Words of Radiance Part 3 - Brandon Sanderson - Fantasy Book - Progression Fantasy Book

Hey, Adventures, we are still on Roshar, discussing Words of Radiance. In this episode of the Side Quest Podcast, Slava and Jonathan continue to explore the world of The Stormlight Archive by Brandon Sanderson. This is part 3 of 10 of our coverage of the second book in the Stormlight Archives. The discussion highlights the importance of character motivations, internal struggles, and the dynamics between characters, providing insights into the storytelling techniques employed by Sanderson. Enjoy!

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(00:00) Introduction to SideQuest Podcast
(01:13) Deep Dive into Words of Radiance
(02:48) Chapter 22: Lights in the Storm
(16:18) Chapter 23: Assassin
(24:36) Chapter 25: Monsters
(35:08) Chapter 27: Fabrications to Distract
(40:34) The Con Artist's Journey
(45:27) Political Intrigue and Moral Dilemmas
(50:56) Nature's Wonders and Artistic Aspirations
(57:01) The Weight of Choices and Consequences
(01:03:43) Justice vs. Vengeance
(01:11:42) Revelations and Deceptions

Creators and Guests

Host

Jonathan

Host

Slava

Digital Strategist. Co-Host. Aspiring writer of stories.

What is The Side Quest Book Club Podcast?

If you’re a reader looking for something deeper or an indie author working on your book, The Side Quest Book Club is for you. We skip the usual book reviews and ratings. Each episode turns fun side quests into real lessons, so you’ll leave not just entertained, but with a better understanding of why storytelling matters.

Jonathan (00:12.782)
Good afternoon and good night, wherever you're tuning in. We are Slava and Jonathan, bringing you the SideQuest podcast, where we talk about character development, stories, and all things that are world building. And we occasionally take SideQuests, because frankly, that's how conversations work. Just as a reminder, this whole show is spoiler heavy. So sit back, tune in, and join us on this episode of SideQuest.

Jonathan (00:44.866)
Good morning, Slava.

Morning, Jonathan.

Welcome back to Rochard. Find yourself in any high storms lately?

Good to be here.

a few ice storms.

Jonathan (00:56.814)
Strung up, waiting to see if you survive. sorry, wrong book.

Well, strung up and survived.

Aren't you storm-blessed? You wish. Don't let him think otherwise, audience. Put him back in his place.

Yes.

Slava (01:13.646)
Well today good people, we are going to continue our deep dive into Words of Radiance, the second and epic installment in the Brandon Sanderson Stormlight Archive, and we're looking at chapters 22 through 34.

That's right, we enjoyed the first two episodes. And if you guys have any feedback on those, on things you'd like to see differently, we'll tap in more to talk about Shalon. Maybe you missed out on some key Kaladin points, like be sure to leave those in the comments for us as we're going through book two here.

So a quick recap, in the prologue and the first 21 chapters, we witnessed Shalan's arrival to the Shattered Plains. She's grappling with the presumed death of Yasna and her own growing powers. We saw Kaladin's struggles with newfound Windrunner abilities, his, dare I say, complex relationship with the Light Eyes, particularly Dalinar and Amoram, and others of course. And then we observed Dalinar's continued efforts to unite the High Princes.

Mm-hmm.

Slava (02:19.47)
and understand more and more of his cryptic visions. As we approach chapters 22-34, we see this section is pivotal as the narrative threads begin to weave together. I would say in pretty fascinating ways, kind of sets the stage for the more explosive events to come. So I guess grab your spheres, settle in and we'll delve into, we'll delve into,

Mm.

Slava (02:48.888)
some key moments that any discerning Stormlight fan or potential reader should know.

Is, grab onto your spheres of euphemism? It didn't mean to be, it just happened to be? Okay, alright.

Do you want it to be? It just happened to be. The Storm Father decreed it to be a euphemism. Yes.

These words are accepted. Hold on to your spheres. man. Well, chapter 22 starts us off. We're in the Throws of a 10 episode arc here discussing book two. And so we're gonna just dive right in. Chapter 22, Lights in the Storm begins with an epigraph that goes as follows. Storm form is said to cause a tempest of winds and showers.

Beware its power, beware its power. Though its coming brings the gods their night, it obliges a blood red spren. Beware its end, beware its end. In this chapter, as all good chapters that start with an apograph that seems separate from the workings of the chapter, Kaladin is in the middle of a high storm trying to keep his crew trained up and

Jonathan (04:05.706)
make sure that they, right? that? No, I'm thinking of a different chapter. Yeah, because he does the training later. This is where he's reddish glow, shutters.

Yeah, in 22 we see the immediate aftermath of a close call for King Elkar, who nearly fell to his death due to the sabotaged balcony railing. Kaladin's keen eye identifies the cut was made by a shard blade. Kind of narrows down the suspect list.

Right. Right.

Jonathan (04:33.871)
It it does it does

I think this underscores the persistent danger surrounding the Lethe leadership. Because ever since the original king, whose name I always forget, started this peace pact, Gavilar with the Prashendi, the Lethe stronghold on the world becomes a little weaker because then the high princes are in fighting. They're not sure what Gavilar is doing. The Prashendi then kill Gavilar, that starts the war. The war fractures everybody further. Now we think possibly, or at least Calden thinks,

This might be an inside job, even Dalinar sort of agrees. Then it leads to, at least to a bunch of things happening and maybe you can, Expand on those things that it leads to a bunch of events occurring that puts Caldyn in a very precocious place because there is an outside job brewing against Dalinar. Not only Seth Sanvolano, but the Nightbloods have a

have something to do with it and moash happens to be a piece of shit I guess

Yeah, you never commented on that to me when you were reading it. Ghost Bloods, not Nightblood. Close second though. Right. Here's, you know, I don't normally correct you, but in this instance, like the Ghost Bloods, it's, anyway, different characters, different entities. But backing up a minute with this specific chapter, because you covered what's kind of going on from a high view pretty well. This chapter is focused on

Jonathan (06:13.356)
Just like he said, coming off of the assassination attempt of the king, the king is highly neurotic, thinks that the assassin's trying to kill him. When I was reading this for the first time, I was looking at Elikar and I was like, yeah, you hold the seat, but you don't hold the authority that Gavilar held. And the thing is, we don't even get a ton of time with Gavilar, but Gavilar being Dalinar's brother and that, and Dalinar, Gavilar, and Saddias, like conquering the countryside.

Sorry, Alucard, but you don't really have anything to offer. You're not doing anything. You're a dweeb.

He is a dweeb and a major one and At the end of this book jumping ahead just for a second and then this book he kind of admits that he's a dweeb in a week and he wishes he was more like Kaladin which throws Kaladin for a mental loop and he decides, oh, okay, I guess I have to protect the dweeb because he's Doesn't know any better. He's just a weakling

Yeah.

Jonathan (07:11.766)
Yeah, a weird place to be when you don't have the authority, but the person with the authority is looking up to you. It's a weird tension. Anyway, we'll get to that when we get to that. third time's the charm. This chapter focuses on Adolin and Kaladin fighting back and forth. And Adolin's still not really trusting of Kaladin. He's not sure if Kaladin should be trusted to watch the king because he doesn't know him, which, honestly, to Adolin's defense, that's a fair point.

