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Uncharted Entrepreneurship - hosted by Brent Peterson out of the Minnesota chapter of Entrepreneurs’ Organization – brings you daring stories straight from the trailblazing entrepreneurs who are unmapping business frontiers across every industry. Settle in around our virtual campfire as Brent sits down to pick the brains of startup pioneers, visionary founders, and intrepid CEOs whose origin stories - marked by unexpected twists, lessons, and stumbles along unpaved paths - will inspire your own trek in launching a boundary-pushing venture. Trading war stories, strategies, and even warnings, these audacious guests invite fellow founders and future leaders into their confidential circles in a uniquely transparent, wise, and motivational way. So join us off the beaten business trails to light your entrepreneurial fire!
Brent Peterson (00:02.93)
Welcome to this episode of Uncharted Entrepreneurship. Today I have Todd Heselhorst. He is the founder and CEO of Healy Labs. Todd, go ahead, do an introduction for yourself. Tell us your day -to -day role and give us one of your passions in life.
Todd Haselhorst (00:19.477)
Yeah, thanks for having me. So Todd, CEO and founder of Healy Labs and I day to day run the operations, manage the teams, clean the toilets, clean the dishes, any role that really needs to be done in the organization. think CEO is a chief everything officer and you got to be able to pick up things and move them along as necessary, especially in the early days of a SARTO.
Brent Peterson (00:50.276)
And how about passions?
Todd Haselhorst (00:52.891)
Passions, yeah, I'm very passionate about innovation. I'm very passionate about economics and creating economic models, business models, and leveraging technology in order to make things more efficient, ultimately. In conjunction with that, a big passion of mine is self -awareness and self -discovery, meditation, yoga, breath work, things along those lines that
you pivotal to managing stress throughout the entrepreneurial journey.
Brent Peterson (01:23.74)
That's awesome, good. And I'll have some little recommendations as we go through for some of that offloading and yoga and all those fun things. But before we get started, you have graciously volunteered to be part of the free joke project. I'm just going to tell you a joke. All you have to do is give me a rating one through five. And I have a lab joke today. maybe you could use this as part of your work. But here we
What are scientists' favorite dog breeds? Labs.
Todd Haselhorst (01:57.767)
I don't know.
Todd Haselhorst (02:02.251)
That's a good one. That's a good one. So I'm going to have to give that a four and a half.
Brent Peterson (02:09.798)
Okay, excellent, thank you. All right, so let's dive in here. I mistakenly said that Healy Labs was how to make better shoes that have the little heel and the little wheel on the back of the heel. You corrected me, it's not that. But tell us a little bit, give us some background on Healy Labs before we dive into things.
Todd Haselhorst (02:30.441)
Yeah, so to understand where Healy came from is, I think, to understand where I came from. So, I grew up in Kansas.
Kansas City actually and started my first company when I was 12, mowing lawns for my neighbors. Always grew up, my dad was a dock worker at a warehouse, associated wholesale grocers. My best friend's family was a freight broker. So I always grew up in and around freight and logistics and the movement of things. Got to high school, got my first scholarship offer to play football for the University of Kansas when I was a sophomore.
Ended up choosing to go to KU and got my degree in economics and game theory while I was there. Won the Orange Bowl in 2008. And at that point, the markets had crashed. So I had a decision to make. Do I go back into...
into finance and Wall Street, which was, you know, had burned the ground ultimately. Or do I do something else? And so I went back to my roots and helped a friend start a freight brokerage. And really at that point got deeply involved in the freight side of the world. And at the same time, you had the rise of web two technology like Twitter and Facebook and others that had created the platform economy. And so I got really deep into the technical
of it and ended up starting and selling two different platforms in logistics technology. And each time we had the same problem, which is that we had all these systems that we had to connect and integrate with. They didn't really talk to each other very well. It was very inefficient to connect them. They all had different data, different data models.
Todd Haselhorst (04:17.739)
and ultimately data silos all over the place. And so I actually had the idea for Healy back in 2016, but the technology wasn't ready and available at that time to do what we're doing today. so I basically, know, Healy is a culmination of all my life experience. It's a culmination of all those random coincidences and decisions that I made along the way that led me to where we are today.
Brent Peterson (04:48.53)
That's interesting. So I was in the e -commerce space for a long time and ran an agency. We worked with the front of logistics, meaning just the shipping part. I more recently did a gig as a sort of a fractional CTO where I had more of the exposure to the ERP side and WMS side. So tell us a little bit about how your logistics, your solution helps businesses.
solve their logistical problems.
