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From Here Forward shares stories and ideas about amazing things UBC and its alumni are doing around the world. It covers people and places, truths, science, art, and accomplishments with the view that sharing better inspires better. Join hosts Carol Eugene Park and Jeevan Sangha, both UBC grads, in exploring solutions for the negative stuff out there — focussing on the good for a change, from here forward.
[00:00:00] Carol Eugene Park: Hello, friendly alumni. You're listening to From Here Forward, an award-winning UBC Podcast Network podcast. I'm Carol
[00:00:08] Jeevan Sangha: And I'm Jeevan
[00:00:09] Carol Eugene Park: So back in June, Alumni UBC asked the public on Instagram who they believed was the most famous alum. there were 32 alumni, and every round, the UBC community in Vancouver and abroad cast their votes.
[00:00:23] and after a few weeks of this friendly competition, the UBC community spoke their truth. And I, for one, love participating in polls and pop quizzes on Instagram, so I was already excited. But it was great learning about alumni that I had little to no knowledge of. And who knew? UBC had some really cool people walking its campus
[00:00:47] Jeevan Sangha: It's so crazy to think that I walked the same halls the likes of Nardwuar, Hannah Simone, Gabor Maté, and so many more. Are so incredibly excited to share this month's guest, the winner the Alumni UBC bracket, the most famous alum, none other than Rick Hansen. Athlete, activist, and global advocate for disability rights. I mean, Rick Hansen is truly a Canadian legend. We had the amazing opportunity to talk to him about his world-famous Man in Motion tour, the obstacles he faced at UBC when conversations around accessibility and disability were even more stigmatized than they are today, um, and so, so much more
[00:01:33] Carol Eugene Park: So, we hope you enjoy as much as we enjoy talking with him, trying so very hard to appear cool, calm, and collected so, normally I would ask who are you, what you do, but you are the most famous alum, so that feels like a very boring way to start. So how would your friends describe you?
[00:01:52] Rick Hansen: Oh, hey, Carol. it's great to be joining you guys and, thanks for including me. I think my friends would kind of call me, the guy who's the energizing bunny, who loves to go after goals and dreams and adventures and bring people together and, you know, I guess the term man in motion, actually applies in real life.
[00:02:10] Jeevan Sangha: That's lovely. it's so great to be here with you and to learn more about your journey. And I guess a great place for us to start as a UBC alumni podcast is with the fact that you were recently voted UBC's most famous alum by tens of thousands of other UBC alumni like us. what was your reaction like?
[00:02:32] w- did you find out?
[00:02:34] Rick Hansen: Maybe there were some AI bots working in my favor or something. That was my first my first-- What? I didn't even know that it was happening until someone, you know, gave me a heads up and, and I, and I went, "Oh my gosh, I can't believe that, you know, alumni and whoever, decided that they would put their time into voting actually chose me."
[00:02:52] It's like an honor and, I'm a proud UBC alum and I've done work with UBC for decades. But it's just kind of cool to have somebody think that maybe I've made a difference.
[00:03:02] Carol Eugene Park: How did your family react? And I'm specifically curious about, like, your grandkids and your kids. were they humbling you? Were they excited for you?
[00:03:11]
[00:03:11] Rick Hansen: Well, my wife is always my best supporter, and so she was, very proud and excited. But all three of my daughters, have gone to UBC, and so they're proud alumni as well. they were very excited when they heard all about it. So yeah, it was really neat.
[00:03:24] And, you know, it, it, it really, I think it brought us all back to our, experience at UBC. sometimes when there's a focus for that, it brings back great memories of when I was a student and, how UBC kind of opened my whole mind to the world and started me on a whole different trajectory.
[00:03:43] but it also reminded me of how they've been good to, our children and, you know, and has helped them, you know, move down their careers and influence their lives as well
[00:03:52] Jeevan Sangha: I feel like university is a big place where so many of us kind of explore these different elements of our lives, whether it's like our social relationships, kind of building resilience, exploring like what kind of adult, what kind of human do I really wanna be and how am I building that in real time?
[00:04:09] And so as a, as three proud UBC alumni here, I'm curious about how that time at UBC that you spent, helped shape the person who eventually took on the Man In Motion tour
[00:04:23] Rick Hansen: I'm so grateful for my experience at UBC, and it almost never happened. my Phys ed coach, Bob Redford, up at Williams Lake in grade 11 when I came back after my injury, he got me into being an assistant teacher. he and the principal kind of broke some rules, and I'd come in and, you know, teach math or, you know, or, or science and also help coach. And, and so that gave me, you know, a, a sense of confidence that I perhaps could do what I wanted to do, which was to be a Phys ed teacher, a coach, and to be able to, help educate.
[00:04:58] but I didn't, I didn't really think that it was possible being in my chair. And Bob encouraged me to apply to, physical education at UBC. And, and so I did. Sent the letter down and, I told him who I was, and the letter came back. I was, you know, I was in this little, little Phys ed room in the gym with my coach, and I opened it up and, "Dear Mr. Hansen, thanks for your, your application. Unfortunately, we can't accept you into physical education, at this time. we encourage you to come down and take first year arts and science, and we can talk later," kind of thing.
