How to Improve Your Sobriety: Understanding the Root of Addiction

🎙️ Episode 7 – How to Improve Your Sobriety: Understanding the Root of Addiction
In this episode of The Lion Counseling Podcast, Mark Odland (Certified EMDR Therapist, LMFT) and Zack Carter(Counselor & Coach for Men) go far beyond surface-level recovery strategies to help men understand what’s really driving their addiction.

If you’ve ever thought, “I just need to stop watching porn, drinking, or gambling—then my life will be fine,” this episode will challenge and encourage you. Because the real issue isn't the behavior. It's the pain underneath it.

🔍 In This Episode, You’ll Learn:

• Why your addiction isn’t the bullet… it’s the morphine
• The deeper emotional wounds and unmet needs driving addictive behaviors
• How to identify when, why, and where your urges strike using Zack’s “Three W’s” trigger tracker
• How stress, boredom, fear, celebration, and even success can trigger relapse
• The role of environmental cues and classical conditioning in behavior patterns
• The neuroscience behind dopamine, habituation, and escalation of use
• Why your addiction may be tied to emotional beliefs like “I’m loved,” “I’m powerful,” or “I’m accepted”
• How CBT and EMDR therapy work together to rewire both your brain and your story
• Practical ways to adjust your environment and habits for long-term sobriety
• Why relapse isn’t failure—but a signal pointing to where the healing needs to happen

💥 Whether you’re struggling with pornography, alcohol, drugs, gambling, or any compulsive behavior, this episode offers real strategies, clarity, and hope.

About the Show:
The Lion Counseling Podcast helps men escape the cages that hold them back and become the lions they were created to be. Hosted by the team at Lion Counseling, we talk about mental health, masculinity, addiction, trauma, faith, success, and emotional growth—from a grounded, faith-integrated, and truth-centered perspective.

👉 Looking for real change? Visit www.escapethecagenow.com to book a free consultation for coaching or counseling.

📲 Found this helpful? Subscribe, like, and share it with a friend.

💬 Comment below: What’s one trigger or false belief you’ve noticed connected to your habits?

Click here to watch a video of this episode.’

#AddictionRecovery #MensMentalHealth #Sobriety #ChristianMen #CBT #EMDRTherapy #PornAddictionHelp #AlcoholRecovery #WhyAddictionHappens #RelapseTriggers #EscapeTheCage #HabitChange #FaithAndRecovery #SelfImprovementForMen #LionCounseling #EmotionalHealing #PodcastForMen

Creators and Guests

Host

Mark Odland

Founder of Lion Counseling, Licensed Marriage and Family Therapist, Certified EMDR Therapist

Host

Zack Carter

Zack Carter is a Counselor and Coach with Lion Counseling LLC.

What is Lion Counseling Podcast?

The Lion Counseling Podcast helps men escape the cages that hold them back and become the Lions they were created to be. It exists to help men obtain success, purpose, happiness, and peace in their career and personal lives. The podcast is hosted by the founder of Lion Counseling, Mark Odland (Licensed Marriage and Family Therapist and Certified EMDR Therapist), and Zack Carter (Counselor and Coach with Lion Counseling). In their podcasts, they address a variety of topics relevant to men, including: mental health, relationships, masculinity, faith, success, business, and self-improvement.

Mark Odland: 00:00

Welcome everyone to the Lion Counseling Podcast. I'm Mark Ottlin, founder of Lion Counseling and certified EMDR therapist. And I'm joined by Zach Carter, counselor and coach. And our mission is to help men obtain success, purpose, and happiness, and peace in their career and their personal lives. Today's topic is how to improve your sobriety.

Mark Odland: 00:55

Alright. Welcome back. If you're looking for help in your life, feel free to reach out to us at escapethecagenow.com or click the link in the description box. Alright, Zach. Here we go.

Mark Odland: 01:08

How to improve sobriety? I know this is, something in your sweet spot. Work with a lot of clients on that. I'd love to get your thoughts on that today.

