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If you're the first to exploit a new opportunity, your advantage will only get bigger over time.
So, is there an exploit you can take advantage of? Find out in the episode.
So, is there an exploit you can take advantage of? Find out in the episode.
This episode is brought to you by by Everstage - the highest rated Sales Commissions Platform on G2, Gartner Peer Insights, Trustradius with over 2,000+ customer reviews. Some of their customers include leading brands like Diligent, Wiley, Trimble, Postman, Chargebee etc.,
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Creators & Guests
What is The Revenue Formula?
This podcast is about scaling tech startups.
Hosted by Toni Hohlbein & Mikkel Plaehn, together they look at the full funnel.
With a combined 20 years of experience in B2B SaaS and 3 exits, they discuss growing pains, challenges and opportunities they’ve faced. Whether you're working in RevOps, sales, operations, finance or marketing - if you care about revenue, you'll care about this podcast.
If there’s one thing they hate, it’s talk. We know, it’s a bit of an oxymoron. But execution and focus is the key - that’s why each episode is designed to give 1-2 very concrete takeaways.
[00:00:00] Toni: Hey everyone, this is Toni Hohlbein. You are listening to the revenue formula with Mikkel and Toni.
[00:00:06] In today's episode, we are talking about the zero day exploit your go to market teams should be taking advantage of right now. Right now. Enjoy.
[00:00:17] Before we jump into the show, today's is to you by EverStage, the top sales commissions platform on G2, Gartner, Peer Insights,
[00:00:27] and Trust Radius with more 2000 reviews from customers like Diligent, Wiley,
[00:00:33] Trimble, and more.
[00:00:34] Visit everstage. com and mention Revenue Formula unlock a personalized sales compensation strategy session with one of EverStage's RevOps experts.
[00:00:46] And now, enjoy the show,
[00:00:47] Mikkel: Welcome to the revenue formula today.
[00:00:49] I'm joined by a guy who was lied to by artificial intelligence.
[00:00:53] Welcome, Toni.
[00:00:54] Toni: Yeah, that's right. I was like so proud of myself. I, you know, we're kind of doing this new setup. I took a picture of my outlets of the camera and I circled them. So I kind of said like, Hey, GPG, tell me about this area here. And it's like, can you tell me what those outlets are? And there are only three outlets.
[00:01:15] And this should have been my first clue. It gave me four answers. That should have been my first clue that something is off. But the first one, the tricky thing is the one that I knew what it was, it got right. You know, and then I was like, ah, this is right. I'm probably the other thing is right too. And turns out, no, was not the case. So basically I took a picture of the outlets and it told me like, Hey, this is a micro USB.
[00:01:45] This is like a headphone jack. And this is like a mini HDMI. Turns out I ordered a mini HDMI. I tried to plug it into it. It wasn't mini enough. So it turns out there's a micro version of this thing. And that's the one that I had to go for. It will be here tomorrow, but that's exactly one day too late.
[00:02:04] Mikkel: Yeah, I mean, you can always file a complaint to the AI HR department about your AI coworker. That's
[00:02:12] totally legitimate these
[00:02:13] Toni: No, I'll go back into the chat and
[00:02:14] just
[00:02:15] downvote, like thumbs down.
[00:02:17] Mikkel: their next prompt is going to be really passive aggressive. So you didn't get the last one, right? Let's see if you do better
[00:02:24] now.
[00:02:24] Toni: What can you get right? You know? Yes,
[00:02:31] Mikkel: more and more time on this AI thing. We've kind of called ourselves for a while now. , Grandfathers, old men uh, in this whole AI game. And it's kind of been like. I think a bit of a journey. I shared it with you the other day. I found a website with.
[00:02:46] Really sophisticated prompts that I had, you know, I had to ask ChatGPT to explain to me what is COT, Chain of Thought Prompting? What is Meta Prompting? There's all kinds of crazy things. And this is just like, you realize we're just the end consumers of a product that is just way more complex in the backend, which is just even more crazy to think about.
[00:03:06] Anyway, what we're going to talk about today, I guess, is one little, Yako dropped in our episode, probably I think last week, it's called the zero day exploit, and we're not talking about the vulnerability of a software and then you can exploit it. That's not that that's not what we were referring to
[00:03:27] Toni: maybe, maybe we are, maybe we are. Let it, let it, let it be up to the listener to decide,
[00:03:33] Mikkel: send us your password and private email and we'll get back to you. No we're going to talk a bit about zero day exploit, which is really something AI is creating heavily at the moment,
[00:03:42] isn't
[00:03:42] it?