[00:05:33] And I just saw that as a huge rejection, and I was just-- I, I kind of threw the thing in the garbage. And, my coach, Bob Redford, said, I know it's disappointing, but, you know, I, I listened to that letter when you read it out and it sounded to me less of a rejection and more of a challenge."
[00:05:50] and I said, "What do you mean?" He says, "Well, you know, think about it from their perspective. You know, they've never accepted anybody in a wheelchair before into physical education. There's probably some stigma and bias, and they probably wanna get to know you and see who you are. Maybe, you know, you're setting a precedent for others, so you don't wanna mess it up. And so why don't you go down and take first year arts and science?" And I went, " Okay."
[00:06:12] And so, so that conversation vectored me to UBC. And, and, and a year at Totem Park was, was one of the one of the greatest social experiences of my life. And, my marks, suffered a fair bit. But, when I finally got the word that I was gonna be accepted, thanks to Bob Schuetze, at physical education.
[00:06:32] and he said, "You know, you're in, but, you know, let's check your marks." So anyway, luckily my marks just barely made it and, and, and I was accepted and it was so incredible.
[00:06:43] So UBC was such an adventure though. I, I met so many amazing people there, I, learned a lot about myself. got to, you know, stretch my horizons and, the barriers were all over the place at UBC, so I was very fortunate that I could actually walk on crutches and braces, hop in my rehabilitation to-- 'cause Williams Lake was filled with stairs, so I could, you know, do that at UBC.
[00:07:10] And I was still kind of trying to get comfortable with my body image, you know, having lost a lot of weight in my legs and, and the wheelchair was still in my mind a bit of a symbol of disability. So, I'd use my chair mostly in sports and/or in my room, But I had a class at Buchanan and 10 minutes later, another class out at Winter Sports and, and back again for another one, you know, at Hub.
[00:07:33] And, and I had to, I had to just be pounding my way through, and I had 25 pounds of, you know, books for my, for my day on the back and, and I'd arrive maybe five minutes late and come hopping in, and I'm drenched with sweat.
[00:07:47] But, I just thought after about maybe three weeks that this is not sustainable. There's gotta be a better way. And I looked down at my wheelchair, and I went, "Yeah." I put my crutches under the chair, pack on the back, and then blew ahead of everybody else, got there to the stairs, took my crutches out, and then hopped up.
[00:08:03] And, and then it becomes a much more healthy reality that the wheelchair is my, technological opportunity. It's a chariot for freedom and in motion and getting those stigmas out of your head to keep clearing the way for a great life.
[00:08:18] And, of course, then there's the moments where teachers, you know, they change everything Lionel Pugh was a, you know, our coaching, you know, an athletic fundamentals, you know, prof.
[00:08:28] said, "How many athletes here, are involved in sport?" And everybody put their hand up pretty much. "And how many of you can say that, you know, if you were stopped by some accident or a reason today that you would have no regrets and that you were focused and you actually put everything towards excellence?" and, you know, maybe a quarter of the class hands went up and mine didn't. That really hit me because he said, "Sport is a window, of time, a moment in time, and it's, in your youth, and then it disappears rapidly, depending on what sport. But education is lifetime, and any of you who are doubting, that question, should rethink because you don't wanna have any regrets." And I came out of that class, and I realized that I was involved in multiple sports. And I was just, like, stretched to the, to the gills. You know, even just trying to live with my disability was, a huge time commitment.
[00:09:22] And so, I came out of there and I, I consolidated some of my units, sort of streamlined my sports, picked one, you know, in track and marathon and everything shifted from that, and it was a powerful moment.
[00:09:35] And other moments at UBC, like, you leave your wheelchair at the base of the stairs and go up to a chem class and come out and it's gone. And it was the, it was the engineers, those cheeky guys that came in and stole my chair and took it for a burn. And, you know, the campus police found them and brought it back and, and I ended up meeting them though because they were apologetic.
[00:09:56] They didn't know. And it turned out that one of them actually he ended up building a brand-new racing wheelchair in his mechanical engineering, course. and another one was in chemical engineering, and he put together the, the, the molded seat that would go in the chair. And, and it turned out that that helped me actually get about 10% efficiency in my wheeling, helped me win a gold medal, my first gold medal ever at the Paralympic Games.
[00:10:24] And so you know, all these, amazing moments at UBC that, affected my life, not the least of which was, Bob Highmarsh, a really key prof there that became a major volunteer for my Man In Motion, Tour and ultimately, became a board member of our foundation and, helped really make the difference.
[00:10:47] And yeah, so UBC was just such a powerful, formative period of time.
[00:10:51] Carol Eugene Park: so, we're just gonna do a hard pivot away from UBC. We'll come back to that. but take us back to March 21st of 1985, a year that neither Jeevan and I were even concepts of. but history tells us, you know, Man in Motion Tour began at Oakridge Mall,
[00:11:09] what do you remember about that day and that beginning?
