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Welcome to today’s episode where we explore the psychology about how we dress, fashion trends and what it really means to dress "age-appropriately." We also chat about social conformity and how it plays a role in choosing what we wear, as well as how our self-identity can influence how strongly we adhere to fashion trends. Finally, we discuss how confidence and body type play a role in shaping our fashion choices, along with the growing impact of inclusivity in the fashion industry.
Creators & Guests
Host
What is The Shrink Down?
Four lifelong friends, all clinical psychologists, unpack the latest in current events, pop culture and celebrity news through the lens of psychology.
Vanessa (00:01.159)
Welcome to today's episode where we are going to be exploring the psychology about how we dress, fashion trends, and what it really means to dress age appropriately. We will explore how social conformity plays into choosing what we wear and how our own self-identity can influence how we kind of follow fashion trends, like whether we choose to or we don't. We will also dive into the role that confidence and body type play in shaping our fashion choices, particularly as we get older.
and how that kind of goes along with the growing impact of inclusivity in the industry, the fashion industry. But before we get into today's topic, we are going to be doing our four minute faves. So let's start off today. Well, Amina, do you want to start us off?
Wilhelmina (00:40.704)
Yeah, so to no one's surprise, I'm going to talk about a TV show I started watching this week. Disclaimer, has anyone heard of this one? OK, it's on Apple TV, Cate Blanchett, Kevin Kline, and an almost unrecognizable Sacha Baron Cohen. It actually took me a full episode to figure out it was Sacha Baron Cohen. No, he just.
Lauren (00:45.901)
you
Teri (00:52.046)
No.
Lauren (00:52.319)
wait, yes, who's in this? Yes.
Lauren (01:03.117)
More.
Vanessa (01:05.331)
Is it because they've disguised him or he just looks so different?
Wilhelmina (01:08.18)
Like you think of him as Borat, right? And so he looks like a, you know, kind of semi-attractive, or like an attractive 50-year-old man now who's married to Cate Blanchett. Not at all like Borat. So that's where, you know, he's not wearing a thong. He's not being completely inappropriate. So it is, I'm going to say very little about this, Terry, don't worry. But because you can't say anything about it, because this is a show.
Vanessa (01:09.669)
Yeah, okay. Hi.
Lauren (01:10.007)
Yeah.
Vanessa (01:15.762)
Thank
Vanessa (01:19.187)
He's not wearing a thong.
Lauren (01:23.467)
neon bathing suit.
Lauren (01:32.236)
Yeah.
Vanessa (01:32.307)
Hahaha!
Wilhelmina (01:37.088)
filled with all twists and turns and it's all about what you don't know that is going to be revealed. But I'm going to give you what happens in the first few minutes of the episode that sets up the whole show. So basically this show is in a couple different timelines. So you have the past, which is about 20 years ago. You have current and then you have a couple middle fillers leading us all the way up to current times.
it goes back and forth between these time periods. And then it starts with Cate Blanchett. She is a journalist. She is getting an award. Everyone is praising her. She's coming home after this very fancy night with her husband and she opens the mail. She gets a package. She opens the package. It's a book. The book is called The Perfect Stranger. It just looks like a simple little book. She opens it up. There's a dedication to my son.
She opens the next page and it says, disclaimer, any resemblance to persons living or dead is not a coincidence. And then she goes on to in one night read the book. You don't know what the book says. You don't know what's going on. But she ends up like throwing up afterwards. Like she is just panicked. She starts to burn the book. She is just in a full panic. And you're like, what was in this book? And basically that's what we are going to find out in this show. What is this secret thing that she has
Lauren (02:41.217)
Hmm.
Lauren (02:59.223)
how sets it up.
Wilhelmina (03:02.584)
done in her past that someone knows about and has written this book that is clearly identifying her. And it's so good. And that's really all I'm going to say, because it's all of these things and all of this. And they released the first two episodes. I flew through them. And then I was like, wait, there's not another episode? Then they released the next two episodes last Friday. Watch those. And now the next episode is going to drop this Friday. So new episodes each Friday. Very good. Very good.
Lauren (03:20.141)
Yes.
Vanessa (03:30.854)
Alright.
Lauren (03:31.277)
That sounds good.
Wilhelmina (03:31.436)
The acting, top notch. It's just great. the director is Alfonso Cuarón. So he's an Academy Award winning director. did Roma back a couple of years ago. He won best director for that. He did that movie Gravity with Sandra Bullock. So like very good. did, I've liked most of the things I've ever seen of his. He has such a good way of like the relationships with the people. It's great. It's great.
Lauren (03:34.529)
Yeah, those are big names.
Lauren (03:44.233)
yeah.
Lauren (03:59.629)
Good.
Vanessa (04:00.915)
Excellent.
Wilhelmina (04:00.92)
Lauren, what are you loving?
Lauren (04:02.861)
You guys, I was thinking about this this morning and laughing with my husband, Tim, and I was like, my gosh, I feel like I've been Groundhog Day, like Groundhog Day in this family, like for like a month. I'm like, I have nothing new. Like we're watching the same TV show we've been watching. Like we're trying to get through the same TV show. Like we're doing the same things every week. Like what in the world am I using or like what's making life good? So I actually finally figured it out. If you are a it's actually.
the tea that I'm drinking. If you are a fall person and you love something warm, something cozy to drink in the afternoons and the evenings, I've become obsessed with cinnamon, apple spice, herbal tea. I know this is like such an old lady thing from Celestial Seasonings, but it's like the best. It makes me happy. It's just like a little perk to my day in the afternoons and evenings when I'm avoiding caffeine. It's caffeine free. Yeah, caffeine free.
Vanessa (04:44.627)
Hmm.
Teri (04:44.783)
Hello.
Vanessa (04:57.287)
I was gonna ask. was like, gotta love that sensitivity to caffeine as you get older.
Teri (04:57.839)
Yeah.
Lauren (05:00.225)
delicious. I know right? forget it. Afternoon I'm like I can't do it.
Wilhelmina (05:02.134)
No, it's great.
Teri (05:03.363)
Yeah, part of the package. Neil, Vanessa, part of the package.
Vanessa (05:08.637)
I used to drink tea every night, green tea. Like Mark and I would watch a show, we'd drink tea, and I started realizing that like I couldn't fall asleep. And so I can no longer drink tea at night. Yes.
Lauren (05:15.979)
Yeah.
I have to be careful about like decaf coffee at a dinner, like decaf coffee at a dinner. I have to be careful because it'll be like midnight and I'll be like, bing. So no, this is very good, caffeine free, perfect for the season, cinnamon apple. That's it. Terry, what you got?
Wilhelmina (05:18.952)
Or anything with caffeine.
yeah.
Teri (05:24.355)
Yeah, it has a little bit.
Teri (05:37.835)
Okay, I feel a little behind the ball on this because maybe this is some, I feel like people were watching these a couple of weeks ago, but the Menendez brothers on Netflix. Yeah, so my husband and I over the weekend watched the first episode of the fictional one. So the fictional series and my plan is to watch that first, because I have a few friends who said they watched that and then they watched the documentary that followed that.
Wilhelmina (05:48.201)
I started it. Mm-hmm.
Lauren (05:48.338)
yes. Yes.
Wilhelmina (05:56.908)
Brutal.
Lauren (05:57.121)
Yes.
