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Stacey Flaster and Dori Goldman are two ladies obsessed with cults and true crime. Join them as they take us into the depths of some of the most notorious cults, crimes, and killers that the world has ever known. They consume content and ask deep dark questions that only a certified expert can answer... enter Dr. John Mayer. Dr. John is an internationally known Forensic Psychologist and expert on violent behavior and crime prevention, with 35 years of experience consulting to law enforcement and testifying in hundreds of court cases as an expert witness. He is the "Real Deal" and will help Stacey and Dori get to the bottom of of their curious criminal minds.
00:00:00:05 - 00:00:03:04
Stacey
Candy.
00:00:03:07 - 00:00:06:17
Stacey
A podcast about cults, crimes and killers.
00:00:06:17 - 00:00:11:17
Unknown
Oh. They.
00:00:11:17 - 00:00:19:04
Stacey/Dori
You know, we love talking about cults, crimes and killers. But what if we told you some of that has happened to us?
00:00:19:04 - 00:00:23:14
Stacey/Dori
Hopefully none of us have killed anybody. But, yeah,
00:00:23:14 - 00:00:31:17
Stacey/Dori
we have been recruited, manipulated, gaslit, and not just by our exes. We've got stories.
00:00:31:21 - 00:00:39:22
Dr John Mayer
And it turns out that studying the dark side gets a lot more interesting. When you lived a bit of it, and you're going to hear about it today.
00:00:40:10 - 00:00:54:24
Stacey/Dori
In this episode, we're talking about our brushes with the bizarre, the controlling, and the just plain shady. Because sometimes the wildest stories don't come from the headlines. They come from your co-hosts.
00:00:55:23 - 00:01:01:17
Unknown
I'm outside my window. No.
00:01:01:19 - 00:01:07:03
Speaker 1
It's all Iranian.
00:01:07:05 - 00:01:14:03
Unknown
When the wind blows, I feel pain.
00:01:14:05 - 00:01:20:10
Speaker 1
I mean, I mean, no, doctor.
00:01:20:12 - 00:01:41:07
Unknown
But I'm not still. A Protestant like that. Oh. I mean, ever since,
00:01:42:18 - 00:01:43:02
Speaker 1
In the.
00:01:43:02 - 00:01:43:11
Speaker 1
In the.
00:01:43:11 - 00:01:51:07
Unknown
Oh, 00000.
00:01:51:06 - 00:01:57:14
Stacey/Dori
So here we are, the three of us together, talking about our our brushes with
00:01:57:14 - 00:02:02:08
Stacey/Dori
killers, crimes and cults. Does anybody version and manipulation.
00:02:02:10 - 00:02:13:00
Dr John Mayer
Get some good stories? I was going to, you know, when in the intro you guys, when you said, I hope nobody's killed anybody, I was going to I was going to clap a little bit. But yeah.
00:02:13:02 - 00:02:40:08
Stacey/Dori
Doctor John do tell. Well, you know what I'll say, Dory, I've wanted to kill people, but I haven't done it because, you know, I have a thing about me that says, don't do that. So, John, what is it about a person that the where's the line between actually following through with it? Is it mental illness? Is it second it behavior between somebody crossing the line to kill somebody.
00:02:40:10 - 00:03:06:00
Dr John Mayer
Well well not necessarily it it really is about boundaries setting you know, that, most of us are race. And I have to say, most of us, you know, we we, we constantly in, in our society are fascinated by the unusual and abnormal. We always have to remember that the vast majority of us are good people, live good lives, contribute to the world.
00:03:06:02 - 00:03:42:09
Dr John Mayer
But what you're talking about is crossing a boundary that, you know, some people can and some people can't, you know, and yeah, let's do with sometimes it's at that moment, you know, you know, the, the, with a lot of the work I do, you know, it's, it's gruesome and with, law enforcement and going into a murder, etc., but the statistics are that most murders are between familiar people, and it's just, you know, it's a killing that happens spontaneously because of an argument or, or whatever.
00:03:42:09 - 00:03:47:00
Dr John Mayer
And that's, that's I mean, the statistics are overwhelming. It's like 80%.
00:03:47:02 - 00:03:48:02
Stacey/Dori
Wow,
00:03:48:02 - 00:04:15:09
Stacey/Dori
I hate injustice. And I'm not going to lie, I don't I here's the thing. I'm, I'm I've never been to the point of like where I'm going to kill anybody because I, I believe that I have some sanity within me. However ever. I have definitely been really, really angry with people, especially when I have been sucked over.
00:04:15:18 - 00:04:18:00
Dr John Mayer
Can I beg to pop in? Because sure.
00:04:18:00 - 00:04:18:04
Stacey/Dori
You.
00:04:18:04 - 00:04:24:05
Dr John Mayer
Can. You know, what are those? You're the doctor that really can't stop.
00:04:24:05 - 00:04:28:15
Dr John Mayer
That really is a great segue into my story.
00:04:28:17 - 00:04:32:00
Stacey/Dori
Oh, okay. Let's go into your let's hear your story.
00:04:32:03 - 00:04:36:07
Dr John Mayer
Because I have been ready to kill somebody because of what happened.
00:04:36:07 - 00:04:41:03
Unknown
Oh. They.
00:04:41:03 - 00:04:46:01
Stacey/Dori
Oh, I'm dying to hear this. I mean, literally no pun intended. No pun intended. Yeah, no pun.
00:04:46:01 - 00:04:48:04
Dr John Mayer
Intended for a pun intended.
00:04:48:04 - 00:05:15:15
Dr John Mayer
Let me tell you the story. You both may know, and maybe the audience doesn't know. I was raised in the inner city of Chicago. My parents were, you know, not wealthy. You probably call us lower middle class people. So as I, progressed in my career and, you know, I got into Northwestern Medical School, etc., and things were, you know, starting to to, happen for me.
00:05:15:17 - 00:05:25:09
Dr John Mayer
I became a doctor, finally making actual real money in my life. And, had had a young family. And then something happened.
00:05:31:02 - 00:05:37:20
Dr John Mayer
A friend of the family, who was,
00:05:37:20 - 00:05:42:03
Dr John Mayer
you know, is a type of guy you can kind of guess is a shyster.
