Ep. 22 Andrew Wyatt Co Founder at CALA

Since 2016, CALA has been providing fashion brands and retailers with a single all-in-one platform that powers every step of the fashion design and supply chain process, while allowing for cross-team collaboration: ideation, designing, fabric selection, manufacturing, fulfillment, e-commerce enablement, and branding/marketing, can all be managed from inside the digital CALA platform. CALA’s partner network consists of a global supply chain including over 60 factories in 13 countries, with 16 fulfillment centers in four regions. This redundant supply chain network allows for customers to be connected to the manufacturer that best suits their product and quantity needs for seamless production. CALA handles the complex back-end logistics of bringing a collection to market so their customers can focus on what they do best, ideate.

https://ca.la/

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Kevin Horek: Welcome

Gregg: back to the show.

Today we have Andrew Wyatt.

He's the

Kevin Horek: c e o and co-founder at Cala.

Andrew, great to chat with

Andrew Wyatt: you again.

Hey, Kevin, great to be here.

Kevin Horek: Yeah, I'm excited
to have you on the show.

Uh, I've obviously

Gregg: kind of known you and what you

Kevin Horek: guys are doing at Cala for
a number of years now, but before we get

into that, let's get to know you a little
bit better and start off with where you.

Andrew Wyatt: Cool.

Yeah, so I was born in Florida, was
seven, moved to Knoxville, Tennessee,

and so I, I kind of consider
that being where I, I grew up.

Kevin Horek: Very cool.

So walk us through, you went to

Gregg: university, what
did you take and why?

.
Andrew Wyatt: So one of the interesting
things about Knoxville, Tennessee is that

it's the intersection of I 75 and I 40.

Okay.

And so, uh, in the US that's, uh, I
75 runs from Florida all the way up

through, I, I don't, I think New York.

And, uh, and then I 40 runs, you
know, from coast to coast east,

all the way the west, right?

And so, um, you know, without really
realizing it, , uh, my parents, you know,

basically put us in a logistics hub.

And so, um, myself and my two brothers,
we all studied logistics and supply

chain at the University of Tennessee.

Kevin Horek: Okay.

Was but like, what made
you want to take that?

Gregg: Just, just
geographically being there?

Or was there something that
happened in your childhood that

you were like, oh, I really want to

Andrew Wyatt: go?

So, you know, it was definitely one of
the top majors at University of Tennessee.

So there's Okay.

There's a lot of, uh, a lot of plugging
that I would say that they did.

But, um, for me, I actually went to school
knowing, not, not thinking, but knowing

I was gonna be an anesthesiologist.

Oh, fascinating.

And so part of the, um, , you
know, part of the how to get into

medical school guide is, you know,
you have to do tons of shadowing.

And so I shadowed, you know, hundreds of
hours, um, orthopedic anesthesia, er, um,

you know, outpatient kind of everything.

And one of the things I kept
seeing over and over again was,

you know, it felt like things were.

Running properly or like there,
it seemed like, you know,

there's always stuff everywhere.

Everyone was always running around,
everyone was, you know, seemed overtired.

And so I was thinking, you know, if
I'm gonna be a amazing, you know, world

World's greatest anesthesiologist, um,
would probably be good to take some

business classes as well, just to kind
of, you know, understand that side of it.

Who knows, you know, I thought maybe
I would have my own practice at some.

And so kind of like at the same time
as I was doing the sort of pre-med

courses, I started taking some
of the business courses and was,

you know, stars aligned in that.

My first business course was operations
management and the professor was

talking about lean for operations
and, or sorry, lean for Healthcare

and how they were taking operat.

Methodology and best practices in
applying a healthcare environment.

And I was just like, wow.

I , I think you're only talking to
me in this room, . And so, uh, I went

and connected with him afterwards and
he connected me with this guy, Dr.

Chuck Noon, who actually worked
in the Center for Executive

Education at Tennessee.

and he was one of the pioneers
of applying lean methodologies

and principles to healthcare.

So I kind of buddied up with him for
the next couple years and, uh, and

got to do some really, really cool,
um, projects, one of which was, um,

doing a, a lean implementation in the
University of Tennessee, uh, medical

center's er, which was super, super cool.

Kevin Horek: Interesting.

Okay, so walk us through.

Kind of the rest of your career and
pivoting and coming up with the idea for,

for Cala, because it is not medical at

all.

. .
Andrew Wyatt: So I think that the
biggest, you know, epiphany from

that experience was, you know, at the
time I was probably 19, 20 years old.

Okay.

But, in that environment, I'm telling
the doctors what to do and I'm working

with the nurses on, you know, how to
organize their, their carts and you

know, where to put things in certain
places so that, you know, uh, patients

can kind of flow through, uh, more,
more effectively and more, more quickly.

And so it was, it was through that
experience where I really kind of

started having this idea of like,
do I want to go to medical school?

Do I want to, you know, In essence,
12 years from, you know, medical

school residency fellowships
to become an anesthesiologist.

And, um, ultimately decided not to,
unfortunately, after I went through

the whole process of getting into
medical school, but, uh, but decided

that I was gonna double down on supply
chain and, and operations because

that's where I, you know, sort of
felt I had this kind of zon of genius.

Gregg: Interesting.

No, that's,

Kevin Horek: that's cool.

So yeah, talk, talk to us about your

Gregg: career and coming up
with the idea for, uh, Cala.

Andrew Wyatt: So, after, Deciding
I was not going to pursue medicine.

I, um, actually threw the Center for
Executive Education at Tennessee where I'd

spent, you know, a good amount of time.