[00:11:12]
[00:11:12] Rick Hansen: some people ask me about, like, what was the hardest part of the Man In Motion World Tour, and I honestly can say that it was that first day actually starting. And, you know, we were so exhausted and overwhelmed just trying to organize this idea and get past the negativity, the self-doubt, skepticism, and try to articulate, you know, the logistics, the finances, you know, in, in a world, you know, pre-digital where, where, you know, you sent messages by, you know, like Telex or by letter, snail mail, or, you know, maybe, smoke signals or pigeons.
[00:11:49] And, and it was like try to organize and connect the world, with this logistical challenge, let alone the awareness and the fundraising objectives behind that. And so, like just getting there, and there were mixed emotions. You know, the relief of being able to start and yet still in my mind, you know, during the speeches and the premier was there, and Betty and Rollie Fox.
[00:12:12] Terry was such a great friend, and they were there presenting me a little miniature maquette of his statue at Thunder Bay, for inspiration. And my teammates were high fiving themselves, so excited, and I'm doing my speech, you know, looking like a deer in the headlight, exhausted, twinge of pain in my shoulder from being injured and, and I'm thinking to myself, "Oh my God," like, "What have you got yourself into here?"
[00:12:37] I gotta get out there and start wheeling, and all these people who came to, kind of offer their support. So it was, a lot of drama and mixed emotions. And then to make things worse, we went out through the parking lot and underneath this tunnel, and my teammates were trying to catch up to me with the motor home, and they had this big box strapped to the top of the motor home, which had all my wheelchair equipment in it.
[00:13:03] And they ran right through and hit an over height warning bar. And instead of like turning around and finding a different exit because they were over height, they sent a crew member up to the top of the motor home to lift the bar up so the motor home could keep going. They got back in the motor home, and they went straight into the top of the tunnel, that that bar was warning them about.
[00:13:25] And there's crap everywhere, wheelchair equipment right on national television and, and the, and the well-wishers there were thinking, "He's going around the world in a wheelchair. Can't even get out of the parking lot. Good luck." Yeah. It was, it was not exactly your most, noble and, and well-organized moment for sure.
[00:13:44] that was a bit of a foresight as to what we were about to face on an almost daily basis in different ways.
[00:13:49] Jeevan Sangha: I'm curious about, you mentioned even in your intro about being someone who has big dreams and kind of goes for them, and that's how the people in your life described you. And at the beginning of your answer just now, you talked about all of the self-doubt that maybe came up in that process. And I wonder, is that, that ability to, like, dream big and make that happen, is that something that you always felt, or is that something that developed over time?
[00:14:10] Rick Hansen: Yeah, as a youngster, I feel so fortunate. You know, I'm born and raised here in British Columbia and, you know, earliest memories were, on adventures with my dad and my grandpa and going on fishing trips or hiking and camping and everything just seemed so filled with awe and wonder.
[00:14:28] and it was in the adventure, that I started to recognize that that was sort of so much a part of me. I started to open up my horizons and set, set my little personal adventure, sometimes getting into trouble with my parents and, you're not supposed to go down to the creek by yourself when you're six and, and, you know, or run off on your bicycle and, forget where you are.
[00:14:51] but then you started to organize and bring friends along and stretch and stretch. And as a matter of fact, that's kind of what got me into trouble when I ended up with my, my accident when I was 15 years of age. I was conceiving of the grand adventure when we would graduate from, grade 10 in high school and go off on a big fishing trip, you know, like a two-week fishing trip and, then I ended up, hitchhiking back with my buddy and, we ended up, having that vehicle crash and broke my back and damaged my spinal cord.
[00:15:21] And that's one adventure that, I didn't count on, I hadn't predicted, but it definitely, shaped my entire destiny as a result of that as well.
[00:15:30] Carol Eugene Park: And you describe it as an adventure, in hindsight, but how long did it take for you to kind of call it that or, or accept that it has become an adventure for you?
[00:15:42]
[00:15:43] Rick Hansen: for me it was always about, what's next, whether it be in athletics or, you know, on a, on a camping trip, a fishing trip, or just something around the corner in the neighborhood. And that just became part of my DNA. And so, I would be setting goals and chasing dreams and then starting to realize that I could, call up my buddies and inspire them to get together.
[00:16:03] And so that kind of culture, was really, part of my life. And as a matter of fact, even in my athletics, I remember the very first time that I was, inspired to come out and play wheelchair basketball by, a mentor of mine, Stan Strong. he was a volunteer manager for the Vancouver Cable Cars wheelchair basketball team. And he, and, and he said, you know, "Come on down to Vancouver and, you know, and, and play with this team."
[00:16:30] And so I had to leave my home and, you know, live with my uncle and aunt and, I got a summer job with the Wheelchair Sport Association, and it was all, you know, a whole new world out here.
[00:16:42] I got, you know, obviously nervous and had to overcome all the doubts and the concerns and the worries and try to populate that with real data and, you know, and a plan and then evolve it 'cause the plans never worked out exactly the way they were supposed to. And there I was with this dream team that inspired me, that ultimately inspired me to go off and recruit, which ultimately, gave me the opportunity to meet Terry Fox and, actually recruit him to come and play for our wheelchair basketball team after he lost his leg to cancer.
