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Convos with the creative folk shaping the arts and culture in the San Francisco Bay Area. Hosted by Shawna Vesco Ahern.
Theme Song: [00:00:00] This is an art. Yap. It is an art. Yap. We're talking art. Yap. Ity y
artfully. Artfully, artfully, artfully. Yap. Yap. Yap. It's.
Shawna Vesco Ahern: Beware the ordinary. I'm Shawna Vesco Ahern, and this is Art Yap. The podcast where I gab with Bay Area creatives about imagination, arts, culture, and everything in between.
In today's episode, I sit down with Stella Lochman, a joy driven community programming visionary with deep roots in San Francisco, the city where she was born and raised. Carrying forward the [00:01:00] legacy of the city's progressive and thoughtful artists. Stella offers a utopian perspective on our current cultural moment.
Along with simple, tangible ways we can show up for one another through a model of mutual aid. So hang on tight for hot takes. Fernet sips, truffle man art, community radio, and collective liberation fueled by imagination.
Today we are here with Stella Lochman. Uh, born and raised SF'er, and welcome to the show. That's, that's you. That's me. And thank you already for being on the show, which we haven't recorded. I have a gift. A loud gift. A loud gift.
Stella Lochman: That, that's good tape right there. It is A bottle of Fernet. Oh, San Francisco's own.
Yeah. Um, do you know anyone who has a Fernet tattoo? I don't. I do Uhoh. I do. It's really, um, thank you so much. That's when you pull down your pants a little and show me the fret tattoo. Yeah. Do I wait? Oh, there it is. There it is. [00:02:00] Hmm. The other San Francisco treat, the other San Francisco treat. It is early in the morning, just so you know.
It is. And I don't have ginger backs and I'm sorry about that. It's okay. There's a little water here.
Shawna Vesco Ahern: Yeah, do a little sippy sip. So Stella is, I'm calling her a joy based community programming expert. I'm gonna use that on my, on my next, uh. You should. I love hyphens. Yeah. Cv. It's good. Yeah. Well, some people are like, impact driven or, you know, I don't know, but I like, you're like joy based.
It's true. I really like, I normally introduce myself as I'm, I'm someone who believes in radical joy. Mm-hmm. And the power and the need for that right now is like more than ever. The world. Well, there you go. A little hyphen Joy based for your LinkedIn title. Yeah, for my LinkedIn title. Um, she's former sfm, OA and former DJ for B-F-F-F-M.
Yeah. Which I think is more relevant than SFMOMA. No. Um, and [00:03:00] you're born and raised in sf. Uh, very bohemian parents. I mean, that's how I know you. You're also former SOTA Former School of the Arts, Ayo. Um, I'm former Mercy and it's okay. We forgive you. Thank you. RIP Mercy. I know. I feel ancient. 'cause now it's gone.
I know. Um, but growing up in this city, like immersed with all these weirdos, these artists, were you destined to be Strange?
Stella Lochman: That's a really good question. Um. And I think the answer is both yes and no, right? Because like on the one hand, my mom tells this story about how I would come out in weird outfits.
Like one time I came on, I'm out with fully dressed in all the inside slots of the records, you know, so like the vinyl, like with the little circle in my head. And I had it all on and I was like, mom, do I look weird? And she was like, yes, yes you do. And like snapped a photo. The photo exists. Um. And on the other hand, I never felt weird enough actually.
Right. I [00:04:00] had a lot of friends who wanted to be artists, knew they wanted to be artists the minute that they were, you know, 4, 5, 6, 7 years old. And I was always really intimidated by that. Yeah. Um, I knew that I was creative, but I was surrounded by people even more talented and creative than I am, especially going to soda, you know?
Yeah. I went for theater and I thought I wanted to be an actress, and then I went and I met people who were. A lot better than me and didn't close their eyes the whole time. They did the monologue and they were funny. Hey, that's a choice. That's an acting choice. Yeah. That's, tell Mr. Rayer that. Um, and really it took a long time.
I knew I was always gonna be weird. Mm-hmm. I guess, but I didn't know I was gonna be an artist and I still hesitate to call myself an artist even though I have a creative practice mm-hmm. That is far larger than a lot of people's. Um, I think that there's also this intimidation factor of. Putting yourself under that category because?
[00:05:00] Because I know so many great people. Mm-hmm. I also hesitate to call myself an artist in any sense, even though I do think even artists are creatives. Like there's this larger umbrella term that we can use for everyone. And indeed everyone is creative. Everyone has imagination, and everyone does use that in different ways to different degrees.
