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Ski Utah's new Last Chair will take you inside Utah's resorts for the story behind the Greatest Snow on Earth®. In a weekly series of audio features, host Tom Kelly will bring you behind the scenes with resort leaders, athletes and fascinating figures who are the stories inside Utah skiing and snowboarding. Whether you're a passionate local snow rider, or a guest to the Utah mountain landscape, you'll learn about mountain life through the stories of the men and women who shape the Ski Utah experience. Each Last Chair episode is 30-40 minutes, with insightful questions and fun anecdotal facts. As a career communicator, Kelly weaves stories with ease bringing listeners inside the mountain tales of Utah skiing and snowboarding.
S7 Ep6 - skijoring - TRANSCRIPT
[00:00:00] Tom Kelly: Joe Loveridge and Brian Gardner. Welcome to High West. Great to have you here in the studio today. We're going to talk about skijoring.
[00:00:06] Joe Loveridge: Sounds good.
[00:00:08] Tom Kelly: Yeah. That's it. That's your life now, right?
[00:00:10] Joe Loveridge: It feels like it. Yeah, yeah.
[00:00:12] Brian Gardner: Yeah, especially this time of year.
[00:00:13] Tom Kelly: We're going to talk about what's coming up with skijoring in Utah. But before we really dive into that, you guys are both skiers. You're both horsemen. What is skijoring? How does it bring all of this together? You want to kick it off? Brian, you look like you're ready.
[00:00:29] Brian Gardner: Well, hey, you know, skijoring is, uh. It's to us. It's something very, very dear to our hearts. We both have, you know, long family roots and ranching and farming and horses and that type of thing. And, we both grew up skiing. We were ski patrolmen at Sundance Resort for 9 or 10 years and, avid skiers and we'd seen the sport in other states and, and it just to us, it felt like the perfect fit for Utah, and it hadn't really been done in Utah before. And, so, we, in 2017, we said we need to give this a try, and we essentially kind of reached out to our ski buddies and reached out to our horse buddies and said, hey, let's all meet up over at Soldier Hollow and give this a roll. And that was … this will be our 10th year. And so that's kind of how it was born in Utah.
[00:01:21] Tom Kelly: That's amazing. Let's let's go back even further in the roots of it. And, you know, maybe, Joe, you could give us an idea of its horses pulling skiers. Okay. Really basic. But what are some of the heritage roots of skijoring?
[00:01:36] Joe Loveridge: So it comes from the European countries up north. Norway. Norway. Sweden. Those locations. And they used it for a mode of transportation during is driving. And so they would hook up horses, dogs, reindeer. And they'd use it as a mode of transportation to get from place to place.
[00:01:55] Tom Kelly: And somewhere along the line, like everything like that. It turned into a bit of a competition, right?
[00:02:01] Joe Loveridge: Right. Yeah. You can imagine, maybe two guys thinking they had the fastest reindeer horse or whatever, and maybe started racing. Who knows? Right.
[00:02:09] Tom Kelly: And you're using horses, not reindeer.
[00:02:10] Joe Loveridge: We use horses. Yep, yep.
[00:02:12] Brian Gardner: Have you? Reindeers are good. We should give that a … We should give that a go.
[00:02:16] Tom Kelly: I've actually seen that. I led a cross country ski trip to Murmansk, which is in the former Soviet Union, in Russia. And they have this big cross country race in the spring, and there's a lot of snow up there in the northern part of the, of the country, 500 miles north of the Arctic Circle. And they had reindeer pulling skiers. Yeah, sure. So I've seen it. It's a it's a real thing. How did you. … Well, actually, let's get into your own backgrounds. And, Joe, why don't you started out. What's your background? Where'd you grow up, and how did you get into ranching and horses, and skiing.
[00:02:56] Joe Loveridge: Yeah. I grew up in Orem, Utah. My dad was an outfitter, and so I just grew up packing horses, riding horses in the mountains, doing hunting trips, fishing trips, things like that. And that's actually where Brian and I met. He came down to help. Help my dad. One year, patrol some of the property that we would hunt on. And we were in high school at that time. And, we just that's that's where I was associated with horses. That's how I grew up with horses. Was just riding them mainly in the mountains.
[00:03:27] Tom Kelly: So, Brian, you guys connected all the way back in high school?
[00:03:30] Brian Gardner: All the way back in high school? Well, yeah. It was, shoot, and from there we started playing basketball and all sorts of things together. But, yeah, we go clear back to high school.
[00:03:42] Tom Kelly: Yeah. When you guys were, uh, doing the trips on your land, what were you hunting for?
[00:03:48] Joe Loveridge: Deer and elk.
[00:03:49] Tom Kelly: Yeah. Can you tell us where the property is about?
[00:03:53] Joe Loveridge: Most of it was down in southern Utah, around Monticello. And we did do some out in Colorado. Yeah. And some around Manti. Yeah. Down by Mount Pleasant, those areas.
