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Audio drama renaissance man JD Sutter joins the inaugural episode of Audio Drama Insiders to answer the all-important question: What exactly IS an audio drama? We also talk about the current state of audio drama, its future, and how newcomers can get started.
Interviews and conversations with the most prolific and talented audio drama creators.
(00:00):
Welcome to audio drama, insiders the podcast, giving you the low down on the most prolific and talented creators in the industry. And now here are your hosts, Craig Hart and Trisha Rose.
(00:19):
Hey everyone. Welcome to audio drama insiders. My name is Craig Hart, and I'm here with my trusty co-host, Trisha rose. How are things going in your world, Trisha?
(00:27):
At the moment? They're going well,
(00:31):
Good to hear today. Both my kids were in school and that's notable because he yesterday, uh, one was homesick and that, uh, always there a wrench and everything. But this morning he tried to pull off the little, like I I'm so ill. Um, and then five minutes later, he was downstairs, running in circles. So off he went. Yeah. He tried to pull that whole thing. Well, I guess we'd get in today's interview. Uh, we do have a great guest today though. Somebody I've been listening to for a long time.
(00:58):
Yeah. I'm excited to talk to this person. Um, because he's one of the very first people that I actually, um, networked with or had any connections with in the audio world. So this is gonna be fun. Yeah.
(01:11):
JD setter is the founder of porch, like family media and the host of the popular podcast. Audio theater, central, a passionate podcaster, JD brings insight, compassion, and knowledge to any program. His goal is to create family friendly content and to assist others in doing the same. Welcome JD.
(01:27):
Thank you, Craig Trisha. It's a, it's a pleasure to be here with you guys.
(01:30):
Absolutely. Uh, Trisha, I was, I was telling JD when he first logged in that I've been listening to his voice on so many podcasts, like to be in the same studio with him in, uh, this kind of setting to actually be able to see him in actually pretty be cool.
(01:43):
This is audio drama insiders. So
(01:46):
There you go. And, and what better first guest to have is our inaugural episode, but JD, you're obviously a big fan of audio drama. How did you first get interested in audio audio in general? And I just say audio drama in specific,
(02:00):
Well, I've, I've been a consumer of audio O drama specifically since I was a little kid and we grew up listening to all kinds of children's programs. So not, not just audio drama, but you know, music. And, um, I mean, that was just the, the way we were raised. We had always had stuff going on. Uh, and we traveled a lot. So something was playing in the car when we were go way on road trips and things. And so I've always just loved the audio medium. And so, and I also grew up in a home without a television. So audio was kinda where we went for, for any entertainment or, or whatever. So it's just been a huge part of my life. I think my first love of audio was, was music. I was really, really into music a lot. And so when I first started getting into podcasting, my first show was about music. It's kind of grown. And, you know, as I got more into consuming audio drama and just learning about the fan communities, a, around some different shows, I was like, you know what? This is something that I would like to get into, you know, that was many, many years ago. And it has, uh, grown quite a lot since then.
(03:10):
Yeah. I've heard, heard somebody say the other day that they feel like audio drama is entering a second golden age. Would you agree with that?
(03:19):
Yeah. And, and I think you could look at that a couple of different ways in terms of awareness in the United States. Definitely. And in terms of just availability of content. Yes. Uh, I would say I, I would say that is the case, maybe not quite so much in terms of quality. I think that a lot of the stuff that's out there right now is not quite up to par in terms of, of the best quality that, that even some productions have had many years ago. So just because there is a lot of stuff out there and a lot more awareness of it, I, I don't necessarily think that all of it is, um, the greatest quality, I guess it depends on how you determine or define a golden age. Is it based on quality or, or, uh, amount of content?
(04:06):
Yeah, I guess, you know, I sort of see a parallel with audio drama, the accessibility of methods to create audio dramas, casting hub, and, and all that stuff. Um, software and apps you can use to create audio dramas and the same way that, uh, KDP with publishing did anybody could not publish a book well that revolutionized publishing. Um, but it also meant that a lot of people published who perhaps shouldn't have, or maybe I shouldn't say shouldn't shouldn't have, but maybe weren't ready. Weren't ready to, but they did because they could. And in a way we're kind of seeing that, I think with, with audio drama too, I, I do hope that, you know, once the dust settles, like the quality stuff will, you know, rise to the top and will end up with a net gain of a medium that I am a huge fan of. And I would love, would love to see grow.
