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The lizards pair Drew Estate's Liga Privada No. 9 in toro with Eagle Rare bourbon, discuss Drew Estate and the Buffalo Trace distillery and also recommend a wild documentary about Pappy Van Winkle.
Released every Tuesday, the LOUNGE LIZARDS podcast helps listeners navigate the experience of finding and enjoying premium cigars (both Cuban and non-Cuban) and quality spirits. Episodes are normally around 90 minutes long and feature a variety of different topics including food, travel, life, sports and work.
The podcast features eight members: Rooster, Poobah, Gizmo, Senator, Pagoda, Chef Ricky, Grinder and Bam Bam.
This is not your typical cigar podcast. We’re a group of friends who love sharing cigars, whiskey and a good laugh.
Join us and become a card-carrying lounge lizard yourself! Email us at hello@loungelizardspod.com to join the conversation and be featured on an upcoming episode!
**Gizmo:** [00:00:00] Welcome to the Lounge Lizards podcast. It's so good to have you here. It's a leisure and lifestyle podcast founded on our love of premium cigars, as well as whiskey, travel, food, work, and whatever else we feel like getting into. My name is Gizmo, and tonight I'm joined by Rooster Puba, Senator Pagoda grinder, and bam bam.
A full house of lizards. And our plan is to smoke a cigar, drink some bourbon, talk about life, and of course, have some laughs. So take this as your 10th official invitation to join us and become a card carrying lounge lizard. Plan to meet us here once a week. We're gonna smoke a new world cigar tonight.
Share our thoughts on it, and give you our formal lizard rating. We'll discuss our first bourbon pairing from the Buffalo Trace Distillery and a wild documentary about Papi Van Winkle, all among a variety of other things for the next hour. So sit back, get your favorite drink, light up a cigar, and enjoy as we pair eagle rare bourbon with Dre Estates League of Bravada.
Number nine in Toro. I gotta be honest guys. [00:01:00] This is a really, really good looking cigar. I've never had one of these, the League of Bravada, number nine, new World. Of course. Nicaraguan Origin. And it has a Connecticut rapper, correct. Aro
**Rooster:** Connecticut broadleaf
**Gizmo:** rapper. Is that right? Yeah, aro. And then, uh, it has a Brazilian binder and the filler is made, uh, of Honduran and Nicaraguan leaf.
So pretty cool. Provided by bam. Bam, tonight. Thank you. Bam. Yep. And, uh, let's cut this boys and see what the, uh, cold draw is. Smells good.
Look,
**Rooster:** rapper. Smells squa. It does smell a sweetness, right? Like the, like
**Gizmo:** raisins, chocolate. Yeah.
**Grinder:** Raisins. Yeah. I get raisin too,
**Bam Bam:** right? I haven't had this cigar in at least eight years.
Wow. Yeah. But prior to that I had it many, many times.
**Gizmo:** So this is a very popular cigar, right? I mean, this whole line, it's
**Bam Bam:** very difficult to find right now. Really? Yeah. Why is that? Do we know the demand is sky high? [00:02:00] Mm-hmm. Also, Grindr made a good point. The leaf itself is difficult to grow in quantity, so it's not relatively readily available.
Got it.
**Poobah:** Apparently it almost looks like a MEO wrapper, but it isn't.
**Gizmo:** It smells really nice on the rabbit. Yeah, its delicious. Have to
**Senator:** say. The rapper smells. The cold draw
**Bam Bam:** is fantastic.
**Poobah:** It's a really neat looking cigar. It has a sheen on it. That's, I mean, it just, um, you can see the oils coming out of this wrapper, right. I mean, and the construction looks really
**Gizmo:** great. It looks really well made.
**Bam Bam:** Yeah. Yeah. It's like borderline rustic. It's got like a rustic finish to the wrapper, but it's really beautifully made. Sea are tight, but do
**Gizmo:** a few wrapper. I my cold, my cold draw. Is that kind of perfect. Just a touch of resistance. It's not like wide open. But it's, it's really, really nice. So if this
**Rooster:** tastes anything, like it smells, I think it's a home run.
Yeah.
**Gizmo:** Right. All right, boys, let's light it up. [00:03:00] The League of Bravada, number nine in Toro, made by Drew Estate. It's six inches by 52. Very nice in the hand. Um, clearly well made. I mean, I'm really looking forward to having my, having my first one of these . It's really nice.
**Poobah:** On the light. Yeah. Ah, Uhoh. No, it's good.
**Gizmo:** Great
**Pagoda:** combustion. Good 'em. Amount
**Gizmo:** of smoke.
**Poobah:** Wow. It's pretty, it's, it's on the light. It was, it's really nice. It's
**Gizmo:** really nice. I would say this is medium. Medium full, right.
**Bam Bam:** Definitely a medium to full
**Grinder:** on it. I think. Medium. Full.
**Bam Bam:** Yeah.
**Senator:** Spicy. Lot of flavor right off the bat. Rich cigar.
**Gizmo:** So bam. How much did you get these four in retail?
What were they about? 11. 1150 I think. Closer to 17. 17. Oh shit. 25. Yeah, it was on the record. Thank you. [00:04:00] Rooster.
**Poobah:** Plus tax. Plus tax. So what's the filler?
**Bam Bam:** I'll send you all my invoices. . We
**Gizmo:** know the filler is will pay by check. It's Nicaraguan and Honduran. A blend. Blend, yeah. And then the binder is Brazilian.
**Bam Bam:** And if I'm not mistaken, the seed, that's a Cuban seed that they
**Gizmo:** use. I think you're right. It's like
**Rooster:** seven. Seven
**Gizmo:** different
**Senator:** blends. Yeah. I think, I mean, I don't know a whole lot about Liga, but from what I've, at least the little that I've read, I think their whole philosophy, they blend a lot of very different tobaccos in their cigars.
They don't make a lot of purees or you know, stuff that some of the other brands would do it. It's just this melting pot of a whole lot of different
**Poobah:** flavors. Yeah, it's a creative process. He, Jonathan Drew's a creative. Guy. He's pretty eclectic, right? I
**Gizmo:** mean, yeah, he's funky. Yeah, he's a funky dude. He's funky guy.
Cool clothes and stuff. He's got like his own clothing line. What about the asset asset cigars? Was that, that was Drew, his statement. That's him. That is, yeah,
**Grinder:** that's him. Yeah. [00:05:00] So this, this cigar actually, um, not the cigar particularly, but the league, uh, bravado line. I love this line. I smoke a lot of these cigars.
Um, the T 52 actually, um, pagoda and I were talking earlier. It's a good, it's a, that's my favorite league of cigar. This is, this is kind of like their, I don't know what you'd call it. Like they're, um, you know, they're ultra premium. No, no. It's, they're all legals. All all leagues are, are kind of priced the same.
Mm-hmm. . But the number nine is like their flagship. Um, and what makes it unique, this line, historically has been the rapper. And to what, what band was saying earlier is the rapper is very unique to Liga. It's grown on a special farm in Connecticut. , and I believe maybe a listener can correct me if I'm wrong.
Um, and they, you know, Connecticut Shade, but Alt Ultra, it's kind of, it, I think it is aged and it's, you can tell it's very oily. It's very rich, [00:06:00] the aromas very rich. The taste is smooth, but, but heavy and hardy. Um, the smoke is really tremendous output on smoke, very consistent. Um, yeah, I mean the, the thing about this, this, this cigar, like he, he, he has these, these legal lines, the T 52, um, what was the other one
**Pagoda:** you were saying?
The, the number nine. And I think then it's a lot of different
**Grinder:** sizes. Well, the size is, uh, I think they're, they're, they're, they kind of really got their footing in the, uh, the double Corona, which was like a 94 rating from ca. And it was like in the top 10, one of those years. Um, . And, you know, since then it's been a, it's been a fan favorite for many cigar smokers,
**Pagoda:** including me.
I think when I started off and I was trying a lot of different cigars, um, um, somebody introduced me to, uh, the league number nine, uh, double Coronas. Uh, [00:07:00] it became my go-to for quite some time. I remember, but this is quite a few years ago. A fantastic cigar. It was a little expensive for me in those days.
It was around 20 bucks in New York City. Um, but fantastic. I used to love it because, you know, you could light one up, spend a good amount of time, uh, smoking a great cigar, great combustion, you know, a little bit of sweetness, a little bit of spiciness. It's just great. Um, uh, I'm more of a number nine fan, uh, than the T 52 for some reason.