00:05:42:03 - 00:05:47:16
Dr John Mayer
he was kind of a tangential guy in my my close family circles
00:05:48:00 - 00:06:20:19
Dr John Mayer
And this guy stole my identity. And, this was in the days when stealing your identity wasn't even a thing. He literally, took my financial information and get this, actually, I'll give you actually how I found out about it, I, I was starting to get calls from, like, the electric company, and gas company that I was past do, bills, and I'm going.
00:06:20:23 - 00:06:42:08
Dr John Mayer
I always pay my bills almost immediately when I get them. And so I would let them go, you know, I just wouldn't even answer the phone. But I answered the phone. And one of them, I forget why. And some of these, by the way, were at like 11 p.m. at night. I'll never forget the first one. I, I, answered.
00:06:42:10 - 00:07:04:07
Dr John Mayer
I was literally in bed and they woke me up and it was an electric company. And I said, what is this about? And they gave me an address of a property. You know, I don't have, you know, any I don't own any property and such and such. I said, well, sir, you're the person of record, you know, and we we passed you like thousands of dollars.
00:07:04:07 - 00:07:38:10
Dr John Mayer
And remember, this is decades ago. And money was that was different. So these calls kept coming. And finally I hired a private detective and I said, what's going on here? And the addresses were all different again. Late at night, I get a call from the private detective about a week later, and he was a little bit too glib at the time because he kind of chuckled and said, you know, doctor, mayor, you own 13 buildings and a hotel.
00:07:38:10 - 00:07:40:19
Dr John Mayer
Oh, yeah. Oh, my.
00:07:41:06 - 00:07:43:08
Stacey/Dori
Wow. That's insane.
00:07:43:08 - 00:08:01:04
Dr John Mayer
it was devastating. And I'm a young I'm like 27 years old. I have never experienced anything like this in my life. You know, again, coming from poor stock, I don't know, finances and, you know, property and all this kind of I've been involved in any of this kind of stuff.
00:08:01:05 - 00:08:32:12
Dr John Mayer
turns out that this private investigator found everything out in this brand, took my financial, financials in my identity and bought all these properties in my name. And then he was the quintessential slumlord. He would not pay any bills on them and just collect rents. And he was making all kinds of money off my name, my finances.
00:08:32:14 - 00:08:58:12
Dr John Mayer
And I became furious. I was livid would also probably both of you don't know. I was a very angry young man when I was growing up because of circumstances. Poor kid, you know, why me, etc. but that's a whole other episode. But, you know, I was absolutely livid. I still had a lot of that youthful anger in me.
00:08:58:14 - 00:09:04:12
Dr John Mayer
So, I found this out. We had 14 separate court,
00:09:04:12 - 00:09:12:16
Dr John Mayer
cases to resolve, and I am just earning money. I'm just making a living.
00:09:12:18 - 00:09:21:14
Stacey/Dori
Wait a second, John, I have to I have to there are just so many questions. I just. Do you still own the hotel?
00:09:21:16 - 00:09:39:20
Dr John Mayer
That was my next line. Dory. Thank you. We got out of, the 13 properties, which were, multi-family home, you know, like three, four, five, family home. But I got stuck with the hotel.
00:09:39:22 - 00:09:47:22
Stacey/Dori
We. Do you still own the hotel? No. Oh, because I was going to say maybe we can all go there. You should go a party.
00:09:48:00 - 00:09:55:08
Dr John Mayer
Oh, no, you don't want to go see our listeners. I won't mention the where it's at and everything, but it's it's one. It's basically a bum's hotel.
00:09:55:08 - 00:10:00:16
Stacey/Dori
how did he get your information? Like, I don't get like, how would initially have I don't even know.
00:10:00:17 - 00:10:06:22
Dr John Mayer
I don't know if he went into my office and pulled records, at some kind of family get together,
00:10:06:22 - 00:10:07:15
Dr John Mayer
and never came up.
00:10:07:15 - 00:10:18:19
Dr John Mayer
And in the trials, the trials were all about the money in the business. They weren't about, again, it wasn't a criminal trial. So they weren't then they didn't care less about how we got the information. He literally had my financial records.
00:10:18:19 - 00:10:33:20
Dr John Mayer
But I wanted why I wanted to jump on your commentaries because I was so angry at this guy. I literally had a gun at the door in my house, and if he showed up, I would.
00:10:33:22 - 00:10:36:19
Dr John Mayer
I will tell you I was going to kill him.
00:10:36:19 - 00:10:39:13
Dr John Mayer
thank God he never showed up.
00:10:39:15 - 00:11:07:24
Dr John Mayer
But that's how angry I was. And again, before I get to the punchline or the closure, I want to tell you I learned something exceptionally valuable by this whole incident. One I was so angry at this guy that it consumed me, just consumed me on my way to the office. I was totally thinking about it. I won't say I've had a good ability.
00:11:07:24 - 00:11:31:24
Dr John Mayer
When I deal with directly with patients on that moment, I could forget about it, but it also took me away from paperwork and everything else. You know, being a good doctor. And I don't think I was a good family man or a good husband at the time because it just it literally consumed me. And I'm sure many people in the audience can relate to how consumed you are with the singer.
00:11:32:01 - 00:11:59:22
Dr John Mayer
When something like this happens. And then true story. I was driving to the office and I had an epiphany. Like a lightning bolt hit me. Then he's still winning. He's still got my mind under control and captured and still hurting me. At that moment and literally let it go.
00:11:59:24 - 00:12:00:17
Stacey/Dori
Wow.
00:12:00:19 - 00:12:20:09
Dr John Mayer
And I and I, this is going to sound kind of religious or spiritual, but I, I said to myself at that time, I said, you know, how can I forgive other people and tell people, you know, to forgive things that happened to them and to heal from it? And I can't do it myself.
00:12:20:14 - 00:12:36:02
Dr John Mayer
So it taught me forgiveness. It taught me to move on in my life, but it also taught me, and I tell my patients, I'll never forget it. And that guy would never be able to do this to me again,
00:12:36:02 - 00:12:37:09
Dr John Mayer
turns out,
00:12:37:09 - 00:12:46:24
Dr John Mayer
he moves to Arizona, finds an attorney, and does exactly the same thing to this attorney.
00:12:47:05 - 00:12:49:05
Stacey/Dori
He in prison now?
00:12:49:05 - 00:12:51:09
Dr John Mayer
he died a young man.
00:12:51:09 - 00:12:54:21
Dr John Mayer
earlier in his life. I think he was in his 50s or something like that.
00:12:54:21 - 00:13:00:06
Dr John Mayer
So it's sort of like he got his comeuppance, you know? But that's why.