(04:55):
I'm hopeful that that that will be the case. Um, but like you said, you know, just because you can do something doesn't necessarily, you mean that you should, or, or that you're ready. And, and that is, you know, it's, uh, the democratization of media it's, it has pros and cons. So I guess that's where, where something like ATC comes in. I mean, that's, our goal is to kinda sift through the stuff and, and let people know about the stuff that we think is worth your time, so that you don't have to.
(05:20):
Now you draw a distinction between audio drama and audio fiction. Uh, I was wondering if perhaps you could explain the difference and maybe why you feel there's a need for that differentiation.
(05:32):
Yeah, sure. So to me, audio drama, and, and this is something that we, we talked about for a long time, especially when we launched the, the Seneca awards, we had to say, had to put this out in words, okay, this is exactly what we mean by audio drama. So people know what we're looking for when we're looking for submissions for, for the Seneca awards. And so we put this down, we said, and to us, audio drama is a dramatized audio production consisting of a full cast of actors performing a story, accompanied by sound design and music to create an immersive oral experience. Now, I know that's a bit of a mouthful, but I think all of those elements are essential to what we mean when we're talking about audio drama, it's, it's not a full cast audio book. That's something different. There's nothing wrong with those.
(06:18):
I love full cast audio books, as, as Trisha knows, you know, both of us have been involved in those kinds of productions. And I, I don't know about you Craig, but that content is fantastic too, but it's not audio drama. It's also not one voice spoken word performances. I mean, there's a lot of that kind of cool stuff out there. Even if it has sound effects and music, it needs that full cast asked those actors playing off of each other. That is a dramatization that's audio drama. And so where audio fiction that term and also fiction podcast, those two have sort of become synonymous with audio drama in, in the last, probably in the last five to eight years. It's, it's, it's been relatively recent. And problem I have with that is not all audio drama is fiction. You can tell a, a, a dramatized story that's true, or based on something that's true. So that fiction tag just doesn't work for me. And then if you use the term fiction podcast, well, then not all audio drama is released as a podcast podcast is just one distribution method. Maybe some producers only use that, that one method, but that doesn't mean that all podcasts that are fiction are audio drama. So I think it's important to make that distinction.
(07:29):
Yeah. When you talk about the, the various titles, um, fiction podcasts, for example, I've seen a lot of those labels used by some bigger are players entering the space, like, uh, movie studios, for example. And it seems to me that they're kind of pretending, or maybe they think, and don't really know that they invented a new art form. And I find that a little bit annoying because this has been going on for a really long time.
(07:54):
It really has. Yeah. And I see those kind of things and press releases put out, you know, so, you know, we, we just created an audio movie and, you know, this kind of, you know, there's all these different terms floating around and, and yeah, and I think some of it is ignorance and I don't mean that in a derogatory manner. Sure. It's just, you know, they're just not doing their research into the space. And some of it might just be somebody trying to come up with a phrase that they think will resonate with their target or their, the people they're trying to get at, go for, you know, using terminology that they think they'll understand. Cause sometimes even now, I mean, if you say audio drama to some people, they still don't really know exactly what you're talking about.
(08:33):
Yeah. I think that's another hurdle that audio drama faces is that not only are we trying to get our product to who the consumer, but we also sometimes have to educate the consumer as well. You know, you've been involved in a lot of different aspects of, of audio acting, reviewing podcast editing. Uh, do you have a favorite among those?
(08:52):
I really like directing and just working with the whole creative process of, of putting together a production. I do enjoy acting. Um, I've not done a whole lot of writing, but I do enjoy that as well. But I think, I think my favorite is just the whole process of just getting it all together. And I guess that's the producer role, you know, just coming, getting all of the pieces together and making sure that it's all flowing. That's the kind of, uh, creative stuff that, that just really, uh, really, I, I, I love, I love that stuff a lot. So, um, that, that's probably my favorite part of it. And if it's not something that I've been involved in, I just love listening to it. So
(09:32):
Now your podcast, uh, audio theater central has been going for, what is it? 12 years now?
(09:39):
Yeah, right around there. So September of 2010 is when we launched,
(09:43):
Um, you do a lot of reviews on there as well. And I always wonder cuz you and the other, the hosts are, are fair. Right? Insightful. Is it ever difficult though, to give negative feedback on an audio drama?
