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Welcome to Keeping It Independent from Wyffels Hybrids. This podcast will focus on answering questions farmers face every day. We’re going to approach each question or topic from an unbiased, independent perspective and provide the best information we can to help you make the best decision for your operation.
Hey, corn growers. Welcome back to another episode of keeping it independent brought to you by Wyffels Hybrids. I'm Eric Wilson. I've got Jared Goplin on today, the, agronomy manager from the, great dry north. Notice I didn't use white this time, Goplen.
Eric Wilson:How are you doing today?
Jared Goplen:Not too bad. Unfortunately yeah. Honestly, it's dry enough. I would take a little bit of that white stuff just to get a little moisture in the system. And looking back, I think it was 2020.
Jared Goplen:So 4 years ago, we did have a nice, like, 8 inch snowfall on this day. So despite the fact I'm not ready for snow, I would take a little moisture.
Eric Wilson:I it's so dry across the state. I mean, I I think guys are just they're begging begging for moisture. It's incredibly dry. The field fires that have come up this year, the combine fires, it's this harvest is gone really quick. I think a lot of guys are rounding things out or getting very close to being done.
Eric Wilson:I know there's a few guys that are done already. So we're starting to get some questions on a big topic today is gonna be fertility, dry fertilizer, and anhydrous applications, especially in in light of some of these extremely dry soil conditions. So, I know I I I know we have the rules, for soil temperature, and we're ways off from from the soil temperature at this point, but we're still getting the questions, probably more importantly about dry soil conditions. And it sounds like maybe a few guys have tried to go in your area applying some anhydrous, Goplen. Tell me about, a little bit what you're seeing and how that's turning out so far.
Jared Goplen:Yeah. There's been obviously a fair bit of tillage done, especially, you know, starting, I suppose, a month ago when, some of those soybean fields started to come off. And even back then, you know, there was a lot of large clods. Right? The soils have been fairly dry.
Jared Goplen:I did pull it up this morning, for basically most of Northern Illinois, Iowa, Southern Minnesota. I think the the big winners are maybe an inch and a half is about as much as we've had since September 1st. So if we look at that in terms of, you know, average, you know, basically, everybody is at the 20 percentile or below. You know, sitting where I'm at, we're at, like, the 5 percentile for for rainfall in September October. So and that will I guess, thought that was important to mention just because that will frame up the rest of our discussions here, kinda revolving around dry soils and Yep.
Jared Goplen:And what that means. You know, so the one thing I guess I would mention on tillage in general before we get into that nitrogen conversation and whether or not the anhydrous is staying where it's supposed to be is, you know, think about with the fall tillage. I know there's the old saying that a bad job in the fall is better than a, halfway decent job in the spring or however that saying goes. But there's some huge clods out there. So, make sure when you are considering fall tillage, that you're gonna be able to knock those down in the spring.
Jared Goplen:There there will be some fields I think we will have to hit twice in the spring. And and if you're fine with that, that's fine. I realize that tillage needs to get done in some places. But do whatever you can to keep those clods to a minimum so we're not dealing with basketball sized clods next spring. You know, if you kinda translate that into an anhydrous, scenario, yes, there have been a couple of anhydrous rigs, that I've I've seen.
Jared Goplen:And I've I've heard some talk about how well that's working up in the north. We are still too warm, so, I don't think you have our permission to start quite yet. We'll definitely put an emphasis on 50 degree soil temperatures and decreasing. You know? So we still have a a bit of time here.
Jared Goplen:You know? The forecast is gonna be warm. We're gonna we're gonna have plenty of time to get this done. You know? Even if we get 2 inches of rain, hopefully, it's still gonna dry out and soak in quick enough.
Jared Goplen:I think we'll be able to get most of this fall tillage and anhydrous on before, you know, freeze up, basically. Make sure you get out there when the soils are cool. I'm not too disappointed that there's been some stuff out there, at least just to see how things are going to work, see if that soil is going to seal. And that's really what anhydrous is about, is getting that gas. Because when you put it in the ground, it's it's a gas.
Jared Goplen:Right? And that gas will either leak out or, you know, it'll basically stay in the soil, and it really is looking for water. It needs enough water to to bind to and basically convert into ammonium. And that's the form that we want the the nitrogen, that ammonium to to stay into, through the rest of the fall season and really ideally up until, next spring after we plant corn, you know, so that that that nitrogen isn't going to be moving around. It's a little more protected in that ammonium form.
Jared Goplen:So need the water? I guess the best way to tell whether or not it's working or not is is really just to to put the rig in the ground. Go out, you know, after a couple of minutes and see if you smell it. If you smell it, that gas is seeping out. If you don't smell it, it's staying in the soil.
