I don't know how much kids have changed as much as the environment around them has. A lot of them are coming to us with situations that are out of our control, out of their control, And that's a lot of the reason they are the way that they are.
Narrator:This is the Transform Your Teaching Podcast. The Transform Your Teaching Podcast is a service of the Center for Teaching and Learning at Cedarville University in Cedarville, Ohio.
Ryan:Hello, and welcome to the Transform Your Teaching Podcast. Today, Doctor. Rob McDole and Doctor. Jared Pyles chat with two public school educators here in Ohio, Garrett Reinhard, teacher at Bellefontaine High School teaching chemistry, and Hank Hacker at Greeneview High School teaching economics. Thanks for joining us.
Jared:Welcome, gentlemen, to the illustrious Transform Your Teaching Podcast. We're very thankful to have you guys on. Rob, why don't you start us off with some questions?
Rob:So, gentlemen, thank you for joining, again. And one of the big ones that we've heard in our previous series as we were talking to administrators here and other students here at Cedarville was anxiety. Anxiety, depression, stress, mental health was a big issue. Can you give us some sort of idea about where things are and where you know, in in the areas that you're teaching? What are you seeing?
Rob:Because I'm not sure how long you've been you've been teaching at your respective schools. So if you could give us some sort of idea about that or background about that and where you're seeing how how are you seeing things play out in your classes? Let's go with Hank first.
Hank Hacker:Yeah. I've been I've been teaching in Greenview just this past year. This is my first year. And I would say, anxiety mental health wise, it's one of those things that's definitely prevalent. And I think it's so prevalent because it's something that is being dealt with in a different way now than it really ever has before, as far as awareness for it.
Hank Hacker:Something that our school is doing that's really cool right now is we're doing a Character Strong program, which is like a curriculum that we go through every Tuesday to sort of hit a lot of the topics that aren't really talked about, Even things just like self awareness and values building and respecting other people, that kind of thing. It has just been somewhat lost in a lot of cases, just being either taught in schools or just taught by parents or whatever. It's just one of those things that's being lost. So that's one of the things we're trying to increase awareness for. As far as in the classroom goes, one thing that I always try to do to support just to support the kids is really listening to them listening to them just because they're telling me something.
Hank Hacker:I'm not listening for validity right off the bat. I'm not listening for I'm not listening for, you know, the the truth or whatever. I got I'm I'm listening to them because they matter. I'm listening to them because I care about them, and I wanna hear what they have to say. And then we worry about the we obviously worry about the truth, and we worry about what's going on and how to help later.
Hank Hacker:But having that solution mindset, but also the just being there for them and listening to them and valuing whatever they have to say regardless of how crazy it might sound.
Rob:Okay.
Jared:Now real real quick. Let me ask you, Hank. Greenview is a is in a urban district, suburban district?
Hank Hacker:Rural. We are very Okay.
Jared:And and Garrett, you can answer this question as well when you answer Rob's question, but are you Bellefontaine is sorry. Bellefontaine. Bellefontaine is rural kinda question mark.
Garrett Rinehard:It doesn't fit really any of We were filling out a paper the other day, and it's like, what kind of area do you live in? I was like, the Logan County County it's in is really rural.
Rob:Right.
Garrett Rinehard:And there's, like, five other rural schools in the county. Bellefalon is like the city school. Mhmm. It's not suburban at all, but it's not really urban either. But it's also not rural.
Garrett Rinehard:So it's there's about 200 kids per class, so it's definitely bigger than the other rural schools in the area. About three or four times the size of some of them, but it's it's not it's not an urban, you know, school really at all either.
Hank Hacker:Gotcha.
Garrett Rinehard:Gotcha. In between. As far as your question goes, in my classroom so I deal with a lot of
Hank Hacker:the high
Garrett Rinehard:achieving students teaching chemistry and some advanced chemistries as well. And so I run into a whole slew of like there's different areas where some of these kids have such high expectations on themselves. And it's not only them, but their parents that have such high expectations for them as well. So something I have tried to be very cognizant of that is of is that these kids are not only academically challenging themselves, but they're involved in sports and musical and clubs and all these things. They're worried about getting into the best college.
