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Chasing the Game: Youth Soccer in America is a weekly podcast for soccer parents, coaches, and players who want to understand how youth soccer development really works in the United States.
Hosted by two dads, filmmaker Liron Unreich and investor Matt Tartaglia, the show covers everything from grassroots soccer to elite pathways like MLS NEXT and ECNL. Combining data, real experience, and expert insights from academy directors, college coaches, and former pros, each episode explains what families truly need to know.
Weekly episodes focus on the core aspects of youth soccer: player development, coaching culture, college recruiting, tryouts, travel costs, and the challenges of youth sports parenting in today’s competitive environment.
For families navigating youth soccer’s complex system, Chasing the Game offers practical advice, credible voices, and relatable stories from two dads working to make sense of American player development, one episode at a time.
Polvara, have in common??
They all came through the New York Soccer Club.
And that makes this a good place to ask a bigger question.
What does it actually mean when a club says it can develop
players?
Because we hear that word common constantly.
This club develops, this club develops, it's everywhere.
But real development is not a slogan.
It can't be.
It's technical, it's cultural.
It's got to be very specific.
It lives in the small details repeated over time.
And eventually, the proof shows up in the players
Today we're talking about something that every club says it values,
but very few can really explain
once you get past the branding.
What is development?
What does it actually mean?
What does it look like on the training field and the feedback,
the culture, and the day to day life of a serious youth club?
you're getting so good at these intros.
I'm trying, man.
Because once you get beyond the logos, the
league badges, the broad promises,
that's the real question for families.
What is your kid actually getting every week?
What is the coaching environment?
How clear is the path?
How consistent is it from team to team, and
how much of what a club says about itself actually shows
up on the field?
Yeah, today we're privileged to have
Christian Gonzalez, the Academy director for New
York Soccer Club.
His own path into the game runs from growing up in Westchester,
son of a Uruguayan immigrants, playing at Fordham,
coaching through the early academy years, and then helping shape one
of the most competitive club environments in one of
the most competitive soccer regions in the country
would be Fordham, not Fordham, but we'll keep going.
And what makes this conversation interesting is that Christian doesn't
talk about development in vague language.
He talks about it in very specific terms
coach education, club methodology, ball roll
time, individual feedback, accountability,
what a director actually does, and how you
and how you try to create consistency
across an entire club when every coach, every
team, and every family is coming in with different expectations
and different dreams.
Yeah, we also get into what makes this region so intense
The competition level in New York and Westchester, the proximity
of other clubs, the pressure families feel, the economic
reality of running a serious youth club, and detention between
philosophy, access, results, and opportunity.
this is a conversation about one club, yes, but it's
also a much bigger conversation about how parents should think about the environment,
how clubs define themselves
and what real development actually sounds like when you strip away the sales pitch.
Yeah, this is very cautiously chasing the game,
youth soccer in America
Liron: Director Gonzalez,
welcome to chasing the Game.
It's a, it's an honor to have
you, uh, we're very excited
on this, uh, Sunday morning.
So, um, before we focus on New York Soccer
Club, can you walk us a little bit through
your own path of the game player, coach,
academy director, and what part of the
journey you think shaped you the most as
far as youth development is concerned?
Christian: As an immigrant from Uruguay.
My past, my family history certainly
shaped how I view and, you know, felt
passionate about the game early on.
The passion that every Uruguayan
has for the game was in me.
And that fueled my motivation
to, to play the game.
Uh, so early on, I grew up in New
York, which is in Westchester County,
and I grew up in their youth program
until somebody scouted me and said,
Hey, like they're putting together a
really good team in Westchester County.
And mind you, this is like mid eighties.
And, uh, and they said, uh, you know, they
wanna put together like a select team.
FC Westchester.
And so as part of the first ever FC
Westchester team, and that team ended up
being very successful, the team really
established FC Westchester, which a lot
of teams came after us and, and really
established the notion of like, let's
say, uh, an elite club right before
elite clubs were, were really a thing.
And that was founded by Al Pastore
really great guy and a visionary.
And certainly established a club that
is known to be FC Westchester today.
And so I had deep roots in FC Westchester
and I ended up, um, going to Fordham.
So I stayed, I was a local guy, you know,
I did well at Fordham, was all two time
all Patriot, uh, conference selection.
And out of that I was selected to
play for the New York Fever, which
was in the USL, uh, at the time.
And 10 of the 11 starters on that team got
drafted in 1996 to, to be in the MLS part
of the MLS teams of the inaugural year.
I, unfortunately was not selected.
I stopped playing and I started coaching.
Uh, and at those times, like, it was
just much different club scene, right?
Like, uh, the clubs were training
twice a week playing, you know,
two, three games on the weekend,
playing a lot of tournaments.
The, the imbalance was off, right?
And when the DA came
along, we were selected.
So I was part of the first
ever FC Westchester DA team.
We took him to the
finals, did really well.
And then this new club came, popped up
outta nowhere and, uh, had Claudio Reyna's
name attached to it, Javier Perez, who's
now the Atlanta United Technical Director
associated with New York Soccer Club.
And one of the biggest carrots
associated with it was inside soccer.
And back in those days, it was
the early days of the internet.
And inside soccer was a really
interesting coaching website resource
website that Mark Heffernan founded.
And what he did was he went around to
all the academies in Europe and South
America, like Boca Juniors and, and, uh,
Riverplate, and, uh, Ajax and Chelsea
it was just amazing content, right?
It was like behind the scenes, like
what do academies do in Europe, right?
Like it was like the first
step of information flow of.
What are coaches doing on the youth
level, like at these league clubs?
Right.
So I was so intrigued by that.
So I was part of that, I had a
great development here, right?
So was attracted by that and they,
they recruited me from FC Westchester
to come to New York Soccer Club I
did that for four or five years and
unfortunately, like inside soccer was a
little bit ahead of its time and wasn't
successful commercially and I had a
transition full time to the New York
Soccer Club and I was coaching a lot and
the boys director left at some point,
and, you know, I just kind of
made a pitch to 'em Hey guys,
like I'm ready to be a director.
And um, so they named me boys director
at the time and I've never looked back.