[00:04:02] Tom Kelly: How did each of you pick up your passion for the outdoors, be it skiing or hunting or whatever? We're blessed in Utah with this amazing land. How did each of you kind of build that passion up as young boys?
[00:04:17] Brian Gardner: For me, uh, probably the same for both of us. But, you know, my dad and my grandpa, um, you know, that's what we did. We were we were outside, um, doing outdoor things all the time. And my grandpa, uh, was a multi-generational rancher farmer in central Utah. And, uh, you know, that's. And he was kind of my hero when I was growing up, and that's where I spent my time. Anytime I could be outside, that's where I wanted to be.
[00:04:44] Tom Kelly: Yeah. Joe. Same similar story.
[00:04:47] Joe Loveridge: My dad and my grandpa. Yep.
[00:04:48] Tom Kelly: Isn't it amazing? Now, my. I don't go into hunting and fishing as much, but isn't it amazing the role that our grandparents play on getting us into our activities of life?
[00:05:01] Joe Loveridge: It is. Yep. They grew. They grew it. They lived it. And what we take is their living is what we do for fun. Nowadays it seems like.
[00:05:10] Tom Kelly: Yeah, that's an interesting way to look at it. I think there's a lot to that, right?
[00:05:14] Brian Gardner: Yeah. Yeah. My grandpa lived to be 103. Just passed away a couple of years ago, and, uh. Boy, his life was as full as you could ever imagine.
[00:05:25] Tom Kelly: Yeah. Yeah, that's. That's cool. I could go into grandparent stories. I actually, I actually have a great-granddaughter now who's five. And I think about this a lot because I've, you know, had the experience now with kids and with grandchildren. Now I have it with a, with a great granddaughter. You know what. What can I introduce her to? I mean, that's what life's about. How did though with this background, how did you guys initially connect with skijoring.
[00:05:53] Brian Gardner: You know, it was really Joe's idea. He called me up, like I said, it was. It was 2017, and he called me up and he said, hey, have you seen these ski drawings? And I said, yeah, I've seen it. I don't know much about it. And they were happening and had been for years, and, you know, little ski towns in Colorado and Wyoming and Montana and things like that. And he said, we really need to do that here. He said, it just is … it seems like it should be Utah's sport. I mean, Utah has such a heritage and ranching and, and and also obviously a famed, world-renowned ski destination that, that it just seemed like the good … a perfect home for it and also include the fact that we both had such passions for both things. And, uh, so I said, well, Joe, listen, we're always up for a challenge. Let's do it. And that's kind of how it all started.
[00:06:46] Tom Kelly: Is that about right, Joe?
[00:06:47] Joe Loveridge: It is? Yeah, actually, the first time I saw it was a poster up in Montana. I saw a horse pulling a skier behind it, and I'm like, as kids, we did that to an extent, just not as an organized race. We'd pull ourselves with tubes, sleds, whatever we could hang on to with a horse. And so I don't think we called it. I don't know what we called it. We just did it for fun. But, but yeah, I saw that. I'm like, Brian, this is what we are. This is what we do. So let's do it.
[00:07:15] Tom Kelly: And then how did you connect with Soldier Hollow?
[00:07:17] Joe Loveridge: We had. So Brian and I started an outfitting business, um, when we were at Sundance doing guided horseback rides and fly fishing trips, and we ended up with a contract there after the Olympics, and we were offering horseback rides there and sleigh rides and things like that. And we just when we had this idea, we went to them, and they liked it, and they let us, let us do it there.
[00:07:38] Tom Kelly: Yeah. Were you guys around for the 2002 Olympics? Yeah. So, you know, at Soldier Hollow, they did this amazing western village. They did not have skijoring. But did you get to see that village in oh two? Yeah.
[00:07:51] Brian Gardner: Yes.
[00:07:52] Tom Kelly: Pretty amazing what they did, wasn't it?
[00:07:53] Joe Loveridge: How they. … Yeah. How it transformed into what it was. Yeah.
[00:07:56] Tom Kelly: Yeah. That turned out to be one of the really fun venues. I want to hop back for just a bit. You mentioned Sundance, and so you guys both were patrollers at Sundance, is that right? Correct. How long were you there overall?
[00:08:12] Joe Loveridge: Forever.
[00:08:12] Brian Gardner: Yeah. Bbeen there a long time? Yeah. I was there for ten years, and. And you were a little bit longer.
[00:08:19] Joe Loveridge: A little bit longer than that. I started there, I think, in 1992 as a lift operator first. Yeah. And then you came on as a lift operator, didn't you? Yeah, we both did. Lift operator, and then thought ski patrol was cooler. Thought we'd get more dates. Ski patrolman. Did it work that way? No, no, no. Lift operator was way better.
[00:08:42] Tom Kelly: You know the other. Which you tell me if this is a myth or not, but, uh, you also get some pretty nice powder shots when you're a patroller. Is that true?
