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Welcome to another SLAE episode. These episodes were recorded at The Salt Lake Animation Expo in March of 2024. We interviewed Expo Speakers and others who were involved with the expo. A special thanks to Jordyn Curly for allowing us to do this.
In this episode, Kathryn and Will welcome Lindsay Knowler at Eat Your Peas, a collaborative effort among passionate artists aimed at mentoring and giving back to the community. Lindsay shares her journey from working as an animator to becoming a Senior Trainer at Toon Boom and eventually starting her own initiative.
In this episode, Kathryn and Will welcome Lindsay Knowler at Eat Your Peas, a collaborative effort among passionate artists aimed at mentoring and giving back to the community. Lindsay shares her journey from working as an animator to becoming a Senior Trainer at Toon Boom and eventually starting her own initiative.
She highlights the challenges and intricacies of Rigging in animation and the lack of standardized practices across different studios and regions. Lindsay emphasizes the need for clear standards and efficient pipelines to help both small studios and emerging artists. The conversation also touches on the impact of style on animation workflows and the importance of good leadership in creative environments.
Learn more about Eat Your Peas here:
https://www.lindsayknowler.ca/eat-your-peas-home
Learn more about Eat Your Peas here:
https://www.lindsayknowler.ca/eat-your-peas-home
Creators & Guests
What is Behind The Pixel: Closing The Animation Communication Gap?
This podcast helps bridge the knowledge gaps between marketing and creative teams. Episodes explore how to communicate creatively, production hacks that save time, and unique solutions to ongoing creative problems.
Open Pixel Studios is a women-owned (WBENC) certified animation studio in Massachusetts that creates custom animated marketing content.
Hosts Will Colón and Kathryn Taccone are co-founders of Open Pixel Studios with years of industry experience in sales, marketing, animation, design, and education.
Submit a question to the pod! -> openpixelstudios.com/podquestion
00;00;16;01 - 00;00;18;06
Hi. Hello. Hi.
00;00;18;06 - 00;00;19;12
It's so nice to meet you.
00;00;19;12 - 00;00;20;12
Great to meet you.
00;00;20;12 - 00;00;22;12
Really nice to meet you, too.
00;00;22;12 - 00;00;23;22
First time on the podcast.
00;00;23;22 - 00;00;26;13
First time on any podcast.
Is that right? Yeah.
00;00;26;13 - 00;00;28;17
That's awesome.
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So honored. Yeah.
00;00;30;09 - 00;00;32;20
It's really. Exciting. Yeah, We were also.
00;00;32;20 - 00;00;36;05
So maybe tell us a little bit about why
you're at the Expo where you do it.
00;00;36;05 - 00;00;37;13
That's a good question.
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Well, I guess I'm promoting Eat Your Peas,
00;00;40;05 - 00;00;43;05
which is a project
that I started over the pandemic,
00;00;43;07 - 00;00;48;05
and it's really a group of really
passionate artists who are trying to
00;00;48;07 - 00;00;50;07
I don't want to say
like specifically mentor students,
00;00;50;07 - 00;00;51;26
but give back to the community. Yeah.
00;00;51;26 - 00;00;56;26
And so we're looking for ways to interact
with more people on a regular basis.
00;00;56;29 - 00;01;00;26
Utah was introduced to me
by a good friend, Mike Morris,
00;01;00;29 - 00;01;02;03
who's there's two of them here.
00;01;02;03 - 00;01;05;18
So one of which Mike which was Yeah, yeah.
00;01;05;24 - 00;01;08;15
This girl using me to every we just.
00;01;08;15 - 00;01;11;25
Met with what he describes himself
as the pleasant ginger.
00;01;11;29 - 00;01;14;28
Yes, I met the other,
I mean the other one.
00;01;15;04 - 00;01;15;18
Yeah.
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So I know the other one.
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Looking for a certain boom.
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I met another who's also pleasant.
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He's just not a ginger.
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And so.
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Yeah,
he introduced me to the people at Utah
00;01;28;12 - 00;01;30;25
and he told me about this
festival last year.
00;01;30;25 - 00;01;33;23
And so I was really like,
Oh, that would be a lot of fun.
00;01;33;23 - 00;01;36;10
I love festivals.
Like a Who doesn't love a festival. Yeah.
00;01;36;10 - 00;01;40;21
And so the opportunity to come to Utah,
which I'm a huge rock nerd too,
00;01;40;21 - 00;01;45;02
so I got to drive from Canada
all the way. Oh.
00;01;45;04 - 00;01;46;25
Oh, awesome. And it's it's.
00;01;46;25 - 00;01;48;06
I was we'll have to have some.
00;01;48;06 - 00;01;50;15
Conversation about, like, the U.S.
00;01;50;15 - 00;01;51;22
industry versus the Canadian.
00;01;51;22 - 00;01;53;18
It's it is. Actually really wild.
00;01;53;18 - 00;01;55;22
I mean. You've been driving
from Massachusetts.
00;01;55;22 - 00;01;58;01
Oh, nice. Are we? It's almost the same.
00;01;58;01 - 00;01;59;26
Almost on the same thing.
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Yeah. Utah was right in the center.
00;02;02;03 - 00;02;05;21
I was planning a road trip
to Vancouver, B.C., because in the process
00;02;05;21 - 00;02;08;29
of moving back to Vancouver, B.C.,
to be around all my friends
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and all the like, the industry.
Yeah, back in the industry. Well, we're.
00;02;11;15 - 00;02;13;18
Planning to visit Vancouver, so.
So you see that?
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Yeah, well.
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That's also due to my favorite places.
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Oh. Okay.
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Do you prefer a double double or a triple
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triple? Oh, that's important. Yeah.
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Oh I don't,
I don't go for that much sugar.
