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Take your leadership to the next level with Bill Search. Looking at real world problems and offering practical solutions, Bill brings a biblical approach to leadership for a new generation.
Leadership Journey is a Lumivoz podcast.
[Unknown]: welcome back to the leadership journey this is your host bill search let me ask you
[Unknown]: a question have you ever had a small group just get a little tired little stale
[Unknown]: they just um they're going so strong and then something happens maybe it's a group
[Unknown]: you've been part of maybe it's group you lead maybe you have a leader that comes to
[Unknown]: you and says what do i do my small group was so awesome just a little bit ago and
[Unknown]: now i kind of hope they don't show up so i can just watch tv watching tv would be
[Unknown]: way more fun than our small group something happened helped me out
[Unknown]: so what do you do how do you coach that leader by the way the show notes are going
[Unknown]: to be available so wherever the notes are found within app or otherwise there's
[Unknown]: going to be a keynote and you can grab hold of that you can use it you can adapt it
[Unknown]: whatever you want to do with it totally fine by me so what we're gonna do in this
[Unknown]: session is we're just going to cover two things to do two issues and then what to
[Unknown]: do about those issues and then in the next episode we're going to cover two more
[Unknown]: and what to do about that but the show notes are gonna be in both places so you'll
[Unknown]: be able to find the whole deal and if you want to teach this to your people that's
[Unknown]: kind of why we do this by the way's the heartbeat behind leadership journey is to
[Unknown]: provide tools for you as a leader so that you can lead to others and so
[Unknown]: this topic breathing new life into tired small groups i think it's timely for any
[Unknown]: group ministry any season i don't care if you have small groups that meet home in
[Unknown]: homes that are more of that traditional small group vibe or if you have more of a
[Unknown]: mix model where you have groups that meet in classrooms sunday schools
[Unknown]: more learning environments anytime you gather people
[Unknown]: and that group was very exciting at one time and then just something happens what
[Unknown]: you do
[Unknown]: and so there's a couple books i'd recommend one is per parker and in fact i'm
[Unknown]: pretty sure nick lens did a did a a podcast on her book the art of gathering how we
[Unknown]: meet and why it matters if you haven't read that book it's really worth a the read
[Unknown]: it's quite a page turner parker is a very fine author and has much to say that it's
[Unknown]: applicable to group life and then if i can be so bold i'd recommend my own i be a
[Unknown]: central guide for small group leaders there's a second edition out i hope you don't
[Unknown]: mind me mentioning that but there's some stuff in there that really can just help
[Unknown]: you in the nuts and bolts of leading a group and so
[Unknown]: so why does a group get tired as i mentioned i'm gonna cover two of those today and
[Unknown]: then two more in a subsequent podcast so why does group
[Unknown]: well one is a leader begins to coast two is meetings become kinda tired and routine
[Unknown]: ah three relationships had a plateau and for purpose is lost so as i mentioned
[Unknown]: we're going to hit the first one and the second one in our time together today so
[Unknown]: so a liter coast we've all been there we've all been that leader before i mean
[Unknown]: sometimes you can really strike hard and the group is going along very well and
[Unknown]: you're very engaged as a leader and you're so excited about leading and every time
[Unknown]: you get one of those emails or text or a note from your small director pastor coach
[Unknown]: whatever we call that person you're very excited to read it and then something
[Unknown]: weird happens you go from very excited to hm well
[Unknown]: you read every other one and then after a while you just sort of put them in your
[Unknown]: junk mail file and hope they lose your email address and meanwhile the group that
[Unknown]: was so electric when they were showing up it there's some of the electricity's
[Unknown]: missing in fact some of the members are missing they don't even bother to tell you
[Unknown]: why they are missing
[Unknown]: and parker in her book
[Unknown]: she has this interesting idea about generous authority
[Unknown]: and she asked this question am i practicing generous authority and generous
[Unknown]: authority is a really kind of an interesting concept the idea is a combination of
[Unknown]: two things generous which you probably know what that means is giving something
[Unknown]: away and authority means you have a job to play you're the boss you're the leader
