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Lounge Lizards is a weekly premium cigar podcast covering Cuban and non-Cuban cigars, cigar reviews, cigar news, Habanos, spirits pairings, cigar culture, and the business of the premium cigar industry.
Hosted by Gizmo with Rooster, Senator, Pagoda, Chef Ricky, Bam Bam and the rest of the Lizards, the show combines long-form cigar discussion with honest reviews, industry news, history, travel, spirits, collecting, and conversations with the people shaping the cigar world.
Each episode typically centers around a featured cigar and spirits pairing, with regular coverage of brands including Padrón, Davidoff, Arturo Fuente, Cohiba, Montecristo, Tatuaje, Foundation and more.
Lounge Lizards isn’t a traditional cigar review show. It’s a group of friends sitting around the table, smoking cigars, sharing opinions, telling stories and trying to make sense of the culture and industry around them.
New episodes are released every Tuesday.
Join Lizard Nation and become a card-carrying Lounge Lizard yourself. Email hello@loungelizardspod.com to join the conversation and potentially be featured on an upcoming episode.
Welcome to the Lounge Lizards podcast presented by Fabric of Five. It's so good to have you here. It's a leisure and lifestyle podcast founded on our love of premium cigars as well as whiskey travel food work and whatever else we feel like getting into. My name is Gizmo. Tonight, I'm joined by Rooster, Senator, Pagoda, and Bam Bam.
Gizmo:And a plan is to smoke a cigar, drink some rum, talk about life, and, of course, have some laughs. So take this as your two hundred and fifty sixth official invitation to join us and become a card carrying lounge lizard. Glad to meet us here once a week. We're gonna smoke at Dominican cigar tonight, share our thoughts on it, and give you a formal lizard rating. We discuss what makes a palate strong and how one can improve it.
Gizmo:We hear from Lizard Nation on Padron, Maduro versus Natural, and we share new Cuban travel restrictions all among a variety of other things for the next two hours. So sit back, get your favorite drink, light up a cigar, enjoy as we pair 12 years age Doorly's Barbados rum with the La Aurora Family Creed series, Perserverancia in box pressed Robusto. A Dominican Robusto on the pod tonight, boys, from our friends at La Aurora. This one is from the Family Creed series, and it's called the Perserverancia in box pressed Robusto, and it's a 50 ring gauge cigar by five inches long. And boys, we are back for another matinee session.
Pagoda:Mhmm.
Gizmo:Look at us.
Bam Bam:Correct.
Gizmo:Sunday afternoon. I like
Pagoda:these better in a way. Why is that? You know? You come in in the afternoon. You smoke.
Pagoda:You have a drink. You're kinda free in the evening
Gizmo:to be able that for win or lose?
Pagoda:Yeah. I know.
Senator:The only downside, we're missing the rest of the afternoon football games.
Gizmo:Yeah. We're missing the 4PM slate.
Senator:This is not our contract. I'm gonna be contacting our union rep, but That's correct. We'll make an exception.
Pagoda:Listen. The game's gone for four hours. We'll dismiss in the first half.
Rooster:Yeah. Let's not make this a habit.
Gizmo:So, boys, we are back to the Family Creed series from La Aurora. This is the second one in the series. We did the Fuerte Sol, I guess, a year or so ago. And what a band on this thing, covering almost The entire cigar. The entire cigar.
Gizmo:Four... Almost... Probably four inches of it here. Right? Very diminutive
Bam Bam:stick. Very small. This would be a quick one.
Pagoda:Yeah. So, Giz, this is the one we tried up.
Gizmo:Yeah, so at Pro Cigar Pro Cigar. In February of this year, Pagoda and I had these. They were still unbanded. Think they were just about to go into production when we tried them. Were released in May of this year at PCA.
Pagoda:Now I remember this because we were talking about, you know, like, was looking forward to La Aurora doing something a little
Gizmo:more, you know, with an oomph.
Pagoda:Yeah. Oh,
Bam Bam:I could go for
Rooster:over to it.
Bam Bam:I need some oomph today.
Pagoda:Yep.
Gizmo:Yeah. Alright, boys. Let's cut this thing. See what we're getting on the cold draw and the wrapper.
Bam Bam:Very cold draw.
Rooster:Mhmm.
Gizmo:Nice. Mine just has a perfect amount of resistance.
Bam Bam:It's quite good.
Gizmo:It's nice.
Bam Bam:Very
Gizmo:good. I'm not getting anything super, super apparent on the cold draw.
Bam Bam:Touch of cedar
Gizmo:and a dark chocolate for me. Very nice. Little bit of fruit. Yeah. Maybe like a raisin possibly.
Bam Bam:It's quite good.
Pagoda:And it's, yeah, it's pleasant. Like, even, you know, it touched my tongue a little bit in the lips. It's pretty pleasant.
Gizmo:Mhmm. Alright, boys. Let's light this thing. The La Aurora Family Creed series, Perserverancia in box pressed Robusto. How much is this cigar?
Gizmo:MSRP BAM is 16. We got them for just under 14 from our friends at Small Batch Cigar using our code.
Bam Bam:Touch pricey, I think.
Rooster:For the size?
Bam Bam:Yeah. I'm officially out of juice and I need to borrow a lighter.
Pagoda:You can reduce the claim.
Bam Bam:I bought two canisters of the DuPont fluid and I can't find them. I am frustrated with that.
Gizmo:Well, you did just move your entire house.
Bam Bam:I know. And I I... Anything cigar related, I kept very close to me. I'm not sure where they... Where the hell they landed.
Bam Bam:If
Gizmo:you need some help finding them, I'm I'm more
Pagoda:than happy to come by.
Bam Bam:Okay. Okay, Pagoda.
Gizmo:I'm really happy. I think we should always be in pod mode.
Rooster:Pagoda's happy. He just made some money. Oh, did he? Yeah.
Pagoda:Good Good
Bam Bam:for I
Pagoda:mean, I could've made a lot more if Buffalo won, but hey, listen. Buffalo lost? Yeah.
Bam Bam:To New England?
Pagoda:Yeah. Again, New England has a number
Gizmo:for whatever reason. Alright. Back to work.
Pagoda:And New England played so crappy. Unbelievable.
Rooster:This is good on the light.
Gizmo:It's
Pagoda:very This good on the is excellent.
Gizmo:There's a little saltiness there.
Bam Bam:Mhmm.
Gizmo:Definitely, I think richer than the other La Aurora cigars I've had. Definitely. Which I think is a nice change of pace. I think with these lines, as we talked about with the Fuerte Sol, also a Family Creed, I think they're trying to reach for that Padron type of smoker, or that Nicaraguan smoker, that higher end, you know, putting La Aurora in that conversation.
Pagoda:No, I like that. Meaning, it's good that they're getting some stronger profile cigars
Rooster:in the $16 for a La Aurora. Isn't that a bit of a departure for them? It definitely is. For most of their lines.
Gizmo:Yeah. Yeah, think that they're trying to go premium.
Rooster:Just come in other sizes. And
Pagoda:I'll tell you, the one thing I can tell you is that since I've been to Doctor, we've been to the La Aurora factory, they're capable of so much more.
Gizmo:Oh, yeah.
Pagoda:They have the infrastructure. They're one of the largest, you know, they're The the
Gizmo:In the Doctor?
Pagoda:They have access to a lot of the leaves. They do a lot of stuff. Yeah, this is really good. Think it's
Gizmo:Yeah. A really good moving
Bam Bam:they grow their own product?
Gizmo:Some of, yeah, they grow some, they buy some. Okay. So let's talk about this cigar specifically. The wrapper on this is Pennsylvania Broadleaf. The binder is Mexican San Andres, and the filler is from Nicaragua, The US, and The Dominican Republic.
Gizmo:This comes in three sizes right now. The box press Robusto we have in our hand, 50 by five. The box press Toro, 54 by five and three quarters, and the Box Press Grand Toro, 58 by six. That's a big cigar.
Pagoda:Yeah. We should have tried that actually today.
Gizmo:So all of these ship in boxes of 20. And like I said, this one's 16, the Toro 18, the Grand Toro just under 19 MSRP. But with coupons like our small batch code, you're able to get them, you know, quite a bit cheaper.
Bam Bam:Getting a faint touch of pepper. Very faint. Enjoyable though.
Rooster:For me Deep espresso.
Senator:For me, the pepper is more than faint, and I'm... I've been trying to figure out if it's just it's hot when I lit it and that's producing the pepper or that's really part of the blend, but I like the flavor I'm getting. It's just not the most refined because the amount of pepper I'm getting, it, like, almost feels like there's a little bit of a bite to the cigar, and I'm hoping that settles down.
Rooster:I don't know. I'm not getting a whole lot of pepper.
Pagoda:I'm not getting a whole lot
Bam Bam:of Just a touch.
Gizmo:I'm finding it very... Pretty elegant. Yeah. You know?
Bam Bam:But I I... There is a faint touch of pepper for me, which I actually love.
Gizmo:I think the pepper I'm getting is in the retrohale, and there's a little bit in the back of my on the back of my tongue.
Bam Bam:It's weird. I'm not getting any pepper Just a touch. In the retrohale.
Gizmo:But it's not overwhelming like you're describing.
Senator:It could be. When I was lighting this, it's like half of this was lighting very easily, and the other half it was hard to light, so it could be a little overheated. So I'm hoping when this cools down that maybe it dissipates. Yep.
Pagoda:It's it's actually leaving a very pleasant, you know, like a slight fruity kind of profile on the top of a palate, meaning so I'm really, it's been very pleasant so far.
Gizmo:Yeah, it's like dark fruit, espresso. Very elegant commentary, Pagoda. Well, I'm learning from the best.
Pagoda:One day at a time. Well done.
Gizmo:So I gotta say, you know, listen, my Spanish isn't amazing. Okay? We know this. But the name of this cigar is the Perserverancia, which sounds like it's about 12 syllables in that word.
Rooster:I thought you would struggle with this, but you're
Gizmo:I practicing because I knew it was the name of the cigar. I was driving here like, Perserverancia, Perserverancia, Perserver.
Bam Bam:Like, I
Gizmo:was trying to not stutter over it because I know I'm gonna have to say it like 10 times tonight, but that's a long name for the cigar, and I've seen folks online, I don't think anybody's pronouncing it consistently
Bam Bam:Not like you.
Gizmo:Or accurately. Yeah. I'm sure I'm gonna mess it up a couple times.
Pagoda:I love the fact that you wanna maintain the authenticity.
Gizmo:I do. I wanna nail it,
Pagoda:man. I'll just call it the perseverance.
Gizmo:There you go.
Pagoda:There you go.
Gizmo:So like the Fuerte Soul line, this line is a nod to the Leon family, who obviously owns and founded La Aurora. So this is the second out of four, so we should be expecting two more lines in this series. So we'll see where they go from here. I wanted to share a little bit about Pennsylvania Broadleaf. So the wraparound this is Pennsylvania Broadleaf.
Gizmo:I know we've had Pennsylvania Broadleaf in here before. I don't remember what cigars, but we haven't really, you know, did it. We haven't done a deep dive on Pennsylvania Broadleaf, and I found a lot of this fascinating. So I wanted to share some of this. So most of the Pennsylvania Broadleaf comes from the Lancaster County area in Pennsylvania.
Gizmo:Most of it grown by the Amish. So obviously, the Amish don't use a lot of technology, right? So they grow it very much like they did three hundred years ago.
Pagoda:Wow. So it's very organic, you mean?
Gizmo:They use horse drawn carriages to plant in the early summer, and around August and September, the families are in the fields cutting the stalks with shears of what's known as Pennsylvania 41. The cut leaves are left in the sun for a short time to soften. The wilted plants, about five of them, then get speared onto a four foot long lath, a thin foot... Lathe? Lathe.
Gizmo:Lathe. A thin, flat strip of wood. The lathes are then stacked back on the horse drawn carts to be hauled to the sheds for curing. Just like Cuba. Farmers and...
Gizmo:Yeah. Pretty much. Farmers and their hired help get up at dark and work until dark. The lathes weigh about 40 pounds each. Tobacco cures for about two months in the sheds.
Gizmo:Then in November, the lathes are taken down. The leaves are a deep copper color. Then they get put in an unfinished cellar where it takes on moisture for a few days. The lathes are then taken to a stripping room where the leaves are removed from the stock and packed up. Stripping process can take more than a month for a farmer.
Gizmo:At the end of the process, the leaves are pressed and sent to auction or sold on the farm. Another interesting thing too, we use the word stogie sometimes, comes from the town Conestoga, Pennsylvania. That is the word stogie.
Senator:Can we... Do we have an extra one of these? He does. Is there an extra?
Bam Bam:Yep. It's not as well conditioned as that one.
Senator:This is this weird situation where it's like the wrapper is so thick, it's having a hard time burning. And the weird thing, I haven't taken a draw of this in, like, five minutes, and the wrapper is fucking hot.
Gizmo:Really? It's weird.
Senator:It's just staying hot. It won't cool.
Gizmo:Oh, you gave it
Bam Bam:to me.
Rooster:Look how dark the ashes. Yeah. It
Bam Bam:is. Haven't gotten through it yet into it.
Rooster:Almost looks like a Maduro, this wrapper.
Bam Bam:Really trying to smoke this one slowly.
Gizmo:Yeah. I think you have to. Yeah. I think if you don't, I think it's gonna
Bam Bam:It'll backfire.
Gizmo:Yeah. Think that's a good word for it. Mhmm. Do you think... Let me ask you a question.
Gizmo:Looking at the wrapper now that we've taken the paper footband off that makes up pretty much half the cigar. Do you think that it's intentional covering the wrapper like they do here? Just from the look of it?
Bam Bam:I don't think so.
Gizmo:Sitting in the store, or are they trying to do that
Bam Bam:It's not
Gizmo:Rocky Patel EPC thing? Like, this is obviously not a pretty wrapper.
Senator:Yeah, I'm sorry. I think It's pretty intentional. There's plenty to hide on this wrapper. It's not a pretty looking cigar.
Bam Bam:Mhmm.
Pagoda:If you
Bam Bam:were to hold a Pedron Exclusiva next to this, you think that's much better?
Senator:Way better.
Gizmo:Think it's better, but I mean, for me, I don't really judge a cigar
Bam Bam:Neither do I. On how
Gizmo:the wrapper looks. It's all about construction flavor, obviously. I do think And if you know the cigar. I do think when it's sitting on a shelf, I think covering that up like they do here, and like we've talked about with Rocky and some others.
Bam Bam:Anybody have an exclusive o?
Gizmo:I do not.
Bam Bam:No. I do. Yeah. Let's take a look.
Gizmo:So, senator, while you're pulling that out, why don't you tell the listeners what's going on with your cigar and what you're doing currently to alleviate the problem?
Senator:The pepper was definitely from the cigar burning too hot, and what was strange is I stopped drawing on the cigar for like a good five minutes, which with any cigar at that point, it would dramatically cool down. Correct. Usually, it'd even go out and you may need even need to relight it.
Gizmo:Was it because you were so intrigued by the story of the Amish?
Senator:Oh, of course. It was riveting. And so It a little late. I felt felt the wrapper, and it's like the wrapper is too thick, and it's struggling to burn, so it's just like bunched up at some parts, and it can't really burn through. And the wrapper just stayed hot, like, even five minutes in, like, it would burn your skin like that hot just to touch it.
Senator:So something's off with this wrapper that's just... It's struggling to burn, and then when you draw, the cigar is already hot and overheating more, is why I think the pepper buildup.
Bam Bam:I will say it is a pretty thick wrapper.
Rooster:Sounds like user error. Could be.
Senator:Okay. Here's here's the difference.
Gizmo:So we're looking Can I
Bam Bam:see that?
Gizmo:We're looking at the Perserverancia, and we are looking at the Padron Exclusivo wrappers from a look standpoint. Bam, describe the two.
