#43 Earwigs Are Very Good Mothers and the De-Ickification of Invertebrates with the Butterfly Pavilion's Jillian Luciow

In this episode of Why Distance Learning, hosts Seth Fleischauer, Allyson Mitchell, and Tami Moehring welcome Jillian Luciow from the Butterfly Pavilion in Denver (Jillian from the Pavilion!). They explore how live virtual learning programs bring invertebrates like butterflies, tarantulas, and crabs into classrooms through engaging, curriculum-aligned content.

Key Topics Discussed:

• Butterfly Pavilion Overview: Jillian shares how the Pavilion is the world’s first AZA-accredited invertebrate-only zoo, showcasing diverse species beyond butterflies.
• Live Virtual Programs: From close-up encounters with tarantulas to life cycle lessons, Jillian explains how Butterfly Pavilion’s virtual offerings align with educational standards and bring unique learning opportunities to classrooms worldwide.
• Technology & Innovation: The conversation dives into how high-definition cameras, and digital microscopes bring these tiny creatures to life in a digital environment.
• Memorable Moments: Jillian shares stories of “golden moments” when students’ curiosity sparks during live animal interactions.
• De-Ickification of Invertebrates: The goal is to help students appreciate the importance of often-overlooked creatures like cockroaches and tarantulas, fostering a love for nature.

Tune in to this episode to discover how virtual field trips and hands-on experiences with invertebrates can transform learning. Explore more about Butterfly Pavilion's offerings at butterflies.org.

About the Guest:

Jillian Luciow is the virtual and school programs coordinator at the Butterfly Pavilion, where she develops and leads engaging educational content. With a background in history and public engagement, she brings a unique perspective to connecting students with the natural world through live virtual learning.

Host Links:

1. Discover more virtual learning opportunities and resources at CILC.org with Tami Moehring and Allyson Mitchell.
2. Seth Fleischauer’s Banyan Global Learning builds cultural and digital competencies in students to prepare them for an interconnected and changing world.

Creators & Guests

Host

Allyson Mitchell

SF

Host

Seth Fleischauer

TM

Host

Tami Moehring

What is Why Distance Learning??

The Why Distance Learning? Podcast explores the transformative power of live virtual learning and its role in shaping the future of education. Hosted by three seasoned distance learning experts, this podcast delivers insights, promising practices, and inspiration for educators, content providers, and education leaders integrating live virtual experiences into teaching and learning. Each episode features interviews with content creators, industry professionals, field experts, and innovative educators who are driving engagement, equity, and innovation through distance learning. By challenging common perceptions and uncovering the realities of live virtual education, Why Distance Learning highlights its true impact and explores how it continues to evolve in an ever-changing educational landscape.

Hosted by Seth Fleischauer of Banyan Global Learning and Allyson Mitchell and Tami Moehring of the Center for Interactive Learning and Collaboration.

Seth Fleischauer (00:00.896)
Hello everyone and welcome to Why Distance Learning, the podcast for educators who are engaged with live virtual learning experiences, whether they be content providers who produce and facilitate or educators who want to complement their curriculum and learn more about the medium. We interview content providers, industry professionals, field experts, and educators who love and use live virtual learning. And I'm going to pause because I don't know how to say your last name.

Jillian (00:14.584)
We interview content providers and student professionals and build experts and educators.

Jillian (00:24.416)
Lucio.

Seth Fleischauer (00:25.706)
Lucio. Okay. Thank you. And this week our guest is Jillian Lucio of the Butterfly Pavilion in Denver. Jillian, thank you so much for being here and welcome.

Jillian (00:38.178)
Thank you guys for having me. I'm excited to be here.

Seth Fleischauer (00:41.396)
We're excited to have you. You are a guest that's in a series of guests that we have who are content providers. The purpose of these episodes is to inform our listeners, to illustrate these amazing programs that you have, to make them known to the public, what is available to teachers and educators and homeschoolers and all sorts of people who want to experience these live virtual programs. So we're gonna dive into that, into what you do, why it works, why it's awesome.

But first, Tammy, could you please introduce Jillian?

Tami Moehring (01:14.226)
I would be happy to. So Jillian serves as the virtual and school programs coordinator at the Butterfly Pavilion. In her position, Jillian develops engaging educational programs aligned with the Next Generation Science Standards and the Colorado State Science Standards to audiences of all ages. Graduating with high distinction from the University of Michigan with a Bachelor of Arts in History, Jillian showcases a commitment to elevating educational programs through compelling content, creation and activities both

Jillian (01:28.612)
state science standards to audiences of all ages. Graduating with high distinction from the University of Michigan with a Bachelor of Arts in History, Gillian's showpieces have been moving to elevating educational programs to compelling content, teaching and activities both virtually and in person.