At that point got plugged in
with a company called Grundfos,

which was based in Denmark.

And so I spent two years
there in a rotation program.

So I got to travel all over the
world and do like, very macro

projects like realigning the North
American supply chain with Oh, cool.

Raw materials coming from Europe.

And also like very, very like micro
projects like in Fresno, California on the

production line, trying to optimize the,
you know, the flow of goods of a single

sort of like pump manufacturing line.

And so got to, you know,
really, really, uh, learn a lot.

, um, operations and supply chain.

But what I learned the most about was
that, uh, you know, doesn't matter

how good your ideas are, if, uh,
nobody wants to implement them, right?

And so that's where I really
started to learn the people,

people management piece and change
management and, and managing change.

When you have no leverage and you're,
you're not their boss, as a matter of

fact, they're, you know, they're up, up on
the, uh, totem pole, totem pole from you.

And so, , that was kind of a
really rich experience, a painful

experience as all good learning is.

Um, and, and through that though, you
know, I learned how to communicate

with people of all, you know, different
backgrounds and, um, was, and you know,

in the end pretty effective with that.

And then, um, part of the rotation
was I was gonna move to Indianapolis

and, um, be a logistics engineer.

And, um, about that time, Ended up
finding a job on angelist, um, for ship.

Okay.

And so, um, as the, as the story
goes, I was flying back to Denmark

and I was going to, um, to tell my
boss there that I was gonna leave and

was gonna do some consulting stuff.

And, um, I met a guy on the plane.

and he was like, oh yeah, you
know, consulting's a cool gig.

He's like, but what you really
should do is go to SF and be like

an ops guy for, you know, engineers.

He's like, this Uber cab company I
think is gonna be the first of kind

of a generation of sort of like
tech plus operations businesses.

And I was like, Ooh, that
sounds super interesting.

And, uh, a lot more interesting
than living in Indianapolis.

I know if offense, anyone from
Indianapolis out here, . And so, uh, and

so I, you know, he, I was like, where?

How, how do I even find, you know, these
engineers that are looking for, for

tech people or for operations people?

And, uh, he's like, Angelist,
it's like a place for talent

and companies and startups.

And so typed in logistics on there, found
ship and became their first employee

and was there for a couple years.

And so with SHIP was, it was
like Uber for shipping, right?

And so you could take a photo of
something, someone would come pick it

up professionally, pack it in a custom
fit box, send it anywhere in the world,

finding you the lowest cost shipping rate.

So got to really dive in and do,
you know, a lot of tech, a lot

of operations, a lot of, uh, you
know, logistics related things.

And I saw this kind of same repeat
behavior where people were using other

tools like Shopify or eBay or Etsy to
basically be their own entrepreneur and

ship was this great solution because
they were able to now outsource another

piece of the value chain that wasn't
necessarily part of their core competency.

Right?

And so, Specifically, um, there is a
boutique in the mission district of,

uh, SF that was using SHIP regularly.

And uh, and they kind of pique my interest
and, and so I went and talked to 'em and

they were like, oh yeah, SHIP is amazing.

Like, you know, once we started using
Shopify, now we can ship cus you know,

we could have customers all over the
world, um, instead of people that

could just walk through the door.

But, you know, we don't know
anything about international

logistics and things like that.

And so it got the wheels kind of spinning
on like, you know, In the future,

there's gonna be way more brands.

The, you know, technology has democratized
people's ability to be a creator or,

um, you know, launch their own business.

However, when it comes to actually
creating physical goods, specifically

within the fashion space, I felt
like there wasn't that sort of, you

know, Key leader in the market that
was like, oh, you know, you've built

a great, you know, Squarespace site.

You have a, you know, a, a big audience
on social, and now you use this app and

you can create amazing, you know, physical
products to sell to your audience.

Right.

I didn't feel like that existed.

Kevin Horek: Okay.

So how did you kind of refine the idea
and what was the first version and, and

made you actually decide like, I need to

Andrew Wyatt: really build.

So first, first thing I
did was I spent some time.

, um, with a fashion brand that
was okay, based in Sausalito and

is called, um, Frida Salvador.

It's actually a, a women's,
um, footwear company.

Okay.

And so spent a couple weeks with them
and just, you know, sort of learning,

absorbing, seeing the way they operated,
seeing what their meetings are like,

their design process, you know, how
they communicate with the factory,

how they, you know, Communicated
with her logistics partners.

Um, and it was through that experience
and I started to kind of see, you

know, basically the tool set is like
Adobe Illustrator and Excel, right?

And then email and phone.

And so that's where I, you know, initially
was like, okay, this is interesting.

Like there's probably something here.

Um, and so started working on
the V1 at, at the time, and this

was kinda separate from that
experience with them at the time.

I was also, you know,
really thinking about.

, the experience I had at SHIP where,
you know, there's just so many

people using SHIP for returns, right?

And so kind of the V1 of Cala was like,
can I create something that helps these

sort of like small fashioned brands and
kind of attacks this problem of returns?

And so the, the kind of V1 of Cala was,
you know, I, I talk about learning here.

We, I, I made this sort of like
standard tech person mistake,

which is like, I tried to jump.

all the way to the, like in solution.

And so, right.

It was a on demand
production, custom fit app.

Okay.

And so , um, a fashion brand could,
you know, create a collection, we would

basically do this crazy grading process so
that, um, it could be, you know, a custom

pattern can be made for each customer.

And then we built this app where, um,
someone could take three photos and

we'd be able to pull their key measure.