Zack Carter: 01:16

Yeah. Know, addictions are definitely near near dear to my heart helping clients with this. I, you know, I've spent years helping guys with pornography addiction specifically, but I've I've I've guys with, you know, a few guys with substance issues and other behavioral issue issues like gambling, for instance. And so I I love working with clients like this. I I I just I really, really enjoy it.

Zack Carter: 01:40

Usually where I start with clients is, you know, oftentimes they come to me and they're like, the main problem. Like, I just if I could just stop watching porn or stop gambling or stop drinking, this is like if I could just solve this problem, like, my life would be so much better. And it won't be any surprise to people who've listened to a few episodes of ours that we've got to dive a little deeper, right? So like the addiction is going to be a secondary problem in my head, right? And so I'm going to be digging a little deeper.

Zack Carter: 02:10

So kind of the story I tell guys to give them a good analogy of what's going on is from the show Band of Brothers. I don't know. Have you seen Band of Brothers? A little bit. Wish a little You haven't done the whole thing yet.

Zack Carter: 02:23

Well, I won't ruin too much. But there's an episode of the people who haven't seen Band of Brothers, it's essentially a group of soldiers that get really tight knit, really close during World War II that are fighting the Nazis together. And there's a particular episode where it's focusing on the medic. And they're in this really cold area, snow's all over the ground, guys are in rough shape. And at one point in the episode, know, guys running across the field and he gets shot in the leg, goes down.

Zack Carter: 02:53

Right? Inevitably, whenever you're watching these World War II movies, the guy starts screaming out, medic, medic. Right? So the medic runs over, like slides into the guy, starts to wrap the leg real quick. And always, without fail, the guys are always like, Doc, just give me the morphine.

Zack Carter: 03:09

Give me the morphine, Doc. Right? And so they like pull out the little syringe and like take it out with their teeth and just pop them in the leg. So much better. Right?

Zack Carter: 03:17

And so I think a lot of guys think that, hey, pornography, gambling, alcohol, that's that bullet in the leg. I could just figure this out, and I would actually argue that pornography, gambling, alcohol, drugs, whatever it is, it's actually that morphine. It's not actually the bullet. Interesting. And that first we have to figure out what is the bullet?

Zack Carter: 03:41

Like what is the pain in the leg? What are the pains that they're sending you to whatever behavior you're doing? Right? And so that's kind of the first place I started just kind of with that analogy, thinking of this in a bit of a different way. Do do you have any thoughts on this before I start to kinda like dig into more specifics?

Mark Odland: 04:02

Yeah. I just think that that's powerful. I've never heard it put that way. But, gosh, yeah, that that is a powerful way to think about it. It makes me think a little bit about this doctor in Vancouver, Gabor Mate, who's been making the rounds in podcasts.

Zack Carter: 04:14

And Mhmm.

Mark Odland: 04:15

His big question is is people always ask why the addiction? And he said the better question is why the pain? Mhmm. And and, man, yeah, that the that the substance or the behavior is the morphine, not the bullet. Gosh.

Mark Odland: 04:29

Yeah. I no. Keep going, Zach. I'd love to hear more. That's that's awesome.

Zack Carter: 04:33

Yeah. Well and got yeah. And so Gabbormate is great. If you're if you're struggling with this problem and you're looking for a book, he he he's written some good books around addiction. But here here's kind of what I where I start with with clients.

Zack Carter: 04:45

And I call it the three W's to track triggers. Right? Three W's. Right? So if you're taking notes, we start with the when.

Zack Carter: 04:55

When did the urge or relapse happen? Okay. You don't have to have a relapse to figure this out. You can track the triggers themselves without acting out. But if you do have a relapse, you can go back and do this.

Zack Carter: 05:07

So get out a notebook, get out a journal. Number one, when did this happen? So you want to look at a few different things. Time of day, right? And so especially with guys in pornography addictions, there's two big times a day that they're doing it, morning, evening.

Zack Carter: 05:22

Right? So oftentimes, they watch porn, masturbate, fall asleep. Right? So it's like used as kind of a sleep aid at night. Right?

