Subscribe
Share
Share
Embed
Mainstream mental health is flawed and I’m pulling back the curtain.
I’m Andrea Clark, a former family therapist, who walked away from the system to expose the truth. After my own journey from medication maze to holistic healing, I’m here to challenge the status quo and reveal the mental health truths most people don’t know.
”The Truth About Mental Health” is your radical roadmap to wellness. Raw stories, expert insights, breakthrough solutions – this is where traditional modalities end and real healing begins.
Andrea Clark (00:01)
All right, guys, we're here and I'm super excited to be here with my dear friend Caitlin. And so the way this is going to work today is you're going to get an insight like you get to be a fly on the wall of us just talking to each other to really good friends who have history and also business history just talking to each other.
and kind of debriefing and the things that we've learned from the obstacles we've worked through together in our friendship. And so that's really what this is going to look like, you guys. So Caitlin, welcome.
Caitlin Raymond (00:29)
Thanks watching!
Thank you. I'm so excited. You guys buckle up, get your happy juice. We...
Andrea Clark (00:45)
Not everybody listening
even knows what happy juice is, just FYI.
Caitlin Raymond (00:48)
They're about to.
Andrea Clark (00:51)
That's so funny.
so, okay, how far back do we want to go?
Caitlin Raymond (00:55)
In 1988, I was born to Tupé. Well, yeah, talk about even just our history. I mean, we've been in the same circle of business starting out for, I mean, 15 years.
Andrea Clark (01:06)
Yeah, I guess. my gosh. Yeah, like, like 15 years. Yeah. So part of why we wanted to do this is because there's relationships you go the distance with and there's relationships you don't. And there's times where somebody, you know, puts themselves out on a limb and shares how they're feeling about something in the friendship. And maybe the other person doesn't receive it well or doesn't agree and doesn't think that, you know, that needs to get work through like relationships are labor.
times, right? It's not always sunshine and rainbows when you have a long-term relationship with friendship specifically, like female friendship is what we're talking about here, and mental health. And so that's like what we're talking about, right? Is we're gonna really pick this apart. And yeah, we've known each other for 15 years. But we weren't, we didn't really get close until how long? Three years ago?
Caitlin Raymond (01:56)
I think we're at four years now. Yeah. It was a thing about four years. Yes. And yeah, so that's crazy that we've been in the same circle of people more from a business standpoint for 15 years. And I don't even know if you like really knew who I was, but I definitely knew who you were. okay. Okay. Yay. And, but then yeah, definitely, you know, down the line, stepping into a second business together and then.
Andrea Clark (01:57)
wow.
Who you are.
Caitlin Raymond (02:18)
just because we're two peas in a pod end up becoming friends. it's like, it's interesting when, and when sometimes when I feel like we say relationships, my mind automatically goes to just a spousal relationship, husband, wife, or you know, whatever that looks like. But relationships is really important in holding those relationships with your friends, with your business partners, with your sisters, with your family, in addition to with, know, with your kids, but in addition to your spouses and just, so we were, you know, business acquaintances and then business partners that turned into friends. But
It's really interesting and really, what would I say, sacred or important to nurture each one of those relationships within our relationship, right? We have our friendship relationship. We have our deep secret type relationship. We have our business relationship. And especially I think when you're friends and business partners, it's, and this is kind of where this all came from, like kind of stemmed from, it's like, it's really important to nurture and respect both of those different hats that you're wearing.
Andrea Clark (03:12)
Yeah, that's a real first of all explain secret relationship. What I think I know what I'm
Caitlin Raymond (03:18)
I just,
I feel like you and I are pretty raw with our communication and I feel like I can come to you and tell you anything, which I have a lot of friends, but not a lot of friends that I could spill the worst tea to, even the most incriminating stuff and embarrassing stuff, and you would just hold that space for me without any judgment and vice versa. And I even have super, super dear close friends, but it's like, I would just hate for them to get the wrong impression with me.
me if I were a little bit too honest and vulnerable. And that's why I like the secret relationship where it's like, we completely hold space for wherever we're at with whatever the situation is. Yes.
Andrea Clark (03:52)
Yeah, it's like a safety
that you could tell me you murdered somebody and I wouldn't judge you.
Caitlin Raymond (04:00)
Exactly. did just tell you how to bury a body if you ever need to.
Andrea Clark (04:05)
my gosh. Yeah, not every relationship has that, right? Where you can bury your shame and different things without feeling like whatever it is, right? So we started in business together like four years ago. So just for people listening for context.
We both sell supplements through a company called Amari Global. And it's a social selling channel. And so it also can have a team component. And for any of you who think that that is whatever, it's all good. We're very cool with what we do. And because just for you to know, Caitlin, like I don't talk about that really on the podcast. So this is the first time they're hearing about this on the podcast.
Caitlin Raymond (04:45)
⁓
and I just slid it in there like dog down the hallway.
Andrea Clark (04:47)
Bye!
Yeah, pretty much. So,
how Caitlin and I came to work together four years ago was she came on to become a brand partner, like an affiliate, on my team. And we started working together and I started mentoring her closely. And over, over that we've also formed a friendship. And I do want to say this, like when you're in business with people, you don't always become friends with them.
Caitlin Raymond (05:16)
Mm-hmm.
Andrea Clark (05:17)
Not
every person that I'm in business with, I consider them like a business friend or like a work friend, but I'm not bearing my soul to them. Or you know what I mean? That kind of thing. And I think that's important too. And you could probably say the same for, you probably have training clients who you get super tight with and others that it's it's, it's.
Caitlin Raymond (05:33)
Mm-hmm.
Yeah. There's like professional relationship.
You know that you just know when some relationships are professional, stuff can be a little bit more playful. And then some are like, no, this is my girl. Like we're going to like inside or outside of business. And actually that's kind of like where this like little bit of a muddy water with our friendship stemmed from is like in or out of business, we're going to be homies. But the deeper you get in friendship, the deeper I feel like you do have the possibility of some beef or just like, you know, more issues come up.
Andrea Clark (05:50)
Yeah, totally.
Caitlin Raymond (06:09)
the deeper you are in that friendship. They're not just so much surface level, but it's like, no, we're super good friends also. And I want to respect that and keep that friendship. So it's really important to have that communication aspect of the deep friendship.
Andrea Clark (06:21)
You know what you just said? You just said something really profound because I agree with you. Like, you know, it's easy to have surface level friends that you have fun with all the time and that's all you do. But when you really do life with people, sometimes stuff gets hard because...
you're bearing your vulnerability, maybe something was offensive and they didn't mean to, but you feel offended or whatever it is because it increases the likelihood of sometimes having like challenges together because you're letting your guard down and you're showing your humanness. And I think that that's important to just note because
Caitlin Raymond (06:56)
Mm-hmm.