00;02;25;12 - 00;02;28;21
So very honestly,
that's just the right answer.
00;02;28;23 - 00;02;29;24
But it's close to it.
00;02;29;24 - 00;02;32;22
Sometimes I'll get double, double
and that's like a hot chocolate to me.
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Yeah, I know. Exactly.
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Yeah.
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Yeah.
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So Utah was on the map,
and I want to talk to Jordan.
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It was all about independent innovation.
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And I was like, Yeah, okay, this is great.
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Let's, let's, let's do this.
00;02;43;22 - 00;02;48;20
And yeah, so we, we, it's a bit
of a detour, but it's definitely worth it.
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I even got to stop off at Mount Rushmore.
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Oh, that's my dog.
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So that's our first pictures.
Yeah, it was.
00;02;54;05 - 00;02;56;00
Was that your. Dog
that we heard? A little.
00;02;56;00 - 00;02;58;09
No, she's at. A little.
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Spa. A spa weekend.
00;02;59;20 - 00;03;02;06
Ooh, there is a
there is a puppy somewhere.
00;03;02;06 - 00;03;03;28
There's I and I want a pet.
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Yeah, yeah, there's a puppy. Yeah.
00;03;06;18 - 00;03;09;23
So tell us a little bit for,
for our audience who might not know you
00;03;09;23 - 00;03;11;19
a little bit about who you are,
what you do,
00;03;11;19 - 00;03;14;18
and a little bit
more about your piece too. Oh, sure. Yeah.
00;03;14;18 - 00;03;18;03
So I, I've been in the animation
industry for about, I don't know,
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I guess about 12 years
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and I just kind of made my way
through the system just started.
00;03;23;09 - 00;03;25;19
I was an animator,
didn't do quite that well.
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So they started putting me around
in different spots to find,
00;03;27;25 - 00;03;29;23
you know, your, your footing. Yeah.
00;03;29;23 - 00;03;34;20
And I made my way into rigging tin boom
rigging really just clicked for me.
00;03;34;20 - 00;03;38;22
And I just
I fell in love with my job, and I did
00;03;38;25 - 00;03;42;21
pretty well
climb the ladder until I hit that ceiling.
00;03;42;23 - 00;03;45;08
And that's when I started to.
00;03;45;08 - 00;03;47;01
I worked all around Vancouver,
but then that's
00;03;47;01 - 00;03;49;14
when I started to realize, like,
I kind of was looking for something else.
00;03;49;14 - 00;03;51;20
Like,
I have this itch to grow all the time.
00;03;51;20 - 00;03;52;22
Yeah. Yeah.
00;03;52;22 - 00;03;54;07
I think that's common in artists.
00;03;54;07 - 00;03;58;08
And yeah, when I didn't know
what I could do in the animation industry,
00;03;58;08 - 00;04;00;02
I started working for Toon Boom
00;04;00;02 - 00;04;03;15
and with them it was really cool
because I became one of their trainers,
00;04;03;15 - 00;04;04;11
their senior trainers,
00;04;04;11 - 00;04;08;23
and I got to travel the world
and teach animation studios everywhere
00;04;08;23 - 00;04;13;19
how to use their software,
how to rig, how to animate
00;04;13;21 - 00;04;16;06
and how to, you know, how
to use those tools very effectively.
00;04;16;06 - 00;04;19;01
And that's like my favorite thing
is like being really efficient
00;04;19;01 - 00;04;23;10
with animation tools
and making everyone's lives really easy.
00;04;23;12 - 00;04;25;23
Hard. Beautiful thing.
00;04;25;26 - 00;04;26;08
Yeah.
00;04;26;08 - 00;04;27;12
So needed and.
00;04;27;12 - 00;04;31;14
Reading is like the probably
the most technical part that is
00;04;31;16 - 00;04;33;12
that affects the creative so much.
00;04;33;12 - 00;04;34;06
Yeah, it really does.
00;04;34;06 - 00;04;36;16
It's a it's
a really crucial point of the pipeline.
00;04;36;16 - 00;04;38;24
And when I started the
in the animation industry,
00;04;38;24 - 00;04;40;26
nobody really knew what writing was,
including me.
00;04;40;26 - 00;04;43;26
Like I, we all kind of like
were really falling into it.
00;04;43;26 - 00;04;44;28
And it's really
00;04;44;28 - 00;04;49;10
what's interesting about it
is it's unique to every part of the world.
00;04;49;12 - 00;04;52;12
So like everybody kind of rigs differently
and it's all about who
00;04;52;12 - 00;04;55;12
you know,
who taught you what they knew at the time.
00;04;55;14 - 00;04;56;11
It's probably been like
00;04;56;11 - 00;05;00;05
the most interesting thing
for me to recognize and learn more about,
00;05;00;08 - 00;05;02;16
um, about
how everybody else uses the program
00;05;02;16 - 00;05;07;01
and then how can you, like, manipulate
that knowledge into like a better system.
00;05;07;08 - 00;05;07;21
That we were at
00;05;07;21 - 00;05;08;07
because we were just
00;05;08;07 - 00;05;11;15
talking about this, about like,
there's no like one standard for.
00;05;11;15 - 00;05;13;13
You to do. Yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly.
Yeah, yeah.
00;05;13;13 - 00;05;15;08
And if I can, if I can like
00;05;15;08 - 00;05;18;11
if I could wish for anything
I want that's so bad for people.
00;05;18;14 - 00;05;20;00
Same because I think that.
00;05;20;00 - 00;05;22;15
That's,
I think that holds small studios back.
00;05;22;15 - 00;05;23;03
Yeah.
00;05;23;03 - 00;05;24;22
They spend a lot of money
trying to figure out
00;05;24;22 - 00;05;26;15
all these little tiny details
within the bigger
00;05;26;15 - 00;05;28;13
studios have really figured out. Right.