Zack Carter: 05:31

And in the mornings, pornography gets the heartbeat running faster, brain waves moving faster. That gets their day started. It's like a shot of caffeine. Right? And so what they're doing is manipulating like the needs of the brain in that moment.

Zack Carter: 05:43

Does the brain need to go to sleep? Does the brain need to be alert? And they're able to manipulate the brain using pornography, right? So depending on the substance, if it's an up or if it's a downer, you might be using those things to manipulate the brain in the direction that you need to go, whether it needs to move faster, move slower, right? So you got time of day, day of the week.

Zack Carter: 06:02

Some guys are weekday people. Right? Like, hey, I'm stressed out. I'm just trying to get to the next day to the next day to the next day. So at the end of the night, boom, this is what I'm doing to calm myself down.

Zack Carter: 06:12

So it may be alcohol. Right? You're like, hey, I just need to relax. Right? Okay.

Zack Carter: 06:16

So alcohol is a downer. All right. It helps you to relax in the moment. Right? Weekends, it might be boredom.

Zack Carter: 06:22

Right? You've got all this time on your hands. And so like, I'm just using this to fill the time. Right? So you have to pick out day of the week.

Zack Carter: 06:29

Right? So like, is there specific days you're doing it? Time of the month. Right? If there is bills.

Zack Carter: 06:37

Right? If you're if you're living paycheck to paycheck and every couple weeks you got some major bills due, like, is that contributing to the pattern? Lastly, time of year. You know, I I've I've I've interacted with a guy who had a major relapse around Christmas time. Right?

Zack Carter: 06:56

What was that? Well, he had wrecked his family. You know, Christmas was a reminder of all the mistakes he had made. Right? So pay attention to timeframe.

Zack Carter: 07:07

Right. So if you get done with the win, next you move to why? Why are we why did I do this? Right? So there could be so many different things.

Zack Carter: 07:19

But here's kind of the three big categories I break this into is negative emotions, positive emotions, environmental triggers. Okay? Negative emotions that are common, especially in pornography, stress, boredom. Those are two big ones. So pay attention to those.

Zack Carter: 07:38

Famously in 12 step programs, talk about HALT, hungry, angry, lonely, tired. Procrastination, it can be lack of meaning and purpose. It could be a big thing. So a bunch of different negative elements. But guys will come to me and say like, Zach, life's been good.

Zack Carter: 07:56

Why am I still doing this? Interesting. It could be tied to positive elements as well.

Mark Odland: 08:00

Unfortunately. Yeah. You don't think about that as much with the positive stuff. Yeah.

Zack Carter: 08:04

Yeah. It can be positive as well. Right? So it can be a form of celebration. Right?

Zack Carter: 08:08

Friday night, you made it. The week's over. Time to celebrate. Right? It could be extension of a vacation.

Zack Carter: 08:16

Right? So a lot of guys come back from vacation and they have a major relapse. Why? Because don't wanna go back to work. So I was like, can I just extend this vacation a little bit?

Zack Carter: 08:26

It can also be, I feel good eight out of 10 right now, but I wanna feel 15 out of 10. Right? I wanna I wanna go to things that are super normal stimulus to make me feel even better. Right? So that's negative emotion, positive emotion.

Zack Carter: 08:41

Before I get to the last one, Mark, did you have any thoughts or comments?

Mark Odland: 08:46

Yeah. I think that's, yes. So helpful to hear that information Zach. I mean that where my mind went is you know I do some I know we both do some couples work and sometimes it'll be a behavior that brings them to couples therapy because it's caused strain, right? And in the case of like say pornography use, there are times when the spouse has all sorts of complex emotions, right?

Mark Odland: 09:12

On one hand they're angry, they're hurt, they might feel betrayed, but they also might feel like well why am I not good enough? Like, why is something in our relationship not good enough where you have to go to this? And that can actually be kind of enlightening for those spouses to hear it's not always the case. Like, it it it could be connected into negative emotions, but I'm sure you've seen guys who actually have decent marriages who that's still a thing. It's it's still a thing, and it's not because there's some gaping deficit or some horrible thing in the relationship, but they're just hooked into this pattern Mhmm.