[Unknown]: and many of us are comfortable with one of two of those ideas but one or the other
[Unknown]: of those ideas but we're not necessarily comfortable with both those ideas so we
[Unknown]: end up being thrilled to be in charge or we're happy to give things away and what
[Unknown]: she talks about in one of the chapters in her book a big theme that kind of runs
[Unknown]: throughout her book is this idea of generous authority you have been commissioned
[Unknown]: with a role to play and therefore you have an authority you are permitted to say
[Unknown]: look this is how things ought to be but in the in the meantime you're to give those
[Unknown]: things away
[Unknown]: you're to allow other people to participate in the group
[Unknown]: and
[Unknown]: there's an interesting observation that parker makes she says that
[Unknown]: some people
[Unknown]: they they say look i i'm not like i'm not like an authority i'm more chill i take
[Unknown]: things a little more easy
[Unknown]: and and what she says is chill get this chill is selfishness disguised as kindness
[Unknown]: another way of putting it is when you abdicate your authority the responsibility
[Unknown]: you have as a leader to take responsibility for your group to lead your group when
[Unknown]: you say you know what actually the kindest thing i could do is give it away and not
[Unknown]: take any responsibility let the group do whatever it is the group wants to do sort
[Unknown]: of go with the flow let the gravitational pull of the group go in the direction of
[Unknown]: the gravitational pole of the group then if you're the leader and you abdicate that
[Unknown]: responsibility and you do it under the guys if like look i'm just an easy going
[Unknown]: soul live and let live man
[Unknown]: well if that's the kind of leadership you practice it really is selfish it isn't
[Unknown]: giving others away because you're actually punishing other people in the process
[Unknown]: what happens is that the otter elements of the group will take over the group and
[Unknown]: so rather than practice some
[Unknown]: leadership
[Unknown]: if you let the odd people run over the group then the group will take on the flare
[Unknown]: of that i'll give an example of this so there's a group that i'm a co leader of i'm
[Unknown]: not the direct leader of the group because as a leader i believe there's some
[Unknown]: places where i shouldn't be in charge of the big thing so i'm sort of an assistant
[Unknown]: to the leader in this particular group now it is a i'll describe it to you it is a
[Unknown]: group of about fifty
[Unknown]: men who meet so it's not so much a small group but there's small groups within this
[Unknown]: large group it's a group of fifty men in the average age of seventy two and if
[Unknown]: you're curious i'm fifty so that's my age so i bring the entire group down a
[Unknown]: generation you know when i show up i slide the group a little bit younger and uh
[Unknown]: there's only at any given moment two of us that are in our fifties when everybody
[Unknown]: else was in their seventy seconds eighty seconds and we actually have a guy who is
[Unknown]: a korean war vet in his ninety seconds and we just lost our last world war two vet
[Unknown]: who is almost one hundred so it's an old group okay so you get the picture of an
[Unknown]: old group and this last time we had a meeting one of the fellows
[Unknown]: gave a nice political joke and it definitely gave away his political persuasion so
[Unknown]: it wasn't like a political joke that made fun of everybody it made fun of one party
[Unknown]: and one politician in particular and there were some chuckles in the group so
[Unknown]: afterwards i went up to this uh gentleman and i said you know jean we'll just call
[Unknown]: them gene you know jean
[Unknown]: you know i i'm not easily offended by anything and i'm not even reacting to what
[Unknown]: you said politically but you have to understand jee that not everybody who attends
[Unknown]: this group shares your political persuasions that's not why we gather there are
[Unknown]: groups where people get together and talk about politics and certainly it's you
[Unknown]: know you're free after this group to go out for coffee and share your thoughts but
[Unknown]: when we're in this group it's best not to make jokes at the expense of one
[Unknown]: political party i said if you made fun of everybody everybody would roll with it
[Unknown]: when he kind of i can tell he was uncomfortable this is a guy who's easily almost
[Unknown]: thirty years older than i am and he didn't appreciate this my point of view on this
[Unknown]: and so i said there are men who have told me that they don't come to the group
[Unknown]: because they just assume that it's one stilted political point of view and they're
[Unknown]: going to be made fun of or at least it's just going to end up taking on that flare
