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"A LOT with Audra" is the podcast for women juggling big dreams and full lives. Each episode, host, Audra Dinell, Midwestern wife, mom and neurodivergent multi-six figure entrepreneur encourages women to embrace their many roles holistically by living a values-based life with confidence and joy. Through candid discussions, practical strategies and inspiring stories, this podcast is your guide to designing and achieving success without losing yourself in the process.
Ep87
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Why Saying No Matters
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[00:00:00]
Audra Dinell: [00:01:00] Hey, welcome back. This episode is for the people pleasers, the do-gooders, the ones that have guilt over saying no. Listen, most of us, myself included, have been there. But last night I went to a peer advisory group and this was the topic. How do you say no? How do you discern where to spend your time when you have a full plate of priorities for work and family and you have a lot of people wanting your energy and just interested in picking your brain?
And candidly, you love people and you love helping, and you see opportunities everywhere, so you wanna say yes. [00:02:00] But then your plate gets too full and you start exhibiting burnout symptoms. So we need to learn to say no, but it's not that easy, is it? So last night at this peer advisory group, a ton of suggestions came up, and they were so, so fruitful that I was like, "That's what we're doing the podcast on this week."
Okay, so I've got just a bunch of ideas that I'm gonna lightning bolt you with on this Monday, last Monday of August. We're getting ready to roll into Labor Day weekend. We are at the end, last month of the third quarter. Let's really hone this skill so that by Q4 we have a solid path to discerning what we can say yes in and what we can say no in.
Time Budget Your Yeses
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Audra Dinell: Okay, idea number one. [00:03:00] No surprise, this came from a numbers guy. The tip was to budget our time just like we would budget our money. So if we are giving work, let's say, 40 to 50 hours a week, if we are giving our work life 50 hours a week, how many of those hours can we afford to give to others to support them, to give back, to open doors the way doors were opened for us without it cutting into our profit?
Some seasons it might be I can do one hour a week or it might be one hour a month. But the thought would be to predetermine how many yeses you can say to the meetup requests. [00:04:00] And then stick with that and let the guilt go because you know you're giving your available allotment of yeses and also taking care of your bottom line.
Ask For The Why
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Audra Dinell: Okay, second idea Ask questions. Get curious. Learn what the person wants to meet up for. It's kind of like asking for an agenda, but less formal. It's more, "Hey, I'm in a busy season. May I ask what's on your mind?" type thing. Or, "Can I ask what, ~you know, ~you'd like to accomplish?" Or, "Can I ask what it is that you're interested in hearing from me on?"
Because the thought came up in this conversation that it might not even be the right fit for you. You may n- know a better fit. A person may think, "Ooh, this person can help me," but [00:05:00] maybe you know of a better fit that could actually help them more. And so then you've saved your time, their time, and offered to make a connection that's actually going to be the most fruitful.
And I will say, as a person who has asked plenty of people for their time, even recently, as of this week, and I've had some yeses and I've had some nos, oftentimes me being a person who quality time is a love language, I feel like if I want to gain some knowledge from them, I need to give them my time, and I need to buy them coffee, or I need to buy them lunch.
I need to just make that offer of like, "Hey, there's something I think your brain, your experience, your heart, your self can uniquely help me with. I'd really love your advice." And so I offer automatically to take them to [00:06:00] coffee, right? Or, "Can we grab dinner?" When really it's, ~like,~ maybe one to three questions that I wanna ask them.
And so even just this week, I made a ask to someone in my life who is more seasoned than me and has experience in a certain area, and I asked, "Hey, after we're at this thing, can I go to dinner with you? There's a specific thing I'm curious about, plus there's just some work life stuff I'd love to chat about."
And this person was like, "Hey, can't do that now. Can we do it in, ~you know, ~two or three weeks?" And I said, "Well, I sort of have a situation coming up this week that I'd love some thought partnering on." And they said, "Cool. Can I call you on the way home?" And we had, ~like,~ a 10-minute call on the way home when we were both on the way home from the same event.
So get curious. ~Kind of ~try and find out what the people you are ~m- who are~ asking for your time are looking for. Is it just a catch-up, just a connection? [00:07:00] Is it something more specific? Can it be moved to something that would maybe even work better for both of you? A short phone call, a Zoom session, et cetera.
Offer A Group Workshop
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Audra Dinell: If you're a person who gets asked this on a regular basis, and if you're in the knowledge industry, this is idea three, but I gave ~kind of ~several ideas on that last one, so maybe it's idea, ~like,~ I don't know, four, five, six. Anyways, you might consider hosting a monthly workshop. If you get asked often, "Can I...
Hey, can I pick your brain?" Like, for me, I meet with a lot of people who are wanting to start a business, who, or who have just started a business. Having, ~um,~ launched a business six years ago, and it getting traction, and eyes, visibility, and clients, and just where it is, I often get people who want to get some experience from me, learn from my experience, and they ask to [00:08:00] meet up.
So if you have that same sort of ask coming into you too, you could always offer a monthly workshop, and perhaps it's in person, perhaps it's digital, depending on, ~you know, ~where your audience is ~and, ~and ~you know, ~how many people are asking to pick your brain in different markets or in just your community.
~Sorry, Bryan, I'm gonna get a drink of water~
You could just host a workshop and say, "Hey, I actually am hosting a workshop on that. It's a free workshop. It's gonna be, ~you know, ~on the first Tuesday of every month." And other people who are starting businesses might also be there. Kind of a win-win, right? Especially if you have a service to sell to those who are interested.