Mark Odland: 09:50

And and and trying to, like, somehow, like you said, hide know, kinda be their own pharmacist for their brain in getting through their day, getting through their week, keeping their kind of managing their energy levels almost.

Zack Carter: 10:00

Right. Yeah. Right. That's such a good point. Yeah.

Zack Carter: 10:02

So you can you can you can be biologically addicted whether it's drugs or alcohol, which are actual substances, but you can also be addicted to dopamine. Right? You can be addicted to these pleasurable chemicals that are shooting into your brain. Right? And the problem is that there's something called habituation that if you become a person who's struggling with alcohol, yeah, I just used to have one drink, you know, and that was one drink a night.

Zack Carter: 10:29

Then it was, like, two drinks a night. Then it was three drinks a night. And you increase it over time because the brain gets used to lower levels. So with pornography, it's lower level stuff, and then it increases to higher level, higher level, higher level. And then they get they find themselves in a place where they're watching very extreme things.

Zack Carter: 10:44

They're like, what? This is not who I am. What is happening? And it's a process called habituation. So, yeah, to your point, sometimes it's it's kinda like people who drink caffeine in the mornings not because they particularly need it.

Zack Carter: 10:57

It's that this is now part of my, like, daily process to just help me feel normal. Right? It's not that, like, I technically needed the bump. It's that, like, if I don't do it, I just don't feel normal. So Wow.

Zack Carter: 11:09

Great points on your end.

Mark Odland: 11:10

Yeah. Thanks, Zach. But, yeah, I want I don't wanna interrupt your your train of thought.

Zack Carter: 11:13

No. No. That was perfect. Well and and so the last category in the why is environmental triggers. Right?

Zack Carter: 11:19

And so there's something called classical conditioning that if you ever take psych one hundred one in college, they're going to talk about Pavlov and his dogs, right? And so if you don't know about Pavlov, he is essentially this scientist who would bring dogs into a lab and he would ring a bell and then he would bring out the food, right? So he did this over days and days and days. He'd ring a bell, bring out food, ring a bell, bring out food. And so Pavlov was a genius.

Zack Carter: 11:46

So Pavlov figured out that he could ring the bell, not bring out the food anymore. And they would measure the saliva in the dogs. And so what they found is by just hearing a bell, which doesn't mean anything to the dogs until it starts to be partnered with food, that they would begin to associate that sound with getting food, right? So they would salivate. Same thing happens for guys if for instance, the front door closes to their home and they're like, oh, I'm alone, right?

Zack Carter: 12:15

The wife has left, the kids are out, I'm alone in the house when I'm alone. I watch pornography or I go in a gamble online or I have a drink. Right? Yep. And so just hearing something like a door shut or just being in a specific room or even just sitting on a specific couch or a seat, the brain begins to associate, hey, when I'm, when I sit here, when I'm in this room, when the front door closes, I do this activity.

Zack Carter: 12:40

You have to be very careful with environmental triggers and you have to be very cognizant of what's going on. So that's kind of some of the main whys. Basically, negative emotions, positive emotions, environmental triggers. Wow. Yeah.

Zack Carter: 12:54

And I was just

Mark Odland: 12:54

gonna say, Zach, I mean, I I might be this is where maybe where you're going next. But Mhmm. I I would imagine then in light of that, there's something to be said for not only being aware of it, but then eventually practically changing up your environment actually could could do something. Right?

Zack Carter: 13:08

Yeah. It can. Yeah. So, like, a very famous strategy for guys struggling with pornography is actually to rearrange a room. Like and so you repaint the walls.

Zack Carter: 13:18

You change the furniture where it's at. So brain doesn't associate the room with the trigger. Now if you go back to doing the same behaviors in the new room, you've done all that work for nothing, unfortunately.

Mark Odland: 13:26

That's what you might be you know, it's it's like a little tip-off to to your your spouse if, like, you're painting the room every day.

Zack Carter: 13:32

Yeah. They're like, why didn't everything change?

Mark Odland: 13:36

They're like Running out of colors eventually.

