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Welcome to the very first episode of The Written Word Podcast.
This show is for people who write stories—and want them to be read.
Authors. Indie or traditional. Aspiring or ten books deep.
Each week, we dive into the business of being an author—marketing strategies, growing your audience, and selling more books. What’s working, what’s not, and what’s coming next.
In this episode, we’re diving into one of the most controversial strategies out there: Giving your book away for free.
Sounds risky? It might be. But it might also be the smartest move you make as an author.
Hosts Ricci Wolman and Ferol Vernon unpack the emotional baggage behind “free.”
They break down the math and share what top-earning authors are doing right now.
They break down the math and share what top-earning authors are doing right now.
Whether you're new to publishing or looking to level up, this episode will make you think twice about the power of zero dollars.
If you enjoyed today’s episode, share it with a fellow author and leave us a review. It helps more writers find the show.
The Written Word Podcast is produced by Walk West.
© 2025 Written Word Media, Inc. All rights reserved.
© 2025 Written Word Media, Inc. All rights reserved.
Creators and Guests
What is The Written Word Podcast?
A podcast for authors who want to build successful writing careers. Each episode explores the business and craft of being an author, with practical strategies for selling more books, growing your audience, and navigating the publishing world. Presented by Written Word Media.
This is potentially a very emotional
topic for a lot of authors.
A lot of authors spend a lot of
time and effort writing a book,
and then the thought of giving it
away for free is extremely painful.
Welcome to the written Word podcast.
The podcast for authors who want to
build a successful writing career.
I am Ferrell Vernon and I'm here
with Ricky Walman, and this is
the written word, media pod.
Today's episode, we are talking
about the power of free promotion.
Hey, Ricky, how you doing?
Great.
How are you doing today?
I'm amazing.
I was excited when we decided we were
gonna do this because, uh, I was like,
I had so much on my mind when I got
back from New Orleans and I really
thought this was like something that
we needed to talk about and might share
with, with all the authors out there.
Yeah, I agree.
I'm really excited to chat about it.
It sounds like you had a wide variety
of responses from authors, um, and
very interested to dive into it and
talk about how people feel about
giving away their books for free.
Yeah.
Okay.
So the backstory, I was in New Orleans.
I gave a talk on free promotions at
the future of publishing conference.
Um, shout out to Russell and Monica, who
put on a great conference for hosting us.
It was, uh, a really cool group of
people, a very big mix of authors, some
of whom had not published a book yet.
Some of whom had, you know, many
books and were kind of in that
middle of the career and some of
whom were super, super successful.
So it was a really wide range of
authors and it was really interesting
because that conference, the focus
is really kind of like alternative
methods of selling your books.
So there's a lot of stuff about
special editions, uh, audio, direct
sales, all these things that are
sort of like interesting new ways to
sell your books and free promotions.
A tried and trusted mechanism that
you and I are very familiar with, but
it was kind of like resurfacing an
old topic to a lot of these folks.
And so when I got back, uh, or when
I finished my talk, one of the most
interesting things was how some people
are like, oh my gosh, you know, I've
never thought about it that way.
And we'll, we'll, we'll go into
some of it in, in a minute.
And then there were some people
that were kind of like, oh,
I've been doing this for years.
It works great.
You know, so it was really
two very different opinions.
I think we can, we can kind of dive
into where that comes from, but that,
that was one of my big takeaways.
And I think you're right, like that
conference that you go to tends
to be on the cutting edge of all
the new techniques and marketing
tools that authors are using.
And that's very cool and
it's really important to stay
on top of what's going on.
But it's also important not to forget
the stuff that has always worked.
And I thought one of the anecdotes
that you brought back that was really
interesting is that in general a
lot of the authors you were talking
to who are making a lot of money.
We're using free and
we're using free a lot.
And a lot of the authors who are
struggling to make money, we're
trying a lot of, um, the kind of
new cutting edge marketing tools but
didn't have free in their toolkit.
And so, you know, it kind of points
to free potentially being more of a
staple, more of a foundational technique
versus some of the other techniques
that are potentially, you know, level
up, level two, level three, level four.
Yeah, and you think about like,
you know, you're climbing this
mountain if you're an author, right?
