Good Growing

In this episode of Good Growing, horticulture educators Chris Enroth and Ken Johnson dive into the challenges of gardening during Central and Southern Illinois’ increasingly dry fall season. From flash droughts and cracked lawns to watering strategies for trees, shrubs, and cover crops, they share practical advice for managing your landscape in low-moisture conditions. Plus, a timely reminder about fire safety and a segment they have dubbed "Hose Talk." Tune in for expert insights and seasonal tips to keep your garden growing—even when the rain won’t fall.

Watch us on YouTube https://youtu.be/9PXCI5ddpBI

00:33 Hey Ken! It is dry.
01:37 How dry is it? Drought levels and recorded precipitation amounts.
04:34 Dry conditions in southern Illinois and a flash drought.
07:32 NOAA predictions for the next three months.
09:13 How does a fall drought affect our gardening this time of year?
11:59 Fall lawn planting. To seed grass or not to seed grass?
16:44 Watering trees in preparation for winter is a critical fall drought task.
19:26 Hose talk!
22:27 Planting fall cover crops during dry weather.
24:44 Fires during dry fall weather.
28:26 Thank you, and see you next week. 

US Drought Monitor: Illinois https://droughtmonitor.unl.edu/CurrentMap/StateDroughtMonitor.aspx?IL

NOAA Drought Forecasts https://www.drought.gov/forecasts

Blog posts by Illinois Climatologist Trent Ford:
Sept 4, 2025, August Ushered us From Summer to Fall https://stateclimatologist.web.illinois.edu/2025/09/04/august-ushered-us-from-summer-to-fall/

Sept 11, 2025, Drought is Intensifying in Illinois https://stateclimatologist.web.illinois.edu/2025/09/11/drought-is-intensifying-in-illinois/

Contact us! 
Chris Enroth: cenroth@illinois.edu
Ken Johnson: kjohnso@illinois.edu
 
Check out the Good Growing Blog: https://go.illinois.edu/goodgrowing
Subscribe to the weekly Good Growing email: https://go.illinois.edu/goodgrowingsubscribe
 
Any products or companies mentioned during the podcast are in no way a promotion or endorsement of these products or companies.

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Creators and Guests

Host
Chris Enroth
University of Illinois Extension Horticulture Educator serving Henderson, Knox, McDonough, and Warren Counties
Host
Ken Johnson
University of Illinois Extension Horticulture Educator serving Calhoun, Cass, Greene, Morgan, and Scott Counties

What is Good Growing?

Talking all things horticulture, ecology, and design.

Chris:

Welcome to the Good Going podcast. I am Chris Enroth, horticulture educator with the University of Illinois Extension coming at you from Mac Omb, Illinois, and we have got a great show for you today. I am dusting myself off as I walk into the office because it is dry and dusty out there. We're gonna be talking about how dry is it this time of year right now. And you know I'm not doing this by myself.

Chris:

I am joined as always every single week by horticulture educator Ken Johnson in Jacksonville. Hey, Ken.

Ken:

Hello, Chris. It is dry. Very dry. At least in Jacksonville it is. Mhmm.

Chris:

I I did a a demonstration this morning on lawn installation, and I have the grit of all the dust in my mouth still. So I'm like, yeah, every time I my teeth come together, it's just kind of this grinding sound. Hopefully, it's not TMJ. Oh, boy. Something wrong with my jaw?

Chris:

No. It's sand in my mouth.

Ken:

Where are your teeth down? I need dentures here.

Chris:

There you go. Yeah. I gotta smooth out those those back teeth there. Yeah. Oh, well, Ken, it it is dry.

Chris:

Dry. And it wasn't always like this, though. We had quite a bit of rain earlier in this year. Let's start by maybe giving an update, you know, what's been going on in our neck our own neck of the woods. So Jacksonville, what have you experienced this growing season?

Ken:

Yeah. So earlier early in the year, we had plenty of rain and just the spigot, as you say, just kinda turned off. I know we are looking at the drought monitor websites. We are currently in abnormally dry conditions. And I know in the looking at the ten day forecast, no rain predicted.

Ken:

I think the last I looked, the highest chance is like 20% chance of rain. So it's it's drying going to be staying dry at least for the next week or two, it looks like.