Uh, I'm happy with smoking the number nine today, so, yeah. So
**Gizmo:** what, what would you say is the difference? I mean, guys that have smoked these, I've always seen the, the nine in the 50, the T 52, what. Is it from the, it's from the same line, right? Liga Bravada. But what's the difference
**Bam Bam:** between these? I happen to think it's probably the strength and flavor where I find the T 52 to be smoother than this cigar.
Um, they're both, I think, quite tasty, but the T 52 to me is a bit smoother.
**Grinder:** I mean, that, that, that checks for me because I [00:08:00] like a smoother cigar. Um, these
**Gizmo:** days. Look at the smoke coming out. I can't believe it. It's so much. I mean, if you hold it,
**Bam Bam:** I can barely see
**Gizmo:** you from across the room. If you hold it vertically, look at how the smoke kind of climbs up the cigar.
So one
**Pagoda:** thing, uh, I want to, uh, say about the league number nine, it was, uh, really interesting. I used to smoke, uh, at a shop called, uh, Nat Sherman in the city for quite a few years and ended up meeting a lot of interesting people. And what I found was that a lot of the guys who really enjoyed, uh, the number nine as opposed to the T 52, we all.
Um, kind of, uh, liked, uh, similar cigars. Uh, um, like we, uh, really enjoyed a lot of, uh, the foundation cigars, uh, in terms of, uh, the tabernacle, uh, the gree. Um, it was just really interesting and a lot of the guys were like, T 52 s weren't that fond of the foundation, and it was always on and off and, um, [00:09:00] always interesting conversations around that.
Uh, but yeah, meaning it seems like, uh, there seems to be somewhat of a divide between the number nine and the 50 twos. Um, for some reason I've always enjoyed the number nine more. I haven't tried many of the T 52 s, but I think as my palate has changed, I'm definitely gonna give it a try.
**Poobah:** Yeah, I've, it's coming back to me.
I've smoked. Um, so now that I'm smoking this cigar, um, my wife's uncle, uh, who, who's retired now, but was in the cigar business, he would gift me like copious amounts. Ofs. And I have some of these in my humidor when we talked about, um, this episode. I don't smoke many of these, but I've smoked or, and I hadn't paid attention cuz he's always like, he, he's such a big league fan, but every time I'd sit out with him, uh, and it was usually around the holidays, Thanksgiving and Christmas, we would, he, he'd give me a li and [00:10:00] I always associate the cigar with him and sitting out.
And I've always enjoyed them. I just, I, I haven't been an adopter of the brand, but I can see why he really loves them. When, you know, I've mentioned this before, when you sit, you talk and you think about the cigar like we do in the on, on the pod, um, it makes you actually focus on it more. Cuz we would just be talking and this is a real, I mean, for me right now, this is a really good cigar.
I agree. I mean it's really tasty. The combustion's really great. Um, , uh, to Rooster's point, like you, you know, the smoke output is just off the charts. Yeah. Rich, thick, oily wrapper. Um,
**Gizmo:** it's a rich, meaty
**Poobah:** cigar. It really is.
**Bam Bam:** Like, what kind of notes, what notes are you getting right now, guys?
**Gizmo:** I'm definitely
**Rooster:** getting some raisin, like cocoa, chocolate, deep, like dark chocolate notes.
**Gizmo:** Little bit of espresso. [00:11:00] Yeah, little
**Poobah:** coffee. Like dried fruit kind of. Yeah. Yeah. There's a, there's like a dried fruit to it. It's the, the, the wrapper. I just keep looking at the, the appearance of the, the cigar. It's so oily. It's a sexy cigar. It's toothy. It's a kind of a sexy, it's very sexy.
**Bam Bam:** Yeah. Yeah. Good point.
**Poobah:** And, and, and it feels really good. It, the, the Toro's a great, a great shape. Um, this is a trip. I mean, this is gonna be a, a nice. A long sit with this. Yeah. . Yeah. A big smoke. Oh yeah. It's cloudy in here. . I mean, it's definitely clouding up. I mean, the smoke output is, is this copious amount of smoke that are, it's like we're half an inch in.
I feel like I'm in a chimney. Right. Senator,
**Bam Bam:** can you please get the fan girl in here please. .
**Gizmo:** It's like fucking incense burning.
**Poobah:** Right. But I think it's, it speaks volumes to what this, uh, to, to the amount of smoke that this cigar puts [00:12:00] out. It's, it's, um, Beautiful. And I'm only, I'm look, try, I'm looking around the room and ev well, ba bam infa infamously smokes very quickly.
But I'm looking around the room and everybody's like an inch in and the room is back with smoke. , . It's, I mean, the combustion on this thing is a, is is, uh, as pagoda would say, a 10. A 10 for
**Bam Bam:** me. For me, the combustion,
**Poobah:** let tell you, lemme tell you, lemme tell you. It's a 10 .
**Bam Bam:** And, and I do think, you know,
**Pagoda:** uh, the draw, the draw and this, this book I'll put, uh, doesn't matter a lot to me for some reason, , I think this is something I would really enjoy smoking on my deck in the
**Gizmo:** summer.
I think this would smoke really well outside. Yeah, the morning before breakfast,
**Poobah:** little stroke for that. No ,
**Gizmo:** you could see that the, the wrapper's pretty thick. I mean, I think this would handle. Golfer outdoors. I think this would handle it quite well. Like put own this, handle anything.
**Poobah:** This will handle anything.
[00:13:00] Absolutely. The rapper's substantial, really nice cigar. I'm, I'm really happy because, um, about trying this tonight, uh, because, uh, it's, it's probably no secret for the listener if you, I I, I, I tend to smoke more old world cigars than New World. Um, uh, so this for me is, is, is great because it, it's forcing me to, to, to kind of expand my, uh, my horizons a little bit and it's very, very enjoyable.
This is very enjoyable. Cigar. Very enjoyable.
**Grinder:** I'm getting that current, definitely the dried fruit. I don't know who
**Gizmo:** said that. Yep. I feel like I'm having like, like you're saying, dried fruit, but I'm sipping like a, an Americano or something from Starbucks. It's kind of given. Type of vibe and, uh, a flavor.
**Poobah:** It's full, but it's not strong yet. But I can imagine this thing picking up, up, it's definitely gonna pick up. It's, it's gonna accelerate big time down the stretch.
**Senator:** So for guys who have smoked other Legos, are, are they all [00:14:00] relatively strong as in full flavor, full bodied cigar? Because this is got
**Grinder:** Yes. A ton of flavor.
Yes. Most of them are ton of flavor. They're
**Bam Bam:** not known for lighter bodied
**Poobah:** sticks.
**Gizmo:** I'm impressed. Yeah. Are they
**Rooster:** typically all, all like Hondu blends or,
**Gizmo:** um,
**Grinder:** I think, I'm not sure about that. I think they, I think the, the binder and filler pretty variable. The wrapper I, I know is pretty consistent. Mm-hmm. , like I said, they use this rapper in pretty much the entire.
**Rooster:** what's the size of T 52 is a 52 ring
**Gizmo:** gauge. Well, the
**Grinder:** T 52 comes different sizes. Yep. I didn't know that. Just like the League of Provato comes in different, the number nine comes different sizes. Like you can have a number nine as a flying pig, which is this like short, like it perfect perfecto. I love that cigar.
It's a good cigar. Yeah. But they make, they make the flying pig in their entire line.
**Gizmo:** They make, they make those in underground too, right? Yeah, yeah.
**Grinder:** They make their, their [00:15:00] Corona, their double, I think they call it Doble Corona or something. Co corona Doble, yeah. Yeah. Uh, in the, in the entire line.
**Gizmo:** That's the Cuban name for Toros.
**Grinder:** Doble, yeah. Yeah, yeah. Okay. I didn't realize that. But that's so that the, the Corona, the double Corona and T 52 is what I smoke a lot. I used to smoke a lot of, and then the number nine, I, I never j it just never really, I think it was probably cuz it was too harsh. But right now I'm smoking it and it's like not, it doesn't, it doesn't.
I'm not recollecting that the, the, the memory in the, in the reality right now are not syncing
**Poobah:** up. Right. I, I mean I think the beauty with these, in, in, in a lot of the really, cuz this is, this is clearly a premium cigar. And, and I think the beauty with these is the creativity that goes into the blending.
It's not a pure, it, it's, it's, this is, this is, this is true. And I think with new, as I'm opening up a little bit more [00:16:00] to, to, to more new world cigars, um, they're able to create the, these blenders are, are able to create really unique flavor profiles and really balanced cigars that are, that have a lot of.