You don't know this person. However, let's rewind a second and like, Kaladin risked his life to save Dalen Ardalen on the plains when they ran back. let's just, let's rewind. It's probably like, I don't know, like a month ago, you know, timeline wise, right? Like where Saddius killed all their men, almost, and Kaladin and his group had the chance to escape. And they said, we have to do the honorable thing and go back.

even if we die, we have to do the honorable thing. And they made a way for Dalinar and Adolin to get out, which they did. And so even though I understand Adolin like, well, I don't know if we can trust this guy, bro, he saved your life. So your dad's life, right, right. So it makes sense, but it doesn't make sense. It's like one of those irrational moments as a human, right? Where you're like,

and your

Jonathan (08:40.147)
I know that I have enough evidence to feel differently about this, but I don't.

Right. And it gives, yeah, absolutely. And it gives both characters an opportunity to view each other and kind of have an arc, a growth arc. Because Calden needs to understand, it's probably going to take him more than this book to realize that, not all light eyes are bad. Because he has this childish view, like, can't take a sharp blade because a sharp blade killed my friends. And we talked about it in the last episode. Right. So I think I mentioned that I was mugged.

and it happened to be a Hispanic male that mugged me and my mom when I was a kid. So now I have to hate all Hispanics? No. Oh, guns kill people, so now I have to give up my hunting rifle because guns are being used for horrible purposes. Inapropriately? Inapropriately. So no, that's not how it works. But I get it. I understand what Kaladin's going through as one who's an observer of this world. And Kaladin, Adolin,

gets to look at dark eyes in a different way too, where yeah, not all dark eyes are what he has perceived them to be, right? They do have honor and they have the same characteristics as light eyes might. With those characteristics that he finds maybe elevates light eyes above the rest, they are found in Kaladin before we see that he has a chance to become light eyes because of the sharp blade, right?

both dudes need some maturing.

Jonathan (10:16.728)
So the only thing I'd push back on a little bit is Adolin's probably the only light eyes who doesn't see dark eyes as secondary citizens. And I say that because we see in book one, The Way of Kings, where Kaladin is supposed to be delivering a message and Adolin protects the prostitute that was being bullied by Sadie's suspend and he gets rid of the guys and then tells Kaladin, hey, here's an emerald, like go tell.

So and so I'm not going to the meeting like I'm going to take care of this woman. So, and the thing is like Adolin is not throwing the thing at Kaladin in a disrespectful way. Kaladin just has a chip on his shoulder the size of a boulder, which is like a great one-liner from this book later in the chapters that I just love. But speaking about that, Kaladin's chip on his shoulder. In this chapter, he also speaks to Dalinar after the high storm is over about

Fair point.

Jonathan (11:16.706)
Well, he speaks about him in private about Amoram's betrayal and how Amoram actually got his Shardblade, which, and I don't think we covered this yet in detail, and maybe it's not the time, but like Kaladin killed Shalan's brother. He was the Shardbearer, right? And Dalinar, being the good general that he is, even though Kaladin isn't like this bristly response, asks for proof about this serious accusation. And Kaladin's like, well, he killed everybody.

And so again, Dalinar owes his life to this man. And we know we are getting to know Dalinar still because his, his point of view is growing in our, the attention we're being given in the book, which is great. But Kaladin chip on his shoulder thinks that Dalinar doesn't believe him. Even though like when you look at it on second, third read to you, you're like, Dalinar doesn't not believe you, but Dalinar knows how the light eyes work.

and he needs proof, right? And so like Dalinar tells Kaladin, I will investigate this. Then we see, this is like another one of those fun tensions. Fun is not the right word. This is one of those relatable tensions where Kaladin is going back and forth with Syl where he's like, you can't trust light eyes and blah, blah, blah to your point, right? And then Syl's like, well, Dalinar has never broken his word to us, right? And he has all the evidence that this should be, he should believe something different.

Again, relatable, we have histories that you just don't get to put down instantly, even though you might like to. So really a captivating chapter of rising tensions between multiple characters and really love that Sanderson's writing, his authorship here has matured to a point where we can get different characters having different tensions with one another and different

moments being shared from characters pasts things like that to give us this very robust and real feeling moment and it feels like a movie. Kaladin dealing with Adolin stuff, Kaladin dealing with Dalinar stuff, Dalinar dealing with the fact that he's looking for more numbers on the wall to know what they mean and his visions, King wondering if he's gonna die and each character and I've brought this up before, you we know for the most part what these characters want.

Jonathan (13:43.616)
Maybe not in detail and like those things shift as well. But like we know that Alucard wants to not die. He wants his, not grandfather, he wants his uncle to believe him that he's trying to be assassinated. He wants to survive and to theoretically he wants to be a good king. Dalinar wants to know what these visions mean. Like we know what these characters want. That's a really important and distinct thing.

that good storytelling shares with us, even if it's a red herring at some point, like in some books, and I feel like King does this a little bit in some of the stuff we've read where there's a red herring of like what we believe the character wants, and then what we find out later what the character actually wanted are not necessarily the same things. So anyway, chapter 22, a really nice punchy, no, it's not nice, a really punchy chapter.

Is it fun? It's a fun chapter. So I listened to a podcast, this is a long time ago, maybe two years ago, which is a long time ago in our world. And it was the actor that played Zach on Saved by the Bell, and I think one of the writers, and they did a episode by episode recap. So they would watch the episode, and then each podcast episode was discussing their experiences during that time. And what happens in behind the scenes stuff,

And they got so much flack because both of them kept using fun to describe. that was fun. Remember when you know, the actor who played so and so did this behind the scenes and it made everybody laugh. And then the director was, you know, crying, laughing and spitting water everywhere. Whatever. This is fun. And that was fun. This is fun. And then there were reviews and comments made about guys. Was everything that fun? So then they started purposefully putting in the word fun. I even have.

This just shows you how stupid my humor is. I went to rate the podcast and I said, fun. This is a fun podcast.

Jonathan (15:48.152)
Of course, of course.

So you're not the only one. There are seasoned actors and writers from Hollywood who can't avoid using the word fun when describing something.

Yeah, we just, you know, we get back into our vernacular, our language rhythms. You know, we've talked about this a dozen times as we listen to the edits and it's like, man, I really want to stop using this set of four words. Yeah, yeah.

fun, interesting.

Anyway. Anyway.

Slava (16:18.936)
Well, do you love books, audience? Do you love this podcast? Don't forget to subscribe and review so you never miss an episode.

So chapter 23, where are we at here, Slava?

We are in the chapter named Assassin. Kaladin's still grappling with his new responsibility. He's given this chance to move up in the world and he has an ability now, he has the chance to do what he's called to do, to help others, to protect others, to live with honor. And he does so as best he can, but internally he's still

struggling and he has this calling within himself that he self identifies as the need to help others the need to protect others this is where we get more and more of his internal struggles because he's guarding a king in a war camp that's right with political intrigue and Calvin's dedication to duty even towards someone he doesn't respect

kind of gets more play. And this has been a thing throughout the story. And we see this because, as you said before we started recording, 22 kind of bleeds into 23. We have Kaladin's point of view in his little internal battle that he has.

Jonathan (17:55.574)
always fighting even if he's not on the battlefield

Always. Yes. Yes, exactly.

Yeah, Kaladin pulls Dalinar aside, tells him about the Shardblade like you mentioned earlier, and they speak about that it's an inside job. And then Dalinar, again, good general, says, okay, effective immediately, you're only watching Elokar. That's it. And then to your point, Kaladin struggles with Elokar's lack of decorum, right? Where the king's not properly displaying composure and he's whiny. Kaladin decides, you know what, I just can't deal with the whineness. I need to just do my job.

Instead of judging him, I'm just going to guard him and call it a day, which is mature for the four minutes that that lasts.