[00:03:43] Toni: And so, and the, the thing about this is you know, when you think about this, you know, maybe it makes sense to explain it actually with this, with this hacker analogy here basically what sometimes happens is that someone finds a vulnerability in a piece of software and that vulnerability can be exploited.
[00:04:02] Until it's being patched and fixed away. Right. But usually the time between finding it and that being patched, not that much time in between. So really that crucial, you know, time before it's getting fixed, exploiting that window of opportunity, that's called the zero day exploit, basically. And in hacker terms, obviously something negative.
[00:04:23] So you shouldn't be doing this, obviously. But in go to market. And we're not going to talk about growth hacking, by the way, but in go to market there's a similar concept actually behind this. And I think this is what we want to peel back the onion a little bit. I think we're going to go back a little bit in time and actually say like, folks, you know, Mikkel and I were presenting us something new.
[00:04:41] It's not that super new, actually, it's been around for a while, but let's look about, you know, what is it, what is it we can learn from, from that you know, and really try and adapt this into the future.
[00:04:51] Mikkel: I mean, I have a really fun analogy. It's kind of intro material,
[00:04:54] though, so I feel like we're
[00:04:56] Toni: It's about kids.
[00:04:57] Mikkel: It's about No, no, no, not this time around, though. Not this time around. It's, it's a little bit regressing in the episode, but I kind of have to do it, though. So I think in my family we have something called the zero hour exploit, which is You know how when you go to a family party, and you drive there Someone has to be the designated driver.
[00:05:14] And quite often, you know, my uncle and his wife, they won't really talk about who's going to be the designated driver. So his trick is when he gets there, he just has two glasses of wine within, you know, the first hour. And then they look at each other. He goes like, well, I can't drive now. Decided,
[00:05:30] decided.
[00:05:31] Toni: think that makes absolute sense with what we're going to talk about today.
[00:05:34] Mikkel: Yeah, exactly. It's a wonderful, wonderful thing.
[00:05:36] No, I think, so let's look a bit back at what are some of the major At least events that happened while you and I have been working professionally, I think let's, let's put it at kind of that marker because we're kind of, I think started working the same time, we're the same age.
[00:05:51] And one of the first thing I noticed as a massive opportunity and a massive change was e commerce. That was really, really big. My
[00:05:58] Toni: the way, you're starting to talk about stuff that happens in 1999, 2000 and so forth. I don't think you and I have been working professionally back then. I think we've been professionally trying to avoid school at that point, but otherwise I don't think you can call it
[00:06:12] working.
[00:06:13] Mikkel: well, maybe for you then, but I ran a business back then. So,
[00:06:18] you know, we can
[00:06:19] Toni: What, you were in a business when you were 12 years old?
[00:06:22] Mikkel: not 12, what are you talking about? It's 2000 and
[00:06:26] uh, 2008 uh, I'm talking about, but anyway, so e commerce, let's get back to the subject here, e commerce, that was like the, one of the first big things I noticed and sure it started before 08, I don't know exactly when it started, but I recall vividly how there were lots of stores resisting to do e commerce, like not believing in this fad of e com and even the internet still, right.
[00:06:52] Unbelievable when you think about where we are today, just. Unbelievable. But I remember conversations like, Oh yeah, the internet, you can only sell cheap stuff there. You can't sell like some, like who's going to swipe a credit card and trust someone with 10, 000 kroner. And I was like, well. You do it in a store, don't you?
[00:07:12] It's like, so,
[00:07:13] so, but that was
[00:07:14] Toni: But hey, on the internet, they're only criminals,
[00:07:16] right? No, true. And by the way, one not so small company coming out starting as an e commerce company, Shopify selling snowboards, just saying that's, you know, very different trajectory, but I think what I noticed was there were a lot of companies who then made it really big.
[00:07:32] Mikkel: By starting doing e comm before anyone else. So why is it they get such a massive you know, I would say outsized advantage compared to everyone else. Why is that happening?
[00:07:42] Toni: Yeah. And to a degree, and maybe you know more about this actually, kind of, let me start and you maybe kind of correct me where, where I got it wrong, but to a degree, you know, obviously accessibility availability was easier with the internet and e commerce, right? You, you had someone like Amazon being able to.