Um, it's just a matter of like finding for your palette what's gonna work for you. So the possibilities. It's almost like you, they're taking literally tobacco from all these different regions and they're blending them together to just come up with these endless kind of flavor profiles that suit a lot of different people.
It's true.
**Senator:** I mean, it goes back to the, the Davidoff Chef's Edition episode we had. I mean, that was a blend of tobaccos from all over. I remember GIZ giving us kind of the rundown and um, that was an outstanding cigar. I mean, we all rated that very high, very high. And, uh, the flavor that this puts out with this blend of seven different tobaccos, it, it's really, really impressive.
**Grinder:** I think it, I think it does go that create creativity [00:17:00] element also kind of reflects the, like Drew Drew estate, I don't forget his name. What's his, Jonathan Drew. Jonathan Drew. Yeah. Because he is, like we said earlier, he's kind of. His interesting character. I, I went to, I went to Cigar Fest like twice. Um, and he's always there with like crazy haircut and tats and wild t-shirts, just like, you know, slamming shots with the average Joe.
But one of the things that he's known for, as we talked about earlier, is the acid, right? And the acid is a very, is not a traditional cigar smoker cigar, but he's willing to try different blends, different tobaccos, do different things. And as a result, he's made, he's made relationships with all these different growers around, you know, in different regions because he is always trying to attract different flavors.
And that's why you get this like, pretty well balanced cigar that has all these different flavors. And, you know, he, that's, he's, he's doing a great thing for his business as well because of those relationships. He has these distribution, he's, he has these [00:18:00] distribution channels that not many people do.
Like he, he distributes the, the ho like all of Hoyle de de Nicaragua. , which is a cigar line. I love, he distributes them cuz he has these, cuz he is been selling acids for years and just like laying down the revenue.
**Poobah:** He's just been, there's so much revenue associated with those Rev, those Javas and, and acids.
You know, they're like a, they're like a gateway drug to cigars. . They're like a st It's like a lot of people out there start out and they start smoking these flavored cigars. I mean, no. Are they for me? No,
**Senator:** they shouldn't be for anyone. For the record. Well, I'm sorry I,
**Gizmo:** I hate them, but I like it as a, I like it as a welcoming tool into the hobby.
**Poobah:** There are people, that's true. There are, there are people, I have friends I who are very, very casual cigar smokers who I've seen start out in smoking, acid smoking Javas, and then like, they'll gra, you know, they'll graduate up [00:19:00] towards, you know, , a non-flavored cigar. I've just seen it happen. Um, it's a very, from a business perspective, from a commercial perspective, he's smart and, and, and Drew Estates that the company is smart because they're, they, they understand the market.
And, uh, I don't think there's anything wrong with that. I think it, there's a lot of different people to serve. There's casual, more casual cigar smokers who smoke one cigar a month, two cigars a month, and maybe they only even just smoke 'em in the summer or when they're playing around a golf. And you know what, like a Java is going to, is gonna float their boat.
I mean, you some, 'em, I mean, who cares? Some 'em,
**Grinder:** yeah. That, those cigars, the acid and all the, you know, there's multiple. Sizes and flavors. Flavors and stuff. Right? A big cell. But when you smell, when you smell it, like not smoke it, but when you're around people who are smoking that, oh, you can smell it. It's like a Pope Perri.
It's like someone lit an incen. It, it [00:20:00] doesn't smell like a cigar. It doesn't smell like tobacco .
**Poobah:** No, it does not. No, it
**Bam Bam:** doesn't. Look, I think what pub is trying to say is a lot of these marginal gu guys are, that are marginally considered cigar smokers. They'll go for the flavored cigars. And I know a lot of guys like that too, and I get aggravated at them.
Why are you smoking that when you can smoke this? That's what I think to myself.
**Gizmo:** But I think we've, I think we've all been on the journey of, of developing a pallet, right? I mean, I guess we've all
**Bam Bam:** been, hold on when I, I ne I've never had a flavored cigar. Now I've only started smoking. I've only been smoking cigars for about 15 years.
**Poobah:** You never had a backwards No. As a kid
**Bam Bam:** or a Philly blunt with the blueberry, strawberry, blueberry note,
**Grinder:** cherries. We use a
**Bam Bam:** Philly
**Pagoda:** blunter for different
**Bam Bam:** things. Yeah. Honestly, yeah. I think
**Gizmo:** my first backwards was like 12. When I knew,
**Bam Bam:** when I knew nothing about cigars, I always considered flavored cigars to be kind of like that gimmicky type of thing.
It it, it wasn't a cigar to me, it was just something else. So the, I just, now I know where you're going. There's a, it, it's a business. It's, I [00:21:00] get it's
business.
**Senator:** I get it. I get it. It's thing I, I wanna go where bams going. So I, I pub's point is, is well taken and totally well taken. It's a business. There's a market for it.
There's no question about any of that. And to people who like to buy those cigars, God bless them. I'm just gonna say a, uh, you know, a, as a lizard and a cigar smoker, I'll never forget. I, I started really getting into cigars when I was in college. And, uh, I had a guy who lived in my fraternity house who I, I was the only guy at the time.
I'd sit in my, on the porch and I'd smoke a cigar every day. . And one of the guys in the house, he finally comes to me, he goes, oh, uh, Senator, you, you're a cigar smoker too. And I said, yeah. And I was like, well, what do you smoke? And he's like, oh, my favorite cigar is the acid blonie. And I'm like, . And I, and I just responded and I said, you're not a cigar smoker, no
I'm like, I'm sorry. Like it's just, look, you're something else. Yeah. Just, this is where I'm coming from. I'm a purist. We, we, we had a great, I think it was our New Year's episode where we talked about we love this organic pure nature about certain things like cigars. It's from the ground, it's unadultered, it's [00:22:00] all naturally aged and roll, hand-rolled, all of that.
And I just hate the idea of putting these artificial flavors in these cigars and trying to make them like things that they actually don't taste like. And to me it just, you know, if someone likes. That's fine. I don't, I don't take anything away from that person, but as far as I'm concerned, I'll never consider that a real cigar that's been artificially doctored in some way.
I love the beauty of even this Lego that we're smoking right now, this amalgamation of all these different flavors from seven different tobaccos that they've naturally sourced and made some magic out of. That's what I really appreciate.
**Poobah:** Yeah. If I sat you down in a conference room and pulled up an investor deck and said to you, Senator, here's the market.
Here are the, here are the consumers in this market, and I've done some market research and it says that the market opportunity with, with some of these flavored cigars that we can have as a [00:23:00] br uh, put under our brand that won't hurt our premium cigar. based on the research, and we can make millions and millions and millions of fucking dollars, you would say.
Sounds like a really good idea. Totally.
**Senator:** That that's where I'm not just under, I mean, understand we're coming at this from different angles, right? You're talking about this from a business standpoint. Yeah, of course. I agree with that. I'm talking about as a consumer, that's all I'm saying. As a consumer of cigars, sure.
To me, I, I, I don't, I find them
**Poobah:** offensive as a cigar smokes. I'm like, for me, for my palate. Absolutely true. Finds true. I would never smoke one, uh uh, unless I was on the desert island. That's very true. And yet, and then I maybe even wouldn't. Yeah. But that's not the point. The point is, is that it's genius.
It speaks to, it's, it's, it's genius. He captured that market. You gotta give the respect. You gotta give the guy respect. Look, a bunch of us for being creative. That's cr, that's a, that's a creative business mind at work. A few of
**Bam Bam:** us in this room, own companies, we're totally on board with that, and I totally agree.
But just one quick note on what Senator said. [00:24:00] It's so fucking hard to make a cigar taste good. because you're using only natural organic materials, right? The artistry, the craftsmanship, it's to be appreciated. Right. And if the listeners are listening to this, you know, the whole point of this podcast, uh, one of one point is to educate and to make aware of the fact that these things are not easy to make, and the better quality is cigar, the harder it is to produce.
**Grinder:** So I, I'll make one more closing comment on acid, because we're not reviewing the acid cigar. No, we're not. But the, the reality is, you, you can't equate, technically, you can't equate an acid cigar to a Philly blunt or backwards because, totally agree. Because the acid is actually made like any other cigar, it's hand rolled, touched 200 different hands.
It's, it's actually aged a little bit and it's rolled by premium cigar rollers, and it's a real cigar and has, aside from the infusion, which is a trade secret that he has, [00:25:00] aside from that, however the fuck he does that. it, it could very well be, uh, you know, just ano another nominal, you know, run of the mill, you know, light medium cigar, who knows?
