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Tap to send me your reflections ♡ Every year, Susan has a word. A word that accompanies her on her journey through the year. This year it’s resonance. It sparked a series of thoughts, because at the time she shared it with me we were both feeling into the new year. We were both also feeling bombarded by the often frantic demands of the emails and social posts telling us it was time to BEGIN, time for something NEW, time to throw out the old and leap into this new year. And we were both...
Tap to send me your reflections ♡
Every year, Susan has a word. A word that accompanies her on her journey through the year. This year it’s resonance.
It sparked a series of thoughts, because at the time she shared it with me we were both feeling into the new year.
We were both also feeling bombarded by the often frantic demands of the emails and social posts telling us it was time to BEGIN, time for something NEW, time to throw out the old and leap into this new year.
And we were both feeling exhausted by it - and for me it sent me back under my duvet to hibernate a little longer.
So it feels interesting - and ALIGNED - to be recording this at the end of January & sharing it at the beginning of Feb. Not a time we ordinarily talk about beginnings. But this is about beginnings with RESONANCE. This is about beginnings that feel ALIGNED with who we really are, and where we are at.
Through our exploration, we touch on five key areas...
I also offer a couple of JOURNALING PROMPTS:
You'll also hear in the intro that I talk about the moon, and her natural cycles of beginning and ending. And there feels something particularly beautiful about releasing this episode on a Full Moon.
Susan and I would love to hear your thoughts. What does this whole idea of Beginning with Resonance spark for you?
Henny x
PS: it wasn’t two and a half years ago that Anton turned 50 - he’s younger than I made him out to be!
CONNECT WITH SUSAN
Susan J. McCulley
Nourishing Mindful Movement Teacher / Artist / Writer susanmcculley.com
Founder & Facilitator of The Age of Becoming Facebook Group
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A space to settle in and listen, and see where the episode takes you. This inspiring, reflective podcast is an invitation to travel deeper, with compassionate self-enquiry.
Henny shares insights from her own life, alongside practices that help us connect with our inner wisdom, explore our relationship with change and find a greater sense of flow. Henny believes we all hold our own answers, so there are no one-size-fits-all solutions here. This is a space to be with what’s true for you, and to grow from there.
If you’re drawn to slowing down, listening in, and exploring what it means to live with greater authenticity, this podcast is for you. Guided by psychology, mindfulness, therapeutic coaching, flow journaling, and everyday compassion, we explore ideas that help us step further into our inner worlds, in order to shape the changes we seek in our outer worlds.
Unknown: for who knows, I mean,
who knows, but like releasing
the expectation around it, and
trusting the resonance right.
And to end the practice that
beginning again is not a
problem. It's not a time. Yeah,
I want to think Sharon Salzberg
says is, it's the magic moment,
is when you realise that you've
wandered away from your
intention or from your practice.
And you you realise that it's
not a problem. It's fantastic.
Welcome to the podcast. That's
all about deepening our self
awareness with profound self
compassion. I'm Henny, I write
coach and speak about how
exploring our inner world can
transform how we experience our
outer world, all founded on a
bedrock of self love. Settle in
and listen and see where the
episode takes you. Every year,
my lovely friend Susan has a
word, a word that accompanies
her on her journey through the
year. And this year, it's
resonance. And she'll share more
I'm sure on what it means and
why it feels so resonant for her
when she joins me really
shortly. And hearing from her
hearing that this was her word
sparked a whole series of
thoughts for me, because at the
time that she shared it, we were
both feeling into the new year.
We were both also feeling
really, like genuinely bombarded
by the kind of some time sort of
frantic demands or somewhat
frantic demands of the emails
and the social posts telling us
it was time to begin at the
beginning of the year, that it
was time for something new time
to throw out the old and leap
into this new year. All this
language of resolutions and
goals and targets and outcomes.
And we were both feeling quite
exhausted by it. And for me, it
sent me back under my
metaphorical juvie actually to
hibernate a little bit longer.
So it feels quite interesting to
be recording this episode about
beginnings at the end of
January, and sharing it as we
move into February. And this
isn't a time when we ordinarily
talk about beginnings, of
course. But this episode is
beginnings with resonance. This
is about beginnings that feel
aligned with who we really are
and where we're at. And to be
honest, time is such a made up
saying, you know, change doesn't
follow a schedule and our moods
and our appetites for things are
not tied to the calendar or not
that Gregorian calendar anyway,
change has got its own cadence
and its own rhythm. So really,
we can begin anywhere, anytime.
And the more important thing is
feeling into how does it feel
for us. There's a connected
thought here actually, as well.
So Anton and I, my husband,
Anton. And I've just been
looking at the moon, the almost
full moon. It's a full moon on
Sunday. And I'm recording this
on Monday through his telescope,
and I bought him that telescope
for his 50th birthday, which was
two and a half years ago. And
it's only now that we've really
had a space where we can set it
up and it can have its own
corner. It's in my stable,
converted stable slash studio
office space. And he just showed
me the almost full moon through
the telescope and went from I
might wet myself because it was
so exciting. Bit of an overshare
there, too. I think I'm going to
be sick because oh my goodness,
like the majesty and the
magnificence of the moon. So
there are a couple of references
here to beginnings. One is
sometimes we can have that thing
for a really long time before we
actually begin with it. So in
the case of the telescope, he'd
had it for two and a half years
before he began using it. And
that's how Okay, you know, now
is the right time then wasn't.