[00:08:50] Joe Loveridge: They say that, but it's a lot of work to get to that point to where we get the powder shots, and then by that time, we're usually soaking wet and ready to change some clothes and get warm. Yeah, but we do get our share.
[00:09:03] Tom Kelly: Yeah, yeah. Do you still get out and ski there? Yeah, yeah. It's. What do you think about the changes they've made there? I mean, it's really turning into quite an amazing little ski area.
[00:09:13] Joe Loveridge: It is. Yeah. They've, they've expanded a lot of terrain I never thought would ever happen.
[00:09:18] Brian Gardner: So yeah I you know, Sundance to this day is, and I'm biased because that's where I grew up skiing. And we were there for so many years. But I love Sundance, and I've been lucky enough to be able to ski all over the Western United States and all the major resorts and and they're all wonderful. But there's just something special about Sundance and, uh, yeah, I love the changes they're making. Clear back in the day. The terrain they've opened now is terrain that clear back then we were saying, hey, they should get this open. We should be skiing. That so? So seeing what they're doing now makes me happy. I buy a season pass there every year. I love going back and skiing Sundays.
[00:09:55] Tom Kelly: Yeah, it's a real bargain season pass, too, for what you get, isn't it?
[00:09:59] Brian Gardner: Yeah. It's wonderful. And midweek. Yeah. There's no lift line isn't even a word. So it's I love. Yeah. Sundance will always be my favorite.
[00:10:07] Tom Kelly: Yeah. It's it's it's a great spot. Let's get back to Soldier Hollow though. So you started this in 2017. You actually started this event at Soldier Hollow. What? When you think back to that first event for where you are now, what do you think? How did that go for you? And did you ever have any sense that it would pick up the steam that it has?
[00:10:24] Joe Loveridge: No. Didn't have any idea we'd be doing what we're doing or talking about? Yeah. And what's happening this year, we thought it was just something we were going to get to get together every year and have a fun time doing what we're doing.
[00:10:36] Tom Kelly: Did people come out for it?
[00:10:39] Brian Gardner: Yeah. Even that first year. You know, listen, it's not like there was a marketing budget. There wasn't really a real outreach program, and I, I don't remember exactly, but I want to say we sold like, 500 tickets, and we were really surprised. And, we saw kind of early on that, um, that people just really love this. I think that's what we've seen. And I think that's what's really propelled the growth of it, is that, um, you don't really have to be into horses. You don't really have to be into skiing. And … but people are just kind of captivated by it, thinking, I can't believe that these people are running these horses and pulling these skiers at a fast speed down a course, going over jumps and doing all these things. It just captures their imagination. And so there's not really a demographic I would say that comes out to watch ski during it. I think people just love it. And that's what we that's what we saw. And so year after year, it just grew and grew and grew. And again, I don't know that that was intentional on our part. I mean, we loved it. We enjoyed putting it on, but it was all very organic. How it's grown to be what it is today.
[00:11:47] Tom Kelly: Did you look? And I'm kind of thinking to myself, you know, where have I seen this? Around the world. And I did see it up in Murmansk. I know that Steamboat Springs has done it as a part of its Winter Carnival, but did you look around the country, look around the world to look for other examples? And did you find any that you could model after.
[00:12:02] Joe Loveridge: We went to one race up in Montana? In Bozeman, just to get a feel for how they organized it and ran it. And that was pretty much it. The rest of it, we just kind of just come up with it on our own, and that's what we did.
[00:12:16] Tom Kelly: So you're the pioneers.
[00:12:18] Brian Gardner: In Utah.
[00:12:19] Tom Kelly: In Utah, in Utah, in Utah.
[00:12:21] Brian Gardner: And that's something that's been kind of neat is, um, because we weren't really connected to the ski drawing community out of, outside of Utah when we started all of this. So, we've been really lucky, and just … it's been fun because we've kind of created our own little micro ski drawing culture here in Utah. So, so many of the teams that compete today had never done it either and kind of started when we started. So now you have teams out there that have done it for four or five, six, seven years in a row. And, they're all local here in Utah. So it's been fun to watch it happen and see families get involved and, and see, you know, incredible, um, you know, pro ski racing type skiers get involved and become friends with cowboys that, that maybe they wouldn't normally cross paths with. And now they're good buddies and, and do this every year. So it's just been really fun to see the two cultures collide.
[00:13:19] Tom Kelly: Let's talk a little bit more about this Western heritage, which is, I think, really, really picking up popularity right now. Talk to me about what that Western heritage is and what it represents here in Utah.
[00:13:36] Brian Gardner: I think, you know, it's funny, everybody talks about Yellowstone. And, listen, I think Yellowstone has done a lot of good, um, for the Western industry and the ranching industry as a whole, just to bring attention to it. I think that, you know, the Western culture is important. It's … there's a lot of integrity, a lot of, uh, work ethic, a lot of strong values. And, um, and that's not to say by any means that cowboys are perfect. But it does mean that there I think there's just a core value base out there that maybe is getting lost a little bit in society. So I think it's kind of a neat thing to see a little bit more attention brought to it.
