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Parkinson’s: An Athlete’s Journey is for athletes navigating Parkinson’s, the coaches and clinicians who train them, and anyone who wants real-world strategies for performance and longevity. Hosted by Eric Von Frohlich and Todd Vogt, the show focuses on tactical takeaways: how to train, recover, manage symptoms, and stay consistent when the rules keep changing. Expect honest conversations, tested routines, and guest experts who go deeper on what works.
TODD VOGT (00:31)
what's going on with you? How you been?
Eric Von Frohlich (00:33)
Pretty good. Feeling good, training hard, eating well, kind of checking all the boxes.
TODD VOGT (00:39)
Nice.
how's your heart?
Eric Von Frohlich (00:43)
Heart's been good. I was doing some zone two and then I realized if I tried zone four, there is no difference in my heart rate. There's a difference in my breathing cadence. But vacillation and fluctuation in my heart rate because of the afib is just as erratic as zone four. So I was avoiding zone four for the six months thinking it was problematic to go there
TODD VOGT (00:53)
Okay.
Eric Von Frohlich (01:09)
Now I can start playing with that a little bit more so I can go zone four like three or four days a week and get the described sparks type of training been missing out on.
TODD VOGT (01:14)
Nice.
Yeah.
Yeah, that's good, that's great. I mean, that's awesome. It's always good when, after you're injured or having some sort of physical injury to be, when you're able to do something that you were, again, that you were able to do before,
Eric Von Frohlich (01:21)
So.
Right, I don't know if this is going to lead me to running again or get me into altitude room and doing a concept two workout the way you do, it's heading in the right direction, so that's exciting. So what about yourself, you've been training for anything?
TODD VOGT (01:41)
Yeah.
Nice. That's good, man.
I mean, I've been working out a fair amount on the erg and on the bikes and whatnot. nothing in particular. Like I was having this shoulder injury. It's nearly 100 % to do like pushups again with no pain, so I can do those pretty unlimited. I was trying to do some getting back to doing pull ups. So yesterday I was doing like negatives. I figured, okay, a star was some negatives and that was like pain free as well. So it doesn't hurt when I row anymore.
on my shoulder, so I'm really happy about that, so that's good. there is this other issue, maybe this is good topic to talk about. So when I first got diagnosed, one of the things I know, actually before diagnosis then happened, was I kept injuring my knee, especially when I would run. I was running a amount, and it would happen after I would run. It was like my MCL kept getting strained. I could feel my left foot sort of turning out as I would run.
Eric Von Frohlich (02:14)
That's great news.
TODD VOGT (02:38)
And so all the force was as opposed to coming down the straight down my leg is like coming over my MCL. Just like my left foot, I don't have like the control of it. You my right foot sort of tracks straight up and down, while my left foot sort of tracks out. So anyway, so I was trying to run a little bit more than I had been, know, nothing excessive, but I've been running like with my dog a little bit and on the treadmill. And so suddenly like my knees, like my left knee like flared up again. So yeah, I do have a strained MCL. It's like very minor,
Eric Von Frohlich (02:44)
Right.
TODD VOGT (03:06)
I think, I don't know, I keep bashing my head against the wall to try to be able to run again. And every time, this happens every time I do this, I'll run a little bit, like a mile or two, a couple times a week, and then suddenly, there it is, my MCL is sprained again. So, I don't know,
Eric Von Frohlich (03:12)
Right.
Maybe it's time to take up cycling.
TODD VOGT (03:23)
Yeah,
exactly. That's exactly what I was going to say. back to where I was before and be happy with the fact that I can row, can cycle, I can lift.
Eric Von Frohlich (03:31)
Yeah, at least with cycling, your foot's locked in and you don't have as much variability with running.
TODD VOGT (03:34)
Yeah.
Yeah,
I don't know if you've experienced this too. Whenever I have injuries, like because I use so many different exercise modalities, you probably experience this too. It's like I know how to work around injuries. for example, I know if my knee is hurting, rowing is great for it. Cause like my knees track pretty much straight back and forth, you know, when they come up. So rowing is great for my knees. If I hurt my like shoulder or something like that, I'll cycle or do something else. you know, if I hurt my back, can swim and you know, I know I'll know to swim and bike. Like I have all these workarounds basically.
