying, and it was just awful
and embarrassing. And she is
another strong lady who I
admire, who helped me because
she said, Brenda, I'm really
busy right now, but I'm going to
help you. And those words were
like manna from heaven at that
moment for me, of I'm going to
help you. And she said, let me
give you some advice. And I
write about this in the book in
great detail. And she said, you
know, you're going to have to
reinvent yourself. And the
sooner she said, it doesn't
matter if you were a good wife,
a good business partner, good
friend, whatever she said, this
is very much a popularity and
monetary situation will always
be that way, and the sooner you
realize that, and the sooner you
reinvent yourself
professionally, personally and
always, the sooner you're going
to stop spinning your wheels.
And so my reply was, Liv I'm 50
years old. I'm too old to
reinvent myself. Country Music's
all I've ever known. And she
said, Brenda, if I can do it,
you can do it. And she says, I'm
concentrating on the film
industry now. And she said, our
first film into theaters and not
into cable, is releasing this
weekend, and she wanted to make
sure that my son and I were in a
theater and to bring a friend.
And she said, You know, so I'm
reinventing myself. And she
said, Are you, are y'all going
to be in the theater? I said,
certainly. What's the name of
your film? And she said, God's
not dead. Oh, wow. And when she
said that, a chill ran up my
arm, not because, you know, at
that time, God's Not Dead,
wasn't even released and but the
chill ran up on my arm, because,
as I write about in the book,
before I called her, I had a
pity party with God. Out loud, I
was just, you know, boo hoo into
God and out loud, pacing the
floors and at my wit's end of my
situation. And so I felt like,
when she said, God's Not Dead,
that it was an answer, that he's
not, you know, he's going to be
active, and that he did hear my
prayers. And so with lib
hatchers or Elizabeth Travis's
help, my situation did turn
around with her intervention.
And God's Not Dead broke all box
office records that little film
internationally broke all. All
records. And so a few months
later, just a couple of months
later, it was her birthday, and
I texted her, and she was in
Italy, and I wished her a happy
birthday, and she texted me back
a picture when we had spoke
earlier, and I go into this in
the book, she gave me an example
that after her and Randy's
divorce, some individuals that
she was very close to, more than
business associates, wouldn't
return her phone call or
wouldn't return her email, and
that's when she realized that
she was going to have to
reinvent herself and not be able
to work in the country music
field, per se. And she said, you
know, she said it really hard
because they were closer than
just business associates, and
she had mentioned that in our
first conversation. And so on
her birthday, she when I wished
her happy birthday, she sent me
a photo this beautiful chocolate
ganache cake that said Happy
birthday was gorgeous with red
rose petals, and she mentioned
those individuals that did not
return her emails or phone calls
during a very hard time that she
was going through of
transitions. And she said, you
know, this was just delivered to
my hotel room. And she said, My
what one little movie can do?
God's Not Dead. So Liv and I
have become closer. She wound up
purchasing a home in San Antonio
about the same time I purchased
my home in Austin without even
knowing it. We didn't even know
that we were we wouldn't be in
that close of proximity.
Well, and you're, talking about
God. When you were talking about
something just made you call
her. I thought, well, that's a
God thing, right there?
Yeah, I hindsight, I see that,
you know, because at the time
when I had my 20 minute pity
party with God and saying, Where
are you? Are you hearing me? Are
you seeing what's happening to
me? Right after 20 minutes of
this, I collapsed on the floor,
and it was as if God said, Are
you finished? You know, I just,
you know, really was
disappointed in God at that
time, and I got an overwhelming
feeling out of the blue to call
lib, and I don't know why,
because we weren't, you know,
the few times I had conversed
with Lib, and it had been so
many years Prior, it was very
formal, distant and informal and
brief, I had nothing to offer
lib So for her to help me, she
had no reason to help me. She
didn't know me, really. She knew
of me, because when,
when she answered and said that
it was her
and I was trying to pull myself
together to sound professional,
I said, you probably don't
remember me, but I'm Brenda
Golden, and I know more. Said
that. She says, I know exactly
who you are, which stunned me
and so but at the same time, I
had nothing to offer her. I had
she had no reason to help me.
And at that time, God's Not Dead
was not God's Not Dead. So she
had not had the windfall
financially at that time from
the movie. So there was no
reason for her to help me, so
the fact that she did, I'm
grateful for
well, and two, I was going to
ask you about
about Frank Stallone, because
I've heard you.
What's your relationship a great
guy, he seems like he'd be a
great guy. I was watching, I
think Sly Stallone had a it was
a reality show, and it featured
him and his wife and their three
daughters, and Frank was always
on there. And I they're very
close. Yeah, it seemed like it
slime.
Frank are very close. You know,
he's one that you don't know
what he's going to say. He's
going to say exactly how he
feels, no matter what the
subject is. But I met Frank
through sly's stunt man and
stump stunt double Mark de la
San. And in fact, I spoke with
Mark delessandro yesterday. He
called me, and he's a crazy man,
but he did all the stunt body
doubles, stunt doubles for sly
since the second rocky Rambo.
He's Pirates of the Caribbean,
you name it this. This guy has
done it. He's one of the top
Hollywood stuntmen. So he's
also, he's, he's worked with sly
for close to 30 years, and so
he's very close to sly, because
he was his body double. He's, he
still is, you know, and stunt
double at times, even though sly
does a lot of his own stunts,
though, the stunts that the
insurance company will not allow
slide to do, Mark delessandro
does. So you can imagine how
crazy he is. And so Mark
introduced me to Frank, and I
worked briefly with Frank. Frank
is a very talented man. He, you
know, he wrote most all the
soundtrack to staying alive.