[00:14:23] Tom Kelly: Joe. Thoughts on that?
[00:14:24] Joe Loveridge: Yeah, it's the same what he said. It's a lot of work and a lot of time, and weather's not always your friend, and you get to do it whether it's cold or snowing or hot and sunny. It's just, you learn how to work is what it does.
[00:14:41] Tom Kelly: And you learned that as a patroller, too, right?
[00:14:44] Joe Loveridge: Yeah, somewhat. Yep. Oh, yeah. Yep.
[00:14:46] Brian Gardner: Yeah.
[00:14:47] Joe Loveridge: Early mornings.
[00:14:48] Brian Gardner: How many control mornings? And at Sundance, it's a smaller ski patrol. Right. So you do it all. So. Yeah, we you talk about powder runs. And I was sitting there thinking, well, it's it's easy to get in the back seat when you have £40 of dynamite on you in your backpack.
[00:15:02] Tom Kelly: I was going to ask about that. So you got to drop charges too, right?
[00:15:06] Joe Loveridge: We did. Yeah.
[00:15:07] Tom Kelly: Yeah. Is that fun?
[00:15:08] Joe Loveridge: It was a lot of. That was why I did it. Yeah, I think why I stuck with it, I should say we both ended up training our dogs to be avalanche rescue dogs, too, so that added a fun element to the job. Cool. Yep.
[00:15:21] Tom Kelly: I want to talk about the Visit Salt Lake Winter Roundup event. That's where I met you guys a couple of years ago. And, uh, I'll let you guys talk about the event, but that was just an amazing afternoon in downtown Salt Lake City. How did that event come to be? And how did it help to springboard you guys?
[00:15:40] Brian Gardner: Yeah, visit Salt Lake. They reached out to us and said, hey, we want to bring some, some winter energy back to downtown Salt Lake City and revive it a little bit from back when the Olympics were here. And they said, we've got this idea we want to do this downtown winter festival called Winter Round-Up. And, we wondered if you guys would work with us and kind of put on a ski joring exhibition in downtown Salt Lake City. And so, uh, again, Joe and I aren't ones to say no. We're always willing to think outside the box, but I think the first thing we were like is, well, there's not always snow in downtown Salt Lake City. And anyway, we worked with them and everybody was super great about thinking outside the box, and Solitude Resort really stepped up and, and a local trucking company stepped up, and we hauled 44 dump truckloads of snow from Solitude Resort down to West Temple in Salt Lake City and built a course overnight. And I don't know for sure that Joe and I can claim this, but we maybe are the first people and only people to ever driven a snowcat in downtown Salt Lake City.
[00:16:56] Tom Kelly: I think that's a safe bet that you were the first.
[00:17:00] Brian Gardner: And so yeah, we took that snow and we built a course and Visit Salt Lake. They're just wonderful partners. And that was the first year, the year we met you and 10,000 people plus showed up to come watch it. And the energy was amazing. And, uh, we did it again last year. And last year they.
[00:17:18] Joe Loveridge: It was even more.
[00:17:18] Brian Gardner: People. Yeah. Visit Salt Lake said it was 15,000 people that showed up down there, and pretty cool, you know. And the skiers are amazing, and they're doing these big flips and stuff, and it's some great footage. They're doing flips and then Nordstrom is right there in the background, you know.
[00:17:34] Tom Kelly: So now that's the thing that I think when skijoring started it was more about the speed over the snow. But the flips and some of the other things. That was real icing on the cake, wasn't it?
[00:17:47] Joe Loveridge: It's a good. Yeah, it shows off. We had to get a little creative because you can't really run a race there with the amount of track we had. And so we're like, we have a bunch of skiers that are good and like to do tricks, and we're like, let's, let's make this a jump so we can do some tricks off of it. And, they did very well at it.
[00:18:06] Tom Kelly: And you had Peekaboo Street, the Olympic champion there as well from Park City.
[00:18:09] Joe Loveridge: She was one of the announcers.
[00:18:11] Tom Kelly: She was one of your announcers. Yeah, yeah, yeah, she was fired up. So you got a chance to meet Picabo?
[00:18:13] Brian Gardner: Yeah, yeah.
[00:18:15] Tom Kelly: Did she ski?
[00:18:21] Brian Gardner: No, she didn’t
[00:18:21] Tom Kelly: Did you try to talk her into it?
[00:18:23] Joe Loveridge: I think they did.
[00:18:25] Brian Gardner: Yeah. We would have loved to have had her.
[00:18:27] Joe Loveridge: Cool. We've reached out to quite a few Olympic skiers to get them to come do this, and they're scared, I think.
