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Join Monét and Quay as they talk with the inspiring Dreama Caldwell, Executive Co-Director at Down Home NC, who went from navigating the criminal justice system to leading a movement for change in small-town North Carolina. Dreama shares how she found her political home (spoiler: it involves a lot of butcher paper and a whole new take on small-town mayors), tackles myths about rural communities, and reveals the power of listening in organizing. Plus, she spills the tea on knocking doors, school board battles, and why rural folks aren’t all MAGA. This episode is a masterclass in building bridges and making change from the ground up.
Are you ready to start the conversation? Eat, chat and act with Down Ballot Brunch.
Down Ballot Banter is hosted by Monèt Marshall and Quay Weston and is a production of Earfluence.
Down Ballot Banter is hosted by Monèt Marshall and Quay Weston and is a production of Earfluence.
Creators & Guests
What is Down Ballot Banter?
Welcome to Down Ballot Banter, the podcast that puts the spotlight on local elections and what local government actually means for you. Hosted by Monèt Marshall and Quay Weston.
Monet - 00:00:03:
Hey y'all, welcome to Down Ballad Banter, the podcast that puts a spotlight on local elections and what local government actually means for you. I'm Monét Noël Marshall.
Quay - 00:00:13:
And I am Quay Weston.
Monet - 00:00:14:
Yeah, you are.
Quay - 00:00:15:
Local elections are extremely important, and we're on a mission to learn together and to break down local politics in a way that makes sense to us and doesn't require us to be experts.
Monet - 00:00:25:
Because we are not.
Quay - 00:00:26:
Hello.
Monet - 00:00:26:
So whether you're a seasoned voter or this is your first opportunity, we've got the insights and information to keep you informed and engaged.
Quay - 00:00:34:
Because when it comes to building new worlds, all of our inputs matter.
Monet - 00:00:39:
Yes. So if you're ready to learn with us, let's go.
Quay - 00:00:48:
So today we have Dreama Caldwell, who is a executive co-director at Down Home NC. And their work is focused on rural organizing for poor and working class folks in small towns and rural communities. So, Dreamer, would you like to do a little intro of your own and answer the question, like, what's your origin story is where we often start. Like, what's gotten you to today?
Dreama - 00:01:12:
Oh, well, hey, y'all. I'm Dreamer Carwell. I am the executive co-director at Down Home. Down Home is actually my political home. It's where I was politicized. I came there in 2017 as a member. What brought me there was I just came out through an incident in the criminal justice system, didn't really understand everything that had happened to me, and had just learned all of the collateral damages of accepting a plea deal and how my life had been changed. And so just looking for organizations that would help me, I was on Facebook and saw an ad from Down Home, and that's how I found my way into Down Home.
Monet - 00:01:55:
I think I find that so interesting, like so often in nonprofit spaces, it's folks who have a traditional path to leadership. And I think it says so much about Down Home that you have like come through and are leading. And can you say more about like what they did that was special that made you feel welcomed and then like supported your leadership and growth over time?
Dreama - 00:02:17:
I think one of the great things about Down Home is our theory of change is that we believe that through leadership development, we can train our members to be able to go out and seek the changes that we need. And so there were lots of opportunities for leadership development for me in Down Home. And honestly, it was the first time anybody had really listened to my story and not from a place of like blaming me and shaming me. It was more of like what happened and just listening. I felt like I'll never forget my first one to one with Juan. It was all about how he was able to listen. He didn't really say a lot. He just listened. And then at the end of the conversation, asked me a question of like, what do you want to do about it? And it was the first time I was like, what do you mean what I want to do about it? And that's when he started telling me about what Down Home does. And then. If I can just be very transparent, I wasn't sold because he told me that it was a multiracial organization. I lived in Alamance County and I wasn't sure I wanted to work with white people in Alamance County. And so he just convinced me to come to the office space. When I got to the office space, there was butcher paper written everywhere where they had listed out all of the municipalities in Alamance County. I mean, I didn't even know Green Level had a mayor. I didn't know Sweptonville had a mayor. But there were all of these offices and all of these people. And I had voted every single year, but I didn't know anybody on any of those papers. And I didn't know what they did. So I was like, this is where I need to be. And so just having that open arm of like... You'd be surprised. Most people don't know what a county commission does, but also most people don't have the space to ask, what does a county commissioner do? And so just having that space, nonjudgmental space, was just very welcoming for me.
