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The Torchy's boys hit the trail to rustle some wild horses and elude one dynamite character actor. This time we cover the AMC miniseries produced and directed by Walter. We follow ranchers played by great actors Robert Duvall and Thomas Haden Church as they try to navigate 800 miles of hard road to save some Chinese concubines from prostitution and make their nut on a fleet of horses. Great times with the fellas with plenty of tangents. Next up, we get the Walter Hill written and Sam Peckinpah directed The Getaway featuring a shotgun toting Steve McQueen!
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Creators and Guests
What is The Butcher Shop?
A multi-genre podcast where Gary and his co-hosts (Iris Walters, Suzanne Cappelletti and Jamie Sammons) put two films that share a thread on the table and talk about them with a bit of banter and laughter at each other’s expense.
Intro: Yeah, well the truth is
Gary Hill: I never had women.
Gary Hill: figured out and that's a cold hard fact.
Intro: Fact. Yeah.
Gary Hill: The deal is ain't enough of them out here to go around anyplace.
Gary Hill: He's always been a pushover for the ladies.
Gary Hill: God amen a man extended the power that lays between a woman's thighs.
Gary Hill: You see the hope?
Gary Hill: That little cooter has on a man's life is Bring a strong man to his knees.
Gary Hill: Now look at the kings and kingdoms.
Gary Hill: Better follow that little split tail.
Gary Hill: My right hand.
Gary Hill: You are indeed. I can only assume you're referring to them.
Gary Hill: To the English King Henry.
Intro: Okay.
Gary Hill: Didn't exactly bring him to his knees, but he did tell the post.
Gary Hill: To kiss his ass and a little bit.
Gary Hill: He started his own church for one of his favorite.
Intro: Yeah.
Gary Hill: Six wives.
[Silence]
Gary Hill: I'll stick to horses.
Gary Hill: Don't let my laptop put you off.
Gary Hill: Like we said for a friendship wrong.
Gary Hill: Yeah. Come on over here.
Gary Hill: Yes.
[Silence]
Gary Hill: How's the head feeling?
Intro: MULȚUMIT PENTRU VIZIONARE!
Gary Hill: Thank you. Careful of whiskey.
Intro: Mr. Longhang.
Intro: Thank you.
Intro: Thank you.
Gary Hill: I prefer call.
Intro: Yeah, well.
Gary Hill: But Male independence is all well and fine.
Intro: But
Gary Hill: But too much. No sir.
Gary Hill: Is that marriage and women with all of being drunk?
Gary Hill: Shot ourselves to death.
Gary Hill: Or die to the clap.
[Music]
Intro: DIGIS!
[Music]
Intro: Not somebody who thinks he's as tough as a nickel snake.
Intro: But you all come to speed for the go remi
Gary Hill: I get this.
Gary Hill: We need friends.
Intro: Friends.
Intro: My little brother was fifteen.
Intro: 15 years old.
Intro: How about cutting heat? Oh, I get it. You want some kind of contest, huh?
Intro: Amen.
Gary Hill: That's why I have to kill him.
[Music]
Intro: It'll hurt if I do.
Intro: Well
[Music]
Intro: Finally raining to some
Gary Hill: Someone that likes to lay.
Intro: Latest reference.
Intro: Yeah, this must be a lucky night.
Intro: My body.
Gary Hill: They're not nice like me
Intro: We're supposed to say the fence.
Intro: You're not supposed to say nazi.
Gary Hill: Hello folks within the last call of Torchy's.
Gary Hill: Uh, take two if you're if you're following home, but not really.
Gary Hill: Um
Cameron: Yeah.
Lee Russell: Right.
Gary Hill: I am here tonight with the with the fellows, uh starting up I'm um
Gary Hill: I'm on my my my right, if you will, is uh Mr Lee Russell. How you doing, sir?
Lee Russell: I'm doing good, man. I'm just, you know.
Lee Russell: Try to get these horses and get my twenty five percent.
Gary Hill: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Gary Hill: And uh with me uh on the bottom
Gary Hill: my screen. But number one of your hearts is uh Mr. Cameron Scott. How you doing, sir?
Cameron: Doing great, just been fly fishing all the damn dong day.
Lee Russell: Mm-hmm.
Cameron: What the fuck was that C unaporn?
Gary Hill: Better before, but that's okay.
Lee Russell: I don't know.
Lee Russell: I'm so perplexed. There there was definitely writing problems in this movie, but we'll get to it.
Gary Hill: You learn a new way of fishing that, you know, is newfangled or whatnot. Come on now.
Gary Hill: Yeah.
Cameron: Robert DeVolve in eighty five year old makeup.
Gary Hill: Yes, indeed.
Gary Hill: Uh it's been a while since you've been here. Um, but yeah, we're back.
Gary Hill: Doing our s s somewhat sort of tribute, but but it happens to be the next in the line of films to do within the Walter Hill Ouvera of films.
Gary Hill: Oh, that's what this show is after all. We you know The next one we're gonna do, yeah, we'll talk about that towards the end of the show.
Gary Hill: Broken trail.
Gary Hill: is is the name of this film. It was a mini series For the AMC network.
Gary Hill: Rem remember quite fondly.
Gary Hill: Uh I own the D V D somewhere, I could tell you where that is. I don't know, I own that. But uh Sorry about that guys.
Gary Hill: Uh Yeah.
Gary Hill: But yeah, the stars are great. Rob Robert Duball and um Thomas Aiden Church is the two leads and I made mention my watches on social media that Yeah, with these two guys you don't need much else as you and I think we got a little bit more than than these two leads in this film.
Gary Hill: Uh but I'll start I'll start with the with the cast here. Uh Robert Guvall as uh Prentice Ritter.
Gary Hill: Uh Thomas Hayden Church.
Gary Hill: You know, I mentioned Robert Goodwall but he's in but you guys should all know by now what Robert Goodwall is in been he's been in many things over the years, um
Cameron: I don't want to know who you are.
Gary Hill: Well, you know pertaining to this, you know, probably a part of
Gary Hill: One, if not the greatest Western miniseries of all time, which is the lonesome the lonesome dove. Yeah. Yeah.
Lee Russell: Yeah. No, it hurts.
Lee Russell: And of course he was he was in Hill's previous drama dranomo film.
Lee Russell: And uh and and and he actually got it, you know, and like a lot of actors from his generation, he got a start in cowboy stuff. He did a bunch of cowboy TV shows, he did True Grit.
Lee Russell: He did Law Man, he did Joe Kidd.
Lee Russell: Uh he was in open range, which you uh watched As a little bit of a follow up uh tonight, Gary.
Lee Russell: He he's actually it was it's actually kinda interesting. He's sort of like Every once in a while he'd dip back into the into the Western genre over his career, but like
Lee Russell: Really he's kinda bookending his career at this point with with this and open range. Like the he he kinda like took a more serious dip back into westerns around this period.
Gary Hill: Well, you know, we're re reviving it.
Gary Hill: too because yeah, everyone every once in a while, you know, it just
Gary Hill: It dies up till they make something worthwhile and then hey it it's back again. But Um
Gary Hill: It never really left all the way, so there's that. No.
Gary Hill: But you know, did the Godfather uh uh when when he died, I I mentioned the the great the great Santini is a great Robert Duval film you should watch. Um
Cameron: I mean to kill a mocking bird.
Gary Hill: Kill Mockenbird.
Lee Russell: Yeah. The outfit.
Gary Hill: For stupidity's sake, then in a film that I love.
Gary Hill: The remake of Garner sixty seconds. I'll I'll watch it. Oh yeah.
Lee Russell: Course he's in uh he's in Fallin' Down, he's the cop chasing Michael Douglas around.
Gary Hill: Defense! Defense!
Lee Russell: Yeah.
Gary Hill: Uh Yeah, r relevant you Yeah, films nowadays, you know.
Gary Hill: Could this happen? Yeah, well it could definitely happen. So it'd be worse now.
Gary Hill: E pute-se na social media. I'll be okay. Oh, yeah.
Lee Russell: It'll be on TikTok.
Cameron: Yeah. The g guy would not be known as a killer, be known as a fucking influencer.
Gary Hill: Yes, okay.
Gary Hill: Definitely.
Gary Hill: Oh my gosh.
Gary Hill: The Thomas Sandy Church a as Tom Hart. This guy shows up in lots of things. Um Notably um sideways.
Gary Hill: Tales in the Curpresents Demon Knight.
