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A production by and for veterans to learn how to help one another task a bite out of veteran suicide. We take with veterans about their service, things they would have done different, and what advice they would give their younger self. We also highlight community resources for veterans and provide an opportunity to connect veterans with community projects to help seniors and children.
Music. Welcome to the Veterans
Club, a production for and by
veterans and first responders.
Each week, we gather as a
community to share stories,
laugh and build friendships that
can stand the test time
together, we can help prevent
veteran suicide one cup of
coffee at a time.
Welcome to the Veterans Club.
I'm your host, Sergeant Major
retired Sergeant Major Roy
Lewis, and I'm so glad to be
here with you this evening. The
the Veterans Club, we are the
organization where we empower
our listeners to to make a
difference to the communities
and to focus on a helpful
future. I'm excited about
today's guest, because normally
when we do our shows or
broadcast on veterans, we kind
of hear it from the male
perspective. So tonight, I think
you're really in for a treat
tonight, because tonight we have
featured our guest is retired
Air Force Master Sergeant
Patricia hurdle fertile
Aguilera. And to tell you a
little bit about her, she is a
business support manager at Bank
of America here in Charlotte,
North Carolina. She specializes
in problem solving and executive
level presentations. But also
she is a like I said before.
She's a retired master sergeant
of 21 years in the Air Force. At
her job, she was a meteorologist
and a space forecaster, so I
love to hear about that as well.
She also is an award winning
speaker and a mental health
advocate, and she spends some of
her time as a mentor, working
with the observed uh deserved
groups. She's also a self
proclaimed nerd. I'm going to
ask her about that as well, but
she spends free time learning
new skills such as three
dimensional painting,
woodworking and baking. So
without further ado, let me
introduce you. Patricia fertile
Aguilar, welcome, Patricia. How
are you glad to have you on the
show? I know we were talking a
little bit offline, and I was
telling you that the Air Force,
pretty much was my first option
when I wanted to go in the
military. And I remember when I
went in, I heard the Air Force
you guys had the best jobs. You
guys had duty stations, and I
raved about it, and you guys are
very picky, very, very picky.
And the guy told me, remember
exactly what he told me, this
is, of course, 1982 but he told
me to come back four months. I
said, I can't wait, man. I've
just I knew the Air Force, the
Navy, I don't swim too well, so
I'm not great swimming. I heard
that they throw all the guys
into the water who don't know
how to swim. You just figure it
out. And I didn't want to go
through that trauma. And then
the Marines were like, too
crazy. So I said, But, so I
defaulted to the US Army. So,
but glad to have you on the
show. Fantastic. I wanted to
talk about tonight that we as
you know, a lot of these veteran
shows that we have, and they're
very, very helpful, very
informative, all that stuff, but
we hear it most of the time from
the male veteran perspective.
And I wanted to kind of get your
perspective. So I'm going to,
kind of, you know, come at you
from different angles, and
that's kind of, I want to hear
from your side, because I'm kind
of embarrassed to say I don't
really have that conversation
with a lot of female vets and
what's going on. I know you guys
are out there. So in dealing
with that, are you running into
that as well. One
of the things that's interesting
is
come from the service that was
in the 2000s right, where it's
more millennial kind of culture
experience, the idea that I was
kind of on my own as a female
veteran until I transitioned
out, and what I discovered is
that in these spaces that are
supposed to be veteran spaces,
it felt a little left out. I
remember going into the VA
hospital the first time, and you
see everybody with their little
hats and everything, right? But
when you're walking down the
halls, I think I ran into maybe
two other females, and I wasn't
sure if they were veterans or
spouses, you know, so, so I
think it's about fitting in. And
not only that, but I've talked
to a lot of female veterans, and
they just, they're cautious
about calling themselves
veterans, because they have a
vision of what a veteran looks
like, and it's not them. That's
a good point, because I go to VA
pretty much on a monthly basis,
and you're maybe I see one or
two female vets, and it's kind
of really that shyness not to
kind of be, I guess, notice, to
kind of be in the foreground,
because you're right, we're
walking around with our little
habits on it. So. Up in and I
know when I was a drill you
know, I was when I became a
drill instructor. That was at
the time when we decided to
trade male and female soldiers
together. And remember, I
purposely volunteered to train
females because I wanted them to
be the best. And I wouldn't let
them settle. I would never let
them settle for second best. And
I would chew them out constantly
about going down. And you should
hear my talk, my pep talks. I
tell them to go. When they go
downstairs, they better not act
like a female. You know, they
better carry their own rifle and
and to my surprise, really, not
really to my surprise, but with
the conflict that's been going
on in the world, I have to say
proudly that our females have
been serving outstanding because
I think your branch has done it
too. They decided to let females
serve in combat roles, and I've
never seen that before, and
they're here to perform the
outstanding. You know, amazing.