(09:55):
I always always want to make sure that I'm not overly negative. And we've talked about, you know, if there are things that we have or issues that we we think should have been addressed or you know, little problems that we have with an audio drama, we've said, we're not gonna shy from bringing those points up, but we also wanna make sure that we are equally sharing out the positives as well. And so it's not just, oh, this thing is ridiculous. You should, you know, this is terrible, you know? And also we've Al always said, if we are taking the time to talk about it on the show, then we think it's worth listening to. And so we'll never do a promotion for something that we don't think is worth your time. We just don't wanna waste your time. That's been always, the underpinning of our approach is, Hey, let's not pull punches, but let's also share what we think is really good.
(10:44):
Sometimes I wonder, man, uh, maybe I was a little bit too hard on that. Sometimes I think about that, you know, but you know, I think it's, it's one of the things that we've become known for. And we've heard feedback from producers that said, you know, you said X and because of that, I changed it in the, in the next volume or different things like that. And so we've heard from a lot of different people that producers and the listeners, the listeners like hearing things that, um, they may not have picked up on and, and the producers that are listening they've, you know, like I said, we've heard that it's helped them to become better at so absolutely.
(11:19):
And like I say, I mean, I find the reviews to be fair and, and insightful. And, and again, when you, when you, or any other host do give feedback, that could be perceived as negative, it's always constructive. And whether the feedback or the review that I'm listening to, whether it's talking about a positive thing or a negative thing, regardless, it makes me think more deep about what I've just listened to. Then I then get more out of the audio drama. I guess we talked about this a, a little bit in terms of the golden age, but where do you think audio drama is going from here?
(11:51):
You know, I think it's probably going to just continue to grow here in the United States. And here's the one thing that we are often very US-centric in, in our approaches to this topic because it nearly died out here in the us, this medium, you know, but elsewhere in the world, it was not, I mean, it was still going strong where we talk a, about this new golden age or this resurgence, well, that's really primarily just in the us. Um, you know, it, it never really went anywhere in a lot of other countries, especially in Europe. So I think it's going to continue to grow. There will be more people that get involved and I, and I've just seen it grow so much. And, and I think that is primarily because of podcasts. I mean, it has become so easy to distribute content and audio drama has been in podcasting since the very, very early days.
(12:41):
I think I don't have the exact date, but I think it was back in 2004, 2005, the first audio drama that was released as a podcast, launched the radio adventures of Dr. Floyd from grant Bocco and, and he's still involved in podcasting to this day. Wow. And he's done several other audio dramas since then all released his podcasts. So it's, it's been in the podcast medium for a long time. And as more people get into podcasting and then they discover these shows, then they're like, well, I wanna make my own. And so I do think it's gonna continue to grow what I'm hoping for. And really trying to push for with, with my efforts in the space is to bring up that quality. Let's let's, let's not just run off and, oh, I've got this story idea and run off and make it no, let's, let's take some time.
(13:29):
Let's learn how to record people properly. Let's learn how to do sound effects that I actually sound good and you know, not a bunch of, uh, extraneous sound and you know, all this other background noise that's going on that distracts from your story, you know, so that's really where my focus is and that's what the Senecas are all about is promoting the, the high quality stuff. And that's, that's where I'm, I'm hoping things are going, but I, I do think it's going to just continue to grow. And that is exciting. I'm excited. Every time I see a new player that's coming in that is really making high quality stuff and I love it. I absolutely love it. And it just makes me happy when I, when I find ESP, I mean, you're an example. I mean, you've been in audio production for a long time, so you're not a stranger to that side of it, but to move into the audio drama space, I was just so excited because it was good quality stuff. The stories are strong and it's, it's just a, it's awesome.
(14:24):
When I started getting involved in, or thinking about getting involved in audio drama, you know, audio theater central, and you were one of the first things I found. And I just wanna take a moment to thank you. Uh, because you've connected me with pretty much everybody that I've been involved with in audio drama since then who've helped me create various things. But you were, you were, you started that. So you were, you were massively helpful to me and I truly do appreciate it
(14:50):
Over the 10 plus years that we've been doing this. I've connected a lot of different people. And I look at it as a privilege and an honor, because I'm actually having an impact in this space because these creatives then get together and then they make something awesome. Like I connected the Brinkman adventures with Jared de squa several years ago, and then he ended up scoring several episodes. He just scored their massive project on William Bradford. And it's absolutely amazing. And I, yes, I do take a little bit of pride in saying, Hey, I connected those folks, but I also am just very honored and, and glad that I can do that because I have developed a lot of context over the years because I'm always looking to, to see what we can do. So love it. And, and it's, it's great to have you in the space, Craig,
(15:35):
And I'll second that because, because JD, you are a tremendous resource and connector. And, um, I don't know how I stumbled across the audio theater essential podcast several years ago. But when I did and I, I heard your reviews and, and the information that you had to put out in your podcasts. I knew I need to know that person. And, um, yeah, you have been very instrumental in connecting me as well, um, with Craig. So then piggybacking on that, where JD would you suggest, um, someone who wants to get started in audio drama, someone who wants to act in audio dramas, or maybe there's someone who wants to be involved in a different aspect of creating story, audio stories, where would you suggest that they get started on their journey?