Wilhelmina (06:06.2)
world did you watch this Terry? I saw the episode. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay.
Teri (06:09.037)
I don't care about shooting. Nope, I don't care about shooting. You could shoot somebody all day long. That doesn't bother me. It's the slice.
Lauren (06:15.73)
In a fictional sense.
Vanessa (06:16.935)
Yeah, she's like, gory. She doesn't like gory stuff.
Teri (06:20.377)
I don't like going. I had no problem. It's very, it's very specific. I don't like cutting, slicing, torture type things. no, no. So yeah, to clarify, fictional shooting. I like the sopranos. I like the Godfather. I like, was fine seeing it. Fictional shooting, I can watch that all day long. So I had been hesitant to watch it originally because I have two boys who are a couple years apart.
Wilhelmina (06:20.509)
This was so gory! That death scene was super gory.
Okay. You're not seeing Terrifier 3. You're not watching that one. Okay.
Vanessa (06:29.607)
knives.
Lauren (06:40.855)
you
Vanessa (06:44.221)
Yeah.
Teri (06:50.031)
So I kept cracking jokes with friends. I'm like, maybe I'll stay away from the Menendez brothers. But we were looking for something to watch. It certainly captured my attention. And what's interesting is I remember when it happened. I looked at the time, I think I was in third or fourth grade. My oldest is in fourth and he is starting to pay attention to news stories. So I do remember and I don't remember being freaked out about it when I was a kid. And what's really interesting to me is my memory of it in real time.
Lauren (06:51.548)
my gosh.
Wilhelmina (06:58.073)
Mm-hmm.
Lauren (07:02.027)
Yeah.
Teri (07:17.647)
was that it was two men who killed their parents. I thought they were really old when I was a kid. And now I'm watching it and they're 18 and 21. They're barely, they're young adults. They're barely out of adolescence. So as I'm watching it, the fictionalized version on Netflix, I was thinking, wow, when I was a kid, I thought they were old, like older men who killed their parents. So I found it just very interesting. I really liked it. It's a little over the top. I mean, it's sort of cheesy in some ways.
Lauren (07:22.33)
yeah.
Lauren (07:26.817)
Yeah.
Vanessa (07:29.149)
Yeah.
Wilhelmina (07:42.679)
Mm-hmm.
Lauren (07:43.639)
Yeah, sure. It's like Ryan Murphy, right? Isn't it him? Yeah, I think so. Ryan Murphy does all the
Wilhelmina (07:47.295)
Mmm... is it?
Teri (07:47.533)
I think so. No, I don't know. I don't know who that is.
Vanessa (07:50.621)
That's it.
Wilhelmina (07:53.964)
I don't think he's right. He might be involved in it. I don't think he's the main director though. He might be like an executive producer. I don't think he is.
Lauren (07:57.609)
Okay. Yeah. Yeah.
Teri (08:00.889)
Yeah, it didn't freak me out. So if you're somebody who's squeamish like me with movies, was, or shows and stuff, I was relatively okay with it. And it was, I know, it was interesting. And now I'm very curious to watch the real follow-up documentary.
Wilhelmina (08:14.668)
Did you finish the show or just watch the first? Okay, so just for like kind of warning, I have not finished it, but I've heard people talk about it. There does, there gets to be some pretty very graphic like abuse, child abuse, sexual abuse that gets brought up later. So just for our listeners.
Teri (08:17.165)
No, just the first one. So.
Teri (08:30.265)
Yes, that's my understanding. Yeah.
Vanessa (08:32.977)
Mm-hmm.
Lauren (08:35.789)
But I have heard, to your point, watching the fictional and then the documentary is like a really interesting contrast. I haven't watched, but I've heard that approach.
Teri (08:46.477)
And we don't get that a lot in general, I think with TV shows, there's fictionalized series and then there isn't a parallel follow-up documentary right after. So I thought that'd be kind of cool.
Vanessa (08:54.865)
Like my dream. Yeah. You'll have to keep us posted.
Lauren (08:55.083)
Yeah. Yeah.
Wilhelmina (08:56.972)
Yeah. I'll keep watching and we can chat.
Teri (08:59.341)
Yes. Yes. How about you, Vanessa?
Vanessa (09:03.699)
So my fave today is kind of goes along with our topic of like fashion, you know, and when we're gonna talk about like trends and keeping up with trends. So I'm gonna talk about Uggs today. So I never got into Uggs when they were popular the first time. Did you guys do Uggs like when they were? Okay. So I didn't because I am five, three in a smidge and I have a size nine foot. And while I loved them on everyone else, I was like,
Wilhelmina (09:13.912)
Wilhelmina (09:20.14)
I did, yep.
Teri (09:21.774)
Mm-hmm.
Vanessa (09:32.301)
I look like I have Sasquatch feet in them. So I never, they never, yeah, so like they make your feet look big, but if you have, like, if you're proportionate, your shoe size and your body height, like, it probably looks fine on you. So I always just felt like they accentuated the fact that like I have big feet for my height, which I'm okay with.
Wilhelmina (09:36.8)
You do make your feet look huge.
Vanessa (09:52.723)
so I never got into them and then they've kind of re-emerged. I feel like they're now very popular, but now they've come out with kind of not just the boots, but they've also the slides. So last year I got just like slippers and I was like, these are amazing. And I realized that some people were wearing the slippers outside. and the ones I got are very slipper. So like, I was like, I wouldn't wear these outside, but I did love how cozy and comfortable they were. And so this year I was like, you know what? I'm going to try some of those.
Wilhelmina (10:08.695)
Out.
Lauren (10:09.537)
Yeah, that's shoes.
Vanessa (10:20.997)
like thicker heel kind of Uggs to see if I like them. Yes. So I bought I'm showing them. So you'll have to come see us. us out on YouTube. I will also post this on Instagram. So they're technically they're slippers, but I would never wear this around my house because they have like a platform. They do make my feet look big. However, they're like so cozy and like easy to like you. So like I have to run to take Ev to like her practice. I just like slip them on, have a sweater.
Lauren (10:23.211)
with the platform ones.
Wilhelmina (10:26.569)
mm-hmm.
Teri (10:28.419)
Those are cute.
Lauren (10:32.353)
are cute.
Lauren (10:39.572)
Thank
Teri (10:43.183)
Hmm?
Vanessa (10:49.145)
know, some leggings and I'm good to go. So this is my sheer today. They're the Ugg. These are the Disco Kett slipper, but there's a bunch of different designs on them. These don't have, some of them have like different colors and stuff. I like these because they're pretty plain, but they're technically a slipper, but they're platform and I really love them. So I did give in finally to the trend of Uggs, but I've just come to accept the fact that I have big feet and it's okay. It's okay. I like the comfort of them. I love the ease of them.
Teri (10:57.54)
like those.
Lauren (10:58.465)
Yep.
Lauren (11:12.877)
You
Wilhelmina (11:13.432)
you
Teri (11:16.471)
I bet you look super cute still.
Vanessa (11:18.099)
So that's my share today. And just as a reminder, we share all of our faves on Instagram. So if you're interested in either seeing what we're talking about, check us out there. We also post links to everything if there is a link that's available. So if you're interested in anything that we're sharing, feel free to check us out there. And then we're also on YouTube. So if you want to see us, that's another great way to kind of watch the show and listen to the show. All right.