Andrea Clark (07:02)
There's so much bullshit on social media that's like, if they don't celebrate me, like I'm out. If they, like just this very all the time, like just ending relationships and it's like, well, yeah, some relationships should be ended, but if that's your philosophy, you're never gonna have like deep connections with people beyond the first obstacle. And you'll feel lonely and isolated. You know what I mean?
Caitlin Raymond (07:13)
Orly.
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
Yeah, definitely. And it's like, you went back to even being like, if you have like such high standards for all these people in your life and you can so easily be like, bye, bye, bye. And we absolutely should have a high standards. We should seek quality relationships and quality friends. But if you're constantly like someone who's has this, all these checklists of things that if you don't meet all these requirements, you know, this isn't working for me. It's going to be a lot harder to have good
deep-hearted, deep-rooted connection with people and communication because then at that point you're not like just fully loving and accepting people with an unconditional heart, loving them for their flaws and their perfections, which I think is what true friendship really is. It's like, we know that we have a heart-soul connection, so I'm gonna love you for all the good and all the bad and all the ugly, and it might get rough a little bit at times, but this friendship or you specifically are worth it.
Andrea Clark (08:18)
Yeah, and I do think there's an element of which we can talk about when we tell the story of like, both people need to want to labor for the relationship when times get hard. Sometimes one person wants to labor and sometimes the other person doesn't. That's why I'm divorced because my ex husband didn't want to labor and at this point that's fine, but it's like...
Caitlin Raymond (08:27)
Totally. Yes.
Right.
Andrea Clark (08:40)
You know what I mean? And this does happen sometimes in friendships and family relationships. And that obviously isn't the person who wants to labor. That's not on them. I do, like, you know, I tell people, in fact, I texted Beck and I was like, I've actually told two people, was like, Caitlin, like healed me.
Caitlin did something that helped me heal, you know what I mean? And they were like, my God, that's amazing. You know I mean? And so it was very healing for me for you to circle back and say some things to me. You know what I mean? Cause I was fully prepared that you were like gonna probably peace out on me or something. My own junk, right? But I was like prepared for that.
Caitlin Raymond (09:17)
Mm-hmm. Sure.
⁓ I think too, when you just talked about like with the, know, not even bringing up or specifically your husband, but how that was like a whole thing of like, you know, I wanted to labor for the relationship, but he did it. We, I'm a huge believer that every single person in your life, even down to your own children and your parents, which could be really hard, everyone's in your life for a season, a reason, or a lifetime. Every person you encounter. And I live by this because it really makes a lot of breakups. And I say,
Andrea Clark (09:23)
So yeah.
Caitlin Raymond (09:49)
breakups or like torn relationships or weathered relationships, a little bit easier to understand that truly every person you cross in your life is there for a reason. They were just inputted in there for some sort of reason or valuable life lesson, or maybe it's just a season, a season of hardship or a season of growth. It could be a year, it could be months, it could be quite a few years, or then you have those solid people that are in your life for lifetime. And it doesn't have to be blood. It could be somebody that you're like, oh,
we've been soul connected for years prior to our bodies actually being on earth. Like our souls truly do meet and we will be lifelong lifetime friends. But even down to like your parents, your relationships, your husbands, even your kids, you know, it's like not everybody is meant to stick around. I think when that's a beautiful thing, we evolve and we grow, they evolve and they grow. And sometimes people grow further apart. And it's like, we get so wrapped up and down that that relationship broke. And yes, it's
painful in the moment, but then you just take a step back later and you're like, okay, that person was just there for a reason or just there for a season. And it's all a blessing and a beautiful, you know, part of your chapter in your book.
Andrea Clark (10:52)
Yeah, I agree. Like I have a good friend we met in freshman year and we like when we get together, it's as if no time has lapsed. But we have we have sometimes gone through extended periods of time where we just don't talk. We've been through a lot of life together. But
Caitlin Raymond (11:05)
Mm-hmm.
Andrea Clark (11:08)
We'll go through a period like we're going through a period right now. She's newly like she's a newlywed. They started a business like we check in on each other every once in while, but there's not that deeper connection right now. But I know she's my friend for my whole life. Like I could text her and she'd be there in an instant.
And I've learned, like the first time that kind of happened between us, I thought like, you know, and then I learned like this is, we have parallel lives. Like, sometimes one of us is in the thick of something. And it doesn't mean that we're not there for each other or not close. It's just like where we're at. You know what I mean? And once like we kind of both came to this understanding, it just really allowed us to be
Caitlin Raymond (11:35)
Mm-hmm.
Yep.
Andrea Clark (11:50)
like when we have the time and when we are seeing each other and went like to just be free and enjoying each other and catching up and having those really deep intense conversations without like all these strings attached or whatever. And even right now with my mom, like I'm going through some stuff that I realized from my childhood that I need some distance, but like.
Caitlin Raymond (12:02)
Mm-hmm.
Andrea Clark (12:12)
So we're not having like the same type of conversations that we usually have, but like we're checking in and texting and I'm giving her updates on her granddaughter. And like, it's not like I'm just like, F you, but I'm just like, I need a little space to work through some stuff. And like, it's not something that you're going to want to talk about, right? So I need some space and
Caitlin Raymond (12:24)
Right.
you
Andrea Clark (12:31)
and but I'm not like cutting you off or I was like I just need some space and she's been respectful of that and so it's like she'll just she went to Europe she sent me some pictures it was good like it was good to have it's good it's like we're connected but there's no pressure right now with where I'm at with some things and I think that some relationships are like that like they change and evolve but you never lose connection it just looks different right
Caitlin Raymond (12:45)
Mm-hmm.
Yeah. And that's exactly, feel like where the whole taking care of your mental health in a relationship, but for the sake of a relationship is so important because there's such this, you know, I don't know, head space around mental health that it's only, you know, that you have all these problems and issues or grief or trauma, but mental health truly is even just like what you said.
these unresolved things are maybe coming up that's affecting me currently and I don't want it to affect me. I want to be able to approach it in a healthy way for the sake of our mental health collectively, mine and yours, me as myself, you as your individual person, but also as the mother daughter connection. This is where that open communication like of you just saying, hey, I need to take a little bit of space so I can work through these things so that I can help keep the relationship good and healthy, but also like help protect both of our mental health around it.
And that's where I feel like too, like what we've experienced in our friendship is that, you know, that communication, depending on the level or the deepness of the relationship, the communication about what you're truly needing, but what you're truly going through too, is so important to protect again, the mental health of the relationship. My individual mental health and yours, but also collectively, you know, just how we move forward in our future together.
Andrea Clark (14:08)
Yeah, totally. Okay, I love this. So let's just kind of give them a little bit of a backstory. So we've been in business together for years, and then fast forward to how long ago did you start dating your ex?