Eric Von Frohlich (03:44)
Mm-hmm.
Right.
TODD VOGT (04:07)
Yeah. Yeah.
Eric Von Frohlich (04:06)
Yeah, I'm the same way. I go to kettlebells as
my go-to leg movement that my feet are grounded and they're kind of anchored into the floor. So it's easy for me to swing a kettlebell without anything really getting out of alignment.
TODD VOGT (04:22)
I mean it's I'm glad I have Things I can do and I'm happy about that the fact I can row and cycle and things but you know, it's a little a little frustrating still not want not be able to do what you one of the things you would like to do but I don't know I keep that I keep Having bashing my head against that wall and I don't Maybe I just need it go a little bit
Eric Von Frohlich (04:31)
But
And it's not just a mobility issue.
TODD VOGT (04:43)
yeah, would say like I can lift, when I lift like my feet track pretty straightforward. It's just that, because my left side doesn't have as much motor control. I think that's what's going on. The lack of like, the less motor control on my left side allows my left foot to kind of just go like this every time I step, you know, and over, when you're walking or hiking, it's not that much extra wear and tear on the knee, but when running, just,
Amplifies it. I guess you'd say so
Eric Von Frohlich (05:08)
And that's dose dependent or dose influenced or it doesn't really have any effect on it.
TODD VOGT (05:13)
Yeah,
I mean, not really. would say the medication doesn't change it. It still does that. My left foot just sort of still wants to come out, turn out. And yeah, and then like I said, when you run, just ratchets up the pounding and the force on the knee. So,
Eric Von Frohlich (05:29)
Right. Yeah, that gets old very quickly.
TODD VOGT (05:32)
yeah. So I've been biking and rowing a fair amount,
Eric Von Frohlich (05:35)
Life goes on. So what's, did you have any insights or any reflections on, you know, we started this two months ago and you have any insights that jumped up at you?
TODD VOGT (05:36)
Yeah.
I don't know. Let me think about that a little bit. You go here.
Eric Von Frohlich (05:51)
think the insights is how similar the initial phase is and how the people we've worked with and have spoken have such a common story about the diagnosis and the fears and apprehensions and how this diagnosis comes to
possibly define you in a lot of ways and ⁓ how you kind of come to terms to that and reach out and share it with your greater community just kind of the process that we all seem to go through seems to be very similar.
TODD VOGT (06:23)
Yeah,
okay, can add one thing to this. So a couple weeks ago, the Brian Grant Foundation, I think I mentioned this, who I work with, affiliated with, have a monthly, the first Monday of every month they have a Young Onset Parkinson's meetup. there's, know, anywhere from like 10 to 20 of us will show up at a local bar and have some food and just talk. So, point of the story, went to, I went a couple weeks ago to the last one I met this, I only met him at the very end, but.
A guy showed up, he was probably in his late 40s, mid to late 40s. He had just been diagnosed a couple to that. I had this funny feeling. We were talking to him a little bit. He was upset about his situation. ⁓ I remember thinking myself he was still in the, not the honeymoon phase, but the beginning of the
after diagnosis, look back now and can say the first couple of years my symptoms weren't so bad, weren't as bad as they are know, I remember thinking like looking back nostalgically I guess you would say and saying, retrospect the first year two after diagnosis wasn't so bad. maybe that's the way this goes no matter
Eric Von Frohlich (07:27)
Yeah, you go through that denial phase and then you start assessing and every ache and pain seems to be Parkinson's related when it was just an ache and pain pre diagnosis.
TODD VOGT (07:30)
Yeah.
Yeah, I think you hit on I thought as well, that maybe others did as well. I don't know if you experienced this, but the denial phase. I don't know, when I first got diagnosed the first year or so, I was still feeling really good and feeling diminished, but not significantly diminished, I guess you would say, as far as my mobility and my ability to row and my ability to work out hard and my ability to just live my daily life. So I don't know, I remember thinking to myself,
Eric Von Frohlich (07:57)
Right.