[00:08:00] Have all the books available, not just the top 20 percent books that fit it into a top 10 percent or 5 percent books that fit into a bookstore, but all of them is kind of the whole long tail. I think that was kind of a persuasive offer. I think though the way they won and a couple of others was basically also in tandem with this whole, Google thing that happened, right.
[00:08:24] Kind of at the same time. And we are really talking about, I guess you would call it now SEO, SEM and really the, you know, the, the issue of a consumer going on Google, looking for something, and then consistently always hitting Amazon as the first choice. Right. And, you know, to a degree, the reason why we would kind of call this a zero day exploit and it's been longer than just, you know, a day, obviously, but to a degree, the reason why this is a zero day exploit is because by now, search engine optimizing has gotten a lot more complicated, a lot more competitive, way more expensive than it used to be.
[00:09:03] But in the super early days, this basically created a very nice trajectory for those e commerce businesses. To jump on this. And you know what, back then, you know, when, you know, this was, you know, it was obviously still in Germany and kind of Rocket Internet and Groupon, kind of all of those things that came out of that business they were going, going heavily into this SEO game.
[00:09:24] And I totally didn't get this. It's like, you know, why, why would you do this? Why would you spend so much money? They even got into lawsuits because some people were like, Backlink spoofing or whatever it was. I mean, there was a whole industry around this, right? And that gave them such a massive advantage in growing extremely fast.
[00:09:43] Extremely cheaply, right? And that zero day exploit has been now exploited to a degree. So all of these things have been priced in now. Everyone knows about this now. And and this, this level, you know, this, this playing field has been leveled. There's not just one or a few parties that have a lot of knowledge about this that can exploit it anymore.
[00:10:02] It's like everyone knows this now.
[00:10:04] Mikkel: Yeah. I think also a couple of points here. If, if we just stick with e commerce for a second You have to realize that some of the first e com stores that really made it big was clothing. Massive industry. Why is that? Well, at least for the male part of our audience, the shopping experience of clothing, at least on my part I can say, don't like it.
[00:10:26] Don't like it. What would happen to me is I would go into the store men would get one floor, women would get four, and sometimes you would share a floor with female. You got, I would get uncertain. Is this now the ladies or the men's department? Right? So it was just terrible, honestly. Now you could actually sit on your laptop and browse.
[00:10:44] So there was kind of utility for, for the, for the, you know, the buyers, the consumers at the end of the day, right? The other thing is when this started, the internet was still being implemented and growing. Like you didn't, you didn't initially have e comm on the phone. Right. You didn't have a smartphone initially, to be honest, to be frank.
[00:11:03] Right. So that wasn't there. You also had all these potential open source systems coming along. So the whole infrastructure part of how do you set up the store, meaning how many stores are even available, right? And then think about fulfillment, which is a point where Amazon also did incredibly well building out fulfillment centers, initially doing it on the back of, I think they probably almost invented the dropshipping thing by getting retailers onto their platform and then slowly swallowing the whole thing.
[00:11:31] Right. So I think a lot of things have been moving where initially it, it wasn't a great experience. And if you contrast that to AI today, it's like, well, we need to figure How do we tackle returns? How do we tackle fulfillment? How do we tackle the e comm
[00:11:45] setup? Now, the
[00:11:47] Toni: the whole
[00:11:47] Mikkel: you get yeah, the whole value chain, the reason you get the advantage, got the advantage in e comm among others was.
[00:11:54] The search rankings to your point, the customer database, highly valuable. If I go and buy clothes, on your web shop or e commerce store, chances are, I'm going to come back. Right. So there were a couple of points there also just the sheer amount of learning on how should you visualize and present the product?
[00:12:12] How should you charge? How should you like conversion rate optimization, all that stuff. So there were a bunch of, a bunch of other elements there. And
[00:12:18] um,
[00:12:19] there, there are a couple of points where if you're the first to build out this massive infrastructure of inventory, fulfillment acquisition, well, then you have just a massively unfair advantage.
[00:12:31] Toni: Uh, some people might've already tuned out by now, but moving on to I think at least for us, the next big thing, the next innovation around this was actually SaaS. Like I still remember a time where when we were pitching to VCs that our delivery method would be SaaS. They were like, What is this even? And can this even work? And would people even do something?
[00:12:56] And,
[00:12:57] Mikkel: You mean the airline SAS?