[00:18:36] Tom Kelly: Well, we'll have to we'll have we'll have to we'll have to work on that. And you guys are you're coming back with another Visit Salt Lake winter roundup this February, right?
[00:18:44] Joe Loveridge: February 7th. Yep, yep.
[00:18:46] Tom Kelly: So right there during the Olympics, actually the first weekend of the Olympics over in Italy. And you're going to be on, still on West Temple, right in front of the convention center.
[00:18:49] Joe Loveridge: Yep. Same.
[00:18:50] Tom Kelly: That'll be fun. We're going to take a short break. And when we come back, we're going to talk about the origins of the pro tour that you guys are launching. Thank you for being with us here on Last Chair. We'll be right back with Joe and Brian after this.
[00:19:10] Tom Kelly: We're back on Last Chair, actually. Let's do that again. We're back on Last Chair. My guests today, Joe Loveridge and Brian Gardner. We're talking skijoring. We've learned a lot so far about skijoring. But what I want to talk about next is the pro tour that you've put together. And this is the debut season, right? Yeah it is. Joe, you want to kick it off and tell us how how did you evolve this?
[00:19:33] Joe Loveridge: It's kind of been on our minds the last couple of years. We've been invited to do some exhibitions and races in different locations. Last year, we took it to Logan, and then. And then there's just been a lot of talk in the community about how do we establish a tour or a competition that actually declares a real champion for all of skijoring and not just an individual race? And and as we talked, um, we had some other guys jump in with us this last year that came to us and thought it'd be really cool to expand this into a tour and, and, yeah, we just look for some different destinations that would allow locations with people to come watch, because that's part of the fun, is actually having a crowd that's cheering you on as you're running through the course. And, and so we, selected some cities that we thought might work and went after it.
[00:20:26] Tom Kelly: And you kick it off in Heber mid-January. Right.
[00:20:28] Brian Gardner: Yes, sir.
[00:20:30] Tom Kelly: Can you walk through the schedule so we know where these are taking place.
[00:20:33] Brian Gardner: Yeah. So the kickoff is in Heber, which we think is very appropriate because the it's kind of the granddaddy of this tour. And the energy in Heber is just, just so wonderful. Joe mentioned the crowds and, and Heber has built to the point now where we have 10,000 people show up and come out to the Heber race and, and for the competitors, that's so much fun. And, you know, we often talk so much about the horse or the rider and the skier, but the horse is an equal part of this, of this sport. And it's just fascinating how much the horses catch the spirit of the crowd. So anyway, kick off in Heber. and then the second stop on the tour is, uh, Gallatin Ski Jaw in Bozeman, Montana. And, then the next stop is coming back to Utah in Logan. And then after Logan, we go to Boise. And after Boise is Driggs, Idaho. Um, up just backdrop with the Tetons, which is amazing. And then we come back to Salt Lake City for the championship finals.
[00:21:40] Tom Kelly: And where will those be in Salt Lake City?
[00:21:42] Brian Gardner: At the Fair Park. The State Fair Park.
[00:21:45] Tom Kelly: And you're still doing the winter roundup. That's more an exhibition than it is a competition, right?
[00:21:50] Brian Gardner: Yes. So? So, the winter roundup, uh, we will still be there. It's not part of the tour in that it's not a competition where competitors earn points toward the tour standings or the finals, but an exhibition for the community.
[00:22:05] Tom Kelly: So if I want to go out to Heber to see the opening event mid January, I think 16 and 17 of January. Where do I get tickets?
[00:22:13] Brian Gardner: Proskijor.com has all of the information on all of the races and links to tickets and even folks who want to compete, even if you're new to it. And that's something we can talk about if you want. But but we're trying to grow new athletes in this sport. And, and so you can register to compete as well.
[00:22:30] Tom Kelly: Let's talk about that both from the athlete and the horse perspective. But from the athlete's perspective, I'm a skier, I'm enthusiastic. I'm a little bit of daredevil in me. How do I get involved?
[00:22:41] Brian Gardner: Yeah. Well, that's one thing that's been fun about about growing this, especially here in Utah, is providing that opportunity to somebody just like yourself that says, hey, I like to ski. I'm a little bit daring, how can I do this? And each each race has numerous divisions. And within that division, really any age or any ability level is welcome, from beginner to expert and from child to, to, you know, a few years ago was really endearing. There was a gentleman who was 80.
[00:23:12] Joe Loveridge: 83.
[00:23:13] Brian Gardner: 83 years old and, uh, and he was pulled behind the horse.
[00:23:17] Joe Loveridge: Flew down, flew down from Washington just to do it.
[00:23:20] Tom Kelly: First-time experience?
[00:23:21] Joe Loveridge: Yeah. First-time experience.