So let's get into today's topic. So I'm going to start off with a question for everyone. So we just talked about Uggs, but tell me or share with the group here, what is a current fashion trend that you're either giving a hard no, you're like, I'm not even going to try it. I'm not even contemplating it or that you're like, well, maybe I'm on the fence about it. Maybe, you know, there's all there's been fashion trends that I'm sure we've all said. I am not doing that. Like when the pointy toe heels first came out, I was like, absolutely not. And then I then I have worn them.
Lauren (12:13.533)
It's funny.
Vanessa (12:16.051)
So, you know, so it happens, right? So like, so again, this is one that you're at, maybe you'll change your mind, that's okay. But you're like, hard no for me, or you're like, I'm not sure about that.
Wilhelmina (12:16.139)
I've said that so many times.
Lauren (12:18.281)
You
Lauren (12:29.035)
Where do we begin? I feel like I have like 10 that I could make card. No, too. Pick one. So the one probably that I'm seeing the most right now, although OK, the most on social media, though I can't say I've seen a ton in real life are those barrel jeans. I I just cannot understand them. I have yet to see somebody that I think looks cute in them. They just feel awkward to me, but that's that's me. But to be fair.
Vanessa (12:32.039)
Pick one. Just pick one. We'll go around.
Vanessa (12:46.386)
yeah.
Wilhelmina (12:46.678)
Mm-hmm.
Lauren (12:57.739)
I haven't seen anybody in real life wear them. So maybe it's more of like an Instagram versus reality situation in which it's like a trend that is really not actually translating.
Vanessa (13:07.889)
Yeah, right. I don't know that I've ever seen anyone wearing them, like, Okay. Okay.
Lauren (13:11.596)
Right.
Teri (13:11.949)
I have a friend, a mom friend who does have a pair. If you're listening, you know who you are. And I do think they work on her. I will say she's younger than me and maybe eight, nine years, give or take. I can't remember exactly. And she's really cute. And I think she really pulls it off. And that being said, I think she's the only person I can think of that I've seen in real life.
Wilhelmina (13:16.086)
No.
Lauren (13:16.321)
Does it work?
Lauren (13:24.535)
Okay.
Okay, so it just doesn't translate, yeah, for me. Yeah. Yeah.
Lauren (13:40.331)
Yeah, as I'm saying it, going, I don't even know that this, I mean, it's a trend, but is it a real trend in real life? Because we're not seeing a ton of people actually wearing, but that's a hard no for me. I don't think, I don't think I, you guys come back to this if, if I actually am wearing them in six months when we, you know, on your girls trip or something, let me. That's when we'll do a photo shoot.
Vanessa (13:51.697)
That's hard enough. Fair enough. Everyone is entitled to their hard no.
Vanessa (13:58.163)
I know we're all gonna be wearing we're gonna share it on our four minute faves. my gosh, Terry, what's your that's okay.
Wilhelmina (14:00.429)
We all have them by the time we go on our trip.
Wilhelmina (14:07.64)
my gosh.
Teri (14:08.772)
Yes.
Lauren (14:10.348)
God. Wilhelmina, what about you? sorry. Go ahead.
Teri (14:13.583)
Well, mine probably, everyone's probably listening, I think, maybe, depending on how old you are is gonna be with me on this. The ankle socks versus the no-show socks. I visually really tried. My nieces wear them. I see them out all the time. It's such a look. It shortens your leg. For both men and women, I don't care how tall you are, how long your legs are, it looks
Vanessa (14:20.943)
Okay.
Wilhelmina (14:20.953)
god. No, mm-mm.
Lauren (14:21.001)
No, can't do it. Boo, can't do it.
Wilhelmina (14:34.456)
Mm-hmm. Yep.
Lauren (14:34.509)
Vanessa (14:35.97)
That's my problem with it!
Teri (14:43.669)
stupid and ridiculous and
Vanessa (14:44.051)
I don't know it looks stupid, but I agree. It does shorten your legs. So if you're petite, it's bad.
Teri (14:49.103)
It's, I think the no-show stocks, I'm with it all the way. I don't see myself vacillating on this. I don't see myself backing down. It looks, it just looks ridiculous. But one trend that, and this has been a topic among some of my friends, my local friends, is jean jackets. And one of my friends had said, the regular, you know, we all look like clones in our jean jackets.
Wilhelmina (15:15.692)
Yep. Yep. I think we all have them. We've all had them on our trip.
Vanessa (15:16.883)
Hahaha
Lauren (15:17.345)
Yeah. We all have the same kind of line.
Teri (15:18.127)
Jean jacket mafia. We're all very attached to them. He said, no, jean jackets are still in, but more the oversized slouchy big one. And she has one, my friend who told me this, she's like, stop wearing your current jean jacket. Get one of these. And at first, my first week I've seen it, I was like, no, I'm not doing that. However, my eyes are starting to acclimate.
Wilhelmina (15:27.948)
Big. Big.
Lauren (15:28.525)
other side.
Vanessa (15:28.817)
I know, I have one.
Wilhelmina (15:36.448)
No, I can't.
Vanessa (15:46.995)
Well here, as someone who owns both, will say depending on what I'm wearing, I do think the old school little one looks better, but it just depends what I'm wearing. So I feel like there's room, there's space for both. It just depends what you're wearing. So yes, that's my take on it.
Teri (15:47.297)
and it's starting to look better to me and I'm contemplating the slouchy, open-sized jean jacket.
Lauren (15:47.927)
Well.
Wilhelmina (16:02.584)
for both.
Lauren (16:06.785)
Well, and Terry, you said something interesting. My eyes are acclimating to it. I think you're seeing it in real life. So that feels different than adopting a trend we're only seeing in the virtual world. Maybe. Like, maybe that's the difference. Yeah. Yeah.
Wilhelmina (16:11.414)
Yes.
Vanessa (16:11.911)
Yes.
Teri (16:21.795)
That makes, I think that's a huge distinction. I think that makes a big difference.
Wilhelmina (16:25.666)
Well, and how many I could give you the rundown of how many times I said since I've been in my 20s, I am never wearing that. Skinny jeans when they first hit. Nope, not doing it. Nope. I love my boot cut. And then my closet was suddenly filled with skinny jeans. The booty with the skinny jeans when that first came out, I'm like, that's ridiculous. That looks stupid. Nope. I wanted the boots over the jeans.
Vanessa (16:33.479)
Right.
Lauren (16:36.491)
Right.
Wilhelmina (16:53.4)
like when you're there, when your dad thinks we look like...
Teri (16:58.223)
So when that look first came out, however many years ago, don't know, 15 years ago, the boot, the tall boots to the knee over, below the knee, but, you know, calf boots over jeans. We were somewhere and my husband, Dan, said, everyone looks like they're in the Revolutionary War. He said, that is the worst look. About three months later, I remember buying a pair and we must've been married at that, I don't even know this, but we were living together. And I remember getting dressed to go out for the night and me and Mike.
Wilhelmina (17:01.185)
You
Vanessa (17:08.423)
Yes.
Vanessa (17:14.434)
Hahaha!
Teri (17:27.413)
I'm doing it. then I, for years we wore them.
Vanessa (17:28.263)
Hahaha
Lauren (17:32.203)
Yeah, for years. Yeah, yeah. Yeah.