Garrett Rinehard:And so you see a high really high levels of stress, and like you said, anxiety among these kids. And then on the other end, I also teach, just the intro level chemistry, has more of your typical kids. And they I mean, same thing just with a different kind of set of circumstances where they might be more worried about peer groups and trying to measure up, again, to expectations, but even though their expectations might not be as high from home. One of the kind of sayings I've used all year is my class is important, but it's not that big of a deal. And what I mean by that is it's really important that you do well.
Garrett Rinehard:I care about you learning chemistry. I also care about you as a person, though. And if you're losing sleep about my class, it's not that like, my class isn't that big of a deal to be losing sleep about. And so I I think that's one of those things a lot of these kids have never heard before. I know growing up, I I had a lot of care for how I did in school, and so I I feel the stress that they feel.
Garrett Rinehard:I remember it. And I just wish someone told me like, hey, what you're doing, like, it's important. It's a good thing. But don't lose sleep. Don't lose years off your life because you're worried about one test grade on one class out of eight that you're taking.
Garrett Rinehard:So that's something I try to do is really model that and kinda just talk to them about, like, I know you think it's a big deal right now, and I remember thinking it's a big deal. But when you look back, you're gonna miss sports. So, like, I've had kids. I don't know if I wanna do sports because I really need to focus on school. I'm like, you're doing fine in school.
Garrett Rinehard:Like, when I look back at high school, the thing I miss is time with my friends. I don't think about, I wish I studied an hour more for that test. And so that's something I've I've really tried to do along with what Hank said, just listening to these kids. Some of them just have never had someone who actually listened to them and actually actually wanted to get to know them more so more than just the superficial level.
Rob:How long have you been teaching chemistry, Garrett?
Garrett Rinehard:Yeah. This is just my first year also.
Rob:Okay. So both of you are first year. Okay.
Jared:So both first year. Okay. I mean, first year teaching period?
Garrett Rinehard:Yeah. Yep.
Jared:That begs me to ask another question that's not on the script. Do you see the same characteristics in your students as you see in yourselves?
Garrett Rinehard:Yeah. I mean, like I said, I I remember. That's that's one thing I definitely feel like is a benefit to us. And like as I talk to students, it's something I feel like they appreciate is that I have the recent experience of like, hey, I I remember all these things that happened in high school. I re like, I know what it's like to have to write papers on a computer versus writing them out by hand.
Garrett Rinehard:Like Mhmm. Having all these assignments you're juggling because you have them online. And so they're all technically there, but these kids still don't necessarily know how to manage their time well. And so I remember all that. And I think that that so long, yeah, I I see a lot of myself and, like, what I remember it being like in them.
Garrett Rinehard:And there's there's definitely certain kids where I like I'm like, man, I I remember that. Like, whether it's the the insecurity of high school. Right? Like, I went to a small Christian school. And so out of the 16 kids, there's only so many of you and you get to know everyone, but there's also a lot of comparison within that.
Garrett Rinehard:And I remember, like, constantly comparing. And I have kids that, you know, they're high achieving students, great athletes, but I just I can see the insecurity because I remember that. That was me. Like, I so that's something where I definitely feel uniquely kinda called by God to kind of reach those kids that look like they have everything together, but they don't because that's how I I remember being like that in high school.
Jared:Hank, what are your thoughts?
Hank Hacker:Yeah. I mean, academically, that's actually kind of been a learning curve because I was very, like Garrett was saying, like, was very much the same way as, like, I tried really hard. I cared a lot about my grades. I cared how hard I was working, what my parents thought, all that stuff. And there's not much of that from a lot of my students.
Hank Hacker:A lot of it's kind of we just, they're just sort of here, sort of just making it through. A lot of it's more of the, they care more about their social standing, their social status, their social health than they do necessarily about the academic side. So I do relate with them in that because I was very scared a kid through high school, and that's one of the things that I, one of my values, one of my goals is to my, to help my kids be less scared than what I was when I was in high school. Because I do, looking back, that's the one thing I wish I really could have changed, would have been to, just to not worry about it as much. Like, just to to enjoy the time that I have.