Monet - 00:04:16:
Jimmy, you talk about a political home. Can you define what a political home is?
Dreama - 00:04:20:
Yeah, a political home for me is a place where I can ask all the questions about what I don't understand. The process, you know, understanding how it affects my life, understanding what these positions that we're electing is. And then just a place where I can gather with other people who have similar values of mine. And we can together advocate for the change we needed in our community. And so.
Quay - 00:04:53:
Yeah, that's helpful. Thank you. And I think that's what one. Made me excited to have this conversation because I think There's a way that some nonprofit organizations can just be organizations, right? And not political homes in which you come to grow and learn and study and commit to like change with people over time, which is a question I'll definitely ask about later. But I'm curious to even in your experience, like. What do people get wrong about folks in rural areas? I am from... Guilford County, Pantigo, North Carolina, Pantigo, North Carolina. And then we have family in Pitt County too, like lines back to there. And I, at least for me growing up, I felt very... Not unclear or unaware about what was happening, but that there weren't like entry points for me until I went to college and was able to join different groups and things. So yeah, back to the question. I'm curious about for you, like what do people get wrong about people in rural communities or rural counties in North Carolina?
Dreama - 00:06:00:
I think the assumption is that rural means white and that it's white people. And that is true. Like in Western North Carolina, in rural areas, it is white people. But if you go out east, it's all black folks, you know. And so I think that that's a really big assumption that people get wrong. In North Carolina, just all of the BIPOC identities, we're talking about 14 million people in the state. You know, that's more than some states, you know, some places have in their state. And I think the other thing that people just assume is like there's this thing about like people being uneducated.
Quay - 00:06:42:
That's right.
Dreama - 00:06:42:
The hillbilly or redneck theory of what they think folks are like in rural North Carolina. And it's really not like that. I mean, there are just as many people that are educated in rural North Carolina as well. People who have a legacy family, like you just said, your family, and they've chosen to live and continue to live in the areas where their families were. And then the other thing about, I think, about rural that people think is that everybody in rural North Carolina is MAGA, and that's not true.
Quay - 00:07:14:
That's right.
Dreama - 00:07:15:
That's not true. We knock on doors and talk to people every day, and that's not the majority of the people. Maybe they're the loudest people, but it's not the majority of the people in rural North Carolina.
Monet - 00:07:26:
Mm-hmm. So you started to talk about the work that y'all do. So knocking on doors. What is some of the other work that you're doing to like within that with down home in this election?
Dreama - 00:07:37:
Yeah. So we have a group called Public School Strong. So if you know, remember earlier in the last couple of years, there was this. Right-wing takeover of our local school boards. People were showing up and they used the mask as an opportunity to try to get people off the school board. That moved on to book bans and other things. And so we have a group of people, of organizers who have organized Public School Strong, which are parents, grandparents, teachers, community members all across this state. I think they're currently in over 71 counties in the state. And they were showing up in school board meetings in their blue shirts, their PSS shirts, all across the state to say that their voices matter too as well. And so currently some of those people are working to get some school board candidates that align with our values elected. We are also knocking on doors right now in our counties. We have six counties that are emerging counties, we call, that we have fellows. And so fellows are people that are not really organizers yet, but we hire them on to learn how to organize. And they're helping to develop new areas that we're in. And so that's pretty much what we're doing, just having a lot of conversations. We spent the first half of our electoral program doing persuasive work, talking to people in rural North Carolina about abortion, which is something that we've kept quiet for a really long time, which is going to be a really big topic for all this election. We've decompose so we don't have the typical five minute vote to this person. You gotta go, we actually share our personal stories. So our canvassers were sharing their own experiences with abortion or their own personal stories and connecting with people at the door with their stories so that we can not vote people in who believe in abortion bans, where people don't have a right to say what happens to their own bodies.
