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Are you a highway user who wants to travel on safe, less congested roads?
Join Andrew Stasiowski, President and CEO of the American Highway Users Alliance, as he speaks with leading experts about the latest policies impacting the transportation community. Each month, Andrew will cover topics of critical importance to the highway user community, from reducing congestion on roads, to reforming highway trust funds, to increasing global competitiveness.
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The American Highway Users Alliance is a nonprofit organization advocating for public policies that promote roadway safety, increase freedom of movement, and preserve opportunities for all people to live, work, shop, and travel unencumbered.
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(light electronic rock)
- Welcome to "The
Driving Forward Podcast."
We have a great interview
on highway safety today.
In this interview, we are going to discuss
how highway policy can improve
highway safety for everyone.
We touch on important subjects,
such as emerging technologies
and their impact on our safety,
how highway investment can improve safety
on our roads and bridges.
And, we'll touch on the
newest Buy America rule
and what impact it will have
on the safety of roads and bridges.
In light of the tragic
bridge collapse in Baltimore,
the safety of our roads for
both the traveling public,
and the workers trying to
fix our roads each day,
has been a big subject.
I hope today's interview shed some light
on the important role
the Safety Infrastructure Industry plays
on keeping both the drivers
and the workers safe each day.
And now, onto our interview.
Joining us today is Stacey Tetschner.
Stacey is the president and CEO
of the American Traffic
Safety Services Association,
also known as ATSA.
ATSA is the leading source of information
for the roadway safety
infrastructure industry.
Stacy, welcome to "The
Driving Forward Podcast,"
- Andrew, thanks for having me.
- Thank you!
Well, you know, like we like to do
on "The Driving Forward Podcast,"
we like to, kind of, level set
and allow you to, kind
of, discuss your industry.
So, can you talk about ATSA a little bit?
How big are you?
Who are your members?
What do you guys do?
- So, happy to.
ATSA is the safety infrastructure
side of roadway safety.
So, when you think of that, it
is guardrail, cable barriers,
pavement markings, signs, signals,
temporary traffic control,
any of the things that,
after the road is built,
that make the road safer.
And so, our members are the
ones who either manufacture
or install that roadway
safety infrastructure.
And, we have just over a
thousand company members.
And, in addition to that,
we have a number of state DOTs
that have become members of ours as well,
so that they could have access
to the second side of our
business, which is training.
And so, in addition to
the safety infrastructure,
we know it doesn't do anything
without proper training.
So, we also have a training
side of the association, as well
that does everything from the flaggers
to the traffic control supervisors
that you'll see on a site.
- The flaggers, are those the people that,
you know, what are they doing?
What are the traffic safety
control people doing?
- Sure.
So, when you, when you think of a flagger,
if you've come up to a work zone before,
you'll see someone who's standing there
with a "Stop/Slow" paddle, in
a number of cases you will.
And, they're really that last
line of defense on safety
before you go into a work zone,
so that they can control
the flow of traffic
that goes through there.
And, a lot of people say,
"Really? Do you need to
train someone to do that?"
Actually, you do.
Because, if you get traffic
coming from two ways,
and a collision, or people
coming through there too fast
without a "slow" sign,
they have an incredibly important job,
even if it is an entry level
position into the industry.
But, then your supervisor is the one
who is making sure, "is the
work zone set up properly?"
What a lot of people don't realize is,
when they take a look at a work zone,
there's gotta be a proper taper.
There has to be proper equipment,
Are the signs placed at the right places
within the work zone,
so that the driving public remains safe?
So, there's a lot that goes into,
what a lot of people
consider an annoyance,
which is a work zone, but
without that proper setup,
we would have chaos.
- Yeah, I think, you know, work
zone safety, and, you know,
we all see the orange signs
that you're entering a work zone.
I think everyone recognized that,
but you don't always
realize all the things
that go into making sure
that people, you know,
working on the side of a highway,
where people are driving 60,
70, 80 miles an hour sometimes,
there's a lot that goes into that.
And, I know one of your big
annual events every year
is Work Zone Safety Week, and
I know that's coming up soon.
Can you talk about that a little bit?
- Sure.
We've, kind of, over the last few years,
rebranded that,
so it's called National
Work Zone Awareness Week,
and this year it's gonna be
April 15th through the 19th.
And, really, the theme of
what we're doing this year
is work zones are temporary,
but the actions behind the
wheel can last forever.
And, that the big national event for that
is gonna be April the 16th.
And, if you remember a year
ago we lost six roadway workers
in a work zone incident.
And so, Baltimore is
actually going to be hosting
that national event at a site overlooking
where we lost six roadway
workers last year,
and unfortunately this year
we just lost another six
when the Key bridge collapsed as well.