You're trying to get to the top
and that's where you make money and
everybody knows who you are and your
books are flying off the shelves.
And then there's like a base camp
and, and Free promotions is kind
of one of those ones that's like
a base camp technique, right?
And so what, what I think from that
conference, one of the things that I
reflected on is, you know, there are some
people who had gone through base camp.
Crushed it, hiked up the mountain,
crushed it, and they were doing great.
And then there were people that were
kind of trying to skip ahead, right?
That, that like hadn't given
anything away from free, didn't
have their brand sort of in order.
And those are the people that were,
were having a little bit of a harder
time with it when I talked to them.
And so I think it's important
to understand that like.
Giving stuff away for
free is not devaluing it.
It's just like that's
one of the mechanisms.
It's like one of the most
powerful ways you can actually
get something out there before
everybody already knows who you are.
And once everybody already knows who
you are, you know, you don't have
to give it away for free anymore.
But a lot of people are starting
at the bottom of that mountain
and hiking all the way up.
Yeah, absolutely.
And I think in your presentation you talks
a little bit about how other brands give
away free, so we'll get there in a minute.
Yeah.
But I do want to.
Name the elephant, which is, this
is potentially a very emotional
topic for a lot of authors.
A lot of authors spend a lot of
time and effort writing a book.
And then the thought of giving it
away for free is extremely painful.
Um, and you use the word devaluing.
They feel like maybe it devalues the work.
And this is not to
minimize those feelings.
I think those feelings are
real, and at the end of the day.
Everybody has to do what?
What makes them comfortable?
But this is akin to the debate over,
do you, do you know KDP, kdp, the left?
You know, do you go why, or do you,
you know, stay only with Amazon
and people tend to have very strong
feelings one way or the other.
So you are obviously an advocate
for free, and I think let's
talk about why you are so.
And then I can try play a little
bit of devil's advocate and, and
have, uh, on my shoulder the authors
who feel very strongly that they
don't want to give their books away.
Yeah.
Yeah.
And I think, you know, I think
those two topics are related,
like the, the wide versus.
Exclusive debate, like it's super
loaded and like everybody's like, I
don't wanna go exclusive to Amazon.
And it's like, you know,
I think I did the slide.
Amazon's given away, like not given
away, has uh, paid out almost $4
billion through the KDP select program.
And you're kind of like, you
know, that's a lot of money.
Yeah.
And so I think sometimes people think
about like, oh, you're supporting
Amazon or you're doing this, but
this is a company that while you
know they don't have your best
interest at heart necessarily, like
they have put a lot of money into
the independent author ecosystem.
And I think we have to recognize that.
And if you know financial success is
part of what you want as an author,
then you know, go get that money.
And I think part of.
Part of what, you know, we always
talk about when you and I talk to
authors is like, use the tools that
are there and kd P'S a great tool, it's
super good product for, for readers.
Like it's super low friction.
Like you can pick any book for $0
after you've paid the monthly fee.
And so I think you know what that
does, it creates a really good system
for readers and a really good way
for authors to access those readers.
There's this emotional baggage of
like, I don't wanna give away my
book for free and I don't wanna
do anything exclusive with Amazon.
And I think what I was seeing when I was
talking to those authors and what we've
seen over the last couple years too, is
that people can get really stuck on that
emotion and it can actually really hamper
their careers and their creative process.
Yeah.
I think, you know, if somebody does feel
really strongly that they don't wanna
support Amazon and there is a growing.
Group of people who feel that way for, you
know, multitude of reasons, that's fine.
It's fine to say, I don't wanna be
in, you know, Amazon's, uh, exclusive
program, or I don't wanna support Amazon.
But then you have to understand
what you're setting yourself up for.
You have to understand the consequences.
So if you're picking not to
go with to Amazon, which.
For many authors, starting out
is basically an easy button and
a really good way to build your
audience and build your business.
That's a, that's fine, that's
a fair, um, decision to make.
But then you have to understand,
okay, it's probably gonna take me
longer or I'm gonna have to invest
more to build up my business, right?
If I'm to do direct sales or if
I'm gonna try build a platform and
some of these other retailers like,
you know, apple or Google or Cobo.
And it's very, you know, it's not that
it's not doable, but it probably is gonna
be a little bit more challenging and
probably is gonna take a little bit more
time and a little bit more investment.