Vanessa (17:32.295)
But there is something to that, right? The more you see something, right? And that goes with anything. It goes with fashion. goes even like a song you hear there initially, you're like, that's terrible. But then they keep playing it on the radio and all of a you're like, I kind of like this. It is that constant repetition that you're seeing something that makes you start to feel like, OK, I kind of like this sort of thing.
Wilhelmina (17:32.352)
And every.
Wilhelmina (17:50.444)
And be all. You see it on people.
Lauren (17:52.205)
What about you Vanessa? Vanessa, do you have a trend?
Teri (17:52.271)
Mm-hmm. Well, people like, yeah.
Vanessa (17:56.275)
I was gonna say the like baggy kind of janko jeans. So if you know me, you know that in high school I was a raver. Okay, so like that was my thing. I wore oversized jankos. I would go into my dad's closet and get his men's size large t-shirts and I would wear them, which is kind of funny because I actually wear oversized t-shirts again, but you know, full circle. But anyway, this is what I wore in high school. You couldn't see my shoes. I looked like I was floating down the road, right?
Wilhelmina (18:24.728)
You
Vanessa (18:25.469)
There was always mud and crud at the bottom of my jeans. So, you know, and that was definitely my look, my aesthetic in high school. So I think there's just something about, like, I see a lot of people, maybe they're not to the extent of the pants I wore, but this oversized look. I know that it's a lot of younger girls doing it, but I am seeing a lot of the folks that I follow who are like in their like mid thirties, some forties, right, who are wearing this trend. And for me, it comes down to like, I feel like as I've gotten older,
I've gotten a really good sense of my body type and what works for me. And I just feel like I can say no to things that I know that don't work for me. And I personally don't think that that type of gene does anything for me. I spend a lot of time in the gym doing squats and you know what, those genes don't show off any of my hard work. So I just don't feel like that's a good one for me that I'm just gonna be avoiding. And I get it, some people feel like that's like...
Wilhelmina (18:57.28)
Mm-hmm.
Lauren (18:57.453)
Yeah.
Vanessa (19:23.751)
They like the way that looks and that's great. But for me, my body type, I'm not wearing the big old baggy jeans. Not doing it.
Wilhelmina (19:29.782)
Well, and I think with the trend I was going to mention and kind of goes along with that is just work with, work with the trend, make the trend work for you if you want to. And so I, the crop is back, right? Like crop everything. I mean, I get so many of my mom friends who are trying to dress their little girls and they're like, why is everything a crop? And I said, cause that's what's in. So I will get things like the sweater that I'm wearing right now, which I love is technically a crop because, but I
Vanessa (19:38.695)
Yeah.
Lauren (19:42.861)
Yep.
Wilhelmina (20:00.162)
So it hangs like this, but the minute you lift your head, it's like full stomach. And it's just a tank top. It's just a tank top. So I'm sure if I were 20, I'd be wearing nothing under that. I'd just be showing off the stomach. Remember just like back in the day with the little baby tees. Now I'm like, no, no, mama needs a tank top.
Lauren (20:02.06)
You mom did up.
Teri (20:07.501)
Is that a bodysuit or a camisole? God, just curious.
Lauren (20:10.412)
Yeah.
Lauren (20:18.85)
right?
Wilhelmina (20:26.998)
just because it's more comfy for me. I don't wanna be like lifting my arm up and like half my skin is showing. Yes, yes.
Lauren (20:28.747)
It's drafty.
Teri (20:32.111)
Comfort matters more.
Vanessa (20:34.225)
Yeah, I think that becomes an issue. you know, it's funny to say that you show that you're crop top. There was this like video circling where there was this mom who was younger than us, but I would say like early 30s. And she went to the library with her two young kids and she was wearing a sweater, just like the one you're wearing, Wilhelmina. Yes. And she was she basically posted about how the librarian came up to her and was like shaming her for wearing the sweater. Because when she went to go pick up the kid and put it on her hip, I guess it lifted up a little and.
Lauren (20:49.037)
I saw this.
Vanessa (21:02.355)
I was like, holy moly, that's shocking. Because she wasn't wearing a crop top, right? It touches the top of her pants. was really because she was putting her kid on her hip. And that kind of goes back to that term of people, age-appropriate stuff. And I definitely think that we're seeing a shift in what that looks like. If you look at what women were wearing several decades ago at our age, it looks very different than it does now. And so I do think that that kind of old school
perception of like you can't wear that right is definitely changing. We're living longer. Like you're seeing different things on social media. So that plays a role. But it's really interesting that there's still, you know, this stigma of like what you should and shouldn't be wearing at a certain age. You know, and yeah, I think the comfort thing comes into it for me. I know, like sometimes I don't wear things. I'm like, I don't want to be worried about my boobs falling out at the top of my shirt, you know, so or, you know, like you're like, I don't want, you know, I don't want to deal like be worried about like, you know, whatever flashing someone.
Teri (21:53.807)
Okay.
Vanessa (22:00.595)
So you might alter it. But yeah, there's definitely that age appropriate thing. And how do you stay fashionable without kind of overstepping the line, but not feeling like you look like an old granny, right? How do you navigate that?
Teri (22:18.311)
The other thing I think about is I sometimes look around and whether it's trends I see on social media or just in person, and it almost seems like everybody sort of looks the same. So if something's trendy and something else I wanted to mention was the idea of micro trends, the trends are changing at rapid fire nowadays, right? Something is, it used to be something was trendy for a year or even a couple of years.
Wilhelmina (22:30.562)
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
Lauren (22:31.159)
Mm-hmm. Yep.
Lauren (22:40.589)
Right. Right.
Wilhelmina (22:41.132)
Yes.
Wilhelmina (22:46.669)
Mm-hmm.
Teri (22:47.201)
Now it seems that the trends just cycle much more quickly than they ever did previously. But is that everyone sort of adopts the trend around the same time and then everybody looks the same. the thing that made me laugh is a J.Crew factory opened in our town about a week ago. And if you ever wanted to create some buzz among people our age, open a J.Crew factory. Text messages that have been flying.
Wilhelmina (23:09.407)
Hahaha
Teri (23:15.631)
between different groups of friends of mine locally have been rapid fire. It's been hysterical. And I've been in once, spent a little bit, there's 50 % off over the weekend, but we all were joking like, J.Crew Factory is opening. And then I made a crack. We're all going to look like clowns. We're all going to be wearing the same versions of J.Crew Factory outfits from shopping there. And it brings, comes back to this idea of everyone's sort of looking the same, but that conformity
Lauren (23:31.117)
right?
Wilhelmina (23:45.175)
Mm-hmm.
Teri (23:45.685)
actually is highly activating for our brain. So there's certain regions of our brain that are highly activated when we conform. And it's both the anticipation of conforming and then the quote unquote receipt and reward of conforming on the other end. So even the anticipation of seeing a trend and saying, I think I'm going to try that. I like that. That actually activates our reward center. And so that's what propels us to engage in the behavior of purchasing that. It's all about that. Those dopamine hits.
Lauren (23:51.458)
Right.
Lauren (24:08.269)
awards.
Wilhelmina (24:08.533)
Yeah. Dopamine, dopamine, dopamine.
Lauren (24:12.993)
Right? Right.