And then, um, basically from those
measurements and the grading process,

we do a custom pattern, and then we
had a factory in LA that would, you

know, cut and sew a, a custom garment.

So it took about like two weeks.

However, um, you know, we had fanatical
customers, but very, very few, um,

who, you know, loved the experience.

They could never find
anything that fit them well.

Now they could get the designer's
style, you know, in a, in a,

you know, custom fit for them.

Um, but ultimately the designers
just kept over and over saying

like, returns is not our problem.

our problem is being able to actually
produce what we want quickly and,

you know, in small quantities.

And, and so it was kind of through that
experience of kind of getting something

out into the world that we learned like,
oh, okay, the actual, you know, request

or, or things that, that brands want
is the ability to like easily have a,

you know, produce internationally and
find, you know, great manufacturers

and, and have, you know, reliable
experience producing the products.

Kevin Horek: Interesting.

So were you coding and designing
these first versions, or, or how

did you actually get these first

Andrew Wyatt: versions built?

Yeah, so the first, I, I did actually
code the first version of the website.

Okay.

Um, unfortunately, Webflow
did not exist then.

Um, right.

We would've saved me a lot of time.

Yes.

Um, web Awesome.

And then Webflow is absolutely incredible.

I think like the combination
of, of Webflow and.

Figma and Framer, and there's just
so many incredible tools now where

you can, I mean, you could get a, a
good, solid V1 of a startup up without

having anyone technical on your team.

Kevin Horek: Totally, a
hundred percent agree.

I still use, as somebody technical,
I still use those tools because

Gregg: they're so much quicker than
coding a lot of that stuff yourself.

So

Andrew Wyatt: I absolutely, yeah.

The Call Kello website today
is, uh, is built on Webflow.

And as a matter of fact, after
this meeting, I have time blocked

and, uh, get it turned, one of our
landing pages into a, a cms, um, so

that our team can quickly spin up.

A landing page specifically for
this customer that does these

things that are looking for this.

Um, and it's just amazingly powerful tool.

Gregg: No, fair enough.

That's very cool.

Yeah, I still do like my, well,
my own personal site is even done

in Webflow, and I do like client
work sometimes in that and, you

know, even just like startup work.

So No, I, I think it's a great tool.

So, but

Andrew Wyatt: uh, go ahead, sir.

Well, I was just gonna say, I think
it's a great, it's a great example

though of when, like, technology
can abstract away a lot of the,

you know, unnecessary complexity.

A hundred percent.

people can build amazing things
and, and that's kind of the, the

way that Cala is sort of like acting
within the, the fashion space now.

Kevin Horek: Okay.

No, that makes a lot of sense.

So walk us through exactly what Cala
has become today and may, and maybe give

us a bit more of the journey because
you've been at this a number of years

Andrew Wyatt: now.

Yeah.

So May 12th, 2022 will
be six years for me.

Wow.

Congrats man.

That's great.

Which is insane in startup years.

Yeah.

Which are, which are similar to dog years.

Um, . Yeah.

Hundred percent.

Maybe

Gregg: even worse.

Right.

.
Andrew Wyatt: Exactly.

Um, but yeah, so, so I'll, I'll kind of
distill it down to some, some big moments.

Okay.

First big moment was when I convinced
my co-founder Dylan to join me.

Okay.

And so he was an engineer at ship.

Um, fantastic engineer, probably.

I only know one other engineer
that's like, has as great of

like an iq, EQ balance as Dylan.

Right.

Um, and he was the CTO of ship, so
, um, was hard to, hard to pull him.

Sure.

Um, so, so basically Dylan joined, that's
when we really started to develop the

technology, both on the sort of like
custom fit and the app side, but also just

like the general, you know, website and
kind of taking that to the next level.

Right.

Basically, I fired myself from
coding and then, um, and then we,

we did a, uh, collaboration with
Wiz Khalifa and, um, Two brands, one

called Pleasures and one called 4 24.

And that was kinda the moment where,
and, and that was still through the, the

kind of custom fit type product we had.

And that was when one of the guys
from Pleasures was like, no one cares.

He was like, Andrew, no
one cares about custom fit.

He's like, but if we can rely,
if we can upload what we want and

have it produced and delivered
to us, like that's incredible.

You should build that.

And so, you know, a lot of people
talk on podcasts and, and Twitter

about listening to your customers.

We did and, and so at that point with not
a lot of money in the bank, we literally,

basically spun down our custom fit
business and started building the, you

know, version of Cal that there is today.

Kevin Horek: Okay.

But just to step back for a second, how
did you land some of these big names to

partner with you being that early on?

Andrew Wyatt: Connections.

The short answer is I have a, one of my
zone of geniuses besides, uh, operations.

I think, and actually I think
even more, um, more, more of a

zone of genius than operations is
my ability to sell and to okay.

Get, get basically people
excited about a vision.

Okay.

And so when it was just Dylan and
I on rotating between, uh, my

couch and his couch, um, we managed
to, um, you know, get connected.

, someone from this really cool
company called Maid, okay.

Which did these big events with
talent and fashion and culture.

And so we told them about our technology
and our big vision for the future.

And uh, and her name was Ruth.

And she basically was
like, wow, this is amazing.

Let's, you know, let's, let's do that
at Made LA And uh, and so that was

kind of the process of, and it was a
cold email that I sent to be honest.

Um, wow.

And, and, yeah.

Next big moment was hiring Ruth.

So . Okay.