And also the moon, of course is
redolent with
the concept of moving through
cyclical experiences, you know,
every month, she is full and
fat, and every month, she wanes,
and every month, she becomes
new, and then she waxes and then
she becomes full again, you
know, we have this, there is
our, our natural calendar, there
is a natural time of beginnings
and endings. And actually, I've
been exploring this a little bit
in terms of how to work, how to
do the creative, and sort of
conceptual stuff that I do in my
business. So alongside all of
the coaching, I also create the
journaling quests, and I write
books and, and I come up with
ideas for retreats and, and
events for people. And so there
is a kind of natural time when
it feels right to begin to do
these things. And a natural time
when I feel myself pulling away.
And I've been exploring how much
of that is connected with the
cycles of the moon. And, and
there's an awful lot out there
and, you know, Google land about
working with the cycles of the
mean, and I don't know, I'm just
kind of curious about it. And if
that's something that you do,
I'd love to hear from you. And
in fact, if you know someone who
does it really well, I'd love to
get them onto the podcast, that
would be a very exciting thing.
So if you do know someone,
please drop me a line. So
anyway, back to today, and the
utterly magnificent, Susan
McCauley. Susan is going to join
me in a few minutes. And when
she does, I'm going to share a
quote that I've literally
literally just seen on
Instagram, from the utterly
wonderful Sharon Salzberg who,
for any of you who are
interested in meditation, I'm
sure you've come across her.
She's just got a really
beautiful soul. She's often seen
as one of the founders of modern
thinking around mindfulness. And
I can see there Susan has
entered the waiting room. So I'm
gonna go on pause, and then
we'll be back and I'll share
that quote from Sharon Salzberg
give us an OH. OH, and we're
back.
Oh, we've got the band back
together, Susan. Now, Phil, so
we should be playing
instruments, but you know,
yeah, reuniting tour. Yeah, we
were just saying before the
recording how much we love these
conversations. And I'm so
grateful to keep having them.
Yeah, yeah, me too. And I was
also saying to you to Susan,
that every time I think, How
shall I ask her? Is she going to
think Oh, no, I've given you too
many words. we've realised that
actually, this is exactly what
it feels, which is a
conversation between two friends
and and I really hope that you
enjoy this exploration of
beginnings, beginnings with
resonance. And I was just saying
to Susan as well that I shared
with you guys listening about
the telescope and me saying I
was gonna wet myself because I
was so overexcited about looking
at the moon. But I also shared
that on Instagram, literally,
just before I came on, to start
the recording, there was a
Sharon Salzberg, quote, which
felt like a really lovely place
to start actually, before we
kind of dive in. And the quote
was, we set forth we struggle,
we lose our balance, and then
realising it, we begin again.
And it felt like such a
beautiful container for the
conversation that we are falling
into right now. And I've also
shared with everyone that you
know, your practice each share
of having a word and that this
year, your word is resonance.
Now And I'd really love just to
kind of begin there and just
talk a bit about that word and
about the connection with
beginnings. Yeah,
that's great. It's great. Um, so
when I pick a word, every year,
I say that with sort of some
arrogance, I should actually say
that My Word almost always picks
me. And I had, I had picked a
word, I, like it was like, No,
late November, and I thought,
Oh, I know, my word is going to
be. And that was all feeling
grand about that. And I was in a
conversation, I did an interview
with a fantastic woman. And we
were talking and she, I said
something about the creation of
art and creative work. And that
I would not do it. If it wasn't
for the sharing for the
connection, because that's why I
do it. There are some people who
say like, I would create, I
would paint no matter what, or I
would write, I write no matter
what. And that is not me. I
said, yeah, for me, it's all
about the connection. And she
said, It's all about the
resonance. And I went, Whoa,
what is that word? Mean?
Obviously, I'd heard it before.
But it landed in me in a
different way. And I got super
curious about it. I realised I
didn't really know what it
meant. Exactly. Like I kind of
knew what it felt like. And what
I think I what she, she meant by
that? Well, it turns out, it's a
pretty fantastic word that has
lots of sciency stuff, like in,
in sound and chemistry, like
there's all kinds of like, kind
of super cool things. And I
found too, is what I started
with was is the feeling is this
feeling of some things vibrating
at the same frequency that I am.
And, and when we are vibrating
together, it becomes bigger. So
one of the definitions of
resonance is that a small kind
of connection creates this much
bigger impact. Which I just
totally love. This idea that we
could do like a small thing, and
have it really ripple out in a
powerful way.
That's yeah, exactly. Yeah.
Beautiful.
Yeah. So in regard to the
killings, when I've been playing
with, it's like, I go into a new
situation, and I say, What do I
feel here? Do I feel like we are
vibrating at the same frequency?
Or are we kind of like, oh,
mushed up and did not so not so
connected? And or somebody
suggests something? And do I
have this feeling of like, yes.
And sometimes people call that
like, the big yes, or something
kind of feeling like that. But
that's what it is, in regards to
my practice with my word and
Beginnings is that I don't want
to begin it. If it doesn't have
some of that resonance.