Hank Hacker:Right? And not just always be on to the next thing. So I I think that that's definitely I see some of that in them. I will say that the the academic drive has been something that's been more of a learning curve for me to figure out, like, how do I motivate them to do their best work? Because I had that internal motivation of like, this is what I, this is just what I do.
Hank Hacker:This is what my family does. It's part of who we are. And for them, it's not that way. So just teaching teaching that motivation has definitely been interesting to learn.
Jared:Gotcha.
Rob:It sounds like you guys are dealing with trying to help foster the why they should learn, especially given given the particular topic that you're that you're teaching. And it sounds, it sounds like you're you you tend to be ministering to or teaching maybe those students who are a little bit further advanced, especially since you're teaching chemistry. Oh, yeah. And you're teaching upper level chemistry, which we all know chemistry is difficult. So to love chemistry, a lot of the kids are gonna like, there's something weird with you to begin with.
Rob:Right? Yeah. So
Garrett Rinehard:I told them that.
Rob:But but you, yeah, you have this drive and and trying to foster that why, I think. Why should you do this? Especially when their biggest why or their biggest need, it seems like, is social connection and social acceptance, within that area. And they're trying to probably please several different people. And and that kinda leads us to this conversation of what are you doing in terms of social connection with them, and then what are you seeing, specifically between peers, you as educators, maybe not just you as teachers, but what are you seeing with other teachers in your school?
Rob:And and, you know, a follow-up to that, we'll obviously, we'll we'll we'll talk about the influence of social media on that and just how that influences your educational practices as a whole. But start with, you know, what can educators do or what are you trying to do to foster these meaningful connections? I know Hank said he's he tries to listen. He he just wants to listen first. Not that he's not concerned with truth.
Rob:He is, but it seems like you've honed in on this idea, Hank, of of listen first and then what?
Hank Hacker:Yeah. That's a great question. I listen first, and then we find a solution to actually work with. I think that's my my main thing is not a quick fix. I was actually just talking to people about this today.
Hank Hacker:Like, I it's not a quick like, I'm not trying to fix anything. It's more of like, how do we what's the next best thing that we can do in order to help you in whatever situation you're in? What's the next best thing you can do in this relationship, in this academic problem, in this whatever? What's the next best thing? And so I think it takes a little bit of the anxiety out of it because you don't need to have the answer.
Hank Hacker:You just need the next best solution. You just need the next best thing to do. And I think that simplifying it into that has been very helpful for the students I've interacted with because a lot of them go through life feeling like everything is a massive deal, and I need to have the answers to every single question, or I'm a failure, or I'm not gonna measure up the person next to me, or my parents aren't gonna be happy, or this or that. And then that's where all of that builds up, that's where all that stress, all that anxiety comes from in a lot of the cases that I deal with. But just as I live longer, right, I'm realizing more of the truth of, you know, well, number one, God's got us, there's a lot that we can't control.
Hank Hacker:And it's like, how can I have more peace in it? It's really just, well, what's the next thing the Lord's calling me to do right now? In a public school setting, it's just, what's the next best thing you can do? Right? What's the next best thing that you can work toward?
Hank Hacker:And then really just trying to find that solution in those difficult spaces. Just one spot one one good action at a time is kind of how life dealt.
Rob:Mhmm. Alright. Garrett?
Garrett Rinehard:Yeah. I think, like Hank said, listening is really important. I found that one of the things I need to foster a good relationship with these students is even if it's just finding one thing that they enjoy, doesn't have to be one thing we have in common, which I think is kind of one of the things that these kids maybe fall into is they only are friends with people who have commonalities between them. I have a kid who he's been he doesn't love chemistry very much. He wants to just go and do construction when he's out of high school.