Zack Carter: 13:38

It's like Each week, it's a new color. You're like, I just, you know, I just want to switch it up. Love it. Yeah. Well and so yeah.

Zack Carter: 13:46

So you're you're kinda leading me into, like, the last w. Right? So we talked about, like, hey. When did the urge or relapse happen? Why did the urge or relapse happen?

Zack Carter: 13:55

And, what do we do next time? And so what do we do next time on paper oftentimes is very simple. Right? So if you're lonely, oh, spend more time with people. Right?

Zack Carter: 14:05

If you're stressed, okay, what are you doing to decrease your stress? How are you coping with your stress? You know, if you're angry, what are you doing to deal with that anger? Right? But in practice oftentimes what's on paper is a lot more complex in real life.

Zack Carter: 14:19

Like forming relationships, staying in good healthy relationships, whether it's family, friends, spouse, whatever, is difficult, right? And so if you do this process, if you're listening and you end up doing this process and you're like, I don't want know what the solution is or I'm having difficulty finding the why, that's very normal, Right? So that's why guys like me and Mark are out there. Right? That you can reach out to us and we we help you identify these things.

Zack Carter: 14:50

Because oftentimes even when I teach people this stuff, they can identify some of it themselves. But oftentimes they need like someone on the outside looking in saying like, hey. Right. Looks like this might be a problem in your life right here. Right?

Zack Carter: 15:01

Yeah. That's kind of the process, Mark. Any any thoughts? Yeah.

Mark Odland: 15:05

I I think it's just it's fascinating too. I was really perking up when when you were talking about the the different I don't know if justifications are the right word, but like the the emotions that go with it. Right? So like, I deserve this. I wanna relax.

Mark Odland: 15:21

I can wanna celebrate. Right? I don't think I work with addictions as much as you do, but when I do, it's it's through that EMDR lens. And one of the interesting sub trainings within EMDR are these addiction protocols that are floating around out there. Mhmm.

Mark Odland: 15:38

And one of them that I got trained in that I've had some success with that's interesting is is part of the front side is trying to identify with the the client. Mhmm. Not only what is this behavior or this substance, you know, some of the things that you're talking about, but what is the basic human need that's emotional that's actually connected to the physical? Mhmm. So a lot of them will say, well, what do you get out of?

Mark Odland: 16:05

What's the best part? And their default will be relaxation. Mhmm. And that's true. But then the guy who led this training I went to, he's like, no.

Mark Odland: 16:13

I never let him stop at relaxation. He's like, but but at the best part, you know, what is the best part of is is it, like, when do your eyes light up? When do you have that good feeling? And that kind of feels weird in therapy. Right?

Mark Odland: 16:25

When they're like, what are talking about? I'm trying to be like, I don't want this in my life. No. But we're trying to understand this. Right?

Mark Odland: 16:30

Yeah. And and that eyes light up moment, he'll be like, what is the what is the I statement? What is the positive belief about yourself that even if it's completely irrational is somehow fused to that behavior? And it might be something like, I'm in control. It might be something like, I'm loved.

Mark Odland: 16:52

It might be something like I'm the man. I deserve this. And the thing about that is those are all normal things for us to wanna feel as guys. But for whatever reason, it got fused to this behavior and and the and the brain is kind of like linked them together. And so then through the EMDR, what I what I try to do with clients is first expose that and then work on it in a way to hopefully detangle it.

Mark Odland: 17:20

Mhmm. So the next time the guy wants to drink or just, you know, smoke the joint or whatever

Zack Carter: 17:25

Mhmm.

Mark Odland: 17:25

He can honestly say, yeah. I'm doing this because I just want that relaxation if they choose to keep doing that. Mhmm. But not with this illusion of, like, I'm relaxed and I'm loved. It's like, no.

Mark Odland: 17:38

I'm not you're right. And the last thing I'd say about it is sometimes if you trace back in their history the first time they used, sometimes it's a negative experience, but sometimes it's a positive one. Yeah. And like the example of the training was, say the kid who has a hard time fitting in. And then one day at recess, you know, if they still have recess these days, I I I don't know.