So, Baltimore, and the Maryland
DOT really have a big role
in work zone awareness.
- Yeah, the, you know, the
bridge collapse is a tragedy,
and I think we're all, you
know, learning more about that.
And, I think it's,
people are learning about
what could have been done,
or what can't be done,
and I don't think we're
gonna know that for a while,
and all that.
So, it's glad,
I'm glad that you guys are
really elevating that option,
that idea, and that issue,
because it's important for
everyone on in the highways.
- We are.
And, what we're really seeing from that
is the investigation's gonna
yield a lot more information
for us, but this collapse is so unique,
especially to roadway safety.
A lot of questions, because,
are are being asked,
around the roadway safety aspect.
And, I'll just say communication is key,
and anything that's going on,
whether you're setting up a work zone,
you're a crew working out there,
whatever it happens to be,
and thank goodness for the
communication from that ship
to the first responders
who were able to shut down the bridge
and get the driving public off the bridge.
But, unfortunately,
not all of our workers were
able to get off there in time.
So, we will be honoring those lives.
One of the things that we do, within ATSA,
is we have a foundation
and we host a roadway worker memorial
that lists all the
people, whose loved ones
would like to have them
placed on that memorial.
And, granted, not everyone wants to,
but that's a traveling memorial
that goes around to various DOTs,
and events around this country,
because not everyone realizes
just how many people we lose
in work zone accidents every year.
- That's really special.
You know, how many are
we losing each year?
Is that number increasing?
Is it decreasing,
or about steady?
- I would say that it's decreasing now.
In 2021, we had our most recent data,
and DOT gathers all that,
and I just don't think the
clearinghouse has 2022 data
complete yet, as they audit it.
But, we lost about 956
people in work zone.
Now, I will say most of those
were the traveling public
drivers and pedestrians,
but when that happens,
there's obviously some
incidences, as well.
And, just to give you perspective,
in '21, we had 106,000 work
zone crashes that occurred,
at various levels.
Now, that resulted 956
fatalities between drivers,
the pedestrians, passengers, and workers.
But, nonetheless, yeah, we're
on a quest to get to zero.
We do not want to have any roadway deaths,
and especially not in work zones.
- Yeah, that's great.
That's really, you don't
realize that's, just that many,
and that's something we need to, you know,
obviously, I know you guys
are really leading the charge
in making that better, and as
we've talked over the years
and others, is how could we
invest in our infrastructure
to improve safety?
What are the things
that, you know, we can do
to really reduce that number?
I know there's some things
on the driver's side,
but what are some of the
things that can be done
as we invest?
- One of the things,
and part of it's just an attitude change.
Roadway safety is an
afterthought for so many people.
And, when we're talking
about the driving public,
distracted driving, yeah, a
lot of those accidents occur
because somebody's picking up a phone
to take a look at
something, or make a call.
I've even seen people try
to do zoom calls, you know,
in their car, while they're driving,
and, you know, I hopefully can
disrupt those when I see 'em
and honk, and it's like, "hey,
you gotta put that down,"
and create some additional noise.
But, the real challenge
we have in looking forward
is making sure we're investing,
and even within the industry,
a lot of times there's
conversations route,
there's highway safety improvement funds,
call 'em H-SIF funds.
But, then once those get dedicated,
then there's always a debate,
"well, can we flex those?
Can we pull some of those
out to put 'em over here?"
And, every time we do that,
every time we have that H-CIF debate,
it's just putting safety at
a lower and lower priority,
which is in complete opposition
to, you know, the DOT,
and NITSA, and everybody
else's road to zero deaths
that we are signed on and committed to.
We were one of the first
partners to sign on to that.
But, our actions have
to be consistent with
how we spend our money.
It's no different than
in our personal lives.
If you wanna do something,
if you wanna make a change in something
in your personal life, you
dedicate funds and time to it.
You wanna make something
change on our roadways,
you gotta dedicate time and funds to it.
- Yeah, I know, you
know, we had Hillary Kane
from the Auto Innovators
on a few months ago,
and we talked about new technologies,
and connected and autonomous vehicles,
and a lot of the safety benefits
that can come from that.
How do you see those technologies,
and interacting with the
work zone safety areas?
I think that's gotta clearly
be a critical portion of that.
- Yeah, it is.
And, I'll say technology's
playing a huge role
in roadway safety, and I
don't think we know everything
on autonomous vehicles yet.
I think we're a few years out on that.
We're still learning
what electric vehicles,
how they're gonna interact
with roadway safety infrastructure.
But, what we really have to
be aware of, in all of that,
is there's always gonna be human element.
Even if there's an autonomous vehicle,
there's a human element
behind a portion of that.
And, the human element has
to be committed to the safety
in order for it to flow through,
autonomous, AI, whatever it happens to be.