Tami Moehring (01:43.993)
both virtually and in person. Before joining Butterfly Pavilion in 2023, Jillian worked as the public engagement and events specialist at the University of Michigan. Most notably, Jillian has starred in the Butterfly Pavilion's invertebrate de -icification online video series, garnering thousands of views to highlight various invertebrates and their importance to our ecosystem.

Jillian (01:46.852)
Before joining Butterfly Pavilion in 2023, Jillian worked as the Public Engagement and Events Specialist at the University of Michigan. Most notably, Jillian has starred in the Butterfly Pavilion's Invertebrate De -Ickification online video series, garnering thousands of views to highlight various invertebrates and their importance to our ecosystem.

Allyson (02:10.18)
You

Seth Fleischauer (02:12.756)
Jillian, I just think it's awesome that you work at a place called the Butterfly Pavilion. I'm trying to think of offices that sound cooler than that and I can't think of one. So that's pretty great. Why don't you just tell us about that? What is the Butterfly Pavilion? Is it as awesome as it sounds?

Jillian (02:30.434)
So the Butterfly Pavilion is definitely as awesome as it sounds and that's because we're more than just butterflies.

Allyson (02:35.502)
You

Jillian (02:37.668)
Butterfly Pavilion is an invertebrate -only zoo, so that means all of our animals that we have here don't have backbones. So on top of our namesake butterflies, we also have tarantulas and beetles and underwater invertebrates like crabs and horseshoe crabs and octopus. So we have tons of different animals here, especially since invertebrates account for

98 % of known species on the earth. So we have lots of different animals that we feature here at Butterfly Pavilion, which is actually the first AZA Association of Zoos and Aquariums accredited invertebrate -only zoo in the world.

Seth Fleischauer (03:17.184)
Wow, that's awesome. So question, did you like from a marketing perspective just recognize that everybody loves butterflies and therefore named the Invertebrate Museum after butterflies or was it first a butterfly only museum and then it evolved into invertebrates? How did that happen?

Allyson (03:18.077)
goodness.

Jillian (03:34.468)
So Butterfly Pavilion opened in 1995 and we have always had more than butterflies. I wasn't there when they decided on the name, but I'm sure it does have to do with butterflies being one of the more charismatic invertebrates in the world. know, yeah, it's much more approachable than calling it the Tarantula Pavilion, even though we do have people come from all over to hold Rosie the Tarantula. You can also hold her cousin Goldie now. So.

Allyson (03:41.924)
I'm

Seth Fleischauer (03:48.019)
It's like the Dolly Parton of invertebrates

Allyson (03:49.601)
Hehehehe

Tami Moehring (03:54.156)
So.

Seth Fleischauer (03:54.496)
You

Allyson (03:58.979)
Yes!

Jillian (04:02.24)
Even though butterflies are most charismatic, we really do want to show people that invertebrates are really important. And even though they may be creepy crawlies, they're super important in our environment. And they deserve all the love that all of our fluffy friends get at other zoos.

Allyson (04:18.915)
Tammy and I actually had the opportunity to go to the Butterfly Pavilion together to see Jillian and we got to see this amazing tour and see all of these wonderful opportunities to jump in and dive in and even actually get to be around butterflies in your actual space, in your physical space. It's so beautiful. But I actually have a picture of Tammy holding Rosie in her hands.

Seth Fleischauer (04:19.227)
Yeah.

Jillian (04:32.1)
even actually get to see a...

Jillian (04:38.301)
But I actually have a picture holding Rosie in her hand. So she actually got to she actually has evidence there. And I wonder just sorry. No, I just want to say I loved it. I sent that picture to my sister and my children. were all together and my brother in law refused to even look at the photo because

Allyson (04:44.352)
So she actually got to, she actually, have some evidence there. And I wonder just, sorry, Tammy, did you?

Tami Moehring (04:52.362)
No, I just want to say I loved it. I sent that picture to my sisters and my children since they were all together. And my brother -in -law refused to even look at the photo because he has a very big fear of spiders. But I loved it. It was so fun to actually meet Rosie in person, even though I virtually seen Rosie. Rosie is a celebrity in my mind.