Todd Haselhorst (05:20.297)
Yeah, so again, the main problem is data silos. So in a shipment, you may have five, six, seven, eight parties that are involved with moving that from origin to destination. You may have, you know, may have drayage on the front end, ocean in the middle, drayage on the back end, going into rail or truckload. And all those are different companies that are involved. And so,
Currently, each one of those companies has their own data silos. And the way that people manage it is they use the old -fashioned phone for text messages, emails, and then they make phone calls. So ultimately, each of those parties is calling and trying to get that information so that they can update their system. So what we did was we created a network that connects all those systems and creates a unified data layer.
so that everybody's using the same information, everybody's updating the same information in real time, ultimately increasing predictability, profitability, and sustainability because you're decreasing things like errors, theft, fraud, and waste ultimately from that process.
Brent Peterson (06:36.318)
Wow, that's a great solution. Tell us a little bit about why, I mean, you told us why you got into it, but tell us a little bit about the journey you had to starting this and maybe a couple of things that you wish you would have known before you started
Todd Haselhorst (06:53.363)
Yeah, so I guess the best way to explain this is that I didn't know why I had made the decisions I made in life until I had the aha moment one day. So I was in Kansas City, I was living there at the time where I'm from, and I was shaving my head and I was thinking about the problems that we were having with one of the platforms that we had built.
And all of a sudden I just had a flash of insight. I had this moment where I was like, wow, okay, here's exactly how this would work. So the whole idea for Healy came to me in a moment. And at that point I knew the technology that we're using wasn't mature. It wasn't ready. It was too slow. was too expensive. It wasn't scalable. And so I waited and
Ultimately, in 2022, when I saw the technology had matured, when I saw that things were more scalable, faster, you had account abstraction, zero knowledge proofs, you have decentralized identities, all these things were coming into fruition. I knew, okay, now is the time to do this. So.
What I didn't realize was the impact that FTX was going to have on the industry as a whole, meaning the Web3 industry. I didn't realize what that would do to the capital markets. I didn't realize what that meant for consumer sentiment and business sentiment and ultimately the reputation that damage that that would have on the industry as a whole. So that created a headwind, if you will, where
I had obstacles that I had to overcome because of the behaviors and things that happened from other people within this space. And so it made it very difficult ultimately to do a business to business project within the Web3 space because you had this uncertainty around...
Todd Haselhorst (09:07.379)
the regulatory and the compliance side. So after all the FTX stuff happened, then people were talking about regulation, they were talking about compliance a lot more. And there was lot of uncertainty, and to some degree still is. And so that created a lot of headwinds that we then had to try to overcome in all the conversations that we're having with people. And so...
It was very challenging to be able to explain things in a way that people would actually be able to grasp the concepts of in a way that wouldn't cause confusion or wouldn't cause people to think about some of the things that had happened in this space.
Brent Peterson (09:56.488)
Tell us the connection between, or explain the connection between FTX and your logistics business. Like why would there be a pushback for logistics because of the FTX failure?
Todd Haselhorst (10:08.139)
We're in the same industry and so FTX captured the headlines. And so when you talk, when we were talking about Web3 in 2022 and in 2023, everybody would reference back to, or lot of people would reference back to, oh, isn't that the FTX thing? Or from a technical perspective, we would talk about.
some of the underlying technology that we were using and that people would be like, isn't that like a picture of a gorilla or something? And so we had all of the perception in the minds of the audience was created by a lot of the sensationalism and what was on the media and in the news. And a lot of what was in the media and the news at that time was FTX and what was happening with FTX and
some of the things that caused within the Web3 industry. And it definitely put a black eye on the industry. Then it also created additional questions around the regulatory and compliance side of things.
Brent Peterson (11:14.746)
Interesting. So part of what your solution includes like blockchain that's going to help people understand the root of their product or or or their product that's going through logistics.
Todd Haselhorst (11:29.931)
So sort of what we do is we tokenize data and we tokenize the underlying assets. So if you look at BlackRock and some of the things they've talked about where they believe Wall Street is going to be completely tokenized.
We're taking that same concept and we're applying it to logistics. Because when you think about assets in general, logistics is full of assets. You have products that need to move from point A to point B. You have the trucks, the trailers themselves. You have the people. You have the facilities and the locations. And you also have the space inside of it. So all of those are assets.
And so our network creates, it tokenizes all those assets and it tokenizes all the data underlying those assets to provide immutability, interoperability and liquidity between all those different components.
Brent Peterson (12:32.734)
As an entrepreneur, how do you feel your impact is to the broader landscape, the global landscape?
Todd Haselhorst (12:43.467)
So I think in general, entrepreneurs are producers and creators. So they have a massive impact and ultimately shape societies and economies that are around the world.
The innovation and technology that they create leads to economic growth. It leads to new jobs and employment opportunities for people within societies. It also creates an environment of competitiveness. It has the impact on society in general. That ultimately leads to things like social change.
better education, more sustainability, and things that ultimately make the world a better place. I think in general, entrepreneurs and the role of an entrepreneur is to connect the world, empower it with tools and innovation, to create and evolve the species in general, and to create a better world and a better society.