Gary Hill: Um
Lee Russell: The Spider Man uh sequels, the rainy ones.
Gary Hill: Oh. Uh uh uh un untalked about, but should be loved.
Gary Hill: Uh un under talked about T B show wings with with uh with Tim Daly.
Lee Russell: Daily.
Lee Russell: Cour of course he's in he's in tombstone and uh Yeah.
Lee Russell: It is.
Lee Russell: He's a bit more of a low key, uh like
Lee Russell: I I think people like after Sideways expected him to really take off as like a big star and he never quite really did that. He kind of slid right comfortably into like solid character actor guy who once in a while pops up in a big movie Like, you know
Lee Russell: uh the the latest um knives out film he's got a part in that but like that's a movie that's an ensemble piece of all great character actors so like when when you're looking for a guy for that kind of thing He's the kind of guy you slot in for one of those
Gary Hill: He's always that guy behind the guy, like I said, I mentioned Tim Daly and Wings.
Gary Hill: Uh Paul Pilgiamati insideways. She's always that guy that's gonna follow that guy and It's not as easy to do, but he he pull he pulls it off pretty well.
Lee Russell: It's a great straight man.
Gary Hill: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Cameron: Yeah, yeah.
Cameron: He was great in twisted metal too in that first season, if you haven't seen it.
Cameron: That's great.
Gary Hill: Is the next season not out? I I should look for that I guess,'cause I I watched the first season.
Cameron: The second season's been out for a while. I think the they're getting ready to release the third.
Gary Hill: Yeah, I heard something about Mark Hamill doing a voice or something and that thing.
Gary Hill: I forget that.
Lee Russell: Wait, he does voices?
Gary Hill: No, he hasn't been impressed at all.
Lee Russell: Uh okay.
Cameron: ご視聴ありがとうございました
Gary Hill: Well I tell folks that that that you know that's the thing.
Gary Hill: At work like in like who's your favorite joker? I was like, Well, you know, Hamill's up there.
Gary Hill: Like what what? Mark Hand's like, Yeah, he was the voice on the animated series. Like, they're they'll tell me that doesn't count and I said, Well well
Gary Hill: You're you're stupid and you think that doesn't count. Come on now.
Lee Russell: Totally counts. Yeah. He is he is the best.
Cameron: Conroy doesn't count as the fucking one of the best Batmen.
Lee Russell: He is Batman.
Lee Russell: So much so that the that latest uh animated series that they did, that's uh the Bruce Tim uh Heralded one.
Lee Russell: kind of a spiritual sequel to the original uh animated series.
Lee Russell: um They got a guy doing Batman in that who's who's doing his best, Kevin Conroy.
Gary Hill: Well I don't know Conroy so many years ago I told him I was like, Hey, you know what? That Christian Bale, he's kinda terrible in the movie, isn't he? He just he's kinda bad at it, you know.
Gary Hill: Any comparison. Yeah.
Cameron: Yeah.
Lee Russell: Yeah. I mean I mean it's it's a different it's a different beast, those
Gary Hill: He didn't need a grabble voice to do that shit. He did it he did it with gusto, you know. But uh Conversate in church though, you know, getting guy behind the guy.
Gary Hill: I'll rep hard for the Brendan Fraser George of the Jungle because I have fun with it.
Gary Hill: He play he plays like the The foil of the movie the the with the boyfriend to to to uh To Ursula.
Gary Hill: Go m go man, if you haven't watched it, it's funny as hell to me, you know.
Gary Hill: There is John Cleese the talking um uh um
Gary Hill: talking animatronic drill in that movie. So it's it's a Let's get, let's get shot, you know.
Gary Hill: The Ape name Ape.
Gary Hill: Now the song's overhead now, see? I can you hear the um
Lee Russell: Yeah, there you go.
Lee Russell: You're fucking dead to me too, you motherfucker.
Gary Hill: Year worm of the thing.
Cameron: Thank you very much.
Gary Hill: oh you're welcome you're welcome
Gary Hill: Greta Scotchy, good grasc. Great grata gruddoscotchy, you know.
Lee Russell: And it sounds like there's
Cameron: I can find them right next to the orange Milano cookies.
Lee Russell: Yeah.
Lee Russell: It sounds like there should be another I in her name. Like it should be Siachi or something like that, but it's not. It's like s I we I don't know if we're pronouncing it correctly. All I as as I stated in our original uh aborted non recording that we did Um
Lee Russell: I remember her from the Coca Cola kid being naked and being a good actress and that those are like the two things that uh stand out for me with her.
Gary Hill: With her.
Gary Hill: nice nice nice Chris Mulkey, who shows up in lots of things.
Gary Hill: I think the first thing I'd seen him in was Ghosts in the machine from the early nineties.
Cameron: Oh yeah.
Lee Russell: Yeah.
Gary Hill: That was that was a fun, stupid movie. That probably wouldn't work, you know, but
Lee Russell: That's great around.
Lee Russell: Yeah, that's that's right around the time in the nineties where they were trying to figure shit out because the the slasher boom had died.
Lee Russell: And now everyone was just kind of like
Lee Russell: Oh, can we still do slashers and maybe make them different? Are we gonna do something else?
Lee Russell: And you know, Ghost Zone Machine was like a uh you know, a byproduct of that sort of mentality from the studios.
Cameron: Like a slasher. Like Lawmore Man.
Lee Russell: Yeah.
Gary Hill: Yeah, yeah. They were in that tech space, like Brain scan, which is a film that people love and I love the bad guy, but it doesn't work very well.
Gary Hill: So so does that.
Gary Hill: It's uh
Lee Russell: They were they were tr they were trying hard for a new Freddy.
Lee Russell: And uh it just wasn't happening.
Gary Hill: I don't know if brave people are liking it, but it's like y you know, it it does it doesn't really work as a film, but he the bad guy works great in it. Um Yeah.
Cameron: Oh the trickster one.
Gary Hill: Wasn't it?
Lee Russell: Yeah, the trickster.
Gary Hill: He's fine.
Lee Russell: He's fine. He's fine. It's Edward Furlong that sings that fucking movie.
Gary Hill: I just watched Tabir Two again and still he still sucks at that movie. I I Yeah.
Cameron: Like Eddie furlong and all, but like man, he is just Just a horrible fucking actor.
Lee Russell: He has he has literally no reason to be as
Lee Russell: As shitty as he is in that movie. He's got everything. Oh sure your mom died, boo hoo, but you've got
Lee Russell: Everything handed to you. That I would kill for that kid's fucking b bedroom and his computer set up and shit back in the mid nineties.
Cameron: I would kill for it now.
Cameron: Yeah.
Lee Russell: And he's got a board's Karloff Butler, a AI Butler, basically.
Lee Russell: Yes, Master.
Gary Hill: Yeah, that tech boom of the early nineties is where where stuff is supposed to work the way it does, but it doesn't like uh
Gary Hill: Like I love the film hackers, but I know this shit's not plausible all the way. It's like perfect block.
Lee Russell: Yeah, no. Movie computers.
Lee Russell: They never get it right.
Cameron: No, never.
Cameron: It's kinda like the net with Sandra Bullock then we
Lee Russell: Yeah. The internet's so scary, guys.
Gary Hill: So scary.
Gary Hill: This little scary.
Gary Hill: Uh Mulkey's not his first spore in the in the Walter Hills films. He was in the Long Riders as as Vernon Biggs.
Gary Hill: He showed up as second cop in forty eight hours.
Gary Hill: But uh Rose you may know more, uh he was uh in Time Writer, uh Mr. Lyle Swan with the great Fred Ward and Other great character action of a film.
Gary Hill: Uh first blood.
Gary Hill: Dreamscape.
Gary Hill: Uh runaway.
Gary Hill: I mean he he has quite the career, quite cool.
Gary Hill: I mean early early on. He's still still working today. But yeah, he he she shows up and things, but he shows up as as What they call big ears in this film'cause apparently you he you hear horses
Lee Russell: Yeah.
Gary Hill: this and yada yada yada. But he's like your main
Gary Hill: I guess Bill and guy that's chasing them throughout the you know, towards through throughout the second half of the film. You know,'cause what's he's done Drinking a horn he can finally, you know go get down to business of our next character, which is Rus Rusty Schwimmer who
Gary Hill: There's been many things over the years too, but Most most notably the horror fans.
Gary Hill: as um oh what was her name?
Gary Hill: The way that on the Diner and and and Jason goes to hell.
Cameron: I love that lady, man. She's so good.