Chris:

Yeah. About about the same story here. We had a lot of rain in in June. July was incredibly plentiful with the precipitation. Looking at some of the the the precipitation totals near my backyard, July was over 10 inches, of rain fell during that month in Macomb, and some weather stations are reporting even higher amounts of precipitation, but but everybody's over 10 for the month of July.

Chris:

And then August, as you said, everything turned off. And the current precipitation, we did get a half inch a few weeks ago, but in total for August, we've got seven tenths of an inch for the month of August in Macomb. So that's it got very dry very quickly.

Ken:

Yeah. I'm not sure how much we got in Jacksonville for August, but I wouldn't be surprised if it's that or less. And we've we've had to start watering our vegetable garden to start doing that because I mean, when I was out in our front yard, we've got cracks I can fit my hand down into and hit my knuckles, and I'm still not touching the bottom of the cracks in our yard. So

Chris:

That's pretty dry. That when I when that is the sign I tell folks, when you can shove your finger between the sidewalk and the lawn, that is when we have to start watering our trees, which we'll talk about I think here in a little bit, but, don't wanna get ahead of ourselves. But that that is my sign for it's time to start. Forget about the lawn. Save the trees.

Ken:

Lose a small child in a crack.

Chris:

Yeah. The amount of snakes that also live down those cracks. I'm kidding, folks. I'm kidding. Stick your hand down there.

Chris:

See what happens.

Ken:

It's the brown recluses. Not really.

Chris:

You gotta look out for them. Ken is kidding. They don't brown recluses even in your neck of the woods, they don't survive our winters, do they? Or

Ken:

It depends on what map you look at. Sometimes

Chris:

Okay.

Ken:

Probably not up by you. Jacksonville would maybe borderline. Okay. But they're probably in your basement, not outside.

Chris:

Yes. They're in they're they're house spider. Like, they wanna be in the house. They don't wanna be outside. They like us.

Ken:

Remember, if you're cold, they're cold.

Chris:

That's right. Well, I I I I think we've established that that it is dry, but there's other things going on. So Trent Ford, he is our Illinois state climatologist. He did do a blog post on September 4, so it's been a couple days. But, you know, looking at sort of what the the state of Illinois has experienced from from the northern portions all the way to Southern Illinois, you know, really commenting about, you know, Northern Illinois has seen quite a bit of rainfall this later half of the summer, whereas with Southern Illinois has seen almost no rainfall.

Chris:

Actually, Carbondale has recorded only two hundredths of an inch of precipitation. I that's like the amount of morning dew that is accumulated in the the the rainfall catcher thing. The the the not the rainfall catcher thing. What's the official name for? Rain gauges.

Chris:

Telling you, dust is getting to me. And and so but August totals for up in Will County up in Northern Illinois has been over 10 inches in August, which is 300% higher than normal. So we have these two ends of the state, far north, far South, really at two opposite ends of the rainfall spectrum. And the other thing that Trent talks about is the humidity from the summer. My gosh.

Chris:

It was awful, Ken. I it it was I've never experienced that. Now you lived in Florida, so maybe you have. But that amount of humidity, it was unbelievable, unbearable.

Ken:

It's definitely having some flashbacks to to to why we why we moved back to Illinois. Yeah. It's, yeah, uncomfortable. And and going back to your the drought stuff in Southern Illinois, there is a rapid onset of drought kind of outlook, for that just because it is we've had so little precipitation. It's going to be getting hot again.

Ken:

We've had our our first false fall, and now summer is coming back. By the time people are listening to this, I think it's going be back into the nineties again. So that, you know, no rain, dry, or no dry conditions, warm weather again, we still have plants, you know, drawing on moisture and releasing it. We've got that those possibilities for that really rapid onset drought, because of that.

Chris:

I like the name that, Trent has in this, blog post. He calls it flash drought. You know, if there's, like, flash flooding, now there's flash drought, which is a new word for me. That's that's a whole new word word that I I will use from now on, when it gets dry in a hurry. So, Ken, I guess maybe a few other items just weather related.