[00:12:59] Toni: and are people honestly gonna pay you 15, 000 to 20, 000 for something that they have just in their, in their, in their browser? Like, that's super weird. This, this was true in 2012 in Europe.
[00:13:09] Right. You can say it probably was a bit more entrenched in the U S already at that point because of Salesforce, obviously kind of, they've been creating this category, but it's, you know, what, what basically then happened over the next 10 years is not only that every new company, Was by default a SaaS company because it's just so much easier to deliver your service.
[00:13:33] Right. And, you know, don't need to send the CD ROM. You don't need to kind of have all the privacy, the piracy protections and so forth on it. But what also happened is that basically every software company started to transition to become a SaaS company. Right. So you, I still remember, what is it? Only four or five, six years ago or something, Adobe.
[00:13:53] Making the big jump from, Hey, you kind of buy peers, I don't know, 5. 0 or whatever the, the, the thing was to, Oh, actually doing a subscription now. And that was a massive change. Same for SAP was a massive change for them. And they were basically kind of late to the party to a degree. Right. And the first the, the, the zero day exploit here really is that, Oh, wow.
[00:14:17] I don't need to pay a bunch of money up front. You know, the software is getting better and better every time I log in. And it's super easy for a company to just keep scaling throughout this, right? So the, the SaaS piece by itself, that delivery method jumping on this early, and then having, driving a radically different experience for the user.
[00:14:38] That was to a degree also a zero day exploit, right? With all its little kind of issues in the beginning, just like with e commerce. And when you think about when you think about the technology stack that needs to be developed in order to do the whole SaaS thing, right? So in the beginning kind of bought servers from Sun Microsystems and later you just did it from AWS and from Google cloud and so forth and all the other things that we don't have any clue about.
[00:15:04] All of, all of this vertical integration basically kind of happened with all the different vendors creating kind of one building block on top of the other, making it extremely easy, right? When we spun up Growblocks in 2020, I mean, basically everything was already built there in order to achieve this, right?
[00:15:21] But that in the very early beginning is really difficult to do becomes a. Reason why people don't want to change over and switch over because they need to do the whole vertical integration themselves. They don't have the, the plug and play building blocks in place. But if you are able to do it, if you're kind of able to jump over those things, then actually kind of the benefit of being able to deliver in this case, a SaaS experience super early on, that might actually kind of be something very, very different for you and your customers.
[00:15:48] Mikkel: Yeah. I think the interesting piece is also it really transform, transforms how you're doing things, quite frankly, right. It's a, it's a big shift. All of a sudden having an e commerce store or running a SaaS business compared to on prem or something else, right. It's a, it's a massive shift quite frankly.
[00:16:05] So I, I think that's, that's just for me also super interesting. I, I want to double back to just one thing. Which is just the simplest and clearest way to portray the zero day exploit. We talked a little bit about it with Google Ads, actually. This is, and large, how Amazon made it big, I, in my opinion, at least, other than yes, having the inventory and fulfillment, all that boring stuff taken care of, they quickly realized that folks are searching and they can be present.
[00:16:35] So it was just like, that was their flywheel, just more and more money into this thing, reinvesting and uh, outgrew everyone else in, in the process, right? A few really big. Book chains in uh, United States died uh, as a
[00:16:48] consequence. Yeah,
[00:16:50] Toni: Who's Barnes and Nobles? I don't know.
[00:16:51] Never heard
[00:16:51] Mikkel: And who's gonna die from whoever is gonna exploit this uh, massive shift now is really the
[00:16:57] question.
[00:16:58] Toni: I think, so kind of, we talked about this whole very theoretical high in the sky or e commerce overall and our SaaS overall, you went now into a search engine management, basically kind of buying Google ads. I want to go into a particular revenue, Aaron Ross, kind of this whole SDR model that was in the beginning, like that, that was just much more efficient, much better, much easier.
[00:17:24] Then it is now. I saw on, on LinkedIn a post today from one of those SDR agencies proudly promising, you know, five, five held meetings a month per SDR. And I'm like, wow, Jesus, we're down to five now. You know, when, when we started doing this um, what is it? 2012, 13, 14, something like this.
[00:17:49] Mikkel: around that time.
[00:17:50] Toni: We've had, you know, 15 health meetings, 16 health meetings where they're all super qualified.