Gary Hill: What should we know about the film?
Gary Hill: Oh sorry.
Lee Russell: It's great.
Lee Russell: That whole scene is great. That that the like that's like one of the standout scenes that makes that film worth watching.
Gary Hill: 'cause her and Leslie Jordan I guess they
Gary Hill: Switch the roles at the last minute, I guess. Like Like he was supposed to be like the the the the butch, yeah, you know.
Gary Hill: you know, diner owner and she was supposed to be the the exact opposite, so That's interesting.
Gary Hill: I I I I'm an happen to watch her will and grace. I love Lizzie Jordan a lot actually. It's it's uh
Cameron: Joey B. I love that up.
Lee Russell: เจ้าเจ้าเจ้าเจ้าเจ้า
Gary Hill: Making the J.
Lee Russell: The two the two for one.
Gary Hill: The two for one deal. Come on now.
Lee Russell: It's a two for one thing.
Cameron: Like an idiot, they're supposed to look like hockey masks.
Lee Russell: Yeah.
Gary Hill: Ha ha ha.
Gary Hill: Maybe it says they don't like that film. It's like the w the I I I I I should do the folks who don't like Jason X. I was like y you just can't have fun, can you? Come on now. It just
Gary Hill: Is it against the law?No
Cameron: Okay. Yeah, I mean it's not high brow entertainment, but it's fucking good times, man.
Lee Russell: I mean if if you're some weirdo who's been taking that series serious after like part Honestly, even like
Lee Russell: After part three, you probably got something wrong with you. Cause like, come on.
Lee Russell: It it got goofy really quick.
Cameron: Yeah, by the time I got to you know, Corey Feldman in part four, it would already jump the shark.
Gary Hill: Shark.
Lee Russell: Yeah.
Gary Hill: Next up Scott Cooper plays Gilpin, w one one of their uh That's the the the guy that the w with the fiddle, the g the running buddy, right?
Lee Russell: Yeah. Yeah.
Gary Hill: Yeah.
Lee Russell: Yeah. The guy the the guy they can loop they can uh you know lose.
Gary Hill: Oh, yeah.
Cameron: She's the red.
Lee Russell: She's the red shirt.
Gary Hill: Teşekkürler.
Gary Hill: Um, most known for his his directing credits. Um Yeah, that's...
Gary Hill: I don't want to imagine our last uh conversation. Again, this this this is this is his take two. Uh he directed
Gary Hill: Crazy player with Jeff Bridges. Uh Hostels, which is a pretty decent little Yeah, w war film.
Gary Hill: out of the furnace, um
Gary Hill: Christian Bill, right? Isn't that movie right? Oh yeah.
Lee Russell: Oh yeah, yeah, no, I like that film.
Gary Hill: Black Mass Johnny Depp. Um Spring the Springsteen film they made with um with the bear in it, which is It's it's okay for
Gary Hill: what it is, but it's probably about the most boring part of his his entire career. You know, that that that Nebra between Nebraska and Borne in the USA phase of his career.
Gary Hill: It's just uh
Lee Russell: I'm I'm over these fucking music biopics of I wish they'd just stop.
Cameron: It seems weird to me to make a biopic about somebody who's still with us.
Lee Russell: Yeah, I I hate these things. Um like that Michael Jackson one, like just totally uh let's let's not uh
Lee Russell: Let's not dwell on the realities of this guy. Let's just dwell on the on the bullshit.
Lee Russell: I'm not into that.
Lee Russell: No, no.
Gary Hill: It's like uh the original plans for uh Bohemian Rhapsody was Sasha Baron Cohen, who who, by the way, is making made a secret allergy movie right underneath our noses, and I can't wait to see it.
Gary Hill: Was gonna play um Freddy Mercury and Do the singing and everything, but I guess
Gary Hill: Something happened in the developer with it. They didn't like the w with the way it was turning out. But uh
Gary Hill: He's probably being too truthful about Freddy and he probably didn't like that very much. Who who knows? Probably.
Lee Russell: Probably.
Cameron: Yeah.
Gary Hill: Oh sorry, go ahead.
Lee Russell: I'll just say, you know, Sasha Baron Code's not a guy to
Lee Russell: you know, cater to bullshit all that much. He's he's pretty honest with his stuff. So I I I c I could see that I could see him Buttonheads.
Lee Russell: With his characterization.
Lee Russell: With the with the producers, probably.
Gary Hill: secret LG film. I I'm I'm I'm I'm jazzed about that. People listen to You listen goes far back as the very first episode That's how the show started with a with a Him and Martin Freeman do with a drive by FM uh thing.
Lee Russell: Yeah.
Gary Hill: Mm.
Gary Hill: Pretty hilarious that that's how the show started, but I it is what it is. You know.
Gary Hill: Yeah.
Gary Hill: Yeah, um what we got? What we got we got James Russo, I got a name I know.
Gary Hill: Been lots of things. Captain Billy Fender.
Gary Hill: Um Um Todd Todd Allen, Marshall Marshall Bill Miller.
Gary Hill: I mean five uh Concubine.
Gary Hill: And if you will, the the the the the girls that are with them the whole time.
Gary Hill: Gwendol Gwendolyn Yao Yo as as Sunpoy Valerie Tian as Qingwa, Jaden Wong as Gi Moon.
Gary Hill: Carolyn Chan is my ling.
Gary Hill: Uh Libya Cheng as Yi Fren To interpret all These lovely girls.
Gary Hill: Uh he comes along for the ride later on. Donald Kong is Lung Hei.
Gary Hill: Yeah, your Q lost synopsis this movie is.
Gary Hill: It is real cheap too. Uh a veteran cowboy and his nephew who nephew Saved five Chinese girls from prostitution while trekking from Oregon to Wyoming.
Gary Hill: This is for Did by by Walter and um
Gary Hill: Why did you do this, I am B B? You're so lame.
Gary Hill: We'll talk about the right later on because it's They're being lame right now, but whatever.
Lee Russell: Yeah, it's it's al it's Alan Jeffrian. Jeffrian, I guess. His hi it's based on his book.
Lee Russell: Oh, is that what it is? Yeah. So like this this was uh this was, you know, an adapted uh property and it originally was going to be a feature film, but they decided to make it a two parter for AMC because I guess they felt like it would cut down on the c production costs and
Lee Russell: probably make it more of a success, you know, A uh AMC I should say, uh I think this was their first Uh miniseries.
Lee Russell: If if I'm not mistaken. So like this this was
Gary Hill: Which is which is surprising, you know.
Gary Hill: 2006, I think it was.
Gary Hill: All this time they only made one miniseries and that's that's weird. But uh
Gary Hill: the the the king of the Western miniseries with the lo the lonesome dove stuff. So, you know, we just uh
Gary Hill: Got the right man for the job, I guess. Yeah.
Lee Russell: Yeah. You look at who who's in the landscape to do that kind of thing.
Lee Russell: Robert Duval, Lonesome Dove is pretty much a shoe in, I think. Like it's like, Yeah, get him Get some other really good actors around this time.
Lee Russell: And uh and they ran with it. So
Gary Hill: Yep. Uh Cam, um First time watch for you, I think.
Gary Hill: Initial thoughts, my friend.
Cameron: Uh initial thoughts, uh way too long.
Cameron: You know, it's it's well acted, it's well shot, uh except for some Some cinematography around the fight scenes where they do a little shaky camp.
Lee Russell: Oh thank you.
Cameron: That that Liam Neeson sh took in shake shaky cam bullshit that I just can't stand.
Cameron: But otherwise I mean it's got the nice big sweeping shots of the countryside and makes America look beautiful.
Cameron: Uh I mean Robert Deval's a master class and given a monologue and he gives several of them here.
Cameron: Maybe one or two too many, but I know that might be sacrilege to say, but I'm
Cameron: Just being honest. Uh
Lee Russell: Press them all.
Cameron: Chris Mulkey is one of the reasons to show up in this. Rusty Schwimmer is one of the reasons to show up for this. I mean, they're both just.
Cameron: C D Cheesy, great.
Lee Russell: Right.
Cameron: people. I mean I I love'em both. Uh
Cameron: Yeah, this was the first time watched for me. I didn't even really know it existed until now. Uh I gotta be honest.
Cameron: Uh so I'm kind of ashamed that I hadn't watched it. It It's a decent western, but it's not a great western.
Cameron: It's just it's it's got moments. I think it was Too many fingers in the pie, too many hands in the pot, so to speak, too many writers, too many rewrites.