Quay - 00:09:44:
That's good. Yeah, and I think that's one of the things that I'm stuck on is like, seems that the focus has been like the presidential election right and that means that then Well, there's many ties, right? Both in thinking about a part of our conversation with Blair was about like media and newspapers not being accessible or being or existing even in small rural counties. And that then means people pay a lot of attention to mainstream media or mainstream news. Which then makes people focus more on the presidential elections than state and local elections, too. So I'm curious there around media and how you find that playing into the strategy of reorganizing. What are people like? What are you hearing from people? What do they care about? How's that tie into maybe some of this like. Media attention or focuses on certain things.
Dreama - 00:10:40:
One of the things when we talk with people, when we're having conversations early on before we get into electoral work, we're not talking about Republican and Democrat. We're talking about straight values because really, no matter how different we are, we really all have basic the same values. What we differ on is how do we get there and who's going to lead us there? And so just talking with people about their values. We heard things like education come up. People, affordable housing came up all across the state where people are just being outpriced, where they can't afford their rent. And then, you know, hearing people talk about, you do have people who talk about the economy and how hard it's been for them. And so just really like continuing to have those conversations with people on that level without bringing in the culture wars of like the buzz talk that everybody else is talking. What you said about media not being in rural North Carolina is really hard because you spend a lot of time having to have conversations with people who are. Using the talking points of the things that they hear on TV and that they hear on the radio. But when you are standing with a neighbor of yours on your front porch having a conversation and you can get them to drill it back down to their personal experience, not what they've heard, not what someone else has said they should think, you get people to really go inside of themselves and really have a more informed decision about voting than just like something they saw on TV. Yep. It really gets, it lands home for them.
Monet - 00:12:19:
That's so important. And I think in both our rural and our urban spaces, we need that because I think we do. We are moving with so many assumptions about each other that we're not stopping to listen. So one of the questions that we have for you is what do you think we can do to help bridge that rural urban divide in North Carolina? And how can folks who are living in these blues, more blue zones of the state, how can we be supportive and lifting up the lived experience and the stories of folks who live in rural counties?
Dreama - 00:12:49:
Yeah, I think, first of all, making sure that, like, Whenever these conversations are happening, the most impacted people are really in the rooms having those conversations. Not people who are making decisions for others, but people who are living with the most lived experience to talk about it. Because when you get people together and we all start talking about our lived experiences. Again, we find that commonality of things. We find the things that we can agree on. And having... Being able to have those conversations about those things. I'm sorry, what was the other part you asked me?
Monet - 00:13:24:
Bridging the rural-urban divide.
Dreama - 00:13:26:
It's talking. I mean, we can't stop talking. I feel like we do everything in this country except for talk to each other. And listen. And listen to each other, right? That's right. We listen. Instead of listening to understand, we listen to defend. Right. And we really need to be listening to understand one another. But it's conversation that cannot stop. And I think that deep canvas skills to be able to talk to people who don't believe like you. I mean, families are falling apart right now over an election.
Monet - 00:13:58:
I know that.
Dreama - 00:13:58:
I'm watching people. I'm blocking you. I'm blocking you. I'm not talking to you. I'm not talking to you. You know, and. We're doing all the wrong things instead of like... Talking and approaching things with curiosity. When someone tells me they're going to vote for, let's just say Trump or whatever. I want to approach with curiosity. I want to know, tell me more. I want to know why I want to know how does that affect you? What do you think? You know, all the things. Because I think that there are there's something in like listening to people's whys that you can kind of like dissect a little bit more and have more conversation about. But if you don't ever get to that point and you just dismiss people. And throw each other away, you know, it doesn't work that way. One of the things we know with our work in rural North Carolina, you can't afford to throw anybody away.
Monet - 00:14:51:
No, we cannot.
Dreama - 00:14:52:
You know, we just cannot afford to. These elections are won by razor thin margins. And so every person in every conversation is important.
Monet - 00:15:03:
Dreama, you mentioned the BIPOC communities and the racial diversity of our state, and particularly in our rural counties. And can you talk more about how that's impacting our elections and that multiracial organizing that you talked about and how Down Home is doing that?