[00:17:54] I don't know, maybe not, but just kind of the sheer amount. Then when we lost left Brandwatch, I think they were around still 10 or 11, like 10 in the US, 11 in EMEA. I think they're now down to what this number was on LinkedIn, right? So you can clearly see how this is working less and less and less and less and less well.
[00:18:11] And that is simply an, you know, a function of when you have a new thing like this, when you have a new exploit in the market, then you can just, Oh, this is working out. And the more people that are going to do it, the less it's going to work out. You know, that's basically kind of what you should be cracking open and trying out.
[00:18:29] Right. Because if something is working, I can promise you, eventually everyone will be doing it. Right.
[00:18:35] Mikkel: I think it's like uh, I don't, I think this was it's Charlie Munger who's like when the odds are in your favor.
[00:18:42] Bet heavily, bet heavily. And I think, I mean, by the way, if you follow, follow Berkshire Hathaway, then you know, you can probably see that pattern. Then they get kind of greedy, right? They invest as much as they can when they see something on their stone.
[00:18:57] And that's the point here as well. I think you, at some point, if you know, it's working, do you just lean in a little bit or do you bet heavily? And yeah, I think you've got to bet. You've got to bet really heavily
[00:19:07] on
[00:19:07] Toni: And so, Mikkel, why are we talking about all of this past stuff?
[00:19:11] Mikkel: Ugh. Yeah.
[00:19:12] Why?
[00:19:13] Toni: So the, the thing is and this is, I think, what almost the point is of this episode is actually to kind of try and make it clear to everyone, all of the things that we're now taking for granted, there's like, obviously. Obviously this had to be done.
[00:19:29] When those things came around, not only were there a bunch of doubters and like people like, oh, it's not going to work out. Not only were there a bunch of things that need to be built again, like back then you still need to go to some microsystems to actually physically buy servers. You need to put them in a rack somewhere in your, you know, bedroom.
[00:19:48] You know, run the whole thing and so many other things that I don't have any clue about, but that's what you had to do if you wanted to run this kind of business. And it worked out extremely well for some of the first companies jumping on this and doing this. And the reason why I'm saying this is there is a very high likelihood that something like this is happening with, with AI right now.
[00:20:09] Like it's a very high likelihood. If you just kind of look back into the past. I think there's a high likelihood that something similar is going on right now. And yes, I don't, I wouldn't say that anyone has reached obvious stage yet. But, you know, just want to say this one more time. I don't think in AI we have reached the stage yet where everyone is, obviously those are the two things you do with AI and you know, it's proven now and you can scale through this and it's fantastic, especially for the go to market, right?
[00:20:39] You have a couple of examples. Like the AI, SDR stuff. I'm not sure if this is a great thing. To me, it's starting to feel more like an intelligent Marketo actually than anything else, but you know what? That doesn't matter. Like, you know, it doesn't actually matter. I'm sure there are some companies where it absolutely works out.
[00:20:58] And then there are some companies where it absolutely does not work out, right? You have teams like Copy. ai and Writer that have, you know, however they're positioning, but what they're doing is they're helping content creation to get easier, which I think is an absolutely great application of AI because that's what it's really good at.
[00:21:15] It can write really great text, right? And then there are a couple of other examples out there, right? It's not about going through all of these pieces here. I think the, the main thing, the main awareness I want to or we want to try and build with folks is like, You should probably be trying out, testing out, experimenting with this thing, because the odds of you striking gold here are fairly reasonable.
[00:21:42] And I'm not saying you need to be the absolute first person to do it. You need to be maybe the first person in your market or in your buyer persona to do it. Right. Kind of to try and do this. But in order to get to this point, you need to expose yourself to this technology, you need to try it out and, and to a degree and within reason you can't get discouraged when like, ah, you know, this wiring here doesn't work out and we would need to build something to connect this wiring.
[00:22:08] Yeah. That's, that's how it works out in the early days. And once, once it's proven. Once this is proven that this works out, there will be 10 vendors trying to kind of take care of this one wiring bit that needs to be replaced and then be kind of creating that solution for that PCM, right? But getting to the point where something works, this is currently a little, I don't want to say it's an arms race but it's certainly a you know, who thinks about this properly, who thinks about it deeply enough and who's experimenting and trying out and understanding the technology.
[00:22:41] To ultimately also apply it.
[00:22:42] Mikkel: yeah, I think it also one question, a couple of things in my mind at least is I don't think as a technology it is fully on the bleeding edge anymore. Sure, there was the case with Strawberry and there's cases where it will get things wrong. We are still really early, like really early in, in this journey with AI.
