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What are the characters of a good leader? Ron Hadley is back with Zach this week to discuss what traits make for a great leader and what traits lead to failure within an organization.
Show Notes
What are the characters of a good leader? Ron Hadley is back with Zach this week to discuss what traits make for a great leader and what traits lead to failure within an organization.
Ron Hadley's Website:
https://whererugoing.com
Purchase the You Can Mentor book:
You Can Mentor: How to Impact Your Community, Fulfill the Great Commission, and Break Generational Curses
youcanmentor.com
Ron Hadley's Website:
https://whererugoing.com
Purchase the You Can Mentor book:
You Can Mentor: How to Impact Your Community, Fulfill the Great Commission, and Break Generational Curses
youcanmentor.com
Creators and Guests
What is You Can Mentor: A Christian Youth Mentoring Podcast?
You Can Mentor is a network that equips and encourages mentors and mentoring leaders through resources and relationships to love God, love others, and make disciples in their own community. We want to see Christian mentors thrive.
We want to hear from you! Send any mentoring questions to hello@youcanmentor.com, and we'll answer them on our podcast. We want to help you become the best possible mentor you can be. Also, if you are a mentoring organization, church, or non-profit, connect with us to join our mentoring network or to be spotlighted on our show.
Please find out more at www.youcanmentor.com or find us on social media. You will find more resources on our website to help equip and encourage mentors. We have downloadable resources, cohort opportunities, and an opportunity to build relationships with other Christian mentoring leaders.
You can mentor is a podcast about the power of building relationships with kids from hard places in the name of Jesus. Every episode will help you overcome common mentoring obstacles and give you the confidence you need to invest in the lives of others. You can mentor.
Speaker 2:All right. Welcome back to another segment of leading, sustaining, operating, starting a nonprofit mentoring organization with my friend, Ron Hadley. Today, we're talking about the character of a leader and just how important it is for you as a leader to have integrity, to have character, to really be the real deal. So, Ron, can you just kinda share with us just why character is so important? And as you've experienced, you know, being a leader yourself but also spending lots of time with other leaders, just how this plays into running and sustaining a mentoring program?
Speaker 3:Wow. Great tee up. Yeah. Good question. So you you mentioned that, you know, we're primarily wanting to to talk through and and share about the character of a leader.
Speaker 3:And I'd almost wanna take that in in the two parts that it is, character and leadership. And
Speaker 2:character,
Speaker 3:I mean, it it's foundational to being able to lead a vision, being able to lead people, being able to lead an organization. There's nothing unique about the character needs of a leader as opposed to the character needs of of any individual. Right? Because character is important in our in our relationship building and the way that we walk through life. It's it's things like integrity and honesty and kindness and and generosity and humility.
Speaker 3:You need that in a leader, but I think there's a a good argument that that's that's nice. Those are those are good qualities and character characteristics to have in in any person. But it it it helps in our relationship building and our trust building and our ability to communicate and and be well received both both by the team and and in leading an organization. So you got the character of a leader. You need character and the integrity and and and honesty and and kindness and generosity and humility, and and that list can go on.
Speaker 3:And then in in leadership component of those attributes, it is the idea of being a visionary, being able to see the future and help move toward it. It's the the ideas of empathy, being able to care about and genuinely understand what people are going through on your on your team. It's it's being a a listener. If if you can't listen to the voices and to the environment around you, know know what's being said verbally and nonverbally, you you know, being in tune to that is important as a as a leader. Being open minded and and flexible is attributes of of a leader that that's important.
Speaker 3:We've talked on a previous podcast about self awareness, understanding yourself and what your limitations are and what you're strong at and and where you might need to kinda help, fill in some some some gaps. So there's almost 2 buckets when you talk about the the character of a leader. The the what are the attributes of good character for anybody is equally important for a leader, and what are the characteristics of of leadership? And that's when you start getting into the the vision and the empathy and and and listening and and so on.
Speaker 2:Yeah. Like, I I know, for me, it's I have learned over the years that the foundation of any good nonprofit is trust, of really any good anything. Any good relationship is trust. People people have to be able to trust you. They have to be able to trust that you are who you say you are, that you will do what you say you're gonna do.
Speaker 2:And I think so much of trust building is this piece that you just have to have strong character. Mhmm. You have to be able to walk out in humility, walk out in gentleness, give feedback, not just saying the the right thing, but saying the right thing in the right way. And I think, ultimately, you can kinda sum it up with, you can't give what you don't have.
Speaker 3:Yep.