I've been with the club about
15 years and 10 of those years
I was, academy director now,
Matt: amazing.
When did when did your ambition shift
from coaching teams to wanting to
shape the whole club environment,
and was there a trigger in that where
you realized that was your calling?
Christian: I just thought I was
ready, you know, and like the leaders
of the club, like I had kind of
stepped away for other opportunities.
And my ambition was like, I, I, I'd
put a lot of time into the teams I
was doing, and I knew that it would
solidify my ability to be full-time in,
in coaching and doing what I love to do.
You know, I, I kind of took a leap saying,
you know what, like, I can do this.
And leading people and making
sure that people follow your
vision is a huge challenge.
And I understood that right away.
And, uh, and so like I was, I was ready
for it because the club was founded on
very strong principles and philosophy.
So it was really easy to say.
Listen, like, you know, in the hiring
process or you know, whatever we
did, this is what we're gonna do.
And the consistency in our methodology
and our ability to deliver our team
tactical principles and our game model,
has always been at the core of what
we do from a coaching perspective.
So that's always been our guiding
light from a philosophical standpoint.
It's never wavered, and that's
why you see such consistency
throughout our teams, from the
youngest teams to the oldest teams.
We don't always win.
Unfortunately.
I wish we won more, but from a plan
standpoint, from a development standpoint,
it's second to none in my view,
Liron: Right.
So as parents are trying to figure
out which clubs, what fits their
kids' style, the, the idea of vision
comes into play how important is the
director as far as what the vision of
the club is, and also how do you define
the vision of New York Soccer Club?
Christian: Yeah.
Uh, I think it's, I think
it's everything, right?
Because like, so like when I was
explaining, like when I first
started coaching every coach has,
own vision of what it should be,
how practice should be delivered.
Like the methodology, the order of how
many activities are in each practice?
What are we doing in each practice, right?
Like, is there a puritization model?
Is there somebody holding accountable,
the coaches to those things?
And back in those days, the answer
was there was nothing in place.
Like literally zero, right?
So now we have a model where we have a
lot in place and we have a structure where
coaches are really required to follow a
puritization model, both from a tactical
puritization and a physical puritization.
But if there's no director, the
coach is gonna always fall back on.
It's human nature, right?
Either the path of least resistance
or what they feel best about.
And when you have that kind of
scenario, you know, there's a lot
of gaps that are created, right?
Because you get coaches that just wanna
work on possession or coaches that wanna
work on the funnel third, or coaches,
you know, coaches hate working on, let's
say, defending or there's coaches that
wanna just work on pressing or, if you
don't have somebody that's kind of really
holding people accountable to, following
a plan, following the methodology,
following kind of the main principles of
coach behaviors, you're gonna have kind
of inconsistencies throughout your club.
Matt: How difficult is it to manage
with the expectations you have if
there's coaches who also, who have
full-time jobs and then coach for
two, three hours an evening as well.
Christian: Full-time is
a relative term, right?
We have everybody on a W2, right?
So they're not 10 99 contractors.
So the mindset changes right there, right?
So that's one thing.
I think the other thing is that we have
very few people that work other jobs.
You know, they find and manage
their schedules pretty well.
I would say 30% of our staff is, you
know, have full-time jobs and have
two teams that they coach with us.
But the rest of the coaches are
pretty much full-time with us.
Like 90% of their work is with us, right?
So for, they'll coach two teams.
And then we have a very vibrant
training programs that we offer to
the community, our own members, right?
And we try to drive revenue
through that, for our club.
And we offer work for our
coaches in that process.
Matt: How many, uh, how many kids are
within the New York Soccer Club community?
Christian: We have 650 full-time players.
And then, you know, I would say
another five to 600 players that
come through our training programs.
Liron: So can't spell New York Soccer
Club without the word New York in it.
So that, that means something.
There's, there's something
about this region.
If you were, let's say, building a
club in another area in the United
States, would it be the same vision
the same club or there's something
specific where you adjust to this
very magical region that we're in?
Christian: I would do it the same way.
I just think the, the principles are very
sound, the philosophy is super sound, you
know, we, our game model's very clear.
when you have clarity, you're
able to deliver consistency and
then refine that from there.
And that's what we continue to try to do.
We try to refine, we
try to make it better.
We try to, but we have
clarity in what we want to do.
Matt: What?
Are the drivers?
When you say refined?
Is it based on results?
Is it based upon development of individual
players who move on to whether it's
a professional academy or to college?
What does that look like?
Christian: No, for us it's always
observing what's going on in the game.
Certain trends.
How can we make like certain
aspects better, right?
So I'll give you an example.
There's a lot of research done in Europe
on different moments in the game, right?
And one of the, that we're talking about
a set peace moment in the throw in and
synopsis was, most teams end up throwing
the ball up the line, lose the ball,
and teams that throw it insider
backwards, keep the ball longer,
they're able to switch play, they're
able to generate scoring chances.
And I said, let's try a, a pilot so
I, I picked two or three coaches said,
listen, this is what I want you to do.
Boom, sure enough, video evidence
after video evidence, we kept the ball.
We were scoring goals,
we're creating chances.
And you see it throughout our teams now.
So that's one example of refinement.
The first action is a throw inside, and
then like two or three passes later,
like, we're attacking the goal, right?
So yeah.
Like, that's just a little example, right?
You know, a couple years ago I noticed
that our coaches weren't very clear
with the defending tactical scenarios
that were very common game after game.
Defending the space in front, defending
the space behind, from wide areas, right?
Protecting the goal.
And they just, they weren't, it
wasn't clear to all our teams, right?
And we just spent time, we refined
it, we made it super clear, we
updated a talent development plan
and now it's in there, right?
Matt: how do you observe
training yourself and matches?
You can't be at everything.
How much video are you watching?
How much in person are you watching?
And then what does the feedback
loop look like with coaches?
Christian: We really see ourselves
as a development club, right?
So part of what we do is we have
to develop coaches and get them to
a level where we feel really good
about what they're doing, right?
So the only way to get coaches to
have clarity in what they do is, is by
observations of what they're doing and
helping them reflect and helping them.