But it is, it's still a premium handmade cigar. It's, you can't equate that to the argument of people who are saying, you know, cigars and flavored cigars. They're just, you put 'em in the same, put 'em in the same line up as cigarettes, because you can't, I mean, you can't. That's correct. You can, you can do that maybe for Philly blunts that are hand, you know, they're, or backwards.
They're backwards. You know, they're not even, it's not even full leaf tobacco. Right. And it's, it's not handmade and it's, they're machine
**Gizmo:** rolling and you can buy them in a gas station and you can buy them in a gas station. That, to me, you can't buy these cigars acid or any, you, you'd buy Philly blunts and those other, you know, machine made cigars and gas stations.
I've, I've
**Bam Bam:** seen acid in c a O in some gas stations. Sorry. .
**Gizmo:** They're premium gas stations. ,
**Poobah:** I was gonna just about to say that. I'll
**Bam Bam:** take you to one that I
**Poobah:** know and I'll show you firsthand. . [00:26:00] Yeah. You, you could buy like marijuana paraphernalia and, and an acid in a shell station, but, um, but this is good. The and, and this bourbon.
Yeah. Let's talk about the bourbon. The bourbon, uh, is really good. Eagle rare. Eagle
**Gizmo:** Rare, huh? Yeah. Made by Buffalo Trace
**Bam Bam:** is somebody in this room masterfully pairing scotches with some of these cigars? Because this goes great with this sco, with this bourbon. This particular
**Poobah:** stick Senator paired it up.
**Gizmo:** It's really nice. It's, it's so, it's,
**Senator:** this was a gizmo pairing. Oh, it
**Gizmo:** was? Yeah. What the heck? I, I, I've loved this bourbon for a long time. It's hard to find. So when I, when I do find it, um, I pick it up. It's not, , you know, you can get a for, you know, 50, 55 bucks, but isn't it hard to find? Very rare. It's, it's very hard.
**Senator:** It's, it's really hard. And to your point, it, it's, it's gotten harder over the years because years ago, my, my brother-in-law, he loves bourbon. And so, um, I think it was right when he had probably graduated college years [00:27:00] ago, I had gotten him a bottle of eagle rare, and it wasn't hard to find. It was maybe 45 bucks.
Founded at a liquor store in Manhattan. And I, I was recently at a bourbon tasting and I was trying to bring a bottle and I had looked for eagle Rare, I can, could not find this anywhere within 50 miles Yeah. Of where we live. So I'm not sure what's happened, but tell us a little
**Gizmo:** bit about it. Oh, so, you know, it's been, it's, it's one of the most popular bourbons that Buffalo Trace makes.
So obviously we know Buffalo Trace, you know, and some of their other brands, I think they make Basil Haydens and some of the others as well. But Eagle Rare, you know, they've been making it since 1975 in Frankfurt, Kentucky. Right in the good old, this is our first US. Pairing, by the way, is it really the wine?
I think we did wine from California, but we haven't done a, uh, a whiskey of any sort, uh, from the United States. So this is our first one, A whiskey with an knee wi whiskey with an knee. Uh, but yeah, it's, it's 10 year aged and it's really, really good [00:28:00] bourbon.
**Senator:** So I wanna say the thing that turned me onto Eagle Rare when I first had it, if you look at almost any bourbon bottle that you can buy in a liquor store at a reasonable price, right?
I'm not talking about some crazy expensive bottle. There's no age statement on it. It's, it's, you know, bourbon of varying years that they've aged and blended and what turned me onto Eagle Rare, it's the only regular production bottle of bourbon that I have seen with an age statement. And it guarantees on there that it's minimum 10 years age.
And I was intrigued by that because as a, as a scotch drinker, I'm used to, you know, buying something that I know exactly how long that's been aged before, you know, I'm gonna consume it. And when I tried it, I was impressed with, for a bourbon, I found it to be pretty smooth. Uh, a fairly complex flavor, a flavor profile.
I, I, I actually liked it and I haven't had it in a few years now, so I'm glad that Gizmo had a bottle of this. It's very
**Gizmo:** good. It's it's purpose, you know, it's [00:29:00] purposefully, uh, uh, scarce by design. You know, they're never gonna reach the, the, you know, the supply demand, I guess you call it equilibrium.
They're always gonna re, you know, hold it back cuz they really want to drive the, the rarity on it. But I'm, with that being said, I'm, I'm. surprised that they don't jack the price up on it because they don't
**Bam Bam:** I was about to ask
**Gizmo:** you, what is the price? It's, it's 30 s msrp p from what I understand. But you're gonna find it for 50 55.
That's where, that's what you're
**Poobah:** gonna find about, right? Cuz the demand on it demand. So there's an interesting documentary on, on Netflix called Papi Gate. I don't know if you guys have watched this. No, I never heard of it. So, so Pap, so Pappy Van Winkle is that we all know what we all know is made by Buffalo Trace.
Uh, this is, it's, it's like the original bourbon. Uh, and, and, and that so , it's a very interesting documentary and for the listener and everyone in the room, I'd recommend that you just watch it cuz it's fascinating because what ended up [00:30:00] happening was the workers at Buffalo Trace as the business evolved, which is a family business, as it evolved over time, workers were stealing.
Bottles cuz their inventory management process was not, you know, good. And the business was based on trust. We're stealing literally like hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of bottles. And I think even barrels, to my recollection of wow aged Papi Van Winkle. Then these have aged statements on them. Uh uh, so this is a premium, very desirable.
And then selling them, uh, locally in Kentucky. And, uh, and this would, by the way, this was a huge, uh, investigation. People went to jail. Um, and there's this whole. [00:31:00] Mystique about Pappy Van Winkle that captures, uh, bourbon drinker's imagination. Um, uh, and then this anonymous tip eventually led the, uh, the Franklin County Sheriff, um, uh, to the home of, of, of one of the workers there.
And they found five barrels, I think, in his home. Um, and they were selling this locally in Kentucky. So there was a whole little, there was a whole. Uh, I recommend watching the documentary because it gives you insight into what happened at Buffalo Trace and some of the re, like some of the overhauls they had to make, uh, the family was hurt by this whole scandal.
Um, but at the end of the day, they were so focused on making quality product and be, and treating their employees properly. But I think some of the economic, um, factors, uh, in Kentucky and then, you know, opportunity means opportunity. Uh, [00:32:00] you throw in a little bit of motive based on that and people, you know, broke, broke some laws and knew it was going on, and then, and it went on for years, years and years.
Um, and a lot of people went to jail. So, um, anyway, it's, it's, it's, it's a pretty cool show. I recommend watching. I'll definitely
**Grinder:** watch it on Netflix. The, the fascinating, it wasn't just Peppi, they were taking everything. Oh, they were taking everything. They were taking everything, yeah. And, and the other. I mean, they, so at the time, I don't know if they still do this, but it started because you give a little, and then you give a little more, and then people take a lot and you Yeah.
That, that's right. So, so they, so they, they, there was a, I don't know, maybe I, I, I'm recollecting incorrectly here, but I believe there was a tradition of like, people on the line taking, taking product home. Yeah. And it was, and it was known, right? Yeah, it was, and it was known by the distiller, it's known by Buffalo Trace.
And they were more than happy to have their people [00:33:00] imbibe and share in their product, because that's just the culture. But they are, you know, to your point, there were some greed,
**Gizmo:** greed kicked
**Grinder:** in. Yeah. I, you know, the, the funny thing is, I think at first the guy, he wasn't selling it. He was just like, he was just taking a lot of it and just, it's getting hammered.
You know? I think at first, I think he, I don't think he was actually, you know, trying to sell, but then it got outta hand. . And, and he, he, you know, he was at, you know, he was at local parties with big wigs and they said, oh, I heard you have a barrel of this. And that's right. And, and then it became like, oh, I'll give you x amount of dollars for that.
And then he is like, shit, I can do something with
**Poobah:** this. That's exactly right. It was like the slow, it's very interesting. That's coming back to me now because the, there was the slow burn, um, that started to happen where it was like, oh, I have access to Pappy Van win. You know, I have access to some Pappy, and you'd have some people over and then like word spread that, that this [00:34:00] was available.
You've got thoroughbred racing that's happening all around there. You know, there are people coming in and outta Kentucky, high net worth people. And it was like, oh, you can get me a bottle. Oh, I'll share a little bit. And he was sharing it and sharing it, and then it was like, oh, I'll give you $500 for this.