Um, so we hired Ruth, uh, after that
event and uh, she kind of came on as

our, um, head of marketing and sort
of head of, um, you know, sort of

like creative director if you will.

And so that's when we moved the company
to New York and, and basically started

kind of getting closer to customers
and kind of getting embedded in the

like, fashion scene within New York.

Um, and then I'd say like the next
big moment was, It sounds kind of

crazy, but, uh, it is very fortuitous.

Basically, I was a big, uh,
superhuman, um, early user.

Sure.

And Superhuman is an email app and
I love it because it's just like,

it literally makes you superhuman.

You can move so much more quickly
through your inbox and such.

And so I gave 'em a lot of
product feedback early days.

So I got invited to a
happy hour that they had.

This is actually before
we moved to New York.

And uh, so I went to the
Happy Hours Engineering happy.

And I'm talking to a bunch of people and I
see this like six foot five guy in a Yeezy

sweatshirt and Balenciaga Triple S shoes.

Okay.

Which are like crazy sneakers.

And, uh, so I'm like, my brain's
racking, like, what is this guy doing

at a superhuman engineering happy hour?

Sure.

And, uh, and so I go and introduce myself
and his name was Ryan Wood and, uh, he

was the first designer at Superhuman.

And uh, I was Ryan, how would
you like to get coffee tomorrow?

And.

. Yeah, let's do it.

So, uh, long story short, three
weeks later, Ryan joined as our, um,

head of product and, uh, basically
was, was with us for four years.

And so he really, you know, if, if, uh,
we had this kind of idea, Ruth helped

us kind of like, you know, build that
legitimacy within the fashion space.

And Ryan helped us actually like
build the app and the product to,

you know, make it easy to, to kind
of achieve our, our purpose of making

it easy to create physical product.

Nope.

Kevin Horek: Very cool.

Okay, so keep going on this journey cuz

Andrew Wyatt: it's fascinating.

Yeah.

So, so now we're in New York and
um, we are having a hard time,

um, still having a bit of a hard
time on the supply chain side.

, you know, we're, we're working with
a decent number of factories, but

it's still kind of like we have one
good factory here that does this.

We have one good factory
there that does that.

And the, a big part of the
vision was having this sort

of like, network approach.

And so, you know, instead of having
one factory and then having all of the

projects go in that queue, trying to
take a distributed model, and this,

you know, this comes from operations
and even like networking, logic.

Um, and so, , we were able to kind
of, a next big step for us was we,

um, we hired this woman, Lauren
Divine, and uh, was a connection

through Ruth and she helped Kanye do
Yeezy season one through four right.

As, uh, his director of materials and
then subsequently was Alexander Wing's

director of materials for four years.

And so, you know, met her at our
space, very small space and uh, and

basically told her the vision and
she's like, yeah, that's never gonna.

And so, wow.

Um, so I was like, well, how about
you tell us how to make it work?

And so I brought her on as an advisor,
which, uh, big, big tip for anyone

that's starting a business out there.

If you can't quite hire the person
you want, bring 'em on as an advisor.

And then that's actually
really good advice.

Help them, you know, understand
and, and also like get skin in

the game on what you're doing.

And then when you're ready, you know,
maybe it's a couple months, um, maybe

it's, you know, longer, you know, make
the big, the big sell and the big pitch.

Kevin Horek: Interesting.

Did, did they eventually come

Andrew Wyatt: on board?

She did, and actually I did the
same thing for Dylan, my co-founder.

So I was like, look, dude.

And he is like, I'm not gonna leave ship.

Um, I'm like, how about you
come on as an advisor first?

And then, uh, about three
months later he joined.

And so, uh, Lauren, I think she was
advisor for about four or five months.

Um, and then, then joined full-time.

Kevin Horek: Well,

Andrew Wyatt: I,

Gregg: I, I think that's,
that's really good advice, but

keep going down this journey.

It's fascinating and I, I think you're
working in a lot of really good.

.
Andrew Wyatt: Yeah.

Appreciate that.

And so, um, so, so we're in New York.

We're at this point in time,
we're, we're starting to get our

operations like really dialed in.

So this is done, this is 2018.

And the issue we're starting
to run into is like, who is the

customer that we're going after?

Okay.

And so, you know, we've worked
with Wiz Clefa before, saw his

ability to sell out instantly.

And in New York we were working
with a lot of small design.

But they were all really still focused
on the wholesale model, which is like,

right, you make a bunch of samples,
you do a fashion show, or you go in

a showroom and you cross your fingers
and you hope that, you know, some

buyer's gonna come and place an order.

And uh, it's kind of this sick cycle
where, you know, the buys are smaller

and smaller and smaller as everything
was shifting towards e-commerce.

And so we had this hypothesis and
we're like, If we can focus on

celebrities and influencers and be
kind of like, you know, the solution

to help them launch brands at the time.

You know, Kylie was on
the cover of Forbes and.

Yeezy was just starting to kind of get
kicked off, um, from like a, you know,

big sort of like name brand perspective.

And, uh, and so that was kind of,
you know, a big pivotal moment was

we were like, all right, we're gonna
double down, triple down on, um,

signing celebrities and influencers.

And so we started that in 2019 and,
uh, we signed about 35 and, uh, we

built relationships with all the
big, you know, wme, C a a, IMG.

Um, D B a, I mean there's 1,000,003
letter and acronyms for talent

agencies and we basically built
relations with ships with all of them.

And, uh, and, and so that's kind
of when we're, we're getting into

covid a little bit and, and basically
we were fortunate to have the

opportunity to get kind of like.