Cameron: Too many things going on, but You know, we'll get into it a little bit more, but you know, I love this as anything, just for Robert Duvall.
Cameron: Not a liter literally a one last time in the saddle, but like one of the last times in the saddle for him.
Gary Hill: Battle for him.
Lee Russell: Yeah.
Cameron: And uh yeah.
Cameron: I mean, I you know, I might I might have some problems with it, but I dug it a little bit.
[Silence]
Lee Russell: Yeah, this is first time watch for me. Um I think I think the thing is like I always kind of mistook this one for uh open range.
Lee Russell: Like I I'd always like see the
Lee Russell: th see the t title and see Rob Duvall's in it and it's like, oh yeah, no, that's that movie. I've already seen it. And then it was like, oh no, no, no, wait, open range, broken tra what, what, huh?
Lee Russell: This is Fine. Um, I think it's probably one of uh Walter Hill's better uh westerns, honestly.
Lee Russell: Um But I think I would have liked this better if it actually was a theatrical release.
Lee Russell: And I think Walter Hill I read something where he agrees here where it's like, yeah, I kinda wish we just put this in theaters and cut like fifteen to twenty minutes out of the fucking thing.
Lee Russell: And I'm like, yes, that probably would have been good.
Lee Russell: probably wouldn't have made any money because it's a western in the two thousands.
Lee Russell: And your track record at this point in the theaters has not been all that great.
Lee Russell: Bye. It probably would have been a That or film overall.
Lee Russell: Um That being said, uh you can't beat the acting in this, like
Lee Russell: Robert Duval is so naturalistic and just amazing. He's so believable.
Lee Russell: Uh Thomas Hayden Church is no fucking slouch either. He's again like we were saying, he's a great second man.
Lee Russell: He is the great like He he's kind of a straight man, kind of a no nonsense kind of dude, kinda like.
Gary Hill: Yeah.
Lee Russell: He he wants his twenty five percent of this uh
Lee Russell: This thing that's owed to him. Like his basically the story is his his mother uh has been estranged from him.
Lee Russell: She owned the ranch that he left to go uh Buckaroin.
Lee Russell: uh in his in his younger days And um And uh it's basically, you know, Robert Duvall is his uncle.
Lee Russell: He comes to him and says, Uh, hey, your mum's dead.
Lee Russell: Uh she left uh some stuff for you in the will, basically, you know, like uh She cut you out of running the ranch.
Lee Russell: Bye. I'm gonna cut you in.
Lee Russell: If we can take these horses and sell them and I'll give you twenty five percent of their value or whatever. Like what what he doesn't tell him, of course, is that he's actually sold the ranch.
Lee Russell: To buy these horses.
Lee Russell: to then go and sell and make move.
Lee Russell: Yeah. Well uh not really a dick move though because um Robert Duvall doesn't want to run the ranch.
Lee Russell: And he knows Thomas Hayden Church doesn't want to run the ranch.
Lee Russell: So he's looking to get even more money out of this purchase because it just so happens around this time uh the British are fighting the boar war.
Gary Hill: War war.
Lee Russell: And the Americans are fighting the Spanish American war.
Lee Russell: Um... And horses are in need.
Lee Russell: And so uh the they make a comment later on in the film, uh uh, you know Uh
Lee Russell: Has it you know, I I I are you telling me I'm a war profiteer basically? Uh when he sells the horses finally? And it's like it's like you kinda are. You got a problem with that? Ah, not really.
[Silence]
Lee Russell: But yeah, no, uh Robert Duval's kind of this salty, you know Uh but like good humoured guy who's you know uh I I think I think the big thing my big takeaway from this is that This film is really
Lee Russell: a a v a very like humanist Western. It's very much more interested in characters getting along and finding their family as they travel through the country kind of thing.
Lee Russell: Uh it sort of makes a point that your family is kind of the people that you meet along
Gary Hill: Bye.
Lee Russell: in in your life, it's not necessarily always blood.
Lee Russell: um So this little family sort of gets created when they They free uh these Chinese girls who are gonna be sold to, you know, as sex slaves.
Lee Russell: And uh They decide, you know against her best interest basically,'cause, you know, they could have jettisoned these girls and just gotten our horses there way quicker and gotten our money and got out of dodge.
Lee Russell: But uh all these guys in the in the group who are uh taking these horses are actually decent human beings, which is kind of a rarity you see in these sort of things.
Lee Russell: And uh you know they they can't They have the they have that mor innate morality in them.
Lee Russell: that they you know, they care about people and they they care about doing the right thing, even if it's like Their all their instincts are saying, No, we should just like leave them in a town somewhere and just keep going kind of thing.
Cameron: Which they do try to do at one point.
Lee Russell: They do, but they...
Lee Russell: soon realize the error of their ways. It's like, no, this isn't good. They're gonna get killed. They're gonna get raped. They're gonna get murdered. You know, like it it's it's not a good
Lee Russell: place to to put these girls. Of course they end up taking them to the town where they were supposed to be delivered in the first place. So that kind of
Lee Russell: It kinda uh jump starts the whole thing. What uh
Cameron: What that was.
Gary Hill: Yeah.
Lee Russell: Yeah.
Cameron: Yeah.
Lee Russell: Pero, you know...
Lee Russell: Yeah, it's it's it's a little too long. Uh Cameron mentioned I think my biggest beef with this film though, it's the action scenes. This is where it really suffers.
Lee Russell: um Walter Hill known for his great action scenes, known for his great depictions of violence.
Lee Russell: uh you know like just a a a maestro of doing that sort of thing.
Lee Russell: And something about this production neuters that and the way he shoots it and the way it's edited.
Lee Russell: The action scenes and especially the scenes of violence and gunplay are are so herky jerky and like Beyond nauseating handheldness.
Lee Russell: That It kinda takes me out of the movie whenever that stuff's happening.
Lee Russell: Like I I I really hated it.
Lee Russell: Um but everything else I kind of really loved in this film. I love the characters, I love the conversations, I love that it's this kind of a big hangout film where this they're going across this beautiful countryside.
Lee Russell: Uh so it's like all Canadian countryside, I believe.
Lee Russell: There might be some US uh locations too, but I think they shot it cheap up here in Canada, so
Lee Russell: Uh but uh yeah, no. Um I liked it. I th I think this is for me um Kind of middle of the pack.
Lee Russell: Walter Hill. I I think it's it's got a lot of great stuff going for it.
Lee Russell: Um it it uh it Ultimately I think it suffers from being on TV.
Lee Russell: and being you know um whatever gut up his ass to shoot the action scenes and the violence and the way he did for this.
Lee Russell: Uh whatever whatever that whoever made that decision.
Lee Russell: made the wrong decision.
Lee Russell: And but I'll leave it at that for now.
Gary Hill: Um, like Lisa, she's shot in the wilds of uh Calgary, Alberta, Canada and Yeah.
Gary Hill: But it th those scenes are you like you mentioned are are shot very, very well to all all the stuff with the horses and You know,'cause
Gary Hill: They they may make make mention that, you know, the the horses are wild as part, but they can train'em along the way. I I I like
Gary Hill: I I like uh that they seem like they're all over the place. It it's it's shot incredibly that way and Right down to the the the stampedes for you know, our our poor are poor Chinese girls who, you know, there's a lot there's a lot of history behind this movie and
Gary Hill: Again, just like when I was at your show, Lee, and we did um
Gary Hill: What was the movie? Again, Lee, we did.
Lee Russell: We did.
Lee Russell: Uh farewell my concubine.
Gary Hill: Yeah. I'm all I'm a little ignorant to uh nineteenth century.
Gary Hill: uh post gold rush um Chinese politics in in in the US, but F from what you can just you can tell the wherever they were I imagine their families came to to Come look for gold in in California maybe and you know, or
Lee Russell: Well, yeah.
Gary Hill: Down.
Lee Russell: The the the interpreter guy he says, you know, uh He's been there for like decades.
Lee Russell: He came because he heard California was the mountain of gold. Yeah.
Cameron: Yeah. The mountain of gold.
Lee Russell: And it turns out no, he's just now he's just stuck like working.
Lee Russell: at a brothel or whatever.
Lee Russell: The fuck he's doing in that town when they when they get there.