Jillian (05:06.136)
very big fear of fighters, but I loved meeting Rosie in person, even though I virtually seen her in person. Yes, it was so fun to able to be there in person to see Jillian you as well in your on -site way, as well as being able to know and learn from you digitally for so many years in the live virtual lessons you have. So can you tell us a little bit

Allyson (05:17.87)
Yes, it was so fun to be able to be there in person to see Jillian you as well in your, you know, on your onsite, in your onsite way, as well as being able to know and learn from you digitally for so many years and the live virtual lessons you have. So can you tell us a little bit about your live programs? And also, since you do work with all of these wonderful living species, can you tell us how it is to work?

Jillian (05:35.108)
your live programs and also since you do work with all of these wonderful living species, can you tell us how it is to work with those living invertebrates that you bring into your programs? Yeah, so our other live programs, most of our programs we love having live animals on there for the kids because it really enhances the lessons for them and lets them engage

Allyson (05:43.49)
with those living invertebrates that you bring into your programs.

Jillian (05:59.562)
with what we're teaching them even if they can't visit us here at Butterfly Pavilion. And with that of course comes challenges as well because invertebrates, a lot of them are tiny. A lot of them do have venom and so there are protocols working with them. We go through lots of

training. We get to have fun kind of playing with, you know, high definition cameras and digital microscopes so that the kids can get really close to these animals during our lessons. And sometimes with, you know, when we pull the microscopes out, they're able to see a lot of things that maybe people miss when they visit us in person here at Butterfly Pavilion. takes them, you know,

a little bit of time to be able to pause and look at all these details about these animals and what makes them unique, what makes them able to survive in their environment. And so I think digital and virtual programs really give a good opportunity for kids to get up close and personal with these animals.

Allyson (06:54.424)
yes, definitely the microscopes. my goodness. The views I've seen. I just didn't even know certain species had those certain features. I'm like, I learned something new every time I see one of your programs.

Seth Fleischauer (07:09.158)
So break this down for us. Like if I'm a teacher and I want to I want one of your programs, how do I approach the choices that you have? Like do you find teachers that are they're aligning the particular learning objectives that you're covering in your programs to their own curriculum? Are they coming in just being like, I want Rosie. Can you hook me up with Rosie? Like how does how does a teacher navigate the catalog that you have available?

Jillian (07:38.902)
Yeah, so there's a variety of different programs that we have and we also offer a lot of different custom programs for teachers. So we are very flexible with working with teachers and kind of bending our program and what we're able to provide with our animals to their curriculum. But we also offer a variety of different programs that cover pre -k up to high school.

And a lot of those are aligned with curriculum standards. So some of our most popular programs because of that are going to be our Life Cycles program, our Who Needs a Habitat program that kind of teach those core like elementary topics to their students and kind of tie in really seamlessly. And one of my favorite programs we have that does this is our Life Cycles program because

Well, you can always teach metamorphosis to kids. It kind of shapes it in a very student driven way where they're seeing a darkling beetle in three different stages that it goes through during metamorphosis. And the kids have to solve a mystery of what connects all of the animals and use their observations to study these animals on camera. And surprise, it ends up being metamorphosis that connects all these animals. They're the same animal throughout these different stages.

Seth Fleischauer (08:31.466)
Hmm.

Allyson (08:42.346)
You

Seth Fleischauer (08:46.751)
Noooo

Jillian (08:48.214)
It's always fun seeing that aha moment kind of go off in their head when they tie everything together.

Allyson (08:54.298)
They get to see that real life. sorry.

Seth Fleischauer (08:54.56)
Does that particular animal have like three life cycles that make it seem very different from each other? Is that why chose it?

Jillian (09:02.958)
So the reason we use a giant darkling beetle in this program and the reason we do this is one, it's kind of a pretty readily available animal to us. They're really sturdy for using in programs when we're having them travel between our rearing room into our classroom or wherever holding that program and.

They're also able to see them pretty easily on camera. don't move. The adults also can't really fly much. It's not like having a butterfly in there. That would be a lot harder with different USDA containment things and whatnot to use in our program. So the Darkling beetles just happen to fit both the practicality of putting them in front of a camera as well as being a bit larger for the kids to see on camera as well and see all those details about the different animals.

Seth Fleischauer (09:50.174)
With the butterfly example, bring up something that I wonder about in working with live animals. Like, can you tell us a story of something like totally unexpected that happened because you had a live animal in a live virtual program?

Jillian (10:02.988)
Yeah, one time I was watching one of our educators hold one of our virtual invertebrate encounters with one of our rosies on camera and Yeah, so that is a little secret because...