Never before seen access to talent
because they were sitting at home

and willing to jump on a FaceTime
or a Zoom or something like that.

And so, uh, we were pretty fortunate.

Um, we, we signed a lot of them and
that, you know, resulted in, um,

a bit of a surprise, which was we
found that not everyone with a large

audience and high levels of engagement
was able to, you know, actually.

And so of the 35, you know, about a
quarter of them were pretty successful.

Um, another quarter would like, you
know, make back the cost of goods.

Um, and then half of 'em just like
couldn't sell all a darn thing.

Fascinating.

Kevin Horek: Why do you think that was?

Just outta curiosity?

Andrew Wyatt: I think,
you know, basically were,

we were thinking that, , you
know, engagement translates

to dollars in its purest.

Okay.

And I think what we learned,
um, and, and, you know, we were

continuously fine tuning the types
of, of talent we were going after.

What we basically learned is that, you
know, a lot of people with high engagement

are, are really have this sort of like
entertainment relationship with their

following versus a taste making or like
a trend setting type of relationship.

Okay.

You also get really good
engagement if people hate.

. Yeah,

Gregg: I guess that makes sense, , because

Andrew Wyatt: everyone's
trolling all of your posts.

So, you know, what we kind of ultimately
found is like, you know, it's, it's

more than just the quantitative numbers.

You know, you have to be able to look
at someone and be like, all right, are

they actually influencing their audience?

Are they, you know, generating new looks
and ideas and, and trend and, and taste?

And so, um, we ultimately found
that was pretty hard to, to, you

know, basically pick winners.

And so, . What we did towards the
end of 21, or sorry, towards the

end of 2020, is we realized that
like the successful brands really

look a lot like fashion brands.

So a lot of their needs are the
same from like a technology and

sort of a supply chain perspective.

And so towards the end of 2020 and
then in going into 21, we basically.

Evolved our solution even further to
really just focus in on, you know, sort

of million in revenue plus fashion brands,
um, enabling them to scale more quickly

and, and, you know, work more effectively.

Okay.

Kevin Horek: Fascinating.

So how does one of these
brands start using Cala?

And then let's dive into.

Andrew Wyatt: Yeah.

So right now it's a, there's kind
of two main channels in which,

you know, people come to Cal.

One is, you know, outbound and the
other is inbound, um, which is,

you know, either signing up on our
site or we get a lot of referrals.

And so once you, um, you know, Get
in contact with us, we'll do a, a

short onboarding session and, and
basically you can start loading in

your designs and your inspiration.

And so through our platform you
can upload, you know, raw sketches,

you can upload inspiration images.

You and your team can sort of
collaborate back and forth.

We have like pretty, pretty robust like
commenting and notifications and um,

app mentioning and things like that.

And so it's this kind of like, you know,
sort of cool little bit figma que from

like a collaboration features, um, type.

We're just like about, like, how
can you get the vision of what you

want out as quickly as possible?

And then, um, once you submit
a collection, we've actually

built our own pricing algorithm.

And so based on even just kind of
those raw ideas on like, here's sort

of a reference image for the t-shirt I
want, but I want it in the, this fabric

that I love from this t-shirt that
I've had since like, you know, eighth

grade and here's our logo based on just
kinda like those small bits of info.

We can price it for you and you
can sort of in real time see how

it changes between like 10 units
to a hundred units to 275 units.

Which is a, a really powerful tool and,
and we quote the total landing cost.

And so, you know, if it's at
a hundred units, it's uh, $15.

You know that if you sell it for
45, you're walking away with,

you know, 30 bucks a margin.

Right.

Um, and that's, that's been a pretty huge,
uh, feature that, that everyone loves.

Sure.

Kevin Horek: Okay.

So, How, from, from what I remember,
and you can correct me if I'm wrong,

you also have people on your side
that'll help me design stuff if I

need it or, or walk us through some of
the full and other services you guys

Gregg: provide.

Andrew Wyatt: Absolutely.

So, so one of the key things that
we've done at Cala is basically,

you know, listening to our
customers, any, any gap that they.

in, in, you know, any need that
they have, we try to see if it

makes sense for us to fill it.

Okay.

So first, as you mentioned, like
what if I need help designing?

And you may think like, well, they're a
designer, how they need help designing.

But what we've actually found is that
like a lot of times, you know, even like

a small fashion brand or even a medium
sized fashion bread, they live a ton of

competency around one type of designing.

So let's call it like sweaters.

But if they wanna do a, a.

That's, you know, historically
you would have to hire a team of

like five people if you wanted to
start getting into foot footwear.

So at Kello we basically have this network
of ghost designers that can be available

on a sort of like, you know, pay as you
go type model, um, which is really cool.

So you don't need to hire somebody
and pay 'em a hundred K a year.

Um, you can just pay us, you
know, a thousand bucks for a

design or something like that.

Right.

Um, I think it's even like
less expensive than that.

So we've done that in a number of areas.

So we have ghost.

And let's say that you already have your
designs, you know exactly what you want.

Um, once you check out, then we
actually now do by default a 3D design.

Okay?

And so we'll basically take those
sketches and reference images, and

you'll get an actual like 3D render
render that you can sort of engage

with through the Cal platform.

once that's, you know, once
you've kind of gone back and

forth and you've approved that.

Um, which actually by the way has been
amazing cuz it's helping us save, you

know, two, maybe even like three samples
in the development process because wow,

people can kind of just like see upfront,
here's what it is in a kind of a three

dimensional space, which is really cool.