Yeah, right.

Jonathan (18:39.884)
Because LLKR opens his flippin' mouth again. Uncle, no one's protecting me, uncle. The assassin's going to come back and kill me,

He's such a whiny sniveler. Gus.

Here's the thing though. You know how much I whiny characters? I don't hate Alucard. I get it. Like his dad did this incredible thing as a warlord and he has to live in that shadow and his insecurities are the thing. Like, and I don't understand the difference here between like this type of whiny and another type of whiny. And maybe simply the difference is that the characters around him feel fuller. Like it's possible that it's that simple.

It might be also because he's written well. So when you have a bad guy, a good guy, a sniveler, a weakling, all of things, when they are written well, and this harkens back to our conversation and Warbreaker, because the women were written so well in Warbreaker, and we went back and forth about Sanderson's ability to write women. And then you mentioned a Reddit user who happened to be a woman who said, yeah,

Maybe, that's fair, he does write women well, but that's because he writes people first of all well. He writes really good characters, well rounded, to use your term characters. So when you come to the king here, who's a little bit of a dweeb, Alucard is written well. And so you can say like, yeah, he's an annoying little dweeb, but the events are written well and the characters and their reactions to those events are well crafted.

Jonathan (20:17.208)
I would say to your point, like their reactions, like touching on that for a second, sitting here, you can tell that Sanderson took the time to allow his characters to have reactions to moments. Fine-toothed combed, okay, how would Kaladin respond to this? Da-da-da-da, okay, how would Adolin respond to that response? And like really gave them the time instead of dictating and giving a prescriptive like this happened, then this happened. Like every storyteller when you first start writing, you know.

And we've talked about this about our own writing where it's like, my writing sucks. Cause you're just reading it and you're like, boom, plot point one, boom, plot point two, boom, plot point three. And then you read it you're like, wow, actually this is garbage. But when you find that nuance of allowing characters to respond as they would respond in a believable way, that's when good writing comes out. Even if they're a sniffler, even if they're a dwee.

Now this goes into Shallan's journey too. In 24, 25 we see Shallan's POV. In 24 she's with 10. 10 is manipulative and 10 thinks that Shallan is a...

And as the caravan approaches the war camps, it's evident, evident, it's hinted at, then it turns out to be true that Shallan's journey and her objective ultimately to get to the plains and to explain to the King and Jasna's mother and Dalinar, me, the void bringers are coming. That objective is multifaceted, right? It's not just, hey, I'm going to go to the war camps till

tell what Jasna told me and then we're gonna go and try to stop the void bringers or whatever. She is immersed with Tin, then she kills Tin, then she gets pulled in with the ghost bloods, then she finds Adalyn more attractive than she imagined, then she gets pushback from Jasna's mother, or not a pushback, but like a wall. She runs into a wall with Jasna's mother because her mother is grieving Jasna. Then there's Dalinar and his objectives and his efforts to

Slava (22:34.19)
pulled together the high princes into a cohesive unified front. So what Shalon finds herself in is a little bit messy, a lot of bit messy and her reactions given what we learn in 25. Now we delve into Shalon's internal world as she continues her journey with Tin. There's this growing sense of unease and then, you know, we get this flicker of doubt in Shalon regarding her mission and her alliance with Tin and she keeps going back and forth.

So all those reactions, this is just me in a long form way agreeing with what you just said. When we see Shallan interacting with these people later on, and right now we're with Tin and she's contemplating how those interactions will be and what she will say and how it will look like. And then we get a little bit of her backstory and flashbacks. We can believe that a girl who went through the stuff that Shallan went through would have the reactions that she has.

Now, maybe we can say, well, if I was Shalon, this and this and I would do this. Maybe you're probably right. You know, maybe half the time you're right, you would do that because you know yourself, but Shalon is a believable character. Just like Alucard and the rest of them, their reactions to their immediate surroundings is believable, relatable in some cases. Yeah. Like for me, relatable. That's why Ciri, Shalon, the two main characters in Brandon Sanders's world that I found myself attached to throughout the story.

And I can relate to them because the way these two women respond to their surroundings with humor for Siri and Shallan's kind of resolve despite her internally maybe falling apart.

She also uses humor and quippy responses. Very sarcastic. Very s-

Slava (24:20.814)
So, well-written characters is what makes a good story. If it makes sense for a person to do this, whether or not we agree with the response, that's why we can enjoy the character, even if he's a sniveler.

Mm-hmm, exactly. Well, continuing down this trail, let's trot along. Chapter 25, although titled Monsters, actually might be referring to the horses that Dalinar tells Kaladin and Bridgeford to start learning how to ride.

Their complete mind boggled response to the horses was very fun to read.

You're joking about the word fun earlier, but like this actually was a fun chapter where we see the contrast of of light eyes to dark eyes in terms of culture and familiarity with different, you know, tools, if you will, if you can call a horse a tool. But we also have Moash coming to Kaladin and going like, you can't trust Dalinar, but like we really should learn to use these horses. I just want to stop on Moash a second. And you didn't mention anything about him throughout this journey.

I didn't, but I had thoughts about him and I found him, well he was revealed to me, let me put it this way, he was revealed to me to be a bit of a piece of crap. Now again, his responses and being angry and his parents dying the way they died. All that is understandable, right?

Jonathan (25:54.06)
Yeah, yeah.

but he's a bit of a slimeball. A bit? In some sense.

There's a whole subreddit called Fmoash.

Okay.

You don't say that about a bit of a slimeball. You know who's a bit of a slimeball? Gaz. Gaz was bit of a slimeball. Moash, different story.

Slava (26:18.958)
his loyalty is a facade. What emerges is hatred and arrogance hiding under his good soldier act. I mean this is kind of crucial to the story because it sets the stage for his subsequent actions which are driven by a profound personal vendetta. That is it. He is set on killing the guy who he thinks is ultimately

Mm-hmm.

Slava (26:47.8)
the starting point of what happens to his parents. He believes King Alucar was responsible or grandparents, excuse me, grandparents, responsible for the death of his grandparents. And this becomes the primary lens, which he views the Alethi, light eyes. It fuels his desire for retribution. He is overtaken by it and no amount of pleading or reason from Kaladin.

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Slava (27:18.38)
seems to dissuade him as we will find out later.

Yeah, entirely justified in his own actions. And to your point, and I don't think you understand this yet, but like Moash becomes a bigger chess piece than you understand right now. And this is like the starting point of that.

Yeah, that makes sense because if I'm putting on my writer's hat or pretending to be a writer, Brandon Sanderson needs to set up this chess piece. What better way to set it up than this chess being part of bridge four, somebody that Caledon considers a trust. The douche piece. is.

Friend. be. Right.

What makes this so agitating? Because, well, I know you and I have stories of betrayal in our history, but guys, if you've never been betrayed by a friend, man, it is a different type of pain. You know? Ugh.

Slava (27:59.886)
Hmm.

Slava (28:16.896)
Even when Moash inquires about Amoram and then coupled the satisfaction that he has of learning Kaladin's history, negative history with the man that underscores again his sentiment, but also kind of the douchiness. Like now this he thinks, I have another notch on my side where I can use this, this thing that happened to Kaladin and Kaladin's

Mm-hmm.

Slava (28:46.316)
maybe hatred for Amoram, maybe hatred for the established Alethi system. Now I can get Kalan on my side and we'll both kill the king. And I have an inside man. That just shows how conniving Moash really is.

Right, and again, we know what the character wants.