And this ties directly back to
what we were talking about
before we came on air. And what
we touched on very, very
briefly, right at the beginning
about, you know, this
conversation that we had about
you being here, me inviting you
as sort of saying, shall we
talk, you know, whatever the the
entry point into our
conversations, you know, is each
time that we speak each time,
there is resonance, because if
there isn't resonance, then the
conversation doesn't flow there
isn't meaning to it. And
actually, as I'm sitting here,
I've realised that my word the
word that I keep using for this
year is alignment. Which for me,
means much of a similar thing,
but it feels for me, it feels
like a very still place. The
alignment was resonances. Like
there's like a there's a
vibrational energetic quality to
it. And so maybe this is like
the yin and yang, you know,
where they kind of sit together
you know, alignment and
resonance they are
I love Yeah, the masculine
feminine know that I can totally
see that because you're I there
is a sort of All awareness of
alignments, the buzz of
resonance, right? Yeah, one of
the things I did in exploring my
word was I just, I just Googled
resonance and images. And I came
up with some of these most
beautiful, I don't know what
they are graphs or are following
the frequency of sound waves and
how they interact with each
other. But they are these
gorgeous, really dynamic. Even
though they're, they're still
they they're full of energy. But
I can imagine if I Googled
alignment, there would be a very
different feel to those images,
right? Even though what we're
talking about is so it's you're
absolutely right. It's the two
sides of the same thing. Yeah.
And so this feels like a really
beautiful place to begin. Did
this was such a such an old pro?
So one of the things that we
both noted when we were kind of
sharing thoughts about this was
this idea of paradoxes. And the
contradictions around the sense
of beginnings, because
obviously, you know, for some of
us beginnings feel very
exciting. And, and for others,
it feels like there's a lot of
kind of resistance because
beginnings signify change,
perhaps. And so, so yeah, to,
you know, and I loved. Just so
you all know, Susan had this
kind of the sort of key, like,
touch points for us to explore
as we come through this
conversation. And this feels
like a really, really beautiful
starting point. Just what these
what this sense of resistance
versus excitement can be. What
does it Yeah,
and don't, don't you? I mean,
for me, they can often coexist.
So, so in regards to Sharon
Salzberg, quote, about we begin,
and we stumble, and we, you
know, we, we run and we fall, I
mean, they all I can't remember
exactly, all things. But, but it
was that sense, right? Like,
it's all part of what we're
doing to get in this, whatever
practice it is, let's just say,
and I find it for myself that I
will, even something that I love
to do that, right at the point
where I'm going to begin it, I
can feel like yay, or nay at the
same time, that there's part of
me that is ready and excited and
wanting to dive in. And there's
part of these, like, we don't
know exactly what's going to
happen.
So one that sparks a thought for
me that one of the things I have
slowly become aware of about
myself is that for me to choose
to begin something to choose to
do something that is new to me,
I have to be really sure that it
is the right thing. Because what
I don't want to do, and I say
this without judgement, if it
does happen, but what I what I
don't want to do is to half
commit to something. So when I
stopped eating meat when I was
21, I think I had I had been
vegetarian when I was eight and
then I was vegetarian again when
I was 14. And then I was
vegetarian again, sort of really
like briefly when I was about
16. And so when I got to 21 and
I was like this like it was this
really like strong drive of this
really just feels right to stop
eating meat. I had to be really
sure with myself that I really
was stopping. Huh huh? And, and
so and I have noted with other
sort of choices, decisions that
I've made through my life and
actually now I'm really mindful.
I haven't been running for a
couple of years, bad back to
frozen shoulders, blah, blah.
And I know I'm, I'm pretty much
like it's okay enough that I
could go running again. And I'm
so mindful of not just flinging
myself out into you know, my
running shoes and like charging
down the road. because what I,
because I want to commit to it,
I need to know that I am ready
to begin that practice without
stopping.
Okay, so I have a question for
you What? What would happen? If
you did? What happens if you
started and you stopped it? What
does it What would it mean? What
it means is it distils? No wrong
word it dilutes me energy that I
will have felt toward it. It's
some of that energy will be
dissipated. And so the fear then
is that it'll take me such a
long time to garner all the
energy again that I will go.
Okay, it's about marshalling
resources may be maybe it's that
interesting. Interesting.
Because if when you tell that
story about your, your
relationship with not eating
meat, that to me is exactly what
Sharon Salzberg is talking
about, yeah. That we begin, and
then we stop, we begin and then
we realise what oh, shoot, I
forgot about this, or it was
inconvenient, or, and then I
began again, and I begin again.
And, and that is not just okay.
But it's part of our aspiration.
And in some ways,
I'm now in solidarity. And now
feel like I'm like, I've just
gone straight into, gosh, you're
so right.
Right. So So I would really
invite you to ask yourself, How
can I begin running with coal
curiosity? Because your body is
different than when the last
time you ran? And you, I think
you're living in a different
place. And so you're going to be
living with her, your running
route is going to be different.
Who knows? And maybe you start
doing it and you're like, I
realise now that I just hate
this. That's the fear. That's
the fear. That's the
fear, because I love running. I
love it so much. That's the
fear. And I think there's some,
okay, so there are two, I've got
two paradoxical conflicting
thoughts here, here we go. So,
the marshalling the resources,
to feel the commitment, like
deep in my belly feels like an
important thing, because I want
to, I want to give it my due
care and attention and love and
to really like nourish myself in
the process of going running
again. And, and I also hear the
release of all of that, and, and
the letting go of the fear about
I might hate it. And there are
really steep hills around here.