Bam Bam:Yeah. You're right.
Bam Bam:So the Padron is a... It doesn't have any blemishes or flaws. It's very consistent in color. The La Aurora, it's a touch darker, which I don't mind, but it's a little marbled. There's a bit more surface imperfection.
Bam Bam:Wow. That's very noticeable.
Gizmo:Can I ask you another question? It's not ugly though. Before you give that back to Senator, or give it I'm back to sorry.
Pagoda:Yeah.
Gizmo:I think these cigars are the same exact size. Five and a half by 50.
Rooster:No. Shorter. Exclusivo looks bigger.
Gizmo:The Exclusivo looks bigger to me. Look at the height. It is.
Bam Bam:It is bigger. It's about a half inch
Gizmo:long. But I mean also, I'm also saying in
Bam Bam:In diameter? Yeah.
Gizmo:In width. Maybe, I think the Exclusivo is a Exclusivo touch is 50 by five and a half. They look
Bam Bam:the same.
Gizmo:This is 50 by five, so they look the same?
Senator:The ring age looks the exact same, but there's definitely The half and half.
Bam Bam:Ex placebo. I don't think the law of Aurora is ugly, but
Gizmo:Well, I'll read you something else here, and I wanna shout out Holtz. This is where I'm getting this information on the Pennsylvania Broadleaf. The soil in Lancaster County is rich in calcium, nitrogen, and potassium. This helps make the tobacco grown there dense, tough, durable, and very combustible, senator. Pennsylvania broadleaf gained popularity as a binder due to these characteristics, but to make the leaves acceptable as wrapper, it takes a lot of time and significant fermentation to get the color to balance out.
Gizmo:So I Okay. This is not really a surprise to the manufacturer when they're getting Pennsylvania Broadleaf that it's not going to be very pretty. But obviously, it's offering something that works
Rooster:Do for the you think the price is a bit higher because of The US wrapper and
Gizmo:the tobacco? It's a good question. I mean, I would think US tobacco is more expensive than obviously growing your own in the Doctor, purchasing Mexica I San would think Pennsylvania has to be more expensive. No. I mean, maybe the exclusion on that would be like the Amish making it.
Gizmo:I mean, their cost to produce is probably significantly lower than Nick Mello making Connecticut Broadleaf up in the Connecticut River Valley.
Bam Bam:And they're exporting this tobacco to?
Gizmo:Whoever's buying it, guess.
Bam Bam:That's correct.
Gizmo:Who'd bidding on it. Yeah. You know? I think it's a very
Bam Bam:nice cigar. It's interesting. I'm getting a really good amount of cocoa. It's not super smooth. It's not super refined, but it's enjoyable.
Bam Bam:I can't say that it's giving me a hard time.
Gizmo:I think the edges on it actually make it interesting for me right now. It isn't like a super smooth smoke, but I think it's intriguing to my palate. I love the retrohale. It's really nice.
Bam Bam:The pepper's totally gone for me. On the retro and the traditional draw, gone.
Rooster:I mean, pepper was kind of feigned for me, but that's completely gone. And this little bit of sweetness that's coming through with the espresso dark chocolate note.
Bam Bam:Espresso dark chocolate and then the draw on finish, a little floral note for me, kind of.
Senator:Flavor wise, this is already dramatically better. So I'm glad that I lit another one. Wow.
Gizmo:I'm glad we had another one.
Senator:That's why I was very quiet when I lit that because you guys all seemed to be enjoying it, and I was very confused why my experience was different. But this from the first three puffs
Bam Bam:Mhmm.
Gizmo:So where where's the pepper? I know you just lit it, but where's the pepper at right now?
Senator:Is it nonexistent. Oh, wow. Yeah. I'm getting a lot more sweetness, a lot more cocoa. I wasn't really getting that.
Senator:It was like very faint, and that pepper was just, like, the only thing coming through. So I think that was just an off cigar, but this is great right now.
Gizmo:So let me ask you a question because we haven't really... That really hasn't happened very much on this podcast. So for you specifically, and I'll then throw it to the other guys in the room, does that affect your rating?
Senator:It depends how it performs. So I'll say this, like, if if this, let's say, the stretch is a mediocre cigar, the fact that it's mediocre in flavor profile and I got a dud that I needed to actually light a second one to get an experience, it's definitely gonna factor in. If this blows, you know, it blows my mind and this is like a nine or a 10, do I really care that, like, I had one off one? No. Because I'm gonna pursue and chase that experience again.
Senator:So That's kind of how it would factor in for me.
Rooster:I wonder if you could've just cut the very end off and see if that would've
Gizmo:It's possible.
Rooster:Mean, the wrapper
Gizmo:is the wrapper, right?
Pagoda:I mean
Senator:Yeah. Mhmm.
Bam Bam:Leaves a nice coating. It's pretty It's well finish. Yeah. It's it's good. It's it's it's
Rooster:I'm looking at the ash The on ash is almost the same color
Gizmo:as the wrapper. Yeah. It's a very dark It's very dark. Yeah. Interesting little cigar.
Gizmo:Alright, boys. Let's go to some news now. A couple of things to share with you tonight. A couple of things I saw that I found interesting. We'll start with this one since we've talked a little bit about The US.
Gizmo:The import numbers were shared by Cigar Aficionado, and they were discussing that the numbers are down a little bit. Slight growth, not as aggressive as it was in the past. We talked about this before. There's really no surprise here. Nicaragua shipping a 148,000,000 cigars accounting for 61% over the first seven months of this year versus the first seven months of last year.
Gizmo:In second place, the Dominican Republic cigar we're smoking tonight from the Doctor shipped 47,000,000 cigars, just under 20% of all imports. That country had a decrease of 6.9% when compared to the same period last year. Now here's what's interesting. This is why I'm bringing this up. The number three producer, Honduras, is right on the heels of the Dominican Republic with 44,900,000 cigars, the 1,000,000 cigars short of the
Bam Bam:Was there an increase last year?
Gizmo:Yeah. Up 11% year
Bam Bam:over year. You know why?
Gizmo:Why is that?
Bam Bam:Because of this podcast.
Gizmo:Can tell yourself that, but here's what I'll say.
Rooster:It's Firebreaker zero zero five. A
Gizmo:lot of folks using code Lizard Pod. But very seriously, it is wild to see Honduras climbing the charts here.
Bam Bam:That's awesome.
Rooster:I
Gizmo:mean, they might in the next couple of years very well take over the number two slot importing into The US. Possible. Yep. It's very possible.
Senator:Crazy.
Gizmo:And you think about why, right? Obviously, a lot of manufacturers are bringing cigars in from there. I think the Honduran tobacco we talk about works for the palate, not just the American palate, but the fan of the Cuban cigar who can't reach them anymore. Right? And also, I think Hondurans generally are priced much more favorably than a lot of Dominican cigars.
Gizmo:Do you guys disagree with any of those things?
Senator:No. Totally agree.
Gizmo:So it's fascinating. And now there are talks about Nicaragua having some problems with the United States government. I don't want to use the e word, but if something were to happen economically, Honduras is gonna be a really important piece of, even more important than they are now, in the coming years, and I love to see it. Because how many Honduran cigars have we fallen in love with?
Bam Bam:Indonesian cigars may increase in popularity. You never know. Think the
Rooster:fact that the Cuban cigars are not coming in, they're not sending any, or they're not coming out of Cuba. And the Honduran tobacco being the closest thing to Honduran cigars, Honduran tobacco, that's a huge, I think, big part of the reason why you're seeing a
Gizmo:big import of Honduran cigars. It fits that profile. So those three countries that we just talked about accounted for 98.7% of all the cigars coming into The US. So you're talking 1.3% coming from every other country in the world in total is 1.3%. So these three countries are very, very important to this thing that we love.
Gizmo:So I found that fascinating. And I... Like I said, I just love to see Honduras, you know, really making a stand and and and increasing those import numbers. Definitely. Let's go to another one now, boys.
Gizmo:This one will go to Cuba. I have two things on Cuba for you here. This one is from our friends at Habanos. They have announced a new duty free exclusive Monte Cristo. It's called the Forgata, and it's the Duke size 54 by five and a half famously the Partagasiri E number two and some others.
Gizmo:But that's obviously the one I think this regular production wise, the one that most folks would have known or tried. So in late September at the TFWA World Exhibition and Conference, Habanos unveiled the monocrystal Fregata, which is an exclusive travel humidor created specifically for duty free stores. So...
Bam Bam:Interesting name choice.
Pagoda:Yeah. My question is, how long have they
Gizmo:been Forgata? The brand takes its name from the Count of Monte Cristo, the famous novel by Alexandre Dumas. Literary connection, they say, forms an essential part of its identity and has accompanied Monte Cristo since its origins, linking its legacy to the Cuban tradition and craftsmanship dedicated to the production of Habanos. The name Forgata itself evokes the ships that played a vital role in the story of the count of Monte Cristo where journey, discovery, and destiny form an inseparable part of the narrative. So these are coming in really fancy, nice boxes of 20.
Gizmo:The cigar MSRP is supposed to be just around $65, which I think is expensive, but it makes sense given the packaging and duty free. But it's just incredible that they still continue to announce these things. They're announcing these things, announcing these things, and they're not... There's no cigars coming off the island. It's like an exercise in Futility.
Gizmo:Futility. Marketing. It's marketing.
Bam Bam:It's propaganda is what it is.
Gizmo:So, like, what I wonder is, number one, duty free shops around the world are bare bones. We've detailed a couple that we've been, you know, in and around over the over the last year or two. But you go through an airport right now, they may have
Rooster:Nothing.
Gizmo:25 cigars total in the whole place. So I doubt that they're gonna be seeing any of these anytime soon. The Monte Cristo Forgata Boys Don't get
Pagoda:too So essentially, a box is gonna be around 13 or $1,400? Yeah. Yeah. And Forgata one
Gizmo:more, boys. This one's interesting, again, on Cuba. The United States Treasury Department has further tightened the travel regulations to Cuba. So in a statement, the Office of Foreign Assets Control, we've talked about these folks before, OFAC, said that US citizens are, quote, no longer authorized to attend or organize professional meetings or conferences in Cuba, end quote. The new restrictions also eliminated the, quote, group people to people educational travel, end quote, category under which travel agencies have organized past tours to Cuba and tightened regulations on US college study abroad programs on the island.
Gizmo:These restrictions just went into effect a couple weeks ago. So what's wild about this, number one, is that makes any American under any reason, any election that you do on these... You know, when you go to... For the listener, when you fly to Cuba from The United States, you have to choose one of 12 OFAC general licenses. Now it's 11 because they just eliminated one.
Gizmo:The one that we've always chosen is in support of the Cuban people. Right? There's a bunch of other journalism, you know, arts, humanity, whatever. There's a bunch of stuff. What they're saying here is that even if you elect to go on any of those 11 others, you can't, for our intents and purposes, it is now illegal for us to go to the Habanos Festival.
Gizmo:Correct. So it's wild that Americans now are forbidden for How attending
Bam Bam:would they know if I had just happened to go to an event?
Gizmo:Well, I think there's a couple of things. I think we know that Customs and Border Patrol has really tightened things up. I think we know that and we've heard from story. You know, we've heard stories of them taking cell phones at the border to go through them. You know, when you go on one of these special licenses, you're supposed to keep a journal.
Gizmo:Like, when we went, we were supposed to have been journaling our entire time there.
Bam Bam:I can write in my journal whatever I like.
Rooster:You didn't do that, Gus?
Pagoda:Actually, I didn't. Chad J. Pity can write one.
Bam Bam:I don't have to write that I'm going to a festival.
Gizmo:Well, all I'm saying is, like staying at hotels, I am someone, I don't wanna play games with the treasury department, okay, with OFAC. Okay? You don't wanna be on the run? The Department of Justice because of the Only Cuban customs. Only Cuban customs.
Gizmo:That's the only people I'll discuss any of this with. But for real, I mean, it's that's a pretty wild development. And I'm wondering if this is just the first step many to eliminate travel down there. Like, they effectively have eliminated these travel services that exist in The US to take people there, you know, and get paid for it. Mhmm.
Gizmo:Pretty amazing. Yeah. No good. So does this... Or just obviously aside from the situation there, where are you guys right now on wanting or not wanting to visit Havana like we have done in the past?
Rooster:Well, after your commentary, this kind of... Know? Mean, you don't wanna
Bam Bam:We don't know. Wanna
Rooster:chance it.
Gizmo:You can still go in support of the Cuban people. That's
Bam Bam:still allowed. Of course.
Gizmo:You just can't go to
Rooster:the festival. Think the bigger problem is what's going on in Cuba right now. We don't know what the power structure is, what the power situation is, what's going on at the restaurants, what's going on at the Airbnbs and stuff. And you know, we can't really stay at any hotel. So that's...
Rooster:So you don't know what it's like.
Pagoda:I don't want to be deported. Scary.
Senator:I mean, I think we do know what it's like. I don't think any of us want to be there for it.
Gizmo:Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's really unfortunate because I really want to go back.
Bam Bam:Oh, I do.
Gizmo:Like I
Bam Bam:Oh, yeah.
Gizmo:Really want to go back.
Bam Bam:Correct?
Gizmo:That's that, boys, on news. And we're coming up on the thirty minute mark, and I think it's time to... Our palate?
Pagoda:Oh, thank you.
Gizmo:We have done, like, twenty minutes without alcohol. I know. It's parched.
Pagoda:It's a Sunday afternoon. Alright.
Gizmo:We have the Doorly's Barbados rum, 12 aged, coming out of the Foursquare Distillery in Barbados. Cheers, boys.
Pagoda:Cheers. Cheers.
Gizmo:Before we sip this, while we have it in the air, what a beautiful color on this rum. Beautiful. Beautiful amber.
Bam Bam:And the aroma is outstanding.
Gizmo:The aroma is very nice. It has a little funk to it, actually. Man. Which is nice. So this is also the reason why I brought this one in.
Gizmo:Number one, I had this at Pagoda's house over the weekend and it was awesome. But also, if you remember, did that American rum a couple weeks ago that was molasses based. This is also molasses based. So we're back to a molasses based rum. This one from Barbados.
Gizmo:And also, I wanna say one thing. The rum, the American rum that we had a couple weeks ago, I said was $78 and I was wrong. It's only 60. So the privateer, Navy Yard.
Senator:All right, let's go back
Gizmo:and We might have to So read you the warnings, I just wanted to share that, that I messed that up a couple weeks ago.
Rooster:But what made you pick up this bottle, Pagoda?
Pagoda:Actually, it was a gift from one of our listeners. Like, he's a buddy of mine. He listened to the pod and he's worked in cigar stores and he loves cigars and whiskeys and rums. Nice. So he was over and he brought this as a gift.
Pagoda:And yeah, I I've been loving it. I think we all have really enjoyed it so far, so this is great.
Gizmo:So a couple things on this. Obviously, 12 years age, like I said. ABV is 43%, 86 proof. The price was $32.
Bam Bam:That's outrageous.
Gizmo:Pretty damn good. Oh, yeah. And this is... I mean, it's even in the same bottle that Foursquare comes in.
Pagoda:Mhmm.
Gizmo:So this is a a sister product to the Foursquare that I think from... For rum enthusiasts, I think Foursquare stands at the top. Obviously, very high proof, but the the rum people really, really love and respect Foursquare.
Bam Bam:How's your cigar, senator?
Senator:Good. The only thing I will say, I don't like the thickness of this wrapper. It's durable for sure. Yeah. But I just find myself checking the burn line a lot, which I don't really
Bam Bam:I have to make a few corrections. Yeah. And mine goes out.
Pagoda:Yeah, it goes out pretty quick. Yeah. So it's gonna be difficult to smoke slow.
Bam Bam:That's correct.