Chris:

You know, if we look at the extended forecast, what NOAA predicts, you know, we're we're kind of sitting in the realm of could be warmer, could be cooler than average, could be wetter, could be drier than average. But when we look at some of the the drought predictions from NOAA, Southern Illinois remains in this three month period, in this three month outlook. Southern Illinois remains still the probability of being about 33 to 40% drier than normal. And and again, with us in Central Illinois, it's kinda like, could be dry, could be wet. We're we're not quite sure.

Chris:

So but it seems like that dry weather pattern is gonna hold up for Southern Illinois. But it does look like when we look ahead at the three month outlook for temperature, most of Illinois is going to be, let's see if I find the correct key here. It's like we're about 40% higher than than the normal temperatures, or the probability is to be have a 40% probability being higher than normal temperatures.

Ken:

So, yeah, hot and dry. Mhmm. You're saying, well, relatively hot. Yep. I'm hoping we're not 90 in November and December.

Chris:

Boy, that would not be fun. The garlic will like that. Garlic's gonna go nuts if we're nice and warm, and then it's gonna get hit by a frost that you can just see it coming. So how does all of this weather affect our gardening? You know, we often tell folks, hey, fall is a great time for planting things.

Chris:

Normally we get some rainfall return after a really variable summer season. Ken, what what why why should we even care? I mean, we live in Illinois. We got so much water. Who cares?

Chris:

We got groundwater. We got lakes. We got rivers, ponds, streams. There's water everywhere.

Ken:

There is. Yeah. So you're normally like

Chris:

Until there isn't.

Ken:

Exactly. So like like I said, you know, typically, this would be the time of year where the rains are are coming back and a little more consistent. And because that, you know, we're we're planting a lot of times trees, shrubs, time per year to plant grass is the best this is the best time of year typically to plant grass and stuff. But if we're not having that water, we probably need it with the models predicting that, you know, we're gonna stay dry at least next thirty days. You may want to think twice about that if if you're not gonna if you don't have the capability or the desire to constantly not constantly, but consistently water stuff, to get that established.

Ken:

So, you know, with trees, they're gonna need quite a bit of water, you know, if you're planting new trees. I know we're at the State Master Gardener Conference last week. One of the the super seminars is tree planting that Emily was doing. And and I before I left, I grabbed my mattock for her so she could dig the holes because the ground was so dry and there's a lot of clay. We could not do it with a shovel.

Ken:

We had to use the mattock, which is kinda like a pickaxe, if you're not familiar with what that is, to get to dig a hole. So if if, you know, you're central to Southern Illinois, if you're planting trees, you may want to look at watering for several days beforehand just to get that soil loosened up and moist so you can actually dig it. And then you're going have to stay on top of that and mulching to help retain that that moisture and stuff. Mums this time of year, you know, everybody's got mums for sale. Mums are very shallow rooted plants.

Ken:

If you want to try to overwinter those, you know, get them established in the landscape. We talked about this last year, planting those earlier, sooner rather than later, and then again staying on top of that moisture, mulching that, helping them get established. If you're just, you know, you're growing them as a temporary thing, you know, water as usual and stuff, but probably not gonna don't, I guess, plan on relying on rain to get you the moisture you need. And then with grass, you know, you're gonna have to keep that watered. And if you're doing really large areas, like your whole lot yawn, that may be, that may be a whole lot of work.

Ken:

You may be dragging a lot of hoses or look at getting one of the sprinklers the that will gonna walk itself so you don't constantly have to move stuff. Those are usually Interesting. Those like little tractors, they pull out a string and like it'll walk itself forward and it gets to the end, it'll shut off. Where have I been? When I worked at ground screw at the high school, they handle I mean, if you were doing these on athletic fields, yeah, you'd set it out and it'd walk itself forward.

Chris:

I think I've seen those. Some of them are like cutesy and they look like little tractors. They're on wheels. I just thought it was cutesy. It's supposed to move.

Ken:

Yeah. Ones the least ones we had, there's a string attached to it. You run it out, put it on a stake, hook up the hose and I don't know how it actually worked on with the water pressure just kind of forced it along, but it would spin out the water, walk forward, roll forward and then it got to the end, it hit it and that would Neat. Compress something and shut it off. But again, that's really big.