That's awesome.

Okay.

Gregg: But keep going.

Sorry.

Andrew Wyatt: So once, once you approve
your 3D design, then it goes in this

kind of like technical phase where we
take the 3D design, make sure that it's

sort of like production ready, right?

And then, and so that's another
sort of skillset that you're

getting access to through cala.

Um, which is like the technical design.

And so this is like figuring out like
the pattern, um, all the specifics

about the prints and the print
treatments and the size and the scaling.

All the things that like you could do as,
you know, an individual designer or as

a fashion brand, but like that's a whole
nother role that, uh, that you need and.

there's a, you know, lingerie
technical designer, and there's

a, you know, knitwear technical
designer, and there's a, you know,

accessories technical designer.

And so, you know, with Cala, you just
get, you know, fractional usage of,

of the ones in our network instead
of named to have them all in staff.

Interesting.

Similarly, once it goes to the factories,
you know, we have 30 different factories

in 13 different countries, and so
instead of going out and vetting them all

yourself, they're all available, you know,
Same thing with like inbound logistics.

We take care of all of that.

Then we also have a direct to consumer
fulfillment product where we have

about 18 warehouses that we work
with around the world, um, where we

can actually store your products and
directly ship them to your customers.

Kevin Horek: Very cool.

And you're, you have obviously like a free
plan all the way up to whatever, right?

Like depend you, like you'll
do whatever people need

Andrew Wyatt: basically.

Is that.

Exactly.

Yep.

So you can get started, you know,
uploading your designs and collaborating

with one person on our free plan.

And then if you wanna actually get
pricing, you have to upgrade to our,

um, our professional plan, which
is I think like 30 bucks a month.

And, and then once you actually
wanna produce something, then you

add our, our, uh, production add-on,
um, which is $500 a month plus a

a 10 to 20% service fee, depending
on how much revenue you're doing.

Right?

And then lastly, if you wanna
add the fulfillment add-on,

that's another 500 bucks a.

. Um, and then another 10% service
fee on the cost of fulfillment.

Kevin Horek: So it's pretty
inexpensive for what you get access

to and all the people you get access
to just based on even your shoe.

Gregg: Uh, example a few minutes ago,
like not having to hire five people

Andrew Wyatt: is . It's insane.

Yeah.

Yeah.

It's, it's literally, and it's, it's,
that's I think one of the examples of

like, you know, why these sort of like
marketplace or, you know, SAS enabled

marketplace or managed marketplace,
why these models are so powerful is

because through that technology you
can basically connect, you know, demand

and supply in a super meaningful way.

Um, and at a really like low
cost because of the scale.

No,

Kevin Horek: yeah, totally.

So, The thing that I always find
fascinating about what you guys

are doing is you are really adding
technology into a space that's not

really known for being very technical.

And I don't mean that in a negative
way, it's just there's not a

lot of software that that plays
in the fashion space, at least.

Is that, that's my understanding.

So is that a fair statement, I
guess before I ask my question?

Andrew Wyatt: Absolutely.

I think, you know, historically,
fashion has prided itself on, you

know, the artisan, you know, cutting
the fabric by hand and flying to

Italy to review samples type model.

Right.

Since I've been working on Cala, it's
definitely very quickly been, you know,

trying to catch up on, on the tech side.

Kevin Horek: Right.

Okay.

So then I'm curious, what
advice do you give to people?

Look, because it sounds like you basically
just figured it out as you went, tried

to make as many connections as possible.

You obviously networked with people.

You gave some really good advice about,
um, if they don't join you a ask them

as a, or add them as ave mentor if
they're willing to do that, in hopes

that you can hire them down the road.

But what other things have
you learned along the way?

, you know, you maybe
wish you knew earlier on

Andrew Wyatt: in your journey.

One of the biggest things that I've
learned through the Cal experience

and really through, you know, I'm
getting close to like 10 years in

tech now totally is I, I got into
the space thinking I knew everything.

. Okay.

And now I'm so proud to say that I, I
know basically nothing . That's funny.

And when you embrace, when you
embrace that nothingness Yep.

It puts you in a position to listen.

it put you in a li in
a position to discover.

It puts you in a position to learn.

And, and I think that, you know, through
towards the end of my ship experience,

you know, I really was kind of like
having my world crushed from the,

like I know everything perspective.

And so as I was starting Cala it,
there really was this curiosity.

Um, and of course it was a new space as.

. And so, you know, as you, as you become,
you know, optimizing for learning

versus optimizing for being right,
um, it really enables a lot of like

beautiful things to come together.

And then you find yourself kind of like
threading together the past experience

you've had and like, oh, actually.

This thing that I learned in this
completely separate experience and

space can actually be repurposed into
a new space to create something new

or something, you know, more unique.

And that could be a piece of technology,
that could be a process, that could

be a, you know, a relationship.

Um, and so I think that, you know, Really,
really trying to approach everything

as a kind of like a day one, like,
you know, I know nothing perspective.

Um, I think that that's
been super helpful for me.

Kevin Horek: No, I, I actually
think that's really good advice.

I also feel like it, it sounds
stupid, but it's kind of an icebreaker

sometimes when things get maybe a
little challenging or if you're having

kind of a, a weird conversation.

, like maybe, maybe not like a customer
or a client, but if it's somebody that

you're just getting to know, you're kinda
like, well, I don't really know what I'm

doing, or I, I haven't, like, and it kind
of just like lightens the mood sometimes.

And if you, if you Absolutely,
if you genuinely mean it, I think

people just totally like, it just
kind of relaxes the situation.