[00:23:04] You have to acknowledge that, right? In one year from now, it's going to be totally different, totally different, right? So that's, that's just one thing. The other is, We can't just compare this to a Google ads, which was the channel that emerged, like search became a thing. For me, this is much more transformative as a technology.
[00:23:23] This is triggering questions like I saw someone on Twitter was like, yeah, as a company, this is a small team, by the way, we've never used the CRM. We just used CAC. We don't need it, but you know what? It would be awesome to have an AI to just help us remember some of the stuff that's happening across all of it.
[00:23:39] We could use like an AI CRM for this stuff and, and, you know, It can start getting a lot more thought provoking than, rather than just the obvious stuff that you're seeing happening now, it's like, well, do we need an inbound SDR to just, you know, for someone has to wait a day for that person to be available and then qualify them and then book them like an AI can probably do that.
[00:23:59] And people will be fine with it. Like probably people will be fine with that. Right. And I think those are going to be the first kind of dominoes to go. And I think Jaco had this example where it's like, well, we couldn't have predicted UberEats. Right. We couldn't have, first you needed Uber and it's the same that's happening now.
[00:24:17] Right. We can't predict where this thing is going to go. But we can say, and probably predict that those companies that are quick to exploit this opportunity, they
[00:24:28] will make it
[00:24:29] Toni: No, absolutely. And I also, I also think the, you know, what is in the way to get there? I think what's in the way is. You don't necessarily need to become a customer of all of those companies we just mentioned. I think what's in the way is actually people starting to understand the technology better. And not from a technical perspective, but from a input output kind of thing.
[00:24:48] Kind of how can you interact with this? You know, what, what are the limitations? What are the things you can do? What are the things you can expect? And, and in order to get to this point, you, you know, you can watch, you know, YouTube videos and, And read blogs and all of that stuff. Or you start using some of those tools, right?
[00:25:04] I think this is one thing. And then the other thing is you mentioned kind of Uber Eats and so why, why are we talking about Uber Eats? Well, you need to invent Uber before you invent Uber Eats, right? And even Uber was super weird. Hey, you call someone, a stranger on your phone, you're jumping to the car.
[00:25:21] Mikkel: the car. Yeah, yeah,
[00:25:22] Toni: And then the, the next iteration of that, which is even weirder, is like you call some stranger on the car. To, you know, carry your food around. How weird is that? I mean, how far have we come? If you think about the e commerce story that we started this conversation with from like, ah, should I really put in my credit card?
[00:25:41] I'm sure it's going to get stolen. I'm sure it's good. You know, to, ah, you know, it's totally fine. You know, this Rando. That just delivers my food for me. Right. And, and the same thing kind of happens right now with AI, at least in the, you know, from, from a go to market perspective, it's like, there are a couple of, we're kind of an iteration one.
[00:25:59] It's like, okay, what, what does an SDR do? Let's just replicate all of that thing, have some AI in place and boom, now it does that. But you know, getting to the Uber Eats thing, you kind of need to think about a couple of more corners. Which is kind of going to be difficult for us, like, honestly, right.
[00:26:16] And I'll give you one example. And this is also an example that Jocko used says this company they're basically trying to create an an AE, like an AI AE basically, right. And they can already do really nice discovery calls and Winning by Design is very proud because they're obviously using their framework and it's fantastic.
[00:26:33] But the thing now that you can do with this is that's basically something you can put behind your book, a demo button, right? And that's, that's just a different, different way of orchestrating and organizing a go to market, right? Instead of clicking on book a demo and filling in a form. You basically can start an immediate live discovery call, like from your bedroom.
[00:26:56] You don't care in the middle of the night, you can have a perfect discovery call. And for the buyer, it's going to be, Oh, great. You know, I can talk to a rep that can actually give me qualified answers, like really well practiced, trained, improved. You know, not, not sourced in BS, not making things up, not like, Oh, let me get back to you on this.
[00:27:16] No, this, this thing will answer these things for you. And for the selling company, you know, this thing will also acquire information and understanding about you, right? It will actually do a discovery call. And when you think about a discovery or call, a good discovery call is like a, you give and you get.
[00:27:31] You, you give some information and then you earn the right to get some information and that works for both parties. Right. And this now can be done without, you know, we had drift with no forms. Sure. Forms gone now. But also the chat is gone. Also kind of waiting for someone to jump on a call and doing that stuff is gone.