Ken:

And like if you just got a postage stamp yard, you're gonna be watering everybody's lawn around you probably, but

Chris:

Well, that's cool. I so this morning, I just did the, a lawn installation demo with with with seed. And so, yeah, right now, I would be hard pressed to suggest to folks to to seed, like, their entire lawn, you know, like, more than half an acre of lawn. I mean, we did a small area along a sidewalk that was being flipped from planting bed back into lawn. And, yeah, it's it's super dry.

Chris:

I can't imagine keeping up with water right now on a larger scale than than this. This is basically a spot where you can cover the whole area with with one little sprinkler that's on, like, half power or, like, you know, I have the the water spigot really dialed down towards, like like, just give it enough so that the sprinkler head moves back and forth. But, yeah, I I would not really suggest right now seeding an entire lawn unless you have some kind of dedicated irrigation system, you have one of these mobile walk in irrigation things, or you're prepared to to follow-up next year with more seed.

Ken:

Yeah. Or you wanna drag hoses everywhere.

Chris:

Yes. I don't wanna do that. So yeah. Lawn's on its own. And we've we've experienced this though for like several years, think.

Chris:

I it I feel like every time we get to mid August, late September, this is the time when I should be telling folks, yes, you need to be seeding your lawn. You need to this is the time to do it. And for the last two, maybe three years now, it has been just just terribly dry this time of year, and which has forced people to to wait, and and maybe try it in spring where where spring lawn seeding is not as successful. It can work. You just you have cold soil.

Chris:

You know, you're you're dealing with, just your all the annual summer annuals are starting to germinate also at that same time. You just have a lot of competition going on in the springtime. So, yeah, I this time of year is ideal.

Ken:

And by the spring, you're going into hot weather. Yes. Surely ever it's getting established and stuff. So Yeah.

Chris:

Yeah. So if we could do it now, this now would be the time, but we just don't have the soil moisture to to be as successful. And it always kinda pains me to take potable water and throw it on the ground for a lawn. I'll do it for a tomato, but a lawn hurts a little bit.

Ken:

Yeah. And, yeah, depending on your your water source, it can get expensive.

Chris:

That's true. Yes. Yeah. Like, the amount of water that's required right now is not rain barrel size. Like, unless you have a thousand gallon rain barrel somewhere, you know, they don't you can't really find cisterns anymore where people use those type of water catchments or rainfall catchments underground.

Chris:

So it's it's potable water, well water, rural water, yeah, some kind of treated water.

Ken:

Yeah. So instead of I guess spending our time on our lawns, which, you know, if you want to, great, but maybe think twice about it because of the amount of water you're going be needing. What we should probably be looking at though, especially as we're heading into the end of the fall and eventually winter, is those perennial trees, those woody plants, trees and shrubs, so especially trees. Yeah, well established trees, you know, can pull a lot of water, but when we're getting this dry for this long, we probably want to start looking at adding some supplemental watering, for those trees. And we've, seen pictures pop up here and there on social media and driving around a little bit, starting to see some scorch on trees because it is getting dry.

Ken:

So even those old mature trees, we would maybe getting to the point where we want to start thinking about watering those. So, and especially newer stuff, younger stuff, getting that water so we're going into the fall and into the winter where we have that good moisture in the soil, especially for evergreens and stuff. Because when we start getting those cold, dry winds, we don't want lot of desiccation. We want that that moisture levels to be adequate. So we're not getting a lot of desiccation, winter burn and stuff on those.

Chris:

Yeah. I'm I'm glad you mentioned evergreens. That's a biggie. You know, what you think about trees, also our boxwoods, our rhododendrons, those retain broadleaf evergreen foliage, which are more susceptible to desiccation in the winter, and and so yeah, I need to make sure especially before we get to freezing, that freezing temperatures that they are going into winter not in a deficit of water because they are going to get scorched as they have in the past. So I I need to make sure to at least be on top of it with those.

Chris:

And and for me, you know, we have woods behind our house, those trees are pretty much on their own, but I do have some ash trees in the front of my house which I have spent a lot of money protecting from emerald ash borer, so they also will be getting water supplemental irrigation. Just I can't help myself. I I love the I love the habit of the white ash tree. I love the fall color. They're great trees.

Chris:

There's a reason why we over planted them. They're tough. They're good trees. And, yeah, they're almost gone now.