I'll give you a quick example.
One of the things that's
happening in work zones
is some of the worker vests
will have a little buzzer
on them that vibrates.
And so, as a vehicle is approaching,
and they might be approaching
a work zone too quickly,
or they might be work too close
to the edge of that work zone,
some of the vehicles
now have been outfitted
with that technology,
so that a beacon senses what's going on,
it sends a message to
the driver of the car
on their dashboard that says,
"slow down, you're
approaching a work zone."
And, also it sends a
message to those workers
that are too close to the
edge, or closer to the edge,
so that they get a
vibration to remind them,
"Hey, you need to move away."
So, there's a smart element in that,
but it can only be as smart as
the humans that are using it.
- That's good to see the
technologies consisting to improve
across every aspect of the highway.
So, that's great.
You know, I think, you touched
on another subject that,
you know, I wanted to
talk a little bit about,
and you talked about how,
you know, new technologies,
like electric vehicles,
how they're gonna interact
with the road safety equipment.
You know, we had a recent Buy America rule
that was just finalized,
and I wanted to, you know,
get your thoughts on the rule,
and on the manufactured products waivers,
and, you know, what are your thoughts
on how this rule impact your industry,
and how, you know, everything's changing,
and how that's gonna impact you guys?
- Sure, yeah.
First of all, I wanna say
we are as biggest supporters
as of anyone, as buying and
producing goods in America.
However, with that in place,
we also have to be realistic
because you can't just turn one spigot on
and turn the other spigot off.
And, unfortunately,
that's what's trying to be done right now.
And, there's also some rules
in place with, you know,
with the EPA.
There are certain things
that go into manufacturing
highway products,
and I'll use pavement
markings for example.
The resin that you make paint with,
the EPA isn't going to allow
us to mine that in the US,
at the levels that would need to be done.
And so, those, that raw good,
comes from somewhere else
that may get mixed and made in the US,
but because of the resin,
of what's in the resin,
it's over 55% from somewhere else.
The second thing, which is
kind of a little known fact,
that we're proud of, is
the retro reflectivity
of pavement markings when you go down,
whether it's, you know, paint,
or anything else thermoplastic.
What makes a reflect back
are a little glass beads.
So, as that drops down,
little glass speeds drop on top of it,
and that's where you get the
reflection from headlights
at night or during the rain,
whatever it happens to be.
Well those also, those raw
materials don't come from the US,
so if we can't produce
those goods in the US
at the 55% level, then
we can't put 'em down.
All of a sudden we are
really cutting off our nose
to spite our face, in
terms of roadway safety,
just to be in compliance with Buy America.
So, that waiver you were talking about
has been in place for decades.
I'm not saying that it won't go away,
but what we really need to know
is it can't go away tomorrow
just because OMB issues guidance,
and says everything in the
IIJA from this point forward.
Well, we can't just turn one spigot off,
and the other spigot on.
There's not enough raw
goods produced in America
for that right now.
So, again, not that we
don't wanna get there,
but we're gonna need
these waivers over time
until we can come up with a
plan that works for government,
works for industry, and works
for the safety on the roads.
- Yeah, it was funny you
mentioned the retro reflectivity.
I, you know, I've seen
such a change in that space
over the last, I don't know,
10, 15 years it seems like,
that, you know, I remember
driving home at night in the rain
and you couldn't see the lane markings.
Now, some of that was the roads around DC
needed a little more work, but you know,
there's so much has been
gone, has gone into that,
and it really, you know, I
think has done a great job
of, you know, reducing crashes,
and it's something we need
to continue to get out there
onto the roads.
- You're absolutely right, and
exactly what you just said,
if we can't put it on the roads
because of the Buy America clause, right,
as it is written right now,
then we can't put paint down.
So, what you couldn't see before,
it's just gonna continue
to wear away in the future
as whether it's rain, wear,
snowplows actually do a lot
of damage to pavement marking.
So, we've just got to be aware of,
"yes, we wanna do what's
right with our heart,
but we gotta take our brains with us."
We just gotta do both of them.
- So, one of the things
we've talked to all of our guests about,
and I think it's probably one
of the most important issues
facing the future of our infrastructure,
is highway trust fund
and the ability to fund future projects.
I think, you know, we've talked
to a number of our guests
about that, but, the certainty of funding,
right now we've been,
we're using general funds
to really fix the shortfall
in the trust fund.
We have new rules coming
out on, for trucks and cars,
on, you know, different technologies
that reduce our ability to raise
revenue from the gas taxes.
What do potential cuts to
the highway safety side mean
if we can't fund projects
because their trust fund
just is running out of money?
How is that gonna impact you guys?
- Well, it's gonna have a huge impact,
because if we truly are
committed, as I said before,
we're committed to moving
towards zero deaths
on our roadways.