TODD VOGT (08:04)
Maybe this won't be as bad as I think it is. Maybe the progression, yes, exactly. Almost as there's, yeah, like you said, denial or some sort of bargaining. You're saying maybe it's gonna be different for me. Maybe it won't be so bad. Maybe symptoms won't advance. But now that it's been eight years since diagnosis, my symptoms are clearly advanced compared to where they were when I first got diagnosed.
Eric Von Frohlich (08:09)
Maybe I don't have Parkinson's.
Right.
TODD VOGT (08:29)
The reality is smacking me in the face, I guess you would say.
Eric Von Frohlich (08:32)
Yeah, but growth and development that you've had as a person over those eight years has to in some way compensate for the challenges that you've gone through.
TODD VOGT (08:47)
the interesting adventures and experiences I've had over the last eight have happened had I not got diagnosed. So, I don't know, did you feel the same way when you first got diagnosed as far as, I guess you would call it denial or bargaining or thinking you might be different?
Eric Von Frohlich (08:53)
Right.
Yeah,
I was I was determined to outwork it. I was just like, you know, I'm kind of built for endurance and I've gone through some couple challenges in my life and I was like, ⁓ I'll just outwork it. lasted until I hurt my back. And then once I had my back injury and I couldn't work out anymore, I kind of got run over by the reality of what I was dealing with and quickly got
TODD VOGT (09:04)
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Yeah.
Mm-hmm.
Eric Von Frohlich (09:26)
a dose of what life looks like without some control. And then your balance becomes an issue and symptoms seem to be amplified and everything kind of spirals out of control rather quickly if you're not managing your mindset and proactive in taking control of the course of your diagnosis.
It quickly spirals out of control. So I kind of caution everyone to do the mindset work and kind of come to terms with it, have support, you know, whether it's a counselor or or psychologist. then, of course, your greater community, sharing it with your community as soon as possible to get the support that you need. So you're not lone wolfing it is super important as well.
TODD VOGT (10:10)
Yeah,
I feel as though I had the same, a little bit of the same feeling that you had when I, within the first year or two of diagnosis, because remember I was training pretty hard. was like trying to make, you know, on the, either trying to make the Paralympic national team or on the Paralympic national team, whatever phase this was. But I remember thinking the same thing to myself. Like, you know, I'm working out like crazy and doing a ton of high intensity workout and mobility work. Yeah, maybe I can just, like you said, outwork it, so.
Eric Von Frohlich (10:35)
Yeah, it is amazing though, in the time that we've been doing this podcast. It's amazing the people that we've spent time with and how resilient they are and how strong they are and how they've managed to find purpose in their life and continue know, working with do. I kind of feel like I have to step my game up a little bit.
because, you know, I thought I was ahead of the curve, now that the average person is like Jimmy some of our other guests, it's inspiring.
TODD VOGT (11:08)
yeah, you realize there's a larger world of people out there with Parkinson's who are are know, some of them are doing really interesting things. like whether it's Patrick or, I don't know, there's a couple other people I follow on social media who are runners and athletes who have Parkinson's as well. Yeah, so you realize there's a group of people out there doing cool stuff.
Eric Von Frohlich (11:27)
Yeah, I think that it just becomes weighted vest in a lot of ways that you don't get to take off.
You know, but it makes everything a little more difficult and a little more challenging. But at the end of the day, it could be far worse. And not to diminish it, but just to keep it in perspective of what we're dealing with. It progresses, but it progresses relatively slowly for most of us. And we can kind of counterbalance that with a lot of lifestyle changes and inputs. certainly having a philosophy and a psychology that works to
give you some control meaningful, at least for me it's made a huge impact.
TODD VOGT (12:07)
Yeah, was thinking about how open people are to discussing about their experience with diagnosis and how they deal with it on a day-to-day basis. So, it's been impressive to see, how people open up about their experience. And it's helpful. It gives you like you some insight as well.
that other people do struggle either mentally or physically with this, so.
Eric Von Frohlich (12:26)
Yeah, there's a huge emotional component that I think has a tendency to get overlooked because the dyskinesia, the the symptoms that get the majority of the attention. But the emotional weight is every bit as challenging as the physical.