Just kind of see what they're doing right.
And just point certain little things out.
So you have to, you have to do that.
Now I coach one team, so I
try to dedicate a lot of, and
I, this is on purpose, right?
Like I don't coach two teams.
I wish I was only coaching zero teams,
so I could just be on the field and
be mostly a coach educator, really.
But that's not the case.
But I try to dedicate a lot of my
time to go sit before my practice.
I watch practices, I watch trends,
I watch individual coaches, right?
We have other directors.
We have a management group that's seven,
eight directors strong that we divide
and conquer and we say, listen, we gotta,
we gotta help mentor coaches, right?
And part of it is observing,
giving feedback, formal feedback,
both in matches and in games.
I just did this with our U 14 coach
I just, I was there watching a game.
He obviously coached the game.
I said, make your notes.
I'm gonna make my notes.
I'm gonna present to you what I
saw you present to me, what you
saw, and see if they match up
and where they don't match up.
Let's talk.
Right.
So just an easy way to kind of hone
his eye to like what I'm seeing.
Liron: I love this because it it
sounds like you have a and I, we can
use the word obsession, but there's
a technical obsession in you about,
about football and development.
And we have encountered, many,
clubs have broad language try to attract
young players, it sounds like you have,
there's a resistance within you, how
you communicate what youth soccer is.
There's a lot more technical
language coming from you in general
than I see from a lot of clubs.
Is that who you are?
Christian: I mean, we, we
strive for clarity, right?
I can't stress that enough.
Uh, that's the only way kids learn
and develop by having clear messages.
If you speak in an ambiguous way
to kids on, in technical terms,
that's what you're gonna get.
Just medi, I mean, look, I
always say this to my coaches.
I say, and I say this to players,
parents, whoever will listen, just because
you do something a lot doesn't mean
you're gonna get better at it, right?
We all drive a lot, and I know
for myself, as I've gotten
older, I've gotten worse, right?
There's been no personal practice
in driving for me, right?
Like I, I started picking up the
phone, like all sorts of things, right?
It's just same thing in soccer, right?
If you have a lot of general
practices, you're gonna get
a lot of general outcomes.
Liron: Wow.
Christian: So I try to drive home being
specific and like when I show up, I,
and I, so I'm talking to my coach, I ask
him, what principle are you working on?
What are we working on here?
And does everything that you
planned feature that principle?
Like, in terms of like getting out what
you want to get out and making that clear.
Did we push the players on or not?
It's not that they're aligned,
it's, it's just a prerequisite
of working at the club, right?
So when I hire people, I say, listen
you know, this is how we do things.
And there's a lot of
flexibility in what we do.
And, you know, choosing the activities
and, and how, you know, your personality
and how you, you know, how you communicate
and how you behave with, you know,
players and things of that nature.
But the team tactical principles
are, uh, you know, what we, what
and how we play our system of
play that's gotta be followed or
else we don't achieve consistency.
I think the other part that, like I
stress all the time and, you know,
our coaches have gotten really
good at it, is ball roll time.
Right?
I see coaches talk when I see, when I
watch sessions and coaches talk more
than like a minute, I start going crazy.
If coaches are talking or the
ball's not rolling 30 minutes out
of every practice, you're losing a
practice a week on just the ball.
Not doing it.
Like the player's not doing anything.
So we stress ball roll time all the time.
And if, if a coach is not upholding
that they're spoken to about it.
So our sessions are, you know, we try
to get as close to like 90 minutes
as possible, but that's impossible.
Right?
Because, you know, you'll have water
breaks, you have a little transitions,
but you'd be surprised how much
an average coach can lose in each
practice of roll time if they're not,
if they don't keep things moving.
Matt: Why is, why is 90 minutes the magic
number for you for a specific reason?
Christian: Not necessarily.
I mean, it'd be nice sometimes.
But they're certainly, um, in
the northeast there's always a
squeeze on field availability.
There's
Matt: yeah,
Christian: there's just no way around it.
Matt: Um, clarity and communication
are two of the key messages here.
coaches
and developing relationships
with youth players.
The,
is there an expectation around
how they provide feedback?
How well do they actually know
the kid and how do you actually
ensure that's happening?
Christian: Yeah, so I would say
about four or five years ago,
we made a conscious decision to
change how we give feedback, right?
And really stick to correcting
versus being critical.
That one principle has
changed everything for us.
Because we just stay on task of
correcting the player versus allowing
our frustration to come through
and a player that's making the same
mistake over and over again, right?
You know, it's easy to get frustrated
and be critical or whatever, right?
Like, so.
So these are the things that like I, I
focused on and things have changed and
we've had better outcomes because of it.
So, you know, that one thing has
allowed us just to be free, to
be really good to our players.
And I try to stress that
to the coaches, right?
Like, we're gonna have every
team is gonna have right?
Like, we have to be good to
all those players right now.
They're all gonna be in different
journeys, different places in
their journey and development.
And it's our job to help them along.
Matt: what about from an IDP perspective?
Do you guys, are you
doing it twice a year?
Parents involved?
Does it depend on the age group?
What's the philosophy?
Christian: Yeah so yes.
In our older age groups, so
what we try to do is meet with
them before the season starts.
And so we try to get ahead of the game,
like in the sense like, Hey, this is kind
of what I've seen in the, you know, first
couple of weeks you know, this is like
top three things you should focus on.
And it's kind of collaborative as well.
And we try to do it in writing, and then
we support it with video as we go, right.
And we, you know, we have video folders
and we'll add to the videos and we'll
make notes and things of that nature.
Um, and the younger age groups,
it's, we try to make age appropriate.
It's a written feedback.
And then sometimes there's a meeting
and sometimes, you know, parents are
okay with, you know, what they got and,
you know, we, we move forward, right?
But I think it's an important
process of development and, um.
We're always like thinking about
different ways of doing it.
Liron: I'm going back to New York.
I mean, well, let's all face it here.
We're in one of the most competitive
youth regions in the country, so
we have economic disparity, soccer
culture disparity, you name it.
Does this make it, challenging is this
part of the magic what do you think?
Christian: Competition
is at an all time high.