My last five deployments were
all in in combat zones,
really.
And, you know, I think there's,
there's still a stigma behind
female serving in those roles,
because I think we still see
them as mothers and wives,
right? But were there to be
soldiers? Were there to wear the
same uniform
I never saw, I saw the females
that I served along with. They
were dead on, you know, they
were very aware of their duty.
And I think people don't see
that. You're right. There's a
they think of the the female
role that's still being solved,
or whatever, and this and that.
But some females, man, I gotta
give my right arm. I follow them
into fire. They do a better,
they were off the chain, you
know, and you're right. But my
next question for you is that,
you know, backing up a little
bit, what was your role when you
that made you go into the Air
Force because you're you, you
read your resume, you've done a
lot of things, but did you go
college first, or did you go
straight into the Air Force? No,
I
went straight in after high
school. My family is a very
military family. My father was
in the Navy. Both my aunts were
in the army. My oldest cousin
was in the Marine Corps. My
older brother had to go army. So
there was no option for me. We
knew that you had to do four
years. You had to serve your
country for at least four years,
and then do what you wanted to
do after that. And my father,
being Navy, said, Don't go Navy.
My brother became army, and he
was Army, infantry. He said,
Don't go army. I knew I didn't
want to go Marine. And when I
walked into that air conditioned
air force office. I thought,
This is the life for me.
You're right. You know, they got
good jobs too, but it's a
different animal. But I think I
laugh because I talk to young
people today when we talk about
the military, some of them
thinking about going Air Force.
And I always tell Listen,
they're not going to give you a
ten million jet.
Yeah, not
even though the Air Force, we
got all the technical jobs and
everything and said, You're not,
they're not going to trust you
with a ten million F 16. You
know, you're not going to fly
that. No,
very few of us do.
But when when you went in, did
you experience any challenges? I
know that was a different time,
but I mean, it's different than
what it is today. Were there any
challenges that you faced?
Absolutely
so when I joined, it was the
late 90s. So I joined in 98 and
I came in with I had a brother
flight, but our sister flight,
this is the flight that I was
in. The group that I was in was
maybe a quarter of the size of
our brother flight, because
there weren't a lot of females.
And for probably the first seven
years, I didn't have a female
leader anywhere in my chain of
command. Me and I was at the
bottom of the bottom right, but
all the way up, not a single
female leader. And I didn't
realize how challenging that was
until you had to have these
conversations that are very
specific to females and and male
leaders. Didn't, didn't do those
conversations well for the most
part. Yeah. So that was that was
always something that that was a
challenge. You had to put away
your kind of your gender, and
live this world that was all
male, and learn to be to some
degree in that maleness.
Okay, so I guess that kind of
rolled me into my next question.
As you got promoted and you
became a senior, NCO, was that
now, now you're the one in
charge. Did you? Did you find a
lot of conflict there? You know,
you know, maybe at times,
leading an all male team?
Absolutely,
one of the things that I always
will remember is. One of my last
positions, I was leading a team
of about 15 every single one of
them males, 15 males, not a
single female and and I remember
being about to step into the
female latrine and almost
opening the door and seeing guys
coming out, because they weren't
used to being around females in
the unit. When you are in a
leadership position, you
establish yourself as a leader
first. And I had to learn that
the hard way that you had to
walk in with your uniform first,
not the name, not your gender,
not your personality. You came
in as a leader first, and if you
established that people tended
to respect that and didn't see
you as the female leader, right,
the female senior. NCO, I guess
that would be important, because
you've been in the combat zone a
couple of times, and that's
really, really important, at
least to me. You know, when
you're in those environments
right there, because anything
can happen at any moment, at any
time, and everybody's got to
show up, especially the leaders.
Absolutely. You know, it's scary
out there, and as much as you're
trained to do what you need to
do when the alarms go off,
you've got to take care of
yourself and you've got to take
care of everybody underneath
you. That is your
responsibility, because there's
a parent that is waiting for
their child to come home, and
it's your job to make sure that
their child comes home.
Script a little bit, but when
you did have conflict with your
subordinates, how was it? How
did they respond, and how did
you resolve it? I'm just kind of
curious, because, again, we've
never had these conversations
with a female leader, you know
what? Because I know it's there.