Rooster:I don't know, mine has
Pagoda:Let's lot just of bounce through this.
Gizmo:Mine's not gone out.
Pagoda:Oh, yeah. Mine's gone out.
Rooster:It's a little inconsistent.
Gizmo:Mhmm. So let's talk about the rum. First, what do you think of the flavor profile? How's it working for you? How's it going with the cigar?
Bam Bam:Take another sip.
Pagoda:You know, I really like the texture and the viscosity of this rum. It's very flavorful, less sweeter than I guess Abuelo and the other Guyanese rum we were having yesterday as True, yep.
Gizmo:El Dorado?
Pagoda:El Dorado. It's... It seems very balanced to me, so I'm, like, really, really enjoying it.
Senator:You know what's funny? You mentioned the mouthfeel. The mouthfeel on this actually kinda reminds me of that El Leon Jimenez rum Yeah. That we had at PCA. That has
Gizmo:a lot made by these people, the La Aurora folks.
Senator:That's right.
Gizmo:That's right. That
Senator:cigar... Sorry. That rum flavor profile wise, a lot more cinnamon than this, but just the mouthfeel, even like the color, and somewhat like the vanilla note that you get in this, like you get some of that in that rum. To me, there's, like, some small parallels.
Gizmo:I wish there were a bit more vanilla, a bit more caramel.
Bam Bam:It's very easy to drink.
Pagoda:Yeah. Sometimes you could if you want something slightly sweeter. It's not that.
Bam Bam:No. No. It's definitely not that.
Pagoda:And it's got no additives. Right? No sugar. I think we checked for Yeah. This
Gizmo:So I I was looking around at that because Foursquare is very much known for no additives, no sugar. The guy who is involved there, Richard Seal, he is one of the most outspoken figures in all of rum when it comes to age statements, added sugar, transparency, or misleading product claims. He's been kind of a loud voice in the rum industry to try to standardize those things, you know, being the premier version of this spirit, you know, obviously versus what I think any lay person out there that any of us would talk to when they think rum. They're thinking, you know, Captain Morgan. They're thinking Bacardi.
Gizmo:They're thinking those things. Obviously, for us now, having gone down this journey, we're thinking Cuban rum. We're thinking the ones you guys just mentioned, we're thinking the florida cana, you know, the stuff that we're drinking with our cigars. Most of them have very, very little added sugar.
Pagoda:I think this is somewhere between the florida cardia seven and the abuela, think that's what I'd mentioned. And you know, in terms of even the sweetness profile, viscosity, you know, even the color, right? So it's really interesting for sure.
Gizmo:So like I said, this is made at the Foursquare Rum Distillery in Barbados. They produce, obviously Foursquare. They produce RL Seals, Old Brigand, the real McCoy, the highly sought after exceptional cask selection by Foursquare. Those are the ones that we've done in the past. Poohba brought that one in very long ago, and then we did one with Rob and Hamlet when they were here.
Gizmo:So Doorly's is the affordable gateway entry to this distillery. Obviously, in at $32 on this bottle. I think that's pretty incredible.
Bam Bam:Yeah.
Gizmo:So 90% of the rum that we're drinking is from ex bourbon barrels. 10% is aged twelve years in ex Madeira casks. The Madeira component is relatively small, but it gives the rum some additional dried fruit and wine influence, they say. So the expected profile, you guys have already named some of this on the nose. Caramel, vanilla, orange peel, banana, toasted coconut, dried fruit, and oak.
Gizmo:And on the palate, toffee, vanilla, banana, cocoa, roasted nuts, baking spice, and fairly prominent oak. What do you think?
Bam Bam:I don't know. A lot of those notes are missing for me. I wish it had a bit more flavor profile in some of those things that they mentioned. It's good. Very easy to drink.
Bam Bam:I don't know if it'll replace any of the rums that we're drinking for me, but it's very drinkable and serviceable. Funny thing is
Senator:the banana thing I didn't pick up, but hearing it, if you search for it, I do feel like it's there and I really like it.
Bam Bam:Fuck, I want some banana.
Gizmo:I'm not getting any banana here. I don't
Pagoda:know what about coconut. No coconut either. I'm sorry, chef is not available today.
Bam Bam:Yeah, I got no one to banter with.
Gizmo:So I feel
Pagoda:like Yeah. I'm really enjoying it though. You know, like, so I I don't know, like, I think the jury's still out in terms of... It'll definitely come into my rotation. So it's it's one of those where, you know, the first time I had it, I felt the same.
Pagoda:Like I felt like something may have been missing or not. But, you know, having it yesterday and even today, I'm really, really enjoying it. So I could see it easily come into my rotation for sure, especially considering the price point.
Gizmo:You know, value, man. You know?
Senator:I think it's very good. The only thing is I think you have to be purposeful about the cigar that you pair it with, and I say that because it's a drier rum. Yeah. So like a cigar that has more sweetness than this is even giving, I think will do well to balance out how dry the rum is. But a drier cigar with this rum, I'm not sure that the...
Senator:This spirit is gonna help that.
Bam Bam:Yeah. Exclusiva would be great with this. Yeah. I think any of the aging rooms would be fantastic, especially the Concerto. Agree.
Pagoda:Yeah.
Bam Bam:Cuban, RAS, I think would be interesting with this thing. Yeah. Possibly a schwa, schwa supreme.
Senator:I think most of the Fabric of Five stuff would do well with this.
Bam Bam:I think all of them. Yeah. Aladino. Definitely the Cheddar Yeah, Bon Robusto yesterday,
Pagoda:I think it did really well with this.
Gizmo:I actually had this at your house. Had the
Bam Bam:So hold on. You have a really nice pair of pants on, and you're lighting... You're you're relighting your cigar for the nineteenth time, and there are actually lit lit... There are lit
Gizmo:Embers.
Bam Bam:Embers falling. I don't want you to ruin your pants.
Gizmo:No. That's our ash meter.
Bam Bam:No. He's gonna end up with holes in
Gizmo:his crotch. Here goes another one.
Pagoda:Maybe some banana. Alright. I'll just
Gizmo:so right now in The U. S, there are six offerings from Doorly's. I thought this was interesting. I wanted to bring something to your attention, so I'll run through these really quick. The Doorly's white, which is the filtered young three year style, $30, the five year, $32.99.
Gizmo:So that's an American Oak x bourbon. The eight year, 2499. The XO, same price as that. That has bourbon aging and Olarozo Sherry second maturation. The twelve we're drinking, $32, which we already detailed, and the fourteen year, which is ex bourbon and ex Madeira, that's 54.99.
Gizmo:What I found interesting about this is the five year and the twelve are effectively the same price. That's weird. I don't get it. Yeah. In some cases, the five year is a dollar or 2 more than the twelve.
Rooster:Yeah. The fourteen year is like so much more.
Senator:Even the the white rum, you says $30.
Gizmo:$39.99. Make any sense. Their pricing doesn't
Rooster:I think you said make 24 or something.
Gizmo:No. 24 was the other two. The eight year and the XO were $24.99. Mhmm. The white is 30.
Senator:So what casks is this rum aged in?
Gizmo:So this is aged in ex bourbon and ex Madeira.
Pagoda:Only 10 So percent
Senator:the the thing that surprised me is, if I heard you correctly, you said the eight year is aged in ex bourbon and sherry.
Gizmo:No. The eight year is aged in American white oak. And sherry. The XO is aged in bourbon and Olarozo sherry.
Senator:Okay, that's what I heard. I would be very interesting to But try and just
Gizmo:it's $8 cheaper than this.
Bam Bam:Yeah. You know, I bet there'd be a touch sweeter of an experience.
Senator:That's the
Bam Bam:thing. No doubt.
Senator:We should try that. Yeah.
Gizmo:I will say, I like this rum. This is more my style. A little less sweet, That's true, I yeah. I really am enjoying this right now. Do like Foursquare, I just don't like the heat of it.
Gizmo:You know what
Bam Bam:this reminds me of also? What's that sherry that you like that we're okay with?
Gizmo:The rum? The Don Pancho.
Senator:The Panamanian rum. The Don Pancho.
Gizmo:This reminds me of that I in a
Bam Bam:think there's a touch of
Senator:I agree.
Bam Bam:Similarity to that one, which I like. I'm not in love with.
Gizmo:Like I preferred, as you know, the Don Pancho
Bam Bam:to Yeah, yeah,
Gizmo:yeah. And this is, I said it to you yesterday. You
Pagoda:did, did mention that yesterday.
Gizmo:This reminds me of Don Pancho.
Bam Bam:Me too, a touch.
Gizmo:Yeah, it's very good. So I I can't figure out how the five year is sometimes a dollar or 2 more than the twelve. It makes no sense to me.
Senator:The only thing I... This you just need a palate adjustment, but right now, I'm starting to really like this.
Gizmo:Not It's turpentine anymore?
Senator:No. It was never turpentine, but...
Gizmo:It wasn't turpentine for me.
Senator:I just think that you need to... Your palate needs to adjust to its dry nature to pick out more of the sweet notes, and once it does, it's like this bouquet of flavors just suddenly hits your palate, and you get a lot more sweetness than you were getting before.
Rooster:I think that's why Pagoda's palate is well adjusted to this.
Senator:That's right.
Gizmo:He drinks it all day. He's been
Senator:on a twenty four hour IV drip of this stuff. Right.
Pagoda:And by the way, listen. You know, feel free to have more than just a little bit. Take a little big gulp.
Bam Bam:That's right.
Pagoda:Enjoy it. Alright.
Gizmo:I've been told you're not allowed to gulp.
Rooster:Well, I
Bam Bam:don't know.
Gizmo:One of BAM's many rules. Chef does encourage it. That's true.
Pagoda:It's an easier, it's a very easy drinking spirit. Yeah. You know, like how I think last week or the week before when we did the higher proof rum, I was like, oh man, I was cringing every time I did the sip. This one's so easy to go down.
Gizmo:It's working with the cigar for me right now. I agree with you a little bit on the dryness thing, Senator, but it does work for me.
Senator:I Yeah. I'm backing off that. I'm saying once it adjusts, I actually think the sweetness really shines. And the other thing I'm realizing, I'm not sure that it's all just a palette adjustment. This is a new bottle.
Senator:Pagoda's had that bottle at his place cracked open for at least a week probably. Yeah. And I think that's had some time to open up because I didn't remember when I tried this at Pagodas being as dry as this started, and now all of a sudden I'm getting so much more sweetness, and I don't think it's just my palate. I actually think it's opening up, and now you're getting a lot more of the sweetness. I think it was tight to start, it a little hotter when you first took a few sips, now it's like smoothed out, sweeter.
Senator:I really like where it's at.
Rooster:And Pagoda was putting some ice in it.
Pagoda:Yeah. I I was putting one cube of ice, because sometimes I just like the spirit to be slightly cooler. And especially like on the deck, it was a sunny, nice afternoon,
Rooster:It was, you know,
Gizmo:just worked no, it was a perfect day.
Pagoda:It was a perfect day.
Gizmo:I drank mine neat. Was awesome.
Pagoda:But hey, listen guys, this, you know, please, next time, include a decanter. You gotta stop decanting all the time.
Gizmo:Another thing I need to bring.
Bam Bam:That's correct.
Gizmo:And clean when
Pagoda:I go home. I'm just kidding.
Gizmo:Alright, boys. We are coming to the end of the first third now on the La Aurora Family Creed, Perserverancia in box pressed Robusto. What's everybody thinking of the cigar right now? Just talked about it pairing with the rum. It's working pretty well for everybody.
Gizmo:But how's the cigar standing by itself for you?
Rooster:I think it's a good medium smoke. It's not very full. There's no pepper now. I mean, pepper was really that faint little bit in the beginning. It's good.
Rooster:I don't think it justifies a 16 price point, though.
Bam Bam:It's a touch expensive.
Pagoda:It's like a milder version of the exclusive or something.
Gizmo:In some ways, I almost think that that's where they're looking. I think they're looking at those Ipi Carrillo. I think they're looking at those Pedrons. And this is not an informed comment. I'm not getting any of this from any of the folks that we've spent time with at La Aurora or Manuel, the blender there who's an awesome guy.
Gizmo:Just from a profile standpoint and where it's reaching, I think it tastes a little more Nicaraguan than Dominican to me. And I agree with you, Pagoda. I think that there are instances here. There are moments that it could be padrone y. I don't wanna say padrone esque, but I think there are some overlap, a little bit flavor wise.
Senator:The the thing that's odd... So I agree with the commentary that flavor wise, this is a milder version of a Padron, but it lacks the refinement that a Padron has. So like this has a bit more of a bite or some rough edges
Bam Bam:It does.
Senator:Where a padrone is just so velvety and smooth. So that's what's missing, and that's why I agree with rooster. I mean, a $16 price point should have that refined, smooth, elegant profile, and that's lacking here for me. And again, this wrapper on this cigar, I mean, I watched... You know, Bam, I think, is usually very precise about touching up his cigar.
Senator:I mean, it looked like he was making creme brulee just to get his whole wrapper burning and relit at one point.
Bam Bam:It's that... It's a little problematic.
Senator:Yeah. And it's still burning uneven. And I saw him go the whole way around trying to get everything, you know, heated evenly so it would burn right. Pagoda's relit his. I've had to touch up mine.
Senator:This wrapper is problematic. Like, this is not effortless, the smoking experience. So what's detracting from my experience is constantly looking at the burn line It's distracting. Touching it up if it needs it, making sure that I'm not taking too long to draw because as soon as it goes out, it's gonna start to, you know, burn uneven. So I just...
Senator:Again, if this were an $8 cigar, I would be more forgiving, but at $16, these are things that have to be present.
Bam Bam:You know, it's unusual. Gizmo and Rooster cigars are burning beautifully. Think
Gizmo:And I haven't... You've not seen me pull my lighter off.
Rooster:No. We haven't had to rely on The glitter
Gizmo:and I have a bit
Bam Bam:of an uneven burn, and I can't tell what
Senator:I did before when I ashed, like, part of it was sticking up, and I had to light that to even it out.
Bam Bam:It's not a demerit for me if the cigar's delicious. I do like this cigar, and I'm not getting the harshness at all. But
Senator:Not harsh. It just doesn't taste as elegant as, like, you would expect a Padron or even an EPCORIO.
Bam Bam:Here's the unusual thing. I'll take a draw, and I'll let the smoke... It's kinda surrounding my face, and I'll take that back in. When I can do that with a cigar, it's usually very easy to smoke for me. So I'm not getting as
Gizmo:much of that, but fighting the wrapper is a little disappointing. Alright, boys. I have a couple things I want to get to tonight. I have something I wanna ask you guys about, but I first wanna start with this one. So coming off of the Padron nineteen sixty four anniversary Exclusivo in natural episode that we did, which was with that privateer Navy Yard True American rum that we just talked about.
Gizmo:Also molasses like the one we have tonight. Double the price, but very, very good. Obviously, an American product. On the FOH thread, I wanted to ask folks because we're so Maduro focused with Padron most of the time. And, obviously, we came out of that review saying, man, we've really kind of missed the boat here for as long as we have on the natural side, specifically to the exquisite, but maybe the 64 line in general.
Gizmo:We don't know. We have to try some of those. Right? So I prompted everybody on FOH to to let us know if they preferred natural or Maduro in Padron. Is it consistent across all the lines?
Gizmo:Does it change line depending? Is it vitola depending? So I wanted to get some some answers and and kinda color in our commentary here. So I wanna share some of these comments with you guys. So Lizard Enrique said, it's inconsistent for me.
Gizmo:I find the Exclusivo in Maduro has too much bite unless it's preceded by a Cuban, which changes the taste entirely for me. The nineteen twenty six in Family Reserve are always Maduro. I love the Padron Diplomatico in Maduro, but the Padron sixtieth in natural is a top five cigar for me. And the Little Hammer, which is the Family Reserve 50 in natural, is spectacular. I also find that Padron is the new world line I like in Maduro, having not had any Cuban Maduros.