Caitlin Raymond (14:20)
Um, it was in December of 2023. And then I think I started coming to you as my friend, but also being the bad ass therapist that you are. Uh, like in July of 2024 was like, all right, some things aren't feeling right. And you're a marriage and family therapist. need to be able to fully tell you. And this is the thing too, like your background helps a lot, but because we have such this raw open relationship, I just.
word vomited all this really disgusting stuff that was happening. And that's things started to change in my life, but even in our friendship a little bit too, not for any matter except for that, you'd be like, stop flushing your tampon down the toilet. And I would keep, you know, I'm like not taking, is that a bad example?
Andrea Clark (15:06)
Well, but you know what, when stuff
was changing for me in a different way, like around the same time or a little before that, like I'm trying to remember when we started, when I started 50 50 custody. So it's, this is, this is actually a really cool story for us to be sharing with people because I feel like I started, we started 50 50 custody, like about six months or eight months before you started dating him. Right. I can't remember.
Caitlin Raymond (15:30)
Mm-hmm.
Andrea Clark (15:31)
It's been now like maybe a year and a half. I think almost around the same time, but I feel like 50-50 started a little bit before. Okay, so for me, like just in my own stuff, I was having my own like come to Jesus, how I'm living my life, how much I'm working, how much I'm doing certain things. I've had full, you know, most majority customer of my daughter.
Caitlin Raymond (15:35)
Probably about the same time, yeah.
Andrea Clark (15:53)
you know, for like nine years and now I'm having a split custody and it really rocked my world. And I remember I started having conversations with certain mentees who I was really close with as a friend and my leaders, right, who had a lot of contact with me all the time and could count on me for certain things. And I had to have like a heart to heart with people saying like, I have to change how I'm doing certain things. Like when Sammy's home with me, I have to have firmer boundaries when, you know, like
And there was just like, I was going through a lot of grief and guilt and like different, just really trying to figure that out. And I feel like that kind of happened around the same time that you guys started dating. And some of that, feel like I talked with you about, but not in the same depth because you were very, you were like busy being like falling in love or whatever. know, it sounds like, oh, it's in love. Well, you know, whatever, like just, and so that was kind of, that was happening kind of simultaneously as well.
Caitlin Raymond (16:41)
Yeah.
Andrea Clark (16:49)
And like you were doing your stuff and going through your stuff. I was really going through this transformation of like, what kind of leader do I want to be? How do I want to be in my business? How much time? Like I really want to function from my feminine energy, not this masculine space where I'm like always on for everybody and always doing, doing, And there were some people who were kind of struggling with the transition I was making like as a mentor and a leader, because they were used to me being a certain way.
Caitlin Raymond (16:49)
Right.
Yes.
Andrea Clark (17:16)
And I had a conversation with my mentor at some point and I said to her, I got to this point, I was like, I have to be okay with people. This was more for business, but like I have to be okay with people falling away if they are here for how I am. Like if they can't shift and adapt with me, then I'm okay with.
people like lose like air quote losing people or people falling away as if I am not okay with that I'm going to keep functioning the way I am from this place of like scarcity and keeping people happy and all this stuff and I said I can't I can't do it anymore like I'm pulling not going to do the travel as much I'm not going to do this as much for a little while you know and I told her and she was very supportive but I was like I was going through all of that at the time I don't even know if you know that but I was
Caitlin Raymond (17:42)
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
Mm-mm.
Andrea Clark (18:05)
Yeah, see, going through all of that while you were going through what you were going through in your relationship.
Caitlin Raymond (18:10)
Ang.
Andrea Clark (18:11)
Yeah. so then you, you know, like, and I'm an, saw already earlier, I kind of could tell that something wasn't fully right. Like when I saw you the, a year ago in the summer, sense you weren't yourself. But I was like, well, she hasn't said anything to me. So I can't say anything to her. You know what I mean? Like type of thing. And then you came to me, you know, and, and told me some stuff. So that was like really scared for you.
Caitlin Raymond (18:23)
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
Right, right, yes.
Yeah, with all the intricate details of the relationship. I feel like it's hard because, that's where, when I come to you with like, these things are happening, I want your opinion, and you give me your opinion, and you also give me your recommendation of what I should do, and I do the complete opposite. It's like, you know, which is what happened. And that, you know, it's like,
Andrea Clark (18:39)
Yeah.
Caitlin Raymond (18:59)
And I've have experiences with some of my friends before like, do not continue to complain to me about the same situation if you're not willing to change it. I can be here for you when you are crying, but if you call and complain to me about this one more time, but you're not willing to make any changes for it. Like I just eventually I have to take a step back and not only not support this, but it's like, can't listen to this anymore because you are letting this same situation tear you down and I'm your safe place, but I've heard it over and over and over giving you my comfort, my suggestions.
and you're just not doing anything with it. So eventually that kind of be like, in your case, you were like, I have to stop watching this happen and unravel ahead of me. I know what your heart really desires. I know what your heart's really going through. know how you're being treated, but I'm watching you do this, this facade on Instagram and not listen to any of my marriage and family advice, but also my, you know, friendship advice.
Andrea Clark (19:47)
By the further record, I never said to you that you didn't listen to me.
Caitlin Raymond (19:50)
Well, no, you never did. You never did. But it was like, you know, it's like
Andrea Clark (19:52)
No, I didn't
think of it like that. I'll be honest with you. I wasn't judging you. I was bummed. was like, damn, like this is not good. But I was like, it's her journey. You know what mean? I'm like, I don't know if I can watch it. It's like making me, I'm so anxious about it. Like I'm scared. I'm concerned for her wellbeing. That it like, it fucked me up a little bit to see.
Caitlin Raymond (20:03)
Right.
right.
Right.
And going back to you having to take care of your mental health. It's like, if I am watching, this is what the, you know, this whole, like the point of us chatting about how important it is to recognize in friendships where mental health is struggling collectively, individually, and then being honest about it. Cause it's like, if I'm doing something repeatedly, that's, you know, traumatizing you in a way that it's like, that's triggering. You're like, man, I can't watch this. It's like, you know, honoring and respecting your own mental health and taking a step back or addressing it.
which is ended up what ended up happening with us, but being able to be like, man, I like, this is affecting me at this point. And for the sake of myself, but also our friendship, I need to take a step back.
Andrea Clark (20:49)
Yeah,
yeah, totally. So I pulled back, like I muted your stories for a while, but I didn't like go tell you. wasn't like, hey, Kate, like.
Caitlin Raymond (20:58)
No, I just noticed because I'm crazy about
looking at who watches my stories and who doesn't.