Jared Goplen:Kind of word on the street so far is the low mirror ground. It has been working fairly well. Anything that's a little bit heavier clay, and that would be those basketball you know, if you're doing tillage, it's it's causing some basketball sized chunks to come out of the ground. It's just too big of cracks, and that gas is is not being able to seal very well, behind that. I guess sandy soils would be in the same boat.
Jared Goplen:Those sandier soils are gonna have a little less water sticking around, so more likely to seep out as well. But I guess your nose is the best indicator, I guess, on whether or not that gas is staying below ground where we want it.
Eric Wilson:Yeah. I I I so, just to call out our our brethren across the Big River, Goplin. Emerson Nafsiger put out a nice publication. It circulated amongst our group saying a lot of the similar things that you were saying for the state of Illinois. You know, try to avoid some of those, more clay soils, some of the sandier soils where we know we're gonna struggle to hold nitrogen, and we have a higher likelihood for leaching, be it this this winter.
Eric Wilson:If we get a mild winter or even in the next spring, I'm glad you called out the basketball thing. If we're pulling up basketballs, dirt clods the size of basketballs, it's, it's probably gonna be tough to get anhydrous to seal. So it's just wildly dry. I know you and I were talking before we hit the record button. We probably should have been recording the whole thing, but then it would have been an hour long because I know how you and I like to get to talking, but, it's it's incredibly dry.
Eric Wilson:And I I think it could rain an inch, 2, 3 inches, and I don't think it would keep anybody out of the field for for a significant amount of time. It's just, we need some moisture back in the soil. Like you said, you gotta have water for it to bind and convert to ammonia. Otherwise, we're not gonna seal up. And then I will call out.
Eric Wilson:I've seen it. I've seen fall application, in some previous years in Northern Iowa where we didn't get the anhydrous band sealed up well, and it actually creeped up, and I was seeing root injury the next spring from fall applied ammonia. And that can be significant if it takes off those those initial roots, that seedling root system. It really sets those plants back. A lot of times they do pull through it.
Eric Wilson:They do make it, but they end up being rut rut like plants before they can get the nodal root system established. So, just be thinking about that as we're making applications. I would encourage the same thing. There's probably some areas where I think it it could go okay, but you're not gonna know until you you get out there and try it. But, as far as I'm concerned, we're just the soils are just too darn warm at this point to be trying anything.
Jared Goplen:Yeah. I know one of the other conversations I've had a lot this year around nitrogen was, you know, this year being incredibly wet. You know, we've had a lot of conversations about, you know, how much of that nitrogen stuck around. You know, there's some areas where maybe corn yields were a little disappointing. You know, you go out and you pull maybe do a basal stock nitrate test or something like that just to see.
Jared Goplen:And and, yeah, nitrogen was deficient, severely deficient in some cases. So I've had a lot of conversations leading up to this even before dry soils about thinking about your nitrogen system and, you know, how you can make that a little more resilient. So one of the things I guess I'm thinking about is this fall, if, say, you're not real confident that, you know, every acre of your ground is going in let's say you're you're planting anhydrous. We're gonna start there. Let's let's say not every acre of your ground is going to take that anhydrous perfectly.
Jared Goplen:Right? You're gonna lose a little bit. Maybe some of it'll it'll it'll leak out, right, as gas. Maybe there's a way next spring you can change your system a little bit to add a little bit of nitrogen next spring. So an easy one easy target is with the pre.
Jared Goplen:Right? If you're putting 10, 15 gallons of water on with your pre, maybe you use 32% or 28% with that. So you can maybe, pull back a little bit on your fall fall nitrogen rate and rely a little more on that spring because it it'll help even things out and just gives you a little bit a little more resiliency. It's kinda like hedging your risk a little bit. So I've encouraged guys to think about their system and what makes sense logistically.
Jared Goplen:You know, logistics will trump agronomy every time. But if there's ways logistically you can work in a little diversity in your system without adding a bunch of, you know, extra headaches or other field passes, I guess I encourage guys to think about that.
Eric Wilson:It's it's good you bring that up, Goplin, because I I would say as a whole, you know, we spent a tremendous amount of time this summer talking about nitrogen and what we lost and what we were seeing. And there was a lot of guys that went out, did supplemental applications. They decided to split some things up. They made extra applications. They used inhibitors.
Eric Wilson:They used nitrogen stabilizers. When we get a year like that, the more those tools or diversity, I guess, like you said, that's a good way of putting it, you add to your nitrogen program, the more likely you're gonna be successful when we have a year that we have above normal leaching and losses. So I would encourage the same thing. Logistically, if it makes sense, if you can split nitrogen applications up a little bit or, you know, especially if we're going in the fall, I highly encourage the use of, nitrogen inhibitors, nitrogen stabilizers. Any of those things, I know they cost money, and it might not seem like much, but they add up, and they can matter in a year when, mother nature doesn't play in our favor to to keep a nitrogen in the ground where we need it.