[00:23:22] Brian Gardner: Yeah. And so, we have the divisions that can that can accommodate any of that. We have some fun divisions in there. We have one called the Century Division, where the age of the rider and the skier need to equal 100 years or more. And so that's always kind of fun. And then we have the novice division which can really accommodate any level or excuse me, any age. And you can be just brand new at it and you can go slow down the course if you want. And then we go all the way to the Pro Division. And the Pro Division generally has a really fast horse, an experienced cowboy or cowgirl. And you know what? We shouldn't say cowboy or cowgirl. We have people in the English disciplines that compete as well, which is wonderful. And generally on that pro level, the skier generally has some sort of ski racing background, and it's fast and furious. So, really we can accommodate anybody in between. And answer to your question, how do you get involved? We have a Facebook Group Page called Team Skijor and you can go there and introduce yourself and say, hey, I'd like to give this a try. I've never done it before. And somebody else who's in the same boat can say, hey, I'd like to do that as well. And that's where people can team up and start forming, forming teams to come out to the events.
[00:24:37] Tom Kelly: If I'm an aspiring athlete and I want to get into skijoring, is there like a training regimen that I should be following?
[00:24:46] Joe Loveridge: Yeah. Go ski.
[00:24:48] Tom Kelly: Okay.
[00:24:49] Joe Loveridge: Get on. Get on a slalom course. Go work on your turns. I don't know if you can find a pasture and find somebody with a horse or a four Wheeler or a side by side, so you can get behind and hold on to a rope and get used to making turns with holding on to a rope. That all helps.
[00:25:07] Tom Kelly: So, how do the turns factor into do you … have a … do you follow an actual course?
[00:25:13] Brian Gardner: Yes. It's very similar to a slalom course. And so, you know, in answer to your question, we, anybody who has a good, solid, uh, fundamentals in skiing can adapt over to this pretty quickly. If they can make good turns and quick turns and go edge-to-edge and, and then, as Joe mentioned, really the thing to learn, um, is rope management, you know, how do you, how do you work that rope, the slack in the rope? How do you use that rope to your advantage? And setting up and getting into your next turn. So that's where a little practice can come in. And, that doesn't always have to be behind a horse if you can, like Joe mentioned, if you can get behind an ATV or a snowmobile somewhere on some snow, that's where you can work on your rope management a little bit.
[00:25:59] Tom Kelly: Are there some corollaries between this and water ski slalom?
[00:26:05] Joe Loveridge: Hold the rope.
[00:26:06] Tom Kelly: With the rope management and.
[00:26:08] Joe Loveridge: Holding on to the rope helps for sure.
[00:26:11] Brian Gardner: Yeah.
[00:26:12] Joe Loveridge: For sure. So the rope helps a lot. As far as the skiing part, I think really it's like a slalom race. We have gates down the course that they got to navigate back and forth over. And then we add some jumps and rings to grab in the middle of it all.
[00:26:26] Tom Kelly: Love love that. I'm just kind of thinking back on the rope management now just conjuring this up that I imagine knowing when to let it slack and when to really take advantage of that energy is a big difference maker.
[00:26:41] Joe Loveridge: It makes a big difference. I mean, we're talking we take the fastest time on their Friday run and Saturday, and then combine those two times. So you're talking a 10th of a second will determine whether you're the winner or second place. And and a lot is a lot of the racers at the very end, they're pulling rope at the very end just to get every little bit across that finish line. To start off, you need to allow some rope to slip so you're not getting yanked out of your ski boots on the ground. So yeah, there's a lot of management in that role.
[00:27:14] Tom Kelly: We really do need to talk to Ted Ligety about this, right? Right. Okay. Well, we'll work on that offline. Yeah.
[00:27:21] Brian Gardner: He'd be a natural.
[00:27:22] Tom Kelly: So looking back now on these last 8 or 9 years or it's your 10th year doing this in Utah. What have you seen in the growth of the sport right here in the state of Utah.
[00:27:35] Brian Gardner: It's been phenomenal. And we just feel really lucky and blessed by it. And I kind of mentioned earlier it's been organic I think because it it does speak so much to Utah's heritage, both its western ranching heritage and its ski heritage, that it just kind of seems to be something that comes naturally. And we've seen the growth, both on the competitor side, you know, people in the horse world that say, hey, we want to go give that a try. We want to get involved, get our horses involved. And then skiers and snowboarders that say, boy, I got to get out and give that a try. And so we've seen teams grow. We've seen athletes grow. And then just the reception on the spectator side, you know, that the events have grown. Of course, they're centered around the racing. But really, it's a real festival vibe, you know, food and music and vendor booths and High West whiskey. People love to come out to experience the overall atmosphere. So it's just been really fun. And it just seems like something that people naturally love.
[00:28:45] Tom Kelly: Yeah. Joe, you came on a pretty good idea here, I think, in Utah, right?
[00:28:49] Joe Loveridge: Yeah. It works. Yeah. It's Utah.
[00:28:52] Tom Kelly: It is Utah. We talked a little bit about the athletes. I want to talk about the horses too. Is there particular traits in horses that you're looking for?