[00:17:14] So I would've never imagined, you know, by just responding to the challenge, and the opportunity of coming down to Vancouver playing wheelchair basketball, that it would lead me to such a rich experience and in many ways change my life.
[00:17:27] Can I ask if, you're comfortable, sharing more about your friendship with Terry? Like, what was that relationship like? Yeah. No, Terry, l- I, you know, anyone who asks, I, I really love to talk about Terry because, over the generations, those that weren't fortunate enough to actually meet him, the, you know, the processes led to this iconic, incredible Canadian who is a global icon who's basically changed the world and he has.
[00:17:56] and yet, you know, if we don't tell stories about the real person, we think, "Oh, that's way up there. That's not, that's not me." and yet I believe, you know, like, like Terry, Terry was a good athlete, and he was very determined and, he really truly was raised like I was in the culture of trying to pay it forward.
[00:18:17] And, you know, he was inspired by our, our dream team, and Stan Strong, who was the manager, who was the selfless hero who volunteered his time to help us be able to be, you know, athletes again and reclaim our identity and, and, and recover from the trauma of, you know, loss of use of legs or whatever.
[00:18:39] and so, yeah, Terry was in many ways, an ordinary Canadian with extraordinary determination and a sense of purpose of wanting to put his personal talent in play to be able to chase a dream that was going to make a difference. and it happened to be, you know, a really big dream and, something that seemed insurmountable.
[00:19:01] But again, like with my story, you know, Terry dipped his leg in the Atlantic Ocean and took his first step westward, right? And, you know, and Terry, we used to, like, train together and he was stubborn and competitive, and he had a great sense of humor, dry sense of humor. he was insecure, you know, in the early days trying to recover from his loss of his limb.
[00:19:25] And he was, you know, in chemotherapy, so he lost his hair and he had a wig on, and no one knew it. He just looked like he had a twitch because he kept patting his head. And, and then, you know, one time I threw the ball into the, into the Kia as he was driving, and he caught it, and then these big guys from Spokane collapsed on him.
[00:19:43] They all started swatting at the ball. And from this scrum of humans out popped a big brown, you know, fuzzy patch of something. And Terry jumped up like a scalded cat and hopped over those guys and hopped over to his wig and put it back on like this. And then he looked around and, and he went, "Ah, whatever."
[00:20:02] He threw it away and went back in his chair and just played, played without the wig on. And, and we all knew then, oh, okay, cool. that's what he was doing. And he was the kind of guy that really, had strong, really strong values like, you know, a, a teenager.
[00:20:17] And, the values are often pure and sometimes unrealistic, you know? but that purity of that is beautiful. and then sometimes life chips away at that, and you hold on to the core of it. And so, his dream, it actually was so important for Canadians and for people around the world.
[00:20:34] Yeah, of course, because of cancer, because it's a terrible disease and it needs to be cured and-- But it's because he actually shows us all, that we all have our purpose and we all can contribute and we all can achieve goals and dreams. And some of the biggest dreams are killed by fear of failure.
[00:20:51] and if we just try, you never know how far you go. And sometimes it isn't achieving the thing that you even started. It's the process that transforms into something far greater than you could imagine.
[00:21:03] And he didn't make his physical journey across the country. Like cancer reclaimed, the, the battle and he was taken from us, way too soon. but he, he, he-- what, what happened after that was almost unforeseeable and it was beautiful. you know, family and community and nation and then world, all getting involved and taking it to a level where everyone is trying to finish that dream, right? Yeah, he's a great Canadian and, and a dear friend.
[00:21:32] I, I miss him a lot. I... Yeah, I... Yeah, I wish, I wish he was still here. But, I mean, anyway, that's just life
[00:21:44] Carol Eugene Park: Oh, I just wanna say thank you so much for sharing that and for being vulnerable with us. I think it's such an important part, not only of Canadian history, but of your journey as well. And so, his memory totally lives on in the friendships and the impact that he had on all Canadians.
[00:22:03] Jeevan Sangha: It's a big part of, even how Carol and I grew up, just his story and both of your legacies.
[00:22:08] Rick Hansen: Yeah. Well, thank you. Yeah, it's a privilege. you know, I was so fortunate to, you know, to meet him and we trained and roomed together and, traveled together and, he was a dear friend and, I know that he was inspired by, by our team and, and our friendship and, and I was definitely inspired by his journey and not, not by the, you know what I mean, obviously cancer, goal was, again, like I said, really important, but what I saw in his journey was the way people looked at disability differently. They saw ability.
[00:22:40] And, you know, and of course I had, like Terry, you know, struggled with my disability after I had my accident for, some time trying to just examine the internal maxims we set in our mind about beliefs that are fine until they don't work anymore, and you wonder where the pain's coming from, and it wasn't coming from my legs.
[00:23:00] I couldn't feel them. It was coming from, the precept that I said I had to be, completely physically able or completely independent, in order to be whole as a human being or use my legs to be an athlete. you know, these, these sorts of maxims, they create your disability and then there's of course the, the, the physical and the social barriers where people's attitudes towards you and then the physical barriers that were out there, for not just me and my little team, the Cable Cars, but Paralympians around the world and people I met that faced the same challenges.