00:13:00:07 - 00:13:03:00
Stacey/Dori
He never went to jail. He never went to jail.
00:13:03:08 - 00:13:25:09
Dr John Mayer
Well, we could have taken that route. But then what? I was advised at that time, and maybe the attorneys in our audience have a different opinion. But my attorney said, listen, we can do one of two things. We can get you out of all that or try to get you out. Turns out we did, get you out of these properties and all this bills, through civil suits.
00:13:25:14 - 00:13:30:15
Dr John Mayer
Or we can go the criminal way and, you know, but you're going to have a harder time,
00:13:30:15 - 00:13:31:03
Dr John Mayer
that's.
00:13:31:03 - 00:13:53:00
Stacey/Dori
That's that is, that's like a whole podcast. And it also reminded me of the, of the story that we told last week, just about somebody completely manipulating somebody. And then just it just keeps growing and growing and getting bigger and becomes an animal. Yeah. And the person just is brainwashed.
00:13:53:00 - 00:14:00:20
Stacey/Dori
so I'm asking you this because I have a personal story as well that is kind of similar to this.
00:14:00:20 - 00:14:08:22
Stacey/Dori
Did you did you follow him throughout the years, like, were you kind of I don't want to say obsessed, but.
00:14:08:22 - 00:14:14:15
Stacey/Dori
Or are you obsessed? That's a really good question about him as the issue.
00:14:14:15 - 00:14:41:04
Dr John Mayer
That's a story that was part of that epiphany. And I just let it go. I didn't care less. I didn't think about him. I didn't follow him on LinkedIn or try to find out or Facebook him, see what was going on in life. I actually heard again, because he was a family friend. I mean, there would be times where I was going to family parties and I had to ask them, is he around?
00:14:41:04 - 00:14:57:05
Dr John Mayer
Because I'm not going to, you know, I'm not going to show up if he's invited and interesting enough and kind of painfully, the family didn't ostracize him. They all found out what happened. And I was I was hurt by that. I'll be honest.
00:14:57:05 - 00:15:05:15
Stacey/Dori
So did you would you like would you ask them over the years why? I know you let it go eventually, but during the height of it.
00:15:05:15 - 00:15:15:10
Dr John Mayer
During the height when I still wasn't letting go, yeah, I had really candid conversations with my relatives and saying, how can you allow him in your house? You know what happened?
00:15:15:10 - 00:15:20:09
Stacey/Dori
is it just cognitive dissonance? Is it like they can't accept it or anything with it?
00:15:20:10 - 00:15:29:21
Dr John Mayer
I mean, I think it was, you know, I come from the stock of people where you don't rock the boat, you know, don't don't we don't want any friction. You know, you know.
00:15:29:23 - 00:15:33:00
Stacey/Dori
Etc. keep it cool, keep it calm, even if it's killing you.
00:15:33:00 - 00:15:52:06
Dr John Mayer
But with the extent of what happened, I couldn't in my mind reconcile. I would never let that happen to a friend of mine or a relative. I wouldn't have nothing to do with this for me too. Me too. I would drive up to family get togethers and I would see his car in the driveway and we would just turn around, go.
00:15:52:09 - 00:15:55:03
Stacey/Dori
Wow. I mean, that is a wow story.
00:15:55:04 - 00:16:03:04
Dr John Mayer
It is. And, you know, I it took me decades to recover from the financial hole and put me in. I mean, it was just, you know.
00:16:03:04 - 00:16:04:17
Stacey/Dori
Sucks. That sucks.
00:16:04:17 - 00:16:06:03
Dr John Mayer
That was another painful part of it.
00:16:06:03 - 00:16:15:03
Stacey/Dori
Such a violation. Yeah. Such a that violating people in all ways is just so it's just hard to reconcile. Yeah,
00:16:15:03 - 00:16:20:00
Unknown
Oh. They.
00:16:20:00 - 00:16:25:19
Stacey/Dori
I'm going to just tell you a couple of my stories. And they're not that intense. Honestly,
00:16:25:19 - 00:16:32:15
Stacey/Dori
But I one point was recruited into a pyramid scheme,
00:16:32:15 - 00:16:41:03
Unknown
Who?
00:16:41:15 - 00:16:44:00
Stacey/Dori
a legit pyramid scheme,
00:16:44:00 - 00:16:51:19
Stacey/Dori
Bob Proctor. It was the name of the guru. As we say, there's always a charismatic leader. You said that, John, in another episode.
00:16:51:19 - 00:16:59:24
Stacey/Dori
He had this series of DVDs and tapes. Okay. So tells you how long it was. It was about 15 years ago.
00:16:59:24 - 00:17:01:15
Stacey/Dori
one of my friends.
00:17:01:15 - 00:17:14:09
Stacey/Dori
Talk to me about it. It's all about this manifestation. I'm using air quotes, manifesting your life. Think and grow rich by whatever that author, Napoleon, whatever, whatever his name is, all the MLM is.
00:17:14:09 - 00:17:35:02
Stacey/Dori
Use this book. It's about manifesting wealth because there's no other way to describe how you can make money in a multi-level marketing company, unless you're thinking the right way. And if you don't make money, that means you don't have enough manifestation, enough good thoughts. It's all it's all justified with bullshit. So my friend says to me, you need to get these tapes.
00:17:35:02 - 00:17:37:12
Stacey/Dori
They're $1,800.
00:17:37:17 - 00:17:53:24
Stacey/Dori
And you listen to each tape. Now, there, there wasn't like a like you couldn't get like an MP3. There's no streaming service to get it. I had to take the DVD and put it in a DVD player and listen to it. It was such a pain in the ass, but that's what it was. I listened to all the tapes.
00:17:53:24 - 00:18:16:19
Stacey/Dori
I read the books. And then she came to me and said that there's another level, and I said, I don't feel comfortable. My and my husband doesn't feel comfortable. And she was like, well, if you don't want to invest in it, and this is the key, then you you're not motivated. That means that you don't trust and you don't trust the process.
00:18:16:19 - 00:18:33:06
Stacey/Dori
And you're you're blocking and you know, you're not allowing these, you know, and it's just money. And if you're afraid to let go of money, how are you going to make any you got to let it go to make it. And I, I went back and, you know, I have a mother who is we always like to talk about cults and stuff like that.