[Unknown]: so i said to my friend because he is my friend i said you know my guess is you want
[Unknown]: as many guys to feel welcome here and if you want them to feel welcome it's best
[Unknown]: just to leave those kind of jokes aside there's plenty of other jokes you can tell
[Unknown]: now i don't know if he's gonna take my advice i don't know if he's going to
[Unknown]: if he's gonna uh kind of self edit but what i did do is i gave him a pretty good
[Unknown]: clue that this isn't what we're about as a group this is probably the third or
[Unknown]: fourth conversation like this i've had with different guys in the group i like a
[Unknown]: good joke a good political joke but we have to decide what we're about as a group
[Unknown]: and that's just one example of it's it's generous in the i didn't k bash him i
[Unknown]: didn't attack him i i didn't try to make him feel low
[Unknown]: i am for him but what i did do is i encouraged him to create a more welcoming
[Unknown]: environment so i i gave authority away to him to have an influence in the group but
[Unknown]: i wasn't willing to advocate my responsibility it's a authority that i have so
[Unknown]: so how do you practice a generous authority well generous authority it lives by
[Unknown]: serving
[Unknown]: and here's a few different ways that you can serve others you protect group members
[Unknown]: that's kind of what i was doing in that illustration i was protecting everyone's
[Unknown]: political point of view in fact i was protecting everybody from each other's
[Unknown]: political of view if i go to a bible study i don't want to hear about politics i
[Unknown]: don't need to hear that stuff
[Unknown]: number two by equalizing group members that generous authority brings all group
[Unknown]: members into equal footing with each other the person who tries to wrestle control
[Unknown]: of the group you bring them back and the person who isn't participating you try to
[Unknown]: lift them up and then through interconnecting group members so one of the ways that
[Unknown]: you can practice generous authority is by getting different people to relate so in
[Unknown]: this particular group that i just described with fifty fellows and one big room
[Unknown]: there's various tables and i sit at the last end back table
[Unknown]: sometimes by myself because that's the table a new guy shows up he comes in the
[Unknown]: door and he doesn't know where to sit so he sits at that table and i welcome that
[Unknown]: guy and i know most of the guys in the group so at some point a new guy comes in
[Unknown]: and i introduce the new guy to some other guys and then i attach them and there off
[Unknown]: into a new group now this is all done relatively organically not terribly organized
[Unknown]: fashion it's just me in the back that's the role that i play i try trying to
[Unknown]: connect these guys so this is examples of generous authority protecting group
[Unknown]: members equalizing them and then interconnecting them so
[Unknown]: ways that we can practice this generous authority in a group as by practicing good
[Unknown]: means in that group which if you if you're coaching a leader one of the things if
[Unknown]: the if the leader is getting kind of tired and posting talk talk to the leader
[Unknown]: about hey what's the tone and tenor of your group how are people getting along with
[Unknown]: each other how are people respecting each other so good manners make good friends
[Unknown]: you practice general generous authorities is a leader by when remembering or remind
[Unknown]: me of everybody of the rules of the group call it covenant call it whatever you
[Unknown]: want to call it and then encourage this is one that was very interesting in
[Unknown]: parker's book i thought i thought it was fascinating she said encourage people to
[Unknown]: make sprout speeches not stump speeches stumpp speeches are long and your wrestling
[Unknown]: control of the group is sprout speech is just a little pop up speech pickle ball is
[Unknown]: very popular right now and pickle ball is not rugby you get the ball you wanna hit
[Unknown]: the ball over the fence to the next person the game is played when each person
[Unknown]: barely touches that fall and moves that ball back and forth well that's really what
[Unknown]: we're talking about here is good interaction good conversation has an equality to
[Unknown]: it in the way that people interact with each other
[Unknown]: so coach and a leader you sense the leaders kind of coasting
[Unknown]: and maybe they told you they're getting real tired the group is feels real tired
[Unknown]: well what do you tell the leader to do well there's some of the very basic things
[Unknown]: that we always come back to if you have a if you have avenant some kind of a green
[Unknown]: some kind of ground rules for your group reaffirm that to have tough conversations