[00:23:35] And so I, years, you know, earlier in my rehab had this dream of physically wheeling around the world as an adventure. One of my, one of my kind of, well, what's next, what's possible, to then being a Paralympic champion and, in marathoning and being able to physically do it. But then not even, not even thinking it was worth giving up the peak of my athletic career until I started to connect purpose and then Terry's inspiration helped me connect purpose and the dream and my talent and I just decided, you know, that that was something I'd love to do.
[00:24:10] You know, but even then, it was still not like seemingly possible logistically, until I met with the president, of Nike, And I was coming to see if I could get a pair of sweatpants. and in that conversation, he says, "Hey, have you heard-- have you ever thought about wheeling around the world?"
[00:24:29] And I said, "Yeah, why?" And he goes, " Oh, well, you know, that World Expo is coming to Vancouver and, and they have this, theme called, Man in Motion And, and they're, and they're going to have offsite promotion, internationally to help, show people that, that Expo's coming to, you know, to Vancouver and come visit.
[00:24:51] and they're looking for projects. And I went, "Oh, really?" And ended up going to meet some folks there, and there was a lot of interest. And finally, with that, I felt, oh, okay, I can go after this. And I uttered the words out loud that I was committed to it. And then they cut their budget and didn't have any money, and, and we were now fully committed, but, you know, had to start from scratch and, and somehow found a way, you know. but there were no magic bullets, and, we just had to really grind, to get the support to, to leave. But that's kind of what happens in, you know, in dreams. It's not like a bolt of lightning where you come from the mountain with the tablets. It, it's, it's some-- it's basically, you know, the grind of life and being open for inspiration and looking for your turn and way to contribute. That's how it all started on March the 21st of 1985.
[00:25:43] Carol Eugene Park: And so that leads to a very serious question that I've been holding back since we first started, talking. What was your workout regimen? What was your diet leading up to the tour? I imagine it changed or maybe evolved. Tell us a little about that
[00:26:02] Rick Hansen: Good question. Yeah, it was because, you know, as a Paralympian, you know, and a marathoner, I, I was, you know, I had a pretty, pretty balanced diet, but moving from being, you know, a marathon sounds like a long distance, but it's not very long at all compared to an ultramarathon every day, like three marathons a day. 70 kilometers, you know, with, two breaks in between.
[00:26:23] And so that was my first half journey, three-wheel, three wheelie days on, one, one off. And, and, and so you had to s- sort of slow down the pace. So, wheeling slower, changed the mechanics and, started to run into all kinds of clunky things and, and, you know, and so that was, an adjustment.
[00:26:41] And yeah, so we brought my cousin on and, he was the chef.
[00:26:46] we had a, a caloric shift obviously from it was maybe 3,000 calories a, a day on a, you know, before I started, and it was about 5,500 to 6,000 calories a day, you know, when I was wheeling. And, and so, you know, he had to monitor that, you know, with the support of a nutritionist.
[00:27:05] we had to source all natural foods mostly, although I must admit, we, we did have a sponsorship from McDonald's and, and they, and they gave us, free access to food anywhere in the world for the whole trip. And, and
[00:27:20] Carol Eugene Park: No way
[00:27:21] Rick Hansen: L- so Lee was, Lee was, was, was known to be frequenting, McDonald's a lot and, but coming in with the Chicken McNuggets and pulling off the batter and making it into a chicken salad for me. And also, their salads, of course, were, were a top priority. And, and every once in a while, there was, yes, there was the odd Big Mac or a Quarter Pounder that came down our way, but that was mostly a treat. But the hardest thing, of course, when, when you're, when you're looking for, you know, consistency in a, in a world where you're going through 34 countries and four continents is to stay, try to stay away from, you know, anything where the water was, you know, suspect, you know, that was fresh, you know, because that's where you can get into trouble.
[00:28:05] And I finally actually ended up getting into big trouble, coming through Spain, Portugal. Got a stomach, bug that stayed with me for almost two months and Till I finally collapsed, in front of the health minister of Greece. And they took me down the, down from the s- this little motel room, that had a flight of stairs.
[00:28:27] She was down there waiting with flowers to greet me, and they put me in a blanket and rushed me down the stairs and asked her if they knew where there, where there was a health clinic. And she was going, "What? I thought this was a celebration of this great Canadian wheeling around the world." Instead, I have to bump a line and, get him some quick support because I was dehydrated from all the, you know, the intestinal challenges and yeah.
[00:28:50] Anyway, just that's the way it works sometimes, right? You have a great plan and, you vector off and you keep going
[00:28:57] Carol Eugene Park: And you have a Big Mac on the way.
[00:28:59] Rick Hansen: Yeah.
[00:29:00] Carol Eugene Park: so, I guess now, what is your, like, health routine looking like these days?
[00:29:06] Rick Hansen: You know, when you're older and you move into, other priorities, moving from athlete mode to, to married, family, you know, kids, grandkids, running a foundation, which I was as founder and CEO, way back when and, and, you know, and, and then trying to pursue other passions and interests.