Brent Peterson (13:53.416)
You had mentioned earlier about sustainability and how you're helping to build a better sustainable logistics journey. Tell us a little bit about
Todd Haselhorst (14:07.487)
Yeah, so when you look at the problem I was talking about earlier, where everybody, have text messages, phone calls, and emails as a way of collecting information and then also sharing information, it's very inefficient because things get lost in translation, right? A lot of the waste that happens is due to a lack of intelligence around...
Where is this product box, pallet, truck, trailer, container, warehouse within space and time? And what is the condition of it? Where is it going? Who has custody of it? Things along those lines. So when you put that all into data and aggregated data layer, the efficiency is much greater because now
all the data is in one place, all of the assets are in one place. And essentially you're just connecting all the parties with, you're just matching, you're using AI and algorithms ultimately to enhance the networks. And that leads to efficiency and ultimately makes the world more sustainable.
Brent Peterson (15:24.67)
How have you seen the, I know that you mentioned that things kind of changed in 2022 or maybe it became more mature. Was that because of some of the innovations around AI or machine learning or tell us a little bit about that change, the date that you mentioned earlier.
Todd Haselhorst (15:46.483)
Yeah, so the technology became available and more efficient. Can you hold on a second? I'm having a... Hold on.
Saul Hudson (18:14.813)
Hey, Brent.
Saul Hudson (18:22.624)
Yeah, he's obviously able to message me on his phone. Should I tell him to get on his phone and do it that way or
Brent Peterson (18:32.702)
Um, we have 15 minutes. If you wanted to re -record some of it, we could do that.
Saul Hudson (18:41.667)
Let me see how quickly we could get something
Brent Peterson (18:43.548)
Yeah.
Brent Peterson (18:48.584)
Or if you wanted to sort of, I would like to sort of make it seamless. if you wanted to do another recording later and we could kind of close things out, that would also
Saul Hudson (18:58.391)
Yeah, right. I get it. Let me see if we can get an estimate for when he can be
Saul Hudson (19:21.922)
It was a pretty good conversation up to
Brent Peterson (19:24.466)
Yeah.
Saul Hudson (19:48.021)
I've asked him when he can join, when he thinks he might be able to join back in and he has, he's typing an answer. So I'll tell you when I
Brent Peterson (19:53.854)
Sure, that's awesome. Thank
Saul Hudson (20:01.586)
Okay, he says it will only be five minutes and he can reset.
Brent Peterson (20:04.368)
Okay, excellent. Where are you located, Saul?
Saul Hudson (20:07.828)
So we're both in Miami, actually.
Brent Peterson (20:09.276)
Alright. Yeah, you also don't really sound like you have Florida accent, but I'll guess.
Saul Hudson (20:16.107)
Yeah, yeah. I am British. But I've been here a while and the accent won't leave
Brent Peterson (20:18.993)
Yeah.
Brent Peterson (20:23.888)
Yeah, my friend moved from Leeds to, well, he moved from Leeds to Minnesota to Miami. So he's also in, I can't remember which part of Miami he's in, but there's a big expat community for English people.
Saul Hudson (20:29.556)
Okay.
Saul Hudson (20:37.728)
It's popular, I think the weather. lot of people come here on vacation because of the weather and then they like it and they think, well, hold on, maybe I could move here. there's an awful lot of transplants in Miami, both from within the United States, obviously different areas of the world, like Latin America, Russia. yeah, we Brits, there's a few of us too.
Brent Peterson (20:42.685)
Mm -hmm.
Brent Peterson (21:05.458)
Yeah, awesome. I have heard though it's not as easy to find all the English food you might. Maybe it's more up the East Coast rather than down in Miami.
Saul Hudson (21:12.937)
Ha.
Saul Hudson (21:16.403)
Don't worry, think of all the things that English people should be nostalgic about, it's not the food. We're not culinary experts.
Brent Peterson (21:24.103)
Right. I mean, I went to school in Birmingham and I'll say I was there a couple of years ago and the food situation has dramatically gotten better, especially in the Midlands.
Saul Hudson (21:29.183)
really?
Saul Hudson (21:35.23)
good. Yeah, think, you know, it's become increasingly international. Certainly when I was growing up, the main meal that we would always want to eat at a restaurant was the Indian curry. You know, it had nothing to do with any longer tradition. My dad sometimes visits me from Britain. The first thing we do is we go out for a curry nearby.
Brent Peterson (22:02.206)
Yeah, that's funny because my Indian friends do the same thing. They come from India and then we go out have a curry.