He's a Golden Globe nominee, as
well as Grammy nominee. He has a
great career of his own. He
performs, he sings, he writes,
you know, he acts. Has been in
great film. So I was going out
for I would go to Los Angeles to
see all the premieres of God's
Not Dead. Or do you believe
other Pure Flix entertainment
films, which Elizabeth is one of
the four partner, founding
partners of Pure Flix
entertainment. And so I was
going out there for, I want to
say it was the third God's Not
Dead. And I was working with
Frank at that time. So I took
Frank to the premiere to meet
Elizabeth and to meet all her
partners and so, but I worked
briefly with Frank, but he's
he's a good guy. He looks like
he don't know what they were
going to say.
Well, I noticed that by watching
that reality show, it seemed
like he would say anything, and
he's still that way. Well, as
far as Nashville goes, Do you
still have because Nashville can
be a weird town, as far as you
know, people will kind of, I
guess, break off from you if
you're not in the business, or
if you're not in the town
anymore, whatever. But do you
still have close ties to
Nashville as far as some people
go,
very much. So my best friend
still lives there, and I still
have very dear friends in the
industry, Scott stem, who I met
during the Garth days, and he
now manages Scott and has been
in so many other positions. I
have a lot of dear friends that
are still in the industry
because I booked talent. I still
have connection, you know, have
to correspond with Nashville, so
I still do that.
So what do you as far as now?
What? Because I really want to
read the book myself, because
we've all gone through this. We
go through, you know, changes in
our lives, and especially when
you get, as you said, the golden
years, because I recently went
through the same thing with
losing a job that I had in I
mean, I've been in radio for,
you know, nearly 50 years, and
all of a sudden that rug got
pulled out from under me, and
I'm thinking, you know, like you
say in this title of the book,
now what? And you have to
basically redefine yourself. Do
you think the book? Is it
helpful to especially I think of
women that go through a lot of
changes, as far as divorces and
life changes as far as careers
goes. Do you think it might help
a lot of women that are out
there that are going through
like, what do I do now,
from the beginning, I my purpose
for this is, if I was going to
write something, I wanted it to
have a purpose and not just be
some kind of, you know, book of
fodder, and because I needed
advice and help when I was going
through this at midlife, and I
wanted it to be for males and
females, because both males and
females go there are so many,
and I'm surprised. I've been
very surprised. The book has
only been released since January
1, but it was on Kindle was
released about them before
Christmas, and I was surprised
at how many people. Have already
messaged me or emailed me,
people, some people I don't even
know, both male and females, who
have said I can relate to what
you've written about. I've went
through similar situations, and
so that really you don't have to
be a female going through a
divorce. Are there so many life
changes from losing losing a
spouse, either from divorce or
death or the unexpectedly, or
having to relocate or having to
change careers? It just so
happened that when I turned 50,
in my golden years, I lost a
spouse to a divorce, relocated
to a new state where we knew no
one had to change career. So I
kind of went through it all at
one time, you know? And so it's
not a how to book as much as
this is what I experienced, and
this is what I learned through
going through that process.
Well, it does help to talk to
somebody that has it's more of
like relating to, oh, I've gone
through this myself, and I think
that it sounds like that's what
the book is like, is that
you're not feeling like you're
alone. Yeah, that's the big
thing. You can feel very
isolated and feel like there's
no one who can understand what
I'm dealing with.
Well, especially when you change
everything, like you just said,
going through a divorce, moving
to a new town, and starting
everything over that, and
especially at the ages. Well, we
are it can be daunting, and it
does help to talk to people that
have gone through similar
things, and it sounds like
that's what this book does,
yes, and to encouragement, to
give people encouragement that
there is light at the end of the
tunnel. It took me a long time
to realize that there, there was
a line at the end of the tunnel,
because I thought, this is never
going to end. This is never
going to get better. But to have
someone let you know that
things, there is life in your
golden years, there is life a
great life
after you have to make a major
change.
Well, very good. I hope the book
is very successful for you, and
it's been a pleasure to get to
know you and get to talk to you
today. And we just wish you a
lot of success in everything you
do. And by the way, are you? Are
you? Are you doing any two
stepping out there in the in
Texas? I am, Oh, good.
I knew the basics of two
stepping, but just the basic.
But these people really know how
to two step. And the whole thing
about it is having a strong,
good leader. And so I have been
dancing with a couple of men
lately who are great two step
leaders, and they make me look
look good.
Well, I think you can do that
pretty much on your own, don't
you?
Yeah, I agree. I think I would
take lessons on how to lead just
to be able to dance with you.
There you go. Well, we wish you
a lot of success for the book,
and the book is available
basically everywhere, correct?
Yes, sir, and it's called now
what? And by gosh, I've said
that a lot in my life, but I
really appreciate you putting
out the book and coming on this
show today, and we really
appreciate it.
Brenda, thank you, John. Thank
you so much.
Well, you guys be sure and join
us once again on circling the
drain. J, where can they catch
us?
Yeah, Johnny. B, thanks, yeah,
of course, you can track us down
on the website that would be
circling the drain.net, we've
got merchandise there, pardon
me, as well as all of the all of
our episodes, and, of course,
all the social media platforms,
Facebook, Twitter, our YouTube
channel, like and share and
subscribe to all that stuff. So
yeah, we try to be everywhere,
Johnny, we're
working on it. Well, we are. And
once again, the book is called
now what with Brenda golden? We
wish her a lot of success, and
we wish you will come back and
see us again on
circling the drain. That sounds
great. Thank you very much.
Thank you,
Brenda, I really appreciate you
coming.