The authors actually, that I talked
to at that conference that were doing
the best It, it was like, you know,
oh, what, what techniques do you use?
And it was sort of all of the above.
Right?
They had some stuff in free,
the stuff that was for free.
Um, that was, that was KDP Select.
There's exclusive in ku.
They had some, some stuff that was wide.
They had some stuff that was
like special editions they had,
like at this conference, right.
There's a lot of Kickstarter folks,
people that are really interested in
that, that approach, which was cool.
But like the most successful authors like.
You know, had hid every camp on
the way up the mountain, right.
And, and were, do like, had sort of earned
the right to do kinds of cool stuff.
Um, and then there were some
authors of fact that like, were
just really pretty happy with
their sort of Amazon exclusive bit.
Like they focused on like running ads,
writing books, and like that was it.
Then like there's all these other
authors who are like trying to learn
the special edition stuff, the direct
sales, and you know, that's fun for them.
Like they're enjoying setting up
direct sales and keeping more margin.
And so like they're just investing
their time in a different way.
And I don't think it's right or
wrong, but like that was what really
struck me is like, hey, you're gonna
spend your afternoon figuring out
Shopify and figuring out, you know,
book Vault and Ingram, or however
you want to get your stuff fulfilled.
And you're gonna keep a little
bit more margin, but like you're
trading writing time for margin.
Right?
And those are fine things to trade,
but I think sometimes authors
don't think about it that way.
Yeah.
I think it also comes down to
what your goals are as an author.
Have to do a whole session on
goals at some point to bet, you
know, if your goal is to have fun.
And doing special additions is fun,
and doing Kickstarters is fun for you,
then you're doing exactly the right
thing by spending your time there.
I think where it gets a little
trickier is if your goal is to make
money, then you have to make some
really hard decisions about where
you want to spend your time and.
You know, a fair amount.
I would say more than half of the
authors that we work with, or who
use the written word media products,
their goal is to make money.
Their goal is to be able to write
full-time and to quit their jobs
and to be a full-time writer.
And a lot of them are doing
that, and it's, um, so cool
to see and so impressive.
But that, if that is your goal,
the easiest way to get there is by
starting with using free promotion and.
Amazon.
Being an Amazon KDP select program makes
that very easy because it allows you
to have five free days every quarter
where you can make your book free.
And the other option is to make
your book permanently free, or
what people call Perma Free.
Then you can be wide on all of these
retailers, but at the end of the day,
having at least one title free or having
book one in the series three is from what
we have seen and we've been doing this.
What, 10 years now?
Yeah.
Almost one, um, one the, one of the most
proven ways to actually building your
author business and getting to that goal
of making money and doing this full time.
Yeah.
And so, you know, to bring up like
the talk that I gave and I thought
what was interesting about like,
when I, when I was doing the talk
and like why I wanted to do it is.
You know, there's this concept
that giving away for free is
like not a profitable technique.
Right?
And that, and that was, and I
was like, when I heard that, you
know, I was like, oh my gosh.
Like that's so wrong.
Right?
Um, like if you're sitting on a street
quarter handing out, you know, free
books, like maybe that doesn't work.
But like free promotion is something
that huge Fortune 500 companies
use to make lots and lots of money.
And I, you know, I was
thinking like, Hey, it's.
Let's get that information in front of
these authors, many of whom are, you know,
entrepreneurs, solopreneurs, whatever you
wanna call 'em, and let's let you know,
show them they can use these techniques
to be, to be really, really successful.
And so that was like the impetus
behind wanting to do that specific
talk to that specific audience.
And I thought it was
really, it was a lot of fun.
Yeah, and I, um, I can't
share my screen right now.
Maybe you can, but there was, there was a
slide that you had with a lot of numbers
on it, like a lot, a lot of numbers,
um, which is a little intimidating,
but maybe you can bring that slide up
and we can walk through it a little
bit in terms of how does the math.
Actually work because I get
why it feels counterintuitive.
If you're giving away something
for free, how on earth are you?
Are you making money?
And as you bring that up, I'll talk
about the one really easy way, which
is if you are in KDP select and you do
use one of those five free days because
your book is in KU and in the KDP
select program, on those five days when
your book is free, if any reader who.