And it wasn't like in the documentary, I, if I'm remembering COR correctly, it was almost like he did it and he made like, Five, $6,000 or something and was able to get extra Christmas presents for his kids. And then it just kind of snowballed. It wasn't like he made millions this guy, but there was a lot.
But there's so little Pappy Van Winkle that they actually produce that, that really ate into, um, the business, uh, and hurt the brand, uh, over time. And it's stealing. Yeah, of course. Theft. Does anyone,
**Grinder:** do you like Pappy, by the way? Is anyone here?
**Poobah:** I've never, I've had it. I've never
**Grinder:** had. I've had it, had it. I've had, I've heard mixed reviews.
Never
**Bam Bam:** had it. Never had it [00:35:00] Definitely
**Poobah:** heard mixed reviews. You gotta get over the, you've gotta, you, you know, the mystique and you see the bottle and, and the price. And the price. . Yeah. I've never
paid
**Gizmo:** for it. And there are bottles
**Senator:** that go in
**Gizmo:** the thousands. 15,000
**Bam Bam:** I've heard.
**Poobah:** Yeah.
**Gizmo:** So I'm seeing here that, uh, I didn't know this, but they also make an eagle rare 17 year old and what they call a double eagle.
Very rare. , which I'm assuming is just impossible to find, but I mean, Eagle, Eagle, Doble, ,
**Senator:** I, I'm just, the scale of Buffalo Trace is, is unbelievable because you just, I I, I still am stunned that this has a 10 year aid statement on it, and it's only, you're telling me the MSPs essentially $40? Yes. 30 bucks. $30.
And even at $50 it feels like a steal because you think of other bourbons that actually have age statements, like a famous 10 year bourbon is minter's 10 year, it's like a great gift. If you know someone who loves bourbon, you wanna get a really nice gift. Minter's 10 is like the gold standard, and that's [00:36:00] like a four, $500 bottle of bourbon.
Wow. How on earth, this has a 10 year age statement as a bourbon, and it's going for the price. It is. I, I don't even understand it.
**Gizmo:** It's, it's crazy. And the other thing that I, I find really interesting about this bourbon, I mean, a lot of bourbons are, are lower proof, but it's only a 40, uh, 45%, 90 proof.
Bourbon. I would've thought it would be more, but I looked at the bottle. It's only, uh, it's only 90 proof. Yeah, it's very smooth. Yeah. Maybe that's very smooth. It's tasty. It's very, speaking of tasty, this cigar, we're about halfway through now. Yep. I'm really
**Senator:** enjoying this. I have to say, the flavor has, it's definitely changed.
It's changed. I'm getting molasses and cocoa. This, this is really delicious. It's like a meal.
**Poobah:** It's a big smoke. So
**Bam Bam:** I've got a question, question for all of you guys here. Would you pick this up and keep it in your humidor? Yes.
**Gizmo:** Really? Yes, I would. Okay. I, I would definitely, I could definitely slot this in, into [00:37:00] my new world, kind of outdoor smoke, like a put, you know, in that padron slot.
You know, I like some tato, his as well. But, uh, this, this is
**Senator:** really nice. That's great. I'll say it's too early for me to decide, just because the last third is what's really gonna be telling for me with this cigar, if it. lives up to what it has so far, then I'll know. But, and
**Grinder:** the
**Bam Bam:** real, real estate in your, in your humidor is very limited.
**Poobah:** Yes.
**Senator:** Right? Yeah. I mean, exactly. We've only , we've all got full tower humidor. There's only, there's only so much space. But what I, what, what I do like about this cigar, this slot, this could potentially slide in for me after a big meal. Something that's gonna hold up. This is exactly the kind of cigar, you know, where I would normally slot in like a full flavored padron after a big, heavy meal.
This has that body that would definitely satisfy
**Bam Bam:** me. So I was gonna go there next. How would you compare this to some of the other full body cigars that we like, like the exclusive, as an example, it's a full
**Grinder:** body stick. I think it's rich. It, I think it's richer [00:38:00] in flavor. I agree with that. Yeah. It, it's buttery
It's, I agree. You know,
**Senator:** it like coats
**Grinder:** your mouth. It, it's on, you know? Mm. It's on your lips. It's,
**Gizmo:** you could definitely gift me one of these man .
**Poobah:** Anytime. I just gifted
**Bam Bam:** you one today, .
**Gizmo:** You did. I'm, I'm surprised by the way to hear Roosters say that. Well, pleasantly, I mean, obviously knowing Rooster's p and what he's smoking a lot.
I mean, um, I'm kind of surprised
**Grinder:** I would've lost my bed. I
**Bam Bam:** have never seen Rooster smoke a legal of bravada ever. I've known you for a, a while now. I've had, I've had a couple of these in the past. Yeah. Yeah, me
**Gizmo:** too. This is really good.
**Rooster:** Yeah. And it's very media. It's, it's a full, it's a full
**Bam Bam:** cigar. Do you think we get caught up in pursuing the elite cigars to the point where we overlook a lot of these new worlds?
**Poobah:** Well, to me, this is an
**Bam Bam:** elite cigar. It's a Oh, no doubt. There's no doubt. But we do, we tend to overlook the new world category. I,
**Senator:** I, I think to, to BA's point, I mean, it's the question, you know, I, I, I, I'm willing to admit right o of New World [00:39:00] cigars. I, I smoke petron and Davidoff and I try other things, but there's really nothing I keep a significant stock of in my tower.
Other than those two new world brands and Liga as a brand, I, I've certainly overlooked. I, I mean, I've tried their stuff, but I've never bought a box of Lis. I've never bought more than a single of a Liga, and this is definitely opening up my mind to, um, trying some more of what they make because I'm, I'm really enjoying this so far.
**Rooster:** Yeah, it would be nice to have a few of these in your humidor. Like the Senator said, you know, after a nice meal, big meal, end of the night, as your last, last stick, you want something with a lot of flavor. This is definitely a meaty cigar. It's, uh, it's rich. and it's got, uh, you know, it's got great burn. I mean, it's, look at the smoke output on this.
I mean, I think it's definitely, uh, it's good to have a couple. So give me, give me a five
**Gizmo:** pack instead. .
**Grinder:** I'll remember that. Not a single, I'll remember that. My, my test on like strength [00:40:00] is the retro hell. And on my retro hale on this thing is like making me, it's too much, too. I'm afraid to retro.
**Bam Bam:** It's like it's on this stick.
I am,
**Grinder:** it's, it's heavy. It's making me sneeze. It's like a, I don't know. It's, it's got a lot of, it's got a little fight. I also like burning from the smoke coming here.
**Senator:** I know, I know. ,
**Gizmo:** I to piggyback on what Senator was saying, I mean, you know, this is kind of make, you know, as we're doing this podcast, we're, we're exploring stuff that we don't regularly smoke in our regular rotations.
And it's, this is definitely making me more optimistic about what's to come from the new world that we haven't tried. That's where, because I, cause I we're kind of where I'm going. Yeah. Because I, I just change is, is I'm not a guy that likes change. . I like the group of people I hang out with. I like the things I do.
I don't search for other things often. And the podcast is certainly forcing us to do that. And this is really making me look forward to, to what's coming. They're not, they're not all gonna be hits like this. We're not gonna have conversations about cigars. We haven't smoked like this, but I'm kind of like feeling [00:41:00] good about, you know, what's common.
Well, I
**Senator:** also wanna talk about something that Liga does that I, I think I discovered during the pandemic, I'm not sure if guys are familiar with, so Liga, Bravada has this like Liga Bravada Club. It's like a cigar club. Is anyone familiar with this? Yes. So I couldn't believe this when, when the pandemic hit.
I remember. I mean it just, we're just desperate to find anything interesting to do consume our time when it's early in the pandemic. And so I'm just trying to find, you know, new cigars, things I'm not familiar with. And I remember going into a tobacco shop and I see these cigars with these really odd bands.
one literally looked like an iced coffee on the band. Another had something else, an iced coffee one. It was actually called the, it was a liga Thai tea. Uh, they, they basically, they have this cigar club where you can sign up. And I like the whole idea of this. I never signed up because I wasn't a liga guy.
I mean, this is probably the second league of cigar. I'm smoking my entire life. And they [00:42:00] have this cigar club that they've created where they send you every month a different ci. and it's all these limited production, limited release cigars. It's not their, you're not gonna get a league at nine. It's gonna be something that they're just gonna put out once and that's gonna be it.