00;05;28;13 - 00;05;31;08
And so there's I don't think
it's proprietary information to build
00;05;31;08 - 00;05;34;27
certain cartoons
the way that they look into the cartoons.
00;05;34;27 - 00;05;35;22
Yes. Yeah.
00;05;35;22 - 00;05;38;02
But like there's a standard of cartoon.
00;05;38;02 - 00;05;41;01
I don't think that should be like there
should be no innovative innovation there.
00;05;41;01 - 00;05;44;00
That should be like a standard practice
with, like universal models.
00;05;44;00 - 00;05;46;19
And, you know,
how does everybody save time?
00;05;46;19 - 00;05;48;22
Yeah,
make the animation. We're right. On board.
00;05;48;22 - 00;05;49;09
Yeah. Yeah.
00;05;49;09 - 00;05;50;17
And the thing that bothers me is
00;05;50;17 - 00;05;52;19
that there are some standards
that we're okay with.
00;05;52;19 - 00;05;55;19
So, for example, everyone's okay
with like the 12 principles because
00;05;55;19 - 00;05;58;23
obviously that's good motion,
but everyone's also okay
00;05;58;23 - 00;06;02;17
with, well, you need a shoulder point,
you need an elbow.
00;06;02;19 - 00;06;02;29
Yeah.
00;06;02;29 - 00;06;06;20
And like we need defamation
in some capacity,
00;06;06;25 - 00;06;09;21
but like then there's like
just another layer
00;06;09;21 - 00;06;11;16
of like a bunch of other things
you can put on there.
00;06;11;16 - 00;06;15;14
And then that just turns into like
someone's like, like crazy hair, right?
00;06;15;20 - 00;06;17;03
Like everyone has a scalp.
00;06;17;03 - 00;06;20;09
Yeah, hair is always
hair is always like the fun part.
00;06;20;09 - 00;06;21;19
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
00;06;21;19 - 00;06;22;25
It's, it's fun and wild.
00;06;22;25 - 00;06;24;09
So is that what your piece is about?
00;06;24;09 - 00;06;27;02
Are we are we talking about, like,
trying to teach folks
00;06;27;02 - 00;06;29;10
a standard way of doing something
or is it something to.
00;06;29;10 - 00;06;30;13
It's a good. Question.
00;06;30;13 - 00;06;34;04
I think that this is going to be a vessel
to find a standard.
00;06;34;07 - 00;06;35;26
I think working with the mentors, that's
00;06;35;26 - 00;06;37;05
the one of the things that I can hook them
with.
00;06;37;05 - 00;06;40;05
They're like, How do you want to see
the animation industry evolve?
00;06;40;06 - 00;06;41;08
Right?
00;06;41;08 - 00;06;44;29
And so one of the key things that we do
want to see is like working
00;06;44;29 - 00;06;46;05
with designers.
00;06;46;05 - 00;06;49;10
Designers really want to know
how their designs affect technology,
00;06;49;13 - 00;06;51;00
but there's no courses for that.
00;06;51;00 - 00;06;51;26
There's not a lot of courses.
00;06;51;26 - 00;06;53;12
Like I think it's just kind of starting
to come out.
00;06;53;12 - 00;06;55;17
People
there's some riggers that know enough
00;06;55;17 - 00;06;58;24
that they'll talk to designers
and that they'll have those conversations.
00;06;58;27 - 00;07;02;13
But I think what we are
trying to do is create like real courses
00;07;02;13 - 00;07;04;13
for like real designers
00;07;04;13 - 00;07;07;24
so that they can actually,
like really learn how like a mouth design
00;07;07;27 - 00;07;10;19
affects how long it takes
to rig that mouth design.
00;07;10;19 - 00;07;12;26
And also we can put price tags on that.
00;07;12;26 - 00;07;16;04
So I was, I wanted to get yeah, yeah.
00;07;16;04 - 00;07;19;08
You know passionate about producing
a producer will be able to say.
00;07;19;08 - 00;07;20;28
Yes or no if almost most cost
00;07;20;28 - 00;07;24;07
you know this mouth is going to cost
$2,000 versus $50.
00;07;24;14 - 00;07;26;11
That's a decision. That right is.
00;07;26;11 - 00;07;27;15
Easy to answer sometimes.
00;07;27;15 - 00;07;31;08
Well, some of our audience some of our
audience are marketing professionals.
00;07;31;08 - 00;07;34;09
They're nonprofit
directors, creative directors, folks
00;07;34;09 - 00;07;36;13
who are trying to get this type of work
done.
00;07;36;13 - 00;07;38;26
And a lot of the times
they don't understand
00;07;38;26 - 00;07;40;27
where the price tag comes from, right?
00;07;40;27 - 00;07;46;14
And so I think you hit on just the
right thing, which is sometimes the reason
00;07;46;14 - 00;07;50;15
why we can't necessarily place a price tag
is because there's no standard.
00;07;50;16 - 00;07;53;11
Yeah, because if I did it one way,
it would be $2,000.
00;07;53;11 - 00;07;55;03
And if I did another 50 bucks and.
00;07;55;03 - 00;07;57;02
You don't know until you get in there.
Yeah, yeah.
00;07;57;02 - 00;07;58;24
Yeah, yeah.
So it's kind of a tricky thing.
00;07;58;24 - 00;08;01;17
So do you have any, like, advice
for clients to at least
00;08;01;17 - 00;08;04;04
what should they keep in mind
as they think about these?
00;08;04;04 - 00;08;06;27
Well, details. Every line is a dollar.
00;08;06;27 - 00;08;09;27
The people that I work with,
we just love having these conversations.