Speaker 2:So if you want your staff to be humble, if you want your staff to be intentional, you have to be humble and intentional. If you want your staff to, submit and to really come underneath a vision or come underneath someone who leads, you have to be doing that in your own life. You can't give what you don't have. And you're consistently pouring out, and it's especially important that you are consistently being poured into, whether that's through something as simple as podcasts, books, you know, the Speed of Trust by Stephen Covey, the Road to Character by David Brooks. I mean I mean I mean, these are just a couple books that you guys can that you you guys can pick up about the importance of a leader anything by, you know, Sean Maxwell.
Speaker 2:But ultimately, if if people don't like you, people don't respect you, they're not gonna follow you. And you have to make sure that you're doing the hard work of maintaining character, of building character, of maturing. I know for me, Ron, that's a huge piece. I mean, I'm a Yeah. I'm a pretty young guy.
Speaker 2:And in my 1st season as a leader, I look back at me. I I was just terribly immature. I mean, there are things that I didn't see. I was I didn't ask a bunch of questions. I was very fast to talk.
Speaker 2:I mean, I I was the epitome of the fool in the book of Proverbs. And, ultimately, you wanna be a leader that is humble, that is mature, and that has a strong rock solid character so that other people will follow you and and not just follow you because they have to, but follow you because they want to.
Speaker 3:Exactly. You know, there's a quote I'm gonna paraphrase because I won't remember it exactly, but it's attributed to Steve Jobs. And and he says that management is the art of persuading people to do what they don't want to do. Leadership is inspiring people to do what they've never thought they could. And so it's that idea of building that relationship and that rapport, casting that vision and having that trust, and you inspire people in your leadership when you're able to have that kind of connection to them.
Speaker 3:Mhmm. And, you know, you can you can accomplish most any task or even any short term, connection to people in in in a short period of time. But if you really want a long term sustainable team, you wanna be a visionary leader that people follow for the the long run, yes, I very much believe, and I think it's it's very easy to argue, that character is the most pivotal component of of being a leader for the long term. You've got to have that connectivity, that trust, and and it's displayed in your daily walk.
Speaker 2:I think so much of having strong character as a leader is having trust in God.
Speaker 3:Mhmm.
Speaker 2:Because, I mean, everything begins with your own personal walk with Jesus Christ. I mean, yes, you need to get poured into from other people, but, ultimately, the main source of your refreshment needs to come from God. Yeah. And so, I mean, on days when I'm weak, going to him for strength. On days whenever I'm insecure, going to him for security.
Speaker 2:On days when I don't know what to do, going to him for wisdom. Right? And so it's especially as you lead a faith based nonprofit, I mean, the the ministry aspect, the having faith aspect, I mean, that's coming straight from you. So the spiritual depth of the nonprofit is going to equal your own personal spiritual depth. Yeah.
Speaker 2:So, like, I I I mean, for for me, I I have to spend time with him every day. I have to be in community. I have to go to church because it is there that I'm equipped with the things that I need to have the character that I need to lead.
Speaker 3:Right.
Speaker 2:So but, like, everything comes down to, do I really trust God with this? Like, being humble. Do I really trust God that if I humble myself, he'll exalt me? Do I really trust God that if I don't say this right now, that he's gonna take care of, you know, the issue? Obligation.
Speaker 2:Do I really trust God that this person can do it? And not just do it, but, you know, do it in a way that's gonna have more impact than me? Submission. Do I really trust God that if I submit to this person, then this person's going to lead me in a way that is good? Right?
Speaker 2:And so, I I mean, I think that trust goes right alongside character. Not only trust other people have to trust you, but you have to trust God. Exactly. So Yeah.
Speaker 3:Because in in some ways, what you're talking about right there is the difference between what we display and what the walk we walk and the source of what we display and the source of how we walk our walk. Because, yes, it's embedded into our lives, and we need to be pouring that into the world around us. But where is that source of character for each of us? And for people of faith, like you and me, it does come from our relationship with Christ and relationship and our faith in God. There's a there's an important distinction there on what is your source, where are you getting that that foundation and anchor, and then how does it manifest itself in your life?
Speaker 2:Yeah. So let's talk about just a couple of the things that we have identified as the things to focus in on as you build the character that you need to lead. And the first one is humility. So can you just kinda share with us just just why is being humble so important as a leader, and how can you grow in that?
Speaker 3:Yeah. Wow. Good question. You know, a couple a couple different things are racing through my mind, and and how do I how do I kinda put it all together in a in a in a consumable way? You know, one thing I want to to say and make clear is humility is very often, if not too often, misunderstood.