And I like the idea of the, the community around that. I mean, I think that's part of the reason that we're doing this podcast and what the lizards are about, right? We wanna bring people into this hobby that we're so passionate about. And I really respect, I've always said in the back of my mind, I wish that some of the cigar brands that I love did something like this.
I mean, how amazing would it be every month to get a different patron drone? I mean, we'd sign up tomorrow for something like that. No
**Grinder:** doubt about it. You know, if Davidoff did no.
**Senator:** Something like that. Oh, no doubt. I think we'd all sign up. So I have to give league a lot of credit. And then I thought it was a really clever idea.
And the following that they have built through this is so intense. So there are some cigars, like I said, they'll ship out monthly and others that they'll drop with a limited release on a certain date. And the reason [00:43:00] I remember this is because that Thai tea I was talking about, this was. 2020 New Year's Eve, they dropped it at select retailers, and I'm just reading online, like people on forums and on social media are flocking to tobacco and is trying to get their hands on this cigar.
They only released a very limited number of them, and I just thought the whole concept was fascinating. So I hope other cigar brands will start doing things like that. I think it would be really fun for a lot of us.
**Gizmo:** I think it'd be great to me. You know this, the League of Provato means private blend, right?
So I guess when they started blending these things, this specific cigar, The League of Nine was made for the c e o of, of Drew Estate. Not Jonathan Drew, a guy named Steve Saka. Right. So they made this for him, and I guess him and the people that worked there loved it so much. I'm sure they fed it through the club.
People freaked out and that's why it became a regular release. But to, to Senator's [00:44:00] point, I, I wish more brands would do this. Gentleman's
**Bam Bam:** name again was what? Steven? Steve, I think it's Steve Sa Saka. I read, I read something earlier today and he said, and I, I'll quote it if I can find it. I wanted to make a cigar that I was proud to hand to other people in the industry.
And that's what this, the dis the origin of this cigar
**Poobah:** is particularly,
**Gizmo:** isn't he the foundation guy? Steve Saka? No,
**Pagoda:** that's, uh,
**Gizmo:** Nick Ma.
**Rooster:** Steve Saka sounds familiar. I don't know what else he blended.
**Grinder:** The, um, the other fascinating thing about Drew Estates, this, this cigar. . They used to give the cigar to the guys and gals who rolled the cigars as they were rolling the cigars.
They'd be smoking them. And they were so good and it, it got so hot. Like the market for this guy just kind of blew up that they said, we, we can't give you guys these cigars anymore. , cuz they're smoking these cigars as they're rolling them and it's inventory that's going out, you know, going out the door, frankly.
And it's a premium, it's their premium blend. Right. So there's lost revenue there. [00:45:00] Right. And it was because it's a premium price, it could be significant. And they were smoking a lot of them. And what they did was like, okay, we'll make a new blend with the same wrapper but a different blend and it's gonna be priced a little lower.
And that's the underground. So they make the underground. The underground was. This is a really great cigar, have this, and then they started smoking this cigar and it's like, God damn, this is just as good. Mm-hmm. not just probably a little
**Bam Bam:** less, it's a little less expensive. Yeah. Yep. And a
**Grinder:** good stick. Yeah.
So, and then, and then they, then they said, okay, this is actually a great stick also. Let's market this thing. And they did. And, and that I think the underground, we, you know, it's not as premium as, as Lego bravada by any crown. I I think it's a good cigar. It's like
**Gizmo:** a cousin. Yeah. It is like a Exactly. It's like a younger's, a good way of putting it.
It's a younger cousin and they offer it. They not only offer it in, they offer, uh, a shade, a sun-grown, and a Maduro in the underground series. So you can kind of, kind of work your way up as you develop your pallet. And, um, and, and, and this is [00:46:00] getting
**Grinder:** cleaner. Go through it. This is definitely getting cleaner.
One
**Bam Bam:** interesting thing about the, the demand on this particular cigar, I'm ki I'm really happy that we're reviewing it because a lot of people love it. I went to three different establishments today. I think I talked about it earlier. Impossible to find the first establishment I went to. I said, do you guys have the league of number nine?
And they laughed at me out loud. They laughed, and they said they haven't had it for weeks and they're not gonna get it for months. Wow. Yeah. I found that at the third place and not the one we were looking for at this particular size is what they had. Hmm. The Toro.
**Gizmo:** Right. So, bam. To your point on scarcity with this cigar, I mean ob obviously we're seeing it Industrywide.
I mean, new World, old World, I mean Cuba, we obviously understand why Covid, they had a lot of shutdowns there, a lot of problems everywhere did. But we're seeing it with Patron, we're seeing it with obviously this cigar. You're saying you went to three shops today, couldn't find it. Like, what is going on with the scarcity?
I,
**Bam Bam:** I was really surprised because I saw Patron at every shop I went to, but I was surprised that they made that statement [00:47:00] about this particular cigar. It
**Grinder:** was re really
**Senator:** surprising. There's a reason for that. Just in, in doing some reading on this, cuz I, I, I'm fascinated, I've pre covid seen in, in different tobacco shops and retailers that there hasn't been a lot of these.
There's like one size of it available or they're completely sold out, and now I'm understanding why, what this says here, there are only four pairs within the League of Factory that are certified to produce the number nine. Each pair is allowed to make only 250 cigars per day. Wow. That's, it says the cigars are then aged a full year before offered for sale, very limited production, so they're not pumping out a lot of these cigars.
And then you factor in, right. Cigar demand has increased during Covid. That's why it's hard to find these. These are not, I always, for whatever reason in my head, I think because of the whole Drew Estates and they have all these different brands and lines, I assume that it was just this giant mass produced operation in what I'm seeing, at least for some cigars, [00:48:00] like the, the League of Nine, that's not at all the case.
It's smaller production, but I think that's
**Gizmo:** a good sign too, as far as quality. I mean, they're cl, they're clearly focused on that, like pedron, apparently there's one woman. One roller that rolls the 80th, that's all she rolls, and she's the only one that does it. When she misses a day, there's no 80th anniversary, you know, cigars rolled that day.
So it, it, that, that is a good sign to me. Wow. And obviously if the underground is something that they're pumping out a lot more,
**Senator:** can I just say that's a good thing? It's actually very funny that you, you mentioned that, that there's one woman that makes that, because just the other day I saw this video, I forget what it was, what website it might have been ca uh, where they went inside of the Padron, not the, I don't think it was the Miami place, maybe it was a place in Nicaragua where they're rolling these and it's this big room and in the front of the room there's maybe four rows.
All of them are sitting at tables next to each other and it's all women that are rolling the cigars. And I [00:49:00] found it fascinating because I feel like there's not really a story told about like, Women in the cigar business, and it was amazing to me. And the, the guy commentating, and he's with, I guess, war hate Pedro, is talking about how only women basically roll and then behind them there may be four more rows of men who box.
And it was just, I, I just never knew that. I, I for some reason, you associate, obviously there are, there are plenty of men and women's cigar smokers, but the role that women play rolling and, and within the business is, it's, it's amazing.
**Grinder:** Very interesting. No pun intended on the role. Yeah, the double roll.
**Bam Bam:** It's still very interesting fact. I had no idea.
**Gizmo:** I, you know, and, and when we have Jorge Pedro drone on at some point, um, I, I definitely want to ask him about that because I've heard, I, you know, obviously that's a, that's something I heard as, it's an anecdote I heard from somebody, but I'm curious if that's true.
And, and, and what, uh, do,
**Poobah:** do we know, um, the size, do we know the, the various sizes or violas that, that this is available in? It's in the
**Bam Bam:** Robusto [00:50:00] Corona Vita, um, Double de Toro. Of course. Double Corona, not a double Toro. Um, it comes in that, what, what would you call the shape The flying pig? Is that, I don't even know what
**Grinder:** Colorado.
It is a shape. I mean, that's the shape of the shape
**Bam Bam:** is that right? Name, shape. It's fabulous in that shape, by
**Grinder:** the way. It's a, it's, it's like a 58 gauge and it's like this,
**Bam Bam:** it's a little football. It's fun to smoke that cigar. Yeah,
**Senator:** this, there's a lot of shapes actually. Wow. A lot. We're obviously smoking the Touro.
There's the re robusto, bam. Mentioned. Yeah. Corona Vita is the most popular, uh, they call it the flying pig Perfe. Perfecto. Yeah. The Corona Vita. Uh, Viva Bam mentioned. Right. A double corona, a belly coso. And they even have what they call coronets, which are cigarillos of this. Oh,
**Gizmo:** okay. Oh
**Poobah:** wow. Is that right?
Wow.