(16:26):
So I think before you ever start working on your own audio drama, the, the very first step is to listen to a lot of really high quality audio drama. You know, the old saying, if you want to be a writer you need to read, it's the same for audio drama. And I think it's, it's extremely valuable because I think I know this is a roundabout way of answering your question, but I think that that's where this issue is coming from with the, a lot of this glut of sub power content is they're finding that some of this stuff out there, they're just listening to that, you know, the easily accessible stuff and thinking that that's where the bar is set, you know? And so they're just making some more of that same level of quality and never digging deeper. So anytime you're gonna go into a creative endeavor, you need to do your research cuz you don't know what you don't know.
(17:13):
And so you've gotta get in there and learn about the medium and so good places to do that are, you know, once you've found some good, really good shows, connect with those creators, if, if at all possible, and maybe they're, maybe they're looking for a voice for, for an upcoming episode or maybe they're wanting to collaborate on an upcoming script or something like that, what, or you are wanting to get into, you know, see if you can get involved in these productions that you are a fan of and that's how you build out your network. But if you're really interested in high quality audio drama and at audio theater central, our focus is specifically on family friendly audio drama. So we're very familiar with Lamplighter, uh, which is a great company out of a New York state. And they have, uh, the lamplight Guild where they dig deep into creation, process of audio drama from music composition to script writing, to acting to postproduction.
(18:08):
So they go really deep into that. So they do those lamplight or Guild sessions, um, uh, every summer I believe that's their still their schedule. So I would say if you're really wanting to do a, a deep dive crash course and learn from experts, that's where you should go. Because out of that has come multiple productions, like heirloom audio's extraordinary adventures of GA hint was born out of the lamplight or Guild, and it's one of the highest quality audio dramas in the world. And, uh, so you've gotta find those, those kind of, uh, connections that you can make with other creators. And then look for places to learn. I don't know of any really specific other programs, um, like the land flat or Guild or, you know, audio drama, specific training. That's, that's one thing that's tough. Um, I would love to see something more in this space, but you just gotta get connected with some people who have some other connections in the space and, and it can grow from there because you can also take, you know, if you're, if you're interested in acting, you can always look up, you know, some of your favorite voice actors.
(19:12):
And a lot of times they do workshops like Katie Lee, who plays con Kindle on adventures in Odyssey and done, I don't know, hundreds, probably thousands of voices over the years in all kinds of different productions, you know what I mean? She does, uh, workshops for, for voice acting. And so, unfortunately there's not like a one place to go to learn this. You've gotta, you've gotta do your homework, I think. And maybe that's a, maybe that's a, a tough thing. Why, why there's not more high quality? I don't know. I know that's probably a very unsatisfactory answer, but
(19:43):
Certainly better than I could have given, but you know, one thing I will say is that I have found in my brief time in this community that the immense amount of generosity that I have found. So if I reach out to somebody most of the time, they not only respond, but respond with more than I asked for.
(20:03):
Yeah, that's absolutely true. I've, I've definitely found that to be the case as well. And I, I cannot believe I forgot this, but I should also mention SoniCon, which has been a, a convention that has run the last couple of years. There it's a, it's a weekend convention specifically about audio drama and it's designed for creators and fans. So there's a, there is sessions and events for both sides of the, of the space. That is another resource. If you're interested in getting into it into audio drama production, go to SoniCon because you will make a ton of connections. There, there are some really cool stuff that has come out of. SoniCon just in the two years that has been running.
(20:40):
Are they having it again this year?
(20:42):
I have not heard a schedule yet for this year. I'm I'm hoping, but I haven't heard
(20:47):
Anything official. All right. Well, thank you for joining us for the inaugural episode of audio drama insiders, JD. Thanks so much for being with us today. Oh, it was a blast. Thank you. And thank you to my cohost. Tricia rose. Thank you so much. Thank you for having me. This has been the audio drama insiders podcast. I'm Craig Hart. Thank you for listening.