Speaker 3:It's it's not a matter of downplaying your accomplishments. It's not a matter of shying away from accolades. We need to be able to accept people's compliments and and and congratulations and and do that in a in a very appropriate way. It's not even a matter of not sharing what we have accomplished because it that can inspire other people. So humility is not downplaying yourself.
Speaker 3:Too often, it's it's kind of seen that way. Humility in in my mind and in in how I see myself walking that walk is more in in in regards to sharing the credit. It's acknowledging that I'm not doing this on my own. It's acknowledging those around me and their contributions to what is being done and what has been accomplished. Humility, in in some ways, is just not elevating yourself higher than others, and it is sharing the the praise and the credit acknowledging that we are all in this together.
Speaker 3:When you when you have that kind of approach, that's that's humility. Mhmm. Humility is just you know, I'm not a one man show. I've I've got some great qualities. That's okay to say.
Speaker 3:And when people tell me that they appreciate my qualities, I want to accept that in in a in a humble way. But I'm not we don't we shouldn't elevate ourselves over other people, and we shouldn't overlook crediting other people. Mhmm. That, in in my mind, is almost a core of humility.
Speaker 2:Yeah. Like, I've heard humility is not thinking less of yourself. It's thinking of yourself less.
Speaker 3:Exactly. Love that. I like
Speaker 2:that a lot.
Speaker 3:Yeah. I love that.
Speaker 2:I heard, professional coach say, whenever we win, it's we. Whenever we lose, it's me.
Speaker 3:Yep.
Speaker 2:I thought that that was so cool, you know. Yeah. As a leader, whenever y'all do awesome, hey, this is a team thing, you know. This is this is how this happened. This person did this.
Speaker 2:This person did that. But when you lose, you, as the leader, take responsibility for it. And then you can correct 1 on 1. Right? Hey.
Speaker 2:This is what should happen. Let's talk about how we missed that. But but it's it's sharing the praise when it goes well and, correcting the praise or correcting the mistakes when it doesn't go well in the right way.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 2:I mean, because, like, ultimately, as a leader, you you are in charge, but you're also a coach. You're a father. You're a shepherd. And just because you messed up, you know, don't see it as failure, but instead see it as a way to make someone else better. Exactly.
Speaker 2:And I I I mean, I I love what you said about being able to receive praise. That's such a big deal. You know, so often I hear people like, well, hey, man. Awesome job on, you know, starting this nonprofit. Well, I didn't really do anything.
Speaker 2:Oh, well, okay. Because I I actually see you doing these things. Well, no. That's not me. Well, hey, just say thank you, bro.
Speaker 3:Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah. Like, just share
Speaker 3:the credit. You acknowledge other people, but don't discount yourself.
Speaker 2:Right. And so I just think that that's awesome. But Yeah.
Speaker 3:You know, on the one practical way that I I play this out, and we all have our own little little quirks. Right? But, I would and I I don't o overdo this because it can be overdone, but I try to consciously not use, singular pronouns. Yes. I or even you, but make it we and us.
Speaker 3:And and and that's not just a a practice. That that is that's reality. Because even if I did do something, I didn't do it alone. Right. And so I will intentionally think to to to use the word we knowing that there are a lot of other people that that helped that.
Speaker 3:And I also try to avoid the the pronoun you sometimes because if you do too much you Yeah. And this this almost can come across sometimes as finger pointing. You
Speaker 2:you exactly. You. Yeah.
Speaker 3:Yeah. And and I try to you use plural pronouns, and it just feels more inclusive, and and it it kinda diffuse issues sometimes. But
Speaker 2:I know one thing that helps me stay humble is 1, and we talked about this, but surrounding yourself with coaches and with mentors and people who can objectively give you feedback
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 2:And asking the hard questions. Hey. What's something in me that I don't see in myself? Yeah. Hey.
Speaker 2:Tell me an area that you think I could grow in.
Speaker 3:I love in a previous podcast that we recorded, when you shared the story about the board Mhmm. Sitting you down and and pointing out some red flags they saw in your leadership style or at least in your developing emerging style. And, I mean, they were blunt and honest with you, and you received that well, and and you grew from that. And and I think that speaks right to what you're you're saying. That that's part of humility is being able to receive that and have people around you who could speak that that clarity to you.
Speaker 2:I know, for me, evaluations are huge. So doing a 360, you know? Yep. Having your staff do an eval, knowing that That'll
Speaker 3:keep you humble.
Speaker 2:That'll keep you humble. Hey, Zach. You're not as you're not as, smart as you think you are. And I think with that, I think apologizing when you mess up, and we will mess up. I this morning, I was having a conversation with a guy on staff.