Downloads your book on those free days,
you still get paid out for the KU reads.
So we see that quite a lot.
Um, some of our audience on, you know,
free books, these are, uh, free, are
the newsletter that promotes free books.
And you know, some percentage of readers
on there are in ku, so when they grab a
book for free from an author, although
technically they're getting the book
for free as they read it, those authors
are getting paid out on the page reads.
So that's one very simple way.
And not what you, you were
talking about specifically,
but I do wanna highlight that.
'cause I think sometimes authors
forget that, that if they are in KU
and they run a free promo, that you
actually still do get your KU payouts.
And when you run a free promo, you tend
to see your k and p reads going up because
more people have grabbed that book because
you're putting promotion behind it.
Yeah, so this is the slide I think
you were talking about, right?
The, the, with a lot of numbers.
Yeah.
And for those people you know, who
are listening on audio, what we have
in front of us is a slide that has
two columns, a 99 cent promotion and
a free promotion, and then a bunch
of different rows with different
metrics from each of those promos.
So, we'll, we'll, we'll run through them.
From, you know what, we'll kind of touch
on what the pertinent stats are here.
So, yeah, so Farrell,
walk me through this.
Yeah, yeah.
So, okay.
So, so what we did, and, and we're
using some hypothetical numbers here,
but they are based in the reality of
our business and what we see, right?
And so what you see is the, the
two most common price points,
the thing that readers like
the most are free and 99 cents.
Right.
And so what I wanted to do is
compare those two promotions
mathematically, right?
And so what, what you see is that if
we start with say, 10,000 impressions
for both the free and the 99 cent
book, the click-through rate, so
the response rate, however you
want to call it on the free book.
We see as like, you know, three
to four times higher than the
response rate on a paid book.
Right?
And I go through some of the psychology
of this, and we can get into it in a
minute, but essentially like the word
free makes your brain go nuts, right?
It just like, it makes you do very
unconventional things that don't
make a whole lot of sense otherwise.
And so you just, you think
free things are great and so.
You can harness that as an author
by presenting that to your readers,
and we help you do that, right?
So because your response rate is
so much higher, even though you're
not selling any books, some, some
interesting things start to make sense.
Okay.
So you'll get a lot of
these free downloads.
So the, when somebody clicks on a book
from an email and they go to Amazon,
there's some breakage there, right?
Like, not everybody will actually go
through and purchase that book, but
when the book is free, the overwhelming
majority of people do grab that book
because it's free for a limited time.
So your, your conversion rate is extremely
high because there's zero friction.
Right, and all these, uh, people already
have, uh, Amazon accounts, but then,
you know, a little point in the side
of the 99 cent promotion, your read
through rate is gonna be much higher.
So if somebody paid for the book, they're
more likely to read book two because
they actually are more invested, right?
So we see a read through percentage of,
on average, around 50% for paid books,
only about 10% for free books, but.
What we know is that the original
response rate was so overwhelmingly
much higher that you're getting a read
through rate on a much higher number.
And so when you sort of math all of
this out, you're actually earning quite
a bit more money on the free promotion
because you have so many more people
that have been exposed to your book.
So even if they converted a much lower
rate, the so-called top of your funnel
or your total exposure is so much higher.
That when you pull down all the
revenue numbers, you end up with
numbers that are, you know, 3, 4,
5 x as profitable to the author.
As a 99% promotion.
Right.
And just to point out, this is
dependent on you being able to
sell other books to that reader.
So in this example that we're
looking at, we're saying, you know,
book one is being set to free, and
then yes, maybe less, fewer people,
grab book one and read it for free.
But then because that absolute number
is significantly higher, the number of
people who go on to purchase book two
and book three more than makes up for it.
So you land up with more
profit on the free promotion
than on the 99 cent promotion.
If you only have one book,
then free is not running.
A free promotion is not a good idea
because you've got nothing else
to sell, so you literally aren't
giving your only your own asset.
Free, you know, on that free promo,
you're not gonna make a lot of money.
Now if you only have one book running
a free promo to get reviews and
to kickstart the algorithm and for
some other objectives make sense?
But, uh, we're just looking at like
the actual math of, you know, a 99
cents book versus a, a free book.