[00:29:03] Joe Loveridge: One, I guess the first is the one that's going to be able to handle the pressure. And you don't think of that as pressure, but there's a lot of pressure with all that crowd, the energy that they feel off the crowd. And so finding a horse that's going to keep it together, um, and be able to focus and run down that track in a straight line, you'll see some that vary off the track and might even go off a jump accidentally. And so, yeah, I think handling the pressure and having the right mind in a horse is most important.
[00:29:34] Tom Kelly: Are you finding them from rodeo stock or other sources?
[00:29:39] Brian Gardner: I think a lot of the current competitors, um, generally have some sort of ties to ranching or, or they do participate in rodeo sports or something like that. Um, um, and, and a good, solid all-around horse. I think if somebody is interested in getting into this, you want to have a horse that you can trust that you've got a good relationship with that you know, can handle different situations. And then as you get them used to pulling something behind them that they adapt pretty quickly. But, you know, a lot of Quarter Horses do really well. Some of your thoroughbreds and thoroughbred crosses will do really well. And again, it kind of goes to that division that we talked about earlier. When you're down in that novice division, then listen, just a good solid all-around horse. It's not all about speed. But as we grow the sport, um, and it gets more and more competitive, which it is those very top teams on the pro level, and especially the fact that now there's a lot of money involved, you can win some money doing this. And so on that pro level, then it really comes down to the speed of the horse matters a lot more in that pro division, that horse can be really fast. And then there's a skier that can still put those turns together behind that fast horse is what's really going to make take this sport and really make that pro division really, really a pro division. And, like Joe said, when it comes down to 10s, then the speed of that horse really matters. And those upper divisions.
[00:31:04] Tom Kelly: Yeah. This is really fascinating. Go ahead.
[00:31:05] Joe Loveridge: No, I was going to say and it also I mean, we you're going to see these guys start really paying attention to like length of the course. What kind of course it is. If it's a long course, you know, a thoroughbred type horse might be more effective than a quarterhorse. To me, I think a horse that's run barrels or is a rope horse do really well because they're used to that, that speed. And you've got to have some agility to … these horses are pretty athletic. You know, they're running on on snow on level terrain. And uh, they're giving it their all when they do it.
[00:31:41] Tom Kelly: As a spectator. When I come out to Heber or Salt Lake City or up to Logan, what are the things that I should be watching for during the competition?
[00:31:52] Brian Gardner: Do you mean, like, if you're interested in the sport and kind of.
[00:31:56] Tom Kelly: Yeah.
[00:31:57] Brian Gardner: You really want to understand.
[00:31:58] Tom Kelly: It just for the … just for the average spectator. What's a day like coming out to ski during? What should I watch for? How should I dress? And so forth?
[00:32:05] Brian Gardner: Okay, sure. Well, um, first of all, I think that you come out just to have a great day and have a great time, and you want to dress warm, um, come dressed for the elements. You know, some days are cold and windy, and we run no matter what. We've been lucky. I think that most of our days have ended up kind of being bluebird, blue sky, sunny days and and which always helps, but come dressed for the elements. And, we've noticed that there's kind of that fashion side of it that's growing, which has been kind of fun. So. So we're starting to see a lot of, a lot of, I shouldn't just say women, men as well. But even a lot of influencers are doing get ready with me for ski in Utah, and that. And so it's kind of turning into that whole culture side of it is kind of growing organically, which is kind of fun to see that happen as well.
[00:32:57] Tom Kelly: Should you have a cowboy hat?
[00:32:59] Joe Loveridge: Yes.
[00:33:00] Tom Kelly: Yes.
[00:33:01] Joe Loveridge: Simple or Stormy Kromer.
[00:33:02] Brian Gardner: And when you come. We have vendors and they sell all of that, so. Yeah, it's. Yeah, come. Just come dressed and be ready to have a good time at all. All walks of life come out to spectate.
[00:33:14] Tom Kelly: Stormy Kromer, a sponsor.
[00:33:16] Joe Loveridge: We're working on it.
[00:33:18] Tom Kelly: We'll talk. Okay.
[00:33:20] Joe Loveridge: I emailed them today.
[00:33:21] Tom Kelly: I'm a big fan of. Big fan of the brand. Yeah, just to kind of wrap it up. And then we're going to go to our little Fresh Tracks question section. But if each of you, uh, Brian, you kick it off and then we'll go to you, Joe, which just kind of sum up what this last decade has meant to you to be involved with skijoring here in Utah and be a part of something that's bringing this Western heritage and skiing and combining it all together here?
[00:33:44] Brian Gardner: Yeah. No, thanks. That's a great question. I think for me personally, it's become more meaningful than I ever thought it ever would have from the beginning. I think meaningful because two things that I love. I mean, skiing and horses have been a very big part of my life. I actually make my living in ranching. And so, to be able to marry two things you're passionate about is just something I feel very fortunate about. And then, as we talked about earlier, I think that sharing the Western lifestyle and the Western heritage and kind of the the Western mindset and sharing that on a, on a, on a larger platform is, is something that is important to me. And so yeah, it's been an incredible journey that I'm very thankful for.