Gizmo:This was a great loose episode. Kudos to the lads. Lizard Christophe, this was a great episode. I laughed out loud in the gym. Everyone was on fire, but especially chef.
Gizmo:He must have really liked that rum or had some special tequila before. He says, I'm with you guys. The Maduro has a slight edge, but I try to keep both stocked. I've only had the '19 64 in Exclusivo and Principe. And in the thousand series, he's only had the 2,000.
Gizmo:I find the same hold true across both lines. Other lines get a bit too cost prohibitive in Europe to do a lot of experimenting. While we're on the Padron, has anyone had the 1964 and Corona? And how does that compare with the Exclusivo? And is the Damaso worth a purchase?
Gizmo:So we'll... We're gonna hold on that question in a in a moment because I do wanna prompt you guys on that. John s says, I tend I tend to prefer natural wrappers rather than the Maduro ones in the Pedron lines. Having said that, I do not mind having the 1964 series in Maduro whatsoever. Lizards z says, I prefer natural in all lines personally.
Gizmo:I do like the Maduros, but I like the natural more. And he says, you know, there's also been a controversial rumor on this subject. Right? Never been confirmed by the Padron family, But quite a few experienced smokers have said they believe the Maduro wrapper they use is Mexican San Andres. So we've talked about this in the past.
Gizmo:In the industry, it's been talked about that Padron uses Mexican San Andres and just doesn't disclose that, says it's Nicaraguan. I don't know what's true or not. I know that there were some things in the past. I don't know if this is a game of telephone or verified. I don't have the information, but some folks do believe it's Mexican San Andres.
Gizmo:Says, I know at least two very experienced new world cigar smokers. People who have smoked Padron's for as many years and smoke eight to 10 cigars a day who think this to be true even though it's been denied by the family. I don't know if I believe it, but it's been circulating online for a while. So this one is from Lizard Bonos. He says, I'm not a Maduro fan.
Gizmo:The wrappers are thicker. Senator, you were just talking about that on this cigar we have tonight. I like the thin Cuban wrapper. I've only had a couple of Padrons, and I'm not seeking them out, at least not yet. So this one here from user Namaski Art eleven.
Gizmo:In the 1964 line, I prefer the natural wrapper as well, at least for the Exclisivo and Principe. So it's interesting. That one gets... Those two are the ones that are getting called out the most here. The big...
Gizmo:You know, the Robusto and the little one. Well, I appreciate the deep flavors of the Maduros, the dark chocolate and dark roast coffee flavors tend to hide more subtle spice and other flavors. For me, the lighter chocolate and coffee flavors give more room for the spice and earthy flavors and the creamy smoothness to come through. These are Jay Park three says, I like both, but I smoke the Maduros more. I prefer the darker coffee and rich chocolate, and I can't find them to have less spice, which I have grown to not necessarily dislike, but I prefer less of.
Gizmo:I also believe that they are consistent with each vitola, having their certain characteristics. I love the superior in Maduro. Finally, from Lizards Scott, he says, I've never tried the natural, and I love the Maduro. This episode motivates me to give the natural a try. Thanks, Lizards.
Gizmo:So I think, you know, Rooster, remember you... We were talking about it, and you said something like, I would assume that, you know, most of the folks buying these cigars are Maduro, and I don't think that's the case. I think a lot of folks are smoking natural, and in a lot of cases, preferring it. I have
Bam Bam:to say, if you're gonna smoke a cigar with a natural wrapper, I have a lot of respect in choosing the line of Pedrons to do that because they're very rich, and they're kind of a different experience than the line of Pedrons. They're almost different cigars, different performance. Well, my performance is excellent, but the flavor profiles are so unique and rich. I can respect the guy or a girl that pursues natural Pedrons.
Rooster:There are a lot of people who only smoke naturals.
Bam Bam:Let it be a Padron, because honestly, I have yet to have a decent experience. Probably gonna put my foot in my mouth with any other marker.
Rooster:Yeah. I mean, that's what I mean. In the Padron line, a lot of people do smoke only the naturals.
Bam Bam:Yeah, well, they're delicious.
Rooster:Yeah, but just talking about just one Vitola taking the Exclusivo, I think the Exclusivo in Maduro does edge out the natural.
Gizmo:It does. And I think that was proven by our discussion and our ratings on that episode.
Rooster:Yeah. But I would be curious...
Bam Bam:But what's interesting is that natural Exclusiva is still a damn good cigar. It is.
Rooster:It is. So if one is a nine, the other one is a 10. You know, it's like that close.
Gizmo:I think it was a nine seven, nine eight here. Yeah. Something like that. Or nine six, nine eight. Right?
Senator:Yeah. Thanks, Rooster. Well,
Bam Bam:you know, he smoked it when it first came out.
Rooster:But I'm curious how the other, the other Vitolas would do in natural.
Gizmo:Well, think that we're gonna have to... We've done a lot of Maduro. Think obviously that's been heavier weighted, but I think we need to start exploring some of the other Vitolas, especially the ones we don't smoke in both natural and Maduro and see what our preferences are.
Rooster:I got a box of the Family Reserve 40 fiveforty fifth in the natural.
Bam Bam:Really? Yeah. I'd love to try that.
Rooster:It's good. I think it's a bit on the... It's more pepper forward.
Gizmo:What? A little bit.
Bam Bam:Yeah. That forty fifth is a touch... It's a bit of a hammer Yeah. In Maduro.
Gizmo:Yeah. Alright. So I wanted to go back to Lizard Kristoff's question here. Has anyone had the $19.64 in Corona? How does that compare with the Exclusivo?
Gizmo:So I... We've talked about this, senator, the natural from, like, 2012, that box I had. Remember, we've tried those. They were excellent. I also have them in Maduro.
Gizmo:I don't love them like I do the exclusive, but I think the natural, even to comment on that, I think it's a little unfair because it just had so much time on it. It probably had ten, twelve years, right? I mean Wow.
Rooster:It's a lot. How'd you get a $20.12 bucks?
Gizmo:Damn. At North Korea, I found one hidden under the thing when I was buying my allotment, and I bought it.
Bam Bam:You still have those?
Gizmo:Yeah. Oh, I want one. You wanna try one? Yeah. Yeah.
Gizmo:They're natural. I also... I bought them in Corona because of... You know, for shits and giggles because the natural was so good, but the Corona, I don't like as... Or the Maduro, I don't like as much.
Gizmo:Haven't ever had a corona in Boudreaux. Have you had the corona in any other variation aside from the old ones I gave you in natural?
Senator:I think I had a young one, and it was not as good as the very age box we had.
Gizmo:In natural.
Senator:Yeah. In natural. Interesting.
Gizmo:So Lizard Christophe, I don't know if we can accurately answer that yet. As far as the question, is the domicile worth worth the purchase? So for folks out there, that's the Connecticut Wrap Padron. A little bit more on the mild side. I've actually never had a domicile.
Gizmo:Your father-in-law. My father loves them.
Senator:That's one of the only Padrons I haven't tried.
Gizmo:I think we should. What we have to figure out is which Vitola to grab because they have a bunch of them. Yeah. My father-in-law, he loves them. Everyone he's had, he loves.
Gizmo:Wow. But it's, you know, lighter cigar because when I want a Padron, I wanna reach for Yeah. You know, the $64.01 usually. Alright. A couple more comments here on this thread just about the podcast in general.
Gizmo:So this one is from Lizard John in Cleveland who writes us a lot. He says, I refuse to believe for one second that Gizmo doesn't rock a logo tee. You go to three Rush concerts in a week, but you never wear a Rush shirt. You were conspicuously silent on the entire conversation because I know damn well when you're hanging out at home, you're wearing a logo shirt.
Bam Bam:A 100%.
Gizmo:Okay. So that is not true. I am always wearing a plain black tee. I do not
Bam Bam:have Oh, you've got a
Pagoda:plain one now.
Senator:That's not true. You have worn from some concert that you went to a logo tee of some band.
Rooster:Mhmm. Barry Maniloff. Who would
Senator:this be? I'm positive because you were talking
Gizmo:about Nine Shales? Taylor Swift. Probably not. Yeah. I can't afford Taylor Swift tickets.
Gizmo:No, seriously. I wouldn't remember which one. It's gotta be Nine Snails.
Senator:Yeah. Because you were telling a whole story around it.
Gizmo:Yeah. I love my Nine Snails hoodie, and the Grateful Dead. Bam and I bought some But really, I mean, most of the time I can't tie Hold on, hold on. A tie dye.
Senator:Wait a minute. Are you saying Bam bought a logo hoodie?
Gizmo:He did.
Bam Bam:Yes. I did. What?
Gizmo:And a t shirt. He
Senator:broke his own rule.
Pagoda:But Graphic tees and hoodies.
Rooster:this, how this comes up.
Pagoda:It's been on.
Gizmo:But He wears them with flip flops.
Bam Bam:So that hoodie is so warm and cozy.
Gizmo:Oh, it's great.
Bam Bam:I wear it at home in the winter. Never leave the house
Rooster:with it. Can you wear it on our next pod? No. That's gotta be
Bam Bam:on It's actually quite
Rooster:put it up on Instagram.
Bam Bam:It's like... It's got this bluish grayish tone to it. Yeah. It's a light blue Got a lightning bolt on it.
Rooster:It's not a tie,
Bam Bam:No. It's not overly graphic. You know?
Rooster:Just wear it.
Gizmo:He continues on. Bam apparently doesn't go swimming during the summer unless he's on vacation. But if he did, he'd be wearing a three piece suit and wingtips. Well, I don't have a pool at home, so that's correct. On a rare cigar note, Bam and others wouldn't be so quick to napalm diplomaticos, the Cuban line that you'd torpedoed, if you'd smoked the Bushnido circa 2015.
Gizmo:Oh, wow. Diplo two, I could live without, but the Bushnidos, and to a lesser extent, the gold medals were gems. So I had a
Bam Bam:very old Diplomatico when we were buying Cubans. One of the guys that we were buying from sent a bodyguard. It was, you know, a gift. Right? It was...
Bam Bam:I think it was a 2,008. It was incredibly delicious. I don't know, maybe a 40 ring gauge.
Gizmo:I don't have no idea what it
Bam Bam:was, but outstanding. But every other Diplomatica has been uninteresting.
Rooster:I think
Gizmo:we did the fresher dip too when we revisited it.
Rooster:Maybe was pretty good. They needed a lot of age.
Gizmo:Yeah. But I know it's... It wasn't enough that I had even thought about it since we reviewed it. I mean, even in the moment, under the microscope, it was good, but
Senator:it wasn't like Yeah. It exceeded our expectations for the market, but by no means beat out anything else in its class. Away.
Gizmo:Couple more for you. Lizard Enrique said, I must chime in once more to say that this was one of, if not, the very best episode yet. Pretty wild. John in Cleveland says replying to that. It was a very, very good episode.
Gizmo:So thanks for the feedback, everybody. We really appreciate you guys tuning in and letting us know what you think. I also want to say the feedback on my conversation with the Cigar Soldier was really, really awesome. A lot of great stuff coming in from folks. A lot of follow-up questions that I'm actually going to save for our five year anniversary about the formation of the pod and a lot of the behind the scenes stuff.
Gizmo:So I'm going save that for our five year episode. A lot of great questions, and I think we'll prompt some cool conversation in a couple weeks when we do that. But just wanted to say thanks to everybody for listening to that and letting us know what you think. It was really well received. So very, very cool.
Gizmo:So I wanted to go to something else that actually is coming out of that same conversation because I said a couple times when we were discussing it that I felt that in the room here, I felt that I had one of the weaker palates. And I'm not saying my palate is weak, but I mean, I specifically said between BAM, Senator, and Chef, and, you know, I think you... The three of us, I think, are kinda on the same page.
Rooster:You might be the weakest. Could be.
Gizmo:No, seriously, I'm not putting myself What I'm saying is I think that specifically chef, senator, and Bam have an elevated palate, let's call it. And what I wanna discuss here, and I wanna ask you guys, is what do you think defines, what do you think the definition of having a good palate is? Because I have a theory that I think actually Pagoda will relate to on my theory, but I wanted to hear from you guys. What do you think it means when you say you have a good palate? What, you know, cements that?
Gizmo:Yeah.
Pagoda:Please let us know. Please.
Gizmo:No. Seriously, I'm not being facetious. I I'm I'm... Because I have a theory.
Senator:To to me, one of those things is just quickly being able to pick out a number of distinct notes that you're getting, whether we're talking about a cigar, a spirit, wine, whatever the case may be. I think that for most people and for less trained palates, it takes more time to figure out what you're getting. And I think just the more either your palate is that sensitive, you are just that much more experienced in some category that you're kind of experiencing and reviewing, you're able to... Like, your your reference points are much closer and you're able to more quickly pick out exactly what it is you're getting and pinpoint that. Or I think for others with a less sensitive palate or just a lot less experience with that product, it takes a lot more time to figure out what's happening.
Rooster:I think I feel like if you have had a lot of Cuban cigars, it makes it a little bit easier to call out some of those notes because they're very distinct. And you get the floral notes that you really don't get in the new world side.
Bam Bam:I would agree with that. Because those those notes are faint, if you're able to pick them up, it trains you over years of smoking Cubans. I think that's that's a pretty legitimate
Rooster:story. After smoking the Cuban cigars, I think it makes it easier to smoke some of the new world cigars and pick out some of those notes.
Gizmo:I could agree with that.
Senator:I agree with that
Gizmo:for sure.
Senator:Because I think in Cuban cigars, the notes are more subtle. In New World, for the most part, they're bolder. They're easier to figure out. So once you're forced to figure out, like, those more subtle notes, it becomes a lot more obvious when you get those bolder new world notes to just immediately be able to call them out.
Bam Bam:Correct. I think also the commentary about reference points is very important. We all eat. We all drink. We all taste certain things.
Bam Bam:I don't know. Think if you make a meal, we're all sitting at the same table having the same meal, I'd like to think that we're all capturing the same experience. That may or may not be the case depending on sensitivity and pace of consume... Consumption. There's a lot to, I think, smoking a cigar or having a meal or a drink very slowly.
Bam Bam:And I think that makes it easier for you to capture some of those subtleties in whatever you're consuming.
Senator:And I think also, chef is a chef, so by training, by nature, he's gotta be able to discern and figure out when something is slightly off. I've always liked to cook, so for me, I've also always been intentional about flavor notes and profiles in food, and obviously that's translated to wine, cigars, and other things. But I think when you force yourself, and and like everyone, I mean, think, you know, Giz years ago, you know, you said, oh, you know, I'm a novice smoker, your palate would have been an amateur palate then. But when you have forced yourself to be in this setting, your palate has grown tremendously over that period of time.
Bam Bam:No question. That is an I think exponentially, from when we met him initially. Oh, for sure. It's actually incredible how your, not just range of knowledge, but the sheer amount of cigars that you smoked and how you're commenting on them, it's impressive. It took me, I don't know, a very long time to understand what I was smoking.
Bam Bam:But I think all of us
Gizmo:have been on a very similar accelerated pace since we started doing this together.
Bam Bam:Yeah, that's true.
Gizmo:Because we've all committed to this sit every week, and we are, even as we've developed over the years, I mean, we've really gone deeper and deeper and deeper into those subtle things, even in cigars that aren't Cuban.
Senator:But that's the thing. It's like the, you know, this is where the experience also factors in. The sooner you commit to doing that, the longer the period of time is that you've been putting things under a microscope. As ridiculous as this will sound like, when I was in college, was doing single malt scotch tastings and buying different single malts and trying to pick out different notes and differences. So it just gave me an extended runway of trying to learn and figure out all the differences and nuances, but I had to force myself through that because my first sip of single malt scotch, I was like, why do people enjoy this?