And if you only have one book and
all you're trying to do is make
money, then doing a 99 cent promo
is the only way for you to make
money on that specific promo itself.
Yeah, so, you know, for those of
you who can't see the slide on a
99 cent promo, when you, you map it
out, that author, let's just say I'm
the author running a 99 cent promo.
I'm probably gonna net out around 77.
Call it, you know, 70, between
75 and $80 based on the, the
baseline metrics we have.
And if ferals, you know, an author
running a free promo, he's gonna net
out closer to, you know, 250 to, you
know, $275 just because of the higher.
Numbers because you know, on a 99 cent
promo, there are probably 300 people
clicking through and maybe 30 sales.
But on a free promo, you're probably
getting closer to a thousand
clicks, and then 800 people are
going and grabbing that first book.
And then because those numbers are so
much bigger at the beginning, as you go
down the funnel into book two and book
three, you start making a lot more money.
Yeah, and I think like one of the
things that people also don't always
appreciate is like the value of a free
promotion and, and the, the impact of
that super big response rate at the
beginning is like, you know, that's
a greater opportunity to get those
first reviews for a debut book, right?
Or to teach.
The, the retailer algorithm
about your book and like,
what, what else it it can do.
And so I think there's, there's a lot of
value in running these free promotions
when you're just getting started out.
But like, as you pointed out, it's
not always gonna be profitable
if you only have one book.
And something else I hit on in the
presentation is, you know, it's also not
profitable for things that have cost.
So this is all for eBooks, right?
But if you have a physical book.
Running a free promotion for a physical
book, uh, is not gonna have the same
returns because you're, you're outlaying
a lot more cash to get that done.
And so I think, you know, that is, is just
something everybody needs to keep in mind.
Absolutely.
So let's talk a little bit about how
other brands leverage free, because I
think one of the objections that authors
have is that offering their product
for free devalues the product itself.
And I think in, in, in your
presentation, you talked a lot about
how major brands that have huge brand
cachet utilize free and free trials.
To convert customers and it doesn't
do any damage to, to the brand itself.
And, and maybe we can go to that
slide, I think where, I think
you have Apple and some of the,
you know, the bigger software.
Yeah.
So like, you know, when I was
doing research for this, I was, you
know, it actually wasn't very hard.
I like set aside all this time in
the evening, you know, I got a fresh
cup of tea and I was like, okay.
Where are all these big companies
giving away for stuff free?
It took me like 10 minutes.
Like major companies are, you
know, and these are like, some of
these are like Fortune 10, right?
Some of the biggest companies on Earth,
most successful companies on earth,
they use free all the time, right?
And like, you know, Gmail I think
is maybe my favorite example because
like Gmail costs you nothing.
Right.
It's a, it's a email service, and yes,
you have to watch ads, but like it's
totally free and they can market free.
And because they can sign up so
many people, it gives them this
opportunity, these other opportunities.
Even a company like Apple who you
know is absolutely on the luxury end
of things, like high price computers,
high price phones, you know, high
quality stuff from like all over.
You know, in order to get people to
use a digital product, which is Apple
tv, they give away a free trial.
So I think it's really important like
a company that like their whole brand
and value proposition is on like super
high quality, super expensive goods.
Even they are using free
to sell a digital product.
Apple's the one that really jumped
out at me 'cause I think if.
You know, you were to ask me like, you
know, give, gimme off the top of your
head, one of the most valuable brands.
The, the two that jump to mind for me
are, you know, apple and Nike, but I
think Apple is, is one of the ones that
would come, come to mind for most people.
And then, you know, to see it on your
slide of, you know, big companies using
free, and you're exactly right for Apple
tv, they send people with a free trial.
Like, you know, try it out.
And when you're running free promo on
book one, it's exactly the same thing.
You're like, Hey, I'm an author.
Try me out and try out book one.
And then they're hoping you're
gonna, you know that you're gonna
pay for book two and book three
and Apple TV's the same way.
It's like, hey, try it out.
You're gonna get hooked on a show and
then you're gonna pay 'cause you wanna
see next week's episode of, you know,
Ted Lasso or Succession or whatever,
you know, great show they have.
But a couple of the other brands you
have on the slide are in JP Morgan.