Speaker 2:I was having a conversation with Steven, and I said a cuss word. And I had to text him afterwards.
Speaker 3:You put a dollar in the cuss jar?
Speaker 2:Yeah. Right? I was like, hey, Steven. I'm sorry. I shouldn't have said that.
Speaker 2:That's my bad. But but it Yeah. It keeps me human. It keeps me humble. Yeah.
Speaker 2:I know that this is weird, but from time to time, I really enjoy going on a fast and not eating for a couple days because it shows my humanity. Wow. I I had a friend who was on a fast, and, you know, he's a he's a really close friend of mine, so we were sharing about it. And he was at he was at Wendy's with his kids, and they messed up their order. And because he was on a fast, he was so hungry, and he just went off on this, like, this person who was worker, you know.
Speaker 2:Yeah. And he called
Speaker 3:me and he's
Speaker 2:like, this is how I this is how
Speaker 3:the Lord humbled me
Speaker 2:today, you know. And so it's it is important to put yourself in situations where your humanity does come out and apologizing for it and learning from it. You know, if you do God's job and exalts you, he'll do your job and humble you. Yeah. Wow.
Speaker 2:Which I love that. But and then just like, hey, Ultimately, everything we do yes. You did have a part in it. Yes. Your team's awesome.
Speaker 2:But, ultimately, it is less of us and more of him. And it's pointing it all back to God. You know? How awesome is it that the Lord gave me that opportunity? But yeah.
Speaker 2:But that that is humility. Andrew Murray, I think, has a book on humility called Humility, which is a great book. But but yeah. But you you have to be humble. You have to be teachable.
Speaker 2:You have to be approachable. You have to apologize. I mean, these are these are things that God is gonna honor because you can look all throughout scripture. God loves a humble leader. And if you aren't humble, watch out because he will humble you.
Speaker 3:You'll be humbled. That's
Speaker 2:exactly right. Will be humbled.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 2:But
Speaker 3:So talk to us, me, about integrity.
Speaker 2:Yeah. So we say integrity is doing the right thing no matter what.
Speaker 3:Mhmm. And I
Speaker 2:think that that's a big deal. Because so often as a leader, whether it's you see it in yourself or you see you know, you need to ask this question. You need to point this out to one of your staff members. You need to say this to a guy on your board. It's saying kind of the hard things in the right way.
Speaker 3:Yep.
Speaker 2:I think it's you gotta do the right thing, whether that is apologizing when you mess up, whether that is saying thank you, whether that is, you know, admitting whenever you mess up, hey, guys. I dropped the ball on this. That's my bad. Will you forgive me? You know, it it is like I know that this is small wrong, but I think God honors it.
Speaker 2:When you walk by the trash can and it's overflowing with trash, you take it out. Yeah. Because it's the right thing to do. Yeah. And it's like, anytime I am going throughout my day, and I just feel that that Holy Spirit nudge that, hey, Zach, you should probably pick up that piece of trash.
Speaker 2:Hey, Zach, you should probably ask this kid how he's doing. Hey, Zach, you should I found more times than not. Whenever I follow those, you'd be amazed at what he does.
Speaker 3:Yeah. And so I mean, no matter how big or small the example is that you choose to give, it speaks to the holistic approach of how you defined integrity, doing what is right no matter what, even if it is perceived small gesture, like taking out the trash when it needs to be taken out. But what you're touching upon, and and I I so much agree and appreciate, is that when you're leading a team or a vision or an organization for that matter, people are watching you
Speaker 2:Most definitely.
Speaker 3:When you don't even know they're watching you. And if they see inconsistency, they can overlook that, and they can forgive that. And and and there's ways, of course, to to recover from that, but they will notice the inconsistency. And they wanna know why you're being inconsistent, and they wanna know if the inconsistency will be addressed. So the integrity, doing what is right no matter what, is essential for a leader.
Speaker 3:It it's essential in character for any individual. Mhmm. But as it applies to a leader, people are watching you even closer. Well
Speaker 2:and here's something that I love about being a leader is I'm gonna do the right thing even if it doesn't bring success to the organization. Mhmm. And that's because I care more about you than I do our success as a nonprofit. Yeah. So if I see one of my staff members doing something that's gonna ultimately lead to harm in their life, the right thing to do is to talk to them about it.
Speaker 2:Now I I do need to talk to them about it in the right environment, in the right way, in the right setting.
Speaker 3:Exactly.