Andrea Clark (21:02)
Okay, let's take a pause and
be very honest. People notice stuff on social and I actually should probably do a podcast on this. Like there's a whole world of how we socialize on social. And for people to try to gaslight their friends and go, what do you mean? Like, I just haven't been seeing your pet. Like bullshit. You're seeing stuff or you're purposely ignoring stuff or you're purposely not clapping or you're purposely, like, I don't, I hate that. Like, I just think it's,
Caitlin Raymond (21:21)
Totally.
Mm-hmm.
Andrea Clark (21:29)
such a such a lie like there is a there is a social aspect to social media where people do shit like that to each other and then try to act like with their friends like that they're crazy for noticing and I'm like bro give me a break and so when you asked me I was really honest with you I wasn't gonna be like what do mean like no I mean that's lamest thing ever like
Caitlin Raymond (21:38)
Mm-hmm.
Yeah, yes.
Yeah.
I was like, hey, well, first off, you missed my birthday. And I was like, oh, okay, now something's going on because because you didn't see it that was posted that other people had posted about my birthday. And so then I'm like, okay, now I know. So then I was like, every day, did you watch my things? Did you watch my story? And then
Andrea Clark (22:03)
I didn't. ⁓
Sorry I put you through that by the way.
Caitlin Raymond (22:13)
I mean, it's like, accepted. Let me say that, apology accepted.
Andrea Clark (22:14)
But I want you to know that I would really hurt my feelings too.
I, and for on, I just was first of all in my own world with all this 50 50. I wasn't online as much, but then I also did mute your stories for my mental health. But like I wouldn't, I like, I'm sorry I put you through that because I know that that was upsetting for you. Like it would be upsetting for me too. I've had things like that happen to me in friendships.
Caitlin Raymond (22:36)
Yeah. I mean, I totally respect and understand that you needed to do it for yourself. And it's interesting. It's like, where would that conversation have stemmed from, right? Had I not known that I was even bugging you or whatever, you you couldn't watch my stories because I was like stuck in this relationship that was not serving me, that was actually really ripping me apart. And you're just standing by watching it happened, even with all your advice. It's like, where do, when we talk about protecting our mental health, where do you then go from there being like, hey,
Hey, what's up, girl? We haven't talked in quite a while because I'm secretly kind of going through like some stuff where I can't, you know, really watch your stories. But FYI, I'm going to meet your stories because that's not how it felt in your heart, right? It was like, I just need to do this. But then it's like, if you're honest with that person, do they take it as, you know, I'm just calling to let you know that I'm going to mute your stories. Even that's how it be received, even if that's not how you meant it. So it's like, well, then
Andrea Clark (23:22)
really scared
if I went out of my way to say something like I didn't want you to think I was being disapproving or judging or you know
Caitlin Raymond (23:29)
Right. That's just where it's
such muddy water in these like deep friendships. It's like you could have totally come to me with good intentions. Be like, listen, I just, I'm to move your stories because I'm not. And I would have been like, wait, what? Your most stories are triggering you. And then, and then this is where, you know, that openness in communication, even between in relationships, but in friendships, it's like, wait, let's talk about this. What was it that's triggering? And then, but like you were saying,
you were going through all this stuff with the 50-50 custody kind of like not turning out in your favor to where maybe you weren't even in the right headspace to have the conversation. And so it's like, do you just protect yourself and do what you did, mute the stories and then deal with it later? Or, you know, it's just, it's interesting when you really get into these deep connections with people and because we had to keep some sort of a relationship open because we were in business together. But then, you know, that's like where it's, okay, I can still keep a business face on and still be able to have these
business conversations, but they're a little bit cooler, like a little bit colder. They're not as like checking in, like, you know, the way that we used to and doing that for your own mental health. But then eventually like I caught on and I'm like, hold on girl, you're talking to me like, like I'm just one of the other girls.
Andrea Clark (24:35)
Okay, but here's what I'll tell you. That's when I was going through the journey of kind of like, I'm not gonna chase my business partners. And so it wasn't like when I, when I wasn't trying to be cold or cool, it was more like, I was just like, okay, Caitlin's busy. Like she's got stuff she's doing. She will come to me when she needs me.
Caitlin Raymond (24:43)
Yes, yes.
Andrea Clark (24:56)
I'm and this is like the business side of it, right? Like not that like I, I started to pull back on not just with you, but with other people on how much I was checking in and how much I was like, you know what I mean? And so that really didn't help this situation that was where there was like the personal and then the business change and you're just like, what the fuck this bitch is fucking abandoning me or something like which
Caitlin Raymond (25:04)
Yes.
Yeah.
And
she's not watching my stories.
Andrea Clark (25:27)
I mean, so I can imagine,
I can imagine, you know what I mean? Like how upsetting that was, for sure.
Caitlin Raymond (25:33)
And actually
it was more so just like, know, before it's upsetting, you're just racking your brain and we just all do this because we're all psycho of being like, my God, what did I do? Was it this? Was it this? Was it You when you start like over analyzing things and you're like, and I think like I, a year ago even, I would not have been the person to approach you the way that I did. I would have like started being catty back and I would have been like, well, I, you know, I'm not going to be as lovey-dovey to message you or in my brain too much and shut down versus being like, hey,
Hold on, all of sudden I just matured in the last few months with therapy and I feel like I can come to you and be like, I've noticed your messages have been a little bit cooler. were a little, I think it was a voice text and it was a little bit like just directed straight to the point where normally you're just like, so my home girl and like, it would be like this. It'd be like, normally you'd be like, what up bitch? Like, hope your day's going well anyways. And now it's like this, what up bitch?
Just kidding, but like it was like, you know, just like the tone and the mannerisms change like this girl's mad at me Totally
Andrea Clark (26:31)
I was like, I was just more getting down to business. It
wasn't just you, was like people. Like I don't even remember what phase I was in of my journey at that moment, but yes, I know. And I was so proud of you because you were like, you just sent me a voice clip and you were just like, listen, like.
Caitlin Raymond (26:47)
Did
I upset you? I noticed you're not watching my stories. I noticed you didn't say happy birthday to me, but you're saying happy birthday to everybody else. ⁓
Andrea Clark (26:50)
Do it.
Well,
I, yeah, and I mean, I immediately responded, mm-hmm. And I was just really honest with you about, and I was really scared, Caitlin, to say what I said to you, because I was like, this is it. Like, I'm gonna say some stuff and like, she's probably gonna peace out and it's gonna be done. You know what I mean?
Caitlin Raymond (27:01)
Yeah.
you
Andrea Clark (27:17)
And I did say, like, I did tell you, I was like, I didn't, I haven't felt like our friendship has, well, I didn't say that right away. I told you what happened with the, like, muting stories for my mental health and all of that and feeling genuinely, like, scared and concerned and, that I didn't want to see it because it would be something that would be, like, bothering me a lot, you know? Like, I'd be worried a lot.