[00:29:25] It's easy to spread your time to the point where you're giving so much, you're not paying attention to your health, you know, because you have other priorities and, and whereas before your health was a byproduct of the athletic pursuit. and so, you have to reframe your view of that, and health had to become an important priority.
[00:29:45] And so for me it's like first of all the, you know, maybe the, it's the guy thing, I don't know. you gotta go in and check with your doctor and, and listen, you know, when they give you some advice and not, not wait until you're in trouble and, and seek perspective, get a plan and, and try to get support from your team, at work and at home so that you cannot feel guilty about taking time for yourself and, kind of nurturing your body and your mind and your soul.
[00:30:14] And that's the other dimension of health for me is starting to like look beyond just the physical body side of things and make sure that you, you work on, you know, your emotional, intelligence and, understanding and, and then your spiritual development and look it at, look at it as a whole health and wellness plan.
[00:30:34] And, and it's an ongoing journey and, and, you know, you just kind of... And it's never perfect. It's kind of like up and down. You go in and out of, you know, moments where you're on the, you're on the program and then you're off. You know, you get some trauma or stress and go and grab a bag of Mrs. Vickie's salt and vinegar chips and kind of crunch it in and oh, whatever.
[00:30:55] Jeevan Sangha: But every day, you know, every, every day I'm thinking about it positively and, and I introduce meditation and, I’m focused on, you know, here at the office, I have a gym that, you know, that the, that the staff use and I get a chance to, use it.
[00:31:08] Rick Hansen: But you know, time is the most precious commodity we have. And if you, if you're not careful, you can, you know, you can basically get pulled off chasing all these appointments and things and, you know, and, and you burn up like two hours of time a day just to try to do things.
[00:31:23] Whereas if you can bring it to you, then, you're making it m- more of an incentive to stay in the game. And then adapted equipment is also important, so I can change things up and be supported, and a trainer from time to time.
[00:31:36] Jeevan Sangha: If the UBC version of Rick could see the Rick Hansen Foundation today, what do you think would surprise him the most?
[00:31:44] Rick Hansen: All of it. Seriously, I, I didn't see it coming, honestly. like seriously, I, I, like I had a vision of trying to change the world and, I mean, I didn't realize how big the world was and, you know, how disconnected un- until I got into it. And, and it was just a struggle.
[00:32:03] I was actually-- I was talked into fundraising because this advisor had said that you can't measure awareness at, you know, at that stage, you know. And so how would you know? You know, fundraising is a tangible expression of support and, it'll help also continue, to be able to move things forward. And I thought, "Okay, what the heck? Let's raise a million dollars," and most of it'll come from, you know, maybe Vancouver if, if we're lucky.
[00:32:28] And then it was so hard to start, we upped it to 10 million because it, it was so hard. You gotta have some respect here. And, and even thinking that was crazy and then-- But, but, you know, but 26 million, you know, was like blew our minds and, and the awareness was substantial.
[00:32:44] so I'm thinking that, as a volunteer, you know, putting this all together and giving up probably about, at that time, probably I thought maybe two years of my life, and turned out to be three. s- start planning, doing, and winding down. And, and I thought that's, that's good. Then I'll get back to my athletic career and then eventually finish my education and then go into teaching, coaching. That was my dream.
[00:33:09] And I didn't realize that the profound, incredible experience of that Man in Motion tour, expressing, you know, the depth of humanity, goodness, challenge, understanding this, this journey, you know, wasn't just a moment in time. It became a lifelong journey and, and, and we did have to set up a foundation and, and we did have to not only keep, like put, like say interest out from that fund, but use the fund and use all of it to, you know, kind of go after bigger solutions and, and ones that created real movements.
[00:33:47] And, and that's not measured by just giving out grants. That's about looking at deep problems, finding out solutions, and having great people come together and bringing in more capacity and leadership.
[00:33:59] And that's where the ongoing work with UBC and our foundation, helped drive so much change and-- But I, again, I thought I was just gonna walk away from it all get back to my athletics.
[00:34:10] And I guess after the first wheeling session, going back into my training, you know, in my quote, "Comeback," and I quit halfway through that wheeling section, and I did it again and again. And then, and then, and then I was like a few months after my tour, I was in the dumps, I was pretty depressed and thought I'd gone crazy. I couldn't even finish a workout, and obviously it was my motivation, my purpose, you know, and my efforts. I was no longer in phase with the goal I'd set two years earlier. I had to absorb more of how my life had been changed and then reset my time, my talent, and my, my purpose and, and then that's where your strength and your energy comes from, right?
[00:34:54] It's not some gift that you're given, I don't think. I think it's all about, you know, mindfulness and, you know, maybe hurting for a while to figure out where the pain's coming from
[00:35:03] Carol Eugene Park: Wow, thank you for that. That was really... I, I feel like I'm in a therapy session.
[00:35:09] Rick Hansen: Me, me too. Me too. Thank you
[00:35:13] Carol Eugene Park: and I, and I don't mean to make this corny, but as you were talking and then as I was looking at your background, I was like, "You know what this reminds me of? The resiliency of salmon." And I know you're, very passionate about salmon and, you announced a really cool boat, that our producer mentioned before, that was announced last year.