[00:27:48] You have it immediately right there, right? That is an Uber moment, like, like in, like in the, the, the car company, not like an Uber mention. This is the Uber moment that kind of happens in the first place. What we cannot figure out yet is what's the Uber Eats moment here, right? Kind of, if this is one of the changes, how, you know, what's the next crazy iteration on top of that, that we don't even get.
[00:28:11] Mikkel: but there's just one, one thing maybe we can end on here, which is so who will succeed? You have to realize when the internet came around, the companies that started let's say an e commerce store. Do you think they were in a better position to exploit Google ads than everyone else who didn't have that?
[00:28:29] Yeah, definitely. They were. So I would look at my team and go. Okay, what are we doing with AI at the moment? Are we even using it? Like, really? Because if this is just zero shot prompting or the I tried getting some titles, but it's so bad, I can only use it for some sparring, right? Or it lies to me or whatever it is, like, if that's the basis of the knowledge I think you're not in a great position.
[00:28:52] But if you've tried, playing with an AI SDR, if you've tried, building a, like a, a really clear process with AI agents to create something internally, whether it's a content or report, just doesn't matter, I think then you start getting that understanding of, okay, this is how the technology works. And once you build up knowledge of a new technology.
[00:29:12] It opens up the amount of opportunities for you to actually implement and use it. Right. So I think you want to make sure as a team and a company that you're positioned to exploit this opportunity as more and more technology gets built, because like we heard the other day from Jaco, there's being thrown government, like money at this, this thing here.
[00:29:32] So it's just a matter of time before, you know, it will truly disrupt some of the things
[00:29:37] we were doing.
[00:29:38] Toni: No.
[00:29:39] And I also think like, if you have found a CEO listening to this, you know, because you're RevOps guy, forwarded this to you this is not about, Ooh, you need to go out and tell your company to create a AI strategy. This is not about that. I think that's silly. What this is about is you need to find ways to encourage your organization to start thinking about this a little bit more proactively.
[00:30:04] And from that thinking, from that experimentation, from those good and bad experiences, you will learn, you will gain insights and you will be able to take the next step. It's not about right now having a big strategy for next 10 years to fit. You know, I don't know, maybe this works out in your, in your, in your software, in your product.
[00:30:22] I doubt that, but I think the main thing you need to do right now is try and Get some of the resistance and maybe there's another topic we should be kind of having a conversation about at some other point, but some of the resistance out there that is in, in companies to, to this change, there's, there are stats that say that developed countries, uh, increasingly so skeptical about AI you know, vice versa, you know, like not so developed countries that are seeing this actually as a great thing for them and, and really kind of, Think about how can you kind of reduce that resisting resistance to change?
[00:30:58] How can you reduce the skepticism? How can you reduce the like, Oh, I tried one prompt and gave me the wrong answer. This is a shit technology. How can you, how can you try and push against that? Because only, you know, I don't want to make it a big culture thing, but only once the culture, you know, opens up a little bit, wants to explore that that's where some of the cool stuff is happening.
[00:31:17] Right. And, and I think if any, if we say anything today. That is, I think, the direction you should be, you know, moving your go to market, your company, your team towards is like. Let's try this thing out. Let's give it more than just one go. Let's find more ways to implement this. And maybe from that comes something that's kind of game changing.
[00:31:37] That's a zero day exploit worthy kind of thing. And we can go full throttle.
[00:31:42] Mikkel: So I did a zero shot prompt before we
[00:31:46] recorded
[00:31:47] Toni: By the way, what is that? People don't know what a zero,
[00:31:49] you learned it. Yes. And you know, a minute and And now I'm, I'm so smart now because I learned it yesterday and now it's a thing. Zero shot prompt is you ask just one simple question just to get one answer back. That's it, right? So I asked it how can we improve the show?
[00:32:05] Mikkel: And
[00:32:06] Toni: It's like only have Toni speak.
[00:32:07] Oh, sorry.
[00:32:08] Mikkel: no, no, no, make sure to ask folks to like, share, and subscribe. So make sure to hit those buttons if you haven't already. Toni, thanks so much
[00:32:20] Toni: thank you so much Mikkel for, for the show today. Hope, hope everyone else who kind of, this was good. And otherwise Mikkel, thanks, man. Have a good day and everyone else. Cheers.