Seth Fleischauer (10:13.098)
Hold on, there's more than one Rosie. my God, my world is shattering.

Jillian (10:18.148)
I know, but Rosie does in fact not want to be working 24 -7. So our Rosies are very pampered. So they only work a couple hours a week actually. And we have different ones because our animals welfare is super important to us. So we want to make sure that they're not getting stressed out, that they're kind of having a good life while they're living here with us. And as an ACA accredited zoo, that's always going to be our top priority.

Allyson (10:22.84)
Yes, Rosie needs her rest.

Seth Fleischauer (10:23.065)
The star of the show.

Tami Moehring (10:23.902)
Ha ha!

Jillian (10:45.412)
when we're having live animals in our program.

Seth Fleischauer (10:46.066)
Okay, okay. Okay, so you're watching Rosie and then what happened?

Allyson (10:48.74)
That's so fun.

Jillian (10:52.408)
So during this program, it's a very student driven one where they're asking questions about the animal and our educators when they're trained for are able to hold Rosie and pick her up and kind of show the kids what it's like to handle a tarantula. And sometimes our Rosies do not want to be held and that is their choice. We always let them choose. And this particular Rosie was not in the mood that day and reared up at our educator. And so that moment was able to

end up being a teaching moment for kids and showing them what a tarantula does when they're defending themselves, how they show predators they don't want them to come any closer. And so I think, you know, being able to flip that, yeah, the kids didn't get to see the educator hold a tarantula, but we were able to teach them why we don't pick the tarantula up when that's happening and what that behavior means in the animal. So that's an example of.

kind of an unexpected thing that can happen during programs and why we have to be careful when working with live animals.

Seth Fleischauer (11:55.008)
And I guess as entomologists, you're kind of trained for any scenario, anything that they throw at you, the bugs that is, the invertebrates, sorry, anything the invertebrates throw at you, you can put into the context of a teachable moment.

Allyson (12:01.518)
Yeah

Jillian (12:08.002)
Yeah, and I think kids being able to see animals display those natural behaviors is always going to be beneficial. And just explaining to them, I guess how we have to pivot our own behavior to make sure that those animals are safe and why it's also important to respect animals, even if they're, you know, a creepy crawly spider that not a lot of people maybe always want to respect.

Allyson (12:30.392)
And definitely good to know what it means if they're saying stay away. That's definitely, I think, something everybody would want to know if they're not comfortable with that.

Jillian (12:34.928)
That's definitely true.

Tami Moehring (12:37.431)
Hahaha

Jillian (12:39.031)
Yeah.

Allyson (12:41.359)
Ahem.

Seth Fleischauer (12:42.282)
So this is the point in the interview where we get Allison more excited because we're going to talk about holograms and virtual reality.

Allyson (12:49.102)
Yeah, I was actually just getting so excited about that because I was thinking just about your programs and we were talking about the different species that you have. When Tammy and I were there, we were able to see the amazing virtual and immersive interactions that you're able to dive into. So you have VR, have holograms and some of it. I remember correctly the holograms are of ancient ancestors of the specific species they're featured over in your exhibits. Is that correct?

Jillian (12:49.454)
Yeah, I was actually just getting so excited about that because I was thinking just about your program. And we were talking about the different species that you have. When Tammy and I were there, we were able to see the amazing virtual and immersive interactions that you're able to dive into. So you have VR, have holograms, and some of it. I remember correctly, the holograms are of ancient ancestors of the.

specific species they're featured over in your exhibit? that correct? Yeah, that's correct. In our new exhibit that we have right now, which is one of our rotating exhibits, is our Origins Building Life. And in there, we have different holograms that are placed over the enclosure of an animal to showcase what one of their ancestors from the Cambrian explosion would have looked like.

Allyson (13:19.663)
Yes.

Allyson (13:37.626)
Right. What was the reason that you decided to have the holograms above those enclosures?

Jillian (13:46.666)
So I think one of those reasons is just because we can't have those animals here in real life. And so being able to have a hologram over the enclosure kind of showcasing that animal moving around what it would have looked like is able people are able to kind of grasp what that is in their head because I know I am and a lot of other people are very visual learners. And so being able to actually see something is a lot more impactful than just reading it, you know, on a sign.

Allyson (14:15.618)
Yeah, it's interesting to see, to try to also find the similarities or differences when we were able to, especially the movement, you know, that you could see some really still have certain, you know, aspects. So just such a fun way to do the technology aspect of things with the holograms. So fun to see. And that we were there to see you at ISTE too. You were presenting at ISTE, correct? Or sorry.