You know, and you know, I've heard
people say, you know, things are diluted.
I just think more kids playing at a
higher level and getting better coaching
and yes, like the best players are
going to MLS academies and that's okay.
But it's super competitive.
Like the games are extremely tight
and the margins are very small.
And you'll have different
styles at play all the time.
Right.
You'll have direct teams play
versus teams that wanna play on
the ground through the lines.
You'll have teams that'll play low block
and play first set piece and win games.
I mean, as far as I'm concerned,
like the competition level is at all
time high because people wanna make
playoffs, people want to make flex.
People want to, you know, make the
13, 14, you know, end of year event.
So that drives them to play really hard.
And for the most part, I think clubs
that, you know, we compete against,
do a similarly good job of trying
to get the best players and the best
coaches and have the best environments
for, for the clubs to play in.
Look, I'll give you an example.
Like last before the Easter break,
our nineteens and seventeens
played in Brooklyn against fa
euro in a very small field.
It was football lined.
It was a high school field.
Matt: New.
New, new.
New Utrecht high school.
I know it very well.
Christian: So look it, you know,
some people would say, Hey, like
this isn't proper, but you know what?
Like, why isn't it proper?
Liron: It's true.
Matt: You're forced.
You're forced to adjust.
I mean, that's what the game is all about.
Christian: It just, it'll be
a little bit different game.
We may have to adjust, but like the
kids are learning how to deal with it.
It's same thing when you go to Med Oval,
like you have to adjust a little bit.
Med ovals super tight and they
have it down to a science in
how they play there, right?
So you know it, these little things
like make you a better coach because
you have to really think through
how do I combat what they do?
How do I give them a problem?
So in that process, you have
to become a better coach.
Liron: So in your experience, do
you find that most families choose
environments by p hilosophy of a club?
'cause I think that's very rare.
Or is it just, okay, my son or daughter
made it into this, I'm just gonna go here.
Or do you find that
parents ask you questions?
Christian: Oh, God,
that's a hard question.
Uh, I think like, uh, I
Liron: Matt wrote it, so yeah.
Christian: There's all sorts
of motivations, uh, behind
decisions that, that folks make.
And, you know, I haven't really
inquired about why people
choose New York Soccer Club.
I only infer just based on
some of the questions they ask.
And look, you know, at the end of the
day, I think people, you know, are
driven to go to clubs because of what
the club kind of stands for, right?
Like, and the image and brand that
they've developed over a period of
time and what they see on the field.
You know, when we play against teams
or, you know, they come to one of our
programs and how we handle ourselves
in our programs, things of that nature,
I think they make their decision on.
And most of the time it
starts off with a local.
Group of people.
Right.
And as they get older, that radius
starts to get bigger because then, you
know, just it gets bigger and bigger
and bigger as, as we get older, right?
We had, you know, kids coming from Long
Island, we have kids come from Jersey,
you know, in the 19 seventeens, sixteens.
Whereas the younger kids, it's, you
know, mostly Southern Westchester kids.
Right?
Matt: I've asked a number of families
who have moved to Westchester from
New York City that I've known, how
do you, how do you choose whether
they're at New York Soccer Club, FC
Westchester, or in some cases even
Beachside, depending on where they live.
And oftentimes it was where my
kid gets in because all, all three
are really competitive and they
liked elements about all of them.
Christian: right.
That's right.
And um, and that's kind of the
market dynamic that we're in is that
is that we do have a club that's
literally a mile and a half from us.
And it's a unique situation right?
Like, not many clubs have a club
like literally right next to them.
So, you know, kids if they wanna play
at this level, okay, like if they don't
make one of our teams, it's completely
understandable that they wanna have
a go at the club next door or even
down the road a little bit, right?
Like that's completely understandable.
And that's, that's what MLS homegrown
has done now by the expansion
they've done is a lot of options.
Right?
And that's what I'm saying, a lot of kids
playing at this level now, getting good
coaching and developing at a good rate.
So I think MLS next has done a
really good job of, setting up an
environment, a competitive environment
that clubs wanna be part of.
And the showcases so in that
respect, you know, their marketing
of the league has really led to
more inclusion of urban clubs.
They're really player
focused with all their media.
They highlight players all the
time on Instagram and TikTok
and things of that nature.
So, yeah.
So that, that's, you know, I think they're
doing a really good job of like the league
and kids wanting to be part of the league.
And now with the inclusion of
the Academy division, it's done a
really good job of kids wanting to
be part of the second teams now.
And taking their chance of,
you know, working their way
up within a club as well.
I just think that, you know, adding the
when they added the competition for like,
uh, the playoffs or the year end event
that just 'cause back in the da, they
were all just glorified friendlies, right?
And teams and players would play
that way and a lot of people
criticized the DA because of that.
Or they would set up competitions where.
Only one team would qualify for playoffs
and like halfway through, like nobody
had anything to play for anymore.
Or, you know, they wanted everybody to,
everybody to play kind of the same way.
Or you were criticized or you
know, if you didn't play on the
ground, you were criticized.
You know, that's just not
how football's played.
I mean, like, you know, just,
there's just different ideas of
how you can win games, right?
So when MLS came in, MLS didn't have any
mandates about, Hey, you have to play
this way, or you have to play the system.
Or they just said, this is the platform.
This is, you know, this is the
competition, and go, right?
And so what I noticed was it
just became instantly more
competitive than the DA was.
And that competition at this level
drives people to be better, right?
And investing more.
And.
Scholarships, investing more in
staff, investing more in technology.
So all that drives um, I think,
better outcomes in my view.
Liron: But there, there's
a cynicism a little bit.
Uh, and I don't know how deep we wanna
go into this, but terms like quality of
play for a certain age group which I know
I, I'm only speaking for the parent side.
I know it just enormous amount
of confusion and I, I see
large quality disparity within
the MLS next systems as well.
So you end up in situation where games
are pretty lopsided and in, in many
terms, in the good clubs are still
the really good clubs, and I'm not
sure how much is pushing the clubs
underneath who still have that badge.
Christian: So look, I think there's
always a question of where do you
draw the line of quality control,
Right?