00;08;09;27 - 00;08;12;10
So we are we are.
00;08;12;10 - 00;08;15;27
We are determined
to, like, figure out a way to put out
00;08;16;00 - 00;08;19;22
put out information to like really help
people, like make those decisions,
00;08;19;25 - 00;08;23;09
especially when things are
if they look like The Simpsons,
00;08;23;09 - 00;08;24;17
you know, like it's the very stand.
00;08;24;17 - 00;08;27;00
It doesn't matter what color it is,
but there's a line.
00;08;27;00 - 00;08;28;14
There's a there's a there's a body.
00;08;28;14 - 00;08;30;07
It's a human BoJack horseman.
00;08;30;07 - 00;08;35;22
It's a horse horse head would be a little
bit more details to to to put together.
00;08;35;22 - 00;08;39;01
But like you know the rest of the body is
that to me is very standard
00;08;39;04 - 00;08;41;25
so there really doesn't
have to be any innovation there.
00;08;41;25 - 00;08;42;11
Yeah.
00;08;42;11 - 00;08;45;12
So on the side of kind of this
standardizing, can,
00;08;45;12 - 00;08;49;10
can you describe to us in your own words
how you would define a pipeline?
00;08;49;12 - 00;08;53;19
Because we've defined it one way,
but like I said, yeah.
00;08;53;22 - 00;08;54;16
Yeah.
00;08;54;16 - 00;08;59;03
It's, I think pipeline is really just
where people and technology come together.
00;08;59;05 - 00;09;01;11
And so I've always been I've been good
00;09;01;11 - 00;09;04;11
with the technology, but I've always been
a little bit better with the people.
00;09;04;18 - 00;09;08;03
And so and because I have like
I have a love for training,
00;09;08;03 - 00;09;12;09
so I really enjoy learning about what
people know and where their skills are at.
00;09;12;11 - 00;09;14;25
And then we can build
pipelines around them
00;09;14;25 - 00;09;18;05
to like help their workflow
and make them efficient.
00;09;18;07 - 00;09;21;19
But then what we can also do
is plan for their growth in the future
00;09;21;24 - 00;09;24;11
so you can evolve your pipeline over time.
00;09;24;11 - 00;09;24;20
Right?
00;09;24;20 - 00;09;28;05
I think one of the worst things
that I've I've done this in the past,
00;09;28;07 - 00;09;30;27
which is why I know, is
you can go into a pipeline,
00;09;30;27 - 00;09;34;24
you can change too much at once
and it's too impactful for people.
00;09;34;24 - 00;09;36;12
And I think that really makes people
nervous.
00;09;36;12 - 00;09;36;26
But I'm
00;09;36;26 - 00;09;40;26
like, I'm also like ultra conscious of it
because I've made that mistake and it was
00;09;40;29 - 00;09;44;13
it was too much and it was on my team
and it was like our animators
00;09;44;13 - 00;09;45;16
and my rigging team.
00;09;45;16 - 00;09;47;17
And it was, yeah, it was a lot.
00;09;47;17 - 00;09;50;13
And it was
it was a huge learning lesson. Yeah.
00;09;50;13 - 00;09;52;10
I have to say that, like,
00;09;52;10 - 00;09;55;00
you're the first person
I've ever met in this industry
00;09;55;00 - 00;09;57;23
that has talked about pipeline
from a people first mindset.
00;09;57;23 - 00;09;58;07
Yeah, Yeah.
00;09;58;07 - 00;10;00;26
And it is like so refreshing to hear.
00;10;00;26 - 00;10;03;18
I think that's
why it's scary to use that term, right?
00;10;03;18 - 00;10;06;17
Yeah, I mean, nobody knows what it is.
00;10;06;17 - 00;10;08;23
So I'm like, I'm afraid to use it,
00;10;08;23 - 00;10;11;07
but I'm pretty sure that's what it is.
00;10;11;07 - 00;10;11;16
Yeah.
00;10;11;16 - 00;10;15;12
I feel oftentimes that pipelines
get defined by the tools that we use.
00;10;15;12 - 00;10;17;17
Yeah. Which doesn't to me.
Does it make sense?
00;10;17;17 - 00;10;21;12
Because it doesn't necessarily matter
which tool you use to get that final
00;10;21;12 - 00;10;22;18
like type of thing.
00;10;22;18 - 00;10;25;17
So like if you're modeling,
you can model and blender, you can model
00;10;25;23 - 00;10;28;19
tools, you know, you can make assets
and different types of things.
00;10;28;19 - 00;10;30;15
And these days
I think those tools are starting
00;10;30;15 - 00;10;33;10
to come out with technology
that that, you know, like universal scene
00;10;33;10 - 00;10;36;18
descriptions
or like ways in which you can export
00;10;36;18 - 00;10;40;14
the fundamental elements
and then transfer between them.
00;10;40;14 - 00;10;43;27
So they're already thinking that it's
not really going to matter what to use.
00;10;43;27 - 00;10;47;29
You just like to use our tool because
we have better mechanisms to do it.
00;10;48;02 - 00;10;49;23
And so there's no question there.
00;10;49;23 - 00;10;54;06
I just think that that's one
version of here's how a pipeline works.
00;10;54;08 - 00;10;56;23
And I'm just so grateful to hear it
because it's yeah.
00;10;56;23 - 00;10;57;21
I think it was a
00;10;57;21 - 00;11;00;06
it was a really unique experience
working for Teen Boom
00;11;00;06 - 00;11;02;01
because that's really what I got to do.
00;11;02;01 - 00;11;05;06
They would fly me to a studio
and I would just be in the environment
00;11;05;06 - 00;11;08;17
and I'd be teaching the team
how to do things.