Do you know what I'm

Andrew Wyatt: getting at?

You're exactly right.

It relaxes a situation and you'll
be blown away at how much time and

knowledge people are willing to give.

Totally.

It's, it's literally like, because you
have that curiosity, um, people want

to help, they want to, not everyone,
but, but a lot of people want to help.

And, you know, I kind of think back
to, you know, when I was in LA in a,

you know, at a manufacturer, Working
with this, you know, wonderful 60

year old woman who is a pattern maker.

And she was like, I'm like,
I literally know nothing.

Like please just tell me everything.

Yeah.

And so she taught me about
grading and about marking and,

you know, the whole experience.

And you know, you would be just
amazed at how much you can learn in

a very short period of time, um, you
know, with that kind of attitude.

And I think when you look at a
lot of the, like, super successful

startups, especially the ones that.

kind of like creating a new space.

Yeah.

It's almost never someone from the in,
like from that industry that's doing it.

Totally.

Yeah.

Something about Travis Kalanick with
Uber and Brian Chesky and team with

Airbnb, like none of them came from
taxis or from, you know, hospitality.

Um, I think it takes that kind of like
that, you know, outsider view and, and

that process of learning where you can
kind of come up with these like crazy new.

Gregg: No,

Kevin Horek: I, I think
that's really good advice.

So you also have a mobile app.

How does that tie into everything
we've talked about so far today?

Andrew Wyatt: Yeah, so, you know, I don't
wanna beat a dead horse, but, you know,

listening to our customers, seeing what
they're they're doing, seeing how they're

using the product, one of the things
became abundantly clear, which is, the

creation process, you know, which is still
heavily dependent on the Adobe Suite.

Few people are using Figma.

Um, that's a desktop experience, right?

But once you get past that part and even
the, like, the collaboration elements

within that part, A large portion
of the team are not in those tools.

They're on mobile.

And so what we kind of realized
about, about a year ago is like, you

know, I think it was something like
60% of uh, people that were logging

to the app were logging on iOS.

Okay.

And so we were basically like, all right,
we need to create like the absolute best.

Experience, um, the best digital
experience for, for our customers

and for many of them, you know,
that means a mobile experience.

And so, um, we launched the mobile
app back in March and, uh, has

had incredible response so far.

It's, uh, it's also a cool opportunity for
us because we've been able to, you know,

use a different tech stack, um, right.

And so really kind of.

Playing around with some new cool,
cool technology and, and things

from like the API side that, um,
is really exciting for our, you

know, our team that's working on it.

Um, but also just like, you know, going
back to that day one thing, you know,

whenever you get a, a chance to kind
of like start fresh with something you

can, you know, do it better that time.

And so, um, the app super, super
fast and, um, some features, you

know, are even easier to do on
iOS like panning and zooming than

they are on, on, uh, on desktop.

And so it's been kind of cool
to, to introduce that product

and, and have heard, uh, you
know, great, great feedback.

So, No.

Kevin Horek: Very cool.

So I'm curious, because obviously you
have some well-known brands and some

celebrities using the platform, how do you
manage your roadmap with their requests?

Because some of these brands could
probably throw lots of money at

you to build some of the features
that you're like, well, they're

not really right for us, or how so?

How do

Andrew Wyatt: you manage that?

That's a good question.

So, , I think it's about staying
true to your purpose as a company.

Okay.

And so our purpose is to power
physical product creation by

connecting the world through an
accessible digital infrastructure.

And so when we get big requests like,
um, oh, you guys should build a factory,

or, you know, something like that, and
it's like, well, does that directly.

Help us on our purpose of,
of making, creating physical

products more accessible, maybe.

Um, by then it's becomes a priorit
prioritization process towards like,

what are the things that are most
quickly and most directly gonna

propel us towards that vision?

And so that's something that's been really
important for, for Dylan and I from the

very beginning, is really codifying our
purpose as a company, but also our values.

And so we kind of talk about it as
like, you know, The purpose and,

and sort of like our O OKRs is just
how we track towards our purpose.

Um, O OKRs, standing for
objectives and key results.

That's kinda like the what that we do.

Okay.

But equally as important is the
values, which is like the how.

And, and I think it creates a really
great framework for, you know, hiring f

creates a great framework for managing,
um, in, in some cases it creates a great

framework for offboarding team members
that, that kind of don't work within that.

Gregg: No, I, yeah, no,

Kevin Horek: that, that makes total sense.

So one thing we haven't covered yet is,
so I, we get through the whole design

process, I have my collection ready to go.

How do I actually, do you, I'm
assuming you, well I know, but you guys

integrate with Shopify or Webflow to
actually sell these to my customers.

Correct.

Or, or walk us through.

Absolutely.

That process, once it's done
and I have everything ready to.

Andrew Wyatt: Yep.

So we do third party QC at the factories.

Our logistics team handles all of the
importation craziness through customs,

no matter which country it's coming from.

Okay.

Once the product's been received in the
warehouse, you can actually, uh, connect

your, your call account to your Shopify
or to a Webflow and, uh, and then.

From that point on, that's kind of,
you know, on, on the customer side.

So, um, you know, you can launch
whenever the products are available

and those orders are gonna flow through
directly, um, and, and be shipped.

I think right now we're averaging like
12 hours, um, you know, from, from the

time the order happens until there's a
tracking information that's provided.

Um, and one of the cool
things we do also is we.

Customer service as a, a part
of our fulfillment solution.