Garrett Rinehard:So he's just in he he's really in my class. He doesn't he's I asked him why one of the days because I I caught him cheating on a quiz, and he was like, well, I don't really know actually why I'm in your class. He's like, well, let's you're I said, you're in here for a reason. We're gonna learn some life lessons. Well, come to find out he's a really good golfer.
Garrett Rinehard:I don't know anything about golf, but, you know, I started learning a little bit about golf, talking with him about golf. And now he stops in my room every day, and he's like, yeah, miss Reinhart went golfing yesterday. And and not that I don't care about his golfing game every day, but every day, I'm not going to sleep thinking, wonder how he did in golf last night. For him, that's a really important thing. It's and at least it seems that way.
Garrett Rinehard:Like, it's an important thing for him to get to tell me how he did golf. That's just one one example, one kid. And if I can do that for just a couple kids every day where I really listen, really think about you know, if I I know a kid has the is in the musical, maybe three days before the musical, hey. How are you doing today? Anything I can do for you to, like, help ease your load as we're getting into the musical?
Garrett Rinehard:I know you you don't have ton of time, so maybe this assignment, I'll give you three extra days for it. Like, just small things like that, think the kids really appreciate, and and and they start to get a little bit more trust. Especially for me, I only get most kids for one year. Know some teachers get them for, like, one or two years depending on what classes they teach. I really just get one year with each kid except for a select few.
Garrett Rinehard:And so I really gotta take advantage of that time and and get to know these kids as best I can in that year. That way, next year, they stop by my room, we can still have a conversation, still have a a relationship that way.
Jared:You you could both are in rural schools, although Bell Fountain seems to be both rural and urban and suburban at the same time, depending on what depending on what street you're on. Tech accessibility was something that we that came up a lot in our discussions. Like, rural districts, typically, students don't have access to technology. Usually, they can find it in the schools through Chromebooks or iPads. But outside of school, they're kind of either at the mercy of their phones, especially if it's like, if Internet access is limited, they might be using their phones as hotspots to connect to help with whatever homework they have.
Jared:What have you guys seen this year as far as that? Is that true? Do you see that in your own classrooms or your school in order to like, is there a disparity there with, like, technology access?
Garrett Rinehard:I mean, when I was in high school, I lived out in the country, and we didn't have good Internet at all. Like, I have four siblings, and we could each be watching maybe a video at the same time. So, like, I I remember what that's like. But I never thought in high school there would be that much of a disparity. Like, you know, you hear about it, but, like, I never really thought too much about it.
Garrett Rinehard:And, like, our school has one to one Chromebooks. I don't really use tech all that much in my room, and it's not out of a necessarily out of a concern for tech stuff, but I guess it kind of works with that. I just I don't I like to use pencil and paper. So but I had a student the other day tell me that they have to pay for their Wi Fi every month. If they don't pay for it, their family doesn't get it.
Garrett Rinehard:And I was like, that blew my mind. I mean, there's this kid kid who's expected to pay $60 a month for Wi Fi or else his family won't have it. And I'm just that would have never crossed my mind. So this kid, if he doesn't work enough or save enough money to pay that $60 a month, I guess he can't do work at home. And that was such a, like, shock to me because I had never in my while like, I would have never thought about that.
Garrett Rinehard:That's really the only example I can think of off the top of my head. But also because I don't use technology as much, I haven't had any issues with tech disparity necessarily.
Jared:Understood. Hank?
Hank Hacker:I I think that's that's a pretty similar answer to what I would give. I don't use that much tech in my, classroom, and I really don't even assign much homework for that reason. Like, yeah, I just don't know what, I don't know where it's going to be coming from, and I've got a lot of kids that have very different home lives. So we keep a lot of it right here where I know what is happening, right? And I can sort of just
Jared:You have control.
Hank Hacker:Yeah, control. So I wouldn't say that I haven't seen it too bad as I I mean, the the kids that might not have the Internet access at home would not be the doing the work at home regardless. They don't do the pencil paperwork at home anyway. So it's like it's not it's not like I haven't had any situations where, you know, I've got a kid that's super motivated, really gonna go after it, and is gonna do that work, and then they don't have the access at home, if that makes sense. So
Jared:Yeah. It does.