And then I feel like we had a back and forth and then I was like, God, I can't believe I'm gonna say this. And I said to you, I feel like our relationship has been more one sided on the side for a while now. And I felt it really was starting like, several months into your relationship, right? And
Caitlin Raymond (27:50)
one-sided. Yeah.
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
Andrea Clark (28:00)
You weren't you didn't act like you were offended. I don't know how you received it on your end, but you were very gracious to me. And then like, I don't I wouldn't say you were getting more distant or anything, but you were busy doing your own thing. And then I feel like a couple months later, you like circled back to me after you were
Caitlin Raymond (28:16)
It was
like just two weeks because remember I was just going to go do my ayahuasca journey. oh, well, just two, I had done that in between. Then all of a sudden, like I, and I feel like this too, I've learned this in the last couple of years to not speak or not respond ASAP, like take a step back and sleep on it, regurgitate it, think about your side. That's the biggest thing you guys in relationship is like thinking about yours. Instead of being attacking like, well, what about this text that I sent you on December 18th?
Andrea Clark (28:21)
I didn't know you were doing that.
Yeah.
Caitlin Raymond (28:44)
And then I sent you another text on July 4th, you know, like instead of like trying to like write your wrong and be like, well, no, we'll know. Be like, wait a minute, I'm going to honor how you feel. I'm to take a step back and evaluate why you're feeling this way and what part I took in it. And then, you know, giving yourself that time and that both that relationship, the grace to be like, okay, did I do this or did I not? Are you overreacting? Did I actually do this? And then being able to have in a healthy space, a conversation about it. But during that time,
one, taking a step back versus just going ahead and responding, just being like, Hey, and I think I might've even said, maybe I didn't actually, but you know, I appreciate this. Thank you for being honest. I'm just going to take a day or two to think about that. I don't know if I ended up saying that or not.
Andrea Clark (29:24)
You didn't say you're gonna
take time. You just said, appreciate that. you responded graciously. You were like, thank you for your honesty or whatever, right? Tell me how you.
Caitlin Raymond (29:31)
Yeah,
and then just a few weeks later came back around when I had gone to an ayahuasca ceremony thinking I was going to do an ayahuasca ceremony for my deep grief of my husband passing and also actually kind of the current grief I was going through with my Beyonce being not a wonderful fit, wonderful fit. ⁓ Yeah, a wonderful fit, a wonderful fit.
Andrea Clark (29:50)
It's a nice thing to say.
Caitlin Raymond (29:55)
And then turns out I actually through that process was able to really come to terms with the darkest parts of myself, which is that sometimes I am very much all about me and put my needs ahead of others. And then when, and then I'm not gracious at times to be able to really look at the darker parts of me and how that affects other people. And I immediately just go to defending myself instead of trying to problem solve or apologize and work through it together.
Andrea Clark (30:19)
Mm hmm. Which is
which is like human nature, right? Like we all have that those inside of us. Yeah, totally. Yeah. So you tell us about your ayahuasca set. You know, I've never been very excited, like for our for people to hear about this.
Caitlin Raymond (30:24)
Yeah, yes. Yeah.
Mmmmm!
Yes.
Yeah. So, you know, like I said, ayahuasca, it's a really much deeper level of healing through plant medicine and guided meditation with a shaman of really trying to get to that deeper. And I don't know, I couldn't tell you all the specifics about it. So if I butcher all these specifics, but you know, the deeper, almost like subconscious of grief or where does grief stem from or what kind of trauma
are we holding on to or what kind of generational trauma do we have? It just really helps you unveil all these different layers of deeper stuff that we can't just go through talk therapy with. And so I had gone to Ayahuasca because I had lost my husband in an avalanche five years prior and then COVID happened right after that. And so I just was really holding on to a lot of deep grief. I couldn't explain it except for just freaking grief that was like suffocating still five years later. And so
Andrea Clark (31:06)
Mm-hmm.
Caitlin Raymond (31:27)
I was like ready, like the first night I took the biggest ayahuasca shot that you could get. I'm like, send me home. Like, I want to just bawl and cry. Like, let's go. know, they're like, how much do you want to meet small, medium or large? I'm all large. Like, give me the large. I'm ready to go to the moon. I'm ready to face all my demons. Like, let's do this. I'm prepared to bawl my eyes out. You know, if I, cause you do, you purge in many different ways during ayahuasca. could be tears, it could be giggling, it could be laughing, it could be coughing, could be sneezing. It's typically vomiting or.
Andrea Clark (31:39)
my gosh.
I was gonna say, is it vomiting on the screen?
Caitlin Raymond (31:55)
I need to go to the bathroom. Yeah. Yeah. So I'm like prepared.
Yeah. Yes. You purge. So I'm prepared to take such a big dose that I have. They tell you to bring a yogurt container so that you have something to purge in. I brought a five gallon bucket because I was like, I was just never done this before you guys. I was prepared. Yeah. Yeah.
Andrea Clark (32:02)
Alright.
I'm trapped!
Caitlin Raymond (32:18)
From both ends like if I need to sit on that bucket and hold something like I was just ready to let it go and get all this stuff out and so It doesn't happen that way for those of you who like I'm definitely not gonna do ayahuasca now It absolutely does not happen that way you don't just we thought we'd be in a circle to solve shit in our pants uncontrollably It's not how it happens at all, but I was just ready to like let go of all this deep stuff I thought I was gonna come out of completely. I maybe my colors was gonna change
Andrea Clark (32:24)
What is this?
Caitlin Raymond (32:45)
on my whole body, like, you know, like a different hue of a person or whatever. I just was like really hopeful. I, and I won't, not to say none of that happened, but it just happened in a deeper sense. It was like, I went through this mirror of myself. I've really seen through the Ayahuasca journey that all the darkest parts of me, but also where all these darkest parts have stemmed from, they've stemmed from a way that I was treated. And these are just general examples, but from a way that I was treated from experience I had, you know, at a certain age.
from the way I experienced through my eyes how another verbal communication happened. Maybe from a way that you were, I don't know, unloved or you were touched or it could be so many different things, but it's like, I really got to see all the dark sides of me and put a visual to why I act that way. through Ayahuasca, was really able to be like, my gosh, this happened when I was four years old. That's why now I immediately go into this.
Andrea Clark (33:25)
Yeah.
Caitlin Raymond (33:39)
you know, defense mechanism. was like all of a sudden, if I was taking a puzzle or connect the dots situation and during that journey, seeing all the dark sides of me that I'm like, ooh, these are like icky. I do not like these sides of me. But then also being like, I'm like this because this happened and I had no idea. I'm like this because I experienced this and I've shoved it under the carpet and I don't remember that anymore. So just going through all these like, cause then once you get to those parts of yourself, you can, it's really great to identify, but then you can have self forgiveness.
Andrea Clark (34:05)
Yeah.