Gary Hill: Yeah, but I've always heard like, you know, s small bits about Yeah, the binding of Chinese women's feet, you know, to to to make them more profitable, to make their feet smaller and Yeah, the whole thing was
Gary Hill: them selling these girls into into slavery, you you hope good things for them'cause you can tell they're terrified the whole time and
Cameron: Yeah, you hop you can hope for good things, but good things are not gonna come to these ladies.
Gary Hill: Yeah, for for three of them it's okay, but the rest of'em not so much. But Oh, yeah.
Lee Russell: And even even then, like when we get to the end there where they do those sort of like, here's what happened to this person and here's what happened to that person, like two of the girls Go back to China and open a hospital, but then it says in the sort of Maoist revolution.
Lee Russell: Uh they disappeared.
Lee Russell: Yeah. So, yeah. So there's...
Lee Russell: The the the the film is definitely not it doesn't it doesn't hold back on
Lee Russell: bad ends for the characters you love sometimes in this. Like it it's a very it's a very earnest, very like
Lee Russell: Yeah, this this rife was this life was rough. Like the bad things happen to good people.
Lee Russell: All the time. And uh
Lee Russell: It it doesn't shy away from that, which I did appreciate. It it doesn't doesn't wrap everything up in a very hell uh you know happy
Lee Russell: package. It's it's very uh melancholy in a lot of respects.
Gary Hill: I mean if if that was the case, yeah, all five girls would survive but one What to die in a stampede'cause she's inexperienced and you know Transporting you know, lar large mantles across the open open plains and Mm-hmm.
Gary Hill: Tick fever as they call, which w would that be Lyme disease in this movie?
Lee Russell: movie it'd probably be Lyme D um it might be Lyme disease it might be something else
Cameron: Yeah, variation of sorts.
Lee Russell: Swords. Yeah. What a what it'd be you know Whatever it is, it kills them pretty quick and uh
Cameron: Isn't that also like malaria or is that mosquitoes?
Lee Russell: That's mosquitoes, I think only.
Cameron: Right, right, right.
Gary Hill: Right, right.
Lee Russell: But i I mean, at the same time they might have diagnosed that as tick fever. You never know. It's not like these people necessarily knew, you know, medicine was Not that not so advanced back then.
Cameron: Yeah yeah, them it was back then it was give'em a shot of whiskey and put a cold rag on their forehead.
Gary Hill: Yeah.
Lee Russell: Like like we were talking about, you know, I I think during the Wild Bill episode, like how Wild Bill is like taking injections of mercury or mercury or whatever for his like fucking syphilis and shit, like Not good.
Gary Hill: Thank you.
Cameron: Yeah, not good.
Cameron: But then back then cocaine was a regular ingredient cough serve. So there you go. Yeah.
Gary Hill: Uh once I give I'll give you guys don't don't do what I did and watch open range right after because You know, certain plot points will cross over.
Gary Hill: Because it it's mentioned in an open range that Robert Duvall's character, um had a family and he lost his family to disease I believe it was and
Lee Russell: Yeah.
Gary Hill: Yeah. I I got mixed up if it was this movie too, he had a family, that's why he was so close to the Chin Chinese girls in a way and
Lee Russell: Yes. Yeah,'cause yeah,'cause it you know,'cause he he tells um Uh Uh Nola, uh Greta uh Satchy in this uh later on he finally sort of opens up to her like, Yeah, I had a wife and kid and that didn't work out so well that so that's why I'm reluctant to like
Lee Russell: have like that kind of a strong commitment with you, even though I
Lee Russell: do really like you and and shit. It's just like It's one of those unspoken things.
Lee Russell: That uh gets spoken.
Cameron: Yeah.
Gary Hill: But the building of trust, you know, m amongst girls who, you know, did not speak the language, but You know.
Gary Hill: I and I love the ending of this thing that the our our girl that that that stays behind.
Gary Hill: Yeah. To stay with our man Tom here.
Gary Hill: They they don't know the language, but you know, there there's that sense of trust that's that's built and They realize that, you know
Gary Hill: This is this is their protector. The only the only shot they have to be protected for in this this wild and woolly country that were they're gonna be sold into sex slavery and Possibly You know
Gary Hill: actual slavery, who who knows? They're gonna work a factory job for a bowl of rice and in the US probably, you know.
Lee Russell: It's just yeah. I mean there's th there there's a we there there's a I don't know if like it was intentional, but it it's kinda weird how like they start off they sort of make the point of oh yes we have these Chinese sex slaves or whatever And then smash boom into Uh
Lee Russell: These guys who are, you know, moving cattle.
Lee Russell: And like they're Yeah, it I think it's maybe trying to make the point that you know at this point these these poor Chinese girls were being treated as basically cattle.
Lee Russell: They they weren't you know, they weren't being treated any different and it's kind of uh a weird irony that these uh These sort of these horse uh runners who are taking'em to be sold are you know, the saviors of these Chinese girls who were otherwise just gonna be
Lee Russell: sold as fancy horses to get fucked by scumbags.
Cameron: Yeah. I think that's also why they don't trust uh Thomas Aiden Church right off the bat.
Cameron: 'Cause he shoots that one horse that broke his leg and right in the head. I mean like they always
Lee Russell: He was scared shit.
Cameron: Shitless about that.
Lee Russell: Yeah. Yeah,'cause they had no like they they they they're ripped right out of their country and they have no understanding of like what the life is like at this time in America and you know, they they learn slowly as they go along in the track with with the uh her protagonists or whatever, but
Lee Russell: Um yeah, yeah, it's a good point.
Gary Hill: It's the it's it's the life you don't know though. I mean in reality, you know, a horse can
Gary Hill: If it breaks its leg, it can't support its own weight. So back in the day, yeah, they wouldn't shoot a short they'd shoot a horse in the head because It it's be cruel to let'em live'cause you can't literally can't You know?
Gary Hill: And he literally is is slowing down the rest of the herd by them, you know, if if they happen to leave him alive or something, you know.
Lee Russell: Yeah.
Cameron: Yeah, the first time they showed that first shot of that horse just sitting down and taking a break, and I'm like, Well, I know where this is going.
Lee Russell: Yeah.
Cameron: Yeah.
Gary Hill: He's going to the the Wild West dog food factory for for for processing.
Cameron: All horses go to heaven.
Cameron: I'm horrible. I'm sorry.
Gary Hill: Yeah.
Gary Hill: Oh my gosh. Yeah, but I like that line with the relationships, you know.
Gary Hill: And them and the girls. It works really well in this film.
Gary Hill: One of the high points really cause There is that that that culture It's sound like a culture clash'cause, you know
Gary Hill: Uh our our boss, uh um I'm I'm gonna c on going back to the other movie, is it was Boss Spearman in the other film. Yeah.
Lee Russell: Yeah.
Gary Hill: Yeah, print by Prentice who w what do they call him?
Lee Russell: Uh Honka Hunker Prince?
Gary Hill: Yeah, they couldn't pronounce uncle, but you actually called him uncle, uncle. You know, yeah.
Gary Hill: Honkle.
Gary Hill: Call me your Honkle Gary, okay. Come on now. You know.
Gary Hill: But yeah, they called him that and it was it's kind of adorable'cause they can't speak English English obviously, but The the the truss is built and They could tell that he's all right.
Gary Hill: But it takes a minute for it takes a minute for them to get there and I like that.
Gary Hill: I liked it a little.
Cameron: I like the little the little things like uh him d giving the meats a piece of candy but like before.
Gary Hill: Yeah.
Lee Russell: And stuff, yeah.
Gary Hill: Yeah, even the whole time is there being s you know subservient women, which is is wild.
Gary Hill: It that's that's the way they're treated and that's the way a lot of women are treated too, you know, back in these days is They're they they're pr you know, programmed To to fix the man a a cup of coffee at the campfire and I I I gotta say
Gary Hill: Duval's ability to to make biscuits uh uh on a campsite fire is uh on point, you know, so there's uh
Lee Russell: Yeah.
Cameron: Biscuits and jam.
Lee Russell: Yeah. They they they they weren't too keen on how much how uh how much they cooked the lamb.
Lee Russell: But uh they were like, Oh, the biscuits are good though.
Cameron: Yeah, they kept making fun of them like this smells awful.
Gary Hill: That's awful.
Gary Hill: Well that's lamb, man. Come on now, you know. Yeah.
Lee Russell: Yeah. But you know, it's a cultural difference. Not not not necessarily bigger bigger you know, Jap a lot of East Asian uh culture's not so big on eating as meat and and at least not preparing meat
Lee Russell: in the same fashion as uh they were doing there on the range. So
Cameron: Yeah, I mean,
Gary Hill: I mean...