Yeah, and he admits he was the one that tampered with the king's balcony.

Well, we're not there yet, but yes, yep.

Well, we're talking in chunks, right?

Jonathan (29:14.668)
Right now we're just learning how to ride horses, Slava.

Well, soon we're going to be cutting balcony stresses, that's a thing.

Yeah, so for some of us it is. But bringing it back real quick and then you can bring us into chapter 26. We see some more tension between Adolin and Kaladin where Adolin berates and cajoles Kaladin into riding the most difficult horse. Kaladin's like, I can do that. And then, know, straps himself to the seat with Stormlight and the horse is trying to buck him off. And then, you know, some other people need to step in and be like, Hey, knock it off you two. The reason they have to ride horses, which we didn't mention earlier is Dalinar wants Kaladin and

the troops to go patrol the outside of the camps. Can't do that on foot, you're not gonna get back in time. Need to always be available in case something happens because tensions are rising both in the light eyes political landscape as well as the parshendi and the void bringers and internally, like there's boilings and boilings all around. Things are heating up.

Maybe that could be an interlude or a short novella. Caledon the horse. It's just them having fun adventures in the outskirts of the Shattered Plains.

Jonathan (30:26.516)
It'll actually, it'll just be one of the parables that Hoyt tells Kaladin about the horses. That's what it'll be. Love it. The Kaladin and his horse instead of the horse and his boy.

The horse and his gal and his horse. That works. That works. So we're moving into chapter 26. We have Adolin and Yakimov leading in a charge against the Prashendi. They capture a gem heart on a pyramid shaped plateau. Yakimov mentions that Adolin isn't supposed to be there and observes the Dalinar is trying to increase cooperation between the high princes. Yakimov is kind of a funny character because he kind of understands maybe deep down even

sides of Dahlnur, but the machinations and political nature of the war camp, he's playing his hand this way.

Yeah, all the light eyes and high princes want to make the best bet based on the rising tide that's all around them. However, they're all in it for themselves, just like Yakimov here, like, you're not supposed to come out here, this is for me. And Dalinar's trying to make changes to like, no, we need to be united. Cause that voice keeps coming to him going, unite them. Which we don't know what that means.

And Adolin and Yakimov reach the Crystallis, but they're too late. Eshenai has already retrieved the gem heart and gave it to another Prashendi who escapes with it. Eshenai and Alden talk. She wants to parlay, to talk with Dalinar. Adolin agrees to tell Dalinar and Eshenai says that a messenger will be sent. So here we have a nice setup for what's going to happen in a few chapters. I find Eshenai fairly compelling.

Slava (32:11.81)
Character something about her that stands out from the other Perschendi and maybe this is on purpose where we now get to Look at her POV in a completely different way because before this all we know about the Perschendi is The prologue to this book and what we hear about them through the eyes of the light eyes No pun intended here. We have somebody also as dedicated as the king was as dedicated as Dalinar is

We have somebody on the other side who is dedicated to whatever it is that they think their duty is. You're being pulled along, so you have these two streams of, not thought, but you have these two stories unfolding. the POVs, you get a little bit of the Parchendi POV, the Alethi POV, and here is where the Parchendi and the Alethi will talk again after what, six years of war? Right. There's going to be finally a face-to-face

conversation not just fighting and killing each other. They're going to try to figure it out. Now what that looks like will be a little bit different than what you think if you're a first time reader is happening here, but a pretty good setup, I think.

Yeah. One thing I didn't hear you talk about is the brother-to-brother moment that Adolin and Runaan have where, you know, they're going out on the field and Runaan wanted to come. Adolin tries to protect him by having the guard watch over him and keep him in the back. And then one of the guards comes up to Adolin and is like, he had one of his episodes, sir. And then Adolin tries to kind of smooth it over and talk with his brother a bit. But Runaan is like, I didn't have an episode. I read it as frustration, honestly, a little bit.

and Renarin says it was just fear. Adolin notices that Renarin's not wearing his glasses that he very normally wears. It ends, that moment is like both touching and curious because Renarin ends his conversation kind of cryptically where he's like, we need to be prepared for the coming storm. And it's like, that's a little ominous, but okay, fair enough, bro. But I really like the, this is, in this book,

Jonathan (34:24.214)
we get to see the most brother to brother moments that Renarin and Adolin have for a while, because they're both characters that we haven't gotten a lot of time with yet, because this is only book two, but these moments should be enjoyed based on things that will come. Let's say that one. Based on things that will come.

Is one of dying?

So item's done. Great.

Based on things that will come.

Why do you have to kill Renarren? You

Jonathan (34:49.55)
As a good author, you know that you wouldn't kill the one that you don't get a lot of time with. That doesn't mean anything to the audience. Anyway, next we go back to your girl, Shalon, sitting in the garden, sketching, listening to the internal storm that is happening in her house with the yelling.

Fabrications to distract. Chapter 27, Fabrications to distract. So we see Shalan, she's sitting in the gardens of her estate sketching to escape. She longs to stay out there where people do not scream at each other and where there is peace. Unfortunately, it's a fake peace. To quote Coppermind, cultivated like the garden itself. And this is something that Shalan and her brothers constantly struggle with.

They live in a constant state of fear, just like the servants. So the servants get more beatings and more anger, you know, thrust upon them by the father. As she's sketching, she hears shouts from a nearby manor and she immediately tenses up and ruins the sketch she's working on. At this moment, she thinks of her brother, Hilaron, who brings her the fine sketching paper. His returns home are unpredictable and short.

Yeah.

Slava (36:06.07)
No one knows where he goes when he leaves or he comes back. And as she's staring at this piece of paper, she loses track of time. Then eventually notices that the sky has darkened. So she was in a comatose state almost, but Shallan packs up her things and heads inside. Of course, her dad is throwing his feasts, one of his feasts. And it's right around the time for tonight's feast. She turns up the stairs to get ready.

there should be a new dress for her to wear and she suspects her father does not like that she's began speaking again. And as readers we kind of know that's probably because she knows who really killed her mother. Her mind goes blank again. Like she's in a state of like constant trauma during this day that we get a little glimpse of. Sure.

Mm-hmm.

Jonathan (36:57.934)
Understandably so sucks, but understandably so

Yeah. We find her. Well, we find her. Her brother, Jushu, finds her on the stairs staring at a wall and Jushu's jacket is undone in a skew and his cheeks are flush with wine. He has no cufflinks or belt, having gambled them away. When asked Jushu tells Shalan that he heard the yelling, Balot, of pulling animals apart fame, has begun starting fires again.

and has nearly burnt down the servant's building because. Why wouldn't you? Jushu says that he is the only one left in the family with any sense, which is a funny thing to say, but okay. They pass their father's quarters is being tidied up with an open door. And this gives a lot of chance to see the far wall. So as she stumbles, she sees through a painting.

you.

Slava (37:59.374)
She can see an outline of a strong box, it's glowing, there's a blazing fire. Juju asks her what is she staring at? And when she tells him, he thinks that she's crazy. Very non-standard family. Shallan continues to stare at light, thinking a monster hides there. And here's an interesting thing, thinking that her mother's soul hides there.

Yeah, this is something I wanted to ask you about. What do you think this moment is about with Shalon? I mean, it's wrapped in the package of living out her childhood trauma, play by play, right? But is it just her trauma that she's seeing things and she's blanking out? Is she seeing something that's really there and her brother can't? Is she just making stuff up?

I don't think she's making stuff up. When I first read this, it...

Liar! Okay.