Caitlin Raymond (34:05)
forgiveness
of like those parts that you don't want any longer, forgiveness of when you were that, that particular person in the situation so that you can move forward and not act upon those parts anymore or be that person anymore. And that's exactly what happened in our situation. It's like, girl, you're calling me out for something. And actually I actually, I did do that 100 % and I could never realize it. Um, well, one, without you telling me, but two, with also me being able to be like, I, I do have
Andrea Clark (34:09)
Thank
Caitlin Raymond (34:34)
I do have that tendency of making relationships one sided. put myself on a pedestal and kind of being all about me and my needs. Well, that's not a relationship. This damn headbob keeps falling out. I must have the slipperiest of ears. And so being able to acknowledge these things that you said about me, but be able to take a look inside and be like, damn, I do do that. And I don't want to be like that anymore. there's...
I'm going to butcher this too, but ho a Pono, a whole opponent Pono. Yeah. It means, know, I forgive you. I forgive me. Do you forgive you? Do you forgive me? And that was a big part of it too. It's just like, you know, being able, I think that's all it takes you guys being able to acknowledge the stark part of myself and for your sake, I don't, I'm sorry. I did this. I don't want to do this anymore and blank. I'm going to turn the page and be a new chapter of not acting that way anymore.
Andrea Clark (34:58)
The prayer.
you
Thank
Caitlin Raymond (35:21)
because of self-forgiveness, radical forgiveness.
Andrea Clark (35:23)
Yeah, that's incredible. I don't know if I'm gonna do ayahuasca, if I'm gonna barf my, I mean, I'm trying to shit myself, but like barf, I don't know, Caitlin. I don't know.
Caitlin Raymond (35:33)
It's very healing. It feels very
good to let that go. I mean, the only thing I will say is like you're in a big circle, the group, right? And we're all on these nests or what they call, but all on these little beds and you people are just going, you know, projectile vomiting very loud next to you. And that's the only, but it's like such a safe container. And it's like, you know, that it's all purging to let all these deep, you know, toxins in our deepest layer of our
Andrea Clark (35:47)
doing their thing.
Caitlin Raymond (36:00)
connective tissue out and did I throw up? Oh girl, oh yes so much. It's kind of, you can't, no I never shit myself and I never actually, no I never actually ended up being in that position either. I already have gut issues guys so like if I want to shit myself it's like that's a daily Caitlin experience.
Andrea Clark (36:02)
Wait, did you throw?
Yeah.
Did you shit yourself? Wait, did you shit yourself?
Caitlin Raymond (36:23)
Anyways, I guess not big of a deal. But no, thought in ayahuasca it was going to be uncontrollable. And that's not it. You ask for help, they help you get up, they take you to the bathroom. And then with vomiting, you're kind of getting nauseous. You can feel it. So you're just sitting there, deep breathing with your bucket underneath of you've got your head like this. And then you vomit and you feel 20 million times better. It's like this, literally this
gunk of weight, like how we feel like weight's lifted off our shoulders. This is physical weight that's deep embedded in our body and our bones and our joints and the deepest level of our memory and connective tissue. And when you purge it or release it, even like through the tears, I had a big hyperventilating cry session. I was the most euphoric release of just this deep, deep, deep grief. purging comes in all those different ways. And if you think about feeling like something that's just weighed you down so heavily for so long.
that purging is a true release. It's like such a gift to your body to be able to release that toxic energy that you're just been holding onto for so long.
Andrea Clark (37:22)
Mm-hmm. That's incredible. Well, probably end in doing it. think, I mean, you can tell me more offline, but like, I just, think I'd be scared I'd be nauseous the whole time. Are you nauseous the whole time? Oh, it's like an emotion, it's like a buildup.
Caitlin Raymond (37:23)
You should definitely do it. You would. I think everybody should do it.
No, no. And if you do get nauseous too much, yes,
you're not nauseous the whole time. It depends. You can control how much you take. It's definitely comes in waves. There's an antidote if you're like just getting, there's something you can take and it will instantly snap you out of it. But let me tell you this, this is interesting. I went and played trivia last night with one of my Parkinson's patients. He's probably 82 years old. He is a doctor. He, last night we just happened to be talking about ayahuasca.
And he's like, I have done, he's very much on board with plant medicine for healing in so many different ways, cancer capacities, mental health capacities for sleep, like all sorts of plant medicines. And so he said, the one thing I've never done, I've done everything from a doctor's perspective. He's done everything. The one thing I've never done is I lost it and I regret it to my bones. But now with having Parkinson's, he's six years into Parkinson's, it's just too much of muddy waters of like.
Andrea Clark (38:24)
Yeah,
Caitlin Raymond (38:25)
You know,
want to really protect what you have left of your whole body. But he said, the one thing I regret is not doing ayahuasca because I know from a doctor's perspective and a doctor that believes in plant medicine, that it's the utmost deep healing thing you can ever do for yourself.
Andrea Clark (38:39)
Interesting.
Caitlin Raymond (38:40)
Next to like an EDMR where you're like really getting into like, you know, it's cutting into that deeper level of some kind of subconscious where you don't have control so that you can really release the deeper emotions but also the understanding like for me to come face to face with a mirror image of the dirty dark parts of myself and be like man I do, Caitlin is this how people see you on your bad days?
I hope not, but I'm gonna now, now that I've acknowledged it and I see it, I'm gonna do everything in my power not to be that person to other people, because I would never want that person to show up who I consider a friend. I would never want to see that side of a person, but that's even personally embarrassing for me that I have those dark parts, which we all do. It's not that, you know, we all do, but the thing is, you know, acknowledging it and being like, all right, I don't wanna be that person anymore.
Andrea Clark (39:17)
Totally.
Yeah, totally. So then you circled back to me.
Caitlin Raymond (39:27)
Mm-hmm.
Andrea Clark (39:27)
And you.
Caitlin Raymond (39:29)
I think I just
was like, listen, like I've been really thinking about your conversation or like what you had said to me in our conversation. And I've done a lot of like deep inner work of just like, you know, I really value our friendship. and it's really important to me that I don't just say sorry, but like we actually make sure that you're complete in what you said and that I've been able to, change those habits, but also be able to truly from the depths of my soul, apologize so that we can move forward in a healthy.
relationship but also know that our communication is strong enough that we can come to each other and say, I really value you and our friendship, but this is some stuff that's really been bugging me or you hurt me. it's my friendship, our friendship means enough to address it so that we can have a healthy container and get to the bottom of it.
Andrea Clark (40:09)
Yeah, totally. Yeah, it was crazy. Like I was just like shocked to be honest. Not because of you, but because of my own, historically when I'm honest with people.
Caitlin Raymond (40:14)
You
Andrea Clark (40:21)
they, it doesn't, not everybody obviously, but like it doesn't turn out well. And I think I've manifested some of that through my own nervous system and like repeating, know, attracting in certain friendships that mirror, you know, my relationship with my mom. ⁓ And, but it's been interesting to see the
Caitlin Raymond (40:22)
turn out well.