Jillian (14:27.198)
So just a fun way to do the technology aspect of things with the holograms. fun to see. And that we were there to see you at ISTE too. You were presenting at ISTE, correct? Or sorry, the Conference International Society for Technology and Education, fondly known as ISTE. That's why we were all together in Colorado. And you were presenting about some of your programs there, a new program, correct? Yeah, that's correct.

Allyson (14:40.654)
the Conference International Society for Technology and Education, fondly known as ISTE. That's why we were all together in Colorado. And you were presenting about some of your programs there, a new program, correct?

Jillian (14:57.034)
This past year, one of my goals was to create a virtual program that would help us engage really young learners when we're trying to reach them. So that's going to be like our pre -K and first grade kiddos that we're reaching out to. And the way we ended up deciding to do this is by creating a virtual storybook. And so the virtual storybook is called Lacey Ladybug's Garden Adventure. And at ISTE, I was able to kind of explain the process of making that book and what the goals of that are.

Jillian (15:29.928)
So making the virtual storybook, it's a very much a choose your own adventure story that follows Lacey Ladybug. And so the kids meet her when she's just a little egg on the leaf and they're able to see her go through her entire life cycle as the story progresses going from an egg to a hungry larva. And they're able to help her find food in her habitat and explore the garden with her. Eventually she

turns into her pupa and emerges as an adult ladybug that we all know and so the kids really get to engage and watch that life cycle fold out naturally and watch how a ladybug grows, how they find food, how they interact with other animals in their environment.

Allyson (16:11.982)
Fun. And sorry, one last question about, because I know, sorry, question. The ladybug, similar to the butterfly, you had a lot in designing the Lacey ladybug, correct? So was there, is that a favorite animal of yours? Is there a ladybug that you visit every day or how did you come up with ladybugs?

Jillian (16:36.708)
So the ladybug was kind of like a group decision of a program, like an animal we wanted to feature in a program. We don't have any other programs highlighting ladybugs, and they're one of people's most beloved invertebrates. A lot of teachers raise ladybugs in their classroom, and so it's a really good way for teachers to further that learning that the kids are getting a reach of raising their own ladybugs, and they're able to kind of...

engage a bit more with that, learn more about the life cycle and habits of these animals that they're raising in their own classroom. And for a lot of us, they're an animal that we see in our gardens all the time and we want to know a little bit more about. And it allows us to teach people a lot about their natural environment that they're going to experience in everyday life.

Seth Fleischauer (17:26.42)
I'm hearing some themes here from your programs. One of them is that you like to highlight some fan favorite invertebrates, your ladybugs, your butterflies, your various rosies. And I'm also hearing like kind of a gamification element that you bring to it where you're really trying to give students a little bit more agency, even though it is a virtual program. There's a lot of direct instruction, but you're

creating that gamification element in order to provide that student agency, which is fantastic. But there also is open exploration happening. And because you're working with live animals, there are going to be things that are unexpected that happen. also hearing that life cycles is a big part of what you guys talk about. And I think that that's really interesting for introducing to students who are at the beginning of their own life cycle. I'm wondering if you think about overall impact. We kind of just illustrated

Jillian (17:59.76)
I'm also hearing that life cycles is a big part of what parents talk about. That's really interesting for introducing to students who are at the beginning of their own life cycle. I'm wondering if you think about like kind of overall impact, right? Like you kind of just illustrate your approach, you can illustrate your approach here, but like what is the impact that

Seth Fleischauer (18:22.076)
your like your approach and you've been illustrating your approach here but like what is the impact that you hope your virtual programs will have on young learners?

Jillian (18:32.538)
So one of the the biggest things we say here at Butterfly Pavilion is we like to de -ickify people to invertebrates because a lot of invertebrates are viewed as icky, know, bugs, that kind of people have an idea of what bugs are in their head. And I think one of our really big goals is to get people to appreciate these animals because they are a very large part

Allyson (18:38.978)
Hehehehehe

Seth Fleischauer (18:39.303)
You

Jillian (18:57.162)
of life on Earth. All of us rely on invertebrates for our food, our pollinators that are out there. They recycle nutrients back into the ecosystem. And so I think being able to kind of shape our earth, maybe not shape, flip people's ideas of what these animals are a little bit and help them engage with it. And for example, in Lacey Ladybug, we tried to include a lot of social emotional learning elements into the story where

they're placing themselves in the ladybug's shoes. We ask them questions to make them kind of think of how you would feel in this situation and have them kind of connect emotionally to these characters so that they're able to kind of see them a little bit differently. An example of this, there's a cockroach in the story, Lacey Ladybug, and while maybe...