Ken:

Yeah. I'm glad you mentioned rhododendron because we planted some way in our backyard where we've got a lot of shade. We have to drag we have to drag a lot of hoses out there to keep those watered.

Chris:

Grab the hose, Ken. Buy some extra. Those lightweight hoses, I like those quite a bit, but they do they don't last as long as the heavy duty ones. I do like those lightweight ones.

Ken:

Yeah. We got one of the ones that, you know, shrinks down Mhmm. And snags it on something and it is now. I think more water is coming out the side of those than the end of those. So

Chris:

I I just I just threw away a favorite hose of mine. It was just a blue rubber hose, but somehow there was a hole in it and water got between the two liners. And the hose just blew up like a balloon, and I got terrified. Like, the entire hose. Like, the it was like like this giant anaconda was like blue anaconda was behind me, and I thought it was going to explode.

Chris:

I, like, ran over to the spigot, turned it off, and it that water stayed in there. And I tried to try to drain it out so I could toss it in the trash, but it was still very heavy, very full of water.

Ken:

Like, make some drip irrigation out of it.

Chris:

That's a good point. I should have held onto it and poked some holes in it, and there's my own personal drip line.

Ken:

Yeah. We've had the the the another one of those hoses that shrinks up when you don't have the water on. Somehow the you know, they got the fabric on the outside that got kinda torn and the inner plastic rubber swelled up like a balloon. I did not shut it off. I let it go until it burst just to see what happens.

Ken:

And filled up with a lot of water before it finally

Chris:

Well, this has been hose talk with good growing. The the other thing while we're while I'm thinking of this, make sure you're undoing your hose from the spigot. Just just do it right now. Even if you're putting it right back on, those things confuse together, especially if you're going if have like a brass spigot and, an aluminum or some other type of metal, hose fitting, they can fuse together. You don't wanna be doing this right before it's about to hard freeze.

Chris:

Do it right now. This is your friendly reminder.

Ken:

Yes. I did not listen to that friendly reminder last year, and I still have a hose stuck on my That's yep. That's why

Chris:

I

Ken:

had hacksaw to cut it off. You

Chris:

just you get those splicers. You just have, like, multiple splicers by the spigot and the all these old hoses.

Ken:

Just reaching to the ground. Yeah. So

Chris:

So but yeah. But that was great great hose talk, Ken. I I'm I'm glad we we we delved into that side road. And so, yeah, I I think is there anything else we wanna talk about, you know, landscape wise, garden wise in terms of keeping those plants hydrated at this point in time? Do you need to do anything with your cover crops?

Chris:

Like, do you do you plant cover crops right now? Are you going to then have to water them?

Ken:

Yes. I just just bought a whole bunch. And then we're gonna have to plant them. We're going to to water them in and we'll probably have to keep on top of that. Because yeah, if it's it's dry like anything else, they're just going to sit there.

Ken:

So, yeah. If it's going to be really dry, may want to think about how badly you want to do cover crops because you will have to you will have to water it. It's going be just like planting a turf or grass seed. You've got to you're gonna have to water those to get them established and stuff. So that may be something, you know, if if you haven't bought them yet and then you're in the central or southern part of the state, and then predictions hold, we're not getting any rain.

Ken:

That may be something you think twice about doing if you don't if you don't wanna have to water those constantly.

Chris:

You had mentioned before we started the show that folks are, that that do alfalfa plantings or second guessing alfalfa plantings this time of year. Just no not enough soil moisture, and you're not irrigating a field of alfalfa Unless you have a center pivot, but I don't know many people that would spend that amount of money on something like that.

Ken:

Yeah. So you have the home garden, yeah, where you can water. You can do it, but yeah. Again, you know, weigh that with having to water that. If you've got if you're planting that, you know, under a crop you already have and you're already watering, it may not be that big of a deal, but just just some food for thought.

Chris:

But then we did that just today. We we put our oats and radish. We we scattered them underneath our tomatoes, peppers, and cucumbers. And they're still on drip irrigation, so we'll still have to water them probably. Go in by hand, hand water around the bed.

Chris:

But, yeah, that that just happened today, September 9. Put the cover crop in.

Ken:

Have strips of cover crop.

Chris:

Yeah. Along the drip line.