00:18:33:06 - 00:18:47:20
Stacey/Dori
And I was always going back and forth of, you know, like, should I invest in this again? Like $1,800? I don't make that much money, you know? And it just felt so scammy. I stopped talking to her. I didn't buy any more. He since passed away
00:18:47:20 - 00:19:09:16
Stacey/Dori
You had said that your mother, you know, you guys would always talk about cults and all that. So when you initially did this, were you talking to your mom about this? Like, this is what I'm doing? Like, what was the influence? When did you bring your fam Marley, into this?
00:19:09:17 - 00:19:20:13
Stacey/Dori
I don't think I told her because I was having this. I was starting to be brain, you know, it's like a beginning of brainwashing where I was starting to think, what if she's right?
00:19:20:13 - 00:19:40:16
Stacey/Dori
And what if I do manifest money? What if I make what myself a node? I will make 250,000 in the next year. And I put it in my wallet. You know, I was starting to kind of buy into this shit, and I my husband was not into it. I, he was not into it. I mean, thank God. But I finally it clicked.
00:19:40:16 - 00:19:43:03
Stacey/Dori
It came to my senses. I had an epiphany, just like John,
00:19:43:13 - 00:19:48:13
Stacey/Dori
So I, I don't think I, I don't think that I told my parents,
00:19:48:13 - 00:19:52:08
Stacey/Dori
I think I was just embarrassed because I was doing something I was against.
00:19:52:11 - 00:19:57:18
Dr John Mayer
And I think people have to understand that their techniques are so effective.
00:19:57:20 - 00:20:01:14
Stacey/Dori
Oh, yeah. I'm very they they love bamboo. It's love bombing.
00:20:01:20 - 00:20:34:24
Dr John Mayer
Their techniques are, you know, based on some very scientific principles that, we humans, certainly susceptible to, the same techniques are used in torture. Same techniques are used in brainwashing. And they're very effective at pulling people in and, and grabbing hold. And so when we talk about getting victimized, you know, we have, the utmost respect for our victims because they're, they're innocent.
00:20:34:24 - 00:20:45:06
Dr John Mayer
They're, they're they're really pawns to these people that are so skilled to make these things happen, not only in our own stories, but in the episodes that we're going to talk about.
00:20:45:06 - 00:21:18:10
Stacey/Dori
isn't it also to like, there's a little bit of it's to me like a combination of like hope, like, of course, who doesn't want to have $250,000? Like, oh, I want to. Of course, I'm hopeful. There's also a bit of like, desperation to like, you know, you're you're longing for this. You, you know, there's that sadness and then there's the hope because I, I really think that that's why, like cults and like, really resonate with me.
00:21:18:10 - 00:21:30:10
Stacey/Dori
Because the two because we've talked about this before, but like, how does one get into it. But honestly, I see it I see, you know, it's it's easy if you're into it.
00:21:30:10 - 00:21:40:18
Dr John Mayer
We have all opened up a spam, email that, you know, attracted us and it was totally spam. I know I have.
00:21:40:20 - 00:21:41:20
Stacey/Dori
I have two.
00:21:41:22 - 00:21:45:00
Dr John Mayer
I, I feel guilty about it.
00:21:45:02 - 00:21:45:15
Stacey/Dori
So do I.
00:21:45:20 - 00:21:47:06
Dr John Mayer
You know, the again, these.
00:21:47:08 - 00:21:49:06
Stacey/Dori
You want to believe. You want to believe.
00:21:49:07 - 00:22:06:09
Dr John Mayer
And they're powerful. They were. Yeah. They're based on again things that we as humans will fall for. So we can't blame anybody for getting involved in them. But one of the purposes of our whole podcast series is to say people think, yes, you know.
00:22:06:09 - 00:22:11:01
Stacey/Dori
Think and analyze and look things up, you know, look things up.
00:22:11:04 - 00:22:18:02
Stacey/Dori
a lot of these, people that are in these companies say they're entrepreneurs and it's their own business.
00:22:18:02 - 00:22:40:13
Stacey/Dori
That is not true. They have a ten, they're 1099 employees, and they are not the owner of the business. They can be terminated at a moment's notice. Moderne, a multi-level marketing company, just literally within hours, shut their entire system down and didn't warn anybody. So it's not like a real job. This they're really anti 9 to 5. They talk about how bad everything else is in order to make themselves look good.
00:22:40:18 - 00:23:02:12
Stacey/Dori
You don't own your own business people. It's not your own business. You're not an entrepreneur. What we are doing is entrepreneurial. Not going in, being a consultant for a lotion company or a health and wellness company or a vitamin company or a bullshit whatever. Juices or or ketone or all this bullshit. That's all bullshit. And it's a bit.
00:23:02:15 - 00:23:08:17
Stacey/Dori
And we, you know. So I wanted to tell you that you don't own your own business. I've learned a lot from Julie Jo.
00:23:08:20 - 00:23:12:17
Stacey/Dori
all the people I follow. Laura. I can't think of their names right now,
00:23:12:17 - 00:23:19:14
Stacey/Dori
but I listen to about ten people, and they're all trying to help people heal their way out of the situation as.
00:23:19:16 - 00:23:20:06
Dr John Mayer
We are.
00:23:20:08 - 00:23:20:21
Stacey/Dori
Out.
00:23:20:23 - 00:23:23:16
Dr John Mayer
So listen to us, because that's what.
00:23:23:17 - 00:23:24:09
Stacey/Dori
We been.
00:23:24:11 - 00:23:39:03
Dr John Mayer
Ups and techniques as we go through each episode on a wide variety of thing, not only, you know, cults, killers, crime, but these, multi-level marketing scams that go up. So so thank you, Stacy, for saying that. Absolutely.
00:23:39:11 - 00:23:56:14
Stacey/Dori
And let me say one more thing about recruitment into multi-level marketing or cults. There is a there is a beginning stage which is includes love bombing and trauma dumping. And when you share your trauma, somebody people automatically feel very connected to you and then they trust you.
00:23:56:16 - 00:24:10:12
Stacey/Dori
And all this manipulation happens and that's why people fall into it. And then it includes, in some cases, most cases, religious manipulation on top of it, that this is Jesus's thought. This is Jesus's company, Jesus's guiding them.
00:24:10:12 - 00:24:18:14
Stacey/Dori
And I'm not sure how Jews even get involved in this, because every single podcast I listen to, the they drop Jesus and Jesus.