Teri (24:15.119)
And there's the idea of that in-group and the out-group. And when you're a teenager, that's the in-group. It's dressing trendy. Like, we're trendy, we're in this in-group. The adults are the out-group, the older adults. But then when the older adults start dressing like the teenagers, which are supposed to be the in-group. So I think it brings up that social psychology concept of in-group and out-group as well, related to conformity. Cause you feel really good when you're in the in-group. And even maybe the people in the out-group, they want to be in the in-group. So.
Lauren (24:29.901)
right?
Teri (24:44.109)
that feels good if they can get in.
Lauren (24:45.877)
And how much we engage in that too, how much we engage in social conformity. I think about the social comparison theory, right? Which is, mean, strongly related to social conformity, but this idea that we evaluate like our own worth by comparing ourselves to others. And if that's something that you engage in, in that social comparison, then you are more likely to conform. Doesn't mean you have to engage in social comparison.
Wilhelmina (24:51.544)
Mm-hmm.
Lauren (25:12.951)
But you're more likely to conform because you want to avoid feeling left out or inferior in some way. And conforming to fashion trends is one of those ways that we compare ourselves, right? And so it can become a real pressure to feel as if we have to conform to these social trends, these fashion trends, if we don't have a good sense of self. Vanessa said what works for our body.
Vanessa (25:25.853)
people.
Wilhelmina (25:37.89)
Yes.
Lauren (25:40.553)
what we're comfortable in and confident in. Because if we're not dressing in a way that works for our self-identity, but rather because of social comparison, we're going to use up some of our cognitive capacity worrying about what we're wearing, not feeling great in what we're wearing, trying to figure out how we're going to sit and what we're like, right? And then we're not going to be as present in the sort of day-to-day tasks that we're engaging in as a result.
Wilhelmina (25:55.34)
Yes.
Vanessa (26:08.755)
Well, also like leading up from that, like, you know, if you're constantly trying to, you know, compare yourself to someone who has a totally different body type and can wear things. So it's not even just in that moment that you're not having fun because you're so worried about how it's fitting you. I think it starts to take an impact on like your mental health, right? You start to feel like, you know, maybe something's wrong with my body. You know, maybe, you know, I need to go on a diet, you know, so that can be things like anxiety, depression can really impact that.
Wilhelmina (26:17.783)
Mm-hmm.
Lauren (26:18.018)
Right?
Lauren (26:26.541)
Absolutely.
Vanessa (26:36.443)
I think the good thing is that as you get older, think most of us, not all of us, right, really start to get a good sense of who we are. Our self identity really starts to, obviously it starts to evolve, but it gets, I think increases over time as you age and you can kind of decide how much do you want to conform versus how much you don't want to. I know for me, I love when I go to some wacky off the beat boutique and find something and I'm wearing it and someone's like, where'd you get that? And I was like, yeah, that to me is like.
Teri (26:50.049)
I like
Vanessa (27:04.755)
there's my dopamine hit. I'm like, yes, I love it when someone asks me about that. But yeah, so think it's this interesting kind of balance of conforming and then figure who you are and how you kind of balance those two things. But I think it's easier as you get older, I think for most people.
Lauren (27:20.257)
Willamina, you do a lot of work with body image, especially like adolescent body image eating disorders. How do you help, I'm gonna put you on the spot, but maybe we can have a discussion further about it. How do you help adolescents, especially young girls develop that sense of self so that they're less likely to engage in social comparison and social conformity and more likely to focus on what works for them?
Wilhelmina (27:20.418)
When I think, yeah.
Wilhelmina (27:43.479)
Mm-hmm.
Lauren (27:48.747)
Listen, we're all in our 40s and we're still figuring that out to some extent. How do you foster that?
Wilhelmina (27:51.64)
Yes. Yeah, Lauren. Yeah, Lauren, that's a really good question. And I think that one of the things that I encourage a lot is to, since I kind of work with what they're already doing. So if they're on social media, I'm like, let's find some people who have bodies that are similar to yours. And why don't you start following those bodies, those accounts? Look at those, because guess what?
Vanessa (27:52.179)
Mm-hmm.
Vanessa (28:14.321)
Mm-hmm. Yep. Yes.
Lauren (28:18.314)
Hahaha
Wilhelmina (28:20.684)
The more you look at people who are like you and have bodies like you, you are going to feel better about yours. mean, you guys, is, yes. I
Teri (28:28.887)
It's that familiarity piece. You're seeing it.
Lauren (28:30.445)
love that, work with what they're already doing.
Vanessa (28:30.61)
Yes.
Wilhelmina (28:33.578)
And so, I mean, I did my dissertation on the detrimental effects of even just perusing, you know, the media and looking at all these, you know, bodies that aren't yours and how like five minutes of that can increase your body dissatisfaction. And so absolutely, if these young kids are consuming, consuming and just seeing the same bodies, the same fashion over and over again. And so I just...
Lauren (28:36.812)
Yes.
Lauren (28:43.669)
magazines.
Wilhelmina (29:01.312)
listen to this fashion psychologist, and she was actually saying that in the fashion industry, they have a social responsibility to, because everyone wears clothes. So the ideal thing would be that all body types, shapes, and ethnicities are represented in the fashion world. that, they are, absolutely, absolutely. No.
Lauren (29:18.089)
I love that.
Vanessa (29:18.739)
which feel like they're doing better at doing that. They're much better, much better. No, I remember, like, so we were in our 20s, you know, in the 2000s when the waifi model was, you know, I'm, yes, and I'm half Brazilian. I've always had a big booty and hips. And I can distinctly remember being like, not liking the way that I looked often because I didn't look like that.
Lauren (29:22.411)
It didn't used to be that way.
Wilhelmina (29:29.385)
Mm-hmm. Kate Moss.
Vanessa (29:43.707)
And I remember my stepmom saying, you look Brazilian. And I would just be like, that's not what I want to look like. And I can just appreciate so much now. I know we can talk about the Kardashians for a whole episode. I will say, curvy body has become acceptable. And now we're seeing a lot of these stores have thank you loft for curvy. And having different, not just that, but heights.
Lauren (30:08.757)
Yes! Yes!
Wilhelmina (30:08.95)
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
Teri (30:09.071)
Mm-hmm.
Vanessa (30:13.275)
Again, I'm 5'3", like I always was like, I'm so short, you know? And now we see, like you can get your pants are short, right? Like you don't have to go hem them, right? And like do all the things. So I do feel like the industry is getting better. I mean, clearly there's still a lot of work to be done, but I do think that we're seeing more types of bodies in ads, on social media, which I think makes all of us, right? Feel better about who we are when we can see that.
Lauren (30:14.818)
Hey.
Lauren (30:38.882)
Yeah.
Wilhelmina (30:42.282)
And I also work with like just what is driving this need to like when you are so dissatisfied with yourself or your body, what's driving this? Like beyond just, well, I just want to look like this, but we really get to like underneath, like what are the, yes, what are the reasons? What happens if you never look like this or what happens? And it's often, you guys, it's often like I'll be alone.
Lauren (30:52.855)
Yeah.
Lauren (31:00.001)
why.
Teri (31:01.647)
What are the unmet needs?
Lauren (31:05.527)
Right.
Wilhelmina (31:10.968)
people won't like me. mean, the things that come up, these are big things. So when people are just, you think, it's just that they just want to look like this body type, oftentimes it's driven by.