I just try to do a really
good job with my club so
now, I know that that may not
always be the case, right?
Because, you know, look, one of our
teams may be a little bit weaker than
the rest, or they're going through
a bad moment, whatever it might be.
But for the most part, our goal
is to try to be as competitive as
possible and win the day, right?
That's what drives us is that like we
want to compete at the highest level.
We want to try to make playoffs,
we wanna try to make flex, right?
If my, if one of my teams was an outlier,
like one of our teams was not competing
well, well, I have to look at everything
that's going on in that team, right?
Is it the player pool?
Is it the coaches?
Like, have we had five guys ripped
away from that team to MLS academies?
Are we going through a transition period?
Our 2009s who are doing very well
this year they've lost nine players.
To MLS academies.
You lose 1, 2, 3 players, like good
players your team's gonna look different.
We've lost nine.
And that team has gone through
different cycles and how they
perform and how they feel about the
team, how they feel about the club.
we lost some games.
We lost some tough games.
We lost some lopsided games
through during that period.
But you know what, because you have people
like myself, we have other directors.
We focused on it.
We, we scouted, we recruited,
we, we made the team better.
We got a coach that motivated
the group that was there.
We, we promoted some kids from our second
teams and now they're going to flex.
They're competing for a playoff spot.
You have to look deeper sometimes.
Right?
And sometimes when you get promoted into
this thing, right, like an MLS academy,
like you're a club outside, It takes a
little bit of time to, to get the player
pool that you need to compete at this
level, or the coaches or whatever it might
be that's going on at any given club.
And then the other aspect
of quality of play.
I, I don't think it's perfect and
they're using some sort of ai.
I, you know, I'm not sure, like
if coding and I'm not sure what
they placed their emphasis on.
For example you know, our 2013s,
our U 13, it's only lost twice, but
they're like fourth or fifth and
there's teams ahead of them that they
beat and have better records then.
So like what weight are they putting on?
Right?
So, So yeah, like, and like they
play good football too, like, so
I don't know why, uh, the quality
of play wouldn't be higher.
Right.
But I don't focus on that kind of
stuff because, you know, they'll end
up where they need to be, you know,
and they'll end up probably making
the playoffs the top tier, and they'll
compete very well and it'll be fine.
Matt: How do you, um, given where
your, where your club is located in
Westchester, generally speaking, a really
affluent, county, but with, you know,
as most of New York has, or all of New
York has socioeconomics dynamics um,
where you've got, uh, you, there's other
communities that aren't nearly as affluent
and you've got a lot of immigrants.
How do you think about it from a club
perspective in, in ensuring that it's
inclusive, thinking about scholarships
and that the players on the, in the
community all come together as one?
Christian: Yeah.
Yeah.
We, we put a huge emphasis on making sure
that any kid that has the ability to make
our team, has the opportunity to do that.
Uh, and we give away.
Quite a bit of financial
aid for our players to help
them to make it affordable.
And some families we go, you know,
above and beyond to help them travel
and things of that, that nature.
So yeah, we, we, we dedicate a
lot of resources to that over the
last, you know, few years or, you
know, we, we give financial aid
to the level of throughout club.
Matt: And then do you offset that?
I mean, we have this, and you
hear this all the time, we hear
this often through, through direct
messages or whatever it may be.
America's broken pay to
play, blah, blah, blah.
Like we all understand it.
It is what it is but
facilities cost a lot.
Coaches have to be paid.
These clubs aren't making the
kind of money that everybody
thinks that they're making.
Right.
So we try to, we do our best
to try to dispel some of that.
Christian: Yeah, so I've, I, it's, look.
I have a take on that.
It could take a whole podcast,
but, um, I'll just, very,
very simple economics, right?
Like from a club level, we have like
we have three buckets of revenue.
We have member fees, we have training
programs, and we have fundraising.
Our expenses are probably like 200 lines,
Matt: Yeah.
Christian: We don't have a men's first
team we have no ability to sell players.
If the pyramid here was
promotion relegation, there'd
be investors lining up.
Right to, to to buy
players from us, right.
To make their teams better so
they can climb the leagues.
But we don't have that.
Right?
Like our biggest expenses, payroll, right.
And field expenses.
Those are the two big ones.
And without either one of
those, there's no program.
Liron: Yeah, I mean, in club
compensation obviously would be,
would really be a game changer.
Matt: We, we've, we've talked often
on this show about, um, about rockets.
So players who just pop and stand
out immediately, you've had some at
New York Soccer Club who have gone
on to have pro careers, whether
it's James Sands or Gio Reyna.
How quickly can you, as an academy
director or coach, identify players
like that, and how much of that is just
natural ability with the mentality to do
it versus truly development on the pitch?
Christian: It's all those things.
You can't, you can't have
one without the other.
Matt: Yeah.
Christian: What you see sometimes
is the kid that's like, um,
like I'll give you an example.
Like Dante Polvara.
Came through our club and
was rejected at N-Y-C-F-C.
He was rejected at other
professional academies.
Until U 17 that Citi was
like, yeah, I see it.
And he went to Citi, he won a national
championship with the U19 alongside
like six other New York Soccer Club
kids, with Gio and, and James and
Will and James ended up going to
Georgetown and his senior year he
was the MAC Hermann Award winner.
And next thing you know, he's in,
in Scotland in the Premier League,
So he ended up having a. A great
stint at Aberdeen won a Scottish
cup and is now at St. Louis.
All those guys same team, yeah,
Liron: So I wanna talk a little
bit about the girl side of,
uh, New York Soccer Club.
Do you wanna talk a little
bit about that program?
Have things changed as much as
they have for the boys as far as,
let's say an MLS next environment?
Christian: It has as you know,
the DA dissolved and with that,
you know, there was a lot of
uncertainty during COVID, right?
Both on the boys side and the girls side.
MLS came through on the boys side, right?
Like As an organization and on the
girls side, the clubs had to do the
heavy lifting and create an organization
out of nothing and create a board, a
nonprofit, and it was called the GA.
And we were proudly in the middle of
that of establishing that league, right?
Like we were definitely a founding
member of that league, right?
And very proud of the, the
work that's gone on there.