Jared Goplen:I guess the other call out here too is, I feel like this shouldn't have to be said, but I think we're gonna say it anyway. And, fall urea is always a bad idea. There has been a handful, not a lot, a couple of of fields that I've dealt with this summer that and fall that did not yield well, and it was a 100% fall urea. And and the problem with that is it converts. It's in nitrate form really quickly, and it that's just prone to loss.
Jared Goplen:So we did lot lose a lot more nitrogen with that fall urea. And that and that's really why, I guess, I don't like that practice no matter where you're at.
Eric Wilson:And it it's near impossible to stabilize urea. You know, when you put those urease inhibitors on urea, that's all they're inhibiting. They're they're inhibiting volatilization. Right? So that's that's half of the urea, essentially.
Eric Wilson:It it it's really hard to stabilize urea, if not impossible. How about the other, the other big one guys you're talking about right now? Dry fertilizer applications. Because that that corn price is ever so favorable to spending money on more fertilizer. Right, Goblin?
Jared Goplen:Yeah. And, unfortunately, the fertilizer quotes have not come down quite as much as we'd like, especially phosphorus. That still seems to have a little bit higher price tag than what we'd like.
Eric Wilson:You know, we were kinda batting this one back and forth before we got on and hit the record button, but, I put some numbers together. You know, these are these are numbers and I'm hearing for fertilizer prices for my area, Jared. So, let's assume let's assume 250 bushel corn is what you hauled off this year. So this would just be in grain removal. And if you take a, MAP price of 7.70 a ton, that would equal a 168 pounds of MAP that you would need to put back just for removal, which comes out to $65.
Eric Wilson:And then if you also include the potash removal, that would be a £105 of potash at 4.50 a ton, being $24. So we're, you know, we're right at $90, not including application, just for a 250 bushel corn removal, which is significant. You and I know how this goes. Corn price is down. Guys need to make cuts somewhere.
Eric Wilson:Fully understand that process. What are we hearing? I know you were talking, there's some research out of universe excuse me, University of Minnesota about some recommendations when fertilizer prices are high, crop prices marginal to low. What are guys thinking about possibly doing up in Minnesota? Because I I think it's it's similar and maybe a good practice or something to think about as we move down into Iowa and the rest of the Midwest as well.
Jared Goplen:Yeah. And I guess just, you know, thinking back too, I mean, hopefully, guys, when prices were good, maybe put a little more fertilizer out the last few years. Right? You know, thinking about that fertility as kind of a bank account to some level. Right?
Jared Goplen:A little bit. But, yeah, for the most part up here, I mean, yeah, p is out of line. Phosphorus is out of line a little bit. And most soils, if you've done a good job of managing fertility, we can probably pull back a little bit on that phosphorus rate, and we'll be okay. So if you are trying to trim a little on the fertilizer bill, which, I mean, I guess I'm in that same boat.
Jared Goplen:Right? I don't wanna spend a ton of money when there's not a lot of money coming in. You know, maybe trim a little on that phosphorus rate, but keeping that potassium rate a little bit closer to what you're planning because, you know, the last several years, I've seen a lot more potassium deficiency than than phosphorus deficiency. And I think most of our soils probably have reasonable levels of phosphorus. I mean, this isn't every soil.
Jared Goplen:Obviously, if you have some soil tests and you and you're calling, you're in that low to very low category. We you know, it's a pretty pretty darn good likelihood you're gonna get money back out of an application. We're talking about those soils that are maybe in that optimum or, you know, high or very high category. You're still putting something out there. You know?
Jared Goplen:Those ones we probably can trim a little on the the phosphorus rate and and be just fine. But keeping that that potassium rate is, you know, a little bit closer to what we thought, I think is a good idea. I don't know if you're thinking the same thing, Eric.
Eric Wilson:If I've got say I've got 10 soil tests in front of me, Jared, I I'll bet you 9 of them come back, and the the phosphate is optimum to maybe a little low or high, somewhere in that category. I don't see soil tests going backwards on the phosphate. The the thing that sticks out, and it probably stick out on all 10 of them, is the potassium is not where it needs to be. And I think part of that's an artifact of we're just, you know, we're just getting tremendous yields. Maybe we're doing 2 year spreads, and we're using up a lot of that potash for the corn crop and robbing a little bit on the seed crop or the soybean crop.