And I used to live in the Fens,
which are flat. And, you know,
releasing all of the worry about
not being able to do it as well,
that's the other thing. And so,
this reminds me of my beautiful
friend of mine, Abby, who's been
on the podcast as well, way, way
back about 90 episodes ago, I
think it is now. And one of the
things that she has noted is
that she no longer sees when she
gets injured running as a source
of frustration as a problem as a
problem, or as a place where she
can like oh, just lose herself
and self criticism of like, oh,
you know, you fall Why did you
go that route? You know,
whatever the thing is, and now
she simply sees it as a time
when she can heal, and begin
again. Yeah. And she will go
back to one minute run one
minute walk. Yeah, that's really
that's beautiful. Actually, I've
just had a massive reframe in my
head.
Well, I think I do want to say
that I think I loved how you
said I wanted to the the I want
to feel aligned with this
choice. I want to feel that
resonance in my belly. I want to
feel it. Yeah, I think that that
is it is valuable to do that. To
choose the thing Things that
really feel like the right
things. And then and say to
yourself, I don't know how it's
gonna go. And I might walk the
whole time today and run for one
minute. Or who knows? I mean,
who knows, but like releasing
the expectation around it, and
trusting the the resonance.
Right. And to end the practice
that beginning again is not a
problem. It's not a time. Yeah,
I want to think Sharon Salzberg
says, It's the magic moment, is
when you realise that you've
wandered away from your
intention or from your practice.
And you you you realise that
it's not a problem. It's
fantastic.
The phrase I've got going
through my head, which I've had
to write down, actually is
commit and let go.
Yes. Yeah. Right. And so I think
that it's super wise not to just
like commit willy nilly, to
whatever the heck that like
comes across, right? This is
really important that I know
people are asking things of you.
And, and, and when when we get a
bunch of, of possibilities that
are presented to us, we can get
confused. I for me, I can get,
you know, confused or, or
fearful that if I say no, that
they'll never it'll never come
again or something like that.
And instead if I can really
allow myself to feel the, the
true, yes, the aligned resonant.
Yes. And then let it go, and
then go in and dive in. And and
see what happens without, yeah,
the fear around trying to
predict what that's going to be.
Because good luck with that,
honey.
Yes, I can be so true. And so
there's this thing about the
discernment, the discernment of
listening in to the resonance,
or the alignment, like, Does
this feel right for me, and, and
there's a really strong
connection here for me with all
of that stuff that we were
talking about that, you know,
the bombardment of messaging
that happens at the turn of the
year, and all the shoulds and
musts and all sorts that come
piling in, often from places
that you really wouldn't expect
it. But it's almost because that
the system of the of the, you
know, the New Year system sort
of lays down the law that this
is how everyone must speak to
each other at this time of year,
we must all ask each other what
are your resolutions for
drinking this shake? If you want
to be healthier? And the new
year? Yeah,
yeah, you must be looking to how
you're going to fulfil your
professional potential, you must
be developing your confidence
skills, you must be like,
whatever the thing is. And, and
so that can be where were the
sort of, well, for me, so
overwhelming, like seeing all of
that, that I just retreat? For,
you know, in another body, I
might charge a number of things
sign up, like say yes, like, you
know, high energy, like, that's
really what I want, and throwing
myself at stuff that I don't
actually do. Unpaid, you know,
unused gym memberships bring to
mind. But so there's that thing
about? Yeah, Gosh, I really love
this the really the the
listening in, to what, what
feels true. And where do you
sense that paradox or that
contradiction between the
excitement? And maybe the fear?
As well as
the resistance of the resistance
behind? Yeah, yeah. And, and so,
for me in this, in this frame, I
would say, once I have the
resonance, once I have that
feeling, then my job or my, my
role here, is just to do my best
and just see what happens as you
say, you know, commit and like
and, and that that would include
beginning again, within the
context, right. It's like, if if
it doesn't go the way I think
doesn't mean well, it's all
garbage and I have to throw it
all away. In Quite on the
contrary, is that that in fact,
that's a magic moment and part
of the practice and trusting
that residence. And this is
like, okay, so I just begin
again. And I go and lace up my
trainers, as you say, in the UK
or throw on your sneakers, as
they say over here. And you get
out there and go again and see
what happens.
So well, what is something that
you are finding yourself?
Beginning or beginning again?
Right now?
Yeah, that's a great question.
I've got a couple of things, I
would say, is as, as listeners
may remember, I teach movement
classes, which I, I adore. And
every time I go to step into
class, I do it with a certain
amount of resistance. There's a
certain part of me that feels
anxious or reluctant to begin.
And I think it's safe to say
that I have never stepped out of
a class and said, well, shoot. I
wish I hadn't done that. Before,
right. I mean, it never happens.
I always walk out and just be
like, Oh, right. That's great.
But so every class so in answer
to your question, one of the
things is everything. Every
class I teach, I'm stepping in
with a certain contradictory
feelings around it. A little
excitement, a little anxiety a
little. Yes, please. A little
No, no, no, thank you very much.