Senator:This stuff is terrible. How old
Bam Bam:were you you had your first class
Senator:of scotch? Scotch, probably my junior year of college,
Gizmo:so Oh, that's young.
Bam Bam:That is young. I didn't have scotch
Gizmo:until What's
Bam Bam:that? I
Gizmo:You were 21.
Senator:Yeah. But that's my point. Like, I just started that journey early,
Bam Bam:and So so you're consuming things that me... I didn't start consuming until my late twenties into my thirties, honestly. So that's, you know, there's lot of merit there.
Senator:That's the thing. It's just giving more time. Exactly. That's what I'm saying. Like it's all reps and-
Bam Bam:But I will say, my bolognese has helped me a lot. You
Gizmo:took the words right out of my mouth.
Rooster:Correct. I'm
Rooster:like, you
Rooster:had some serious bolognese
Gizmo:That fucking bolognese, man. It got me over to hump. Alright. So I I wanna offer up my theory and see what you guys think of this. And I...
Gizmo:This is Pagoda. I wanna go to you specifically because you comment often very specifically on one thing that I completely relate to, and I think it ties exactly to what we're saying. You always say... You must say it almost once every time I see you, I have no memory.
Pagoda:I have no memory.
Gizmo:And I think that I have always had a little bit less of a memory, like quicker recall or like remembering dates and events. Like, my brain just doesn't, my ADD just doesn't capture things that way. Obviously, like you said, Bam, I'm obsessive, and I go down these rabbit holes, and I'm nuts about when I get into something, I go That's
Bam Bam:a very good merit
Rooster:to the wall.
Rooster:That's a
Gizmo:merit, yeah. But I think an additional element to success in this game is the ability to recall. Goes to what I was
Senator:saying, quickly being able. It's No the
Gizmo:reference It's like you've also stored it, senator,
Senator:You're in a way right. You're right.
Gizmo:That you're pulling it For sure. Really quickly. And I think, Bam, you have a great memory like senator does. Obviously, chef's in it every day, so maybe memory
Senator:Yeah, has it has a selectively great memory. Correct. True. We've learned this
Rooster:Very over the true.
Bam Bam:But when it comes to cigars, there are cigars I've smoked years ago that I won't ever forget, and I look for those notes in things that I'm smoking and capturing, And that's what makes this interesting too, because you can always go back to those experiences and hope to get them in maybe the same cigars are gonna be different. It's what makes it fantastic.
Gizmo:Would bet anybody out there either relates to the notes that are called out here or elsewhere on a cigar, and can identify them when they smoke, or they're under the microscope, they're putting themselves in a similar position like we do, I think the folks that are able to do it on a very, very high level have great memory, the ability Agree. To recall Totally agree. And I think that that, as I've been thinking about my commentary there, and I really believe that, I'm not putting myself down saying, You guys have better palates than I do, or whatever. I'm not putting myself down. What I'm saying is, is I think that is my weak point from a palate standpoint is like my storing and recalling to the level you guys do.
Gizmo:And that's why I said to Cigar Soldier, was like, I lean on those guys. You know, they have a stronger palate. So, yes, I can form good opinions as we're discussing and helping pick these things out. But anybody who listens to this podcast knows is we're getting into the first third. You three guys are really leading the conversation on notes.
Gizmo:Totally.
Senator:And in a way, even, you know, some of how you have to force yourself to train your palate. Like, for me, wine is the hardest thing. Yeah. Because, you know, for New World cigars
Bam Bam:It's a piece of cake for me.
Senator:They're meant to... For for New World cigars, they're meant to be consistent year to year. Right? So a Pedronix Lusivo now is meant to taste exactly like it did fifteen years ago. In wine, it is impossible for a 2016 vintage to drink exactly like a 2021 vintage.
Senator:It's meant to be the same thing, but it's impossible. The environmental factors... It's so much different with tobacco, wherein wine the environmental factors impact it to such a great degree that no matter how much they try, they'll get as close as they can year to year, but you will taste the difference. And when you force yourself down that rabbit hole which I have, it really really forces you to just discern the tiniest differences. To be able to say, what's different from a Schaeffer Hillside Select 2016 versus 2018?
Senator:To the untrained person, they would drink both and say, they're both incredible, I have no idea what's different. Early in my journey, I would have had the exact same answer. Now in my journey, I've had so many different wines, and from so many different years and regions, you start to be able to figure out what are those tiny little nuances that are different year to year, vintage to vintage. So I think there's also some ways to like force yourself, and I do think, you know, spirits are like cigars. They're meant to...
Senator:Macallan 12 is meant to taste the same today as it did ten years ago. Wine is very different, so I do think one way to do it is to be a chef. Yeah. I think another way to do it is if you're into wine to really explore that rabbit hole, it will sharpen your palate like crazy. You know, he's saying something that we talked about a while ago on this pod.
Bam Bam:With cigars in particular, you have to keep smoking. Just be consistent in your smoking. Smoke every week and stick with a certain repertoire of cigars and maybe once in a while step out of it, but the longer you smoke, you're training your palate, and you'll get to understand what you like and what you don't like. But you've gotta keep smoking. You can't do it in a week or two and then quit and then come back to it a month later.
Bam Bam:Good luck.
Pagoda:It's Groundhog Day for me.
Gizmo:Every day is a new day, every day oh, this day.
Bam Bam:I don't believe that.
Pagoda:I'm very easy to please. You know, it's really interesting because I was speaking to chef about a few things. So for, I think I'm probably the weakest of all, and you know, I'm kind of really proud of it. Not true.
Gizmo:I'm really proud of it. I don't agree with that.
Bam Bam:Neither do I.
Pagoda:You know why? Because I do represent a huge population, which are very similar to me. They're like, we don't go into these. So I think for me, it's very easy for primary flavors, right? Meaning which we all can experience.
Pagoda:Spice, sweetness, bitterness,
Gizmo:all those things, yeah.
Pagoda:But, and this is where me and our chef talked about, there are a few things that, you know, when you're kids, you're growing up with certain flavor profiles and certain things that you've really enjoyed over the years, and you kind of now establish those into your long term memory, for me, that's when it'll come out. Remember, like I talked a little bit about the glucose biscuit. Or you know, there's the salt and there's a red cayenne pepper mix, which is put on... Like in India, it's put on a lot of different things. So it gives you some kind of like a floral spice salty flavor, by the way, which is what I'm getting here now.
Pagoda:You know, so for me, it's a very recognizable flavor. Like I know that's exactly what it is. Now for someone who's grown up in a similar background as me, I grew up in India, they would be able to identify with those flavors. So there's also a bit of history where you grow up, you know, what kind of foods you like and and what is it that you enjoy. For people like me who are into primary flavors, so those come as exceptions in terms of the nuanced flavors.
Pagoda:But you know, I can't really go and pick up, like chef picks up tomato. I've never experienced tomato in a cigar, right?
Bam Bam:Neither have any of us.
Pagoda:But what I mean to say is like, some people just have like, you know, this exceptional ability to really break down flavors. For me, now there's certain cigars, you know, where when I get lucky enough to retrohale and you get these really specific notes, that's really an amazing experience. So a part of me does wish that I had your kind of palettes and the ability to recognize those notes. But at the same time, it does not mean I'm not enjoying, you know, the primary flavors. And I do know what I like and what I don't.
Pagoda:And at the end of the day, you know, whoever I come across, I always tell them, at the end of the day, the only thing that really matters is whether you enjoy that hour, hour and a half or not. And you'll begin to figure out over a period of time that there's certain flavor profiles in cigars that you gravitate towards, and you know you can bucket them. But, you know, I've been fortunate enough to be in the spot where I've been able to really try so many different types of cigars from different, you know, markers and different vitolas. Then it's been a great experience. But, yeah, like in terms of really trying to pinpoint the specific notes, and, you know, in terms of the reference points, like you, I have no memory, so it's very difficult for me to go back and relate and compare.
Pagoda:And, you know, so, yeah, I do... It is a weakness, you know, if you were to really think that the pod was only about, you know, just specific notes.
Gizmo:But I... Like I said to Cigar Soldier, if I was doing this pod by myself, flavor component of it, the flavor discussion of it, would be probably the weakest link in the whole thing.
Bam Bam:Oh, you'd be talking to yourself.
Senator:Everything would be pigs in a blanket. You're right.
Gizmo:Oh, let me get graphic And cheese all day hot mustard. No, but you know, we all bring something strong to the table, right? And what I wonder though, were you gonna say something?
Senator:Just two things I wanna add based on what Pagoda said, which I thought was very helpful. The first thing, you know, the reference points as you guys are talking about, sure, there's... Okay. If you have a really, really strong long term memory, it's easier to pick up those reference points. It's harder when you don't.
Senator:But regardless of that, the fun thing with reference points is that we all have different reference points. We all grew up eating different things.
Gizmo:Yep.
Senator:We grew up in different places, we've been to different regions and parts of the world, and the fun part of that is like, okay, know Giz is saying that some of us here have a stronger palate or a stronger memory. But what's fun for me, even in that, you know, camp, there are times that someone calls out a note describing something that they've eaten many times that I've never had.
Gizmo:Mhmm.
Senator:And so for me, I'm sitting there saying, I have no clue what that tastes like, but it's fascinating to hear because for them, they have that reference point. You know, when Pagoda brings up some of the things that he had in his childhood The glucose biscuit. Yeah. These were not things that I had commonly when I was young.
Bam Bam:Mhmm.
Senator:But it's fascinating to hear that. Yeah. And chef, obviously, you know, there are times he brings up foods none of us in this room have ever had, and so you're even learning reference points, and then it kinda, you know, I wanna try some of these things over time, and I may then start to pick them out. So the fun thing for me about the reference points is, yes, some have stronger recall than others, but we all have different ones, which is what really makes it interesting when you're trying to break down the profile of a cigar. People are gonna bring in things that your mind would have never thought of because you've never even experienced them, which I think is really cool.
Bam Bam:Mhmm.
Senator:The second thing I'll say is for the person who's trying to strengthen their palate, it's important to recognize what senses of yours are stronger than others. So for some people, they have a really strong sense of taste, other people may have a really strong sense of smell. Mhmm. Some people may have... Be weak in both of those camps, and that makes it harder to pick out the notes, but you have to know yourself.
Senator:Like for me, that's why I've said many times, my sense of taste is extremely sensitive. So for me, I don't need to retrohale to get the nuanced notes. Now if my palate, my taste was not as strong, I would desperately need to retrohale to pick up some of those more nuances, and I think for another smoker who has like a weaker sense of taste, like, you ought to be retrohaling if you want to pick up the full experience. So I also think you kinda need to know yourself to know what you need to do to pick up everything that you really should out of the flavor profile of a cigar.
Gizmo:I'm an audio guy, any suggestions? Just smoke from your ears.
Rooster:Yeah, correct.
Gizmo:We do see some smoke coming see out of it coming out.
Pagoda:It's like every time you're setting up everything.
Rooster:I think Pagoda also made a great point about, because of the podcast, we have smoked so many different cigars that we wouldn't have otherwise.
Bam Bam:Correct.
Rooster:So that makes us
Bam Bam:Very fortunate.
Rooster:Like a varied number of notes that we pick out on
Senator:different
Bam Bam:That's reference correct.
Gizmo:And it's a constant control. It's the same individual perspectives or backgrounds or, you know, experiences. It's the same group coming to each sit. Yeah. Right?
Gizmo:So we're all kind of bouncing. We've created a consistency there that when those things come up, I think it makes
Rooster:it even the other more point is, in the cigar industry, how important the blender is. I mean, you talk about Padron. Like, can you think about the blender that they have who's blending these cigars year after year and make it taste the same? And that's probably not true throughout in the cigar industry. It can change.
Rooster:Like you said, in wine, it's different each year. The vintage can change. But we smoke a Padron and it tastes like exactly the same.
Bam Bam:That is the hallmark
Rooster:of Padron. The blender is tweaking the blend each year to mimic what they did the year before and the years before.
Bam Bam:Sure. And they're smoking and tasting. Imagine how powerful their Yeah, their palate is. Sense of aroma, sense of taste is. It must be incredible to do that.
Gizmo:So boys, we've come to the end of the second third now on the La Aurora Family Creed, Perserverancia in box press Robusto paired with this twelve years aged Doorly's Barbados rum. What's everybody thinking right now?
Bam Bam:Well, I got a question for center. Are you still getting some of those slight rough edges that you noted earlier?
Senator:Honestly, I still am. I... Like, it's it's smoother, but the way your palate feels after, it... It's still lacking the refinement that I'm used to in some of the best Epi Carrillo cigars, some of the best Padron cigars. I'm I'm still wanting that velvety kind of finish, and it doesn't really have that.
Gizmo:This to me right now
Bam Bam:Are you feeling the same thing?
Gizmo:I'm gonna make a comparison point. This to me right now, from my experience, I haven't had a ton of them, is close to a very fresh thousand series Padron. Interesting. Where there's where there are those rough edges, where there's not as refined as what you're getting in the 1964 anniversary. But the problem here is this is priced
Bam Bam:A lot more, yeah.
Gizmo:At the 1964 anniversary price point. Whereas the Padron is what? Half the price. $8? Yeah.
Senator:I actually think the thousand series comparison is spot on here. Yeah.
Bam Bam:I have to say though, both with the spirit and the cigar, both started off a... So I had just a little bit of the spirit on your deck, Pagoda. I didn't have much. I thought it was fine. You should've come earlier.
Bam Bam:I know. I really just had a taste, and it was okay. Wasn't gushing over it. But as I continued to drink this glass, it has really become really quite delicious. It's buttery, I get a little bit of salt, things I wasn't getting when I was on his deck.
Bam Bam:So for me, it's it's actually an excellent experience. And I have to say, the cigar started out the same way. Wasn't interesting. It was okay, but I've got roughly an inch and an eighth left here, and this is just delicious right now. For me, it's really checking a lot of boxes.
Bam Bam:The retrohale is exquisite. The palate is really fantastic. I'm quite surprised how good it is right now.
Rooster:What about the price point at $16 Would you pursue the cigar?
Bam Bam:I'm not even thinking about the number right now. I'm just thinking about how I'm kind of enjoying this. And I'm really trying to smoke it slowly. I've had to light it maybe 15 times.
Gizmo:Yes. I'm borrowing his just not being out of fuel.
Bam Bam:Yeah, I'm using his fuel.
Rooster:Yeah, that's a demerit.
Bam Bam:It is a demerit, but the flavor I'm getting, it's a deep, deep coffee and a little dark chocolate, and it's really pretty velvety. I'm kinda surprised with
Gizmo:I'm what I'm getting enjoying this, I think, like I said, I'm enjoying this like I would a thousand series Padron. It's really right in that zone for me where I wish it was a little more refined. And when we talk about price, I'll answer your question, Brewster. I do think it's 4 to 6 to $8 more than it should be. Yeah.
Gizmo:Correct. Honestly.
Bam Bam:And it's not performing very well.
Senator:That's the thing. And to be clear, I mean, I I agree with you, Bam, in that I'm enjoying the flavor notes.
Pagoda:Mhmm.
Senator:It's just the delivery is not as refined Jagged. Jagged. As it should be.
Bam Bam:So that's part of the performance as well as having to relight it Yeah. 15 times.
Pagoda:Although, you know, like, me, in addition to, you know, the cocoa notes and a bit of coffee, I'm getting this, like I mentioned, this slightly, it's very light, this salt with the red cayenne pepper. It's got
Gizmo:a little, it feels like
Pagoda:a floral mix on the top of my palate.
Bam Bam:A little floral I'm getting.