So it's like a funnel. You're hosting a free event. You're, like, putting that hour on your calendar. Multiple people might choose to come, so you're not giving multiple people multiple hours of your week. They might create community with one another. Who knows [00:09:00] what could come from that? And then if they still want more of your experience or expertise, then you can talk about your fee.
~Just a second, Brian~
Protect The Power Yes
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Audra Dinell: Another thought that came up, I'm gonna make this topic four, in this conversation was our nos are so important because if we do not say them, they will dilute the power of our yeses
I had a little mind blown emoji during that part of the conversation because I just felt that in my whole body. How often have my yeses been diluted because I've over-committed and I'm not fully present, or I have to cancel, or I'm late, or I'm scattered because I've said too many yeses Instead of choosing to say no so that what I do say yes to can get the appropriate amount of energy.
~Sorry, Brian~
Create A Not Now List
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Audra Dinell: [00:10:00] Okay, idea five was to make a list of 10 things that you just say no to, and remember that everything is a season. You might be in a season where you're very involved in your kid's school, and so you might choose to say no to these 10 things: serving on a board, starting a side hustle, spending time with friends on a school night.
I don't know what would be on your list, but just remember, this is not a forever decision. ~I heard that great, great advice from Mary Beth Jarvis, an entrepreneur and amazing... Wait, let's back up, Brian. ~I heard that advice from Mary Beth Jarvis, an amazing professional, a couple of years ago, and it has stuck with me.
We have very few forever yeses and nos, right? No can be not right now. So not right now am I spending my weekends away from my family, or right now I'm not going to networking events because I have so much work on my plate, or [00:11:00] right now I'm saying no to staying up late to watch this awesome show that I love because I'm prioritizing getting up early so I can get a consistent workout routine I think one of the best things that came out of this conversation for me was just this idea around we must be able to trust ourselves and tune into our body as a part of this process.
Trust Your Body Signals
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Audra Dinell: We must be able to trust that we know the right nos for us and we know the right yeses for us because if we listen to our body, it will tell us what is a yes this season and what is a no for whatever reason. And I did not mean to rhyme. That was very cool that I did. I often think we go so fast, partially due to saying so many yeses, that we get so out of tune with our body.
And I just, I know because I've been there But it's [00:12:00] so important to just take a beat and learn to, ~like,~ listen to yourself and feel where you feel it in your body Because it will tell you. ~It will, ~it will give you that guide. And then, yeah, sure, take it up to your mind, but I know my mind when thinking about yeses or nos really only sees opportunities.
And so my mind can always find a reason to say yes, almost always. Because I will admit, right now in my life, I'm so excited about so many things, and when I say yes, it's because I genuinely wanna do all the things. It's not, oh, I'm saying yes out of obligation or because I feel guilt. It's that genuinely there are so many amazing people that I'd love to connect with and so many amazing things I'd love to do and [00:13:00] places I'd love to see and missions I'd love to contribute to that it's so easy for my brain to figure out why I should say yes.
And there have been some seasons of my career where it was just a yes season. Starting a business, everything is a yes. Being a young professional, everything was a yes. But then there are some seasons where there is a really strategic priority that needs a lot of focus, and so that's when a list of nos or this ability to listen to my body, not let my brain talk me into yes if it's not that season, use any of these tools that we talked about, that's when it becomes so important.
Guilt Pride And Overcommit
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Audra Dinell: And I had a sidebar conversation after the group was officially concluded, and it was with a professional who's also in my line of work, and he noted the distinction he has found between men and women [00:14:00] and this issue of overcommitting or saying yes too much out of pure excitement, generosity, love, et cetera.
Because I had wondered, is this just a problem for women? ~I mean, I, ~I do see a lot of women in my community having a problem with overcommitting or, ~you know, ~just feeling ~kind of ~spent because they're giving, giving, giving to everyone else and saying yes to all the things. And across the table, it was like, no, this is a problem across the board.
But this particular professional I was talking to mentioned he's noticed that oftentimes men can overcommit more out of, ~like,~ a pride response of, "Look at all the things that I can do and be and contribute to," whereas women often overcommit and say yes, too many yeses, out of guilt. And I just thought, "Oh, wow, that's it."
The feeling that we [00:15:00] as women often are trying to avoid when we know we need to say no but don't want to and talk ourselves out of it and just say yes is that feeling of guilt. And ~I mean, ~we could go on and on and on and unpack that, but we won't this episode. But that was a really good takeaway for me from this conversation that I had last night, was just to monitor that awareness of like, ooh I know I need to say no, whether it's because I'm listening to my body and my intuition, or I'm using one of the tools that I mentioned.
I don't have an allotment of time for that this week, or I'll dilute my yeses and not be able to fully show up for them. But to just be aware of when I'm tempted to say yes out of guilt And honestly, that's not really a problem I'm gonna solve on this podcast episode. But [00:16:00] just really the awareness for me is so helpful, because when I think about my life ~and, ~and the work I wanna do and the ways I can make impact and the people that I want to pour my energy into Like I know they're worth the yes, so I have to say some nos elsewhere
And even if that does come with a little guilt, which sometimes it will, if I know that I'm doing my best to show up and use my gifts and shine my light and pour my energy where my top priorities are, then I just have to be okay with that. I just have to be okay with no coming sometimes with a little guilt.
Closing Pep Talk
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Audra Dinell: Okay. If you needed this pep talk, I hope it was helpful. I know the conversation last night was ~so, ~so helpful to me. Thank you so much for listening, and [00:17:00] I'm so excited to be back next week with a really awesome lineup of guests. We are gonna be diving into second act conversations again in September, and I'm really looking forward to it.
So thank you for listening.