Moving on. Anyway. The first time I read this, I thought of what happened to Jasna in the prologue where she was pulled into Shadesmar. So I was thinking this has to be her perceiving something outside the immediate realm. I didn't give it more thought than that. I just thought it was, that's interesting. And move right on to chapter 28. That's how I remember it.

Slava (39:25.528)
But if you have something for me in the audience that will help us understand Chillon's visions, vision here, lay it on us.

I'll tell you a couple of things. There's always another secret and this book, there was actually, what is it called? Community consensus using the clues that are spelled out in this book and the next book about some of Shalon's past and that is these fugue states and like gaps that end up being proven in book five. So we have, I'm calling it enough facts.

to make conclusions is not the right phrase. We have enough facts to make conjectures and some of those conjectures end up being true. Not in the fact that we're in book, you know, two chapter 20, whatever, 27 something. We don't have enough facts right now, but like pay attention to Shalon's story and you will be able to potentially make out what is coming. Tell you that much.

That is as clear as cheldung, but thank you.

Mm-hmm, mm-hmm, mm-hmm, mm-hmm. Yep.

Slava (40:34.039)
Speaking of chills.

I was gonna say, we stay on Chalon. It's a good segue. Keep going there.

Yeah, and speaking of Shalon and Tin are on a cello wagon and Tin is

Is Shaw Wagon? That should be an insult.

Tin guides the Chell wagon, she's driving it, and is giving friendly advice to Shalan on being a con artist. Tin explains how carefree she is and how fleeting personal belongings and missions are to her, and that most of her missions ended without a positive resolution. But Shalan senses that there's more tension, more to what Tin is saying to her. And the caravan encounters four uniformed horse riders.

Slava (41:18.592)
One of them is Callan doing a patrol. He's learned how to not get bucked by a horse, I guess. Tint speaks to the writers and proclaims Chalon to be a horn eater princess. And Chalon sort of attempts to play the role.

Yes, attempts is a fine way to say it.

Calden asks if they've seen any bandits and Tin replies that they had and ask why he cares. Calden tells her they represent the Lethe King and need to patrol the area to clear it of bandits and keeps pressing them for more details on the attack. Then Cal comments is funny on Chalon looks too thin to be a horn eater and she acts offended and demands Cal's boots and compensation which comes back up later and yes made me chuckle because they are

both events. Yes.

as you call it fun. He gives them up reluctantly because you know, because he's

Jonathan (42:09.72)
Well, and he's a soldier and he literally needs them to fight the battles that are coming. But he also doesn't want to offend a horned apprentice if she's a horned apprentice and he represents the king.

Whatever.

Slava (42:21.07)
I would have kept my boots, but whatever. But after this encounter, we have Tin complimenting Shalon on her impressions and then criticizing her for being overly empathetic. Because that is not a good quality for a con artist. You shouldn't be empathetic.

But this is like a real moment of hope for Shalan because she's finally at the Shattered Plains. She's close enough to be reaching the patrols that Kal's on. And so our stories are intersecting. Shalan's been on this long journey from the beginning of the book of trying to get to the Shattered Plains. Jasna dies. And let me remind you, Slava, Jasna's dead. Now she's not. She got through the Frostlands, survived some bandits, and is trying to learn her powers. Can't tell anyone about her powers. Very big struggles.

for Shalon, but now we've consolidated the character arcs to be in the same geographic location. We'll still get very separate stories, but at least we know kind of what's going on and our attention doesn't need to be split anymore. Shalon gets to finally meet her betrothed.

She does. And I think the interaction, I'm going to back up. I agree with everything you're saying. I'm going to back up for one second. Something I wanted to mention, but failed because I skimmed my notes as I was describing the plot of 28. I think everything that happens here for Shalon, it speaks volumes about her quick thinking and ability to adapt in situations. Another reason why I like Shalon so much, despite her being scared and afraid and

carrying all this baggage and trauma, when forced to react or forced to adapt, she does so and does so well. With Tin, with Cal, then here with the Boots, with the Ghost Bloods, with Adaline, every event that happens to her, this book shows her ability to adapt quickly to difficult, unexpected situations. And I think, and I'm right because this happens later in the book, this is a subtle hint that

Slava (44:23.246)
Brandesons puts in the book at a future connection between these characters who operate in different ways and in different spheres. She is royalty for all intents and purposes. Kaladin's still a soldier no matter how high up the chain he's been lifted by Dalinar. and finally, Yes, that's a life. I'm just saying.

I'm just glaring at him, audience.

Yeah, the, she was killed in the beginning of the book, I had a sprint attached to me. Yeah. I was like, what the bloody hell just happened?

And I responded to Slava, Sanderson being a good author will kill characters that he's gotten to know and that he likes, which is

I would have been less upset if Calvin was killed. I'm just telling you.

Jonathan (45:07.406)
Well that's rude. I'm gonna go find a new co-host. Alright. That's rude.

Maybe you and Matt can take over the podcast.

Maybe we can. He's got to read these books first, maybe we can. Be sure to drop us a rating and help us spread the word if you're enjoying today's side quest. Chapter 29.

What do we have next? We have chapter 29.

Sadius and Amoram. And Amoram has this distorted sense of justice and honor where he's trying to get Alucar and Sadius to have peace with Dalinar and Sadius is purposefully throwing wrenches in Dalinar's plans, you know, going out when he's not supposed to on the plateau runs to get the gem hearts.

Jonathan (45:54.41)
Amoram acknowledges that there's a bigger picture, but asks Saddius if he ever worries about the cost of war. Saddius has come back from one of these long battles and he's kind of reveling in the thrill as well, but he's noticing that it's not as sweet as it used to be when he was younger. And there's a pointlessness to the fighting that's going on. And this is all happening kind of like at the dueling arena and Avalyn is currently in a duel with Araniv.

I don't know how to it.

What I found funny is, funny is the wrong word, but yes, it was fun and funny, humorous and entertaining. thank you. That saddias tells Amaram that a realistic viewpoint is necessary to achieve anything in life. He thinks that his view is realistic.

Did you find it fun?

Jonathan (46:33.858)
Please go on.

Jonathan (46:44.706)
Well, and Barat thinks that he's the best, the most sane child or whatever it was, pulling small arms off creatures. Sorry, continue.

And as Saddias sits there in the dueling arena, he contemplates that his fashionable clothes are very uncomfortable. And he wishes he could wear a simple uniform like Dalinar if that didn't send the wrong message. And this is just how I'm manipulative and dirty Saddias is too. It's this, I'm realistic. That's why I'm a piece of crap and I'm.

I do the things I do because I'm a realist where he's just utilitarian and a pragmatist in the worst sense of those words. But then there's this thing where he's like, he wishes he could be like Dalinar, but he goes, but that'd be the wrong message. Okay, buddy.

Right. Yeah, well, and honestly, I don't think we get enough of the struggle. And maybe it's not a struggle. Maybe that's exactly the reason. But like, Sadius, Dalinar, and Gavilar were all like best friends. They were blood brothers, literally. Because they slaughtered the countryside and spilled a lot of blood. We don't see Sadius struggle with the issues that Dalinar does. We see him...

Literally.

Jonathan (48:03.266)
going like you have crumbled and you're frail and you're old age and to Dalinar. He tells his wife, Ele, that he wants to expose Dalinar as a hypocrite. Yeah. Come from Sadia's. Yeah, because Dalinar didn't include Sadia's in the investigation and he should have because he's a high prince of information. And so he's just going to denounce the title to protest and harm Dalinar's strategy.