**Senator:** Hmm. Oh, and sorry, there's a landero. Oh my. What's God. But it's a short landero. They call it a short [00:51:00] panatella. and they say landero slash penton. What's the, what
**Poobah:** are the dimensions in that? Corona, Viva Viva.
**Gizmo:** It's
**Senator:** 46 by something, right? Yeah. Uh, six by 46.
**Poobah:** Interesting.
**Grinder:** So you mentioned it's aged one year before it's sent out.
There's gotta be more age on this thing than it's, it's, it's definitely
**Gizmo:** ages aged than the, they rolled the cigar. Yeah.
**Grinder:** Pre agent.
**Gizmo:** Agent in the warehouse. I saw. It was one I saw. It was one year. That's
**Senator:** all I saw. One year. And the wrapper, it says is fermented for 18 months.
**Grinder:** There you go. Okay. So then, so then it's aged two and a half years.
**Gizmo:** Yeah. Right. I'll be honest. Then the tobaccos are all saved probably. Yeah. Before they even blend them. Exactly. Yeah. The, by the way, the accidental pairing with this eagle rare. Complete accident, but it, it, it really is pairing perfectly. That goes
**Bam Bam:** back to what I said 10 minutes ago who came up with the pairing.
Yeah. It was an accident. Now, the last home run that we had with the last cigar and pairing was spectacular. And this pairs beautifully with this
**Senator:** particular cigar. [00:52:00] Yeah. The, the only, the only thing I had suggested here and, and I think is, is instructive, just as you're trying to pair things generally with a cigar.
I know the League of Nine is a full flavored smoke, and so to me a bourbon actually would hold up really well with that. Something. More body and structure to it. And you know, it's a higher proof, right? Like a lot of, there are scotches that are just 40%, this is, you said 45, most bourbons are 45, 40 8%. So just something with the body to hold up to a full flavored,
**Gizmo:** and I think the sweetness, I think the sweet about
**Bam Bam:** was to say that I was about to really pair as well with this.
Do you think a sweeter, uh, spirit goes well with a robust, uh, cigar like this? Maybe like a rum? Do you have to have a, could be a rum, does it
**Gizmo:** work? A rum could work rum well too,
**Senator:** I think with any Maduro or just, you know, dark rap, dark sweet wrapper like this lends itself well to something like
**Poobah:** that. Sure.
Yeah. I asked about the Absolutely. I agree. I asked about the sizes because it is a full bodied cigar. And, and I guess before we, we, we get to rate [00:53:00] this, like I could see myself smoking this, um, in Rob Robusto and really, so a little shorter. Yeah. And really, really liking it, like, We're in the last third.
We've smoked the, we're basically at the end. Now I'm, I feel like, um, for me personally, like it's not like it was, I didn't, I didn't enjoy it. I've enjoyed it thoroughly, actually. Uh, but for me, I could see this in a re buso format where it delivers like a lot of a, a lot of flavor. And it's actually power-wise, it's not as like, quote unquote, I would say powerful.
I know some if I'm jumping through a review too quickly. No, but you're not. But, but, but, but it, like, it doesn't, like, it doesn't, I don't feel lightheaded. I don't feel, feel It's not giving you the jitters. No. It's not giving you the jitters. No, it's just a lot of, it's a lot of cigar.
**Gizmo:** Um, to use a phrase that you say often, I think this is a very [00:54:00] approachable ci.
in, in its flavor and its strength for, for an experienced, for an experienced smoker. I don't think that that was
**Senator:** about, honestly, I, I would not call this approachable, really, and I, I say, so for me, approachable is a cigar that you could give to almost anyone on the spectrum that smokes cigars. And, and to me, this cigar, it's not a criticism of it, it's just trying to parrot with the right cigar smoker.
I think this is for someone who either smokes a lot of cigars and so is just used to, you know, a lot of flavor in a given day, or someone who really maybe just smokes one cigar a day or a week, but likes a really full flavored cigar. And I think that's who would like this. But if you smoke, you know, a Connecticut shaded cigar regularly, I think you're not, this is
**Gizmo:** not in your, but I guess the reason why I say it's, no, it's not.
I guess the reason why I say approachable is just because it's so smooth in what it's deliver. like, it, it is a smooth cigar. It's really,
**Bam Bam:** it doesn't make you nice, you know, it doesn't make you dizzy. Right. It doesn't make your stomach hurt. No. Like a lot of the other cigars would in the new world. Right.
But I'm, I'm [00:55:00] very pleasantly surprised that you puba liked the cigar. And I'm saying that from the perspective of a listener, cuz a lot of listeners aren't at the point, I'm not gonna say all of them, but most, they're not buying elite level cigars. So for this group to love this cigar or enjoy it tonight,
**Poobah:** I think, well, I'm an old world guy.
Oh, totally. We, we know that. We know that. But, but, but, and, but I really enjoyed this. Yeah. And I'd say, you know, keep an open mind if you're to, as a change of pace. So for me personally, I'd love it. I would, I would, if I could find this in Rubo, I'd buy a box. I'm getting you
**Bam Bam:** a.
**Poobah:** Thank you. That's
**Gizmo:** on record Accept, by the way, that's on record Puba, so we're
**Bam Bam:** have to but Out Flying Pig.
But I'll split it with you though. .
**Gizmo:** Seven Ways. . I'll take six sevens of it. Julie.
**Poobah:** Noted in the minutes. Done. Done. Um,
**Gizmo:** so I think, I think
**Rooster:** anybody who smokes a pod drone
**Gizmo:** cigar would love this cigar. Yeah, yeah. I agree with that. Now
**Bam Bam:** I'm gonna make a controversial, uh, a a [00:56:00] question I'm gonna ask a controversial Okay.
Right, go ahead. So, you know, we have, as this group a accused, a lot of cigar makers pursuing the type of and quality of a Pedro drone. They're very similar, but we don't smoke them because what the fuck is the point of smoking that cigar when we can have an, now we're smoking this
**Grinder:** particular stage.
**Senator:** Well, we, we don't, just to clarify, we don't smoke them because they're not similar.
They're
**Grinder:** trying to, they're trying to be, but
**Bam Bam:** they're not similar. Right. How do you, where would you put this particular cigar that you have in your hand and how do you compare that to a petrol? Let's talk about that for a second.
**Senator:** Well, I don't, look, I, I think all these brands are their own brands, so I don't, I don't know that we were comparing them as the, you know, not, they're intentionally not the same.
They're, they're a distinct brand for a reason. But I think, you know, rooster's point, I very much agree with where if you like a very flavorful cigar, which is what a Patron drone delivers, then you're gonna like a League of nine. Yeah.
**Poobah:** I, I'd like so I appreciate what you're saying. Bam. But, but, but what I would argue is, is that [00:57:00] Pedro drones are Nicaraguan perros and it's a pure, so you're getting a different, very true.
A very different experience. This is a, this is a Drew Estate's, uh, creative blend that's delivering something that's, Of its own. Where if you look at, if you look at the, you know, it's just, I think, I don't think it's apples to apples. I, I don't think it's fair to compare. Okay. To compare. Got it. Nicaragua piro to this in any way?
I think,
**Gizmo:** I think the, the one thing I'll say about what they're trying to do here or whatever anybody's trying to do, I like the art of what they're doing in, in creating these blends and really trying a lot of different things and trying to find something that sticks and I think they've found it here.
I do too.
**Poobah:** Great. I did. Agreed. And I think Agreed. The last
**Senator:** thing I'll say, you know, I hate creativity for creativity's sake. I always worry when, whether it's cigars, whiskey, just about anything. When there's this crazy new thing that's [00:58:00] created, usually I look at it and I say, well, that's probably a marketing gimmick.
And what I really give Georgia State credit for. This is not a marketing gimmick. This is actually a really well done creative blend and makes me want to experiment with some of the other stuff that they make. So I, I, I say that as a skeptic usually of, of things that are, are trying to be extraordinarily creative.
Cuz I think sometimes it's, it's for the wrong purpose. And I think here it's served them really well, perfectly
**Grinder:** stated. So I, I think this, I really, I really enjoy the cigar. Um, and it'll, it'll come, you'll see evidence in that, in, in my rating at least. The, um, the thing I like about the cigar. And I would, I would argue, not argue, but I would say that I could, I could definitely smoke this to the end and, and not feel overwhelmed if I smoke it lightly slowly.