Our director, Carlos Mejia, has done an
unbelievable job with getting the girls.
Teams to a level where they're
competing, you know, in the top
third of every table just about.
And, you know, they made Champions
Cup this year for the first time.
And that was a huge
achievement for the club.
I don't, I don't know if you're familiar
with it, but it's, you know, if,
if all your teams achieve a certain
amount of, you know, in the top half
of the table table, you know, your club
goes to a Champions Cup tournament.
And we were able to, to qualify for that
tournament and we were very proud of that.
And in that process, you know, they've
really established you know, a way to
identify girls for the next level, which
is for college and for national teams.
And, you know, we've had great success
in pushing kids on to, you know, colleges
of all divisions and national teams,
both domestically and internationally.
Liron: In the scale of what you
are running, is it realistic to
have both elite programs running?
I mean, do you, is it just as far
as field staff logistics, is that
Christian: That's what we do.
Liron: That's
Christian: that, that's we strive to
compete at the highest level, right?
You know, that's what we have to do.
And we, we strive for excellence
both on the boys and girls.
We don't win every game.
You know, it's, I wish we did.
And match days are hard for me
because it's very rare that we
win thirteens through nineteens.
And that, you know, if we lose one game,
it's still like we lost one game, God.
Like, you know, like I think
about that, like reflect and, you
know, you just obsess about it.
But, you know, and you know,
when you have heavy defeats,
it's, it's really hard, right?
Like match days when you don't win
a lot of games, it's, you know,
you really, you really have to look
inside and like, what's going on here?
Right?
Like, and you know, like we, we take
this hard because it's important to us.
Matt: So we're what, like a
month and a half out from the
end of the 2025, 2026 season.
How do you evaluate success
either at the team level, age,
group level, boys, girls and then
overall, what does that look like?
You were talking about how you think
about training from week to week.
You're looking at results
as part of that too.
You're looking at player pathways.
How do you, there's so
much to look at, I guess.
Christian: Is.
There is, and different teams
are in different places, right?
Like we have teams that have been
building for two and three years and
we, we keep adding to the player pool.
We have a good coach and the
expectations are high then.
Yeah, making playoffs is
realistic goal, right?
And trying to do something in playoffs.
And then there's other teams where,
you know, like it'll be a different
situation where we've lost two or three
players, to MLS academies, and we're
trying to find the next players that,
that can help us compete at this level.
And, and, you know, both on
the boys and girls side, right?
And so we look at each individual team as,
as each, like an individual kind of silo
of what's our goals with this team, right?
But then you have club goals, right?
Where it's like, are we
winning more than losing?
Are we our aim is to try to put on the
best possible training environment,
give the, you know, compete at the
highest possible level, get results,
play a good brand of soccer, right?
And, and develop kids
all at the same time.
Matt: I dunno if this is a rumor or
true that parents are not allowed at
training or anywhere near training.
Christian: So a lot of that is driven
by facility rules, so we're on a
campus of a college and when we have
six teams practicing at once, we
take over the, the campus, right?
So the colleges.
We have to be respectful of our
agreement with the college, I know that
some people drive from far away and
they, they have nothing else to do so
they'll watch their kid or whatever.
But I know that, a lot of times
that's not the motivation.
A lot of times the motivation is
'cause they wanna know exactly
what's going on in training and
that's not healthy for the player.
I just think parents should just
let soccer, be soccer, you know,
and let them do the, their thing.
Matt: I think that's true.
I also think that goes back to the earlier
comments around clarity and communication.
I think that as a parent, um, where I
come from on this angle, you spend so
much time, you invest a bunch of money.
Um, your family life is oriented
around soccer in a lot of cases.
If you're training four nights a week, but
then there's not a whole lot of clarity
or communication, whether it's with your
player, your kid, or with you as a parent.
And I think that actually drives
quite a bit of that, as opposed to,
I don't have anything else to do.
I want to be there.
Right.
Christian: Where our coaches
are not clear in feedback is
where problems start to fester,
So I try to encourage all
our coaches to be super.
Clear about what's, what's going
on and what's necessary to fix it.
And sometimes those fixes aren't
overnight, so it's hard to accept
as a family, if I say Hey, the
physical profile, you're one year
behind in your physical profile.
There's nothing that player can do until
that player changes, you know, maybe
grows or, you know, maybe gets stronger.
But that takes time.
Matt: How much has bio banding helped?
As far as that's concerned
and, and are you seeing it
Christian: many, uh,
stories of bio banding.
Matt: Yeah,
Christian: I mean, it's, it's really,
I think it's, I think it's, when used
properly it's a really fantastic thing.
We don't take big kids and, and play
'em down for a competitive advantage.
That's not what we do.
And you can probably get away with it.
And some clubs try and do,
but that's not what we do.
What we try to do is truly kids that,
you know, are good players but need
a little bit of time to either grow
physically or need to become one of
the better players on the younger team
to, you know, boost their confidence.
Um, and we've seen that work
really well and uh, and you know,
we've been pretty successful at,
and sometimes we miss, right?
Sometimes it doesn't work, right?
So that's been a really good division
for kids that are really, really
good, good players, but need a little
time to physically develop as well.
Matt: Yeah.
Liron: I mean, it wouldn't be
a uh, chasing the game episode
without talking about parents and
pressure and parents involvement.
Region like New York, new
Yorkers are demanding.
We're spoiled for choice
as we covered here.
Do you find that there is a, a certain
quality of parent involvement and
pressure within your club and then how
do you deal with it as an organization?
Christian: Look, I'm blessed.
I don't have my phone ringing
all the time about issues, right?
Because we've kind of set the tone about.
Correcting versus being critical.
I think that's been a massive
thing that we've changed.
That's kind of probably slashed 70% of
calls regarding coach behavior maybe more.
Matt: Incredible.
Christian: And so what we spend our time
doing is kind of counseling families
on, hey, like this is what's going on.
Maybe that's, this is why
your, your player's not
playing as much as you'd like.
Or the conversation turns to, Hey,
if we think that your player would
get more playing time, it'd be more
beneficial for them to play on MLS
two or Aspire in the girls case.