00:24:18:14 - 00:24:28:22
Stacey/Dori
Guess what? I told you this before he would not approve of this way of making money. He is, and I know this from the things I know about Jesus, and I think it's it
00:24:28:22 - 00:24:37:23
Stacey/Dori
is absolute, as I've spoken to Jesus, because I personally can just because I have a line, direct line to talk, you know, when, you know, reason.
00:24:37:23 - 00:24:41:15
Dr John Mayer
People can't see. I have a tinfoil hat on right now, you know? Yeah, yeah, yeah.
00:24:41:15 - 00:24:42:23
Stacey/Dori
Yeah, yeah. But but
00:24:42:23 - 00:25:02:13
Stacey/Dori
truthfully, I mean, it is that thing. It's like all of a sudden it becomes it's a religious thing. So. Oh, now this is part of religion. And so, you know, in, in our, you know, if you believe in Jesus, if you pray, if you do these things and remember my daughter, my daughter passed away and then my dog died, and then I needed something, and I needed something, and then I got this, and then I retired my husband.
00:25:02:13 - 00:25:10:05
Stacey/Dori
And now everything's great. And I'm making $250,000 a month. And these people are hearing this, and they're seeing dollar signs. Their eyes are going, wait, where are you right now?
00:25:10:05 - 00:25:15:24
Unknown
Oh. They.
00:25:15:24 - 00:25:29:18
Stacey/Dori
But over the years I've also been recruited into other. I'm not going to name the multi-level marketing companies right now, but I've been recruited into that, brought to dinner and talked about. You're such a great saleswoman. You have such great energy. You're so good at that.
00:25:29:18 - 00:25:42:00
Stacey/Dori
You're so good at selling. I'm like, well, I'm so good at it, you know? I'm doing what I'm doing. I didn't ask for another job. I didn't ask for a side hustle. Because as we know, 1% of the people that are in multi-level marketing companies make
00:25:42:00 - 00:25:42:10
Stacey/Dori
money,
00:25:42:10 - 00:25:43:22
Stacey/Dori
So that was my second.
00:25:43:22 - 00:25:45:11
Dr John Mayer
What was that statistic again?
00:25:45:11 - 00:25:48:16
Stacey/Dori
Say that 1%, 1%, 1%.
00:25:48:16 - 00:25:49:05
Dr John Mayer
Wow.
00:25:49:05 - 00:26:09:12
Stacey/Dori
So in in a pyramid scheme, in a multi-level marketing scheme, the people that start off at the top or that are recruited at the top are always the people making the money. Because then as you go down the line, it's called the downline and the pyramid gets wider there because it becomes more fleshed out. And there's not, any money at the bottom, there's only money at the top.
00:26:09:18 - 00:26:22:15
Stacey/Dori
And so they can they tell you in these lives that they have on Facebook and Instagram on these things I follow, you know, you need to you need to push, you need to motivate, you need to do this in the pockets of your day. It doesn't take a lot of time. You can do it from your phone and you don't.
00:26:22:15 - 00:26:41:12
Stacey/Dori
And you can have the financial freedom and freedom to be with your children. That's a big manipulator. A big manipulator is time, freedom time with your children. And you can retire your husband. There's no such thing as retiring somebody. You can't retire another person. But they use that all the time. And they. This is the scam. It's a scam.
00:26:41:12 - 00:26:43:02
Stacey/Dori
It's a it's a grift.
00:26:43:04 - 00:26:47:12
Dr John Mayer
From a psychological point of view. And also studying people,
00:26:47:12 - 00:27:05:05
Dr John Mayer
we I don't know if other cultures have this as strong as we do, but that's one of the American dreams, you know, that I don't have to do much effort. I don't I'm into it. And money will rain down on me for just, you know, being a part of this, etc..
00:27:05:05 - 00:27:14:24
Stacey/Dori
Yes, it it's doing it's something for nothing, but it's more than anything. Yeah. If it's too good to be true, it's not. It's not done or true,
00:27:14:24 - 00:27:18:02
Stacey/Dori
don't they also make you invest?
00:27:18:02 - 00:27:41:06
Stacey/Dori
Yes. So you the products up front. So even that 1% there must what's the percentage of people that lose money. Because you have to buy all the stuff. It's right. It's it's actually devastating for people. They they have to work their way out of it. They have to unlearn, you know, they have to get because there's this guilt that's put on them.
00:27:41:12 - 00:28:05:16
Stacey/Dori
Now, listen, I've listened to thousands of podcasts about all different multi-level marketing companies, from Amway to to. I don't even know everything. Everything. Herbalife, Arbonne, juice plus, la Roche sensi, la la Roche. I mean, so every single one is the same. They all say we're not a pyramid scheme. We're not a multi-level marketing.
00:28:05:18 - 00:28:25:23
Stacey/Dori
If you are recruiting people as part of the if the product is secondary and the recruitment is first, then that means like there are some companies that have just opened Make Wellness and another one, called Nueva. They don't even have a product yet. They're just recruiting. So some of these companies, affiliate marketing and network marketing are two different things.
00:28:25:23 - 00:28:48:09
Stacey/Dori
Network marketing is when you have recruitment and a product where affiliate marketing is when you have a product like Sarah V calls me up and they say, or they email me and they say, hey, we want you to be our affiliate for Sarah B, if you promote it on your site every time it sells, if they use this link, you'll make money that's totally kosher, but not multi-level marketing where you're recruited and you're invited for this opportunity.
00:28:48:09 - 00:29:10:23
Stacey/Dori
And no means yes. No doesn't mean no. What does that mean in our society? First of all, yes. And for improv, we know that Dory from our classes. But when somebody says no and you don't listen or hear that and you take that as, oh, you're just not ready, then you're fucked up, something's wrong with you. So that's happened to me a few times, and I want to tell you one more story.
00:29:10:23 - 00:29:11:06
Stacey/Dori
And, and.
00:29:11:07 - 00:29:19:20
Dr John Mayer
I though something about that. Yes. I was just sitting here thinking after telling my story, which I don't tell to anybody. Now it's out there for the.
00:29:19:20 - 00:29:23:01
Stacey/Dori
Whole now, but not everybody knows everybody who's listening. But.
00:29:23:04 - 00:29:34:02
Dr John Mayer
I was sitting and thinking that maybe a silver lining to this whole thing is for all those decades that I was recovering from this financially, I never had the money to invest in them in MLM or no.