Pagoda:Very pleasant. So you know, there's some cigars but don't leave a pleasant profile in your thing. And you know, was worried about this cigar in particular because you know, a lot of, you know between the Nicaragua and the Dominicans, if you're smoking an average cigar sometimes, it doesn't leave a really good profile. I was, but it's, from that perspective, it's been pretty good. But yeah, meaning in terms of the construction issues, and maybe, you know, we can attribute it to the rapper, yeah, meaning it does It's have its own challenging.
Gizmo:So I want to go back quickly to the discussion we had about the palette. I want to wrap that up with a question for you guys. And I'm asking this kind of as myself, but really for the audience out there. We have so many folks who write in, I have no palate. I have no...
Gizmo:You know, I can't understand how you guys could call all this stuff out. I don't relate to it. All I know is if a cigar is good or bad. As far as improving your palate, aside from improving your memory, which I think for me is what I need to do, right, or my my recall of it, and defeating my ADD to the point where I can actually print those things to memory, What kind of suggestions would you guys make to the listener? If you could have one, two, or three, specifically YouTube, but also you, Rooster and Pagoda, what what do you guys think people can do to improve it?
Senator:So I'm happy to start. I mean, a lot of people have asked me this question over the years, and there's two things I typically say. The first is, and this goes back to Pagoda's commentary around primary notes, you have to start simple. I think people set themselves up to fail when they're trying to discern notes and they're looking for complex callouts, like right off the bat. They're trying to say, I getting tomato?
Senator:Am I getting boysenberry? Am I getting honeysuckle? Mean, these ridiculous notes. You cannot start there. Like, it it will be impossible to figure out what you're experiencing if you're trying to start with that level of depth.
Senator:You gotta start simple. Is it sweet? Is it savory? Salty? Can I
Bam Bam:interrupt you for two seconds? Yeah. I love what Pagoda said. You can identify the primary notes, and I think that's kinda what you're saying.
Senator:That is what I'm saying.
Bam Bam:That's really where it all begins for us. Regardless of how long you've been smoking, it begins there.
Senator:So that's where you have to start, and once you can call out the simpler things like sweet versus savory, salty, acidic, all of those, then what makes it sweet? Am I getting honey? Am I getting milk chocolate? You have to then break down that
Gizmo:So it's a little flowchart in your Yes. Exactly. Here's the big branch and I'm going off of that.
Senator:Exactly. And so like, I'm getting chocolate, I'm getting cocoa. Okay. What kind of chocolate? Is it dark chocolate, milk chocolate?
Senator:So you just keep going down, but you have to start very surface level
Rooster:Mhmm.
Senator:Broad categories. And once you've mastered those, you go to the next layer. Once you've mastered that, you go a level deeper. So I think that's really key to being able to call out those notes. I've done it with people in the lounge, and literally, it's been fun to watch over a year's time, people be able to get more specific eventually, but they've gotta start simple there.
Bam Bam:Primary, yeah. It's great way to help your friends that are having challenges.
Rooster:Yeah, and also smoking different markers. And within the markers, smoking different votolas will differ. The more you smoke, more different regions Nicaraguans, Hondurans, Dominican cigars. So you'll be able to tell what tobaccos are, what they should be like, and what they are like. And sometimes even we are very fooled by some Nicaraguan cigars that don't smoke like Nicaraguan cigar.
Rooster:They might smoke more like a Honduran cigar.
Gizmo:And I think this Dominican smokes more like a Nicaraguan for me.
Senator:And the second piece of advice I would give, and this is meant to solve for the memory piece because it is key and it was a very good point because
Gizmo:Walk in here.
Senator:Yes. Help me. Honestly, it helps for a period of time to like cigar journal Yeah. When you have a cigar. I remember years ago for like Christmas, I think my dad had got me like a wine journal, and I used it for a period of time.
Senator:I definitely haven't kept up with it. But it was helpful for a moment in time for me to be intentional about writing down what I was getting from a certain wine, a certain vintage, all of that, And to have something you can go back to and reference if your memory is not instantly gonna take you there, is the only way, absent having a really really strong long term memory, to document those reference points, and then as you go back to them, they actually start to become part of your memory. Yeah. It'll be easier to call those out. So I would recommend for anyone that struggles with that, just journal.
Senator:I mean, it can be the most rudimentary, bedronex lucivo, earthy, chocolate, this, this was the vitola I had, and just move on to the next one. And that way, when you're struggling, I think this reminds me of something I've had, I'm not really sure, just go back to that, you'll find it, and it will start to get committed to memory.
Gizmo:You what's interesting about you saying that? Is I'm thinking about the times that I've called out different notes, and everybody said yes, I'm with you on that. A lot of the time, what I'm kind of feeling, and I go back to my ADD on this, is that I don't print to memory like average flavors, you know, a berry or like a Like, I'm always calling out some weird thing that I've had in my childhood that like is some off the wall chocolate or taste or flavor somewhere. It's like I don't print the stuff that's kind of like the every day. I'm only printing like the holy shit moments.
Gizmo:And I think that's impacting my ability to recall as quickly as I think you guys do. On top of the other things I think you're saying, I think, well, you know, just I think if
Senator:you documented those kind of true. Mediocre moments
Gizmo:That's it. Even if I'm sitting there and I... If I were to print, okay, this tomato tastes really interesting or this But You know?
Bam Bam:Those holy shit moments are also very important.
Gizmo:Of course they are, but it's not a complete
Bam Bam:No, it's not.
Gizmo:It's not a complete It's part of a database, I guess, would say.
Rooster:Have a new database. We need a lounge lizard cigar dossier. That's what we need to create.
Bam Bam:I gotta buy Pagoda journal.
Pagoda:My Lord, that's more work.
Rooster:He's gonna lose it.
Gizmo:By the way, was at that. Oh, I'm gonna put an air part in there.
Pagoda:You know what I do wanna say is two things. Firstly, like, if you were to pick up a cigar and listen to the pod and listen to what everybody's experiencing and go step by step along with all the lizards over here, I think you might get a sense of what flavors you can identify along with what's happening with the rest of, you know, the lizards. I think that's a really good, like, first step in the exercise. And the second thing is, do you remember class Kellner had done that?
Gizmo:The tongue.
Pagoda:The tongue. Yep. That's another thing, you know, if you look
Bam Bam:The at palate diagram, right? Correct.
Pagoda:And if you look at that, right, it'll give you a sense of what to experience where. Like if you really want to start delving a little bit more
Senator:into And those are primary notes, which is why
Pagoda:That's that's great. And so once you have got through that exercise, you know, hopefully you graduate. By the way, I've been still hoping to graduate into the next level. But hopefully you graduate into the next level where you can identify a lot more subtle notes.
Gizmo:Well, think this was a really interesting discussion. Obviously, a little selfish for me because I've really been thinking about this stuff as I've been thinking about, you know, a more complete palette and recalling better, and obviously then kind of getting myself to the point where I'm like, shit, my memories, Obviously, I don't have a strong memory here. And then thinking about you here, Pagoda, with with your commentary. But I want to throw this back to Lizard Nation. I would love to hear from Lizards out there who believe they have strong palates or do.
Gizmo:You know, maybe some Psalms out there. I'd love to hear from you on this. And also the folks that don't feel that they've developed this. What are you doing to improve your palate? I really wanna have a robust conversation over the next couple weeks or, you know, a couple months even as folks hear this episode and think about it.
Gizmo:Tell us what you think about this discussion and where do you relate? Do you relate more to Pagoda having no memory, me only having a select memory, or the other guys in the room who are recalling a lot of things much quicker because they have a more complete database and obviously the ability to pop into it pretty quickly and recall, you know? But... Yeah. So thanks, guys.
Gizmo:I I think that was really interesting and helpful. And, yeah, now I want to get to some listener email before we wrap up tonight. We're gonna start first with a voice memo from our friend Lizard Chris, and this actually ties into a little bit about what we were discussing. We were talking about the palate, but this is about palate fatigue going back to a discussion we had a couple weeks ago.
Rooster:Hey, Lizards. Lizard Guido slash Lizard Chris here. Just wanted to, you know, send a little note about the discussion you all were having a few weeks ago about palate fatigue when that one listener wrote in. And, you know, I I totally take what you guys are saying about letting a cigar be cooler in order to get flavor, but I wanted to share a bit of a perspective based on the journey I've been going through. Since last year, I've been having flashes of palate problems.
Rooster:You guys may remember my first ever, note to you that I wrote was about having some palate problems, not being able to taste things. Flavor has come and gone and come and gone. I was able to taste fully some exquisite sticks gifted to me by some wonderful folks, you know, some of you included. And for the past about month and a half, I could taste nothing. And so I finally went and decided to go to the doctor.
Rooster:My doctor sent me to an ENT, did a head CT. Found out yesterday that I have something called enlarged turbinates that may have resulted from my being sick, essentially for six straight months, because I have a toddler who is essentially a bioweapon. And that has been restricted. It's true. The doctor was explaining that 90 ish percent of what we perceive as flavor in cigars, even if we don't retrohale, is from retro nasal sensitivity, and the enlarged turbinates may be to blame.
Rooster:And so now I have scheduled in two weeks, so middle of September, to get them shrunk with lasers, after which there's about a four to six week recovery period. It's not certain this will fix it, but there's a really good chance. And so I wanted to tell folks that, you know, if they're experiencing some palate issues, talk to your doctor. I didn't at first tell him it was about cigars, said it was about general taste and flavor, but then I opened up and he was very receptive because especially if you have young kids around, things of that nature, I've been doing Flonase and Navage and that has helped, but not really. So if you get sick a lot, things of that nature, have a lot of allergies, the ENT was very specific that those things over time could cause this.
Rooster:Not within the same session necessarily, but certainly over a period of weeks or months. And so if other listeners are dealing with that, might be go, good idea to go get that checked. The other thing I wanna talk to you about is I am kind of mad at myself now because I feel like I've wasted the entirety of summer smoking season when maybe I could have gone in March or April when this was in its infancy and gotten it fixed. And so I'm a bit frustrated, kind of angry, but I'm trying to think ahead to what that first stick might be when I come back. And right now I'm thinking maybe a 2018 Sir Winston, maybe a Kellner eightieth, maybe something really special, or do you think maybe it's worth it to go with something that is really familiar?
Rooster:Something, you know, a little more basic, maybe an exclusive, something like that in order to really test it out. But thank you guys as always for what you do. Long live Lizard Nation. And I hope that maybe this could help anyone out there who's experiencing palate issues the same way I have been. Thanks so much, and, look forward to hopefully get to celebrate five years with you guys somewhere in the the New York Metro Area.
Gizmo:Great voice memo from our friend Lizard Chris.
Bam Bam:Yeah.
Gizmo:Sorry to hear that he's going through that. I mean, that's a Well, it's That's tough.
Bam Bam:Gotta give him credit. He's gonna go under laser surgery to improve his cigar experience. That's
Gizmo:That's a real Lizard
Pagoda:right there. Lizard. Please let us know how it works because I think I may have a super enlarged.
Gizmo:I'm gonna
Bam Bam:run a garden hose through
Senator:your nose.
Rooster:Might be a power washer. Yeah. Right?
Gizmo:Well, best of luck to Lizard Chris. So let's answer his question. He's coming back. Let's say he's got the all clear from the doctor after the procedure and the recovery time and everything else. Would you go to something crazy like that 18 Sir Winston, the Kellner 80?
Gizmo:No. Or would you start at something that's a little bit more everyday smoke?
Bam Bam:I think what you said is pretty accurate. Something familiar.
Rooster:Yeah. Familiar makes sense. Mean, you know, what if it hasn't changed?
Bam Bam:Right.
Rooster:And then you still don't taste a Sir Winston twenty eighteen and you're
Bam Bam:wasting Got a point. Got point.
Rooster:Got a point.
Senator:I I think that's it. My mind immediately went to, I think that lizard should go to their favorite cigar.
Bam Bam:Mhmm.
Gizmo:Mhmm.
Senator:Your favorite cigar. You know what that tastes like and what that experience should be more than any other smoke. And the only way to know if this has improved his, you know, sensitivity to flavor is something that familiar that he's either gonna smoke then say, this is... The notes are even more pronounced. This is even better than I remember some of my best ones to know that maybe this is working, or worst case, this is just as amazing as I remember the last one.
Senator:So Mhmm. I couldn't agree more with Rooster. I think that you gotta start with something super familiar.
Gizmo:It's almost like going back to something that you've calibrated your palate with, like the barometer. I think a lot of us, it would be that Exclusivo, right? You know, the in Maduro. Like you just said, I think that, you know, that's probably where I would start. Or even after coming off a cold or a sinus infection center, you were mentioning a couple of weeks ago you had one like, that's probably where I would start, like, as the barometer of like, Okay, am I back or I do I still need some time here?
Rooster:Yeah. And I wonder what caused this for him.
Gizmo:Yeah, was suggesting it was because of being sick as long as he was. I don't know if
Rooster:You know, it's a sinus infection? Could be,
Gizmo:yeah, I'm not sure. I'm not sure. But I've never heard of the issue he'd referenced. I've never heard that term. No?
Gizmo:It's like a chef Ricky medical term I've
Bam Bam:never heard of.
Pagoda:I'd like to suggest to Lizard, Chris, have more than one. Have all three on the same day, and you'll know for sure. Listen, if you've gone through some laser stuff, you need to treat yourself.
Senator:Hold on. Abundance.
Pagoda:Abundance. Yes. Enjoy.
Bam Bam:Piccata, did you get your nouveauge?
Pagoda:Oh, by the way, yeah, I I... So this... You know, the first nouveauge went to my old address in the city.
Gizmo:Which you haven't lived at in how long? How long? What?
Pagoda:So you're now
Gizmo:You've lived around here for how long? Ten years?
Bam Bam:How does that happen? Ten years.
Rooster:You had to put in that at
Pagoda:this No. You know what it is, is I think for some reason it defaulted to when I used to live in the city and I got into Amazon. But you checked the
Senator:So you haven't placed an Amazon order in ten years? That was the last address that
Pagoda:you No, I don't know why it automatically It's
Rooster:still on your profile.
Pagoda:It is. I've gotta delete that. The second
Gizmo:I said that you still have.
Pagoda:Yeah. So the second thing is I reordered it. I thought I ordered the Navaj, but I got something known as Nasal Fresh. It's the same price. So it's lying in a box at home.
Pagoda:So now I don't know whether to return it.
Gizmo:This guy needs guy
Senator:it and get the mud that we
Gizmo:Correct. Might tell Pagoda needs a personal assistant.
Pagoda:Absolutely.
Gizmo:Like, I think it's time that we figure this out for you so you can invest in yourself. How much would you pay
Pagoda:I'm not willing to marry again, I'm just saying, by
Rooster:the way.
Rooster:He needs a technical manny. He does. Yeah.
Pagoda:Somebody Muse. Muse. Is it Muse? No. Apparently, it's really hot nowadays.
Gizmo:By the way, I wanted to say something on the Navaj thing while we're talking about it. I went to pick up some more of those Navaj pods. They have a bunch of different kinds now. Eucalyptus, they have another one that's infused with a bunch of stuff. Make sure you're grabbing just the saline.
Gizmo:Like, don't accidentally grab the eucalyptus. I was wondering if when you said your nose was burning, if you had like a eucalyptus pod in there or something.
Bam Bam:No, no eucalyptus.
Gizmo:Like, no, I'm not making fun. Like, I almost grabbed the wrong one. The packaging's identical.
Bam Bam:I don't know what happened that day, but it was a bad day. I was awful for like a day and a half after that. My nose is burning, but I'm back on the Navajo and it's been... Honestly, it's changed my life. I have to be brutally honest.
Bam Bam:Me too, man. It's really incredible.
Gizmo:I do it every night. I love it.
Rooster:Does that also help your palate, I assume?