Right.
So those are the type of conversations
that we're having more than
nobody's talking to us or like
we're unhappy with A, B, and c. Now
my directors are more frontline.
They may have a different take on it, but
I not, not so much to be, I'll be honest.
'cause we meet all the time and
you know, I hear the level of like,
what's going on on a daily basis.
You know, again, like, like I said,
most of the things we talk about
are more related to playing time.
And like where they're at in the
team versus, hey, like, this coach
did this, this, this and this to
my son or daughter or whatever.
Liron: Can you give a concrete example,
what that switch made in a way, how was
that report before you made the switch
to what you call correction to what it is
now?
Christian: It's about, It's about
creating more confident players, right?
Like we had a summer where we really like
reflected and said like, you know, we're.
We're losing ourselves as coaches,
you know, we're letting our
frustration get the better of us.
And our players aren't
performing because of it.
So we had to really take a
hard look in the mirror, right?
Including myself as the leader of
the club and say, you know what?
Like, I have to change and then
everybody else is gonna change, right?
So I went from like being like
ultra, like ultra intense,
but at times negative, right?
And letting frustrations at
times get the better of me.
And saying, you know what?
I, this isn't working anymore.
Not in a like, terrible way or like a
negative way, but it was giving the green
light to other coaches to maybe take it
further than I was, let's just say, right?
You know, coaches will feed
off of the leader, right?
So I knew that if we're gonna make
a change, it had to start with me.
So that was the pivotal moment.
Right.
And you know, in consultation with,
you know, our, our board, you know, we
talked a lot about it, you know, like,
um, our chairman Stephen Fel, we, we
talked about some of the things that we
could change and we, you know, the root
of it was building confidence in players.
And it was good for us, right?
And it's been good for us.
And now the culture is correct.
Before you critique just correct.
Just stick to that, stick to the
facts and there'll be no trouble.
You know, that's been our approach
and it's been really good for us.
Yeah.
Liron: Is there like a built in
hierarchy within the club for a
parent to come with questions,
Christian: we have a
management team, right?
And the management team runs the
club on a daily basis, right?
And we meet a couple times a week.
And we have, I'm the academy director.
We have a boys director,
we have a girls director.
We have a zone one director,
overall zone one director zone.
One's like the young kids U 12 and under.
And under the zone one director,
we have a zone one boys assistant
director, a zone one girls director.
And then we have scouting, and recruiting.
And that's, and then we have
finance within that, right?
And then we have a board member that comes
in and helps us as well, and guide us.
And so that's our management
team and that's our hierarchy.
So parents can reach out to
any one of those people if
they need to talk to somebody.
Now, sometimes, you know,
they may not know, right?
But they'll start with their
coach or whatever, and then
they'll go to their director.
If they're getting satisfaction,
but most of the time it's a
coach, parent type of situation.
You know, if there's any
concerns or whatever.
Matt: Great.
I just wanted to shift gears a little
bit to the college landscape and
how you as a club, you, I'm sure as
an academy director, you get pretty
involved with with college coaches,
both on the boys and the girls side.
Also, how is it evolving in this
country, as far as division one, soccer,
division three, soccer, division two,
whatever it may be, and of your kids
who come through the system play with
you through U 19, how many of them are
going on each year as a percentage to
play in college at one of those levels?
Christian: So on the growth side it's
the girls and boys are different.
That's what I'll start off by saying.
You know, the girls have
done a great job of placing.
All their players most consistently.
You know, I would say 90 plus percent
of the girls, most of the girls that
wanna play end up playing, let's
just say somewhere, whether that be a
division one, two, or three school right.
Depending on, you know, making
sure that their academic needs or
match for their sporting needs.
On the boy side, it's just
changed so dramatically.
COVID and the advent of the portal
has really hurt incoming freshmen.
Matt: And we talk a lot
about international too.
Yep.
Christian: So it's absolutely
killed the American freshman player.
So what a lot of players have
to do, is start somewhere,
maybe somewhere where they'd be
overqualified for in the past, maybe.
Just 'cause there's so
many more players, right?
There's just too many players
at the moment in the system.
And then they have to do well
there and then look to transfer.
Now.
You did a really good job last
year of placing most of our players
that wanted to go and play college.
This year we've had a
little bit of a drop off.
But that's because some kids like
aren't academically qualified or
you know, there's just a variety of
reasons why kids don't go play college.
But well we've, we had our fair share
of kids that we, we placed this year.
Matt: Does something need as far
as the international players coming
in, I mean, one, we're creating a
much more competitive environment
in colleges, which is great.
Hopefully they'll change the season
and have it actually reflect a proper
season as opposed to two and a half
months in fall, which is insane.
That still exists that way.
But do they need, what's your feeling
on, or what's your, do they need
to create some sort of cap around
international players coming into
US universities to help with the
American player continued development?
Christian: Oh goodness.
I don't know if a cap's
the right thing to do.
I hate putting restrictions on
player movement and things like that.
Matt: Yeah.
Christian: But, you know, I just think
as, just from a, like a university
philosophical standpoint, right?
I think universities should really look
in the mirror and say, what are we doing?
what do like, what's our mission?
Is our mission to like educate
American kids or like the world, right?
Like, and same goes for like
their athletic programs.
What are we here to do?
And listen, it's one thing to
like recruit a couple of players
from abroad, but like when I hear
you have 25 players from abroad.
I mean, I, I think that's, that's a lot.
There's a lot of players here.
I, why are we doing that?
Matt: We had on an assistant
coach from a top 20 division
one school a few weeks ago.
Tom Bowen, who's the Long Island
Soccer Club Academy director.
And, uh, you know, before we got on
the pod, we were scrolling through
his roster and the top, the first 10
players alphabetically were from abroad.
And, you know, look, I thought
his explanation was pretty
solid, which is, you know, one.
Not every kid wants to come to Hofstra,
that we would love to come to Hofstra.
So in some cases we're forced to go
international or to the portal for sure.
Which is a whole other story.
So the other thing is we get,
we've got a kid, a center back
who's 25 years old who played a
hundred games in Serie C in Italy.
Why are we saying no to that, right?