And so I think it's so interesting to. Try and walk around and like figure out how you fit into that constellation of freaks and creative people. Yeah. Yeah. And to me, I really found freedom as I started to work with artists who had a social practice. Mm-hmm. Right? Like, I can't draw, I have a ceramics practice.
If you want a mug or a spoon, uh, you know, or a weird clock, right? I'm, I'm like, I'm doing something. I'm making stuff with my hands. But when I met people who. Uh, like Bick VanderPol who are from the Netherlands, who I came out to work with, or Suzanne Lacey, and I was at sf, MOMA, working with these people [00:06:00] who work directly, like their practice is actually bringing creatives and thinkers and outsiders together and giving them voice.
That was when I realized, oh, that's, that is what I do. And I, you know, I used to work at SF, MOMA and I very much so did that. I ran my creative practice at SF, MOMA. That's such a lovely thing to feel a way about yourself. Like, I am creative, I do these things, and then to look back a year or two, five years and be like, oh, I've been doing this social practice community building has been part of this kind of just innately.
And that's, I think when you turn to externalize it and formalize it a little bit. Um, but what I do love is the phrase you used a lot. With your time at SF Ooma is that you were the institutional outdoor cat. Yes. And it's like such a cute phrase, but also so pointed. And I didn't know if you wanted to talk a little bit more about that because I know it's like you're institutional in the [00:07:00] sense of your work ethic.
You project manage, you manage the budgets, you get events, people, places, all organized. So in that sense you are very institutional. Um, but what's the outdoor cat part of it? Yeah. Um, so I, I give credit to my old boss, Chad Ver, for, for calling me the outdoor cat and I really. Uh, stuck with that. And there, there's a whole history with that, right?
So I was working at S-F-M-O-M, I started in 2009 and in 2013, for those who've been in the bay long, long enough to remember S-F-M-O-M-A closed mm-hmm. Uh, for the Snohetta remodel. And at that point, I had to learn. What a museum was like if it didn't have walls. Mm-hmm. We were just a brand really, and we were out, and while most of the museum was getting ready for the new building, um, I was in the education department and we were out in the field.
We were doing projects at, uh, Chrissy Field, at Angel Island, um, in the mission for like with liquid. We were, we were [00:08:00] out in the world and I became, I, I found that I was really good at that. Because I'm from San Francisco and I'm talkative. I was a theater major in high school, and I know a lot of people, and I have a lot of, I'm, I'm in a lot of different communities.
And so when the museum was closed, I felt really like I had found a certain stride. And so when the building reopened in 2016. Uh, most people then became very obsessed with being in the building. Obviously you have to bring people in there to run this large building, and I was one of the few people left to focus on.
That interstitial space between the museum and the city. Mm-hmm. And was, uh, had a grant that, uh, Dina Chubby and Tomoko k Mitsu and Dominic Wilsdon and I all put together an NEH grant called Public Knowledge that was really about [00:09:00] the museum still being out in community. And so we would bring these artists in.
Mm-hmm. From Soic, VanderPol was one of them. Um. Barack, I forget Barack's last name, sorry. He's really cool. Uh, came up from LA we, and my job was to make sure that these artists weren't just plopping in mm-hmm. And then leaving and that there was some kind of. Trail that felt authentic. I was gonna say, this is the most rigorous, organic, authentic way of doing community-based programming is not to come out of your tower, come out of your castle, come out of your building and do this.
It's the other way around. Yeah. Um, and with your public programs, you have like the catchy ones that I remember immediately, like soapbox derby, um, and working with other places you did like Sundown Cinema. You have so many, you have like hundreds. But what parts of your [00:10:00] identity have you kind of taken away from this or have been shaped with this that you wanna carry on into the future?
That's a really good question. Um, I. I think so part of that is what we started talking about. It's radical joy and it's, it's having. One of the things I discovered specifically with the soapbox derby that, uh, it didn't just come out then it's, it's, you know, a career long mm-hmm. Thought process, but that I think the soapbox derby was so successful.
Um, for those of you who don't know it, you can google it. San Francisco, uh, SF Mom a Artist Soapbox Derby, uh, back in 2022 in McLaren Park. There's a lot of stuff there. It's very cool. Highly recommended Google. Um, but. What we did there was that we had 50 artists making cars and then [00:11:00] 25 artists making trophies and bands playing.
And announcers and judges and it's too much. It's, no, it's not too much though, because each one of those people, right, nobody built a car alone. Mm-hmm. Right? So that's 50 cars, but that's 500 people, right? Who are, who are part of this process. And the real recipe for me is. I think that in the Bay Area, the art world can feel really truncated, right?