[00:34:34] Tom Kelly: Joe, how about you?
[00:34:35] Joe Loveridge: It's…. Well, it's just bringing two things that I love, which is is the, well, three, I guess, the outdoors, skiing, and horses. I make a living off of horses. Um, I ski for fun now. I used to do it for a living. And so bringing these things together and watching. Really watching two cultures meet up and have a good time is pretty pretty unique. And Utah has all of that.
[00:35:04] Tom Kelly: Well, we thank you guys for what you've done and bringing this sport around. It's going to be exciting this year to get out there and watch a little skijoring we're going to wrap it up with our Fresh Tracks section. So I have just a few final questions before we do a little taste of this High West that they've put out for us here today, uh, as skiers and you guys spent a lot of time working together at Sundance on the patrol. But as skiers, what's your favorite ski run in Utah? Joe?
[00:35:29] Joe Loveridge: Far east.
[00:35:31] Tom Kelly: Far east. That's an easy one, huh?
[00:35:33] Brian Gardner: Far East.
[00:35:34] Tom Kelly: Okay, you guys are united on that?
[00:35:38] Brian Gardner: And we used to have a name run a run there named after us three boys … was named after us.
[00:35:45] Tom Kelly: Who? Who's the other boy?
[00:35:46] Joe Loveridge: Matt Erickson.
[00:35:47] Brian Gardner: Maddox.
[00:35:47] Joe Loveridge: Okay, we got in trouble.
[00:35:49] Tom Kelly: Yeah. We did.
[00:35:50] Joe Loveridge: We used to be on patrol, and all three of us would end up down there skiing, and then we'd get in trouble because it's two chairlifts to the top.
[00:35:57] Tom Kelly: So we're we're, I'm actually going down to Sundance a little bit later today because we're doing an episode with the new hotel. Will they know you guys down there?
[00:36:08] Joe Loveridge: A couple of them.
[00:36:09] Brian Gardner: Some of the old timers.
[00:36:09] Tom Kelly: Some of them will. Okay. Now, you guys may not want to answer this one, but I'd love if you could share a favorite hunting or fishing spot here in Utah that you love. Brian.
[00:36:23] Brian Gardner: Well, the hunting spots are a little secret. But, I grew up again, going back to my dad and my grandpa. I grew up down hunting up in the Manti area just south of Manti, a little town called Mayfield. So I love it down there. And, um. Hey, fishing. Joe and I again, we founded Rocky Mountain Outfitters, a guided fly fishing service, and that was predominantly on the Provo River and the lower Provo be. Below the Deer Creek Dam is some of my favorite places to be.
[00:36:55] Tom Kelly: Pretty amazing spots, huh? Yeah. Joe.
[00:36:59] Joe Loveridge: Uh, favorite hunting spot would be down by Monticello. Um, on a mountain called Shay Mountain. Um, it's got a lot of history and memories down there. And then, uh, fishing. I like Diamond Fork. It's a little bit more remote, a little bit more technical and fun. Fun river to fish.
[00:37:17] Tom Kelly: You know, I, uh, I didn't fish while I was there, but this fall, we went up Diamond Fork. It was the first time that I'd ever been there. And we've explored those mountains in our Jeep so many times, we just never made it. Diamond fork. And that is really a gem.
[00:37:32] Joe Loveridge: It is. It's it's not as easy to get to. So you don't see as many, many folks show up there.
[00:37:37] Tom Kelly: Yeah. Pretty remote. Brian. Favorite high West whiskey?
[00:37:44] Brian Gardner: The bourbon.
[00:37:46] Tom Kelly: We got a lot of it on the wall behind you. And I'm going to go to both of you guys for one final question. I'd love to do this to people. And it's the toughest question of the day. If you could sum up what skijoring has meant to you in just one word, what would it be? Brian. Just one word.
[00:38:06] Brian Gardner: Legacy.
[00:38:07] Tom Kelly: Legacy. Joe?
[00:38:09] Joe Loveridge: Culture.
[00:38:10] Tom Kelly: Culture. I want to thank you guys for coming in and talking about your passions for horses and skiing. And we look forward to seeing you out on the skijoring course, sometime this winter, we're going to close it out with just a quick toast before we go. We're here in the High West Whiskey Library, so why not? Folks, if you're a follower of the podcast, you know that we've sampled some pretty nice High West whiskies here. This one you can't even buy yet. It'll come out on January 16th. It's called cask strength. I highly recommend it. So with that, thank you guys. Thank,s everybody for listening. Cheers. We'll see you again soon.
[00:38:45] Brian Gardner: Hey, thank you for having us.