Speaker 2:But if I see one of my staff members being sarcastic, or being rude, or talking down to someone, or complaining, I'm gonna pull them aside, and I'm gonna have that hard conversation because that's doing the right thing no matter what. No matter if they get mad, no matter if they get their feelings hurt, no matter how they respond, I'm gonna do my part. But I wanna live my life in such a way that I can look back and say, I don't have any regrets. You know, like, I wanna do the right thing. And how people respond, well, that's I don't have any control about that, but I do have control about what I choose to step into.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 3:And if you do have a misstep, acknowledge it. And and that's that's you've you've already said that. But people will they'll forgive, and they'll overlook, and they'll forget Mhmm. If if you're willing to acknowledge.
Speaker 2:Well, this is what's so crazy. I have found that when I mess up and I've made some pretty big mess ups, and I apologize, and I truly say I'm sorry. Not only does that fix the issue, but it gains respect.
Speaker 3:It strengthens.
Speaker 2:It strengthens it. It's the weirdest thing. Yeah. It's like
Speaker 3:You've become more human. There's there's there's a there's an added depth to your connection to those people.
Speaker 2:I think that's awesome.
Speaker 3:Yeah. Talk to me about talk to us about generosity too.
Speaker 2:Yeah. So I think this is a big deal because freely I've received, freely I'll give.
Speaker 3:Mhmm.
Speaker 2:So I am here today. I mean, yeah, I have worked hard, and I've done my part. But, I mean, we stole mentoring from Mercy Street down in South Dallas. We stole after school program from Voice of Hope down in South Dallas. We stole a single mom's ministry from Hope Farm out I mean, everything we've done, people have been have given me they've given me their time.
Speaker 2:They've given me their advice. They've bought me lunch. Like, I mean, everything that I am today is because someone took time out of their schedule. They were intentional. They gave me a book.
Speaker 2:They gave me a podcast. They gave me a meeting. And so how it just doesn't make sense for me to not do the same. Yeah. And so it's like, God's gonna honor that generosity.
Speaker 2:In some ways, I think it's being faithful. I think it's being a good steward. Hey, Zach. I am gonna give you this connection to this nonprofit that's gonna teach you how to mentor better. Now who are you gonna share that with?
Speaker 2:You know? Like, the Lord's given me 5 talents. The Lord get has given me 10 talents. Now am I gonna bury those in the sand, or am I gonna turn those 5 into 10 or there's 10 into 15? Exactly.
Speaker 2:And so being generous, it's not just about money, which it's important to give money away, but it's it's giving people your time.
Speaker 3:Mhmm. It's
Speaker 2:giving people your energy. It's giving people your intentional coaching, their your feedback.
Speaker 3:Exactly. So Yeah. Being generous with your words.
Speaker 2:Oh, yes.
Speaker 3:With your your time. With your words is huge. Talent. Generosity encompasses all aspects of life.
Speaker 2:A handwritten note goes a long way.
Speaker 3:Yep. Yeah.
Speaker 2:And that's being generous. It's, hey, this is something that me and my wife talk about often. How many times have you been, like, man, I sure do like Ron. He's a great guy. And one thing that
Speaker 3:You never told me that.
Speaker 2:And one thing that me and my wife do is, well, have you told Ron that? And I'm, like, well, no. I and then they're how come? And so I'll legitimately pull out my phone and text and be like, Ron, I just want you to know I'm super thankful for you today. But it's like that's And
Speaker 3:I have gotten those types of texts from you. I wanna clarify that from the audience.
Speaker 2:I mean, that is
Speaker 3:good about that.
Speaker 2:That is being generous.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 2:And and if if you really think about it, every time someone calls you, every time someone texts you, every time someone sends you an email, they're thinking about you. Mhmm. And that's a really powerful thing
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 2:To know that someone gives a rip about you.
Speaker 3:Yeah. Right? And and and so, again, a a lot of these characteristics, these qualities, if you will, that we're talking about are important in any life Mhmm. For anybody. Yeah.
Speaker 3:But they're amplified for leaders. When you talk about integrity and humility and kindness and and honesty and and generosity, they're just amplified.
Speaker 2:Here's one. What about trust? Yep. Being able to trust other people. I think that plays into delegation.
Speaker 2:I think that plays into being flexible. I mean, why don't you talk about the character of a leader is being able to give your trust away to someone?
Speaker 3:Yeah. That's exactly right. And and you referred earlier, I I believe, in this podcast to Covey's book, The Speed of Trust. Yeah. It's a powerful book.