Dreama - 00:15:22:
Yeah, multiracial movement building is happening all across the state. The infrastructure here in North Carolina is very young. When I talk about the movement infrastructure, it's only about seven years old here in North Carolina. And this year is probably been the most coordinated that I've seen across the state where we're really all working together and working together in one. And so that involves us training together. We're currently running phone banks with two of our partners with Carolina Federation and Siembra organization. And so we're doing more things together, which helps as well to kind of like uplift the infrastructure, the unity and the solidarity that we have happening.
Monet - 00:16:13:
I want to drill down a little bit more here and ask specifically about the relationship and the wins and possibilities you see between Black folks and Latino folks here in the state.
Dreama - 00:16:23:
Yeah. I mean, amazing work. I mean, and I want to just not lift up just Latino folks because we also have partnership with organizations that work with Asian American populations. So I just think just the BIPOC work that we're doing all across the state has been amazing. Our canvassers are out on turf together. Like I said, we're on phone banks together. And just to be able to go into a community where there's more than one language spoken and to be able to have an ally that is able to communicate with people has been really great. And I mean, I think we all find that as BIPOC across the state, again, we have more in common than we don't have. And so we're finding our ways to work together a lot more.
Quay - 00:17:11:
Yeah. As a member of an organization, Black Men Build, Miami and St. Louis and developing here. Why is coalition building so hard? People talk about, I think, one of the ideas of the most racial coalition building. It sounds simple at first, but it takes some very intentional, thoughtful work to get to that point. So, yeah, I wonder, like, to your for your perspective, like, why is the coalition building so hard, particularly amongst people who are looking to do the transformative work of justice?
Dreama - 00:17:48:
First of all, like, we first have to acknowledge that, like, There's been so much done to make sure that we don't trust one another. And so there's a lot of things there we have to unpack and unlearn and relearn there for that. The other thing is when you have coalitions and you're bringing groups together, every group has a different theory of change. Every group has a different method of doing things. And so when you're putting everybody together, sometimes that's really hard. And so for me, I found that the best way to work through coalition is to, at the very top, be very clear how we're going to work through this. And when conflict comes up. How are we going to deal with the conflict? Because one of the things I know from working in coalition is that conflict will come up. Absolutely. And so being able to work with it, work through it so that it doesn't stop the work. And then sometimes we have to just be honest with each other and just. Take a step back. Sometimes you have to take a step back and come back to the work. I mean, we're all coming from this work from different lenses. We're bringing our own personal traumas into the work. We're bringing our organizational traumas into the work. And so all that messiness goes into the coalition spaces. And I think we have to stay very clear on our self-interest and our whys. And so I think that's important at the beginning of coalition building, being very clear of what our objectives are here. And then the other thing is just like, I like to name it like, our enemy is not in this room. Our enemy is not in this room. And just to be able to name that, even when it feels really tense and it feels really tight, they're like, you're not my enemy. And so, you know, yeah, it's just messy.
Monet - 00:19:37:
I'm going to take that with me, Dreama.
Quay - 00:19:39:
Yeah.
Monet - 00:19:40:
Our enemy is not in this room.
Dreama - 00:19:42:
And that's what we have to always. Always remind ourselves when we're doing this work. I mean, it's so much traumas in this work alone. And people are coming to it and they haven't had access to therapy or somatics or don't have the skills. And honestly, like myself, trauma brought me to the work. So trauma brought most of us to the work. And so that comes along with us when we come into the work.
Quay - 00:20:09:
Wow. What keeps you anchored in this work? Because it's hard and tiring.
Dreama - 00:20:15:
I think my ancestors keep me anchored. Knowing that everything they went through was even harder. And seeing what they were able to accomplish in the time that they were in. Knowing that there's no reason we can't accomplish greater. I assume good intent with everybody that I meet, and I don't take anything personal. And so because of that, I'm able to stay anchored because the thing that keeps me anchored is kind of like my why. And, you know, I don't want people to have to take plea deals that change their lives forever. And so I always stay centered on that. And when I'm having, I've had some terrible moments in movement. And particularly being the first black female to run for office or the first black female to lead this organization. I've had a lot of terrible moments and then just had to go back to like, this ain't personal. This ain't, you know, these people are not my enemy. How do we get to where we need to get to? And so.