I smoke it slowly, I smoke it lightly. I let that billow take its time because it, it's a hefty cigar and it carries its fucking weight [00:59:00] and it does it through the whole time. And it's, I'm at, you know, the last third. It's transformed a little bit, but now it's just, it's even smoother. It's more chocolatey.
It's more mellow. And I can smoke it for an hour and 20 minutes and enjoy every one of it, and I'll, and I'll smoke it like I drink a scotch. I'm, you know, I'll, I could smoke it for the whole time and I'll have two SCOs and, and I'll call it a day. Whereas other cigars, I might have two or three of them and, and be in the same time span, time span, you know, I think this is, for me, this is a cigar that I can really
**Gizmo:** enjoy from success.
I think you're onto something there, because I think that if you try to rush this and make it really hot, if you're pulling a lot on this, I think it's gonna be a much different experience that we had tonight. If you're trying to stuff this in to 50 minutes, under an hour, I think you're gonna have a real struggle, you know, feeling like we do about it, right.
**Pagoda:** I'm not sure what you're talking about because I'm
**Gizmo:** to Yeah. To note I'm closer to the end. Yeah. To note for the listener, pagoda has about a half inch left and we're all in the last room. His fingers are burning
**Senator:** right
**Grinder:** [01:00:00] now.
**Bam Bam:** Exactly
**Pagoda:** right. I'll tell you, I've really enjoyed the cigar and I, I think, uh, it was the last one third, I got a burst of spiciness, which kind of faded away very quickly.
Back to a little bit of the creaminess and the sweetness. I'm really, really enjoying the cigar and it's kind of, uh, coming to an end. It's kind of disappointing. Yeah.
**Poobah:** It, I should keep going. Yeah. It, it, it made me, it actually, um, you know, that feeling you get when you smoke a cigar and it makes you feel good?
Yeah. Like, it makes you feel, you get that kind of like, that jolt. It, it wasn't like a nicotine rush, but it was just, it's just enough. I felt really good smoke in this, so,
**Gizmo:** um, I think it's very, it's very satisfying. Wow. Yeah. It's very satisfy, satisfying, I gotta say. Wow. Yeah. It's surprising. Yeah. I'm very happy about it.
Well done. Bam. Wow. I just bought it. All right. Are you guys, uh, are we ready to give it the formal lizard rating? What do we think? Let's do it. Everybody ready? All right. Brewster, you're up.
**Rooster:** Lot of flavor on this stick. I mean, I really enjoyed it. I think we're gonna give it a nine.
**Poobah:** [01:01:00] Wow.
**Grinder:** Whoa, wow. Rooster nine is a high nine.
**Senator:** That is first new World
**Bam Bam:** Series Elite rating. That is an elite, elite score.
**Grinder:** Wow. I'll be honest, I, if I could do an 8.5,
**Rooster:** I would, but I think
**Gizmo:** that's, wouldn't mind only rookie scores here. That's great. All right.
**Poobah:** Pba, go. Uh, for me, it's an eight. Um, I, I, I think, uh, for my palette, I would've enjoyed it. I, I, I think the full experience for me in a, in a re uh, in re robusto would probably be enough.
And maybe the rating would be higher, but for me it's an eight. Very good. Highly recommend it. Really liked it.
**Gizmo:** I am in the same exact category and, you know, to mimic your thoughts, this is an eight for me. I'm very happy with it. I, I definitely will get a few of these and put 'em in my humidor. And, uh, in the summer, I definitely expect to smoke a lot of these, but to your point, in rub, Robusto probably, or Corona
**Senator:** Senator.
So I, I'm in a similar camp as, as the last two lizards in that I would also give this an eight [01:02:00] for my palate in the sense that, you know, as I'm smoking this cigar, the reason I, I think I, I would compare this to a, a patron 90th, not that the flavor is the same and by any stretch, the flavored notes that you get, but that it just delivers a full flavored experience in a smooth, non-aggressive way that's just gonna, you know, hit you over the head with nicotine.
Um, but for what I seek. . You know, it's rare that I say that a cigar almost has too much flavor for my palate, and in this size this is a little bit more than I want out of a cigar. And so I would pick this up again in a rub robusto. But would it make it into my everyday rotation? No. Only because I, I smoke a lot of cigars in a sitting and I, if I had just one of these touros, I'd probably be done that, that would be it.
And, and I wanna try a number of things in a night, so I know, you know, we joke that rooster, you know, a breakfast cigar for him is a [01:03:00] bero 90th, and he could probably like this up for breakfast, but for me, who smokes in quantity, um, it, it, it wouldn't make it into my everyday rotation. But every now and then, I absolutely would smoke this again.
So it's a strong eight. So
**Rooster:** that is the reason why I gave it a nine, because all the points that you made, cuz sometimes I only smoke one cigar in a day and
**Gizmo:** mm-hmm. and I would pick Oh, that's true. That is true. The point and the second point.
**Rooster:** About comparing it to a padron 90th, which is my,
**Gizmo:** you know, I smoke a lot of those,
**Rooster:** so this is very similar to that.
And I think it's, it's, to me, it's like a, like a late hour too, which, which is another cigar that I would smoke just one cigar. If I was just gonna have one stick, I would do that.
**Pagoda:** Yeah. This is a tough one for me because I don't know, uh, I prefer the double Corona for some reason. And, uh, I've been debating whether a's an eight or an nine.
Uh, but, um, you know, cons, considering that I, I'm the first one to, uh, kind of finish this, uh, really [01:04:00] enjoyed every moment of it. Uh, I think I rated a nine
**Gizmo:** my man grinder.
**Grinder:** Wow. I'm a nine, nine.
**Bam Bam:** Wow. Excellent. Oh my God. Bam. Bam. No pressure. Bam. No, I'm at an eight, a solid eight. You know, I've had this, I had this for, I've always loved this cigar, but I never, you know, I, I've learned many things about cigars with you guys around me, but, um, I'm very pleasantly surprised at this rating.
It's quite an elite score.
**Senator:** This is what happens when Senator doesn't do the math,
**Gizmo:** unfortunately. Yeah. I'm fucked. I fucked this up real good.
**Poobah:** Why, why do you, why do you have the producer doing? Can you have I did it. I did it. He started before I Did You have IV league? Do the math. Yes. I need, I need Harvard Math.
**Senator:** I'm gonna, I know, I'm gonna need to check the math. Okay, here we go. I did it.
**Bam Bam:** Grindr. Grindr, please take over Grindr. I
**Grinder:** did it as soon as
**Gizmo:** we finished. 24 plus 27.
**Grinder:** 8.43.
**Poobah:** Oh, here he goes with this. That is Georgetown
**Gizmo:** in his head. All right, so the composite lizard score [01:05:00] is an eight point. I am completely shocked.
I am too that this cigar delivered what it did tonight and, and that the lizards enjoyed it to the degree that we did. I, I'm really, really surprised,
**Senator:** shocked. I'm too because we, I, I mean, I never really see guys picking this up now. I mean, I know Bam said he used to smoke a number of these and, you know, um, Grindr and some others have obviously had this before, but I think all of us would smoke this again.
And, uh, I'm glad, you know, thank you for sourcing these. I, I'm glad we tried this. Yeah, I'm sure.
**Gizmo:** I'm glad you found it. Bam. I know it was tough today. Yeah.
**Bam Bam:** You know, we talked about cigar selections a week ago when we were texting each other, and this is an obvious one to try.
**Poobah:** Yeah. Very good one. Thank. Bam.
Yeah, well done. Bam. Thank you. And,
**Gizmo:** and again, the pairing with this was really, really nice guys. Wonderful pairing. Yeah. Really, really
**Senator:** nice. Good thing you had this, uh, giz cuz the eagle rare is not easy to
**Gizmo:** find. Yeah. I, I've had this for a while. I'm glad I had a bottle. And a, by the way, Paris
**Rooster:** fantastic. With a non-alcoholic Brooklyn
**Gizmo:** logger.
I gotta throw that in there. All right boys. An 8.4 for [01:06:00] the Liga, number nine in Toro. And uh, we'll see you next week. Thanks Father, thanks so much for joining us tonight. Hope you enjoyed it. Don't forget to leave us a rating and subscribe on your favorite podcast platform. If you have any comments, questions, if you wanna reach out, say hello, tell us what you're smoking, email us Lounge lizards pod, p o d, that's lounge lizards pod gmail.com.
You can also find us on Instagram at Lounge Lizards Pod. We really appreciate your time and we'll, uh, we'll see you next week.