Speaker 3:He's a amazing brilliant thought leader in business and relationships, and speed of trust is is is a great resource for anybody and leaders in particular. But but that is one of the primary cornerstones to relationships and to relationship building. You've got to know that, you can trust the other person, but you also have to know that you are trusted by the other person. That that's just a fundamental element to to working together into to strong relationships.
Speaker 2:Yeah. I know, for me, I've had staff people come up to me and say, Zach, the fact that you trusted me with this, that's a huge deal. Just your your act of saying, hey, you're in charge of this. I'm here if you need me, but I trust that you're gonna do awesome. It might not be it it might not be how I do it, but I trust that you're gonna do it your own way, and that's gonna be great.
Speaker 3:That's exactly right.
Speaker 2:That says a lot.
Speaker 3:Yeah. As a leader, one of the things that brings me some of the greatest joy in that role of leadership is to agree with my team as to where we are going and have benchmarks and progress reports all along the way and make sure that we're providing the right training and resourcing. But we know where we're going and then and what their role is, and I just let them go. I'd love to be surprised by how they get us from a to b. It might not be in most cases, it's not how I would have chosen.
Speaker 3:And at the end of the at the end of the project, I'm like, wow. I never would have thought of that, but I trusted them to get us where we said we were wanting to go.
Speaker 2:Yeah. I don't care how we get there.
Speaker 3:Mhmm. All I
Speaker 2:care about is that we got there.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 2:And I that this happens to me all all the time. They get us from point a to point b, but it looks weird, and I'm like, what? Like, that's not how I would have done it. But every time I walk away with these two thoughts, wow, my team's smarter and better than I thought. And 2, that blows me away.
Speaker 2:I'm so surprised. I never saw that coming.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 2:And that's what makes makes work fun because I'm I'm so proud of my team. I can tell them that. And 2, it's just like, man, Lord, you work in mysterious ways.
Speaker 3:Exactly. And I've learned something. I learned a new way to do it.
Speaker 2:And I learned something. So I think that's awesome. But and one of my favorite quotes, and this goes along with trust, specifically when you do, you know, delegate tasks and responsibilities. You can have growth or you can have control, but you can't have both.
Speaker 3:Love that. Yeah.
Speaker 2:And so it's it's like, hey, if if you wanna control and if you wanna micromanage, yeah, go ahead. But you're just not gonna get a lot done because that takes a lot of time, it takes a lot of effort. Yeah. And it's just things aren't gonna grow that fast. And so if you want growth, yes.
Speaker 2:Give them the vision. Hey. This is where we're going. Figure out a way to get there. You know?
Speaker 2:That's that's how things grow quickly. Yeah.
Speaker 3:So we've we've talked, a lot about qualities of good character, if you will, that really apply to any life. But let's talk to us now a little bit about let let's explore the qualities of that are even more unique and more needed in a leader. Mhmm. Things like vision and listening and empathy that are are pretty essential for a person to be an effective leader and start with vision. You know?
Speaker 3:How how would you help us understand the value of being a visionary?
Speaker 2:Yeah. I don't think you have to be a visionary as a leader, but I think you have to promote it. And I think you have to have it. So if that's not you, you it doesn't really matter where it comes from, but you have to figure out a way to promote it, to make it center, and to make sure that it's being spotlighted in your org every single day.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 2:And so you as a leader, you have to know the importance of it. How it it is it's the foundation because it's it's the call. It's your purpose. It's why you're here. And so, I mean, vision is painting a picture of what is to come.
Speaker 2:Right? Yeah. It's, hey, we're a mentoring organization, but here's why we mentor. I'm gonna paint a picture of this kid that we're serving today in 15 years. Mhmm.
Speaker 2:Right? I'm gonna paint a picture of how his life is better because of us. Right? It is painting that picture of where we're gonna be in 3 months, 6 months, 9 months, 5 years, and it inspires, it gives hope, it it gives confidence, it's fun. I mean, you've gotta have vision in your organization, and you have to talk about it often.
Speaker 2:It is the reminder. It is the why. Right?
Speaker 3:Exactly right. Simon Sinek has a viral little video clip going around right now that he's advocating I don't know if he's legit or if he's just, you know, trying to emphasize a point, but that the title CEO needs to change to c v o because chief executive officer doesn't say what that person really does and they should be called c v o chief visionary officer because that is a primary function of the leader, and it's to your point either be the creator of the vision or have that team that's creating it, and you're the the the chief, proponent of it. Jack Welch has another saying that CEO should stand for chief encouragement officer Mhmm. Because that is what the the primary leader does is is they promote and they encourage not just on the individual level, individual staff team team members and, partners, but you're encouraging the vision as well.