our first thing when we see a ladybug and we see a cockroach, we're gonna probably favor the ladybug in that case. But in this situation where maybe they're competing for things or something's going on in the story, we asked the kids, how would you feel if you were that cockroach and this happened to you? And it allows them to kind of connect with a creature that we often view as grimy or awful. And cockroaches are pretty gentle creatures and they're very important for decomposing down.

Seth Fleischauer (19:57.194)
obviously.

Allyson (19:57.867)
Yeah.

Jillian (20:18.648)
dead waste, dead organic matter and returning it to the soil so that we can have food and beautiful trees and they help us everything flourish. And so I think little things that kind of change people's perspective on these animals that we view as maybe gross or icky is one of our big goals here to kind of just foster an appreciation for these little animals that often get overlooked but have really impactful

consequences on our environment, impactful roles in our environment.

Seth Fleischauer (20:54.28)
I say yes to all of that about cockroaches and also stay out of my kitchen.

Allyson (20:58.349)
Yeah

Tami Moehring (20:59.426)
Hahaha

Seth Fleischauer (21:01.14)
I, this is not something I intended to talk about here today, but I had a cockroach infestation once in my house and I was searching for like where those things were coming from for like months. And this is when I had like young kids. So like there was food all over the floor all the time. I'm like, okay, well they're well fed, but like where are they living? And it turned out they were living in the foot pedal of my trash can.

Allyson (21:07.588)
now.

Seth Fleischauer (21:25.044)
Right? like my trash can had a little like, you know, empty thing down at the bottom. It took me months to find this. And when I finally did, we got rid of them. And so this leads me to my question. Have bugs been de -ickyfied for you? Are there any bugs that you still feel are icky?

Allyson (21:27.402)
no. Yeah.

Allyson (21:40.014)
was thinking that too. I was gonna say, there one bug that you maybe isn't one you prefer?

Jillian (21:41.614)
Well

Seth Fleischauer (21:47.089)
Hahaha

Jillian (21:47.284)
I this is, I'm probably very biased on this question because I do work at a bug zoo and I think a bug zoo does draw a certain demographic of people to work for them. So I've been a lifelong bug nerd. Like I grew up on a farm. I spent most of my childhood outside playing with animals, catching spiders and building habitats for them. So I might not be the best person to answer that. If I had to pick.

Allyson (21:53.4)
Yeah.

Tami Moehring (21:59.505)
You

Allyson (22:14.329)
Eheh

Jillian (22:16.12)
one invertebrate that I have not been fully de -ickified from. It's probably a barnacle. I don't like looking at barnacles. They creep me out. I think it's just because they kind of pop out a little bit. That's probably the one that still gets me a little like, icked out. A terrestrial invertebrate. I will say I'm still little bit squeamish about earwigs, but I am working on it.

Seth Fleischauer (22:25.44)
Wow, was not expecting that.

Allyson (22:26.658)
Interesting. Me neither.

Jillian (22:46.122)
Earwigs are very good mothers. They take care of their offspring unlike a lot of animals that we have out there in nature. They really foster their motherhood role. And one thing that really changed earwigs a little bit for me is we have a lot of gardens out behind Butterfly Pavilion with native plants because we try to support all of our native invertebrates in that way. And in our garden one day when I was walking out there,

Seth Fleischauer (22:51.157)
you

Jillian (23:12.522)
I found a little earwig sleeping in a flower and it was so cute and that really helped the ickiness. I still am trying to de -ickify from myself with the earwigs.

Allyson (23:25.624)
You can picture the sleeping one and be like, okay, it's fine now.

Tami Moehring (23:30.104)
I think that's a universal thing though. When people or things are sleeping, they're a lot more approachable than when they're not.

Seth Fleischauer (23:37.408)
Also, earwigs are very good mothers is not a quote I expected to hear today and I love it and that might be the title of the episode. see.

Allyson (23:37.986)
That's fair.

Allyson (23:43.14)
YEAH!

Yes, I was just, I appreciate that fact. That's one of my facts I'm gonna tell everyone that I see this evening. I also wonder in the same type of question, is there an invertebrate that you love and you don't think enough people provide attention, give love to, or maybe shouldn't be as icked out? Like is there one species that you're like, you have to go visit this. How did you just walk by?