Cameron: Like and speaking to cultural differences when uh apprentice uh Robert Wall's character is naming them.
Cameron: And he names one number four and she is just like
Cameron: Just like, oh no, absolutely not. That means death. I don't want that. I don't want anything to do with that. He's like, okay, well, the one that ran off will call her number four. You'll be number five.
Gary Hill: Спасибо.
Lee Russell: Ha ha ha.
Cameron: Yeah.
Cameron: He never feels like he's acting. He just feels like he's
Lee Russell: There.
Lee Russell: Not just him.
Lee Russell: It's just him on screen.
Cameron: I don't mean that in a bad way. I meant that in the most possible way.
Lee Russell: Yeah no no no But but I mean it his character, like he's such an an actually just like really decent human being without like any
Cameron: Any
Lee Russell: Any like sense of bigotry or racism or malice in his heart for anybody.
Lee Russell: Uh He he merely does the one, two, three, four, five thing'cause
Lee Russell: That will help him remember because he knows his limitations. He's not necessarily a highly educated man or anything. He doesn't know fucking Mandarin Chinese.
Lee Russell: So that's he knows that's gonna go nowhere. And he knows he's not gonna learn it. So that's gonna go nowhere. So he's gonna do this.
Lee Russell: 'Cause he he he'd rather do that than like mispronounce their names every fucking time he tries to say it.
Cameron: Yeah, it's almost uh more respectful that way.
Lee Russell: Yeah, he feels it'd be more insulting to do that.
Lee Russell: So like it's it's a great performance.
Gary Hill: But but but even in the end, you know, once once we're joined by by uh our our Chinese uh interpreter Alright, gentlemen.
Gary Hill: Yeah, y you gotta love you know, he gets right in the mix with him when he he he literally gets his head busted open.
Gary Hill: Robert Duvall, he uh r m p uh uh uncle Pryn inform him how to how to do a stitch properly because he he likes his it's like he likes his clothes.
Gary Hill: Yeah, being being properly dressed.
Gary Hill: That's all right there.
Cameron: You fucking can't you can't get him to drink the whiskey, so he just pours it on his head.
Cameron: Yeah.
Gary Hill: Yeah.
Gary Hill: Which is the way to go. You're sterilizing the wound. Come on now.
Lee Russell: Yeah, because he had a pretty deep gash in that head there. It was
Gary Hill: Yes I did.
Gary Hill: Um I love the I love the scene, the small scene you get with with uh when they invade the Crow's territory.
Gary Hill: They want two horses but like the whole time Uh Hunkle Pren there is like whittling wood.
Gary Hill: he offers an offering t to the to them which is this little horse that he whittled. See, now you have two horses and Yeah.
Gary Hill: 'Cause like I I kinda dig what you're laying down and they just take the one horse and you know It's it's a it works.
Cameron: Even the best source.
Cameron: You know, he offers him the best horse and he even says to him when he's like, You know, tell him I'm too old and too tired and I ain't afraid of dying and he's like, So we're we're just gonna give you one fucking horse.
Gary Hill: Yeah, I like that whole bit there. W I wish there was it it's kinda like in in centers where you get like the uh Was it the the the na the was it Navajo, um Vampire hunters.
Lee Russell: Yeah.
Gary Hill: I I need that movie, that movie. I I'm I'm I'm still I'm still torn on that movie for that reason, you know.
Lee Russell: Yeah, it's it's it's almost like we walked into like, you know, the first movie just ended or whatever and now we're into the second one. It's like, Wait, where's the first one? Where's the Navajo Vampire hunters? Please.
Cameron: Please.
Gary Hill: Oh my gosh. So you get you get weird, modern dancing.
Lee Russell: Yeah, like Yeah, it
Lee Russell: Kind he kinda crosses the spiritual barrier and like sees the future. And uh I I I like that. I like how that how that whole like You know, the the the the future of black music.
Lee Russell: progresses throughout uh America's history.
Lee Russell: Kinda like uh just like uh what what that um
Lee Russell: Uh American American Pop, was it the the one we did on my podcast? Yeah.
Lee Russell: Yeah, kinda kinda the same vi vibe almost in in in the way that scene plays out.
Gary Hill: That guy wrote night moves, but not really, is all I'll say about that. But that's fine.
Lee Russell: Yeah.
Gary Hill: It's my favorite bagshead, so I'll I'll I'll I'll I'll I'll let it slide. Yeah.
Lee Russell: Yeah.
Gary Hill: But yeah, I like most things about this one, but like you said, the action sequences are are And I didn't think about until you guys mentioned, you know, the the shakiness of them'cause I'm just thinking about How charismatic, um
Gary Hill: Robert Duvallas when the when shit starts to go down, you know where they So some bad guys along the road which is A guy who literally is His his mission in life is to kill a bunch of people with with, you know smallpox waving blankets and Yeah.
Cameron: That called that motherfucker.
Gary Hill: See he was.
Gary Hill: He wants to make sure this guy is dead dead for sure and all those comp company are dead, so I'm just so distracted by the the the caris caris the charisma of Robert Duvall in that scene.
Gary Hill: The the the shaky scamness of you know what would happen later on, you know?
Lee Russell: Yeah. Well that one wasn't so bad. It's it's it's really more the like the the close up stuff, like the uh
Lee Russell: the the the final sort of gunfight and conflict and stuff that's shaking all over the place. When they're It's it's even worse when they're uh saving the girls from the rapists in town.
Gary Hill: Yeah.
Cameron: They start shooting up the places like
Lee Russell: Yeah.
Cameron: You couldn't like focus on what was going on. It didn't make it it logistically didn't make any sense.
Lee Russell: Yeah, the camera only stops for when he shoots that dude's thumbs off.
Lee Russell: Mm-hmm. Yeah.
Cameron: Which I enjoyed immensely.
Lee Russell: Yeah, that was great. Like that was a good little that was a good little Walter Hill esque touch there. But I I just wish the rest of the fucking scene had been As good as that.
Lee Russell: But uh it's just like, yeah, no, and he and he and I think one of the conflicts too was that uh like Duvall had a had a say in the writing of this, apparently.
Lee Russell: 'Cause he's one of the producers, so Apparently when they were doing rewrites to make this
Lee Russell: work on television. Apparently there was a lot more action and stuff in it and Duvall kind of like told Hill.
Lee Russell: You gotta kinda act some of this shit.
Lee Russell: Uh because it's it's killing the flow of the film and You know, maybe there's some artifacts of that kinda left in the way it the the final product came out where it's Sometimes it does feel a little disjointed in parts.
Lee Russell: You know.
[Silence]
Gary Hill: Yeah, for sure But yeah, the way this all came together, I I I enjoy my time with it.
Gary Hill: Like I said, this is Yeah. It's probably the most highly decorated film as far as awards go.
Gary Hill: It won some Emmys for sure, I know that. Yeah.
Gary Hill: I am...
Gary Hill: I enjoy my time with them mo mostly. I mean, I'm not gonna lie to you.
Gary Hill: That will take you out of it. You know, you can suck your back in with the other stuff.
Gary Hill: Just the characters you can relate to and You know, the very uh again you're not used to this, uh b badass Chris Mulkey in this film because he's
Gary Hill: Can we talk much about him? He plays like this Score on dude just.
Gary Hill: got a prison and you know he finds out who put'em there because of course, you know Go Rusty Schw Rusty Schwimmer needs uh some motivation for him to go Go get her Chinese girls, you know, from her her her property from from those people.
Cameron: Right, right. Now a question for you guys.
Cameron: You think she was telling the truth or just telling him that to get him to go?
Gary Hill: Well, that's that's a real hard question'cause, you know, the the way she acts around them
Gary Hill: She's really a squirrely. Like either she's afraid of him or she she knows something He doesn't know.
Gary Hill: So
Lee Russell: I mean Gratis Satchy, she's rightly afraid of of him anyway,'cause the last time they they got together he split her head open and left her to fr her hair to freeze on the cold ground outside.
Gary Hill: Right, right. Yeah.
Lee Russell: Yeah.
Cameron: Yeah, I I kinda wondered that about that, whether or not Rusty was telling the truth. But you know, she might have been with the way Greta was reacting to him.
Lee Russell: Yeah, it could have been. I mean e I mean either way.
Cameron: Oh, Big Ears was a bastard.