00;11;08;17 - 00;11;11;17
And I, you know, you recognize
as who's going to be the supervisor.
00;11;11;24 - 00;11;14;24
And then because I was supervisor,
I basically trained them
00;11;14;24 - 00;11;17;24
on like how to be a supervisor as well.
00;11;17;27 - 00;11;21;01
And then when you talk to production,
you say, okay, your team's here,
00;11;21;05 - 00;11;23;05
but in six months it could be here.
00;11;23;05 - 00;11;25;17
And in one year
you guys could be doing this.
00;11;25;17 - 00;11;29;08
However, you got to make sure
that you keep an eye on X, Y and Z.
00;11;29;08 - 00;11;31;00
So that you can get here, right?
00;11;31;00 - 00;11;33;16
And then it helps the studio grow as well.
00;11;33;16 - 00;11;37;01
So that that part was always really cool
to me, get that job.
00;11;37;01 - 00;11;40;03
And then when I left town, boom,
it was a bit I had to like figure out
00;11;40;03 - 00;11;43;03
how to keep doing that
because yeah, it was, it was a,
00;11;43;05 - 00;11;45;22
it was easier to do
when they were sending me.
00;11;45;22 - 00;11;48;22
Now I'm doing it for myself,
so it's a bit different.
00;11;48;22 - 00;11;50;10
I was going to ask about that transition.
00;11;50;10 - 00;11;53;07
So like you're acting boom for a while
and then transitioned.
00;11;53;07 - 00;11;55;13
Are you solely your PS now?
00;11;55;13 - 00;11;57;28
Like where,
where are you kind of that? I am.
00;11;57;28 - 00;12;02;12
I've just made the decision to double down
and keep going on is awesome.
00;12;02;15 - 00;12;05;11
So yeah, we're. Congratulations.
Thank you.
00;12;05;11 - 00;12;08;07
Yeah he's has been
I mean we're we're brand new.
00;12;08;07 - 00;12;09;16
We just started in January
00;12;09;16 - 00;12;13;02
so like really and again,
it's really about pipeline knowledge.
00;12;13;02 - 00;12;16;26
Like we've worked together as a team
for almost a decade
00;12;16;28 - 00;12;20;07
and we all go to different studios and I'm
the only one that works on it full time.
00;12;20;07 - 00;12;24;13
And then I have volunteers
and I have all my mentors are volunteering
00;12;24;13 - 00;12;26;15
for me right now.
They're all good friends.
00;12;26;15 - 00;12;29;19
Yeah, Yeah, they're, you know,
I make it very easy for them to like,
00;12;29;23 - 00;12;33;02
you know, this is only going to cost
you about 3 to 4 hours this month.
00;12;33;02 - 00;12;37;24
Then you can tell me exactly when you want
to put that in your schedule,
00;12;37;26 - 00;12;38;20
and that works.
00;12;38;20 - 00;12;42;07
And then we're hoping to get into
like next.
00;12;42;07 - 00;12;43;17
We're hoping to basically
00;12;43;17 - 00;12;47;24
look at the whole pipeline breakdown,
all the skills for all the jobs,
00;12;47;27 - 00;12;51;17
and then we're going to try to get into
a skill verification system
00;12;51;17 - 00;12;55;09
so that when people start to work with us,
they can say, okay, this is the job
00;12;55;09 - 00;12;56;08
I want to learn.
00;12;56;08 - 00;12;58;27
Then they can start
checking off those skills
00;12;58;27 - 00;13;01;16
and then we can start to verify people
and like really help them
00;13;01;16 - 00;13;05;18
grow and really get into the
and this is from a student level
00;13;05;20 - 00;13;09;18
to a I call them professionals where
people are like brand new in the industry.
00;13;09;18 - 00;13;10;01
So, sure,
00;13;10;01 - 00;13;12;18
they're still trying to figure out
how a pipeline works,
00;13;12;18 - 00;13;15;02
how that how the departments
like flow into each other.
00;13;15;02 - 00;13;15;13
Yeah.
00;13;15;13 - 00;13;18;25
So everything that we do revolves around
like departments
00;13;18;25 - 00;13;21;25
helping departments
not I'm learning storyboarding.
00;13;21;25 - 00;13;25;05
It's how to storyboarding impact
the other departments. Yes.
00;13;25;05 - 00;13;26;26
Thank you.
00;13;26;29 - 00;13;28;21
And that's all departments.
00;13;28;21 - 00;13;30;29
So everything has a cost.
So there's a lot of repetition.
00;13;30;29 - 00;13;32;09
People are really nervous about that.
00;13;32;09 - 00;13;34;15
But at the same time,
I think people need to hear
00;13;34;15 - 00;13;37;04
that repetition
because yeah, that's important.
00;13;37;04 - 00;13;38;06
Well, it's so true because.
00;13;38;06 - 00;13;38;21
Oh gosh.
00;13;38;21 - 00;13;41;06
So how does how does style impact this?
00;13;41;06 - 00;13;44;03
Because like, you know,
you think about workflows.
00;13;44;03 - 00;13;46;16
Yeah. Lines and we talked
about the standard and you get a break.
00;13;46;16 - 00;13;48;25
We're going to break that stand.
We're about. I'm about to break it.
00;13;48;25 - 00;13;51;18
Yeah. So like,
if I'm. Doing something for clients about.
00;13;51;18 - 00;13;54;17
Yes, I'm doing a 3D thing
or if I'm doing a because I can I can
00;13;54;17 - 00;13;57;17
see it going beyond like
just like the two of them world.
00;13;57;18 - 00;14;01;11
I can see this idea applied to games
00;14;01;11 - 00;14;04;13
or, you know, feature films or whatever.
00;14;04;14 - 00;14;07;13
Like I think any part of the creative
industry can use something like,
00;14;07;13 - 00;14;08;10
Yeah, yes.