00:29:34:03 - 00:29:48:22
Stacey/Dori
Right. Well, and that's the thing you asked me about investment. Yes, you have to invest in the products. Either you have to carry the product so you can show them on lives or you, you know, you have to order a starter kit or you have to order the book, or you have to order the book, and it's all bullshit.
00:29:48:22 - 00:30:11:08
Stacey/Dori
And they all they're also like diluted because like a company that specializes in skin care now also specializes in health. And they're not nutritionists. I'm not going to take advice from somebody who's a man who says, anybody can do this. Any job where you say, anybody can do this, but yet anybody can't. The whole thing is hypocrisy. It's just hypocrisy at its finest.
00:30:11:10 - 00:30:40:13
Stacey/Dori
The third thing I want to tell you about is about my mother. And when when my mom was working for a junior high on the North Shore of Chicago, she was directing productions there and casting kids and shows and we believe we don't know where her stock. She was being stopped for ten years, stopped, but through the mail and also on the phone, somebody called her and said, Mrs. Pastor, your husband has Aids or you know, we're going to blah, blah, blah.
00:30:40:16 - 00:31:02:21
Stacey/Dori
I don't think there was any murder threats. We did have a case, an open case, but the mail that that was sent was sent from all these bullshit, like companies, Reader's Digest, who knows? And they all said my mom's name, but written differently, like written in or the diminutive form, or in a dirty words or all this really gross stuff.
00:31:02:21 - 00:31:13:18
Stacey/Dori
And the person was a female. We believe she would call my mom and make threats, and we don't know who it is, but we're convinced that it's somebody whose kid didn't get the lead.
00:31:13:20 - 00:31:14:17
Dr John Mayer
Wow.
00:31:14:19 - 00:31:40:12
Stacey/Dori
Story of my life. But okay. Big time stalker. It was scary. It was scary. I don't we don't think she ever showed up, but we don't know. And now it's been, you know, 30 years. So we think things are 20, maybe 25 years. So we think things are cooled off. But that went on for quite a long time and it was really violating and scary and and sort of unhinged,
00:31:40:12 - 00:31:42:12
Stacey/Dori
That's like those cheerleader moms.
00:31:42:12 - 00:31:43:01
Dr John Mayer
Yeah.
00:31:43:03 - 00:31:52:24
Stacey/Dori
Yeah. Like that she'd go and murder or they going to try to kill when their kid doesn't get the leader of the squad.
00:31:52:24 - 00:31:56:05
Stacey/Dori
there is this anger that comes out when your child doesn't make it.
00:31:56:07 - 00:32:04:18
Stacey/Dori
Oh, yeah. You know, my when my kid didn't make the baseball team, I was very upset. I think I was really that angry, but it hurts.
00:32:04:20 - 00:32:05:08
Dr John Mayer
Oh it does.
00:32:05:09 - 00:32:22:03
Stacey/Dori
You don't know what to do with that. You don't know what to do with that hurt, right? Can I say one more side note? My dad recently told me, and I know I've told you both this before. He's one of the nurses that he worked with at the hospital, had a birthday party in the 70s, and they hired a clown.
00:32:22:05 - 00:32:26:20
Stacey/Dori
Guess who it was. You see Gene Casey? Yep.
00:32:26:20 - 00:32:31:15
Unknown
Oh. They.
00:32:31:15 - 00:32:58:17
Stacey/Dori
So my story has, some nuances of both of yours, and I'm not going to. It's honestly, my story could take hours to tell, but I'm going to consolidate my former college roommate. And this was, I would say, recent within the last like 12 years, I think 12, 15, ten years or something like that.
00:32:58:19 - 00:33:23:15
Stacey/Dori
She we reconnected through, you know, social media and we started hanging out. She's a ton of fun and like, great. You know, she was a fun actress. She was we we both shared a lot of commonality, same personality. And I was freelancing at the time like I am now. But I was struggling back then. And I'm a freelance recruiter struggling more back then.
00:33:23:15 - 00:33:39:04
Stacey/Dori
And she mentioned that she has this company and it's, I'm going to say the name of it, and I don't know if you can Google it anymore, but it was called The Profits Group.
00:33:42:23 - 00:34:10:06
Stacey/Dori
And essentially there's a bunch of people that do services for one another and you can write off your taxes because of this. So you essentially use your credit cards to give money back and forth to the other members.
00:34:10:08 - 00:34:38:12
Stacey/Dori
Now, Stacy and Doctor John are like what they ask, but you both have like, you know, John, yours was truly taken advantage of. And and identity theft. Stacy, you were more on my level of, oh, maybe I should. And at the time I'm like, listen, I trust this person. We live together. She was my college roommate. How would she ever fuck me over?
00:34:38:14 - 00:34:54:03
Stacey/Dori
I at the beginning, I just thought this is going to be great. She told me she works with tax attorneys and CPAs and who am I to question that? I was like, great. But like I had
00:34:54:03 - 00:35:04:01
Stacey/Dori
mentioned to Stacy, like initially you you for these MLMs, you purchase products upfront, you invest upfront.
00:35:04:03 - 00:35:32:18
Stacey/Dori
This was the same thing. And she explained it to me right from the get go. She charges, I don't know how much, maybe like, 10 to $15,000 on your credit cards. So that is what you are in the hole for at just the very beginning and for almost a year I was getting I. I've always been one to pay off my credit cards.
00:35:32:22 - 00:36:12:15
Stacey/Dori
I was getting the money back to pay off the credit cards. And then after that year or after 11 months, the money stopped coming regularly, where I had to beg and scream, what is going on? This is a scam. Now, during this time, if you Google her, she did have lawsuits against her in another state, but I was like, oh well, let me ask her about it.
00:36:12:17 - 00:36:25:08
Stacey/Dori
And she had perfect answers for it. Again, making me feel bad for even one class and very classic, classic manipulation. That is classic, right?
00:36:25:08 - 00:36:28:05
Stacey/Dori
so mind you,
00:36:28:05 - 00:36:39:01
Stacey/Dori
after the first year, I'm like, I need to get out of this. However, at that time I was down like almost $40,000 on a credit card.
00:36:39:01 - 00:36:41:04
Stacey/Dori
Yes, on credit card charges.
00:36:41:08 - 00:37:08:05
Dr John Mayer
And everybody remember the day you know, this this is not contemporary money. And the other thing, speaking of that, I wanted to, mention is that we all are a little more savvy now about credit card, scams and things like. But in that day, I'm sure, Dorian, you know, you'll agree that, you know, we didn't hear about people using and abusing credit cards from each other or to hacking into, etc. I don't think.