Lee Russell: Figures is a just uh s piece of shit and he he's he's a good villain to to put in contrast with our heroes here who are just like Deeply caring.
Lee Russell: uh moral people and uh big ears is definitely not big ears is just a fucking psychopath Obrigado.
Lee Russell: He's a monster.
Gary Hill: Monster rapist, arsonist, he's these all the all the bad things. It's like
Gary Hill: I just did my time. Well, let's go do let's go things do things that are more that are slightly worse than what I was doing right now, which is, you know
Cameron: Yeah.
Gary Hill: I'm sorry.
Cameron: No, I was gonna say this uh the way the sheriff was going on about him, he's like, Oh, he's a well known horse he but like Horse thief, but he was a murderer or a rapist and a
Lee Russell: Yeah.
Cameron: Other things in arson was much worse than stealing horses.
Lee Russell: It just goes to tell you the priorities.
Lee Russell: Cover boy.
Cameron: Right.
Lee Russell: Yeah. horses are worth a lot of money, you can get you can get another another woman for a lot less money, apparently.
Gary Hill: Right.
Cameron: Uh the the eighteen hundreds, uh
Gary Hill: Whereas, you know, the value of a of a Chinese woman with with girl with bound feet is uh
Gary Hill: exponentially more money, you know, than anything else. Come on now. You know.
Lee Russell: Yeah.
Gary Hill: I I said, Chinese woman with no bound feet? Well shit, what else you got? You know. Yeah.
Lee Russell: Yeah. You mean I gotta look I gotta look at her natural feet?
Cameron: I gotta look at all her toes? What the fuck? Yeah. What
Gary Hill: What I really think they girl with broken toes James Alves after that.
Cameron: For everybody that uh
Cameron: Chris Mulke is a bastard. James Russo is ten times worse.
Lee Russell: Oh, this the scene at the campfire where he's like trying to joke and stuff with them and he's saying all this disgusting stuff and they're just keeping quiet and looking at him.
Lee Russell: scene to just show how like decent and and moral our heroes actually are.
Lee Russell: They're not, you know Just out of... innate morality, they're not murdering this guy straight up, but they all want to.
Lee Russell: Because they're just looking at this piece of shit and they're like, Fuck.
[Silence]
Lee Russell: Yeah. Yeah, they're they're just like they're both they're staring daggers to this motherfucker and
Lee Russell: And rightly so,'cause he's a m he's also just uh like a monstrous piece of shit. He's just a big scumbag.
Gary Hill: Well, it's more like a det task of the hand when when that's sullied because he he drugs their whiskey.
Gary Hill: And then all you know fall asleep and then take their horses and yada yada yada.
Gary Hill: Doesn't get too far by the way'cause he's scumbag and he's drunk too, but you know. Yeah.
Lee Russell: Yeah.
Gary Hill: Mm-hmm.
Gary Hill: They had a reason to go after him then, see yeah.
Gary Hill: Well yeah.
Gary Hill: Which is you know, our our our our Tom's uh big biggest loss is that is a is a rope because he had to hang his ass. Yeah.
Lee Russell: He he complains that he's lost two ropes so far, you know.
Lee Russell: Uh
Cameron: I love the term uh what Thomas Edenshire says. I had to stretch him.
Cameron: Yeah.
[Silence]
Lee Russell: I think...
Lee Russell: I think my favorite bit that made me do a little research here was uh he goes into town at one point and he buys therapeutic paper. I was like, what the fuck is that?
Lee Russell: Yeah. And and I was like, Oh, that's that's actually that's actually the first commercially packaged bathroom tissue in the United States was called therapeutic paper.
Gary Hill: Well well they kinda really really hit it home, you know, when Uh uh you know, p he had to go take a shit and he just said watch out the paper map splinters in it'cause you know he Exactly.
Lee Russell: Yeah,'cause like the it was a luxury item back then. Like it it had aloe and hemp in it.
Lee Russell: Um
Lee Russell: And it was d designed as a preventative treatment for hemorrhoids as well at that at that point. So like un unless you were gonna use like uh Leaves and like I I think Th there was like usually people would use like dry corn cobs back then or mullen leaves.
Lee Russell: And mullen leaves have like little microbarbs on them. And if you If you don't like wash the leaves or whatever or get like the proper ones and the proper stage of the plant's development.
Lee Russell: They'll just like cause irritation on your like they'll be like almost like fiberglass microfibers just like hooking into your ass.
Gary Hill: You know.
Gary Hill: If you squeeze the Charmin you get the corn you get the dry corn cobs, okay, that's all he's saying, you know.
Gary Hill: He takes away your therapeutic papers.
Lee Russell: Yeah.
Gary Hill: But um yeah, this is good. I I think it I think the imp the the end is very important, you know, with the whole epilogue of You know, th them dying is is a is is unfortunately a a deep reality of the times, you know,'cause Yeah.
Gary Hill: Yeah, y you're lucky of a man of of uh Uh um Uh, Robert Duval's age lived as long as he did,'cause it's really an anomaly that he lived as long as he did.
Lee Russell: Yeah.
Gary Hill: Right, right.
Lee Russell: Right, right.
[Silence]
Gary Hill: Yeah, that it's it's fine. I I love Yeah, the the interaction between Thomas Hayden Church and I I forget what number she was.
[Silence]
Lee Russell: Three. Yeah.
Gary Hill: Kind of falls for a bit and Yo.
Gary Hill: tries to talk to her, but, you know, again in a very Yeah, th therapeutic way to where she really she can she can read his emotions.
[Silence]
Gary Hill: And cap to this thing.
Cameron: Yeah. I wasn't.
Gary Hill: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, or something, you know.
Lee Russell: Could it couldn't all be downers. It couldn't all be just, oh, a couple of them died back in China and Robert Duvall and Greta Satchy never consummated the relationship. They just wrote letters to each other.
Gary Hill: But then he got then he got then he got buried with her. So, you know, it's kinda like One of those notebook things, you know.
Gary Hill: Which I I I tried, you know, people who love the notebook, you know, I'm sorry, but it's a bunch of bullshit, you know.
[Silence]
Gary Hill: Gosling, you know.
Gary Hill: Stay with her although she fucked her out on plenty.
Gary Hill: You know, through Alzheimer's and you particularly chose to die with her, like, yeah, that's fucking bullshit right there, you know. Yeah.
Lee Russell: Yeah.
Gary Hill: Yeah.
Gary Hill: He treat you too good, brother. Yeah.
Gary Hill: Yeah.
Cameron: Yeah.
Gary Hill: Yeah.
Cameron: It's a decent man.
Gary Hill: He's still a decent man, there you go.
Lee Russell: Yeah.
Gary Hill: Um
Gary Hill: But it's good though. I I I enjoyed this. I think it like like they said, it's kinda like m m not Middle of the road is is a wrong is a bad choice of words, but like it in the middle in the middle of the The the the filmography of Walter, I think it it belongs there and
Gary Hill: People should check it out. I think there's a there's a no frills D V D out there you can And I wanna say there's like a three pack you can get for really cheap But this and the film I thought we were doing, Comanche Moon, which was a T N T Movie.
Gary Hill: I'm not gonna lie, I thought that was what we were doing.
Gary Hill: It was so long ago. I think another film too, but Fairly cheap, but like eight bucks you can get this on D V D. So Check out the no frills D V D of this if you don't have it and Or you can, you know...
Gary Hill: Get it on digital, I got it for like five bucks. So there's that. Yeah.
Gary Hill: And then we all enjoy to see, you know.
Lee Russell: Спасибо.
Gary Hill: Um Cam, final thoughts, sir.
Cameron: Uh final thoughts. Um As I like to often say about movies that f fall in the middle of the road for me,
Cameron: I liked it, but I didn't love it. It was a good movie, not a great movie.
Cameron: Well, mini series, what have you.
Cameron: Uh But it's filled with great performances, especially surprisingly, by uh Thomas Hayden Church.
Cameron: You know, bringing it.
Cameron: Uh Robert Duvall.
Cameron: He's just a master class and watching Just actors just subtly giving you Giving you the goods.
Cameron: Each time, every time.
Cameron: But um you know it's but it's just kinda It's
Cameron: misleveled, if that makes sense. You know what I mean? Yeah. S some moments are really great. Some moments are really semi decent and some moments are really bad.
Gary Hill: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Cameron: i.e. the
Cameron: action sequences which we already mentioned, but I won't be the dead horse here, but I'm bummed. Uh
Cameron: But yeah, yeah, like I said, I liked it. I didn't love it.