I mean, sometimes parents, there's a lot of heavy influence of parents and pressure. And so they actually believe that they will be unlovable if they don't look a certain way. So it really is, it's never as simple as just this, it's always more. And same with fashion. mean, you could talk about it on this surface level, we, underneath there's so much driving fashion psychology and the reasons why we gravitate to things, the reason why seeing this trend makes us.
Vanessa (31:24.147)
Yes.
Lauren (31:24.865)
Yes.
Lauren (31:31.063)
Yes.
Wilhelmina (31:49.11)
want it more, know, and wear it. So it's fascinating.
Lauren (31:50.401)
Right.
I read the same article Wilhelmina is referring to with the fashion psychologist. And she quoted that up to 80 % of the clothes in our closet are not worn because we engage in this social consumption, right? Like seeing... Correct. Yeah. And this idea of like, can reduce that, certainly the sustainability piece, the overconsumption is a huge thing, but we can reduce it for ourselves.
Wilhelmina (32:06.999)
Yes.
Vanessa (32:10.717)
So we're purchasing even though we're not gonna wear it.
Wilhelmina (32:12.802)
Mm-hmm, mm-hmm, yep.
Lauren (32:22.325)
And just recognize like, are the pieces that I'm actually wearing? What do I actually feel really good and confident in? And then focus on those and go from there. And I mean, that to me, I don't know, that seems like a good thing to instill in adolescence as well, right? Like what makes you feel good?
Wilhelmina (32:36.748)
Yes, absolutely. Well, isn't that like the Maria Kondo where she said, what sparks joy? And she actually touched on clothes and she said, get rid of everything. She's like, most people go into a packed closet and they actually, the more packed it is, the more likely they are to think they have nothing to wear. But if their closet is smaller with just pieces they absolutely love, they don't feel that way as much, which is interesting.
Lauren (32:42.316)
Yeah.
Lauren (32:47.329)
Yes.
Lauren (33:05.355)
Right.
Teri (33:05.743)
How do you feel I'm having a reaction to you saying that? Because I've been trying to work on cleaning out my closet and I thought I was being ruthless. And I know deep down, I still have more to go and more to do as I'm in my closet right now looking around. And my initial reaction to that is, what if I need it? What if there might be an
Wilhelmina (33:17.804)
Yep.
Lauren (33:18.007)
All right.
You're like looking at it.
Vanessa (33:20.824)
Hahaha!
Vanessa (33:29.607)
Yeah, yeah.
Wilhelmina (33:29.836)
Yes.
that's what.
Lauren (33:32.929)
So I do the seasonal rule. If I get to that season where I think I'm going to wear it and I get to that season again and I haven't worn it, does that make sense? So like right now it's looking at all the stuff in the winter that last year I said, but what if, and then if I spent all last year and I never wore it, then it's out. I mean, it's hard.
Vanessa (33:42.301)
That's a good role. Yeah.
Teri (33:42.681)
the one year.
Wilhelmina (33:55.254)
No, it's tough for me too. I keep way too many things and I emotionally attached to things, but I love this outfit and I think I'm going to bring it back. no, I just doesn't like you don't. Yeah. So.
Lauren (34:01.325)
I
Vanessa (34:05.735)
Huh.
Lauren (34:06.608)
And you don't.
Vanessa (34:08.977)
And then we've talked about this before, because sometimes you say, well, this trend is going to come back, because lots of trends cycle. But we've talked about this. It never cycles exactly the same. So if you're willing to be that standout person who's like, I'm wearing vintage whatever, great. But it's not going to trend back exactly. And whatever you had in your closet probably now looks like you've pulled out something, and it looks.
Wilhelmina (34:14.785)
Yes!
Lauren (34:15.445)
Yeah.
Wilhelmina (34:19.106)
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
Lauren (34:19.295)
No.
Teri (34:28.417)
It's a different version.
Vanessa (34:36.111)
old. Like it looks like it's been sitting in your closet. Like it has that look to it.
Lauren (34:39.659)
Remember the seven wide leg jeans? I loved my sevens. I just donated them because wide leg jeans are back in style, right? I put those on. They are so low waist. I can't do it, right? I just donated them because I had kept them for exactly the reason Vanessa said. And they were in great shape actually. And I think they, I mean, I am sure they are still making that cut.
Teri (34:44.527)
Mm-hmm.
Wilhelmina (34:47.448)
Yes.
Wilhelmina (34:53.452)
That's what I was gonna say. I saved all my boot cuts. was like.
Vanessa (34:54.45)
Yeah.
Wilhelmina (35:01.176)
Yep. Yes.
Lauren (35:08.897)
but with a different waste now. And so I just donated them. It was like, we're done, right?
Wilhelmina (35:10.187)
Mm-hmm.
Vanessa (35:10.405)
or like a different kind of flair to it. Yeah. Yeah.
Teri (35:13.133)
I have a question. If low cut jeans come back, you're sort of back, but the ones, will you indulge in those?
Lauren (35:16.321)
Hope.
Lauren (35:21.581)
can't do it. I can't sit down and worry that I am like showing the world the nether regions.
Vanessa (35:21.732)
so I don't know I don't think so.
Teri (35:27.407)
like your butt crack?
Vanessa (35:28.051)
Especially like, you know, not even that, like I feel like after you have a baby or two, like your body's different. Like, I feel like the high rise give you like a little support. It's like built in support, you know, so I like my high rise.
Wilhelmina (35:32.694)
Yeah, I want to tuck it in a little. Yeah.
Teri (35:35.863)
God is
Lauren (35:36.543)
This doesn't work.
Right?
Wilhelmina (35:44.086)
And I actually think people look better with, I genuinely like, from like aesthetic, like it makes their legs look longer. It makes everything, everyone gets cut off with low rise. So I actually was like, I can wear a lot of these shirts that I always wanted to wear, but with low rise, I looked kind of like dumpy. But when all of a sudden, when you put it with high rise or like high waisted, it looks totally better. So I think actually from a fashion, like what actually looks good on a body, I think high waisted looks better than
Lauren (35:46.859)
I do. Lengthens them.
Teri (35:47.055)
Same. Same.
Wilhelmina (36:12.908)
the low rise, not to say that that's just, I'm sure it'll come back.
Teri (36:15.759)
Lowrise has a sort of a trashy element to it. Don't you think?
Wilhelmina (36:19.18)
Mm-hmm. All you can see is the thong coming out of the back. That's all I can picture right out.
Lauren (36:21.688)
Yes.
Teri (36:24.299)
It's... It's...
Vanessa (36:25.171)
I mean, it's probably also because we wore those when we were in our 20s, right? And you imagine what you were doing in them, right? So you correlate those things. You're like, yeah.
Wilhelmina (36:28.258)
Yeah.
Lauren (36:28.894)
it.
Wilhelmina (36:32.822)
He's in a cute top. He's in a cute top.
Teri (36:35.055)
Going out tap and a going out pop. Like this is a good going out tap
Vanessa (36:37.862)
Jeans and a Q-top, yeah, going on top.
Lauren (36:41.086)
What do you guys think of the concept of a work uniform? So in one of the articles I was reading and researching this topic, talked about how the people that are highly successful people, business people in different kind of areas and different professions, tend to adopt a work uniform because it frees up cognitive capacity. They reference Steve Jobs.