The other thing that I am
beginning again, recently is, is
making more visual art. I felt
very stuck around that practice.
And, and I can find myself
looking at my art supplies and
saying, I don't know what to do,
I feel uninspired. And and, and
so for like, four months, I was
just, you might my, my art areas
right over there. And I would
just be like, given it stink guy
from over here, just like go
down want to have anything do
that. And what I have been
playing with a Susan, just show
up, just get them out and just
play around. And there's part of
me, it's like, cross, yeah,
that's not gonna work. You've
got to know what you're gonna
do. And, you know, it does work.
It does work. And what happens,
I make a bunch of little things.
I sometimes make a small piece
that I'm sending to my mom or my
niece or something. And then I
think, wow, that's really fun.
That was cool. Let me What if I
made it bigger? Right. But so so
that's sort of a bigger process
that I am exploring in a bit of
a different way than the sort of
regular thing. I do tell my
students, sometimes my movement
students that it's a good, it's
a good thing, I'm the teacher,
because if I wasn't a teacher,
half the time, I wouldn't show
up. And, you know, it's because
I've made that commitment, as we
were talking about and, and, you
know, after doing it for a
couple of decades, I can say
with, with certainty that this
is something that's important to
me, and that resonates with me.
And that matters to me. So I do
keep showing up, even though
there's all kinds of grumble
parts that are that are sitting
around about this. And the art
practice is a little different
in that I have the ability just
to sort of set it aside. And so
my re starting with that was a
little bit different. And but
it's the same thing, right? It's
the same thing of just, it's
this constant flow of getting
stuck. And as Sharon says,
falling down and stumbling
around, and then like, oh, and
then there's that the WHO that
feeling again, and then and then
begin to back out. And again,
it's just, huh, yeah, round and
round.
It's listening to you. So I for
me, because I was thinking as I
asked you the question, I was
thinking, Is there anything that
I'm beginning again, other than
the running Why should I talk
about running so much? I mean,
it's just, you know, I really
need to do more of it and talk
about it less. However, the
other thing for me where I'm
feeling the resistance is the
beginning again, aspect is I
have realised that I have
another volume of my darling
girl. Birthday. thing itself
through my solar plexus is what
it feels like. And when I
gathered up all of the love
letters that weren't in the
first volume, turns out, I
actually have exactly the right
number for volume two. So it is
now designed. And just going
through kind of editing process,
and I am in a similar sort of
way, you know, with you with the
kind of art in this like this
slightly conflicted place of
this feels extremely vulnerable.
But I've been extremely
vulnerable before because I
published the first volume. And
so that also can be a sense of
like, begin again, like come
back to that place of absolute
wrongness. And begin again, like
really feel into what is that
like, because I've forgotten it
was two and a half years ago.
And, and it has surprised me at
how raw it feels. And so then
there's that my observer is
going, Oh, that's a delicious
thing, my darling, that's just
really feel into this and
experience this again. And then
I know that once it's published,
it's out of my hands. And, and
again, that that's another begin
again, because it's it's it's
beginning, release, and
beginning and ending,
beginning and letting, letting,
letting go letting it go. It's
absolutely yeah. Ending, it's,
it's accountability to me, and
it's just often and it's, you
know, it's in the world. It's
nothing to do with me then.
Right. So, yeah, there's some,
and I got this, there's
something else going on here. I
think there's something about
also the coming back to that
kind of pressure about
beginning. And, and also that
there are so there's this kind
of cyclical time thing of when
women to begin things, but I
think also there are times of
our life when there is pressure
to begin, you know, or to adopt
a particular mindset, which is
like beginning that particular
mindset. So I'm thinking
particularly about things like
retirement or grief loss.
Menopause as a life stage, you
know, we're often the rhetoric
can be about this is, you know,
this is, this is a time to look
ahead at retirement, let's take
that. And actually, for an awful
lot of people, it's a time of
great loss, and a time of
ending. And, and we also have to
honour that, as well, we, and I
know, there's much more just
sort of, there's much more
awareness of that now, there's
much more awareness of the need
to honour what went before,
rather than just barreling into
what's ahead. But I think it
still kind of warrants some
attention, when we think about
this sort of concept of
beginning with resonance.
Because part of that resonance
is how, how do I actually feel?
About what? What went before?
For sure? Sure. And that is all
coming with you.
With you,
right, so one of the things that
I talk about when in the
physical body is in regards to
say alignment is and listeners,
if you're not driving in an
automobile, you could do this,
you could stand up and feel your
body just sort of rock just in a
very small way, front and back.
And a little bit side to side
and just finding kind of your
alignment finding your centre
and, and one of the things that
we can do is explore was there's
a whole practice with this, but
but when we talk about front and
back, which is really what we're
talking about and beginnings and
endings is our culture as you
point out so well. It's like
it's tumbling forward. It's all
it's it's constantly Looking to
the next thing, and where am I
going to get my dopamine hit for
the next thing, when instead if
we feel the back of our body, so
in the physical body, all of the
big muscles are all at the back.
And so all of your strength and
support is behind you. And so
sometimes, what I invite people
to do is when they are ready to
step into whatever if it's a
movement experience, or a next
time of life, is to do it from
the support from behind. And we
sometimes have the image of this
big one, like a kangaroo tail,
or T Rex tail that reaches back,
and it's just like, holding us
up. And that's our experience
that everything that we have
done in our whole lives until
this moment, and all of that has
your back, is there supporting
you. And it's, it's from there
that we can move forward, right?