Rob:It's interesting to me to see how you all are using technology. Do you think it's going to be a deficiency for your students moving forward into college, or is that even a consideration for you?
Garrett Rinehard:Yeah. I definitely think about it. Like, I have kids that type at what I would consider, like, a fifth grade level. Like, they don't type very well. They don't have skills in Google Docs and Google Sheets.
Garrett Rinehard:But for me, we'll do lab reports. So we'll write them on Google like, I'll have them write on Google Docs and share that with each other and collaborate. And they they do fine with that, but, like, there's definitely parts of their tech instruction that they just missed. And, like, when I was in elementary school and middle school, we had computer class. And, like, we learned how to type, but we also learned how to use Docs and Excel.
Garrett Rinehard:And, like, we learned all these things. And I just I don't know how much they learned, which is ironic because they were at home for two years for COVID. It's like you would fit in in their they've had a phone since they were in third grade. And so they've grown up with so much technology, but they don't know necessarily how to use the basics, in my opinion. Like, they're missing out on some really simple like, they forget their password, and they don't know how to reset their password.
Garrett Rinehard:Mhmm. Stuff like that that is missed. And I definitely like, I think about it, and it's something that as I continue to teach, I definitely wanna, get better at preparing them for college in that way specifically.
Rob:Mhmm. Hank, you it looked like you had some some comments.
Hank Hacker:I think a lot of people at Greenview use some form of technology, so I don't I I definitely feel that they're they're decently prepared. There there's at this school, there's not a there's not, like, a clear oh, they just don't know how to do that. Right? I I I can at least they have the basic skills, which is good. I think the main thing that I'm trying to prepare them for in college is, like, this is how you think outside of just what the professor tells you to do.
Hank Hacker:Like, here's actually what they're after. Like, I I think that's more of where I I go. Like, with technology, like, if they're like, create a presentation about about this. It's like, do they want this is what they actually want. Like, these are the main points that you need to hit.
Hank Hacker:You'll just need the information vomit on everything, and just, like, paste everything that was on Google into your slideshow. Like, this is what they need. Like, this is actually what they're what they're going after. So, I think that's probably the main thing that I had going into college that not a lot of people did have, and kinda harping again on that stress and anxiety portion, a lot of my classmates had a lot of stress and anxiety over things that was like, Well, you don't know what they're asking. It feels overwhelming because you're writing all this stuff.
Hank Hacker:It's like, that's not really what they're going for. So, that's kind of how I try to prepare technology of, this is this is really what we're going for here. This is how you use that rather than just trying to do the bare minimum, but it ends up being more than you would actually do if you just used your brain to think a little bit more about what was going on.
Rob:So. I mean, you two are both fresh out of college. Right? What would you say to your instructors who trained you? How how would you give them feedback, helpful feedback that would say,
Hank Hacker:here's
Rob:some things based on what you're seeing. Right? And I know you're fresh into it. I get it. But also your own training, so there's kind of this connection between the two.
Rob:Right? What would you wish you you would have known, and how could we, as educators in the college sector, had you know, do a better job of preparing you for? And or what what do we need to know from these students coming up? What are things that we need to be prepared for?
Garrett Rinehard:Something I wish I knew, and it might seem like a dumb thing, but, like, what does the first week of school typically look like between open houses and a syllabus? And it's like, I've read and been read to about 100 syllabi, but I've never made one. How do you write that kind of thing? That's something off the top of my head I definitely know that I didn't do, which would have been really nice. Thankfully, there's great teachers around here that are willing to help with that.
Garrett Rinehard:But I also something that I know is really helpful that we did get a little bit of, but it's also just a restriction of the programs in college. The the classes about teaching science specifically were super helpful to me because what I'm realizing now that I'm here and we're sitting through professional developments and stuff is there are a lot of things that touch all different subject areas, like different practices that you can do. But there's also certain things that don't work in science that do work in social studies, and things that work really well in science that you can't do in a math class or a foreign language class. And so just kinda getting a little bit more exposure to science specific. We had one class about it, but especially in my younger in the in the early years of my undergrad, I I feel like that would have been really beneficial.