00;14;08;10 - 00;14;10;29
So no matter what size you're out
to, yeah, almost.
00;14;10;29 - 00;14;13;11
The smaller you are,
the more you need to consider.
00;14;13;11 - 00;14;14;03
Yeah.
00;14;14;03 - 00;14;15;01
Yeah. Exactly.
00;14;15;01 - 00;14;15;11
Yeah.
00;14;15;11 - 00;14;16;07
And so,
00;14;16;07 - 00;14;20;06
so that's one question is like are you
I guess are you going to think about that.
00;14;20;10 - 00;14;22;26
Yeah. Yeah, of course. Of course
I, I have thought about that.
00;14;22;26 - 00;14;24;14
It's definitely, it's,
00;14;24;14 - 00;14;27;19
that was the first question
when I was running this idea by some like
00;14;27;22 - 00;14;31;04
some CEOs in Vancouver, just to be like,
like, what do you think of this?
00;14;31;04 - 00;14;33;19
Like, I'm about to, like, really.
Go for it. Yeah.
00;14;33;19 - 00;14;37;02
And these were my bosses at the time, so
I really respect them and their opinions.
00;14;37;02 - 00;14;38;26
And that was the first question
they asked were like,
00;14;38;26 - 00;14;39;26
Are you going be able to cross over?
00;14;39;26 - 00;14;41;26
And I was like,
I think I don't see why not.
00;14;41;26 - 00;14;43;29
But we got to focus on what we know first.
00;14;43;29 - 00;14;48;00
So to do is we don't think
too much further, but we do invite,
00;14;48;03 - 00;14;50;08
like a lot of students, 3D animators
00;14;50;08 - 00;14;53;23
who ask if they can get animation
reviews by our animators.
00;14;53;23 - 00;14;56;03
And we have like art.
00;14;56;03 - 00;14;59;16
The Vancouver industry in the Canadian
industry is so wildly talented.
00;14;59;16 - 00;15;01;12
Everyone is so multi-disciplined.
00;15;01;12 - 00;15;02;20
They're also super nice.
00;15;02;20 - 00;15;04;11
Yeah, everyone's way.
00;15;04;11 - 00;15;06;06
Nice every time we've been to like,
00;15;06;06 - 00;15;08;17
we've talked to our friends
up in Vancouver and it's just.
00;15;08;17 - 00;15;10;23
The stereotype is true.
00;15;10;25 - 00;15;11;03
Yeah.
00;15;11;03 - 00;15;12;00
So, so yeah.
00;15;12;00 - 00;15;16;08
So I, we can,
we can technically take 3D animators
00;15;16;08 - 00;15;19;24
that maybe not modelers right
now, but 3D animation
00;15;19;24 - 00;15;24;15
we can cover in kind of cover and we just,
we just ask like I've got 3DS
00;15;24;17 - 00;15;28;07
animation supervisors that are working on
shows up their main frame studios.
00;15;28;08 - 00;15;28;25
Oh yeah, yeah.
00;15;28;25 - 00;15;31;28
We just make sure that, you know, if,
if we've got 3D people,
00;15;31;28 - 00;15;34;01
we will tell them, okay,
wait for this person
00;15;34;01 - 00;15;36;18
because they'll be able to help you
and then you can write them that month
00;15;36;18 - 00;15;38;24
and you know,
you're not wasting time or money.
00;15;38;24 - 00;15;41;18
That makes. Sense.
Yeah. Yeah, that's really interesting.
00;15;41;18 - 00;15;44;22
So I guess, you know, I feel like
00;15;44;22 - 00;15;48;21
you've already touched on this
a little bit already, but why? PS
00;15;48;23 - 00;15;50;13
Why should it need them?
00;15;50;13 - 00;15;51;05
Yeah.
00;15;51;05 - 00;15;51;17
Yeah.
00;15;51;17 - 00;15;54;06
It's more the question,
what is this really struggle?
00;15;54;06 - 00;15;57;06
Because I don't know how far of an answer
I should go with this is go
00;15;57;06 - 00;16;00;08
as far as it's so. Much meaning to me.
00;16;00;13 - 00;16;04;17
These are the there's
so there's the three keys of happiness.
00;16;04;19 - 00;16;06;05
So tell us. Yes. As we.
00;16;06;05 - 00;16;07;21
Learn. This is my favorite.
00;16;07;21 - 00;16;09;10
My favorite thing is the blues.
00;16;09;10 - 00;16;11;12
Owns the blues.
I haven't heard of the blues.
00;16;11;12 - 00;16;14;07
No, it's people are they live to 100?
00;16;14;07 - 00;16;16;19
Naturally. Okay, so that's like the world.
00;16;16;19 - 00;16;17;24
Oh, yes, I have people.
00;16;17;24 - 00;16;20;06
There's a thing on Netflix about it. Yes.
Yeah.
00;16;20;06 - 00;16;20;28
So, Dan Buettner.
00;16;20;28 - 00;16;23;14
Yeah, I've been a huge fan
for like a long, long time.
00;16;23;14 - 00;16;26;17
And I've read his books and like,
I'm like a big nerd about it.
00;16;26;17 - 00;16;29;19
Like,
it goes back to, like, my love of rocks,
00;16;29;21 - 00;16;30;17
but excellent.
00;16;30;17 - 00;16;31;13
But yeah, so
00;16;31;13 - 00;16;35;19
the blue zones are the keys of happiness,
So that's purpose, pride and play.
00;16;35;20 - 00;16;38;13
It's pleasure,
but I like to play. Play like play too.