00:37:08:05 - 00:37:08:22
Dr John Mayer
Correct.
00:37:08:24 - 00:37:22:24
Stacey/Dori
Well, she told me this is a essentially with tech because then there were taxes involved as well. So she had told me that this was a loophole that the government,
00:37:22:24 - 00:37:33:21
Stacey/Dori
not allows, but it's a loophole that they don't go after. So because she's working with these CPAs and tax attorneys, this is totally above level.
00:37:33:23 - 00:38:05:24
Stacey/Dori
So my taxes were impacted by this as well, because I was paying all this money on credit cards to pay them off every month, because I didn't want to go into credit card debt. So again, there are a lot of different nuances about this. One was after about a year and a half or so where I was furious about everything, I'm like, okay, I'm going to pay all this off, and I don't know how it happened.
00:38:05:24 - 00:38:35:04
Stacey/Dori
But I said to her, if I pay this all off, will we be able to get on track moving forward? Me again thinking she was on the up and up and it just got bad that way, so I did. I don't think it was that much. I think I paid like maybe like 18,000 or something. I mean, a lot of money, a lot of money that I did not have, but I paid that, but still was in it.
00:38:35:06 - 00:39:02:15
Stacey/Dori
So I think like almost three years. But during that time, towards the last like two years, I was fighting with her. John, I hated this person so much. Long story short, Covid happened. So what? This wasn't that long ago. This. Right. So so the start of Covid happened. She was nowhere to be found. She never followed up anymore.
00:39:02:16 - 00:39:29:20
Stacey/Dori
There was also an issue with the, we would, you know, send money back and forth with these other people that I have never met in my life. And so she had all these people in this group. And then, the processing way that we used to transfer money that ended it was through a bank, and they were like, no go, because they probably were like, this is a scam.
00:39:29:20 - 00:39:30:15
Stacey/Dori
What? Right.
00:39:30:17 - 00:39:37:08
Dr John Mayer
They're probably under, you know, some kind of, you know, legal, yeah. Need themselves and.
00:39:37:13 - 00:39:46:13
Stacey/Dori
Yeah. So then Covid hit. She rarely even speaks to me at that point. But then
00:39:46:13 - 00:40:01:10
Stacey/Dori
other quote unquote members from this group reached out to me. I was reached out by this woman, and we all got together. And this is this is kind of a knock on our legal system. So we all got together. But none of us had any money.
00:40:01:12 - 00:40:31:19
Stacey/Dori
There was one woman who was going through cancer treatment. She was out like $180,000. I was the only one of this group that had paid up, that had kept up with my credit card payments, so I was not in credit card debt. However, I used any savings that I had to pay all of this off. So we all had no money, but we got an attorney
00:40:31:19 - 00:40:48:11
Stacey/Dori
who said we won't be able to go to court for you because it would cost you all too much money, but we'll put it together for you, for the attorney general and or the district attorney or the State's Attorney's office.
00:40:48:11 - 00:41:12:11
Stacey/Dori
It could it happen not only in Illinois, but it also happened in New York. There were people from New York. There are people from California. Yeah. And long story short, to this day, nothing has happened to her. She is walking around free. I had asked you, John, do you keep, you know, like, do you keep tabs? I had to let go.
00:41:12:11 - 00:41:37:11
Stacey/Dori
Let God as well. As soon as I did that and said, because I was furious, I don't blame you. That's all your money. And you're like an artist. You're an actor? Yeah. And I had no money. I was crying, God, time I was. I tore up this day. I told my sister, but I've never told my parents about it because I'm too embarrassed about it, however, harassing isn't it?
00:41:37:11 - 00:42:05:12
Stacey/Dori
However, I came out on the other end of that. But even, within a month ago, one of the guys from the group contacted me because he had to go to court multiple times because these credit card companies were going after to get their money. And we had a we had a letter from the attorney's office and from the state's attorneys like we are, and it's being investigated.
00:42:05:15 - 00:42:13:03
Stacey/Dori
But this was now years ago. Yeah. So the credit card companies do not care. I want to know that you're out of all that money. Yeah.
00:42:13:05 - 00:42:19:05
Dr John Mayer
I want to make a couple of comments, especially. I think it's valuable for our audience to, to hear,
00:42:19:05 - 00:42:28:04
Dr John Mayer
that should fall under what they call a Rico case. You know, any time you have fraud that crosses state line, that's that's you'll hear it on a television shows.
00:42:28:04 - 00:42:51:18
Dr John Mayer
I watch a Rico case. That's what a Rico case is about. Second of all is this whole idea of lawsuit, lawsuit, lawsuit. You see it all over the media, you know. Well, I'm going to sue. I'm going to sue. What you will find every one is that it's not so simple as that. It costs money. That's one thing, you know, to file any kind of a suit costs money.
00:42:51:20 - 00:43:14:15
Dr John Mayer
Attorneys want retainers, and it's often quite large. So it's not as easy as, you know, just throwing all the popcorn around and, oh, I'm going to sue this. I'm going to do that. So your ability to take action is really limited. And then finally about that is that, the I heard in my case, for example.
00:43:14:20 - 00:43:36:15
Dr John Mayer
Well, okay, now let's go after him to recoup some of the money and the attorney that I had and I got a couple of second opinions on this, said, yeah, but what are we going to get? He doesn't have anything. You know, you can sue all you want and you can spend tens of thousands of dollars on a lawsuit and years in, in court.
00:43:36:17 - 00:43:59:09
Dr John Mayer
And at the end of the day, he's almost Teflon because he has no money or no assets in his own name. So I want to make a point that everyone that's listening is that be careful about, you know, threatening or thinking about, oh, my solution is a lawsuit. Because, as Doris said, you know, that's a little bit of an indictment of against a legal system.
00:43:59:11 - 00:44:01:17
Dr John Mayer
You know, it's often a dead end.
00:44:01:19 - 00:44:24:05
Stacey/Dori
Yeah. I think, I think that that's absolutely right. And I never was under the guise that we would ever see another dollar from her. My thinking was lock her up, like, throw her away. And no, she's walking free. And I don't I don't want the moral of the story to be like, yeah, go scam people. You're going to totally get off scot free.