It just kind of what's the
dynamic of when you how do you
resolve conflict with you? You
had to deal with your
subordinates and and issues,
and, you know, things that they
were dealing with
really relied heavily on
regulation. So it was never a I
very rarely ran into situations
where somebody had a conflict
with me because of my
personality. They may have an
issue with the way things are
running, or policy, and I always
had to go back to well, this is
what it is, and I understand
you're disappointed, but this is
what the regulation is. As long
as you follow the regulation,
we're fine. There's only been
really once or twice where I
really had to get in somebody's
face, and I am five foot three
inches, so getting in somebody's
space sometimes is a little
tricky, but you're fighting for
that you you have to just
realize that you were giving the
rank of senior NCO for a reason,
because the Air Force trusted
you To be able to hold that
rank. And so to
hear you say that, because I had
to do an assignment with down at
Fort Jackson, we had to train
the Navy one one year, and I had
a my command was a new captain.
And bless her heart, she was
terrified. She, I think she's
the same height as you, and she
would, you know, I was her first
sergeant. I was the first
sergeant at time, so, and she go
in there, and we would go in her
office and talk, and I could
tell she was scared. That's and
I would tell her all the time. I
said, Ma'am, and you go in
there. Listen, you walk in there
like you six feet tall, you
know. And you, you, you bring
the business, you bring the
heat. And I said, it don't
matter. It don't matter what you
you know, what you look like, or
whatever, so that you just bring
you going there. I said, even if
you don't know, act like it. And
she Yeah, and I felt so sorry
for it. But at the end of our
tour, she she got her
confidence, though, I mean, it's
but I felt so sorry for her.
Because I know, I know the
officer track is a little bit
different than the the non
commissioned track, but it's,
you know, the officer track. She
would just trust it into her
first come. That was her first
command, and all of us kind of
rallied around her. I said, man,
we got your back. We got, you
know, and all our, all our guys
and, yeah, matter of fact, no,
we had no we had two females. So
we, we all respected her, you
know, we all supported her, gave
her that thing right there, and
just she it really boost her
confidence up like that. Yes,
you know, because there was time
she was in a officer meeting.
She's the only female, you know,
sitting there. And a lot I can
really imagine, I,
I interacted a lot with a pilot
and fighter pilot, and they,
they tend to have a bit of an
ego. Understandable? He's like,
Oh, it's 100% because, and I get
it, they're fighting in a
fighter plane, right? It's
right. They have to have that
attitude, fake it sometimes.
It's, as a meteorologist, I had
to tell them often, you know,
the weather's not good enough
for you to fly. And they would
get in my face like I could
change it, but you just had to
fake it and just stand in your
in your to some degree, right?
And just while a full birth
colonel is yelling, your face,
you just smiling, nod, and you
just stare
them down. Video, go back in
time to see you, because I know
you. Ladies and gentlemen, I
know Patricia. She's not the
nicest person you ever want to
meet, but if he had to break the
heat, I would love to to have
seen that. You know, oh, my
goodness, that's funny. So now
that you're now that you're out,
you know, you're in a civilian
role right now. So what do you,
what do you cow pitch at your
role now as a veteran? You know,
one of the most important roles
that I have right now is in
mentoring other veterans,
especially female veterans, and
showing them that there is
something out there.
Conditioning from the military
is hard, and I don't think we
realize how hard it is until
we're in it voluntarily. I put
in my retirement paperwork. I
said I'm out. I'm done getting
shot at I am ready to be in a
place where people are just
handing me drinks and not
shooting at me right. Ready for
that, but transitioning was very
difficult because you don't know
what you don't know.
So I mean, when you say
difficult, I know for me, I know
what you mean, but I mean for
me, I like, I I've been
interviewed before, and I would
tell like, for instance, like I
would had a habit of going in my
manager, and I would give him,
like a daily brief on my work,
you know. And he thought that
was weird, and I had to pull him
to the side. I said, in our
culture, and you know, where I'm
coming from is that, you know,
we were accountable 24/7, you
know, for every single thing
that we do, we're accountable.
And it's not like the civilian
world where, you know, you kind
of get to it and you kind of
float to it and all that, you
know, we if you were, and I'm
pretty sure it's the same for
you, you had to give status
reports and brief, you know,
higher command of what's going
on, and then also brief your
troops of what's going on, so
all that stuff's going on so, so
how was it difficult for you? I
mean, that was the challenge
that I faced
before, even before finding a
role like I mentioned, I was a
meteorologist in the Air Force.
When I transitioned out, I
thought in my in my mind, I had
to focus on jobs centered around
meteorology. And I didn't
realize that in the military,
you have a job that you're
trained to, but you have a whole
lot of skills that don't
necessarily have a job title.