00;16;38;13 - 00;16;39;17
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
00;16;39;17 - 00;16;42;12
And so I basically wanted
00;16;42;12 - 00;16;45;21
to figure out a way to, to utilize that
00;16;45;24 - 00;16;49;00
those like those three words into, like,
what I wanted
00;16;49;00 - 00;16;53;02
to do for the rest of my life
because I wanted to like blue zones
00;16;53;04 - 00;16;55;26
to live to 100, yet to move naturally.
00;16;55;26 - 00;16;56;19
And I love that.
00;16;56;19 - 00;16;59;04
I like I want to move naturally
for the rest of my life.
00;16;59;04 - 00;17;00;25
I don't want to rush.
00;17;00;25 - 00;17;03;23
I mean, I have to rush sometimes,
you know, But I like, you know, there's
00;17;03;23 - 00;17;05;22
there's a way to about a rush.
00;17;05;22 - 00;17;07;16
Yeah, it's all about balance.
00;17;07;16 - 00;17;10;15
And so that's kind of like, like wipes.
00;17;10;15 - 00;17;13;28
But then also peas are disgusting.
00;17;14;00 - 00;17;16;17
And the things you don't want to like,
they're really the things you.
00;17;16;17 - 00;17;17;06
Don't want to do.
00;17;17;06 - 00;17;19;08
And so like,
I come across that as a trainer,
00;17;19;08 - 00;17;23;14
like some people just don't want to do
certain things as a learner, I should say.
00;17;23;14 - 00;17;28;00
And really when you're learning something,
you are like, like eating the keys
00;17;28;00 - 00;17;29;07
to your happiness.
00;17;29;07 - 00;17;32;06
And so that's why
our logo is a huge bowl of peas.
00;17;32;06 - 00;17;34;00
But it's like one pea at a time.
00;17;34;00 - 00;17;36;14
You can get through this whole bowl
and it's like a
00;17;36;14 - 00;17;38;09
like a little mountain of self-discipline.
00;17;38;09 - 00;17;39;22
Yeah, Yeah, that makes perfect sense.
00;17;39;22 - 00;17;42;14
It is like I find.
00;17;42;14 - 00;17;44;22
And there's so many fuels. Yeah. Yeah.
00;17;44;22 - 00;17;46;00
Well, it also feels like it's
00;17;46;00 - 00;17;49;02
one of those things that you feel like
it doesn't matter.
00;17;49;02 - 00;17;52;09
Like, you know, there's people at the top
maybe creators,
00;17;52;10 - 00;17;54;21
maybe like the folks
who are trying to get this done.
00;17;54;21 - 00;17;56;22
Did Who cares?
00;17;56;22 - 00;18;01;09
Like, there's just this like light
eeriness about, I don't want to do this.
00;18;01;12 - 00;18;03;01
And then they don't realize
00;18;03;01 - 00;18;06;09
that it affects
all of the things that you do care.
00;18;06;11 - 00;18;10;03
And it's also like we've talked about this
on the business side of like there's
00;18;10;03 - 00;18;13;28
so much development work that happens
that we would call thankless tasks.
00;18;14;01 - 00;18;14;21
Yeah, they're like
00;18;14;21 - 00;18;18;23
the things you build out on the back end
that like don't visibly make a change
00;18;18;23 - 00;18;21;00
all that much
but make a world of difference
00;18;21;00 - 00;18;23;15
in your communications
and your workflow and your pipeline.
00;18;23;15 - 00;18;24;00
Like.
00;18;24;00 - 00;18;29;06
And it's just, it's the stuff that needs
to be done, but no one's addressing it.
00;18;29;09 - 00;18;32;06
And it's like a big elephant in the room
that's like, We need to change this.
00;18;32;06 - 00;18;33;10
Yeah. Absolutely.
00;18;33;10 - 00;18;37;03
And like, like on that point
and maybe a little bit queasy, but like,
00;18;37;05 - 00;18;39;25
like not all supervisors
are the same, Right?
00;18;39;25 - 00;18;40;02
Right.
00;18;40;02 - 00;18;43;29
Not all supervisors
have the same training sometimes.
00;18;44;02 - 00;18;48;28
Like I've worked for supervisors
who've been fantastic and I really admire
00;18;48;28 - 00;18;51;12
having that that that guidance
00;18;51;12 - 00;18;54;24
if you if I can call it
that so early in my career, because I knew
00;18;54;27 - 00;18;57;01
this is good guidance,
this is good leadership,
00;18;57;01 - 00;19;00;17
and I've had supervisors
that have like totally isolated me
00;19;00;17 - 00;19;04;26
and especially in the work from home
atmosphere with ten years of experience,
00;19;04;26 - 00;19;08;04
I have felt like loneliness in my job.
00;19;08;04 - 00;19;10;22
And I mean, it's so much harder for me.
Yeah.
00;19;10;22 - 00;19;15;00
And so when I think about people
who are just entering the, the industry
00;19;15;04 - 00;19;18;04
and like when we used to go to work,
we'd look over everybody's shoulder
00;19;18;12 - 00;19;19;28
and we would see what they were doing.
00;19;19;28 - 00;19;23;20
And that was like part of the magic
of working in an animation studio, right?
00;19;23;24 - 00;19;25;28
You don't have that as much anymore. Yeah.
00;19;25;28 - 00;19;28;05
So if they can go to the studio,
they'll get it.
00;19;28;05 - 00;19;31;22
But it's it's
just not as prevalent as what it was like.
00;19;31;22 - 00;19;34;02
Yeah. Really in that creative space.
00;19;34;02 - 00;19;38;08
And so we are really trying to make sure
that we created an environment
00;19;38;08 - 00;19;42;01
where people get that good leadership
so that they know when something's wrong,
00;19;42;01 - 00;19;43;22
something's wrong, and
00;19;43;22 - 00;19;48;05
hopefully they'll be able to come to us
even and be like, How do I what do I do.