It's like this holistic moving
forward, rather than the Western
culture of like Latin America
tumbling into. Right. And it's
funny, I see it in people's
bodies, often, that people tend
to be just sort of leaning
forward. And I'm always like,
come on back and just feel all
the strength and all of the
support that's right there
behind you. And that's, that's
exactly. And that's that, I
think that retirement is a
perfect example. It's like, oh,
what are all the great travel
and you could start like,
volunteer and well, what what
are you bringing with you what's
supporting you as you step into
whatever's next and feel both at
the same time?
And I think that idea, I love
that idea of the the kangaroo
tail, the sort of point of
support that we can also, you
know, at times when you're
tired, you can kind of just eat
just have a little lean back.
Just to keep you up, right, you
know, it's okay. And yes, and it
applies, it applies, I think, to
any life stage change. And, you
know, I think this kind of
transition through through
midlife, whether you're male or
female brings with it you know,
so much, so much change so much
like, who am I now? Who was I?
Then who am I becoming all of
that? And actually, to kind of
to hold this sense of everything
we were comes with us everything
we've learned the, and that
there is room for the joy and
the pain? Yeah, I think is the
other sort of aspect of that.
And it's really, I mean, that's
talking my darling girl, you
know, those, I call them love
letters for all the girls and
women we have ever been. Yes.
Because that's the sense of, you
know, everyone is with us.
Right. And that's what the Brene
Brown talks about that midlife
she calls it. I think she calls
it. The home for wayward girls
is what midlife is that she
feels like she's gathering up
all of the girls and young women
and middle young, middle aged
women, that she's been in her
whole life. And she's just like,
taking care of all of them. And
getting wisdom from all of them
and getting inspiration from
them. Yeah, I love that. I think
that's great. And I'm doing a
little happy dance that another
volumes coming out. That is
amazing. And I know what a
tremendous undertaking making a
book is so I just want to honour
that too. So
yeah, thank you, Susan. Thank
you, it'll appear at some point
when it you know when it does.
It does. Because that's, that's
the that's the resonance. That's
the alignment and so and so
there's something here as well
about I think you you you raise
something before we came on, on
air, which I found really are
such a beautiful distinction
between this difference between
the act of beginning and the
state of being a beginner and I
know we've touched on it a bit
around the running and you know
how how we can support ourselves
with this mindset of it is okay
to begin again. Yes, you and
thank you Sharon, you know for
kind of feeding this to us
endlessly. I know that the power
of this
Thank goodness she says it many
times like oh Over and over,
doesn't matter.
I mean, in fact, her her New
Year, I just loved it, her new
year post was we can always
begin again. And then the next
sort of slide, you know, the
next image was, we can always
begin again. And then the next
one was we can always begin
again, like 12 Full images or
the words we can always and it's
like, Okay, I'm getting it. I'm
kind of getting this message
now.
Right. Right. And then and so so
yeah, I think. Yeah, it is. We
can't say it enough that it's
not only is it not a bad thing,
but it is an essential thing.
And, and so I think that so far,
we've mostly been talking about
this, this process of beginning.
But what what I also wanted to
introduce into the conversation
was the idea of being a
beginner. Whatever stage we are
in of any endeavour, process,
time of life, is can I come into
it as a beginner? And this is a
you know, the famous beginner's
mind from Zen Buddhism, this
notion that in an expert's mind,
there are few possibilities. But
in a beginner's mind, there are
many. And so I just, I think
that that is also a sort of
radical and countercultural
notion is to allow myself to be
a beginner, and to not know.
And, you know, we are so trained
to, like, have the quick answer
or have the the pithy summation
to know to know what's going on
knowing know what to do, and all
of that, yeah, Ticket, ticket it
all from the from the head. And
being in beginner's mind is sort
of like I think of it as sort of
this toddler part of me that
kind of wanders into a situation
going, Wow, what's going on
here? And what are we doing? Oh,
this is kind of cool. What can
we do? And so whether it's me
teaching your class, or you
going running, or they're, there
are me doing art again, it's the
same thing, right? It's, it's,
there's first there's the act of
choosing to begin. And then
there's the stepping in with
like, I don't know what how it's
gonna go.
That's so beautiful. And do you
know what I've realised, and
I've never, I've never
articulated this to myself or
anyone, but there is a moment
when I first start coaching with
somebody, where we've had, we've
had a discovery call. So we've
had, and we've spent an hour in
each other's company, and I've
got a kind of sense of, like,
where they are, and we've
started to sort of, you know,
get a sense of where they want
to get to. But that first
coaching conversation, might be
a month afterwards. And so
they're in a different place,
you know, a month on stuff will
have changed. And, and I will
have changed in that month. And
you know, so actually, it is a
beginning point. And I have to
and, and do go into every single
one of those conversations with
the beginner's mind, and I've
never really thought about it.
But I know that when I first
started coaching, I didn't.
I read, you've got your
questions. You're like, this is
what we're going to do. I'm
going to take her here, and then
she's going to we're going to
talk about how
we're going to use this model.