Wilhelmina (36:45.814)
Yes.
Vanessa (37:04.294)
I definitely have one.
Wilhelmina (37:06.966)
Yep. And Facebook, I...
Lauren (37:09.621)
Well, yeah, Facebook guy, what's his name? Mark Zuckerberg. But I thought about like Jennifer Aniston. She's always getting flack for wearing a little black dress on the red carpet, but she has remarked before it works for her exactly. So she doesn't have to think about it. She can put it on and she can keep it moving and it frees her up to engage. Again, we had kind of touched on this before, but to like engage cognitively in the rest of her life, as opposed to being focused on like, I'm doing something.
Wilhelmina (37:12.319)
Thank you.
Wilhelmina (37:16.268)
Yes!
Teri (37:19.769)
She looks great.
Wilhelmina (37:20.492)
We look stunning every single time. Yeah.
Vanessa (37:21.735)
Yes, yeah, yeah.
Lauren (37:37.697)
that's trendier out of my comfort zone and I don't feel great about it.
Teri (37:41.721)
Well, we have a finite amount of self-control and reserves per day to focus on what we need to do. It's why kids have meltdowns after school. It's called restraint collapse because you have used your resources. I always, the analogy I give my patients is that you start your day with a full bottle of self-control and cognitive capacities to focus on what you need to get done, your to-do tasks. And every time you have to exert self-control, even brushing your teeth, thinking about your
Lauren (37:47.361)
Right?
Lauren (37:53.079)
Right? Poor impulse control.
Lauren (38:09.873)
Yep.
Teri (38:11.725)
drive, even if it's the same commute every day, thinking about your drive to work, having to return calls for work, you're pouring out a little bit of that self-control. So as the day wears on, by the time you get to the afternoon and evening, you're pretty much tapped out and it starts over again by sleeping. And so if you can eliminate the wardrobe crisis in the morning, that's keeping some water in your bottle for other tasks that have to be accomplished that day.
Lauren (38:25.101)
We're done.
Lauren (38:30.848)
Right.
Lauren (38:34.807)
Right? I I think that's part of the reason behind school uniforms. Right? There's something to be said about that.
Wilhelmina (38:39.636)
Mm-hmm. Yeah. You know.
Teri (38:39.939)
Yes, yes. I like the idea of a work uniform. And since I mainly do evaluations nowadays, I don't see the same people very often. So one of my, one of my suitemates, Dan, the social worker that chairs my office suite, sees me. I'd even, I pointed out, said, I know I this last week. It's the same. He's like, I don't care.
Wilhelmina (38:46.72)
Yeah.
Lauren (38:48.621)
Same! I do-
Lauren (38:58.633)
sometimes I will wear it back to back days because I know I'm not seeing the same people.
Wilhelmina (38:58.744)
You
Vanessa (39:03.655)
I just like rotate the hang, like I put the shirt at the end. Like I have a small rack for, it's funny, like my work clothes section is very tiny compared to like my going out section, which is hilarious because I spend most of my time at work. And so I just put the shirt at the end so that like I go like, because otherwise I'm like, did I wear this last week? Just so that I can make sure that I'm like rotating it. But it's a very small, tiny rack of work clothes, which I laugh because I have like racks and racks of going out clothes and I don't.
Wilhelmina (39:04.118)
Mm-hmm.
Lauren (39:07.841)
Yeah.
Lauren (39:17.377)
Yep. They pull through. Yep. Yep.
See you around.
Vanessa (39:32.209)
go anywhere, i'm like why do i have
Lauren (39:33.901)
That's at 80%. That's at 80%, right?
Wilhelmina (39:38.008)
So I think I would struggle with it. I very much understand the logic behind it and the psychology. it would be less effort to just grab. When I was pregnant and just had my small little wardrobe of maternity clothes, I was like, this is amazing. I want to keep this forever because this is, I pack, I just put those things in.
Lauren (39:52.111)
right.
Wilhelmina (40:00.296)
I get up in the morning, I'm like, do I wear this shirt or this shirt? Done. Like it was so freeing. And I was like, I'm going to capture this feeling and I'm never going back. Yeah, that didn't last. but I will say one thing that I've been doing, I know you girls have heard me talk about this and this is not a sponsor. This is just something I truly love. I have been using Nuuly rental. Yes. And.
Lauren (40:22.435)
yeah.
Vanessa (40:22.479)
it's like rent the runway. Yes.
Wilhelmina (40:24.92)
For me, I like it because I do like to try new trends. do like that dopamine hit of new stuff. But I also am at the point where I'm like, I don't want to be spending all this money on just something I'm going to wear a couple of times for a quick dopamine hit. I do have that sustainability piece in the back of my head of like, let's not just keep buying stuff. So there's that. And just I like the refresh every month. And so I pay a set amount.
Lauren (40:36.503)
Right. Yeah.
Lauren (40:53.101)
was just gonna ask, what is it? Okay. Okay.
Wilhelmina (40:54.936)
It's like $90 and you get six items. And you can choose. So this isn't like Stitch Fix where they just send you stuff. This is you pick the exact outfit or the sweater, the size, pants, everything. And so you can do it for trips. I did it last year for our trip. I do it around the holidays because then you get like new holiday outfits that you're then not needing to buy a whole new holiday outfit.
Lauren (41:18.199)
for health.
Wilhelmina (41:22.154)
And so that for me has been a nice little, I've actually shopped a lot less because I'm able to kind of fill that cup, but I do it in a way that feels financially responsible for me, more so than like going out and spending a bunch of money, like environmentally responsible. And it still allows for that fun fashion flex for me that I get to like try on new stuff. So that's one way that I've been doing, and I do it for work a lot. So I get my little work out uniform for that month. It's like,
Lauren (41:44.129)
great deal.
Wilhelmina (41:49.634)
those two pants, these two sweaters, and I just sort of rotate through those. So that's how I kind of make it work.
Lauren (41:51.206)
Yeah.
Vanessa (41:56.883)
I try to do things that know that are what I would consider a staple in your closet, so a black blazer, a jean jacket. I'll spend more money on them. But anything that I think is going to be around for a minute, I will look for the cheapest. I won't invest a lot of money in it, just if it's something that I really like. But that's how I try to figure out, what am I willing to invest in, spend a of money on, versus
Teri (42:04.975)
you
Vanessa (42:26.555)
like, you what am I not? So I really try to figure out like, what is something that like, is a staple that's going to be around for a while, that's not like super, super trendy. And that's where I'm going to put my bang for my buck, right? Like that's where I'm going to spend more money versus something that's like, you know, like this is probably isn't going to stick around sort of thing, then I might, you know, get like a Amazon version of it or something so that it's not, you know, as expensive. So that's what I try to do when I'm trying to decide like,
Lauren (42:37.355)
Right.
Vanessa (42:51.763)
Do I want to spend the money on this? Like, is it worth it sort of thing? I try to figure out like how much am I going to be using it.
Lauren (42:59.073)
Well, and what Wilhelmina said before, it's like that idea that you buy five for, know, buy one shirt, get five free or whatever. It's like, that isn't, it's not sustainable. And that's probably not the thing that you're going to have around forever. So it makes more sense to spend the money on the one really nice item.
Vanessa (43:13.202)
Yes.