[00:35:36] Could you for fellow salmon lovers, tell us about when that salmon passion began, how that has evolved throughout the years?
[00:35:47] Rick Hansen: Yeah. what's really interesting is that, I mean, my earliest memories being, again, being born in Port Alberni, the west coast of Vancouver Island, and, and pretty much right on the banks of, a great salmon river and, and the ocean. And earliest memories with, you know, my grandfather and my father out, on the water and connecting.
[00:36:07] was always part of my, my understanding of how beautiful and abundant, nature was. And, and I felt connected to it and dependent on it. And, over time you realize that it's finite, and, that there are limits.
[00:36:21] human impact, you know, can get to a point where we can negatively affect, our ecosystem and our planet. And, and so, you know, this is where, I started getting pulled in, you know, to, to use some of my, my skills as a leader, as a convener.
[00:36:40] It took something profound and, and tangential to salmon, in the, in the-- one of the world's largest salmon rivers, in the Fraser River. white sturgeon, they are, you know, the iconic species that are the apex of the ecosystem and, and they've outlived the dinosaur, and they survived two ice ages, and, and they depend so much on salmon and everything else in the Fraser River.
[00:37:04] And, and then one day, and I hear about this die-off that started washing up on the beaches, and they were all, like, looking healthy, and they were filled with eating sockeye salmon, and they were, like, 10 or 12 feet long, and some of them were maybe 150 years of age.
[00:37:21] And, and everyone was arguing about what was going on. Some thought they were going extinct. Some thought it was just a healthy natural cycle and everything in between. And so, I just decided that I would bring a group together and start a Fraser River Sturgeon Conservation Society.
[00:37:38] The first priority would be to, you know, move from subjective beliefs to good science and objective information about the status of the population and mobilize, you know, folks from UBC and, and SFU and others to, guide us, in the biological statistical approach towards modeling and, and then volunteers from, sport fishing anglers to First Nations to commercial and and other environmentalists to actually find out the population and get great information. And of course, that was a, a really critical beginning.
[00:38:13] And, and then, recognizing, of course, that without healthy salmon, sturgeon were never going to be able to survive, and then starting to move into salmon conservation. And, working with the Pacific Salmon Foundation, a tremendous organization, federal, provincial governments, universities, and, and encouraging more energy to work with indigenous leaders to, to really find a new model for how we work on, supporting salmon and, their abundance, but also, how we do interact with them culturally and economically in a sustainable values-based way, which means that they'll always be here because, without, without their unique contribution to everything else, including sturgeon, and humans and the ecosystem and bears and eagles and everything else, then, you know, we were-- we will be in trouble.
[00:39:09] So these fish are, are fundamental and, you know, it's, it, it's incredible. Here we are in British Columbia with this, gift of these two iconic species, the sturgeon and the salmon, and they're so connected, and so are we to them. So, yeah.
[00:39:25] And, and now of course, you ask the question, what's that got to do with accessibility? everything, because, you know, if we have 1.3 billion people on the planet living with disabilities today, and they have access to nature like I did, they can not only have better health outcomes great social benefits, but they can actually be engaged, in contributing to paying it forward and making sure that, you know, we, we don't take too much from this planet.
[00:39:53] Lovely. Thank you so much for sharing. before we close, is there anything, any final words for the UBC alumni community that you'd like to share? You know, I, I, I just wanna say, first of all, that, you know, again, UBC has been such a huge part of my life and still is today. you know, it wasn't just the Man in Motion Tour where that relationship ended. When I came back, I was asked by the president of the University of British Columbia, Dr. David Strangway, to come and work as a consultant at UBC, and I said I would, but not fighting fires, but looking at big solutions.
[00:40:27] And so it brought a great group together, and we established a disability resource center, and that center is mainstream at UBC now, and it's supporting thousands of students so they can do, what I had the privilege to do. But I had to fight so hard just to get in the door, and now, it's normal at UBC and, and, and doesn't matter what kind of a disability, you know, that center's there to be able to help, students and faculty and staff to be able to actually look for their best talent and, opportunities, in such a great institution.
[00:41:06] And at the same time, there was one researcher who had the courage, Dr. John Steves, to talk about curing paralysis back then, without being, told he was a heretic. And, and now there's something called ICORD. it's one of the top five spinal cord research institutions in the world. And, Dr. Brian Kwon is the director of ICORD, and our foundation has been helping ICORD, operate outside of the university into a world-class spinal cord research center of excellence at the Vancouver Hospital and, and where clinicians work with researchers and patients and community.
[00:41:50] And it's a great example because sometimes universities are criticized for not being relevant to the community. And, you know, and this is where, you know, UBC’s, core excellence is now, you know, in the community partnering translating great basic science into clinical trial and application and connecting with the world and accelerating progress.
[00:42:13] you know, I, I was told when I was injured when I was 15 in 1973 that, you know, I'd had a spinal cord injury, I, I was paralyzed, I'd never walk again, and that was the end of it. But today, thanks to UBC's leadership and the great work at ICORD and the Blusson Center, we’re in the golden age of clinical trials where that myth's been shattered and, and people's lives are improving.