Yeah,
it's hard to translate it
sometimes. So we we joke a
little differently, right? I
mean, on, on my performance
reports, I have several bullets
that say that I'm responsible
for so many enemies killed in
action. So we make jokes about,
you know, well, you know, you
just shoot them if they get it
with you. People say that in
corporate America, that's not a
conversation you need to be
having during an interview. So
being able to kind of speak the
corporate language, yeah, and
not be as direct as we tend to
be in the veteran community,
because bottom line up front for
us, tell me what you need, and
then we'll do the small talk
afterwards. But I need my
mission up front, yeah, like
you guys in the Air Force, you
guys are very technically
driven. So everything, like your
evaluations, everything is
quantified through you go to
schools, you go to technical
training. So that's how you
verify your productivity. Of you
as like you're at a, you know,
e7 level. You know, at every
level of leadership of rank, you
have to qualify that rank, that
you're taking x amount of
training classes and doing this,
and that's not in the civilian
world. I mean, I think some
people probably freak out if
they had to do something like
that,
absolutely. And to your point,
those status reports when you
get an email that says, hey, I
need this. That becomes my
number one priority, and you're
going to get it in 10 minutes.
Yeah,
yeah. Well, nothing on this too.
This sense of sense of urgency,
it still drives me nuts. It
still drives me nuts because I
used to work at Bank of America
as well. I was project manager,
so when we have meetings, nine
o'clock am meeting with the
manager. I'm there at 845, in
the conference room, and I'm
here by myself, you know, I'm
sitting there the people walking
in at 901902903, and they're jaw
jacking for at least 1520,
minutes before we get down to
business. And I'm just like, I'm
just, I want to pull my hair
out. I'm just screaming, you
know?
Really, let's get the work done
meeting. Let's get the work done
and then we'll we can chitchat
afterwards. We can chit chat
during our breaks.
Hey, you come around me and my
son, because my son's active
duty now. He's, uh, he he went
to the evil side. He went to the
officer side. He's a Warrant
Officer now, so he's uh, in
specialty too. His specialty is,
military intelligence. And he
sits down, he he's like, you've
been around some some pretty
smart people and stuff on and
it's funny though, he'll call me
sometime. We'll talk, we'll talk
shop, this and that and stuff
like that. And he's getting a
little bit too big for his
britches. I got to cut him down
a couple of I told him. I said,
I'm a sergeant major, so I eat
offices for lunch, you know,
that kind of thing. So, but it's
so it's so interesting. And the
funny thing, he was my problem
child, too. So it's funny
though, he's just found his
niche and and it's like he's
gonna do 20 years as well, too,
because now he loves it. He's
just having a blast over there.
So my next question for you is,
just like, you know, we were
talking about it earlier, you
know female vets, you know you
you've done your your your 21
years, you've got your VA
benefits. You going there. I
mean, what are challenges are,
you know, that you can kind of
bring to the forefront the
female vets are like dealing
with today,
one of the ones that not only I,
but I know a lot of other female
veterans, have expressed, is
that the assumption for most
male veterans is when they see a
female they tend to think she's
a spouse. Happened to me when I
went to get my blue ID card,
retirement ID card, I went in
and I said, I need to get my
retirement ID. And the young man
in front of me said, Well, you
need your spouse with you.
And I thought,
Do you believe it's 2019 and we
still think that a female coming
in asking for a retired ID may
still just be the spouse, so
that can make you feel very
uncomfortable, especially if you
experience it several times, may
make you feel like maybe you
really don't belong. So I think
one of the things that I always
tell female veterans is own it.
I don't care if you've served
four years or 10 years or 21
years,
uniform, further stuff, because
I know when I go out and about
on my routines and stuff, when I
run into a veteran, whether they
serve one or two or three years.
I mean, instantly go to that
question, are you have you
checked your VA, your benefits
as a veteran? And a lot of times
I get that when guys I get, oh,
well, I just served two years or
three years. It's not a big
deal. I'm like, yeah, it is a
big deal. But I'm wondering if
same thing for females too. I
wonder Yes,
and in fact, probably more than
and I want to say statistics
actually show that females tend
to not file as often because of
that identity crisis of, Am I
truly a veteran? And it's even
actually the older generation. I
would say the Gulf War veterans
are experiencing even more
because they don't they don't
see themselves as combat
veterans, and because they're
not combat veterans, because
they haven't been, you know, to
the Middle East and all these
places, they don't feel like
they have earned that right?