It can feel, you can feel very siloed. You can feel like, how do I join this? Um, but what the Bay Area is most famous for, or I think should be most famous for is our collectivism, right? You go to New York to be an art star and you come to the Bay Area to join a collective. Mm-hmm. And to think together.
And the soapbox Derby really shows how incredible it is. [00:12:00] To bring artists together and the power that, that make, that, that residual effect within the whole community. Because artists are people and they, news slash artists are people, and some of them have day jobs and they have families, and they have schools that they participate in and they're teachers and all of these different things.
And if you give space for artists to show up in, in several different hats. Then. The joy that gets created there is just a lot more authentic. 'cause they're showing up as their full selves. Mm-hmm. Not just as their artists. Right. I think about, um, Maki, who has a great show, uh, that just opened at ICA.
Mm-hmm. Right. And her sculptures are so fun and so incredible, and we asked her to build a car and she said yes. And she partnered with the Truffle man from Dolores Park. Perfect. Perfect. Like who, but who would've drawn that connection, right? Yeah. And [00:13:00] it's, it's, I learned a lot about Masako that I didn't know.
I was like, how do you know the truffle man? Like, he's so cool. He's a San Francisco legend. Mm-hmm. And they built this beautiful winged, sort of scaled beast together that looked like her artwork, but not unlike her artwork. Mm-hmm. And it was, it was a full embodiment, I think of, of her, of her practice that doesn't get to show up.
When it's not in community. Right. If that makes sense. I think it's so scary and sad for me to think about with all the federal funding cuts going on, what's gonna happen to these spaces and these events. That are just no longer gonna take place or on a much smaller scale. And I think part of what I'm doing here on the podcast is trying to show that there is value for individuals and communities and the larger economy when you do one of these giant [00:14:00] events that's contract work for a lot of different vendors.
Yeah. I mean the, the, you know, full transparency, the soapbox derby cost about $350,000. Mm-hmm. All of that went. To local artists, local contractors, local announcers. Right. That money didn't leave the Bay Area. Right. Uh, and you know, I think about, uh, I'm very inspired by the work of Stephanie Ko. Mm-hmm. I got to work with her early in both of our careers, frankly, uh, with Shadow Shop, which is a project she did at SF MOMA, I wanna say like 2010.
Okay. Like we're talking ancient history. Um. Basically that project could like drive a car now. But thinking about it, you know, she created a store that sold artists by products. So not capital a art, but the things that art artists made to get by multiples, um, [00:15:00] cassettes mm-hmm. Plates, all, all those sort of things.
And it was in a gallery at the museum. Mm-hmm. And. The budget was What the budget was. I forget, but the store ended up making something like, I don't wanna get that. Megan, Megan Kiskadden knows the exact number, but it made hun like, I wanna say like a hundred thousand dollars. Yeah. That then. Those checks went directly out back into the art world.
And I did a similar, very inspired by pro project, uh, two, two years ago in 2023 with a, with a collective that I'm in at, uh, the corner of Hayden Ashbury, where redid a similar mm-hmm. Generosity project, I think right where we paid rent to, uh, San Francisco heritage for this incredible, uh, small gallery stores, front space on the corner of Hayden Ashbury.
And we took that out of our sales and we took sales tax out of our sales, but everything else went directly to the artists. Mm-hmm. And artists couldn't believe our generosity. They were getting 90% of their [00:16:00] sales. That doesn't happen. That's amazing. That doesn't happen. They were like, and we didn't pay ourselves because.
Is, it's an art project, right? Yeah. Our projects like cost money, but we sold stuff in the store. Mm-hmm. And so everybody ended up just about breaking even. And, uh, that's a long-winded way to sort of answer your question about what I think about federal funding. Right. On the one hand, it's so scary. Mm-hmm.
And it's awful. It's, it's, there's also a lot of awful things mm-hmm. Happening in the world today. Right. It's just one, one thing. But where I, what I know at least in the Bay Area to be true is that we are resilient and we are creative and we support each other. It's that idea of mutual aid that might really hurt New York City where people are trying to make it right as an individual.
Yeah. But when it comes to the Bay Area. We help each other, and it might get small, and it might mean [00:17:00] that you can't have the show from New York City or Los Angeles, or. Memphis come into the city. Mm-hmm. We have to show our own art 'cause that's what we can afford to do. And that's actually what happened in the 1970s.
Mm-hmm. In San Francisco, like when it was in a similar sort of economic downturn, was that that's when you get the funk movement. Right. Right. That's when you get. Uh, the Bay Area figurative movement. Right. Because people, Wayne Tebow Right. They came out of this time where we had to support our local artists.