With free online trades, at and t
with free phones, with trade-in.
So once you start priming your mind to,
to look around and see who's using free
as a, as a marketing techniques, there
are actually so many examples that are
out there and so many examples of brands
that have very high brand integrity.
So it's not devaluing
the brand in any way.
And I just thought that that.
For me that was, you know, a really
tangible example that could give comfort
to authors who feel like giving a
book away for free devalues the work.
The other thing that I've been thinking
about, and I don't have, you know, maybe
a fully formed thought on this yet, but
in the book industry, free is in some
ways, not a default, but kind of like if,
if, if you were gonna pick any industry.
Where free feels like the norm.
I would say books.
Is it because of libraries?
Right.
So like every town has a library, every
school has a library, you know, and
libraries are a place to get free books.
And then we have, you know,
in our neighborhood, tons
of little free libraries.
Yeah.
Which I absolutely love and they're
popping up everywhere, but literally
the name is Little Free Library.
And so, and you know, and I'm a huge
reader and I, I obviously am a big fan
of, of indie authors and indie bookstore.
So when I wanna read a book, I,
I tend to purchase books 'cause I
feel really strongly about that.
But so many of my network who read books
will get their books from the library
or be on a wait list for a new release.
Yeah.
Oh.
I'd be like, have you read that book yet?
And they'll say, oh no,
I'm on the wait list.
You know, on Libby, I'm on the
wait list of my library to get it.
And these are people you know of
means, um, who can spend $20 for a
new release book or, or you know, $7
if it's an Indian new release book.
Yet they don't.
And so I think there is a bias in
the world of readers and in the
world of books toward free already.
And so if, if you wanna fight that and
fight the good fight that that's fine.
But it is somewhat of a fight.
And, um, yeah.
I do think you can, you know, also choose
to lean into it and say, okay, free is
something that people understand, and then
how do you leverage it and then create
a relationship with the reader so that
you can, at the end of the day, you still
also need to make a living from this.
So we're not saying just give your
books away, you know, for free in
perpetuity, but have a strategy behind it.
Yeah, that's such a great point
because like libraries, like
what other industry are there?
Literal physical buildings
in your neighborhood, giving
away free stuff, right?
Like that doesn't exist for cars, doesn't
exist for, for really clothes, right?
Like even if you go to like a thrift
shop, you're still spending a few dollars.
But books, there's like this huge
building in almost every place
in America where you can walk in.
And walk out with 10 books and pay $0.
Right?
So like that, that's the environment
that you live in as a writer, right?
Is like that's what you're competing with.
So I think it's a really interesting
point that it's like, Hey, if you wanna.
Tell people like, uh, the library's
better than than my book, then,
you know, you can do that.
But that's, that's a, that's
a tough hill to climb.
Yeah.
The other point I think that I really
wanna make about these companies
that are on the screen is like,
these companies are not doing this.
The same way a library is, right?
A library exists as a public good, right?
They're usually government funded and
there's volunteer organizations and
everything, but it's literally there for
the good of the community of society.
Uh, it is sort of an altruism thing.
That's not the case for Apple and
for Google and at and t, right?
Like they are doing this
because it's profitable.
And so you can bet if
Apple's doing it, it works.
You can bet if Google's
doing it, it works.
And I think that's the thing that I
really wanna, you know, I was hoping
that people would, would come away with
after the talk is that like, these people
aren't doing this to save the whales.
Right?
They're not, they're not doing
it just because out of the
goodness of their heart, giving
you three months of Apple tv.
Like they think that.
They are gonna make money off
of you by giving that away free.
And I think authors can use that same
technique that the big boys are using.
And there's really good ways to do that.
Yeah, and I think that's.
A very helpful point
psychologically for authors, right?
So when you're giving away your book,
instead of feeling like, oh, I'm a
sucker, or I'm, you know, devaluing
my work, what you're really doing is
you're being highly strategic, right?
Exactly.
You're employing exactly a highly
strategic tactic to achieve your
end objective, which is being able
to write more books and do this
full time as a living, and just
that simple mind shift, I think.
Can really take the sting or the pain away
from free if that's what you're feeling.
I know a lot of authors,
you know, they embrace free.
It doesn't bother that.
Yeah.