So not only for 500 bucks a month
do you get, you know, access to

incredible shipping rates and all these
different facilities everywhere and.

Amazingly high caliber of of fulfillment
provider cuz we're doing so much volume.

Um, but you also get a team that's
gonna be able to answer questions

from your customers directly.

You know, my item didn't arrive or it
was delivered, but I didn't get it, or

it was damaged, or I need to return.

All of those things can
be taken care of for you.

And we actually, we had this sort
of like 17 page brand bible template

that we, when we onboard a fulfillment
client, we'll go through talk

about like, what's your customer?

What's your sizing and grading?

What do you want your
friendly fraud protocol to be?

Um, and of course we have all of
our defaults and recommendations,

but it's a great way for you to
kind of like, take a pause and be

like, oh, how does my brand operate?

And, uh, oh, look at these best practices.

And so it's a really, you know, great,
um, tool for brands to be able to offer

really great post-purchase experience.

No, very cool.

Kevin Horek: So is there anything else.

Kind of ongoing that you guys also
include because like customer service

is obviously super important, but you
know, once it's kind of everything's

up and running and I'm maybe working
on another collection, how does

that kind of play into the platform?

Or is it just kind of a rinse and
repeat type cycle that, okay, now

I'm working on my next collection
and we kind of started over?

Or how does that kind of work

Andrew Wyatt: exactly.

So, you know, In the platform,
things can be organized into

collections and so, okay.

You know, you can actually see
through a dashboard for different

collections and different products,
you know, what stage are they in?

Is it in the sort of
technical design phase?

Is it in sampling?

Is it in production?

. Um, and then so we've kind of built the
product so that you can easily do that

across collections within one team.

And you can even do it
really easily across teams.

And so let's say for instance
that you have, you know, kind of

one brand that you're primarily
working on, but then you also do

some design work for another brand.

You can kind of easily within the
platform track the status of, you know,

multiple different designs that are being
produced in five or 10 or 20 different

countries, um, all at the same time.

Which is, which is pretty.

Gregg: No, that's, that's very cool.

But we're,

Kevin Horek: we're kind of coming to
the end of the show, but I'm curious,

is there any like books or podcasts
that you recommend that you've

learned a lot from over the years?

Andrew Wyatt: Absolutely.

So the, probably the most
impactful book for me has been 15

commitments to Conscious Leadership.

Oh, interesting.

I think, um, That was introduced
to me about three, maybe four years

ago now, and, um, absolutely changed
the way that I think about life,

but also of course management.

And, um, and one of the key, I guess
actually the , the first of the

commitments is taking 100% responsibility.

And it's not just taking
100% responsibility of your

work, but of your whole life.

So your physical, mental, spiritual,
well, , and you'll be amazed once

you kind of go through reading this
book and you start thinking about

like, oh wow, actually I don't take.

Well, you know, I don't take
full responsibility ever.

In some cases, you know, it's
like, oh, I'm, I'm too tired.

I'm not gonna work out, or, uh, you know,
I, I, um, just so burn out, you know,

blah, blah, blah, or, you know, and, uh,
and so one of those, one of those, uh, uh,

when I, when I kind of read that book, it
had a, almost like a, a great awakening.

It was also in a very,
you know, tough time.

Um, At Cala where, you know, we are having
big issues with a big customer and um,

of course always running outta money.

And so, you know, I was in kind
of a, a tough place and, and kind

of got introduced to that book and
helped, uh, to create sort of like

a tool, a tool belt if you will.

Um, cuz life's, life's a rollercoaster.

It's ups and downs and that's
the beauty of life, right?

If it was all the same, it would.

Be super boring.

And so what the 15 commitments do is they
kind of give you this, like, this tool,

tool set, um, to use when, you know,
things get thrown at you that help you

just, you know, to be more zen and, and
kind of flow through life more happily.

Well, I,

Gregg: I think that's a
really good recommendation.

Kevin Horek: Any podcasts

Andrew Wyatt: you listen to?

I mean, none, none that
I would highly recommend.

I'm kind of a, a bit scattered
from that where like Sure.

A lot of the, a lot of the
podcasts I listen to are through.

Twitter or, or something like that versus
like me following, um, I like, uh, the,

the podcast that Jack Conte is doing
for, um, from Patreon is pretty cool.

He's had a lot of really
interesting people on there.

Um, and of course, you
know, Hayden or love him.

I think the, the Joe Rogan podcast
is, is super interesting just to like,

hear the, I was, I was listening to
one this weekend about the Amazon and

uh, how maybe there's actually like,
You know, crazy civilization there

that is now just being discovered.

And so, um, that one's always
interesting to, to kind of

tickle the brain a little bit.

Oh, interesting.

Cool man.

Kevin Horek: Well, we're, we're out
of time, so how about we close with

mentioning where people can get more
information about yourself, Callan,

and any other links you wanna mention?

Andrew Wyatt: Absolutely.

So if you wanna know more about Kello,
visit our website ca.la And uh, yeah,

if you wanna follow me, I'm on Twitter.

A W H Y I t um, did it phonetically cuz
somebody had a wide already hot about.

Um, but yeah, feel free to to choose
a note on, on our, our website or,

or follow us on Twitter as well.

This is ca or sorry, uh, this
is call is our, um, Twitter

and it's also our Instagram.

Perfect.

Gregg: Well, Andrew, again, I really
appreciate you taking the time and

your day to have a chat with me and
have a good rest of your day, man.

Of

Andrew Wyatt: course.

Thanks for having me.

Take care.

Thank you.