Uh-huh.
Andrea Clark (40:43)
since I've been putting boundaries in place, whether it's in business or my personal life and being more vulnerable and honest, who decides to like labor with me? And you were one of those people. And you were like, I'm really sorry. You told me like you thought about me at the at the ayahuasca retreat or whatever. And that you don't want us to have a one like a you want it you want me to know that you care and you and
Caitlin Raymond (40:54)
Mm-hmm.
Andrea Clark (41:09)
you know what I mean? And all of that. Like, my gosh, like, what's like, that's, it was so he it was like, very healing for me. Yeah. And it also made me feel like, okay, I can have I can have standards for relationships. Like,
Caitlin Raymond (41:11)
huh.
Yeah, ugh, I love that.
Totally.
Andrea Clark (41:26)
which sounds ridiculous for me to say, right? But it's like, just the sisterhood wound is like, I did a post about this two days ago. It's done a lot of healing in my life, but the sisterhood wound, I'm still uncovering layers of that, of just like beliefs I have or who I've attracted in or.
I'm not feeling like I can always be vulnerable with women because of, again, like my own subconscious stuff from my upbringing, you know, and having like experiences that have kind of confirmed my beliefs or whatever, right? And so I've really been leaning into being vulnerable and being really soft and like more raw.
Caitlin Raymond (41:56)
huh.
Right.
Andrea Clark (42:10)
in my female relationships and also like allowing the ones that they're not here for that, they were here for the other version of me, right? The one that takes care of everything and nurtures them and does all the whatever, that those fall away, but then also like calling in new sisters, like new girlfriends.
Caitlin Raymond (42:19)
Right.
Mm-hmm.
Right?
And remember, a season, reason, a lifetime, and it's all okay. It's like, you know, some people aren't on, let's see, how do I say this so kindly? Because I don't mean it to be mean to anybody at all. Some people just aren't on your caliber yet when you're stepping into the next version of yourself.
Andrea Clark (42:32)
Yeah.
Yeah,
totally. Mm hmm. Yeah.
Caitlin Raymond (42:50)
And that's
fine, know, they'll catch up or they're on their own path. And that's what's just beautiful about like, you know, us being individuals.
Andrea Clark (42:56)
Yeah, totally. So what do you think would be some of the most important things for people to glean from our story?
Caitlin Raymond (43:03)
Well, so I think like, you know, for getting back to the point of why we started talking about this, which maybe we didn't even talk about it in introduction, but it's like how important mental health is in relationships and then dissecting that not just your mental health around that you have like grief and trauma, but like truly taking care of your day to day mental health, recognizing the things that trigger you that don't feel comfy that you're like, gosh, that's actually not helping me. But also relationships, not just meaning
you know, our spouse relationships. This is, you know, so, so many different relationships, especially your sisterhood, especially, you know, being in, you know, the boys or just the relationships that you have with friends specifically. But if you think about too, your friends are outside of your close family, your friends, your friend circle is the one that you're most closely connected with. Talking to all the time, texting, sending memes. So to really be on point with
both of your mental health, like nurturing your mental health for the safety and the overall health of the relationship. That just starts with clear communication, really honest communication about where things are standing if there's a problem. It doesn't mean you have to do a check-in weekly like, how are we this week? So how are we this week? But if there's an issue, just instead of just nip it in the bud or whatever that they say, hey, this is not feeling good and cozy to me and I want to address it for the health of our relationship, but also
I mean, I'm going through this right now. I've got a friend I have to have a conversation with. She really hurt my feelings two days ago. It was on Saturday and it's Tuesday and it's eating me alive that I haven't said anything. But it's like, I don't know how it's going to go, but it's on a day-to-day basis. It is draining my mental health right now because I know once I have the conversation with her, if we have the friendship I think we have, we're going to talk about it, squash it and move on. But because I'm not protecting or taking care of my mental health right now and holding onto this because I have so much anxiety to talk to her.
It's like, you know, bleeding into my sleep. It's bleeding into my concentration. She's been texting me and being like, what's up, girl? And I'm just like, You know, I know I was thinking this morning, I'm like, you're literally doing a podcast today on mental health in friendships. you are whole year. I know. But it's just like, like how you had that, you know, that anxiety, like, man, this could change our friendship. What I need to talk to you about. But that's just that.
Andrea Clark (44:56)
You fucked her!
Caitlin Raymond (45:14)
That's where it comes back to just having this open communication. And these are the parts I need to learn to be like, hey, how do you even open up that conversation? Like you with wanting to mute my stories, how do you even safely open up that communication to say, something happened. Are you in a place, asking permission, I don't even know, asking permission, are you in a place that you can reciprocate what I have to share with you? Something was said that hurt my feelings and I wanna talk to you about it. It's like, even that, even though that's such a respectful way to start a conversation.
That's intimidating in itself because it's like that person might be like, you know, depending on how they are. When I was my old self before, I mean, I've definitely worked on these in the last couple of years, but for sure before Ayahuasca, I would immediately have gone into defective defense mechanism. What do you mean I hurt your feelings? I can't think of one thing I ever did. I'm so curious. this should be good. You know what I mean? Just being like, yeah. Instead of being like, you know, now we call her Caitlin 2.0 or at this point, Caitlin 7.0. I've gone through so many versions of myself. I'd be like, my gosh, like,
Andrea Clark (45:58)
No
Caitlin Raymond (46:09)
Share it with me girlfriend, like what? You know, I'm in an open space. Thanks for asking permission first to make sure I'm in a good mental space today to receive this and be able to talk about it. But you know, it's a whole turn.
Andrea Clark (46:18)
Maybe you can say,
hey, I have something really, that's really important to me and a little bit like kind of serious to talk.
Like are you in a spot where you can have that kind of conversation?
Caitlin Raymond (46:27)
Yeah.
Andrea Clark (46:28)
Yeah. And I do want to say this for all of our listeners, that no matter what relationship you think you have, sometimes you are taking a relation, well, every time you're taking a relational risk and sometimes doesn't turn out well. Like I took a relational risk probably six to eight weeks ago with somebody who I thought like,
Caitlin Raymond (46:41)
Mmm.
Right.
Andrea Clark (46:49)
not that they were, I didn't assume how they were gonna respond in a sense of like, yeah, you're 100 % right or something, but more just like, yeah, like it will be no issue that I'm going to share how something is affecting me. And it wasn't, it was a huge issue that I shared it. I was actually shocked by how they responded to me, like very uncharacteristic.