Very rich.

Jonathan (48:32.534)
This feels relatable because sometimes people act in our lives where they do something and they're like, it really feels like you're just doing this to spite me.

Yeah, well, Sadius ponders the assassination on Elikar. They debate the ramifications of it, him and his wife, and Sadius goes, huh, maybe Elikar must die because he's the realest, right? At the same time, as he's going, man, I wish it could be like Dalinar. It'll be easier. Dalinar must be dealt with so we can wipe the slate clean.

Of course, yes.

Jonathan (49:08.29)
Yeah, what's that phrase, imitation is the best form of flattery or something like that? And it's just like, yeah, Saddius wishes that he could be half the man that Dalinar is becoming. But the thing is, like, Saddius also knew Dalinar in a very dark time in his life. You haven't really gotten into book three yet, so I'm going to leave it there. like, Dalinar's name on the battlefield is the Blackthorn, and it's not for no reason.

Yeah, that's exactly it,

Jonathan (49:37.698)
I'll tell you

So all we get a little bit of in this book where there's a memory that we get to view or a moment in Dalinor's early life before he meets his wife where he's just slaughtering this town, right? This kingdom.

That's child's play compared to what you find out in book three.

Okay, excellent.

That's like a child playing in a sandbox.

Slava (50:02.968)
Well, good on Dallinor. Blackthorn.

Yeah. Anyway, they're watching the, the duel happening, and the duel meaning Adolin's duel to gather the high princes by punishing them through dueling, which he was not allowed to do previously because Dalinar wouldn't let him, but Saddias can tell Adolin is very skilled as a duelist and he's toying with him. So Saddias knows that he's not going to be goaded into a duel himself.

Tying with his opponent.

Slava (50:31.65)
Yeah, but being the pragmatist and planning strategist, planning genius strategist that he is, Sadius tells his wife, we're going to stop interfering with Adolin's dueling aspirations, and we're going to take advantage of Adolin's hotheadedness.

Right. Be sure to drop us a rating and help us spread the word if you're enjoying today's sidequest.

Moving into chapter 30, nature blushing. We have an excited Shalon and she's excited because she sees a small naturally occurring ecosystem of plants, animals that is protected by a rock overhang. And she has their carolyn diverted to investigate it as a good, what would you call a Shalon? She is a learner because she wants to absorb the world. She has this.

She wants to be a scholar. or whatever you will.

There you go. it is. Call it. And an ape desire to be a scholar, probably spurred on by the still alive Yasna. Shalon settles down to draw sketches of the garden and she's joined by your favorite character, Gaz. Who requests, yeah, who requested she draw him? I thought you'd like Gaz. You seem like a guy that'd like Gaz.

Jonathan (51:40.118)
My favorite character, Kuriru.

Jonathan (51:47.36)
Yeah. Do you want to expand on that?

I'm just gonna leave it hanging. But anyway, stupid jokes aside, Shalan draws a quick picture of Gaz with some slight modifications from reality to make Gaz appear a little bit more impressive than Gaz really is. Gaz kind of likes it. He's very appreciative. Vatha comes up, tells Shalan they're stopping for the night and Padden tells her that there will be trouble. Shalan seems to agree. She continues drawing a bunch of sketches of the thicket, then draws whatever floats to her mind.

including a rocky shore with some figures which one reminds her of Yalb and a woman taking a hammer and chisel to a statue. And Chilana is confused and does not know why she drew this last picture. Is this the same way she saw the flaming box in her dad's study?

This is different. So there's a concept in the Cosmere called Fortune. This is not exactly that, but this is a good enough moment enough to mention it. It's one of those like principles of the Cosmere that we don't have strong details about, which is why I want to mention it. At some point, a character will ask Shalon in the series, have you always tapped in to Fortune or has the, you know, is Fortune something that comes naturally to you? Because Fortune is not something that is available for everyone.

or that that fortune is not something that everyone can tap into. We don't even know why, the reasons. Fortune is a spiritual property in the Cosmere related to luck and seeing the future or versions of the future, which is why when Cholan is drawing people, it's always the best version of themselves.

Slava (53:23.444)
So could this be some sort of subconscious prophetic ability that Shalaa has?

Yeah, that's probably the best way to call it because sometimes it's luck is not the right word, but like it's described as luck if that makes sense for like less Cosmere aware entities and groups.

Okay, this luck thing has anything to do with Mistborn?

Well, this is the Cosmere, so yes, there's definitely overlaps. Gold, I think, if I remember correctly, is the closest thing to fortune in terms of Mistborn, but it's not the same thing. And I'm not trying to talk around nonsensically, it's just we don't have all the information. Nobody really knows all the details.

Okay, another question for you then. This sketch of a woman chiseling the statue, are there any connections to Shalash, the one who's destroying images of herself?

Jonathan (54:20.174)
Probably, I guess I'm gonna be transparent here. Of all the storylines about the woman destroying the paintings of herself, so she's a herald, because in every book we get viewpoints of the heralds, but hers until the third read through didn't make sense to me. I'm not really an expert on that one. So don't understand the connection there.

Well, I guess what we have here is both our lack of understanding and Shallan's lack of understanding of this ability. The only thing we're left with is there's a second, third, maybe fourth, there's a dimension to her artistic intuition that we're just not pretty to yet. And herself included.

Yeah, and that's part of the enjoyment of this journey before Destination is going along with the characters and them having to figure it out too. And you being able to be there for like, you have a little more information than them because you get to jump point of views, but it's still limited in some senses, right? That's part of the enjoyment of reading these books. And we talked about this, I believe last time or the time before where it's also the third person limited, not third person omniscient perspective as well. Well.

We have Tim telling Shalon that her artistic talent should really focus on forgery instead of drawing because it aligns more directly with the real life of a criminal. And Tim's point of view from her perspective offers a practical skill that Shalon can utilize and not draw attention or get into trouble. And she acknowledges Shalon's artistic talent, but ultimately sees forgery is more applicable and safer for somebody.

Intending to engage in what she thinks Shalon is doing, illicit activities. She also claims Shalon needs a dose of realism to be ready for this life of a criminal that she thinks Shalon really is, and is practicing. Tin asks Shalon if she wants to back out of their criminal enterprise, but Shalon says she's committed and that her planned scam is to impersonate the betrothed of

Slava (56:33.28)
Adeline Colin. Tin gives Shalon some advice on carrying out her love scam. And as they talk, Shalon worries about the state of the betrothal, even though it is secondary for her research. And she also contemplates on what to do with Tin when the fake scam falls through. Scam within the scam. Deception within deception. But she's also excited because she's Shalon. She's funny.

the within the scam. The Incepta scam.

Yes.

Jonathan (57:01.902)
True. And in this chapter, we also get, well, sorry, I'm jumping ahead. It bleeds into the next chapter where Tin is watching Shalon practice sleight of hand stuff, continuing to inquire about her accents and her lectures and her ability to over get her prudiness because Shalon comes from a backwater town that is very prim and proper, not if you cut out all of the trauma. But in the same chapter, the stillness before chapter 31, Kaladin is like quickly devouring his

so that can go protect Dalinar and Rock chases off some guy who was trying to sketch the Bridgeman. You think that's relevant for the coming tales?

would say so. That's not thrown in there haphazardly. It's not just some guy happens to be drawing something and unrelated to everything in the story. So yeah, that's related to something. All right. Do we know who he is?