Jillian (23:47.15)
I appreciate it.

Seth Fleischauer (23:52.351)
you

Allyson (24:14.818)
I just wonder, is there anyone there?

Jillian (24:17.189)
This is one we don't always have on display, but we do use it in a lot of our programs that we have in person here at Butterfly Pavilion and our Outreaches, not so much in our virtual programs.

But I feel like black widows get a really bad rap. And while they are one of the most, they do have, they're one of the only spiders that we have here in North America that do have like a medically significant venom. But they are, it's not gonna be great. It's not, but you're probably not gonna die from it. And most, no one has died from a black widow bite since the 1980s. So.

Seth Fleischauer (24:35.932)
Yeah.

Allyson (24:36.921)
Yeah, I got it.

Seth Fleischauer (24:46.208)
Huh. What is that significance?

Seth Fleischauer (24:58.11)
What? No way. That is bad PR.

Jillian (24:58.66)
Yeah, so you're not gonna, it's gonna be really painful. Basically, you're gonna be in a lot of pain, but black widows do not, you're not gonna see them very often because they like to hide in dark little corners in attics. They wanna stay away from you as much as you wanna stay away from them. So most of those black widow bites that you're gonna see is gonna be when you're reaching your hand into a dark thing in your attic to grab something out. That's gonna be the most common time you're gonna meet a black widow.

but they're really kind of just like reclusive. They're really like introverts. They don't wanna see you just like you don't wanna see them and they're gonna stay in their little corner in their web. So I think while black widows are, they are significantly venomous, they're gonna wanna save that for their food and they're gonna wanna keep away from you. So I think like that's one that has probably one of the worst raps of like spiders.

at least like in North America, but like in reality they just want to keep to their little corner, you know?

Allyson (26:00.248)
Yeah, like read the signs people don't mess with me and I'm not gonna mess with you like please Yes, and also i'm now never I have a reason to never put my hand in any dark corner spot without a well light situation

Seth Fleischauer (26:05.226)
with the red on my bellies for.

Jillian (26:07.428)
hehe

Seth Fleischauer (26:12.761)
You

I can't believe that no one's died of a Black Widow bite since the 80s. I mean, it makes sense. That's the last time I was taught about to be afraid of Black Widows was in the 80s, but my lessons have not been updated since then. So thank you for that new information about Black Widows. My goodness.

Jillian (26:29.796)
Yeah, I still like, you know, if you see one I wouldn't suggest picking it up. Like, you know, just leave it by itself in its little corner because like I said, they just want to stay in their little dark corner. They're little introverts.

Allyson (26:35.245)
No. Yeah.

Tami Moehring (26:36.14)
you

Allyson (26:44.218)
They're just trying to let them be in their little space. Yes, good to know.

Seth Fleischauer (26:48.104)
Yeah, despite Scarlett Johansson's portrayal, they are introverts. So, I mean, you've illustrated some really cool stories of your work within vertebrates at your bug zoo. I'm wondering if you can kind of zoom in on your virtual programs and tell us about a golden moment.

Allyson (26:51.852)
Yeah.

Seth Fleischauer (27:08.992)
We on this podcast talk about these moments when this technology just works for exactly what we hope it to work for, which is to provide access to an opportunity that a student otherwise would not have access to. are, what, tell us the story. What, what is an example of that in your work?

Jillian (27:26.382)
So I think one of the things at Butterfly Pavilion that we end up seeing every day is people walk in the door and they're able to come in and hold Rosie like we have our members that come in there and it's just a normal part of their routine. They come in, they hold Rosie, they go see the butterflies and we're, like I said, the only invertebrate zoo out there where you're able to come and do stuff like that. And so for most people, they're not able to go to the zoo and hold a tarantula. And so...

when we have our virtual invertebrate encounters and we pull out a tarantula and our educator goes to pick it up, you hear gasps, you know, like you're like, what is that person doing sticking their hand in with a tarantula? And exactly. And I think just seeing like that little switch in their brain go off when they are first, they're scared for the educator and then they see them being able to touch these animals and saying, maybe.

Seth Fleischauer (28:02.56)
you

Seth Fleischauer (28:07.028)
Yeah, another spider with a bad rap.

Allyson (28:08.993)
Yeah!