I knew there was something I
couldn't put my finger on it,
because you're right. When I go
into some of these VA
facilities, I see a lot of men.
I just probably ever seen any
women. I know the women are out
there just maybe, like, why are
they just kind of blowing it off
to the side? And community
is actually that the fastest
growing veteran community. So
you're seeing more female
veterans coming out and
transitioning, then you're
seeing male veterans. That
community is kind of staying
about the same percentages, but
that the female veteran
community, that percentage, is
just rising and rising and
rising. But that's because you
expect to see more females
coming in. So you have to have
more females coming out as well.
I hope so, because I know,
again, from the army side, been
to the first time my career,
I've seen females walking around
with Jump patch on. You know,
they got jump wings and they got
we had, it's kind of debatable,
but still, about five years ago,
we had our first female go to
Ranger School and do school.
They have a 50% or was would not
50% 70% male failure, failure
rate. I'm kind of like because I
wouldn't even make it, and I'm
pretty hardcore, but I would
have loved to have tried. But,
you know, I don't know if I were
punked out of that, but still
see, I'm still seeing females
get jump wings. They get an Air
Assault badges. Just stay
getting combat decorated out
there. And I want to see that,
you know, I definitely want to
see that. I'm glad I had to had
you on the show to address those
issues that confirm some some
ideas that I had in mind. So, I
mean, we're at the the the end
of our broadcast here, and I
want to ask you, what's the one
thing? And I've been asked this
question before, what's your one
message to the veteran community
that you that you would like to
say?
The one thing that I would say
is realize that your service
met. I don't care when you
served. I don't care how long
you served. Your service
matters, and taking off the
uniform doesn't take away the
service that you provide. It
doesn't matter. You know, if
you've been retired 1020, 30
years, if you wore that uniform
at one point, it's always going
to be in your heart. And so own
it. Own it. Let
me echo that, that settlements,
because I did two years of
college before I went in, and I
just, you know, at the end of it
all, I've become the one
resolution is that that's one of
the greatest decisions I've ever
made in my life, one of the
best. And I remember, I still
rehab the memory, when I was
saying that in my first
formation out there, when I got
there at basic training, I
thought I had signed my life
away, Patricia. I thought I was
done. What in the world? What in
the world have I done? And not
knowing what's the best
decision? And the funny thing
is, like, You're a master
sergeant, but I remember seeing
the ranks when I was walking
into the injection center, and I
was like a private and I'm
never, I'll never make that man
that's, that's crazy, you know,
but now I got something straight
to my uniform to give everybody
stripes, you know, but, and, but
the, you know, the reward, I
think, is, is, And I think you
probably second this is that to
have met so many wonderful
people and gone so many places
and and I think it's that's why
I think the civilian culture, it
can really learn a lot from
that, because you know we you
know us, vets, you know it
doesn't matter what branch, but
you probably hear the same
conversation people say when you
vets Get together, you guys have
you know each other. Oh my gosh,
you know, you know, like you
guys have been known each other
forever. But I try to explain to
people, we all have the same
rite of passage. We all went
through the same thing. We cut
from the same cloth. There were
times we wanted to quit.
Somebody was there to pick you
up, and we got each other's
back, you know. So it's kind of
an unwritten law, you know? And,
yeah, I
will always say it doesn't
matter whether somebody served
with you or not. They will
always be my group, and they
will always be my brother and
sister in service. Always
we wanted to, before we kind of
sign off Patricia. I want to, is
there, like a website or
something that someone wants to
reach out to you, why we want to
like to kind of network you or
talk with you, reach out to you,
maybe because I know you're a
professional speaker, so maybe
somebody would like to invite
you. So how can somebody get in
contact with you? Absolutely
So LinkedIn is the best way to
get in contact with me. That is
a great platform, and I, I
actually invite all veterans to
jump on LinkedIn. It is a great
community, and you find out so
many different things about so
many different people, and
you'll be able to really get in
touch with with some great
people. But find me on LinkedIn,
okay. All right, awesome. All
right. Mrs. Hey you there you
have it. Fit your hurdle,
Angular, you know, female
veteran. There it is right there
in front of you, here on the
Veterans Club, you find you have
our contact information right
there on the on the screen right
there, and hey, this has been a
great platform. This is a great
time for us to connect, to come
together as veterans, to be able
to kind of have that concern,
any questions, comments. Going
forward, those two as we'll be
more than glad to address those
on the on the show for you. And
again, thank you, Patricia, for
joining us. We had a great
conversation. I always enjoyed
meeting with you and talking and
catching up with you and stuff
like that when you can. Thanks
for Veterans Club.
Thank you.
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