00:44:24:07 - 00:44:51:19
Stacey/Dori
But I did, I did a lot of the research. I did like how you said Doctor John, you got like, a private investigator. I was kind of the investigator of the group. I spoke with her ex-boyfriend. I spoke with other people from years prior that she had done the exact same thing to. They all went bankrupt, like there were a lot of bankruptcies that this happened with.
00:44:51:21 - 00:45:17:17
Stacey/Dori
And I just mentioned this, because she is walking Scot free and we all have so much anger against her. But I did let it go. I'm not going after her, but I'm not going to lie, every once in a while I do googled her name just to see what's going on because I have that fascination. Finding out.
00:45:17:17 - 00:45:33:22
Stacey/Dori
And I'm also not going to lie, I do wish her, you know, ill will like to because she is continuing to screw people over again, not only just financially, but also tax wise too. Like, she's just a huge scam artist.
00:45:33:22 - 00:45:39:12
Stacey/Dori
Can I say one other thing that I was that I wanted to, follow up with multi-level marketing is
00:45:39:12 - 00:45:40:10
Stacey/Dori
00:45:40:10 - 00:45:57:11
Stacey/Dori
Dory's story is very similar to there's a there's a grift and I can't remember the name of it. It's about selling a course to somebody who sells the course to somebody who sells the course to somebody. The course is about how to sell a course. Yeah. I mean, it's the most ridiculous thing ever.
00:45:57:17 - 00:46:21:18
Dr John Mayer
I want to pop in with a couple of hopefully amusing quips. Someone wanted to say to you, Dory, thank God you're still following up because you know, that's the same audience that's brought to our podcast. People that are absolutely fascinated by the craziness and and ill will of these stories that we're going to present, you know, and so, I can certainly understand you wondering what's going on.
00:46:21:20 - 00:46:31:05
Dr John Mayer
the other thing and Jeremy might take this out, but I just wanted to say what would be, hard candy podcast without an appearance by the the Penis dog, you know, which is.
00:46:31:05 - 00:46:54:19
Stacey/Dori
Do not delete that. I first of all, this dog is so cute, and he's just so in love with you. What is his name again? Or is it just up for adoption through MCP Dot or what's his name? Josh. His name is Bosch. He's under 30 pounds and his penis doesn't work. People. His penis does not retract. He's had multiple surgeries, but he keeps jumping up on top of me.
00:46:54:19 - 00:46:57:01
Dr John Mayer
That's why we call him the is adorable.
00:46:57:03 - 00:46:59:21
Stacey/Dori
He's adorable. And I hope he gets adopted because
00:46:59:21 - 00:47:05:03
Stacey/Dori
dogs deserve a good life. Even dogs with bad penises. Yes.
00:47:05:05 - 00:47:10:04
Unknown
Oh. They.
00:47:10:04 - 00:47:36:19
Stacey/Dori
I'm glad that we all divulged our stories because I think I think that I know myself, I am always embarrassed by things or thinking, oh my gosh, I'm so stupid. But hearing other people who are decent people hearing their stories, it always helps me. So I'm hoping that it'll help other people as well know that it can happen to anybody.
00:47:36:20 - 00:47:56:00
Stacey/Dori
You're not stupid. You shouldn't be embarrassed. And if you question it, if you question it, you're not a hater. You're just questioning. Yeah, I was just going to say, but also too, if it's too good to be true, it's usually too good to be true. And that's exactly what I think is what we can all get out of this as well.
00:47:56:03 - 00:48:13:21
Dr John Mayer
And this is our story. You know, one of the reasons we thought of doing, this particular episode is to let everyone know who we are. We're not we're not talking from the Mount on our our episodes. We're we're people just like you are that have been involved in these things. I do have one question
00:48:13:21 - 00:48:16:05
Dr John Mayer
do you think for both of you
00:48:16:05 - 00:48:23:12
Dr John Mayer
that, this is one of the reasons why you wanted to do this podcast so much is because of these personal incidents that.
00:48:23:12 - 00:48:24:12
Dr John Mayer
Yeah.
00:48:24:14 - 00:48:51:08
Stacey/Dori
I know when Stacey asked me about this, I instantly thought of this. Okay? My I instantly thought I sensed it, I sensed it, and I didn't know, instantly thought of my experience and also what is happening to our country right now. The grift that is, you know, going on in our country, my own personal experience. So, yes, that is absolutely.
00:48:51:08 - 00:49:13:19
Stacey/Dori
How about you? That's a great question. Yeah, it is a good question. And I'll answer it like this. I, I don't think it was because of my experience. I think it's because I feel like an advocate for these kinds of people who are manipulated and controlled and gaslit. There's something that I relate to. It's almost like a feeling of a past life, but not really.
00:49:14:00 - 00:49:20:01
Stacey/Dori
So I just feel very compelled to talk about this shit. I don't like scamming. I don't like people who scam.
00:49:20:05 - 00:49:33:22
Stacey/Dori
And I think that's where this came from. And I just love hearing about it and talking about it. Yeah. Don't ask me what the psychology is behind that, but we can ask Doctor John. But there's something about it that just makes me excited.
00:49:34:00 - 00:49:44:15
Dr John Mayer
And look at two very different stories of what brings you to be hosts on this, podcast. So it's. Yeah, it's really cool. This is a great. Yeah. We
00:49:44:18 - 00:49:55:10
Dr John Mayer
We're going to move on and everyone we're going to have more and more episodes to come. We really are passionate about what we're doing. We're not going any place. So. So keep listening.
00:49:55:10 - 00:50:10:11
Dr John Mayer
And spread the word to your relatives and friends to listen as well. Our original theme music is written and performed by Midnight Current. You can hear more of their great music on their SoundCloud account. There's also a link to their SoundCloud account on our website.
00:50:10:15 - 00:50:15:16
Dr John Mayer
Hard Candy podcast.com, and don't forget to visit our website,
00:50:15:16 - 00:50:34:19
Dr John Mayer
to learn more about us and listen to all of our episodes. You can also listen to all of our episodes on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, YouTube, or wherever you get your podcasts. And speaking of episodes, wait to hear our next podcast episode. It's captivating. It's a doozy.
00:50:34:21 - 00:50:36:10
Dr John Mayer
See you then.
00:50:36:10 - 00:50:39:09
Stacey
Candy.
00:50:39:11 - 00:50:48:24
Unknown
I.
00:50:49:01 - 00:51:02:14
Unknown
Wish.
00:52:27:21 - 00:52:31:02
Stacey
Candy.