Jillian (28:22.51)
this animal is not what I'm thinking it is in my head. And just kind of seeing their wheels turning and kind of changing their perspective on what these animals are is one of my favorite things that I'm able to witness during our programs is just kind of seeing their whole idea of what something is shift in their brains. And I think that has to be one of my favorite things that I'm able to see while teaching.

Seth Fleischauer (28:47.058)
And what I love about that and this idea of de -icification is that what you're talking about is curiosity, right? Like you're talking about students letting down some preconceived notions of animals that perhaps have not been portrayed accurately in media and giving them an opportunity to learn more about them and be open to the benefits that they bring to this vast diverse ecosystem of animals.

Allyson (28:50.948)
You

Seth Fleischauer (29:16.18)
I love that curiosity piece. So this is our titular question. We ask this of everyone on the show. Jillian from the Butterfly Pavilion, why distance learning?

Jillian (29:29.412)
think for me, like I kind of touched on in my last question, Butterfly Pavilion is not a place that a lot of people get to go to because

There's not really a lot of other places like us around the world. And so being able to share our mission and these animals that we love and being able to teach about them to people who are not able to access our actual facility is something that really drives me to continue to do these virtual programs and to have these moments with students virtually because just being able to spread

of the love for these animals and be able also to, you know, a lot of people are not able even here in Colorado to bring a bus to our facility to be able to see these animals. And so being able to stream into their classroom and bring these animals to them is something that's just really exciting. And it's excited to see these kids that are just, you know, kind of enamored with Rosie up on the screen and being able to make that accessible and fun and engaging for them is something that

really drive these virtual programs for me.

Seth Fleischauer (30:40.96)
I do have a question about Rosie. Another question about Rosie. Do you number them? Do they have last names? Do they have nicknames? Like how do you tell the difference between all the Rosies?

Allyson (30:49.986)
And additional question, how did Goldie come up and how many Goldies are there? There multiple Goldies as well.

Jillian (30:50.628)
additional

Jillian (30:55.781)
Yeah, so our Rosies do all have like numbers and assignments to them, but their names are all Rosie. So they are Rosie in and of itself. And the Goldies, we ended up being, I don't know exactly how we got them, but I think something happens where they were either donated to us from like another institution or something like that. And so,

Rosie is a Chilean rose hair tarantula and our Goldies are a Chaco golden knee tarantula. So that's where those names come from there. And actually Goldie's name was chosen by the public. we actually just had our public start holding Goldies this summer and they were able to vote on the name and they went with Goldie. So now we have our Rosie and Goldie and there are multiple Goldies as well. Yeah.

Allyson (31:46.588)
my goodness. you know, here in Philadelphia, there's multiple Betsy Rosses too. So it's just thinking of the connections of museum work. You have to give all of those that are contributing to the program, all living things contributing to the program that break.

Seth Fleischauer (31:52.307)
Hehehehehe

Jillian (31:53.444)
thinking of the connections of museum work.

Seth Fleischauer (32:02.328)
Well, Jillian, thank you so much for being here today. Thank you for sharing these amazing stories from the Butterfly Pavilion, otherwise known as your Bug Zoo. For teachers who want to find information about this, they can book your programs on CILC. Where's another good place to go on the internet?

Jillian (32:16.356)
Yeah, you can visit www .butterflies .org to check out more about Butterfly Pavilion and learn more about everything that we're doing here, including our conservation work and everything else that's going on here at Butterfly Pavilion.

Seth Fleischauer (32:35.04)
I'm sorry, you got butterflies .org? That's dope. Yeah, well done.

Allyson (32:37.24)
I know, I'm su

Jillian (32:37.536)
Yes, we do have butterflies .org. We also have it for our email, so it's awesome being able to have my name at butterflies. You know, it's so much fun.

Seth Fleischauer (32:44.006)
Yeah. It's the most whimsical email address. Might as well be fairies .castle, you know. Well, thank you again so much for being here. For our listeners, please do check the show notes for all the links that we mentioned here today. If you'd like to support the podcast, please follow us, rate it, or leave us a review. Tell a friend.

Allyson (32:44.756)
my gosh, dreams. That's what dreams are made of.

Jillian (32:50.094)
Thanks

Allyson (32:54.346)
Ugh, right.

Jillian (32:54.431)
Yeah.

Seth Fleischauer (33:11.348)
Thank you as always to our editor, Lucas Salazar. And if you want to know the answer to the question, why distance learning, check out the people we highlight on this podcast. These are the people who are leveraging this amazing technology to truly transform the learning experience. Why distance learning? Because it's accessible and it's awesome. See you next time.