Caitlin Raymond (47:04)
you
Andrea Clark (47:09)
And we've kind of smoothed it over, but it hasn't actually been addressed or resolved. The thing that I said that was affecting me and then also how they responded to me, none of that's actually been resolved. It's kind of been like, well, I love you, I love you. And there's distance. Yeah, and right now, I'm just kind of like okay with it.
Caitlin Raymond (47:25)
Mm-hmm. elephant in the room.
Andrea Clark (47:31)
I'm shocked that it actually went that way, to be really honest. And so I think that this is important is like part of mental health and relationships is it's not that you go in guns a blazing and you're like, well, if they don't agree, I'm out. But it's more like if I'm willing to take this risk for what's important to me and how I want to be loved or treated or whatever, like how I want to be the boundaries I want to have or whatever, you have to be okay with.
people not always seeing eye to eye, be prepared to let that, to like maybe let that person go or have that gap in time for a while, whatever it is. Like I think that's what can make conflict healthier is that, at least this is my opinion for me. It's like when I go in, I think I was more devastated because I assumed she and I would like work it out and smooth it over. And
Caitlin Raymond (47:59)
Mm-hmm.
huh.
Andrea Clark (48:24)
then I was just like totally taken aback by how she responded to me. And so with you, was like, I, she may not like what I say and this may mean distance or potentially our relationship looking different or whatever. And I was sad, but I was like, I have to be okay. I have to be okay with however she responds and figure it out.
Caitlin Raymond (48:45)
The outcome,
Andrea Clark (48:47)
And I didn't
think that way going into the other one for whatever reason, right? And I set myself up for more upset in a way. Does that make sense? More disappointment. So some of it is also like in relationships, it's managing your own expectations. It doesn't mean you have to take shit. It's just more mistreating you, but it's more like, okay, they might not give me the apology I'm looking for. They might not validate me. They might not...
Caitlin Raymond (48:50)
this other one.
Mm-hmm. Yes.
Yes, right.
Mm-hmm. ⁓
Andrea Clark (49:16)
And if that happens, like, am I okay with how the chips fall? Right? And I think that relationships, even the really long-term ones, are full of risks when we're having these things that could cause a little bit of a stirring between people. And I think it's like being okay with...
Caitlin Raymond (49:21)
Right.
Yeah.
Andrea Clark (49:36)
This might not go exactly how I hope it goes, but I'm doing what I think is right for myself and also for them, whether they agree or not. Like it's important for them to know maybe how something they're doing is affecting me. You know what I mean?
Caitlin Raymond (49:47)
Mm-hmm, for sure.
Yeah. Yeah. And two, like holding space for wherever they are, you know, because you don't know what maybe she was going through that day or that week that made her react like that. And it was just like, you know, I said what I needed to say to get this off my chest so that we can move forward in it. I'm just going to love you for where you are. And, you know, I did my part. We can re-circle or revisit this a couple of weeks later. And maybe it's like, this is where you, when you're honest in these relationships, this is where you start to get down and honest with yourself too.
Andrea Clark (49:58)
you
Caitlin Raymond (50:17)
get to find out if people are there for a season, a reason, or a lifetime. And it's all good and it's all beautiful.
Andrea Clark (50:21)
Yeah,
I agree for sure. Cool. Okay, well, this has been amazing. I feel like this is gonna be really powerful for a lot of people who listen in to this. Yes.
Caitlin Raymond (50:27)
man!
Yeah.
Friendships and sisterhoods and just relationships
in general be taking care of the mental health of the relationship fam
Andrea Clark (50:42)
Yes. And I do want you guys to go follow Caitlin. She is amazing. tell them like you're designing your own, your own, what would you call it? Like you've created this very specific targeted way to work out for women that supports hormones, but still gets them like shredded and looking fly AF, right?
Caitlin Raymond (50:52)
you
Ahem. ⁓
Yes.
Yeah. Yeah. So I've been a personal trainer and a fat loss coach for 15 years. And really as I'm getting closer to my forties, been learning so much more about the body and hormones and how women are not designed as small men. And we should not be training and eating like small men, which is such a blessing because once we really tap, once we tap into this, we're going to see our bodies just start to change. And so my best friend and I, both have been teaching a class called war and peace with the idea
Andrea Clark (51:28)
Totally.
Caitlin Raymond (51:33)
about it being that it's, we tap into war and we tap into peace and we tap into mindfulness. I'll just say that, but our styles of it have been very different. She teaches in Los Angeles. I teach here in Hawaii. And so then the more I've been doing my class, I'm like, listen, working out where there's such a, there's such a verbiage around getting healthy and working out that it has to be an hour of this crazy cardio plus an hour of these workouts or weighted workouts.
Andrea Clark (51:54)
Yeah.
Caitlin Raymond (51:55)
And all these to-dos, all these things that we need to do, but really getting healthy, and that doesn't just mean within our body, but within our mindset too, within the peace within our mind is tapping into, well, first of all, making it manageable, making it like, I don't want to say easy in terms of an easy workout. mean, easy on your schedule, being able to just do something at home where you're getting all the pieces of the puzzle, the mindfulness, the meditation, the calorie burning, burning I'll call it, the calorie burning, fat burning.
but also the resistance training to the muscles, which is how we actually change the body specifically, but you know, it's a whole total package. So what we've done is created a at home workout that you can do with just your body weight and just bands, it's easy enough, I'll put that in air quotes, that a beginner can do it, but it's intense enough that somebody who's been working out for years and years and has tons of muscle and tons of like a great endurance and the cardiovascular is top notch,
they can do it as well and so get a really kick ass workout. And so it's called war and peace. We actually, right before this, just had our meeting with our trademark lawyer to make sure that everything's rocking and rolling. So you can follow me specifically with my fat loss and personal training. And also I'm just kind of like a really silly shit show of a blonde bombshell on my bodies by Caitlin. Always.
Andrea Clark (53:05)
He the best, most hilarious stories. He your mental health story a lot.
Caitlin Raymond (53:11)
Yeah, my mental health and just a lot of fat loss tips on my bodies by Caitlin dot fat loss coach page, but definitely follow us on war and peace because we're just about to launch all of our zoom workouts. can join zoom workouts that you can purchase that are recorded and they're anywhere from 30 to 45 minutes all at home with just body weight and band. And you might think, you know what this is going to look like in your head, but you have no idea because we've really brought, she's 18 years in the industry. I'm 15 with all sorts of certifications and we've really made this.
Pretty spicy. Yeah, it's incredible.
Andrea Clark (53:42)
I'm excited. I'm so excited. So yeah, we need to
follow you. And thank you for being vulnerable with me today and letting people see the inside of our relationship.
Caitlin Raymond (53:53)
Yes, this was so fun. really appreciate you having me.
Andrea Clark (53:55)
Absolutely, I love you, friends.
Caitlin Raymond (53:56)
I love you too,
Andrea Clark (53:58)
Okay, see you guys in the next episode.