Gizmo:I think not getting sick helps my palate. I think not having sinus infections helps my palate. Don't I don't think it's done anything necessarily to improve my palate, but I think it's protected it. Yeah. You know?
Gizmo:Same. Alright. Let's go to one more here from Lizard Chris. This is a quick little add on here. See if we can help him with this.
Gizmo:I I don't have an answer to this, but you guys might. He says, hey, Giz. Hoping you guys can help with something. I decided last minute to go with my wife to Playa Del Carmen for a few days for our tenth anniversary. Congratulations, Lizard Chris.
Gizmo:I know there's an LCDH there, and I've heard that they have custom rolls next door that are incredible. Do you or the guys have any experience with this shop or those custom roll cigars? Anything you can recommend as being can't miss or counterfeit issues. Thank you so, so much. This week's episode had me rolling on the floor laughing.
Gizmo:Happy belated birthday to Senator, and long live Lizard Nation, Lizard Chris. I've been to
Rooster:that LCDH because we rented an Airbnb, which was very close to it. It next to I think it's next to a Haagen Dazs, if I remember.
Gizmo:Big ice cream guy.
Pagoda:I like that already.
Rooster:Yeah. They have an outdoor area where you can smoke. But this is also years back, where there was a lot of supply of Cuban cigars. I don't remember the shop next door selling custom rolls, so I don't know. But who knows what the selection is like now?
Rooster:Yeah. Has anybody else been there? I have not.
Senator:No, I haven't.
Gizmo:So I've heard things up and down about Mexico. I don't know specifically about that shop or the custom roles, but I don't have an opinion to offer on it. I would just proceed with caution. Correct.
Rooster:Just proceed with caution. Yeah. There's also one in Cancun, the LCDH.
Gizmo:Yeah. And by the way, Lizard Chris, please report back as to what the stock is there. Obviously, we talked earlier today about the issues going around... Going on with Cuba, LCDH, the stores, etcetera. So I'd love to hear what you find there as far as stock and how many Vitolas they have and everything else.
Senator:I would just say on the custom rolls, buy one, try it. Yes. And then make a decision after that. Don't just go in there and have someone sell you and, you know, you walk out with bundles of 20 of a few different kinds. Like, you have no idea what that cigar really is, so I would just strongly advise try one
Gizmo:first. And if you do bring some home, make sure you do the freezer protocol. Gizmo style, not BAM style.
Bam Bam:Correct.
Gizmo:Because you want to make sure you eliminate the possibility of Don't any put
Rooster:them next
Bam Bam:to the steaks. Stakes.
Gizmo:Entering into your
Pagoda:And when you're entering and when you're entering The US again, if they ask you, are you carrying any cigars, say no.
Gizmo:Alright, boys. It's time now to go to our lizard of the week presented by our friends at Bond Roberts. And our lizard of the week this week is Lizard J. Of course, Lizard j is gonna win a 10 count box of cigars from our friends at Bond Roberts. A lot of great stuff over there.
Gizmo:Obviously, you can find the Bond Roberts cigars at fabrica005.com. Use our code lizard pod for 10% off the entire store. So let's go to Lizard j's email. It says, hi, Lizards. With all the negativity, naysayers, and recent laws passed against cigar smoking, I've really appreciated hearing you guys talk about the aspects of cigar life that are genuinely healthy and wholesome.
Gizmo:For some of us, cigars are a great gateway to companionship and community. For others, they're an important part of self care. It is so relaxing to take the time to light up and enjoy a good cigar. Taking that time for yourself can mean the difference between thriving and burning out because you've given all your time and energy everywhere else and you don't have anything left. You need to be able to step away and take good care of yourself for a little while.
Gizmo:The time you spend alone with a good cigar is a personal meditation that resets your stress levels. Is cigar smoking as healthy as doing yoga? Maybe or maybe not, but I think the benefits are pretty similar. While cigar smoking can be a habit, I don't believe it's an addiction. Cigars are not cigarettes.
Gizmo:You will never catch someone huddled in the rain smoking a well aged Cohiba because they need a nicotine fix. A good cigar deserves a comfortable chair and the full ritual of toasting, lighting, and slow measured puffing. Maybe some rewarding conversation with friends or with strangers who can easily become friends even if they are of different ages or cultures as you lizards have done, which we discussed earlier tonight. That's one of the reasons I enjoy listening to you all, especially now that it's harder for me to get away to a cigar lounge. Without getting into too much detail, life has thrown me some challenges lately.
Gizmo:Sounds like same thing we just discussed with Lizard Chris. My dad is on hospice care and I'm doing what I can to manage everything. Some days it's a lot. Taking time for myself with the cigar has made a huge difference for my mental health. I am so grateful for a good cigar, not just for the experience of smoking it, but for everyone I have to thank for making it possible.
Gizmo:I wrote a little thank you poem called The Time of a Cigar that I'd like to share, though it might as well be called an ode to fabrica five for more than one reason. It It was actually something Rob Ayala said in a private message on FOH that reminded me how grateful I am. I won't share that message, but I will share what it inspired. When I don't have the time and mental fortitude to deal with a disappointing cigar, I'm not as interested in reaching for anything new nor dipping into one of my hard to replace Cubans or finding out it's plugged or not just very good. So I reach for a Mofo Magnum 44 almost every day.
Gizmo:Sometimes I'll have a Trinity Robusto or a Sovereign Sons or something else from the Fabrica five lineup. They do not disappoint. Reliably having a good cigar to smoke that I don't have to think about is such a blessing. Fabrica V never needs to be relit or having surgery done with a draw tool. They are stupid cheap for how good they are, and I can buy more with a couple of clicks whenever I want, and they are always delicious.
Gizmo:Reliability matters a lot more now. A good cigar is one I can count on to give me a little oasis of time to relax and recharge before I get back up to deal with the rest of my day. And that has meant more to me than I can describe in any other way. Alright, so I am going to read Lizard J's poem, The Time of a Cigar. When your burdens weigh down heavy past endurance and belief, when your duty sees no refuge, there is comfort in the leaf.
Gizmo:Grown in sunlight, sleeping shaded, shaped by hands of knowing folk, pray the gods of good tobacco grant the peace of gentle smoke, Bam. Yeah. When there's little room for mourning and the end of sorrows far, there is still a quiet comfort in the time of a cigar. Let the thoughtful clouds transport me for a little while away. I will rise in brave renewal.
Gizmo:I will go and meet the day. Praise the farmers and the rollers, the merchants, blenders, great and small, many hands that move tobacco. I am grateful to you all. With my thanks to all of you who make life a little better in ways that matter a lot, Lizard
Senator:J.
Gizmo:We should print that in large format, frame it,
Bam Bam:and put it in a lounge. That is very well written.
Gizmo:Very well written. Yeah. And and very apropos. And, know, of course, Lizard J, we're so sorry to hear what's going on in your world, and and hopefully, you can get back to enjoying a lot of cigars soon and hope everything's okay. But I really appreciate the time and effort that it took to not just put that email together, but to share that poem given everything that Lizard Jay is going through.
Gizmo:So we're very, very grateful. And for that reason, of course, boys, Lizard Jay is our lizard of the week. Very nice.
Pagoda:Our very own William Wordsworth.
Gizmo:Correct. Winning a 10 count box of cigars from our friends at Bon Roberts. So we're gonna wrap up there, boys. We have come to the end of our evening with the La Aurora Family Creed series, Perserverancia in box press Robusto, paired with this Doorly's Barbados rum aged twelve years. Any final thoughts on the pairing before we get into our ratings?
Gizmo:How did things wrap up for you?
Bam Bam:I think they ended beautifully. I think I've said for a long time, when a cigar or a spirit ends very well, it does leave a lasting memory.
Gizmo:It does. That last inch is very important.
Bam Bam:When it ends like shit, it's something you want to forget immediately. I think that's a lot of merit in what we had today.
Rooster:I thought the cigar was good. It was very pleasant. It was a bit one dimensional, but it was throughout the notes that we were getting. They were pleasant. I didn't quite get that harsh note or the little edginess that senator had mentioned.
Rooster:But overall, it
Gizmo:was a pleasant experience. Not bad. Save it for the rating, senator?
Senator:Yeah. My rating will reflect my experience.
Gizmo:Alright, boys. It's time for the former liquor rating tonight on the Doorly's Barbados Rum, age 12 years. Bam, bam, you're up. Smoking a nice La Aurora 120
Bam Bam:in one Honestly, very good. Surprisingly smooth. Much smoother than the initial delivery of the cigar that we had tonight. Like the cigar, for me, the spirit started off okay. It wasn't great.
Bam Bam:It took a while for my palate to adjust, but I think I noted earlier, as it adjusted, honestly, it became buttery with a touch of salt. And for me, I didn't get any banana, but I did get a good deal of dried apple, which has that funky, pungent... And it was very subtle, but that coupled with a little bit of vanilla, which was also very faint, it was quite delicious. I'm into my second glass. For the price, I'm going to give this a 10.
Bam Bam:It finished strong for me, and that's a big deal for what I'm consuming. I want things to end beautifully so that I can transition to another cigar or another drink happily, and it's left a pretty good memory for me. So this is surprisingly a 10. On Pagoda's deck, for me it would have been a seven, honestly. It was fine.
Bam Bam:It was a mild, very soft
Senator:You lose the company.
Bam Bam:Correct. I didn't burn out in front of your house. Actually came into your driveway. But it's actually very good. 10 for me.
Gizmo:All right, Pagoda.
Pagoda:A 10 for me. So you're right about the first, think when I had it for the first time with my buddy who presented this to me, I thought it was... You know, it just felt very different. But, you know, now that I've had a lot of it, I've consumed quite a bit yesterday and back to it today. There are a few things that I do want to mention about this.
Pagoda:From a flavor profile, it's excellent. It's very easy to drink. You can pick it up. I know this is $43.86 I'm typically around $40.80 is where I typically like most of my spirits. It doesn't feel harsh at all.
Pagoda:For me, it's very smooth, very easygoing, very flavorful. I've really grown to like it. The price point is excellent. And you know, the way I like to give my ratings is also, hey, is this gonna get into my rotation? This definitely is.
Pagoda:If I find it on the shelf, I'm buying a bottle or two all the time to keep it along with flodecarne, Vuelo, you know, I wanna have this. And I'm gonna be including this. There are a few things I really like about this. This is, you know, the viscosity is slightly more than what a flodecarne is, which is slightly lighter in viscosity, and it feels like a lighter spirit. This comes in slightly more, I think it's less sweeter than the Abuela or even, you know, the Guyanese rum, I keep forgetting the name for the Eldorado.
Pagoda:And we had that yesterday, and that was excellent right after. But having said that, you know, coming into the fall, into the winter, I could see myself smoke this a lot. In terms of versatility, yeah, meaning it may not pair well with every cigar.
Rooster:Gonna smoke the rum?
Gizmo:No, I didn't want to interrupt. In terms
Pagoda:of pairing and versatility, it may not pair well with every cigar, but still it offers so much. And for the price point and for the ease of drink and the flavor profile and the viscosity, there's something really elegant about it, very well balanced in my mind. There's no added sugar, so you can drink a bottle and you won't feel it the next day. It's a 10 for me.
Gizmo:So it's also a 10 for me. I mean, this rum is right up my alley. This is Don Pond... This is doing that Don Pancho thing as far as sweetness goes where I honestly... I...
Gizmo:When I drink the Forti Cane, had some last night with my father-in-law.
Bam Bam:I like this better than a Don Pancho. It's a touch better for
Gizmo:me.
Senator:Really like
Gizmo:Don Pancho. I like Panamanian rum. It really talks to me.
Rooster:I hear you.
Gizmo:I haven't had it in a while, of course, because we can't find it. But when I had the Forti Cano last night, for how much I love it, I was kind of having this moment of like, I wish this had a little more oomph to it. You know, I think this is a complimentary rum to what we drink and how we drink that if you're wanting something that has just a little bit more oomph, I think this is a great rum to go to as opposed to the Fortacana. Abuelo, I don't even have that at my house. I just don't love Abuelo.
Gizmo:I'll take Fortacana or Don Pancho any day over that. This one, though, I think I'm gonna get a couple of bottles of this, and I think I'm gonna keep it around. And Florida Con is gonna be my my a one, I think, that I I continue to go to. Obviously, Cuban rum would be in the picture too if we could get it, but I think this is right there with it. I I really enjoyed it.
Gizmo:I think the price at at $32 is crazy good. I love that it's coming out of four square. I love that it doesn't have any added sugar. I love the color, the viscosity. Everything about it was perfect for me.
Gizmo:I didn't need ice. I didn't need water. Really, really excellent for me tonight, so it's a 10. Senator?
Senator:I'm honestly shocked. Tens across the board. I'm in a strong nine. I think Pagoda said earlier that if he kinda put these on a scale based on, like, flavor and body, it would be Florida Cana on one end, Abuelo on the other, and this right in between. And I think for me, as someone who loves both of those on the opposite ends of that spectrum, That's why this is a nine, and it's because when I want something lighter, I'm gonna reach for florida cana.
Senator:When I want something fuller and richer, I'm gonna reach for abuelo. There's far fewer times that I'm looking for something in between those, so this wouldn't necessarily be something that I'm reaching for as often as those other two, but I would happily drink this. I think the commentary around it's balanced, I think it's very well balanced, I think it's a huge merit, no additives, any of that, like we talked about with FortiCany, which is great. It leans drier. I think, you know, the only limitation...
Senator:I can't think of any cigar really I've had that has clashed with Florida Cana or clashed with Abuelo. I think a drier cigar, this would have a hard time with, and I think rum is, you know, usually meant to be a sweeter spirit. So those other two rums in every instance, drier or sweeter as a cigar, a 100% of the time they fit. I think this fits, let's say, 80% of the time. So just because it doesn't have the complete range of versatility as those others, that's why I'm at a nine, but I think the flavor notes are great, and I would be really interested to try more of what they make, especially that XO that uses a sherry cast that we all typically love.
Senator:So I'm... I think for a new entrant as far as this brand, it's done really well, and I can't wait to try more.
Bam Bam:Yeah. Nine's a great score.
Gizmo:So boys, the former liquor rating tonight on the Doorly's Barbados rum, age 12 years, is a 9.8.
Bam Bam:That's impressive.
Gizmo:And before we get to our rating, I wanna go to our ash meter.
Senator:Did you get my picture?
Gizmo:I got your picture.
Rooster:Oh, boy.
Bam Bam:Oh, what?
Gizmo:Bam, do you wanna tell us what's going on on Pagoda's belly?
Bam Bam:Well, it looks like a map of the of the universe. You've got these clusters of, like, you know
Gizmo:Trillions of stars. Yeah.
Pagoda:Correct.
Bam Bam:It's like a map of Orion.
Gizmo:Bam just fired a a photo out to the entire Lizard Chat with the ash meter.
Pagoda:No. Absolutely. Listen. You're an artist, but I
Rooster:And consistent. That's like a work of art there.
Bam Bam:That's like, you know, Consistent.
Senator:Pagoda Van Gogh. Correct.
Pagoda:Know, since we're talking about this, I do wanna give a shout out to Lizard Alex for introducing us to this Thank you. I really, really appreciate it, Lizard Alex. And listen, any more suggestions from you, always welcome. And I know you have an excellent palate in terms of spirits and and cigars, and any recommendations from you, always welcome here. And once again, thank you so much for introducing us to a great, great spirit.
Gizmo:Thank you, Lizard Alex. And now it's time for the former listed rating tonight on the La Aurora Family Creed, Perserverancia in box pressed Robusto. Rooster, you're up.
Rooster:So I think the cigar is pretty good. It's not great. I think they kind of went after the Padron Exclusivo, but it fell a little bit short of that. I don't think the flavor is quite as refined as an Exclusivo delivers. The cigar, I think it looked great, had decent amount of flavor.