[00:42:38] And, probably in the next 30 years, you know, it will become the norm that you would expect to have more or sometimes complete recovery after a spinal injury. I'm just proud of that relationship, both on the balance between wanting to have a cure for paralysis after spinal cord injury for the next generation, s-so that's normal, but also being sensitive to the 1.3 billion people and aging boomers who will never have a cure.
[00:43:07] And we have to remove barriers so they can still be whole as humans and have a great life. and UBC is central to that. And it's, it's w- a lot of pride for me to know that UBC has, has developed to that level. And I, I just hope they never lose that until we get to the dream, and the goal. And, and I, I, I know that I'll be kicking around and, and my part as best I can too
[00:43:32] Carol Eugene Park: Great. Thank you so much. yeah, we hope you get to witness many adventures
[00:43:37] Rick Hansen: Yeah. Well, thank you too. I appreciate both of you and it's been lovely having this conversation. And keep up the great work and, keep sharing stories and working your magic. it's where synapses happen and people get inspiration, and you never know how lives will be changed
[00:43:52] Jeevan Sangha: Oh, thank you so much.
[00:43:54] Carol Eugene Park: So, I still cannot believe that we had the opportunity to have a conversation with the Rick Hansen
[00:44:02] Jeevan Sangha: I know. It was crazy. I mean, we've talked to so many cool people on this podcast, but I hate to say it, actually I love to say it, he was truly one of the sweetest, most genuine people I think I've ever had the chance to interview. Like, just so, so genuine, so earnest about his experiences. It was, like, a treat to be able to talk to him, and his life is just... He, he's lived such a grand, full life. And so just getting to hear about it was, was so cool
[00:44:33] Carol Eugene Park: And it was really nice too that he asked us how we were doing, like before we even jumped into that conversation. Like not that... Well, actually, in recent memory, I don't know if I've ever, ever been asked that as someone who's interviewing. So, it was so nice to just be seen like that.
[00:44:54] Jeevan Sangha: A true gentleman.
[00:44:55]
[00:44:55] Carol Eugene Park: I am really glad that you asked him about his friendship with Terry Fox, um, who, another Canadian legend. Um, 'cause I feel like it's really easy to forget that the people that we learned about in school were like real people whose memory still lives, um, in their loved ones today. And so, it was just nice hearing Rick talk about his friend Terry, not just the Canadian hero Terry
[00:45:23] Jeevan Sangha: Yeah, that was such a special moment. I- I mean, it was just so beautiful seeing how much love is still there. Um, and it takes a lot to be vulnerable with two people you've never met before, so
[00:45:32] Carol Eugene Park: Yeah. Over, like virtually too. Like he, he just... 'Cause even when you asked it, I was like, "Oh my God," like I know that this is gonna be fine, but still I was like, "Can we ask this?" But it was just so nice. And I, and I, I think something that he kind of alluded to is, it's nice to just be able to talk about that person, or like being asked to describe a person that you have lost.
[00:45:56] Yeah, that was beautiful. I also really loved his reflections his, like, long relationship with UBC. Like, from talking about breaking barriers in the physical education program and just all the reflections he had about, you know, zooming around campus on his crutches and then coming to a place where he was able to embrace his wheelchair, as he called it, a chariot to freedom. he's literally the reason that UBC has the Center for Accessibility today, which is wild
[00:46:24] I know, and like, listening to him speak about it, I was just like, "Wow, I have taken so many of these things for granted." But it really wasn't that long ago when people were having to truly fight for the bare minimum
[00:46:37] Like, the way that he moves through life, he's just so excited to be here, and he just wants to just make it a better place, and it was just so refreshing 'cause I feel like I'm, I'm so jaded, even though he is much more experienced than I am.
[00:46:53] Jeevan Sangha: But it was nice to hear an older person not be as jaded and still have so much life, um, to give Yeah, he had so much, he had so much excitement for life and all its possibilities. And I think whenever you talk to someone who is truly, truly passionate about what they still do, about how they, can make an impact on the world, you can't help but feel moved by it. You can't help but, like, leave that conversation and think about how you can bring that energy into your day-to-day.
[00:47:22] It was, it was truly like breath of fresh air
[00:47:26] Carol Eugene Park: Agree. In fact, I was so inspired that the next day I went to a cafe and I asked the barista, "How are you doing today?" I don't normally do that.
[00:47:37] Jeevan Sangha: That's... No, knowing you, that is major.
[00:47:41] Carol Eugene Park: I know. I've never done that before, so I was like, I hope Rick is proud.
[00:47:44] Jeevan Sangha: Thank you Rick Hansenn
[00:47:45] Carol Eugene Park: proud. Yeah. You inspired me. Um, well, thanks everyone for listening. Make sure you catch our next episode by subscribing or following our show on Spotify, Apple, or wherever you listen to your podcasts.
[00:47:58] And if you're feeling your feels, please drop us a review. You can find me on Blue Sky @caroljeanepark
[00:48:04] Jeevan Sangha: And me on Twitter @jeevenksanga. From Here Forward is an alumni UBC podcast produced by Kylie McPhedran for Podium Podcast Company