00;19;48;08 - 00;19;49;02
To. Help them?
00;19;49;02 - 00;19;50;25
Because I know there's
going to be a whole bunch of people
00;19;50;25 - 00;19;54;05
that are like stuck in that and don't know
what to do and don't feel comfortable
00;19;54;07 - 00;19;58;03
going to their supervisors
or their producers to say like, How?
00;19;58;07 - 00;20;00;10
How do I how can you help me? Right.
00;20;00;10 - 00;20;04;26
That's really yeah, I, I think both of us
equally admire what you're doing
00;20;04;26 - 00;20;07;28
and like the importance
of it because it's just
00;20;08;01 - 00;20;11;08
it's just I keep saying it's refreshing
to have a conversation like I was.
00;20;11;08 - 00;20;14;16
I was a visiting professor
at the five colleges in Amherst
00;20;14;16 - 00;20;18;26
and teaching just through the pandemic
00;20;18;29 - 00;20;21;12
animation 2D 3D.
00;20;21;12 - 00;20;25;07
And I realized from an academic
standpoint, there is no standard there.
00;20;25;07 - 00;20;28;14
And so yeah,
and so I commend you for everything
00;20;28;14 - 00;20;30;19
you're doing,
and I would love to be a part of it.
00;20;30;19 - 00;20;31;10
Oh, thanks.
00;20;31;10 - 00;20;32;12
In some capacity.
00;20;32;12 - 00;20;33;28
For. Sharing future. Yeah. Yeah.
00;20;33;28 - 00;20;35;29
Still sounds like Skillshare.
00;20;35;29 - 00;20;38;01
Yes. Yes, obviously. Yeah.
00;20;38;01 - 00;20;41;13
So in the interest of time,
because I know we're already almost there,
00;20;41;16 - 00;20;45;25
please tell us like if if people want
to learn more and follow or like,
00;20;45;25 - 00;20;48;11
you know, get connected with you, where
where should they go?
00;20;48;11 - 00;20;50;25
You know, feel free to share
whatever you're comfortable with. Yeah.
00;20;50;25 - 00;20;53;01
No. Yeah. It's not like
I have a lot to talk about.
00;20;53;01 - 00;20;55;24
Are Social Security numbers
00;20;55;26 - 00;20;57;21
I different? Can?
00;20;57;21 - 00;20;59;03
Oh, that's true.
00;20;59;03 - 00;20;59;29
Yeah.
00;20;59;29 - 00;21;02;06
Yeah. One, what do you have in Canada.
00;21;02;06 - 00;21;03;29
We've seen number seven.
00;21;03;29 - 00;21;05;16
Yes. Social insurance number.
00;21;05;16 - 00;21;07;09
So let's say okay. Yeah.
00;21;07;09 - 00;21;09;06
I think it's probably
just a different number. Yeah.
00;21;09;06 - 00;21;10;18
I've learned. I've learned.
00;21;10;18 - 00;21;14;14
I know once I see what it is.
00;21;14;16 - 00;21;17;04
I have a website
so you can find me at Lindsay Noel.
00;21;17;04 - 00;21;20;08
Okay. I'm using my name right now,
but I'm.
00;21;20;09 - 00;21;23;01
I'm really hoping to get the whole thing
under your piece. That's the.
00;21;23;01 - 00;21;24;18
I want that website as well. Yeah.
00;21;24;18 - 00;21;26;12
So we're going to be transferring over.
00;21;26;12 - 00;21;28;09
That'll be a big step for us. Yeah.
00;21;28;09 - 00;21;31;06
When we like really figure out
the format of everything.
00;21;31;06 - 00;21;34;03
But Lindsay know the dossier,
find everything there.
00;21;34;03 - 00;21;38;13
There's you can see the recordings, past
recordings of what we've done and meet
00;21;38;13 - 00;21;39;25
a whole bunch of mentors.
00;21;39;25 - 00;21;41;03
Dischord is a big one.
00;21;41;03 - 00;21;42;27
I don't know exactly how you probably have
00;21;42;27 - 00;21;46;22
to jump through my my website
to get to the Dischord.
00;21;46;24 - 00;21;49;00
Things change. Yeah. Constantly.
00;21;49;00 - 00;21;52;29
And then Instagram and LinkedIn
as an Instagram is
00;21;52;29 - 00;21;58;02
your PS underscore AMC
and then LinkedIn in Miller.
00;21;58;07 - 00;21;58;27
Awesome.
00;21;58;27 - 00;22;01;23
Well, thank you so much for being here,
taking the time.
00;22;01;23 - 00;22;04;14
I hope your first podcast experience
was good.
00;22;04;14 - 00;22;07;14
Yes, so much fun. Yeah. Also relaxing.
00;22;07;16 - 00;22;08;09
Oh yes.
00;22;08;09 - 00;22;10;04
That's the environment
we like to keep. Yeah.
00;22;10;04 - 00;22;12;10
Most days.
00;22;12;10 - 00;22;13;10
All right. Thank you.
00;22;13;10 - 00;22;20;25
All right.
Thank you so much. That's nicely.
00;22;20;28 - 00;22;24;02
A big thank you, as always to E Media
for producing this podcast.
00;22;24;02 - 00;22;26;00
Our producer is Jackson Foote.
00;22;26;00 - 00;22;30;00
Our music is created by hidden
and licensed through premium Boots.com.
00;22;30;00 - 00;22;33;04
And as always, stay honest, stay creative.
00;22;33;05 - 00;22;34;05
Stay open.
00;22;34;05 - 00;22;36;05
Open Pixel Studios, Thanks.
00;22;36;05 - 00;22;37;06
We'll see you in the next episode.