They understand it as a strategy and a
tactic, but like I said, there's some
authors who don't feel that way, and
that might be a different way to, you
know, shift the window in your mind and
think about it, instead of saying, oh,
we're giving it away for free today.
No, it's just a tactic
you're using to get Yeah.
Or to reach your eventual goal.
Yeah, and I think this is something I
talk about, you know, uh, whenever I
talk to authors or, or even like other
entrepreneurs, you know, in our community
is like, Hey, when you're running a small
business, small organization, whatever
it is, they say, you wear a lot of hats.
You have a lot of different roles.
You do a lot of different things.
And sometimes it can be
helpful to like literally.
Personify those different
characters, right?
So think about your author business.
There's like the chief creative
officer, which, which every author
is their own chief creative officer.
And that person doesn't wanna
give away the art for free, right?
That's okay.
So imagine that person sitting at
a, at a round table and saying like,
we shouldn't give it away for free.
Then imagine your CFO.
Right, because you're also the CFO of
your little offer business and that
person saying like, well, well the
numbers check out on this free thing.
Like, let's, let's make the money right.
And then you have, you know,
you're also the CEO of that, of
that, uh, little, little company.
And like, that's the person
who's gonna make the call about
whether we're doing this or not.
And, you know, maybe you've got a,
you know, you, your controller, you
have some other people at that table
that they're all still you, right?
But give voices to those people and
sometimes that can help you make the
decision and not let sort of one aspect of
your business overrule another aspect of.
Yeah, I love that.
It's like, you know, all the, all
the, the little yous in your mind.
Yeah.
That, and they're all
arguing with each other.
And there's conflict, of
course, there's conflict, right?
Like the artist, you doesn't
want to do what the finance
u uh, is telling them to do.
And.
Being able to look at it that way
and understand exactly what is,
what's going on, can really help
to diffuse that conflict and, and
reach a decision and also spend
less emotional energy around it.
So, yeah, and I, I know we're not
talking about like craft today, but
like, you know, it's the same idea when
people talk about cliffhangers, right?
Like, you know, we know very
definitively that cliffhangers from
book one into Cliff two, like work.
Like, they make good
financial sense, right?
But, you know, maybe you don't wanna
write that because you don't feel
like doing that to your reader.
And so, you know, again, you imagine
your little conference table, right?
And your CFO is like,
Hey, this checks out.
Like, let's, let's sell book two.
You know?
And then maybe, maybe your, you
know, HR person is like, well,
I don't know if that's fair, if
that's the right thing to do.
And everybody makes their own
decisions at that table, right?
But I think it's helpful to, to
sketch that out for yourself and
realize like, which, which version
of you is actually making the call?
Yeah.
Super helpful.
I think as we're, we're getting to
time and wrapping up, that's, that's
probably a, a good place to stop and
whoever's listening to this, when you
turn the podcast off, you know, spend
five minutes and, and try to see who
are the, who are all the mini use, who
are the people at your tables Yeah.
About these different things.
And it might, uh, help you, give
you some clarity as to some of the,
the things that you're feeling.
So before we wrap anything we didn't
cover Farrell on, on your talk around
the power of free, any other like,
important, you know, takeaways or
insights that you have around this?
No, I think we hit the big
parts and I, you know, this
was great talking about this.
I, and I also like, you know,
talking about it in person was great.
Talking about it on the podcast
is, is always really important.
So, you know, folks that can't
travel can, can kind of hear,
can kind of hear these things.
But I think, you know, the, the big
takeaway that, that I sort of ended the
talk with is, is like free is profitable.
It does work.
It's your call to make, and if
you do make the call, you know,
like Ritmo Media can help you.
And, and so we, you know, we do have,
uh, free promotion stuff, we have
stuff for wide authors and all that.
But I think, you know, what I
would love to end with is, is, uh,
just asking the community, like,
you know, what do you all think?
And is there anything that we missed here?
And, and, you know, maybe we'll
do a follow up show on that.
Send in your comments and
questions, we can do a follow up
on all the feedback that we get.
Yeah, that was ton of fun.
Well, awesome.
This has been really cool.
Really fun and uh, look forward
to doing it again next week.
Alright, talk to you.
Alright, thanks everyone for joining us.
Bye y'all.