You know, and I've got this
fabulous tool that I'm going to
exercise this exercise. Exactly.
And now I know in all of my
wisdom, and I know that not
everybody works this way, and
that is absolutely okay. But for
me, I have to go in with the
beginner's mind, because that is
the only way that I can serve in
the best way that I can serve.
Right.
And yeah, and and you're coming
but yeah, I think there's
there's a lot of interesting
things at play here. But one of
them is that you are bringing
your kangaroo tail
exactly. I mean, exactly.
Because that way I'm actually
bringing the whole of myself
rather than just this like
narrow part that goes I know the
answer before I even know what
the question is. I know the
answer.
Yeah, and oh, and what was the
there was a connecting thought?
I know. I can't remember if
we've raised Ram Dass yet
whether his name has come up in
this conversation yet No, not
yet. A contemporary, while
Sharon Salzberg is quite a bit
younger, but they they hung out,
I believe quite a lot. In this
isn't a quote from him, but from
a just from one of his books. So
somebody else said, old age can
be a wonderful thing. As long as
we haven't forgotten how to
begin. So that way, so old age
can be a wonderful thing. As
long as we haven't forgotten how
to begin, right? And that is the
beginner's mind, isn't it?
Right? Yeah. That is enter into
every life stage, every
experience with, with the
remembering of how it is to
begin. Yeah. Because Because if
we don't have I mean, this goes
back to the Zen Buddhist saying,
if we don't have this beginner's
mind, we come in believing that
we are that we know the score,
and when we think we know, well,
then there's nothing left to
know. And so therefore, we have
built these walls around us. But
in and I've just got sort of
going through my mind that
they're kind of Rolodex, you
know, flick, sort of people that
I know and I, people who are
open to beginning again, people
are open to that beginner's
mind, to being unsure. From
CEOs, actually, all the way
through an organisation from,
you know, friends, family
members, whatever. And there is
a there's a kind of sense of
sort of wonder, wonder, I think
in them, and a willingness to be
foolish. It's, I mean, brings
joy. Yeah.
Yeah. Yeah. I think that's right
on, I think that there is the
sort of paradox of walking into
a situation knowing that you
have never been in your case,
you've never coached this
person, even if you have
actually, right, to be honest,
every day. They're, they're
different. You're different
every session. Right? Exactly.
Um, and so it's this, this, this
openness and willingness, and
the trust, the trust that you'll
know, the right, you know,
you'll you'll follow the flow of
it and know what is actually
right, and not what you your
brain is just assignment, your,
your, your, the part of you a it
for me, it's the part of me that
is uncomfortable with
uncertainty. Like I want to go
into those situations and know
how it's gonna go. And as you
say that, you know, I'm sure I
could teach a class like that.
And, and it feels very different
than the ones where I say, okay,
here are some possibilities, and
we'll just see what happens.
And that that for me is is
actually what a Master
Practitioner looks like. Yeah,
so Abby, again, she's so she's
here twice. She's shown up in
this conversation. She She is a
voicework teacher. And one of
the things that she said to me
so she teaches at skier OS,
which is a retreat in Greece,
it's quite well known retreat.
It's been running for about 40
years. And she talked to me
about her experience there last
year, where she realise that
she'd spent the last 20 years
teaching. And then last year,
she realised how much better it
was if she stopped, which meant
that the experience of being
with these people was so much
more enriching, and she was able
to just carry the process and
lead it flow. And, and I think
she's always done that, but
there's always been this part of
wanting some degree of control.
Yeah. Whereas this time she just
let it go. So. So there's
something here as well about
beginning from a place of almost
like innocence. No expectations,
it's back to the letting go.
It's the trust.
Yeah. Fascinating. I want to
meet me some Abby.
Oh, you really do. But maybe we
have to have a three way
conversation because what is
fascinating to me, I am actually
considering not stopping calling
myself a teacher for this very
reason. That my my observation,
and the longer I do this is that
I'm not teaching anybody
anything. I'm creating
opportunities. I'm creating
ideas. I'm like, I'm reminding
people of stuff they already
know. Right?
It's the reason why I don't like
the word coach. I don't think
people I just don't I think I
walk beside people.
Right, exactly. Yeah, exactly. I
sometimes I also think of myself
sometimes as a tour guide and
guide. Exactly. And I'm like,
Okay, you might not have noticed
this, but I'm going to point
this out to you. I don't know,
how does it land with you? Maybe
it's interesting. Maybe you want
to go down this other end of the
museum? Have at it, you know,
but um, yeah, I, it's exactly
very similar with the coach
ideas. Like, there's something
about that word. Yeah. Yeah.
And, and there is, and there is
this sort of hierarchical thing.
I appreciate this, like, and
then in and out. Like, that is
not what I do. Um, so I love
that I love me some heavy.
You really? Yeah. Yeah. I might
have to orchestrate an
introduction.