Not that I remember, honestly. But another keynote that happens in 31 is that Pitt, who's from Bridge 17, apologizes to Kaladin in Bridge 4 because he admits like, hey, I was actually real happy when you guys went on hunts when we were Bridgemen. And he apologizes, which is, it's kind of a nice moment. It's endearing. It's appreciative. But the thing is like, if you were in Bridge 17, you'd also appreciate that someone else went, right?

All right, I'm not the guy on the dock right now having to deal with whatever. So I get it. Does it make it right? No, but I get it. And then the final thing in this chapter is that Tin tells Solange she's gonna get more information that evening via a span read of everything that's going on because Tin shares that the Vaden King's dead, the Six High Princes are dead, all by Zeth, son, son, Villano, and they've reached the outside of the war camp. So they're finally moments away.

Jonathan (58:52.11)
from Shalon meeting Herbert Rother and being in the war camp and being able to report about Yasna's research and discoveries.

And this brings us to a long chapter, chapter 32, the one who hates. Kaladin is asleep during a high storm and dreams he is the storm and speaks to Stormfather about Sil. The Stormfather predicts that Kaladin will betray and kill Sil and that he is already beginning to do so. As they speak, a second larger storm with red lightning appears and the Stormfather says he is sorry and tells Kaladin that he comes.

Kalina wakes up as Adolin and Renarin are discussing the upcoming meeting of the Prescendi. Kaladin goes to a balcony to check the weather, but only sees the diminishing of the winds as the high storm passes. And we quickly get a view of Pattern who is whimpering, Sil tells Kaladin something is wrong and the one who hates is coming and that something bad is going to happen.

So who do you think the one who hates is?

goodness, I know his name. It's,

Jonathan (59:59.298)
Well, when you were first reading it,

this is the guy I was thinking about. What's the guy's name? The one who is coming. He's bringing the desolation.

That guy. That's what I think it is.

Yeah. Yep. Okay. Cool.

Kaladin explains that his instincts sends danger to Dalinar, and Dalinar agrees and tells him to trust his senses and leave the palace despite Alucard's descent. And Alucard's always descending on something. Kaladin sends Beld and Haber to scout their way and leaves Moash and Rellinar to guard the rear with Mart and Eth. They have to stay with the king.

Jonathan (01:00:29.186)
Yes

Slava (01:00:42.56)
As they flee to the palace, they find a dark hallway where the spheres were drained and a hole cut in the palace wall right through the rock. And our boy Seth appears with stormlight leaking from his body.

It's just such a visceral scene, like the hallway is dark and then you see the shadow, the outline of a man walking down the hallway glowing blue.

Yeah, Dalinar orders Runaaren to take the king and flee. Dalinar, Adolin and Catelyn stay to fight Zeth. Such a good fight scene. Yeah, Dalinar and Kaladin are armed with spears and Adolin with a shard blade. The three rush Zeth, but he loots them by using lashing. He binds Adolin to the ceiling and Kaladin and Dalinar both stab Zeth with their spears, but he chops their weapons in half with his blade.

It's very good.

Slava (01:01:35.042)
and smacks down Dalinar as he heals using Stormlight. Adolin falls to the ground and the lashing runs out and he stays down. Kaladin uses his spear like a quarterstaff and with Syl flying around him attacks Zeth. He hits him a few times and forces him to draw more Stormlight. Zeth, because he's a worthy assassin, is able to dodge, strike and stab Galadin through his arm with a sharp blade, causing it to go numb and lifeless. This was a very

was intense. Kaladin is kicked into a wall and slumps in frustration as Seth goes down to chase his prey. Sil tells Kaladin that Zeth is not a radiant but something worse and pleads for Kaladin to get up. Dalinar confronts Seth and says he won't let the king die but Zeth says he's here to kill Dalinar instead.

scene here.

Jonathan (01:02:27.842)
This is an eye-opener for us because we are in the same belief system as the king that Zeth wants to kill the king. But Zeth is here to kill Dalinar, which is like, whoa, okay, that's not good.

Yeah, but I think we know. Somewhere I picked up that Zeth is there to kill Dullanar. This wasn't a surprise to me. There's a conversation somewhere.

Yeah, Zeth is given orders to kill Delanar earlier. But it's still shocking to see it happen.

And then we see Seth swing from above his head for a killing blow. But Dalinor catches the sharp blade between his palms and Kalan arrives and knocks both him, self and Seth through the hole into the open air. the chapter ends. Thanks for stealing the joke.

on a cliffhanger.

Jonathan (01:03:13.74)
Well, it's not really a cliffhanger. A wallhanger. Also not true. But as we're wrapping up here, we got two more chapters. Something we haven't done yet in this episode is any side quests. So I want to know if you're a monster Slava. At what point does the pursuit of justice turn into a thing like hate? Kaladin's inner struggle and Zeth's moral dilemmas reflect our questions about vengeance and justice in the real world.

So are you a monster? What is the line with justice and, not betrayal, justice and vengeance?

That's a good question. I don't think I'm a monster, but...

The people you've harmed would say otherwise you're a villain in their story.

Well, everybody's a villain in somebody's story. We've all done things that are unkind to other people, whether we knew it or not. Sometimes we just act like D bags because we're immature, unknowing, young and ignorant. We're all a villain in somebody's story, but maybe I can answer your question with a example or a story. Like the American justice system, there are parts of it that are on their head, right? They're, they're inverted.

Jonathan (01:04:02.465)
I'm not.

Jonathan (01:04:13.061)
Young and ignorant,

Slava (01:04:28.662)
A murderer can get a plea deal just to expedite the process and serve, you know, seven years for murdering somebody when decades ago, a guy who got caught with a few ounces of weed, depending on the state or federal statute, would make him a felon and give him 20 years and nobody bats an eye. Not the judge, not the prosecutor. So justice has to be a warranted.

measure responds to the crime if we're gonna talk about criminal. Yeah, so that's justice if

Should be. Yeah, it should be.

That's objective justice. Right. that is blind. The Greek visual for justice is a woman holding scales in one hand and a sword in another blindfolded, which is where the phrase justice is blind comes from. Because justice doesn't care about your dilemmas. It simply measures the scales and then lets the sword descend where it does. Or what? Yep.

where it needs to, right? It's not arbitrary. That would be my answer as best as I can formulate it on the spot. So that would be my best answer. It has to be measured and it can't be self-serving. It can be blind, hateful retribution. It has to be a measured response.

Jonathan (01:05:47.702)
Retribution's a good word. Retribution might come up later in this series. Yeah, I agree with you. The justice should be more objective and let the crime, let the punishment fit the crime rather than some sort of light eyes level, you know, distinction of like, well, if you've got two ounces of weed, you're going to prison for 20 years versus killing a man going for seven. It's like, no, that's a broken system. That's not.

justice, that's classism and other things. And it needs to be rooted out from the top down. Anyway, let's get back. Let's wrap up these two chapters and send people back on their way so that we can revisit Roshar again next week.

Yeah. So chapter 33, burdens. We're still with Kaladin and Zeth. They're plunging towards the ground. Zeth starts glowing more brightly and Kaladin uses Seth's gemstone to draw in some stormlight before he loses his grip on the assassin. Kaladin lands hard, but the stormlight quickly heals him. And though his right arm is still gray and lifeless, he has some sense of feeling in his arm, which eventually...

It's better, heals. Zeth is shocked at Kaladin's and thinks he accidentally lashed Kaladin to slow his fall.

This is enjoyable with Zeth starting to question his own sanity.