And SF om O was a part of that lineage. Mm-hmm. Uh, this is before they owned the, the Good Rothko. Right, right. And people came to the museum to see local art. And so it's, that's my bit of optimism, if you will, is that this is a great opportunity to. Pass that same dollar around, right? Yeah. If you make a hundred dollars on your art, go spend 50 of it on someone else's art.
Yeah, right. You're speaking my language now [00:18:00] and. I mean, not to do a plug for Transwestern, but we are in a biotech campus right now doing an art podcast. And why? Because they recognize this need that different industries go up, different industries go down, and we do need to support each other. So they've given us this nice conference room to record in, and we also have my gallery.
In the lobby, wall box gallery where artists keep a hundred percent of the commission. Um, and I of course do like marketing and that kind of stuff to try and sell their artwork. And people are taking away actually a pretty good chunk of money at the end of their solo exhibitions. But moving forward, I think my goal is to get more of these random spaces opened up to generate places where currency can move around, um, and do it.
I don't know, we just have to get very creative. When you think about your ideal move, your ideal next move, what does that look like for you? Do you [00:19:00] wanna be part of a larger institution? Do you wanna join a nonprofit? Do you wanna start your own thing? I go back and forth because my instinct is that I wanna start my own.
Thing because I've been around the art world and the nonprofit world and the public space world mm-hmm. For a long time. And I just know so many incredible people here. I wanna work with my friends. Yeah. Like the answer to that question is I wanna work with my friends because they are incredible thinkers and creatives and artists and just people, and they're fun, right?
Mm-hmm. Um, and I've had too many. Negative experiences in various workplaces, right? As a millennial, I'm traumatized, I'm tired. We're all traumatized, we're all tired. And it, it's, it could be a great place, but it do, you know, working the grind that we've been working for so long through economic downturns, through presidencies, [00:20:00] through pandemics, right?
It. It's hard for me to not be utopic. Mm-hmm. Right. And to, and to think that I can, I can provide something better. And so, you know, I'm really interested in being a child of San Francisco. I'm very interested in the counterculture and living counterculture and how we keep the, that ethos alive today.
Mm-hmm. But the other side of that coin that I go back and forth on is. We have so many incredible institutions here that need to stay alive. Mm-hmm. So like I'm on the board at, so Marts, it's my favorite place, it's my third place. It's, they do incredible work and I don't want So Marts to go away. Right, right.
Like, does, how can I help support that is, and where are the places that already exist? Counter Pulses, right? Mm-hmm. Doing incredible performance work. Um. You know, I don't, I don't, I mean, they're all cool. Southern exposure. Southern, they're all southern exposure. They're [00:21:00] all, uh, the lab, right? Yeah. Like we, the, the smaller institutions, right?
And I, I leave the big. Sharks, the de young, the SFMOMAs, they have, they have different goals, frankly, they have different boards. Um, they're not, mutual aid is not gonna save sfm, OMA if it's going under or it's a different level of mutual aid that's happening. But where we as ground level artists or, uh, people in the Bay Area who arts interest interested or creatively inclined, or where, if you're part of the Bay Area diaspora mm-hmm.
And still care about this place. Those are the places that are gonna need the most help right now. Yeah. And so part of me wants to start my own thing and part of me wants to support those as much as possible. And so right now I haven't quite figured it out. If somebody listening is like, this is how you do it, I am fully open.
Drop a line. Yeah. Find me on LinkedIn. I'm, uh, what am I, uh, uh, joy based, [00:22:00] yeah. Joy based, uh, creative producer. That's, that's what I'm looking at right now. I guess, I think collective liberation through imagination is a hot topic and there's plenty of people out there willing to do the work. Um, so if we could all just assemble together, your mom was wrong about one thing.
You did not outgrow socialism. No, you did not. I, I really was hoping for that day. Uh, but I also think, you know. I've heard a lot of people when you talk about fundraising mm-hmm. Um, I'm on a couple of different boards who say something like, I don't know rich enough people mm-hmm. To support the cause and like, we all don't need a Pamela Hornick.
No. It doesn't have to work that way. It doesn't have to work that way. And it's about really keeping within your scope and amazing. You were saying, you know, not to, not to like look at you, but you were saying, you know, the, like, the scale isn't possible without federal funding. [00:23:00] Right. The scale of our imaginations is unbound.