Mark Odland: 18:03

But he's he's you know, they're they're behind the building, and the older kids give him a cigarette. Mhmm. And he he lights up, and he kinda he's able to, like, take take a breath without choking too much. And then and then the older kid pats him on the back, says, hey. Nice job, man.

Mark Odland: 18:19

And so what's happening in that moment? His brain is saying, okay. Nicotine feels great Mhmm. And I'm accepted. And I'm accepted.

Mark Odland: 18:28

And depending on how that moment, how the brain records that moment, things can remain fused for decades. Right. And so what happens is the guys have more than one driver. They have the physical addiction to the dopamine or the nicotine or the alcohol, but then they have this, like, sneaky this sneaky addiction to that good feeling that every guy needs to have, but somehow got stuck to that. And it's a lie it's a lie.

Mark Odland: 18:57

Like, the guy is, like, feeling loved because of the kind of pornography he's using he's choosing where it's it's like he has that fantasy, that illusion, but like the opposite. He's alone in the basement, and his loving wife is, like, right there available for love and friendship and connection. So so, yeah, things can get really twisted and and kind of like, the signals get crossed. Yeah.

Zack Carter: 19:25

I I'm so glad you've taken this route because this is something recently I've been doing more and more work with clients on because, yeah, it's not just about what is this numbing out, but also what are the positive things it's making me feel. And so Right. You know, guys might run to something like pornography because, like, you know, yeah, it's it it can be calming in the moment. So, like, some some form of contentment, but it also may make them feel powerful. Like, this is a place where I can tell people what to do.

Zack Carter: 19:51

Like you said, you were you were talking about, hey. For smoking smoking marijuana, you know, if that their first experience was feeling accepted by their peers or respected by their peers, oh, man, you're able to drink way more than any of the rest of us, or you were able to smoke way more. Like, oh, this is where I can get some respect. And so if you can't get if you're not getting that in other places in your life, like that might be where you go, right? Hey, this is the place I feel peaceful.

Zack Carter: 20:18

This is the place I feel optimistic. This is the, you know, so this is the place I feel successful, proud, right? So it could be tied to so many different positive emotions. And so really digging into that and saying like, what what am I getting out of this? And oftentimes guys wanna say, I'm not getting out of anything out of this.

Zack Carter: 20:36

It's just completely negative. There's nothing nothing good that comes from this. It's like, oh, it's not true. Like during the

Mark Odland: 20:42

Yeah.

Zack Carter: 20:42

Thirty seconds or the one hour or the five hours, you're getting something that feels great. Like, you're getting stuff out of it. It's not just that, like, oh, it feels good. It's like, no. You're probably being emotionally validated in some way when you do this action.

Zack Carter: 20:55

So that's that's perfect, Mark. Yeah. And so on that note, I mean, like, that's that's kinda what I had, you know, on this.

Mark Odland: 21:03

That's awesome, Zach. I I just appreciate you, you know, sharing your expertise. I know you've done coaching for for quite a while and and and counseling with with lot of lot of guys going through that stuff. And and it's not easy to face that. And but, man, there's help out there.

Mark Odland: 21:20

You know? There's help out there. People don't have to you know? That's a whole another podcast about the way that shame weasels its way into this to the the healing process and how that can keep people from from getting the support they need. Mhmm.

Mark Odland: 21:32

But the truth is we're all human. We all have vices, if we're honest with ourselves. Right? And some are just more destructive than others. And if there's a way to get some support and help, I think we all kinda need that.

Mark Odland: 21:46

You know? We we all we all need help with that. So so yeah. I mean, all that being said, if you enjoyed this video, if you don't mind, hit that subscribe button, notification bell, be notified of of future videos. And if you're looking for help, you can always reach out to us at escape the cage now dot com.

Mark Odland: 22:06

I know Zach and I both do free consultations, for people who are testing the waters, not sure if it's a good fit. And then, that support's there if you want it. So, thanks everybody for listening, and, talk to you next time. Bye, everybody. Bye.