Speaker 2:Yep.
Speaker 3:There's an another leadership model or or or teaching that I I really like by a gentleman, named Mark Johnson. And he he calls his model leading from the future. Meaning and it's what you had just said. You paint that picture of what is possible, what could be down the road, and you you you begin to backtrack to today. You know, you're leading from what you know can be in front of you, lead from the future.
Speaker 3:And it's that whole idea, whether the vision, again, comes from you as the individual or if it comes from the team that you've pulled together as a leader, you are still that chief visionary officer. You're that that chief encourager, and you can see what the future can hold, and you lead from there. And you get them there, whether it's on it could be on a life level, individual life level like you talked about in a mentoring organization. What can the student's life be, or if it's on the organizational macro level?
Speaker 2:I think one thing that's important is, in my opinion, stories promote vision, maybe better than anything else.
Speaker 3:Mhmm. Yeah.
Speaker 2:So if something happens in your nonprofit, if something happens in your staff to where you're, like, we're an inch closer to making that vision happen, share that story. Hey. Our vision is that every kid in our community would have a mentor. Well, here's a story about how that happened today. Yeah.
Speaker 2:Here, you know, our vision is that every young man will have a male role model to look up to. Here's a story of how that happened today. Let me tell you about Mentor Menti. Right? And sharing those stories, they're they're so important.
Speaker 2:Yeah. Because it's like putting gasoline in the tank of your nonprofit. It's, hey, guys. It's working. It's, hey, like, this person over here, they spent the last 2 days filling out, Excel spreadsheet, but let me connect that to what happened yesterday, and let me connect what happened yesterday to what the what God called us to.
Speaker 3:Exactly.
Speaker 2:And so you have to be able to to do that as a leader, and I think that stories is a great way to do it.
Speaker 3:Agreed completely. Because most all of us can put ourselves into the story. We can see ourselves as a character in that story and also see how it is working to your the point you made. It it's it's a it's a real time, real life celebration Yeah. Of the impact and change that we're doing together.
Speaker 2:And I think this kinda flows into your next point is to have empathy. And it's it is that the vision is not gonna happen unless people feel cared for. Yeah. Unless people feel safe, unless people feel like you as their boss care more about them than what they do. And it's about listening, it's about carving out time to make that person feel valued, to feel heard.
Speaker 2:I know for me, Ron, I have a hard time creating a safe environment. I'm a big dude. I'm intense. I'm loud. I'm aggressive.
Speaker 2:And sometimes for some people, for most people, it it doesn't come off as a safe environment. I can't share what I really want to share because I'm afraid of Zach. And so I've had to really work on that, and I've had to go through trainings, I've had books, podcasts, da da da da. But to be an empathetic leader, to have my staff know that I actually care about them, And as I shepherd them, and as I lead them, I have to carve out time in my schedule just to go into someone's office and be like, hey, let's toss work aside. How are you doing?
Speaker 2:Exactly. Right. Hey, is there anything that you need to say to me? Is there any way that that I can better lead you, that I can better serve you? You know, and putting yourself in that spot of really kind of putting yourself in their shoes and saying, man, how how would this person feel if if I was their boss?
Speaker 2:You know? Or or how would I feel if I was this person's boss?
Speaker 3:And I don't know. There's so much packed into what you just said that, I would would want to highlight and pull out and and affirm. But it's it's that idea, Zach, that as a leader, of course, you are leading a vision. You are leading a team. You are leading an organization.
Speaker 3:You've gotta keep them focused, keep all of us focused on where we're going and how we're gonna get there. But if it's done at the expense of or just the unintentional overlooking of the individual team members, it's not a healthy journey. Mhmm. And and what you said about listening to them and asking them, how can you help them? How can you best be a leader for them?
Speaker 3:Don't presume to know how to be empathetic, how to care. You've got to really listen and and show that you care about them as an individual and their journey. It's not just about leading a team and a vision in an organization. It's about being a part of people's lives, and that's where that empathy comes in. And and that is best done when you when you intentionally ask and listen.
Speaker 2:Yeah. And I think that early on in my journey, I would think having conversations with people carving out time in my schedule to take people out to lunch was a waste of time. I mean, I I would say we need to execute. Let's move the ball forward. Let's let's do things.
Speaker 2:Let's do things. Let's do things. And now what I realize is it's my staff's job to to do things. Yes. It's my job to create the perfect environment, to remove obstacles, to give them what they need so that they can execute, but it's not my job to ex yes.
Speaker 2:It is my job in a couple key
Speaker 3:Right.