Like he's a, like, he's
a proven commodity.
Who's gonna change the impact of our team?
Christian: So that, that's
exactly like the change.
You know, players that are like, you
know, is it an, is it a league for
18 to 22 year olds or is it you know,
does it matter how old people are?
You know, NCA has to answer all these
questions and the whole transferring
easily, like, is really, really bad.
Matt: uh, I think so.
Too tough to build it.
I mean, tough to build a team with
continuity and, and actually focus on
developing and winning in year to year.
It changes.
70% of your team turns over.
Christian: Yeah.
Really difficult.
Liron: You have like a, obviously
you guys are so knowledgeable.
Do you have a, like a school counselor,
but do you have a place within the team
so parents and families can consult
internally and to help guide families?
Christian: Yeah.
We have, we have somebody that within
the club on the boys and girls side,
that helps coordinate, gives information
prepares the families for the recruiting
process, is there to answer questions,
at times, you know, talks to coaches,
on their behalf to say, Hey, like
they're interested in your school.
It's an interesting, you know, the
whole college recruiting process is so
misunderstood, you know, from parents
and they think that directors, coaches
can pick up the phone and call one
of their friends and just place it.
Like, that's just not
how it works, you know?
And we, you know, the coaches have
to see it for themselves, right?
Like if the college coach has to
see the benefit of that player or
else it's never gonna work, even if.
Matt: They're, they've got a job.
They've gotta win, right?
Like the development goes by the wayside
in college and your job is to win.
Christian: Yeah.
So there's, you know, there's a lot
of services that have popped up.
There's a lot of, you know, there's
just some misconception amongst
families that say you know, all, you
know, if you're well connected, like
that's all that needs to happen is like
the coach just needs to make a call.
That's not the case.
That the recruiting dy of the
recruiting process is dynamic.
It's multifaceted.
It's, you know, it's a process
that, you know, kids have to go
through and take the appropriate
steps and market themselves really.
Matt: What, what do you
think about the talent IDs?
There seem, they, there seem
to be thousands of them.
And, uh, and, and in different varieties.
Where are kids?
Are kids getting Yeah.
For colleges, are kids
getting, are they beneficial?
I mean, are they're, they're different.
I'm sure some are more
beneficial than others.
How much of it is being ID at
Next Fest, for example, versus
their ongoing, like, what's, what
It look like?
Christian: So I can only give
you my take on it, and just
from watching what goes on.
Right.
You know what I notice?
Where it goes wrong is like kids,
they'll never have a chance.
Let's say we have a kid on our
seventeenths or nineteens that's
like good player, but like he's not
ready for Indiana, let's say, and
they'll go to Indiana, for their camp.
There's just no chance that
player's being recruited by
And I know it, and I, I don't wanna say
anything because it's like, just because
I don't wanna say like, you're wasting
your money, but it's wasting his money
because they've already recruited somebody
or they already have somebody or, and if,
if you haven't already been contacted by
them or you're not on the youth national
teams, like it's gonna be hard for you.
a lot of times their sporting
ambition doesn't match their ability.
And they might be good players,
they might be good enough to play,
but the coach doesn't come to watch
Matt: Right.
Christian: or they may just
be dismissive right away.
So that, I see that.
Liron: Matt, what a future
awaits us in in chasing the game
season six, seven, and eight.
Director, I want to
thank you for your time.
I know you're incredibly busy.
Sunday for you is a full workday.
I could hear the pings
on the phone nonstop.
And this would, this is, uh, I, I give
us a badge of honor that we've, uh,
managed to complete this interview without
talking about supplementary training.
So
Christian: Yeah,
Liron: a massive success for us.
Christian: guys,
Liron: yeah, those guys, this is how,
actually we're gonna, we're gonna
end the interview saying those guys,
Christian: You know, it's if
there Instagram, there wouldn't
be those guys, you know?
Liron: There wouldn't be those guys.
I mean, we're also baffled.
Trust me, the every episode
we just learn more and more.
But you guys are doing incredible work
and I just want to throw a huge shout
out to coach jp, uh, which is, I know is
one of your coaches Christopher Moraya.
Yeah.
And, uh, one of, one of your kids,
Lincoln Kai Moraya, who have his
dad arranged this interview for us.
So, um, and he's a big fan of the pod.
Christian: Thank you I appreciate it,
I want to say wow, but I'm
a little nervousous that Director Gonzalez
is going to correct me on how to say it.
So I'm just not going to do that now.
This conversation takes me back to one word, and it's not wow.
It's clarity, not branding, not some broad
language..
At one point, Christian says, we strive for clarity.
I can't stress that enough.
It's the only way kids learn and develop by how having clear messages
Then he adds to that, if you have a lot of general practice,
you're going to get a lot of general outcomes.
That really gets to the heart of what families are trying to figure out.
And for me, the other line that really matters is correcting
versus being critical, that one principle
has changed everything for us, because
that is not some small wording change.
That is culture, that is coach behavior, that is player confidence
That is whether feedback actually helps a kid improve or slowly
shuts them down.
And when he connects that to the fact that it slashes 70% of
calls regarding coach behavior, you
calls regarding coach behavior, you
realize this stuff is not abstract.
It changes the experience for players, coaches, and parents.
Yeah, yeah, you know, and I think this is why this episode matters beyond
one club, as you and I have discussed, because families have to
make decisions for all kinds of reasons.
We talked about geography, level of play, opportunity,
and where their kid fits in.
But underneath all of it, the deeper question is still the same.
Is this environment clear?
How's the communication?
Is it thoughtful?
Is it helping my child improve?
Or is it just saying the right things?
you enjoyed this one, send it to another soccer parent, coach
or club leader, who thinks seriously about player development
in club culture.
And if this brought up something that you've experienced in your own club environment,
we'd love to hear from you.
And if by now you haven't sent it to people you
know or care about, then you know what?
You know, still do it, please.
Yeah, no, but still do it, yeah.
shame.
I'm sorry.
I apologize.
I still do it.
Thanks for listening, everybody.
Thanks for sharing the show
And thanks for chasing the game with us, Bye Matt.
Bye Liron