Eric Wilson:There's lots of situations. Right? I mean, having up to date soil test is extremely valuable because it it gives you some flexibility in in making some of these recommendations. Right? But, I would encourage the same thing.
Eric Wilson:If we're gonna trim somewhere, trim a little back on the phosphate and continue to try and push the potash levels at at what you've been doing, if not even higher, because those are the ones that typically come back low on on a soil test. And and I will say potash, in particular, Kaye, is is really critical to mitigating a lot of plant stress. When we when we have stock integrity issues, when we have dry soil conditions or or drought issues, k is really important to helping that crop get through that situation, from a physiological standpoint. So it's not something I wanna be short on. It's it's not that phosphate is less important.
Eric Wilson:That's not what we're saying here at all. Right, Goplen? It's just that phosphate tends to come back in a lot better shape on the soil test that we have been looking at broadly. So, having those up to date soil tests is gonna let you be a lot more dangerous in what you can do in in terms of dry fertilizer rates. But if we're just throwing a a dart at a blank board and trying to make a guess, my guess is that your your phosphate is probably okay, and your potash is probably quite low.
Eric Wilson:And that's the one I would encourage to, you know, make sure you keep applying. And that that's also the cheaper product of the 2, and it it always has been. Now everyone wishes it was a little cheaper yet, but, that's the one I would continue to make sure we're we're spending our dollars on if we do have to make a cut somewhere. So you you brought up a good point on the the likelihood of response. You know, the way these soil test values work without getting too deep in the weeds, Basically, if you are on that low to very low end and you apply based on what your state says that you should apply for that soil test, the likelihood of getting a yield response is, like, in the 80% range or if not higher.
Eric Wilson:And then it it tapers off significantly as you get in that high and very high category. So that's why we we always big proponents of pushing fertilizer because you need the bushels, especially when corn's worth what it is. You you gotta have the bushels.
Jared Goplen:80% of the time, it works every time.
Eric Wilson:Right? I love that. 80% of the time, there there's a title. Nick's already writing it down. I promise you.
Jared Goplen:I've had
Eric Wilson:a few questions on soil testing. You wanna talk about that a little bit, Goplin? I mean, it's very high conditions across Iowa. I've been getting some reports that, you know, guys running around with hydraulic probes. It's taken 30 to 40 seconds to try and get that probe into the ground to pull some of that, pool of dirt to get it to the lab.
Eric Wilson:So the quite, you know, p not necessarily p, but k and pH level can be very much affected by dry dry soil conditions. I guess what I would say, there there's some research out there on the k. It can move that soil test result 5, maybe 8 percent in in what I've seen. It probably depends on where you're at with, you know, what state you're in. That can differ.
Eric Wilson:But what I would say with the k is that generally isn't gonna move you into or out of one of the buckets. Right? The very low low optimum. So I wouldn't necessarily be too worried about potash scores or k results from a soil test, but I would watch the pH. I know you looked up what Iowa State said, Goplin, what it was.
Jared Goplen:Yeah. It's about 0.1 to 0.4 pH units lower Yeah. Than than what it actually is if if the soils are really dry.
Eric Wilson:Which that could be significant. I mean, you know, not lime's important, and we need to get lime applied if if we are at a low pH level. But, yeah, those dry soil conditions can can really offset a pH score. So just keep that in mind if you are having some soil test pulled and and, maybe make those adjustments or best guess on what you're seeing.
Jared Goplen:Yeah. And just to be clear on the on the potassium, levels as well, those typically are a little bit lower in dry conditions. So just Yes. I mean, when you're interpreting, I mean, I'm still a huge proponent of, you know, recommending soil testing, especially if you're due for it, you haven't tested in the last several years. Just keep that in the back of your mind.
Jared Goplen:I mean, if soil conditions are really low really dry, you might see a touch lower k levels than what you're expecting maybe. And and don't you don't have to get crazy on adjusting your, your management as a result of that. Just something to keep in mind.
Eric Wilson:Yep. Which I would say just use it as is because a big fan of having extra k out there in my opinion. So
Jared Goplen:Yep. Kind of a worst case scenario. And I mean, that's kinda what the crop is experiencing too. You know, we tend to see k deficiency in dry conditions. So, if you kinda put it through that lens, I guess.
Eric Wilson:I guess with that, thank you guys so much for listening. Another episode of Keeping It Independent. If you have any questions or you want us to talk about any other topics, you can reach out to us at agronomy@wyffles.com. Those of you still finishing up harvest, please stay safe out there. I know the home stretch is is getting very close for a lot of us, but, please do stay safe out there.
Eric Wilson:And thanks again for listening.
Jared Goplen:And don't forget, 80% of the time, it works every time.