That's gonna take investment,
and the pay for that,
which we, you know, a
lot of us talk about,
is how do we pay for that?
Well, a lot of that
comes from the gas tax,
and as we're moving to more
and more electric vehicles,
by the way, electrics not using gas.
So, we've gotta come up with a system,
so that everybody pays their fair share,
and the gas tax hasn't been
raised in many, many years,
and it may be time to
readjust that, as well.
I'm not one for new taxes,
but I don't look at the
gas tax as really a tax,
it's probably a misnomer.
It's a user fee,
and we have to have a
fee that everybody uses
to access these roads.
They're not free, they're
not free to build,
they're not free to make safe.
And, we have to remember,
when these roads were built,
it was for a different
purpose with vehicles
that weigh different, look
different, behave differently.
And, we have to evolve our
roads to meet the technology
of our vehicles and the
evolution of the drive.
- No, that's a great point.
I think there's a lot there that,
you know, the IAJA was really,
we talk about it as a once
in a lifetime opportunity.
I, you know, I think we
need to change that thought.
We need to look at that as,
this is how all of our bills need to be.
We need to continue to invest.
We can't go back to the,
you know, smaller bills
'cause our needs are so high,
and as we are getting new
technologies onto the roads,
you know, we're gonna
need to have enough funds
to really invest to accommodate
those new technologies.
So, what do you think about that?
- You're exactly right.
I'm gonna use an example
of a new technology
in electric vehicles, and
it's a hot topic right now.
We're just at the point
where we're testing
"what does a collision
of an electric vehicle
on today's roadway do to the
roadway safety infrastructure?"
And, the vehicle has a
different center of gravity,
it's heavier than it used to
be, and it travels differently.
And, in reality,
a lot of them don't have
an engine in the front
because they have everything underneath.
So, as they collide with
some of our infrastructure,
we're finding that it behaves differently,
and it may not be as safe as it was
with a gas powered vehicle.
So, we can't have these unfunded mandates,
of "move to electric vehicles,"
but not fund improving and
updating our roadway technology,
which is the responsibility
that comes to the government.
- Well let's move on to, you know,
our final question that
we've asked everyone.
And, I want, curious what
your answer's gonna be.
So, if you could wave your magic wand,
if you could do one thing to
really improve roadway safety
in America, what would it be?
- We are all about moving
towards zero deaths
on the roadways.
And so, it would be about
removing the distractions
from the roadways.
I'm gonna go ahead and use an example,
I'm gonna go back to National
Work zone Awareness Week
because that's where we see
we can make a difference.
And, if we can wave our magic wand,
it's how do you become more
aware of roads being made safer,
being viewed as an investment,
and not an intrusion in your privacy?
I would say let's start by
making our work sound safer.
Because, if you have that first step,
it'll make more people more
aware of how they're driving
and what they're doing on the roadways,
so that everybody remains safe,
everybody comes home
at the end of the day.
There's nothing worse, Andrew,
than one of our contractors
having to go to a family to
let them know that their mom,
or dad, or sister, or brother,
whatever it happens to be,
is not coming home because
there was a distracted driver
that went into a work zone
and took their life that day
while they were just working
to make the roadway safer.
With that, I'm just gonna
put a shameless plug in,
one more time.
April 15th Works on Safety Training Day.
April 16th is our national
kickoff event in Baltimore,
but they're events all over the country.
April 17th, if you do nothing else,
make that your Go Orange Day.
You'll find companies
like M&Ms, and Sunny D,
and a lot of other companies
who are really focusing
on their orange products
to help us support Go Orange Day,
so that we can remember those
who have lost their lives
in work zone.
And then, the 18th
watch your social media,
we have a social media storm that day,
that hashtag is NWZAW.
- Well that, it's great to hear.
We will obviously support you guys,
as we get the orange out as well,
and I appreciate that,
and I really appreciate your
thoughts on what we could do
and you know, distracted
driving is a huge problem
in this country.
It's a huge issue facing
the highway users industry,
as well.
I mean, I think the number of deaths,
we're not seeing that decrease,
we're really seeing that
increase on the roads,
and a lot of that is because
of distracted driving.
So, I appreciate your thoughts on that,
and with that Stacy Tetschner,
I appreciate you coming on today.
This was a great interview,
and I look to have you
on again sometime soon.
- Thank you.
(light electronic rock)
- Alright, I'd like to thank Stacy,
once again for coming on "The
Driving Forward Podcast."
I thought it was a great interview
on a really important subject.
I hope everyone learned a lot.
Please continue to listen,
and subscribe to "The
Driving Forward Podcast,"
wherever you get your podcasts.
(rhythmic music notes)
- Last topic.