Speaker 2:Areas, but it's my job to invest into them. It's my job to make sure that they're the best version of themselves possible so that they can do the best job possible. Exactly. So how can I love I mean, it's as simple as this? How can I love my staff?
Speaker 2:How can I champion my staff? How can I add value to them? How can I father them? How can I shepherd them? How can I make their life better to where when they come to work and they see me, they say there's a boss that loves me, There's a boss that cares about me more than he cares about what I do?
Speaker 2:And here's a place where I feel safe, I feel valued, and I feel like I'm set up for success.
Speaker 3:Yeah. Simon Sinek's got another quote that I enjoy very much believe in. Leadership is not about being in charge. Leadership is taking care of those in your charge, and that's exactly what you're saying.
Speaker 2:That's good. Yeah. But there's a new book out by Patrick Encioni called The Motive, and it talks about what's the motive of a CEO. Is it to be the guy in charge? Is it to, hey.
Speaker 2:I'm the number 1, nah, dah, dah, or and and he makes the point. It's no. It's actually that servant. It's that the motive of the CEO needs to be, I wanna carry that healthy weight of shepherding my staff. Yeah.
Speaker 2:So that's good.
Speaker 3:You know, and I've I've I've got a thought floating in my head that I'm gonna share, but I'm hesitant to because it can be it can be misunderstood because it's it's a it's a generational painting. Sure. It's a generational overstatement. But, you know, I would suggest that being empathetic as a leader has always been important. I mean, that's just a universal foundational caring about other people in your charge and and and investing on a personal level is always the best way and always has.
Speaker 3:But I would also add, I think it's even more important when you're leading the the current younger generations that are entering entering the workforce or have just recently entered the workforce because they've grown up in a world where they share most the most minuscule aspect of their life on social media. They're posting what they're eating. You know, they're they're talking to their friends, and they're getting affirmations. They're they're not only used to that. They expect that.
Speaker 3:And if you don't take the time like you like you mentioned a moment ago to something maybe as as simple as taking them out to lunch. If you don't invest on that personal level and just spend time with them getting to know them, there's gonna be a great disconnect. The younger generation, I it's not only the right thing to do and the right way to lead. The younger generation is expecting that kind of interpersonal interaction.
Speaker 2:Well, and and here's something that I found, Ron. I think you're spot on. The older generation, they care a lot about money. They care a ton about status. But what I found is the younger generation, they don't care as much about that.
Speaker 3:It's about people.
Speaker 2:It's about people. Uh-huh. I have friends who would take significantly less money to work in a fun culture, fun environment where they're poured into, where they're invested into, where they love coming to work. Yeah. I mean, it really is like these things, these soft skills, they matter.
Speaker 2:And I would make the argument to the millennial, it matters more than the things like pay
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 2:And, like, status and, like, title. And so if you can tap into this, if you can create a culture, if you can create an environment, if you can, as a leader, have these types of characteristics to where you're fathering them well, you're shepherding them well, you're leading them well, you're giving them hope, you're inspiring them, you're empowering them, you're delegating to them, you're making them feel valued, like, all of these things, then you're gonna be able to have a great team, and you're gonna be able to to be having people lining up out the door to wanna come work for you.
Speaker 3:That's right.
Speaker 2:And so, like, we have in this is my opinion, we have a great culture. And we just hired 2 new people. And there was a time whenever we couldn't find anyone to work for us, but now this happens all the time. I've got friends of people who work for us saying, let us know the next time there's a job opening because we would love to work for you. And that's what you want, and that's what character can do.
Speaker 2:That's what you, as the leader, you can create that. Whenever you invest freely, whenever you're generous with your words, with your time, whenever you coach, whenever you do all of these things, when you're flexible, when you're honest, when you have integrity, when you're following Christ, when you're humble, people wanna be around that.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 2:And, like, just you can't give what you don't have. And so invest in yourself, and just know that if you do the right thing, and if you take self improvement seriously, and if you make other people better, then God is gonna That's good stuff, Ron.
Speaker 3:Love it.
Speaker 2:Alright, man. Hey. Well, we just talked about the character of leadership. As the leader goes, so goes the organization. Self care is not selfish.
Speaker 2:Do the right thing no matter what, and trust that God's gonna take care of the rest. We love you guys. You can mentor. You can lead. You can run a nonprofit.
Speaker 2:You can start 1. If we can help you in any way, reach out to 4 Runner Mentoring, reach out to You Can Mentor, reach out to where are you going? Ron Hadley. We're here to help. We love you guys.
Speaker 2:See you.