Garrett Rinehard:As far as these students, kids are honestly they're the same as what I remember them being like when I was in high school. Like, they're the same as what I remember, which granted I'm relatively young. But I don't know how much kids have changed as much as the environment around them has in the sense that, you know, you take someone who's 70 years old now. If you take them back to their childhood and give them a phone from the time of the third grade and give them both parents working outside their house and give them a place where their communities isn't doesn't have a great fabric because there's disagreement and argument over everything, I don't know how much different the 70 year old would turn out than our kid is today. I I don't know how much different kids really are as as far as where they start as where we brought them up to be.
Garrett Rinehard:I think the thing I'm realizing the most is that the fight for the kids really starts at home. A lot of them are coming to us with situations that are out of our control, out of their control, and that's a lot of the reason they are the way that they are. What good or bad or indifferent. A lot of who they are shaped at this point, especially as high school students, where I can do what I can. And sometimes just a 1% change in their life is what I can do.
Garrett Rinehard:And that's that's good. Like, that's a good change. If if I can get them 1% better over the course of a year, I've done something for them. And so I think the thing I would tell, you all looking to the students now is hope is not lost for them at all. I have some students that I've there's been a lot of god moments this year already where, you know, I had a kid who I've been praying for, and he came up to me.
Garrett Rinehard:He's like, mister Reinhardt, I really think I need to, like, get serious about about god because I was struggling with this thing. And then some guy who I used to hang out with who was not a good person came up to me and just prayed for me. And I was like, well, it sounds like God is trying to tell you something, dude. Like and just having conversations like that with kids who are comfortable approaching me because, you know, they know I went to a Christian school and they went to Christian college, And and they haven't really had a teacher that they've probably felt comfortable talking with about their faith and about stuff like that. So hope is not lost.
Garrett Rinehard:The the next generation really can be the best one as long as we steward them well.
Rob:That's a good word.
Jared:That's good. Hank?
Hank Hacker:Yeah. I that was a perfect answer on the front end. The main thing that I learned that was completely on me was that I that I I just needed to commit and go for it when it came to teaching. Like, just commit and go for it. As you're teaching new teachers, I think that's probably the biggest thing.
Hank Hacker:What you do is not going to be perfect. It's not going to be, and just go for it, because I was very hesitant through my early field experiences, and some things that I learned in my first year of teaching, and then also in student teaching, I could have learned a lot earlier had I just gone for it, had I just been willing to do the idea that I was wanting to do and then move on. So I think that's probably the biggest thing that that I have. Also, I mean, my my wife's also a teacher, so I hear a bunch of teaching stories all throughout the day, and a lot of kids' stories all throughout the day. And I think that the the one main thing that I would love to see more in the teaching profession is kind of that that attitude toward our calling of, like, we're here to do some really awesome work.
Hank Hacker:Remember why we're here to do it. Don't let the discouragement of we're investing in all these kids, and then, like Garrett just said, like, the home life is just terrible. And don't let that, like, completely ruin your view of what you're doing. Yes, you might have had a bad day, but it's like stay committed to it, keep fighting for it, because it is good work, and I 100% agree that there are some exceptional kids coming through, and there's some really, really good there's some good work, but there's some good kingdom work to be done on on on what we're doing here in education. So the the fact that we get to that's why I'm that's why I'm here.
Hank Hacker:That's why I'm doing this. It's like it's the you get to invest in these people. You get to spend time with them every single day. You get to walk with them and show them exactly what Jesus thinks about them. So I think that that's a there's hope.
Hank Hacker:There's here. And I think that that's definitely something to be reminded of and continue to be encouraged by.
Ryan:Thanks for listening to this episode of Transform Your Teaching. Remember to like and subscribe on your favorite podcast platform. Please also, if you have a comment or a question, feel free to reach out to us on LinkedIn. And don't forget to check out our blog, cedarville.edu/focusblog. Thanks for listening.