Saul Hudson (22:23.645)
So this delay complicates my life. I'll tell him this as well. I have to get off at Miami time 12 .45, which is in 15 minutes.
Brent Peterson (22:32.37)
Yeah, yeah, when we can get back on we'll wrap things up and I'll edit it all together.
Saul Hudson (23:45.082)
The signs of life from Todd, right?
Alright, you guys carry on. I'm going to have to get off in 13 or so minutes, but if it goes longer, great. You guys carry on. I'm going back on mute.
Todd Haselhorst (23:50.487)
We're back.
Brent Peterson (24:00.84)
Alright, yeah, the joys of Mexican internet. We had an office in Mexico City for quite a while, so I spent a lot of time
Todd Haselhorst (24:01.413)
Thanks, Brent.
Todd Haselhorst (24:11.624)
yeah, yeah, it was an unforeseen challenge.
Brent Peterson (24:14.11)
Yep. Good. All right. Well, we'll kind of close things off. I think you had just finished talking about AI and logistics and things like that. So let's think of a good way to kind of wrap things up. Is there anything that you'd like to kind of emphasize in last five, 10 minutes?
Todd Haselhorst (24:42.671)
Yeah, do you want to just dive right into it? Okay, So, yeah, so in logistics, so when you think about you have all this data, you have shipments, all these different components, and ultimately AI and algorithms can match those more efficiently than humans a lot of times. matching the right trailer with the right truck with the right driver,
Brent Peterson (24:44.732)
Yeah, yeah. All right, Todd. Yeah, go ahead.
Todd Haselhorst (25:12.693)
with the right shipment, ultimately optimizing all the different components of that shipment lifecycle. One of the biggest challenges today is that if you don't have the necessary data to make those decisions, either from a human perspective or from an artificial intelligence perspective, you're ultimately not gonna be able to make the right decision. And so the data is available, it exists, but
you know, we built that data layer that connects all these different systems together to bring this data into one location so that you can apply machine learning and AI to it and ultimately optimize for better outcomes.
Brent Peterson (25:50.462)
So Todd, we have a few minutes left. What would be your prediction now for the rest of the year in terms of logistics and where logistics is heading? I know that from my own experience, being more in the commerce space, the LTL shipping part of logistics is still a problem and getting quotes from a driver or from a company that's just doing LTL. Are there...
a lot of things coming down the pipeline that are going to change dramatically in terms of the entire logistical landscape, not just the sort of last mile and front end of how logistics works.
Todd Haselhorst (26:30.223)
Yeah, so I think if you look at what's happened, have the last mile network has been pretty well optimized by companies like Amazon. So the end consumers, they press a button and in a couple hours they can get packages delivered to them. The middle mile though, what it takes to get that distribution network in place and all those logistics in place is still very inefficient. And so...
That's the piece that we're primarily focused on. Now, the industry as a whole is still in a freight recession. So it's still, we're still in the process of emerging from that freight recession. I don't see that really changing until people have more discretionary spending and they can start ordering.
you know, online or they can start buying at the rates that they were, you know, prior to the last couple of years. So I think that good indicators would be interest rate cuts, I think can drive economic growth. And I think that drive of that economic growth will increase people purchasing, you know, goods and...
That will be a good early indication as to when we can get out of this freight recession. Now, the other piece on the freight recession side is that during the pandemic, we had this massive boom in e -commerce because everybody was staying home and they were ordering things online. So that created a massive boom in the freight and logistics markets. then...
all these companies, these carriers started coming online and all this additional capacity came into the logistics network. And so some of that over capacity is still working its way out. And I think that we should see by the end of 2024 and into 2025, kind of a reversal of the freight recession, which is perfect timing for us to come in.
Todd Haselhorst (28:37.337)
with solutions that will create operational efficiencies, make companies more profitable, ultimately increasing their bottom line and helping them grow and scale their business.
Brent Peterson (28:49.438)
So if I'm really hankering to get a container from the US to Hawaii before 2025, waiting until December might be a good idea.
Todd Haselhorst (29:02.425)
Yeah, could be a lot better at that point.
Brent Peterson (29:06.846)
Todd, we have a few minutes left. As we close out, should say, as we close out, I give everybody a chance to do a shameless plug about anything they want. What would you like to plug today?
Todd Haselhorst (29:19.205)
Yeah, so follow us on Twitter at Healy Network. Join the conversation in Telegram at Healy Community. Check us out online. Follow us on socials and be in touch. you want to collaborate, work together. We're open community. We want to work with those who are wanting to innovate.
Brent Peterson (29:43.496)
That's awesome. I'll make sure I get all those on the show notes. Todd Hasselhorst, Hazelhorst, I'll get the name right. It's been such a great conversation. Thank you so much for being here today.
Todd Haselhorst (29:56.549)
Yeah, likewise. Thanks, Brent.