Cameron: But you know, it's a
Cameron: It's kind of middle of the road for me as far as m Walter Hill goes. It's not my favorite, but it's not my least favorite either.
Cameron: And I'll leave it at that.
[Silence]
Lee Russell: This is a perfect like Sunday afternoon watch if you got nothing else going on.
Lee Russell: And you like cowboy movies, it's One of Walter Hill's better ones, it's got its flaws, uh that we've laid out.
Lee Russell: But it's...
Lee Russell: You know, um...
Lee Russell: I'd say it's better than Geronimo.
Lee Russell: I liked it better in Geronimo.
Lee Russell: Uh I'd agree with that. I would agree with that.
Lee Russell: And I and I think, you know, uh it stands out as a quality production that's better than some of the Walter Hill movies from this period that we've watched.
Lee Russell: As of late.
Lee Russell: Um so you know, we're we're in a we're in a shaky ground kind of area where like some of his stuff just isn't up to snuff anymore.
Lee Russell: Or, you know, he's coming onto projects that he has little control over and they end up being dog shit.
Lee Russell: But this is pretty quality and uh it's got great actors in it and uh great performances. It's a good story.
Lee Russell: uh And it's easy to overlook the flaws.
Lee Russell: Because of those those things. So uh yeah, uh check it out. It's it's it's decent hill. It's it's not top of the Top the line, but I mean, even middle of the pack hill is usually pretty goddamn good compared to most stuff.
Lee Russell: So uh it's it's around there for me. Yeah.
Gary Hill: Cool. Yeah, I enjoy my time with it. I I would I would watch it again.
Gary Hill: I watch it twice for this show, so maybe not right away, but I I watch it again.
Gary Hill: um like i said don't watch this and open range together'cause they're they're themes that you kinda run together and might confuse you a little bit.
Gary Hill: And um
Gary Hill: Yeah amazing cast. Um I was watching it today, I was like
Gary Hill: Yeah, Dumbledore's a real dick, isn't he? You know, come on.
Cameron: Yeah.
Gary Hill: Yeah.
Gary Hill: Do do an Irish anxia, that movie. That's fine.
Gary Hill: Uh
Gary Hill: Yeah, this this this is a good this is worth your time. I I think uh I just say one half was weaker than the other half because they all they all had their They're slow.
Gary Hill: low points, but when you make a film like this where they're you're going Literally a thousand miles across open land to to bring these horses.
Gary Hill: Uh there's not a whole lot to talk about'em except for the folks you meet down the road and I think that as a as a story it works pretty well in those sense.
Gary Hill: them being folks down the road and interesting people and Raining into random troubles and yeah, it it works as a film in that sense and I think it's your your two lead actors that really uh Steer the ship um so well.
Gary Hill: Well you got like I said, when you got these two actors and it's not hard to do and I think it's like this they they pulled it off pr pretty well.
Gary Hill: In my opinion.
Gary Hill: Middle tier Walter Hill is is still
Gary Hill: Still good. It's it's kinda like that.
Gary Hill: The cold pizza from Tuna.
Gary Hill: Nights ago, it may be a little funny but you but you're gonna you're gonna still eat it eventually if you're hungry enough and you know.
Lee Russell: You know.
Cameron: It's like undercooked lamb.
Gary Hill: Ha ha ha.
Gary Hill: Yeah.
Gary Hill: Yeah, sure. You bet you better that right creek cross rodia, yeah.
Gary Hill: You smell that Yorubae coming out the spigot there. It it's it kinda smells a little funky, but it tastes some good with some some pita and some uh Some white sauce right there, some
Gary Hill: Sazaki so whatever call it shit. Oh.
Cameron: Oh, Taziki.
Gary Hill: It tastes good, man.
Gary Hill: This episode tasted good too, guys. I I appreciate um you guys showing up always and
Gary Hill: Go back sooner rather than later. I think uh
Gary Hill: Maybe the guys will approve of this. We're gonna do one It's not directed by Hill Next, but written by him.
Gary Hill: I just watched this and for the first time ever I really enjoyed it.
Gary Hill: Um Walter Hill Ridden, Stan Picabah directed the getaway.
Gary Hill: Our Steve McCoy.
Gary Hill: I think we'll do that next, I think.
Gary Hill: And um go go out of the out of the the sequence of films that you would do something he read he wrote and Σας ευχαριστώ.
Cameron: I mean, always a good time.
Gary Hill: That'll be your next torque these guys. And um You got stuff to push, my friend, go for it.
Lee Russell: Uh TMBDOS.podbean.com That's they must be destroyed on site, my podcast. Um Stuff that's coming up in the next little while this summer, uh Just this weekend we're gonna be recording uh an episode on the uh Wake Up Dead Man, the uh new knives out uh the latest knives out uh film.
Lee Russell: And uh if plans work out The rest of the month.
Lee Russell: Uh we'll be doing uh female trouble. Um the uh the John Waters' film with Divine.
Lee Russell: And uh we're probably gonna finish off the month doing a couple of uh bikini booby sex comedy movies. Uh Bikini Summer and uh Beach Babes.
Lee Russell: From beyond.
Lee Russell: So uh
Cameron: Oh some Charlie Bann stuff, huh?
Lee Russell: Yeah, yeah, that's right. It is it is the uh softcore porn offshoot of full moon. Yeah.
Gary Hill: Which is, you know, ironic'cause by the first Charlie Bann production I've seen there was I wasn't supposed to watch was was um What the fairy tale movie that they made, you know, earlier?
Lee Russell: Yeah.
Gary Hill: Oh god.
Gary Hill: I...
Gary Hill: Digress though.
Gary Hill: Yeah, sounds awful, man.
Gary Hill: Can't be the episode that come out today actually, so uh lay it out there.
Cameron: Yeah, I had uh for my sequel two deja vu show show, which is uh
Cameron: an offshoot of my cinema degeneration uh network of shows. I Released uh Demons Two by Lumberto Baba.
Lee Russell: Nice.
Cameron: Uh uh the the superior sequel. Um not the superior movie in the series, but the superior sequel. Yes. Uh
[Silence]
Cameron: yeah yeah yeah Uh I also have uh an episode drop in n hopefully next week if I can get off my ass and edit.
Cameron: Um um For Grindhouse Pizzeria on Swishblade Sisters.
Gary Hill: Nice.
Cameron: And then I'm doing another
Gary Hill: Yeah
Cameron: uh Howling at the Full Moon, the Charlie Band show, where I'm reviewing the final well, one of the final films by Tony Todd with Cutters Club.
Lee Russell: Mm. So
Cameron: So it's kind of an eclectic mix coming out over the next few weeks.
Gary Hill: Yeah, demons too is a classic case of, you know Well how do you have a birthday party and the you don't want to have a birthday party?
Gary Hill: The white folks and white we vote white people over anyway.
Gary Hill: And then you know what you should get? You get fucking demons. That's what you get, man.
Gary Hill: 'Cause you overs you overship your goddamn bounds there and say, You know what, I don't want company. Let's bring company anyway and see what happens tonight.
Cameron: Just tell your friends I just want to be alone.
Gary Hill: Yeah. Next beef we're we're starting a I did a lot of theme modes and stuff mixed in.
Gary Hill: We're doing uh the there's something growing on you month, which is uh first one Is the mana to With uh the little tumor that could movie, the dark half, we're putting those two together.
Cameron: Oh, love that movie.
Gary Hill: Record that tomorrow actually for time recording this.
Gary Hill: And uh that will be inter intermixed with an episode two weeks later.
Gary Hill: Where we uh talk about Kawatu and total recall.
Gary Hill: Um r brother Belisle in in the very first basket case. And um Yes.
Gary Hill: It should be a good time and
Gary Hill: We always mixed up in it and that's fine. It just it's
Gary Hill: I'm feeling froggy and say, Hey, you guys wanna do something this week? And then you know, we do something this week, but Yeah, but thanks for supporting all all all these programs on the Butcher Shop Beach and The show uh on the misuse were on site and
Gary Hill: Cinema Degeneration on Cameron's uh stuff and your GoCo's and all this stuff. You know, they're they're they're all They're all working hard for ya, and that's great shit.
Gary Hill: But um this has been Last called torchies and um
Gary Hill: We'll see y'all next time with an episode of the for the getaway. I'm looking forward to that.
Gary Hill: Uh bye bye now.
Lee Russell: Bye-bye.
Cameron: Later.