[Unknown]: within the group
[Unknown]: if the group is is uh in an odd place have the tough conversations encourage the
[Unknown]: group leader just to say i feel like things could be better what could i do better
[Unknown]: as a leader and then re up as a leader or get out this might be to you as you're
[Unknown]: listening to it you might need to hear that do i need to read or do i need to move
[Unknown]: on to something else or when you're talking to a leader do they need to react or do
[Unknown]: they need to get up and then uh finally encourage them to share leadership there is
[Unknown]: nothing quite like building into other leaders to sharpen you as a leader as i
[Unknown]: became an executive pastor years ago one of the things i learned was that
[Unknown]: developing other pastures giving away ministry to other pastors is one of the great
[Unknown]: joys of this work that when you're young and starting out in mi you're just trying
[Unknown]: to do a whole bunch of different things and sometimes you become very territorial i
[Unknown]: know i did in my younger years but as you get older
[Unknown]: the quality of giving things away is
[Unknown]: it not only is full of its own kind of joy but it helps you as a leader sharp of
[Unknown]: art so this is what to do if the leader is coasting now we talked about one of the
[Unknown]: other issues which is
[Unknown]: tired groups because of a routine meeting and this is um by the way is is i kind of
[Unknown]: hit these topics think about you as you are leading other leaders this is kind of
[Unknown]: self diagnosis for your group you could if your leader comes to you and says
[Unknown]: something's not quite
[Unknown]: going right and i don't know what it is the first thing is to ask them about their
[Unknown]: own leadership style what they're doing in their group are they controlling the
[Unknown]: group are they abdicating responsibility are they practicing generous authority but
[Unknown]: the other piece of it is is well tell me about your group what is it that you guys
[Unknown]: do where do you meet
[Unknown]: how do you practice your group what are the key elements in your group and if you
[Unknown]: kind of hear like a
[Unknown]: boom in the voice you know that part of the issue is that group i like this quote
[Unknown]: from jerry seinfeld the comedian he says the room is doing eighty percent of a job
[Unknown]: if you've ever delivered a talk a speech a sermon you know that's true you can have
[Unknown]: a great talk and if the room is icy cold or if it's just kind of spread out weirdly
[Unknown]: then the group can just not quite function right and so be very aware um than you
[Unknown]: matters venue matters the space
[Unknown]: should be a symbol or reason for meeting i mean this is one of the beauties of
[Unknown]: traditional small groups that meet in a home because the traditional small group
[Unknown]: sees itself somewhat as a family so meeting in a home is gonna reinforce that in
[Unknown]: fact that's one of the things that bugs some people sometimes it's like hey all
[Unknown]: small group does is get together and eat and talk yeah because you're meeting in a
[Unknown]: family ro and that's what you do in there but if you meet in a classroom a lot of
[Unknown]: the complaint is you know what it's just it's just kind of
[Unknown]: you know di it's just a teacher environment well that's true because you're meeting
[Unknown]: in a classroom so a small group even if it's twelve people sitting around a round
[Unknown]: table in the classroom still might feel a little more clinical and that's okay but
[Unknown]: just know that the the ideal is when you match up your your big picture of what
[Unknown]: you're trying to do as a group and the space that you're meeting in
[Unknown]: the the space should bring out desired behaviors and discourage the behaviors you
[Unknown]: don't want i think about that for a minute that's why in classrooms so often
[Unknown]: students sit in roads at desks you really don't want them interacting you want all
[Unknown]: eyes forward right
[Unknown]: that's and that's that's kind of key to that environment and so a space should
[Unknown]: bring out those behaviors again this is where the the living room space it's not
[Unknown]: just having a big space it's having appropriate seating around that space
[Unknown]: incidentally a lot of groups mine included use video so what do you do when you're
[Unknown]: not going to be in a circle because you have a big tv to look at well my small
[Unknown]: group we kind of layer up we have two or three rows while we're watching the video
[Unknown]: and then i encourage people to move and change their chairs around it doesn't
[Unknown]: always work by the way some people like nah i'm good here i don't mind looking at
[Unknown]: the tiffany's uh back of her head that's fine and she got my chair but ideally