Quay - 00:21:22:
Thank you.
Monet - 00:21:25:
So what races or what counties are you particularly looking at? Are you feeling excited about? And where should people be focusing in this electoral moment in the state?
Dreama - 00:21:36:
Yeah, so what I'm most excited, we've got 15 candidates, members that are running for office all across the state. Very excited. Nine of those are black women running for district court judge, running for North Carolina Senate, running for North Carolina House of Representatives. This is the largest number of member candidates that we've had run.
Quay - 00:21:59:
Wow.
Dreama - 00:22:00:
We did a candidate boot camp last year where people who thought they wanted to run for office were able to come for a weekend and train and get ready to go and run their campaigns. And so I'm just excited because we're firewalled off from those candidates because we've endorsed them. But to be able to watch them run their campaigns has been exciting. So I'm excited about Cabarrus to see what those ladies that are running out there do. I'm excited about Alamance County. I'm always excited about Alamance County. I've been able to watch the politics change there from being the first black woman to run for county commissioner. To this cycle, they have two people, a male and a female, running for county commissioner, which is so exciting. And then I'm always excited out east in Granville, Franklin, Wilson, like just some powerhouses out there. They're building some real powerhouses. And, I mean, I believe we're going to break the super majorities. We've broken it in 2018. We were able to break it. We were able to break it again in 2020. And, of course, they convinced someone to change their seat.
Monet - 00:23:18:
I know, it really does.
Quay - 00:23:21:
I was like, whoa, okay. We won.
Dreama - 00:23:23:
Literally, we were in that district. That particular seat was won by 648 votes.
Quay - 00:23:29:
Wow.
Dreama - 00:23:30:
We were running like 50 shifts out of there a day, knocking doors, all the way up until election night until the election polls closed.
Quay - 00:23:39:
Wow.
Dreama - 00:23:39:
Yeah.
Monet - 00:23:42:
I think it's so important for us to be reminded of those numbers because it is such small margins, those razor thin margins that you mentioned. So it does mean that when we have conversations with our neighbors, when we text our friends like, yo, what's your voting plan? Like those little things could really have a huge impact on our like our cities and our counties. And I think. So where do you go? I mean, I know you're super tapped in. So you have. But like where can the average person go to? Like, I want to look at to see how many people voted and the difference between the winning vote and the losing. Like where can we go to get that information?
Dreama - 00:24:15:
Yeah. The Board of Election has really good records where you can go to the state board of elections and look at past results. And it'll show you past elections and where they've won. But that that what you said about local and state races. I mean, we've had races that go down to a coin toss. We had a candidate that won a race out west and tied with the incumbent and it went down to a coin toss.
Monet - 00:24:40:
A literal coin toss?
Quay - 00:24:41:
Like a for real coin toss? A for real coin toss. Like the NFL, like a flip in the coin?
Dreama - 00:24:45:
Yes, she lost from the coin toss. And you pick heads or tails?
Monet - 00:24:48:
That could not be how we're choosing the election.
Dreama - 00:24:49:
That is. I mean, each board of elections get to choose. This is the thing. Board of elections get to choose those type of things.
Monet - 00:24:56:
How do they settle?
Dreama - 00:24:57:
How do they settle ties?
Monet - 00:24:59:
I am gobsmacked.
Dreama - 00:25:00:
Yes. And so she lost her election from a coin toss. And, you know, that's the moment where we think, like, one more vote and she wouldn't have had to have a coin toss. Two more votes, you know. And so this is the story we always tell when people think that it doesn't matter whether they vote or not. We're out on election night telling that story. Like, yeah, you got to get to the polls now. It does.
Monet - 00:25:22:
Because if not, a court is going to choose your elected official.
Dreama - 00:25:25:
I mean, the seat that I, the year that I lost my election, Ricky was only elected by 600 votes. The supermajority that we broke was only by 600 votes. So, I mean, it is a matter of, like, texting a few friends. You know, if six or seven of us text 10 or 15 of our friends, it could make a really big difference in elections.