Yes, I think maybe. Well, I know
that we're just mindful of our
time. But I did want to weave in
this idea that the title of this
thing not withstanding that what
happens if there's really no
such thing as a beginning? Yeah,
what happens if everything is
just part of this big flow. And
we talked about, there's the the
line in the in Dan Wilson songs
every beginning is at some other
beginnings, and that every time
we say yes to something, we are
stepping away from something
else. Every time we move
forward, we're moving away from
something else, it's just like
this part of the flow of time of
flow of our lives. And, for me,
as sort of mind bending as it
can be. It's so helpful, to not
to not get attached to, you
know, I'm starting this right
now. You know, I turn over the
January, I love that we're doing
the beginnings thing in
February. So fantastic. And
instead seeing all of it, it's
like the divine feminine is this
huge flow of, of life energy. At
the risk of becoming, you know,
sort of woowoo we, but it's
true, that, that it is all
interconnected. And sort of like
we were talking about our past
is always with us, and we bring
it with us. And this this idea
that everything is being birthed
and dying at the same time.
And where does anything begins?
Yeah, where
does anything? Yeah, I mean, you
zoom out far enough. You know,
it's it's all just part of the
flow of things.
And when we say You know, you
talked about us having the the T
Rex tail or the kangaroo tail.
So one of the things that I was
sometimes talk about is that we
have a peacocks tail. It's a
very beautiful thing, and
everybody's got one. And each
one of the eyes of the peacocks
tail is a system that we've been
part of, and we so the biggest
most densely packed one is like
right behind his work, which is
our family system. But also
every system as in every class
at school, every group, every
friendship group, every book
club, every whatever job we've
ever had. They're all systems
and, and each one is influenced
and influences us in some way.
And everyone who was ever part
of that system carries their own
peacocks tail with all of the
other systems that they're part
of. So you get this sense of
this enormous network of systems
that we are all part of. But
when you think about the family
system, you go back seven
generations, and I can't
remember what the number is, but
it's, it's well over 200 people
have have influenced us, you
know, grandparents, great
grandparents, great, great,
great grandparents. And, and so,
you can look at something that I
do like a behaviour I have or a
belief I have, I don't know that
money is something to worry
about, okay, classic belief.
Now, that belief, I will have
got learnt somewhere down the
line from one of my parents who
will have learnt it from one of
their parents who will have
learnt it from one of their
parents and will have learnt it
from one of their parents, back
to the point where somebody
really really struggled for
money, and it meant life or
death. And it was like, so
deeply ingrained, and they
taught it to their children, and
that message got carried down
because it was so important. And
so even with like belief
systems, the family like stories
that we carry, it can often be
really hard to see where they
began, because, because they go
back so far in time. And you
know, and just that sense of
kind of that life is this
endless flow. When when we do
step back, you know, I mean,
literally go back far enough, a,
everything becomes so
insignificant and meaningless.
And you just have to laugh at
the, you know, the hilarity of
the fact that you and I are even
here having this conversation
with these delicious, delightful
people listening, you know,
hopefully, following us on this,
you know, crazy ridiculous
conversation because like how on
earth any of this ever actually
came to be is mind blowing back
to looking at the moon and, you
know, wanting to be sick,
because it was just so
incredible. I lost myself
slightly in my little rampage.
You know, yeah,
I just think that, um, I think
that the big the bigger message
from this whole conversation is
to be a little less precious.
Brilliant, and, and a little
less precious with endings and
just honouring them for what
they are, but without getting
too wound around the axle about
about them, because they're
happening all the time. And, and
what we can always do is just
begin again, again.
A well done, Susan, for pulling
us back from the brink there.
Oh, my darling. Wonderful. As
always, thank you so much for
joining us. And I can't wait for
our next conversation. I really
can't.
And I also, as always, just
would love to hear from anybody
listening about your own
experience. The the wisdom that
you've gained about beginnings
and endings and being a beginner
and not being a coach and not
being a teacher.
Exactly. And are there any words
that you can recommend? And I
think this question about is
there any such thing as the
beginning is a really beautiful
thing to journal about?
Actually, you know, particularly
if there's something which is
going on in your life right now,
which feels like it is a big
beginning, or feels like
something is ending and but you
can't yet see what the next
beginning is because every
beginning begins with an ending.
And so to actually journal
about, is there any such thing
as the beginning or is there any
such thing as an ending? Yeah,
yeah. If everything is flow,
yeah, yeah. Oh, I want to hear
about that.
And, and just to echo that point
that you made about not to get
too precious, about, about these
things. Which reminds me of that
quote about angels fly because
they take themselves lightly.
Oh, that's sweet. I love it. Oh,
you're such a gift. Anything you
so much.
Thank you so much, everyone.
Thanks for listening and thank
you my darling Susan. Okay, so
don't know quite where I went
with the whole ramble right at
the until Susan brought us back.
Thank goodness for Susan. I
mean, yeah, just generally,
thank goodness for Susan. But
oh, gosh, wasn't that a
wonderful romp through the whole
idea of beginnings and my
reflection sitting here now is
that it's such a rich and varied
subject that we rarely pay that
much attention to and maybe
that's, that's really a that
could be the strapline for this
podcast actually exploring ideas
that we rarely pay a lot of
attention to. And I just hope
that it added some richness for
you as well. And to Susan's
point, I really would love to
hear from you and hear your
thoughts, your reflections. Hear
your challenges. Was there
anything that you know that you
didn't agree with? Was there
anything that you saw Gosh, you
really could have talked about
this. That would be wonderful to
hear, and, and to hear about how
beginnings feel for you are how
endings feel for you. So, my
darlings we are at an end of
this episode. I send you a hug
and a wave