Ken:

So I I got the email there. Ours our cover crop seed is in the mail or on the truck. So

Chris:

Well, Ken, one more thing about being so dry, and I I guess this is our our our warning. PSAs, Smokey the Bears, fire. It's a big deal. You don't maybe think much about wildfire in, in Illinois, but it happens. And it has been happening with fires that have escaped, into dry cornfields, and those fires could travel quite quickly.

Chris:

I mean, it kinda depends on humidity and wind and and other weather conditions, but anywhere from, like, a slow creep to upwards of 20 ish miles per hour, which I think both you and I confirmed, Ken, we cannot run that fast.

Ken:

Nope. Okay.

Chris:

Yeah. Can't can't do that. So, yeah, fire. Do do you do you practice in pyrotechnics in the fall months? Because I know I do.

Chris:

I have a little pyromaniac side of me that that loves to have like a little fall fire. Do you do such things, Ken?

Ken:

Not at our we live in town, it's not at our house. We you and me build a small fire and roast marshmallows and stuff. But my parents do as a kid, you know, we had lived out in the country, so to speak. And we had, it was like 10 mature oak trees and we burned leaves. So that was lots of weekends that we were out burning leaves.

Ken:

So yes. So not as not as much as I used to in my younger days. If I didn't live in town, yeah, I probably would because buyer's fun. But when it's this dry, yeah, this is something to keep in mind, especially if you live in a more rural setting, if you have farm fields around you. I probably do not wanna be doing that.

Ken:

You don't wanna spark any of that stuff, catch it. Lead to some big problems and your your neighbors aren't gonna be happy with you if you burn their fields down. Mhmm.

Chris:

And I and I know we're getting into fire season for, like, habitat management folks that do prairies. You can even do timber burns in Illinois. And really the timber burns are usually pretty docile compared to the prairie fires that I have been a part of. And it would be one of those, like, you know, you have to really pay very close attention to the weather, to that relative humidity factor, and do not I I do not participate in controlled burns where I don't have somebody else in charge who has taken classes, who is certified as a a burn boss in Illinois, And always always be contacting the local fire department. And, yeah, do not do not go out and say, ah, I'm gonna start burning right now.

Chris:

That's probably not a great idea. We probably wanna wait till we have some precipitation, a little bit of more moisture on the ground, and then maybe wait more into the wintertime.

Ken:

Just be smart about it. Mhmm. If it stays dry, hold off. Say, if you're gonna do one, have those nearby. So if if something does spark, he can hopefully get it out.

Chris:

Mhmm. Extra set of eyes, extra long hose, couple extra buckets of water. Yeah. Plan for the worst. Well, that was a lot of great information about dealing with fall drought.

Chris:

Year after year after year, it seems like. It's like we're on a Groundhog Day loop here of this dry fall weather. And we have to talk about it now, folks, so that it actually rains. Because if we didn't say anything, it wouldn't rain. But now that we've said something, it it's supposed to ring.

Chris:

Right?

Ken:

Is that

Chris:

right, Ken? Is that how it works? It's gonna rain on Thursday before this comes out. Exactly. People be like, what are we listening to?

Chris:

Or maybe we'll just throw this episode in the trash can and start over. Well, the Good Growing podcast production of University of Illinois Extension edited this week by me, Chris Enroth. Hey, Ken. Thanks for hanging out today, looking at the the NOAA maps and in the backyard, the crispy backyard in both our cases, and and talking about the dry fall weather that we're experiencing.

Ken:

Yes. Thank you. And we have to go buy some new more hoses and drag them out to my rhododendrons and get those watered. Mhmm. Let's do this again next week.

Chris:

Oh, we shall do this again next week. It'll be more horticultural hijinks. We'll see if it's rained, and we'll see what the topic is of the week. It might change based on the weather. So listeners, thank you for doing what you do best, and that is listening.

Chris:

Or if you watched us on YouTube, watching. And as always, keep on growing. It is dry and dusty out there. Let me tell you. And I you know, I'm not doing this by myself.

Chris:

I am wait. Did I even I don't think I said that right. It is dry and dusty. Okay. Should we just keep going?

Chris:

Take two.

Ken:

Why why not? Okay.

Chris:

Take two. Sorry, Ken.