Rooster:It had the coffee, cocoa, even a dark espresso with a little bit of dried fruit on it. The flavor stayed pretty consistent. I think for me and Giz, the cigar performed construction wise pretty good. I think towards the end, there was a couple of touch ups that the cigar needed. The cigar does have a little bit thicker wrapper, so you have to constantly puff on that cigar because the cigar will go out on you.
Rooster:Having said that, if you're going after an Exclusivo, even if the flavor is not quite there, I think the price point is a bit high for the cigar. It needs to be a little bit lower. And it's a little bit shorter than the Exclusiva. As far as a value customer, if you're not going to make that size, reflect that on the price side. So I think at $16 it's a bit high.
Rooster:But it's a good attempt for La Aurora to go after a little bit of a fuller experience. And I'd be curious what lies in the future. So for that... For those reasons, I'm at a... I'm at an eight.
Rooster:Alright. Senator.
Senator:This was a frustrating experience for me because I do like the flavor profile of this cigar. There... This had all notes that I think we traditionally pursue and chase, and I thought the flavor for the overwhelming majority of the cigar was good. The construction, I'm gonna start with because that is what really significantly impacted my experience. I can't remember how many cigars on this pod I've had to relight as many times as a cigar, how purposeful I had to be about watching the burn line and trying to help course correct several times.
Senator:That significantly detracts from the experience. There was nothing relaxing to me about this smoke because of the construction. Halfway through the cigar... Mind you, my second cigar, I had two holes. I was just like...
Gizmo:Oh, you don't you don't like that in your cigar?
Senator:It was insane, and I had to smoke through it, and finally the rest of the bunching of the tobacco corrected, and I was able to get a normal regular draw, but for a good portion of it, I was... There was just air coming through the cigar, no flavor, that's a problem. This wrapper, I think, is very problematic. I really wish that they would reconsider a different wrapper. I think most of us in this room had burn issues and had to relight, and it was a direct result of this thick of a wrapper that just doesn't burn evenly, and therefore doesn't make it an effortless smoke as every cigar should be.
Senator:And the final thing is the refinement was missing from a cigar at a premium price tag. Yep. I can't remember that many, you know, $16.16 dollar smokes that just felt that they needed more age, some creaminess maybe to bring it together, something to just round out the flavor profile that was there. So for all those things I had to take off definitely for construction, definitely for the lack of refinement, also for the price point because it it does not meet the experience that it should, and so I'm at a seven. It's a soft recommend.
Senator:Would I smoke one again? Sure. Is it something I'm gonna pursue and buy a box of? Is it something that I would actively seek out, you know, to give others? No.
Senator:And the reason it it pains me is because the flavor notes are good, and I want this cigar to be great. I just think that there's some more work that needs to be done to get this to the level that it ought to be at. So I'm at a seven.
Gizmo:So I obviously... As you mentioned, Rooster and and and senator, you had the worst construction experience in the room tonight on two cigars. Mhmm. I didn't have the terrible construction experience. I had a relight once after I was talking quite a bit.
Gizmo:It was only one time. I think you and I... You know? So I'm not gonna... I'm gonna reward it for construction tonight.
Gizmo:The thing I'll say, going back to the conversation about the Padron thousand series, it's almost like the Padron thousand series is like the Gulf Stream flying through the air, perfectly smooth, no bumps. And this cigar was the Gulf Stream flying through extreme turbulence and like, you know, jagged. Delivery of this experience tonight was the opposite of refined. And I think while there were great moments and great flavors there, the delivery vehicle that we were presented tonight at $16 does not align with a cigar that is $16. If you wanna compare this even to the Padron thousand series at half the price, it's still one step below that in both flavor and performance.
Gizmo:I will give it some other kudos. The length of smoke, I looked, we all got, like, an hour thirty five, hour forty minutes out of the cigar tonight. That's pretty damn good. Coming in, I was thinking that this was gonna be a short episode based on how small the cigar felt in my hand. Obviously, that wasn't a...
Gizmo:It wasn't the case, so I'm very, very happy about that. It's too expensive. Might be more forgiving. I might be more forgiving if it was under $10. I might be a little bit more reasonable if it was a $9 cigar, an $8 cigar.
Gizmo:At $16, I think what we had tonight does not align at all with the price. Like Fuerte Sol, the the cigar that preceded this in the Family Creed series from La Aurora, I like where La Aurora is going. I like their intention. I appreciate what they're doing. I appreciate who they're trying to reach as a smoker.
Gizmo:I am looking forward to iterations three and four, and I hope that those are a little closer in experience to what we're expecting out of a cigar at this price. So we'll see how they do in the future. But tonight for me on this
Rooster:one, it's an eight. Pagoda.
Pagoda:I'm at an eight as well. You know, and I toyed between seven and eight. So the reason I'm in an eight is definitely what's driven it to an eight really is the flavor. The flavor profile for me worked really well. It was very pleasant.
Pagoda:There are a few things I look for in cigars in terms of the flavor profile. Obviously, you know, you want to enjoy the flavor. I want a pleasant palate experience, which it provided. I had a little bit of that salty cayenne thing going very mild, but it was very, very pleasant on the top of my palate. Having said that, you know, in terms of the construction, I let it like at least 10 times, think, maybe more.
Pagoda:Maybe more. And it's really difficult, and that's why I was between a seven and an eight because, you know, it takes away from the experience of smoking a cigar. But the flavor profile really did kind of compensate for it. For me, the smoke output was great, by the way. Like when I was, like I didn't have any, you know, draw issues from that perspective, that it was just perfect in terms of resistance and smoke output along with the flavor.
Pagoda:So it's a reasonably enjoyable cigar from that perspective. The price does not match what the cigar is. I totally agree with everybody. Like, you know, considering the price and the construction issues, you know, the flavor profile kind of added a little bit, so I'm at an eight, I've gone up, right, like I've gone up towards eight in terms of this cigar. I would like to try it.
Pagoda:I don't know whether aging's gonna help. I don't know whether the wrapper was aged a lot more before they, you know, distributed these cigars and brought it to market.
Gizmo:I wanna say, I think the two that you and I have had before this, not just at PCA, but in Doctor, were far better than this cigar tonight.
Pagoda:Absolutely. Yeah.
Gizmo:Like way better.
Pagoda:Way better. Interesting. Yeah. So I think that I would have rated it slightly higher.
Gizmo:Me too. I would... I thought coming in tonight, dude, I thought I was coming in at least a nine. Thought I was coming in tonight.
Bam Bam:Well, you're also at a party, so everything was really positive.
Gizmo:No, no, no. We were not at a party.
Pagoda:In tasting kind
Gizmo:of We were at like a real serious tasting thing. We were writing down, like it performed very, very well. No bullshit. It was good.
Pagoda:And I'm sure we had the best of the batch over there, for sure. You know, having said that, yeah, I mean, it's an eight. No. It's an optimistic eight. And Were there any agree with you?
Gizmo:Burn issues when you guys had a
Pagoda:bad experience? Zero.
Bam Bam:Not at all.
Pagoda:Zero burn issues.
Rooster:So these cigars came out of where? Bam's Tower?
Gizmo:In Doctor? No,
Pagoda:the ones Oh, we had
Bam Bam:no, that's not funny.
Pagoda:Yeah, no, yeah, but I do agree with you that I like where La Aurora is headed, Because you know, this is really going to come towards our flavor profile and maybe if you know, if they're able to just improve you know, these kind of flavor profile, like these kind of cigars, improve on them, I think you know, La Aurora is gonna become definitely one of those, you know, markers where it's gonna become very, very
Rooster:easy I think a different rapper on this would do
Gizmo:huge I think Night and Day.
Bam Bam:Could be, yeah.
Gizmo:With a Mexican San Andres on the rapper. So, you know. Mean, I think it would totally change the vibe.
Pagoda:Yeah. But it's very positive. I like where LaRue is headed with this.
Gizmo:Me too.
Bam Bam:Alright, Bam. So again, I'm very optimistic tonight.
Rooster:Good.
Bam Bam:I'm at a nine.
Gizmo:Okay.
Bam Bam:And for me, that nine, I justify it by that final third. It it left me wanting more because as I noted earlier, like the spirit, it didn't start off great, and it built into this really smooth, subtle, delicious, pretty creamy experience. I don't get that a lot in a final third of many cigars, except for the ones that we love. If I had that experience all the way through, this would've been a perfect cigar, regardless of price. I didn't factor numbers in on this one.
Bam Bam:Honestly, it was shocking how much I had to slow down my pace of smoke, which I think helped this cigar. Because if I would've burned through it, this probably would've been a seven for me because it would've been awful. But with all that said, I mean, when something leaves me with a final lasting experience, that's the ultimate... That's what I'm after. I'm after that in everything.
Bam Bam:I'm drinking, eating, and smoking. So for me, I'm at a nine.
Gizmo:Alright, boys. That puts the former Lizard rating tonight on the La Aurora Family Creed, Perserverancia in box pressed Robusto at an 8.0.
Bam Bam:That's pretty
Pagoda:I think that's a good score.
Rooster:I think
Bam Bam:it's a perfect score
Rooster:for this.
Pagoda:You know, it's really interesting because
Bam Bam:It's so unusual. I'm sorry.
Gizmo:Go ahead.
Pagoda:Yeah. No. So when, you know, when you're rating cigars, for me, I really enjoy the flavor profile, meaning I, like, and you're right, I think there were lesser of a construction issues. I would definitely be And
Gizmo:a lower price.
Pagoda:Yeah. And slightly lower price, this would, yeah, this would do so.
Bam Bam:Ultimately, this has proven to be an inconsistent cigar. Very We all essentially had kind of different experiences.
Gizmo:This was a significant step down from the two that Pagoda and I have had, and the one that you, Bam, and Senator have had
Bam Bam:Correct.
Gizmo:At PCA. Because he and I had one in Doctor.
Bam Bam:I will say, this Lancero, the one hundred and twentieth by La Aurora, is really worth trying. I'm shocked how creamy, biscuity, touch of sweetness, a little Coke. It's really well constructed, beautifully refined cigar. I didn't buy it. I don't know how much it is.
Bam Bam:It ended up in one of my bags that actually was gonna give away to somebody. I saw it tonight. Let me take another lot Aurora and try it, and I'm happy I did. It's very, very good.
Pagoda:That's that's excellent. Good to hear.
Bam Bam:Yeah. That's great.
Gizmo:Alright, boys. Let's compare this to the other two La Aurora cigars we've done on the podcast. We'll start with the sister cigar to the Lancero you're smoking, Bam.
Pagoda:Mhmm.
Gizmo:The one hundred and twentieth anniversary in Robusto scored an 8.7 on episode 154. Then on episode 181, we did the La Aurora Family Creed, the first out of four in the line to the one we spoke tonight. The Fuerte Sol in Robusto, same size, scored an 8.8. So what I will say, I said this coming in tonight.
Bam Bam:Not bad.
Gizmo:The cigar that we had in Doctor and at PCA was a better cigar, not just than the one we had tonight. It was a better cigar than the Fuerte Sol. Yeah. So I don't know what happened tonight. The disc scored eight points lower than that, that these cigars we got were just not great.
Bam Bam:But look, you have you have to admit, would you have ever thought that any La Aurora cigar would score eight and above
Gizmo:They've in this done a great job over the last couple of years trying to talk to a more premium
Bam Bam:far, they're doing okay
Gizmo:They're trying to elevate their brand, and let's see what happens in the future here.
Rooster:Yeah. They're on a good trend.
Pagoda:Yeah. They're good trend. A good trend. Yeah. Very positive.
Gizmo:So boys, we have to congratulate again our lizard of the week, Lizard J. That powerful email, the great poem. We really, really appreciate the effort you put into that email and sending us that Lizard J. Thank you so much. And of course, Lizard j is gonna win a 10 count box of cigars from our friends at Bond Roberts.
Gizmo:And to all the Lizards out there who send us your emails, your voice memos, your comments all over on Spotify, Instagram, YouTube, Reddit, DMs, everything, We really, really appreciate it. I try to say this every week now. You are the lifeblood of this show. We need to hear from you. It's really, really important for us to have this conversation with you all.
Gizmo:So please keep those comments, voice memos, and emails coming. We really, really appreciate it. And again, thanks to our friends at Bon Roberts for supporting our Lizards of the Week each week.
Pagoda:What? Oh, no. I wanted to add something.
Gizmo:Oh, what?
Pagoda:Lizard Chris, once you've done your laser operation and you find really positive results, please send us a note.
Gizmo:Know, because Send a referral over to Pagoda.
Bam Bam:He may need a procedure.
Pagoda:I'd say
Gizmo:You know what? If you call Lizard Chris, maybe you can get like a BOGO, a buy one get one
Pagoda:kind Oh, that'd be great. Listen. Little Chris, wish you the best. Hopefully everything goes well.
Gizmo:Yeah, man.
Pagoda:And hope you're back on track in terms of tasting cigars.
Rooster:And please write a poem.
Bam Bam:Very well written.
Gizmo:For Pagoda. And of course, boys, we have to thank Small Batch Cigar, the exclusive retail partner of the Lounge Lizards Podcast. Use our code lizard 15 for 15% off your entire order at smallbatchcigar.com. 5% rewards back on every order plus free shipping on every order. You can't beat it.
Gizmo:And, of course, the Laura Aurora cigars we had tonight, I'm gonna cross my fingers that they're a little closer to the first two that we had, and you can get them for under $14 each using our code at smallbatchcigar.com. We really, really appreciate those guys. And, boys, Drew Estate, our new friends at Drew Estate, the rebirth of cigars, you have to register right now for their thirtieth anniversary celebration and rewards program at de30rewards.com. If you are smoking Liga, if you are smoking Undercrown, if you are smoking the Tigray, anything from Drew Estate and you are not enrolled here, you are missing out. You gotta take your receipt from anywhere where you buy their cigars.
Gizmo:You upload it, you get points, and you get free stuff for smoking their cigars. You're already doing it, so you might as well earn something. Go to de30rewards.com and register for the thirtieth anniversary celebration rewards program. And finally, boys are presenting sponsor, FabricA five. They're the best.
Gizmo:I'm gonna have another one tonight with my father-in-law watching Sunday night football. Nothing better than Fabrica five. We love their stuff. The Lonsdale, especially, I've been really, really loving. It's actually replaced the Trinity Robusto in my regular rotation right now.
Gizmo:Really? Yeah. It's... Actually, I've slotted out the trigger Robusto, and I'm into the Lounge, though. I'm obsessed
Rooster:with it.
Gizmo:Great size. It's freaking great, Feels
Rooster:so good
Gizmo:in your hands. It's very similar to the Dahlias. It's like right there, but I really am enjoying that cigar. Dude, you're getting it for $8, man. Wow.
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Gizmo:Sign up for the mailing list at loungelizardspod.com or at my site, lizardgizmo.com. It's all the same thing. You're gonna win free stuff. It requires no action aside from you signing up and opening our emails. Loungelizardspod.com or lizardgizmo.com, whichever you choose.
Gizmo:And please, like we said tonight, chime in on the palate conversation. We wanna hear from you on that. Boys, one more time tonight on the Doorly's, Barbados rum, age 12 years, scored a 9.8, and the La Aurora Family Creed, Perserverancia, and Box Press Robusto scored an 8.0. A great night, boys. Yeah.
Gizmo:And we'll see everybody next week. Hope you enjoyed this episode. Thanks for joining us. You could find our merch store and ratings archive at our brand new website, loungelizardspod.com. That's loungelizardspod.com.
Gizmo:Don't forget to leave us a rating and subscribe on your favorite podcast platform. If you have any comments, questions, if you wanna reach out, say hello, tell us what you're smoking, email us. Hello at loungelizardspod.com. You can also find us on Instagram at Lounge Lizards Pod. We really appreciate your time, and we'll, we'll see you next week.