[Unknown]: people circle up so the space should bring out the desired outcomes by the way that
[Unknown]: circle discourages people from having side conversations and then consider
[Unknown]: what parker talks about in your book consider density you need to have enough
[Unknown]: people to make the room feel good
[Unknown]: and yet not too many that people uncomfortable if anything the pandemic has shown
[Unknown]: us is that
[Unknown]: there's different seasons where people consider density percentages to be
[Unknown]: appropriate and during different eras it's uh oh i wanna be in a mostly empty room
[Unknown]: but in other eras of the pandemic it's been oh we're fine i want to be in a packed
[Unknown]: room or i want to be close with people well within groups at least were very
[Unknown]: cognizant if you have two or three people in a very big room that's not very fun at
[Unknown]: all and if you have five or six people in a small room that could be very fun so
[Unknown]: just think about density it's not just about having adequate seating you might have
[Unknown]: more than adequate seating so if you have eight people at a dining table the seat's
[Unknown]: twenty it will kind of feel like nobody came to your party but if you have eight
[Unknown]: people around the table that seats six it seems like you're the most popular place
[Unknown]: to be so keep that mind so the format also matters it's not just the space the
[Unknown]: format matters mix it up
[Unknown]: if you have been doing the same old thing for a long long time then mix it up if
[Unknown]: you've been doing video for a long long time then here's a crazy idea grab one of
[Unknown]: those old bible studies from the like nineteen
[Unknown]: late nineties they still make 'em and actually read the scripture and go through
[Unknown]: something like that um but mix it up curtail the dull parts we all know the parts
[Unknown]: that get really boring so you know what cut those cut them right in the middle if
[Unknown]: necessary and then try different curriculum not just different formats of
[Unknown]: curriculum but try different curriculum you know if you constantly used one voice
[Unknown]: use a different voice try different ones my small group we tried i tried to
[Unknown]: introduce them to nt wright he has a bunch of video curriculum tons of it out there
[Unknown]: now it just seems that i think as i am filming this he's filming two video
[Unknown]: curriculum simultaneous he's that brilliant okay he's not really doing that but
[Unknown]: he's very good stuff i like it my small group didn't on the other hand it was just
[Unknown]: a little over their head and so they sat through it and uh after a few sessions
[Unknown]: they're like bill can we do something else
[Unknown]: and that's okay i'd rather they be honest so we moved on we're doing this dan
[Unknown]: kimble and uh he's got a video curriculum on how not to read the bible and if
[Unknown]: you've never seen dan teach he's really terrific teacher so anyhow that was all for
[Unknown]: free right there and then what do you do now well here's some things you can do
[Unknown]: when when um when you are in the middle of needing routine you rotate host who
[Unknown]: hosts the thing so if you are o's host get someone else to try out different places
[Unknown]: you know what have a testimony time spend a couple of weeks and instead of doing
[Unknown]: the normal routine say everybody rotate through and you're gonna share your your
[Unknown]: fifteen minute testimony or your ten minute testimony depending on how many people
[Unknown]: in your group it's pretty remarkable when people share their story i'm amazed what
[Unknown]: comes out when people share their testimony even if you've done that but you
[Unknown]: haven't done that like three years do it again i'm pretty sure don't remember
[Unknown]: everybody's story and they'll probably remember yours either you could also serve
[Unknown]: together do something as a group that's outside of your normal group and then
[Unknown]: choose an unlikely meeting spot
[Unknown]: so you know if you're always doing the same thing in the same place then go
[Unknown]: somewhere else and enjoy that different environment so those are a few things that
[Unknown]: you can do if you want to mix it up with your group and so as i mentioned we're
[Unknown]: talking in this session and the next session why a group gets hired and we've
[Unknown]: covered well the liter begins to coast and how do you know that and what do you do
[Unknown]: about that and then we just covered the meeting becomes routine the next time we're
[Unknown]: together we're going to cover the other two which is relationships hit a plateau
[Unknown]: they all do at some point what are you gonna do about that and then the purpose of
[Unknown]: the group is lost so until next time i look forward to our time together