Slava (01:07:14.028)
Yeah, very much so. As Seth is confused, he pauses for a second and Kalden uses his Stormlight to bring his right arm back to life. That's where he finally heals. And Seth is completely shocked. He cries out in surprise. Seth jumps back on the rock and asks what Kalden is and Kalden replies that he's a wind runner, the same as Seth. But Seth denies this, angrily shouting that

he was named Truthless and asks if the Radiants are back. Calvin says yes. Zeth runs away and Calvin collapses in exhaustion.

Yeah, this is a big moment for Zeth because he has to confront that all of the killing he's done for being called truthless by the equivalent of light eyes in his culture means that he's killed arbitrarily and he's shed innocent blood. Yeah. And he's running away from himself from that. This is a big moment for Zeth, even though we're distracted with the presence of Kaladin and bringing his shard blade wound back to life, which then Adolin

You know, when things come to and Kaladin wakes up and, you know, everyone reconvenes. Adolin in the heat of battle is remembering that like Kaladin got struck in the arm. His arm should be dead because Adolin knows about sharp blade wounds because he uses one on the battlefield all the time and this big fall that he had. And he just like chalks up like, yeah, I'm being paranoid. And I think understandably so like Adolin was in the midst of battle. Adolin is the best duelist, but he's out of his element.

completely in terms of like now having to fight Radiance as a normal mortal. Like that's really hard, especially with like someone who's been well-trained. Also like having to trust Kaladin and then protect the king, but then find out that like the assassin wanted to kill his father, not the king. It's just a lot to deal with for one young man.

Slava (01:09:14.88)
Absolutely and Kaladin, Syl, Adolin, Dalinar, they're all surprised. They pondered the strangeness of Kaladin's healing ability because they all know that he was hit with a sharp blade and all of them to a degree kind of dismiss their suspicion and paranoia because they're in this heat of battle. They're just, they're in this moment of extreme pressure. And so they're like, yeah, okay, whatever. But they kind of put it in the back of their heads. There's something about Kaladin after a little bit.

Kellan finds Bell's corpse and laments that he failed the Bridgman. Here we get Moroso Kellan, which here we kind of understand because

Even in the midst of like his arm healing, like he's not even paying attention to his arm healing from such a big wound. He's like taken away from that. Sorry, keep going.

Yeah, and Syl confronts Kaladin and comforts him in a way, says, hey, died protecting, and that was Bel's choice. Kaladin asks how skilled the assassin was and if Kaladin has more words to speak. But Syl says that though there are more words, he's not ready to speak them. Kaladin ponders how the assassin could have found a spren to bond and yet slaughter without honor and compares that

to his killing of Prashendi. Sil tells him the two situations are totally different since Kalan is protecting and Zet's sharp blade is somehow different. Dun dun dun. And that he uses the wrong amount of Stormlight. Kalan finds another one of his men, Haber, he's still alive, both legs disabled because he got hit with that sharp blade. And he says he will stay with Bridge 4 as a cook.

Slava (01:11:00.096)
and brings him to get some medical attention.

Yeah, Kaladin is now having to face similar personal truths like Zeth, different but personal, of like, okay, are there more words to speak? Well, of course there's more words, but how is the comparison he made about Zeth different from his killing Parshandi? And like, this is a big moment for that because he has to, he will continue to wrestle with that moving forward. A little here, a little there, but like that's a big deal having to deal with that.

Yep. All right. Last chapter of the section, 34, Blossoms and Cake. That could be a good band name for a 90 alternative rock.

I was thinking late eighties, just because of Blossom. Anyway, or were they seventies? It doesn't matter. Carry on. Blossoms and cake. Shalan catches some information on Tin's span read about political situation in Yakov Ed and dwells on the consequences of her family if there's a succession war, because she left her brothers, as a reminder to the audience, she left her brothers to try to get to Jasna and steal her soul caster and find a way to replace their.

Blossoms and cake.

Jonathan (01:12:12.216)
dwindling wealth because their soul caster is broken, but Jasnah's soul caster was not real. So we, that's when we find out that Jasnah before she died, dramatic pause, was simply doing it because she is a radiant. So then she reads more information about Sadius and the former leader and reward bounties and some other information. Shalon gets angry at Tin because Tin wants to turn them in and says that she promised them amnesty. And this is

talking about the people helping Shalon. But Tin scoffs and says that a con artist can't afford to believe their own lies and that Shalon has no choice to get saddiest to forgive the deserters who fled from Bridge 4 before Bridge 4 was freed, Gaz and the crew. And Shalon's upset and worries and is letting out her own personality again instead of keeping a bottle up to continue training under Tin. She basically believes that Tin is wrong.

Tin continues to read this band read and announces that there's good news and Shalon reads the printout about Jasna being dead, just like I said, and that the wind's pleasure of being lost, everyone died.

Such a great moment. love this moment. Span read also mentions Jasna taking on a new ward, a girl named Shalan. Tin reacts immediately, understanding what's going on. She slams Shalan to the ground, asking if Yana somehow survived. Shalan, not knowing that Jasna still alive, says no. Pattern. Pattern distracts Tin briefly, but it's not enough for Shalan to break free. Tin draws her sword, but Shalan uses Stormlight.

Shalom, Stead.

Slava (01:13:49.614)
creates an illusion, distracts and stabs Tin just as Tin deserves. Talk about justice. Just kidding. very good scene. Shalan kills Tin. Vatha, Gaz, and the others appear in the tent saying they heard a voice telling them to help Shalan. That would be pattern. And then heard Shalan screams and fought their way through Tin's soldiers to help Shalan. Vatha sees the sharp blade and says that Shalan could have killed the bandits all on her own. Shalan tells them

The voice they heard was her spren. Tin was an assassin, and they are to search Tin's tent for any documents for to read. Shalon watches as the Spannery continues to write that Tin's employers, who happen to be the Ghost Bloods, want to hire her for another job and inquire if she would have a meeting arranged at the war camps. Shalon realizes that the city the Ghost Bloods are investigating is Eurythru.

and replies, yes. Deception within deception.

The Ghost Bloods are the ones who killed Jasna because she's dead. The Ghost Bloods are also the ones who gave, and I don't know if we learned this or not, if we didn't, know, that's right, at me in the comments. The Ghost Bloods are the ones who gave Shalan's father his soul caster.

Yeah, I think you're right, yeah.

Jonathan (01:15:14.668)
I know I am right. I just don't know if it was revealed to you yet or not. And I can't remember if it was in this book or not. It slips my mind. The Ghost Bloods are related to Mistborn, which I've told you to read. And you've started, so albeit you don't like the book so far.

Not particularly, not as captivating as these books.

fair, but the Ghost Bloods are directly related to Mistborn, entirely related. So that's why it's important to know what's going on here, or sorry, what's going on in Mistborn to know what's going on here more because some of the people from Mistborn are in Ghost Bloods. Any final thoughts as we wrap this one up?

Nothing except the fact that this is such a dense book and this section has a lot, a lot of things that set up what happens at end of the book and then what happens in the front end of the next book, which I've paused to read Mistborn. Just great writing. mean, we all, you in the audience and everybody else, knows that both you and I are Sanderson fans, so we probably won't say anything, you know, overtly negative. Although I found some people who...

don't like the series on YouTube doing some research for this particular episode, which was whatever it is what it is. Final thoughts are dense section, very packed in with a lot of leaves a lot of questions answered, a lot more questions that are brought up. So good stuff.

Jonathan (01:16:44.82)
Awesome. Share this episode with your fellow book adventurers. It helps more listeners discover side quests. And join us next time for more story adventures. Until then, happy questing.