Vanessa (43:16.562)
Mm-hmm.
Lauren (43:17.473)
that is gonna be in your closet in five years from now that you're gonna know, like, that's in my rotation regularly. And you don't have to ask yourself that question, but like, what if I need it one day? Because you are regularly wearing it.
Wilhelmina (43:17.773)
Yes.
Teri (43:30.115)
Mm-hmm.
Wilhelmina (43:31.704)
Can we talk just one second with this, like how this factors into hair, like hairstyles for women? Because I think it's something that I've been very aware of recently in terms of, you know me, I used to love to change my hair, right? Like you have seen me in every hair color, I do cuts, I do it all. Like I just have always liked to change that up. And now I'm like, I'm too old to change my hair color that.
Lauren (43:35.969)
Yeah.
Vanessa (43:37.971)
Sure. Yeah.
Teri (43:48.77)
Is this it?
Wilhelmina (44:00.568)
drastically. I can't do pink. Well, can what if I can I do pink highlights? No, probably not. I mean, I could I could
Vanessa (44:01.811)
Don't say that.
I mean, you could, it just depends, what do you, like, you know, like, yes, like, are you just like, this is what I want for me and I don't really care, like what people think, like, then you could certainly do that. Yeah.
Lauren (44:09.067)
You're fine.
Teri (44:09.135)
Good.
Lauren (44:12.265)
What's the goal behind it, Willemie?
Wilhelmina (44:14.327)
Yes.
Wilhelmina (44:17.9)
Well, that is.
Lauren (44:19.851)
Yeah, then you should do it.
Wilhelmina (44:22.338)
but like those hair trends that are like how, we like age and hair trends.
Teri (44:23.576)
I do think
Vanessa (44:27.035)
Yeah, I mean, well, I think, you one of the things like historically, it's like when you get to certain age, you chop off your hair, you're not allowed to have long hair, which. Yeah, like that's exactly how it is. But now you have like, you know, you're like Demi Moore's who have long hair and like she looks great and that's like her thing, right? Like we all know her and we know that she's got long hair. So I think like, you know, that things have changed and I do think we're more accepting of long hair and women, right? Or like even color. I've seen plenty of.
Teri (44:33.359)
Yes, that's how was when we were growing up, looking for lot of women.
Lauren (44:35.789)
I was gonna say, I don't think it's that way anymore.
Vanessa (44:55.709)
people in professional jobs who have different colored hair. Like it just depends. And even like piercings, that's another good one. So when I was in high school, I had my nose pierced, my eyebrow pierced, all the things pierced, right? And I remember I had a job at a grocery store and they were, they told me you have to put a bandaid over your eyebrow ring. This is 1995, okay? And so many people would come in the store and they're like,
Wilhelmina (44:59.576)
That's true.
Lauren (45:00.897)
Yeah.
Wilhelmina (45:03.487)
yeah.
Wilhelmina (45:16.098)
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
Lauren (45:16.723)
Yeah. Yeah.
Vanessa (45:22.033)
this is so stupid, why are they making you do that? And my 15 year old self was like, I don't know. And now you go anywhere and everyone is like all pierced out. It's like completely acceptable. So I think those things change over time. But I do think, you know, it's easy to get kind of used to the way you look, right? And so I think that starts to contribute to difficulty kind of changing and maybe keeping up with trends. And so.
Teri (45:31.599)
Mm-hmm.
Vanessa (45:47.665)
you start to see yourself like, have long hair, that's who I am, this is my identity, right? And then you want to keep that. And so it's harder, I think, to kind of move with trends as you get older because you're used to the way you look, what works for you, and you kind of just stick with it. So I don't know, I feel like you can do whatever you want to do. I personally think that. But I also feel like there's that piece where you're used to how you look and it starts to get harder to change that.
Lauren (46:17.153)
And that's okay. Right? mean, I think that's an advantage. I think that's an advantage of getting older. We feel, it's like we feel better about where we're at. Yeah.
Vanessa (46:20.091)
I think, I mean, I think it's.
I think that if you're okay with it, then it's okay. I think it's building that strong, right? That building that strong sense of who you are. know, speaking of hair, I've always, there was years I can look back at pictures where I'm almost blonde from all the highlighting. And I remember like last year, my daughter was standing in the mirror in front of me and she says,
mom, she's like, I wish I was blonde. And I was like, why you have such beautiful brown hair like mommy? And she looks at me and says, no, you're blonde. And I'm like, OK, yes. You know, like, guess, I guess I am pretty blonde right now. And just being like mindful of like, you know, the message that you're sending to your kids, too. So I immediately went to the hairdresser and was like, OK, making you brunette again. Like, you know, I need to be need to have brown hair.
Wilhelmina (47:10.251)
Thank
Vanessa (47:12.765)
So yeah, so I think, absolutely, I think as you get older, you become used to who you are and you become less concerned about what other people think of you. But if you want to do the pink hair, you should do the pink hair.
Lauren (47:20.62)
Yeah.
Wilhelmina (47:22.06)
Yeah. I know I do. I really, love like cute pink highlights.
Lauren (47:24.247)
Do the pink hair.
Teri (47:25.295)
You're thinking.
Lauren (47:28.663)
Do it. Start with a little clip in or something and like, see if you like it. fun. Yeah. Yeah.
Wilhelmina (47:32.258)
I did that for the Pink concert when I went, got like clip in and I loved it. I was like,
Vanessa (47:39.411)
Yeah, you could do that. Any last thoughts on our topic today?
Lauren (47:46.027)
I think so.
Wilhelmina (47:46.808)
think the biggest thing is that the more that you can figure out who you are and that intersection between sort of being authentic to you and finding what makes you unique and then applying that to what you're wearing or your hair or any of that, you're going to be feeling good in what you're wearing. You're going to be feeling like you're making good choices.
Vanessa (48:14.47)
most important.
Wilhelmina (48:15.35)
Yeah, and you're not just spending money on things that you're never going to wear or you're not going to feel good in. So really holding on to that identity and your own self-concept of yourself. Yeah, absolutely.
Lauren (48:26.613)
And confidence is trendy all the time. So it'll come through.
Vanessa (48:29.127)
Yeah. And I think that's why people can wear, like sometimes you're like, man, how is she wearing that? And it's like, if you're confident, you can pull a lot off. It's all about how you feel in something. So whether it's trendy or not trendy, right? So you can see someone who's not wearing anything trendy, but she looks so confident and she's like, I got this. That comes across, you know, in whatever they're wearing. So it's not even, I think, about what you're wearing, but it's just that confidence. Absolutely. That's a big piece of hard presentation.
Wilhelmina (48:35.147)
Yes.
Lauren (48:37.121)
Yep.
Wilhelmina (48:41.911)
Yes.
Wilhelmina (48:45.941)
Absolutely.
Wilhelmina (48:54.392)
Yes, that's huge. mean, I've seen people like I've put on like hats. I'm a big hat person and people are like, I can't wear hats. I'm like, you can wear anything you want if you just like own it, like feel good. So yeah, absolutely. Confidence.
Vanessa (49:06.257)
Yeah, absolutely.
Vanessa (49:11.003)
Awesome. Well, that was a good chat, ladies. Thank you for joining us today. Join us next time on The Shrinkdown as we explore a new topic and add our psychology knowledge to it.