Monet - 00:25:49:
All right, y'all, you heard that. Text your friends. What's your voting plan? Do you have your vote in place? Are you registered? Is your ID up to date?
Quay - 00:25:57:
Is your ID up to date?
Monet - 00:26:00:
Dreama, thank you so much. So we're going to close with our last few questions. Our last is, what are you dreaming for North Carolina?
Dreama - 00:26:10:
I'm dreaming for North Carolina where the people run the North Carolina General Assembly, where working people are elected all across the state and they are the ones that are governing the state. That's what I'm dreaming about. And that we have a movement aligned. Governor candidate one day that is in line with movement and that will meet with us and talk with us. And that possibly even came out of movement.
Monet - 00:26:37:
I'm with you.
Quay - 00:26:38:
Yeah, I'm with it.
Dreama - 00:26:39:
Oof.
Quay - 00:26:40:
Yeah. Okay. So we have, to close, quick round of questions. Okay. Either ors or you can throw in something if you want. Okay. Doesn't even matter. Okay, first is Pepsi Cola or Cheerwine?
Monet - 00:26:54:
Cheerwine. Okay.
Dreama - 00:26:55:
I know. Cheerwine. Okay.
Quay - 00:26:56:
Yeah. Bojangles or cookout?
Dreama - 00:27:00:
Well, Bojangles.
Quay - 00:27:02:
Here we go. That's all I needed to hear. Nobody said that yet.
Dreama - 00:27:04:
Shout out to Mike.
Quay - 00:27:05:
You feel?
Dreama - 00:27:06:
I know the man that owns the Bojangles.
Monet - 00:27:08:
Shout out, Mike.
Quay - 00:27:09:
Shout out to Mike. Run down to the Bojangles.
Monet - 00:27:12:
Sweet or unsweet.
Quay - 00:27:15:
Half and half.
Monet - 00:27:16:
Yeah, that was my answer. That's my answer. Because it's too sweet sometimes. We got to be honest.
Dreama - 00:27:21:
It's a cup of diabetes.
Quay - 00:27:23:
Yeah. And then UNC or Duke. That's it.
Monet - 00:27:27:
Duke. Really?
Quay - 00:27:29:
Yes.
Monet - 00:27:30:
Duke. Okay, all right. And then the last one that Quay added last time that we're going to keep. Favorite North Carolina artist.
Dreama - 00:27:38:
So I have a song that's written about me.
Monet - 00:27:41:
Of course you do.
Dreama - 00:27:42:
So I've got to shout out Joe Troop from Shea Appalachia, who wrote the song. And he's one of my favorite North Carolina artists. He's a bluegrass artist. Wow.
Monet - 00:27:52:
That's dope. We're going to link the song. Because I want to hear the song. You should hear the song. Facts. I want to hear a song about Dreama.
Quay - 00:27:57:
Facts.
Monet - 00:27:57:
Thank you so much for your time today. You're brilliant. We're going to be thinking about you and thinking about Down Home. And as y'all knock on doors, we're going to send some people. How are we going to support? Yes. Thank you so much. Thank you.
Dreama - 00:28:09:
Thank you.
Monet - 00:28:16:
Thanks for tuning in to Down Ballad Banter. We hope y'all enjoy diving into the tentacular world of local politics with us.
Quay - 00:28:24:
Yeah, and don't forget, this podcast is an extension of Monet's beautiful dream, The Down Ballad Brunch, where there are three simple steps. It's to eat, have a conversation, and to act.
Monet - 00:28:35:
That's right. Have a conversation using this podcast episode, the Down Ballot Brunch chat guide, or your own prompts. Write a note to an elected official on a Down Ballot Brunch postcard. Share quotes from your convo on social media with consent, of course. Or text three friends about their voting plans and find out what matters to them.
Quay - 00:28:55:
And if you're watching on YouTube, be sure to like, share, subscribe. If you're listening on other platforms, be sure to rate and review. Share it with your people.
Monet - 00:29:04:
Until next time, stay informed, stay engaged, and keep up with the down ballot banter.