Mm-hmm. Right. And I think it's about being more creative, right? It's just, it's hard. Work is hard and it's not easy. It's not gonna be an easy way to do it. But if, if we want, we, the creative community of the Bay Area, wanna see something happen. You know, like there's no, it'll happen also if Pamela Hornick is listening, she does love tiny dogs and I think her and Zappa yeah, would just get along phenomenally well.
We are doing a pet portrait, uh, day at, so Marts at forever and always on June 7th. So if you have a little extra cash and wanna get. An incredible portrait of your petmate that is worth more than the ticket to get in. Uh, come on down and have a drink. And I know it's old hat, but I do wanna talk about your [00:24:00] show.
Radio Shoe. Oh, I love radio show. Which you did for how many years? I did it for eight years. Yeah. Every Friday. Uh, if you go back, I don't listen to the archives because I'm, I do, I I listen to the playlist. Okay. Yeah. Constantly. But to go back because it's like I have. So many friends who I don't talk to anymore who like it was the corner of my life for eight years because I was working this.
I was working at SF MOMA and kind of trying to live this dichotomy where my. Creative practice and my work, were one in the same. Mm-hmm. Which I don't know if I recommend to people moving forward. Mm-hmm. Uh, but the radio shoe was the one thing that was always mine. It kind of saved me on Friday nights.
'cause I could say no to things. I'd be like, ah, I'm not going to your art show. I have my radio show. It kept, it kept a. Boundary up for me that it was something I had to do every week and I had a different theme every week for eight years. I mean, I think of it [00:25:00] as a very curatorial project. Yeah, it was a very curatorial project and it was so much fun and it was so chill.
And I love live radio. I still listened to the radio every chance I get. I love BFF fm. I drop in on my friend's morning show, uh, whenever, uh, whenever. They will let me. I, I love it. I just, in the end, I, I think that I ran, no, it's not that I ran out of themes. Mm-hmm. But I felt like I had explored what I needed to explore.
I also became a stepmom. Mm-hmm. And Friday nights with your eight, nine, 10-year-old are actually pretty valuable times. Yeah. To get their whole attention and. Uh, you know, the first two or two years I think that I was a stepmom also would come to the studio and hang out. Uh, but now, now I think I, I really traded it where ceramics is my practice now, so.
Mm-hmm. It's a much more private, [00:26:00] uh, maybe practice. But this is so interesting though, how your practices kind of are coming in waves or eras throughout your life. Yeah. And the ceramics one is fun, and then who knows what'll be next. Exactly. Right. It's like, I think that that's. That's the fun of not identifying as an artist at an early age, right?
Mm-hmm. Like I, I am, I'm, you're not pigeonholed at at all. I'm not pigeonholed at all. I am honestly, the thing that the radio show and my ceramics practice have in common is that they're both communities that I'm part of. I was really a part of the BFF community when I was doing that, and. Mondays and Wednesdays, it's uh, it's a group.
It's a class, but it's not a class like we get together. It's run by an incredible artist, Matt Goldberg, who really, he would maybe blush if I called him a social practice artist 'cause he is a ceramicist and, and a visual, visual artist. But he has created this safe space at so mart for people who a lot of SFAI, former SFAI alum, but [00:27:00] also.
Folks who work at Adobe mm-hmm. And our massage therapists to come in and be creative together. And we, we co, we don't make like one sculpture altogether. Mm-hmm. But we definitely hold up glazes and we're like, this color, you know, it feels. We all teach each other. What's so interesting too, is in another conversation that's going to be an episode of this podcast, another artist said the same thing.
They started a fine art dinner where they're hoping the guests are gonna be from different sectors and they're hoping it's gonna have people who maybe don't even consider themselves creative at all, come into this creative atmosphere and exchange ideas. Yeah, so it seems like. We're all trying to do that too, which is like invite everyone in.
We're so hungry for community. Yeah. I think that that is the secondary pandemic that we don't talk about that even an extrovert like myself forgot how to connect [00:28:00] over COVID, frankly, and became very comfortable in my own house doing my own thing. And that was one of the other reasons I got out of radio was because it be, it became.
Mm. I didn't have guests like you have guests. I mean, I did, but it was more like, do you wanna come hang out at the studio and have a beer? Right, right. Like it wasn't very planned. And um, you know, I don't drink as much. Mm-hmm. I hear the you except for that Fernet at the top of the episode. Except for, you know, I still got it in me party, girl at heart.
Uh, never say No to a little Nette. Um, but, you know, I, someone was telling me that their, that their friend works in whiskey and they're worried that the kids aren't drinking like they used to. Right. Like, I think that's a very real. Thing that is part of the pandemic that is probably healthy, but also people have a lot of anxiety.
I have a lot of anxiety about just leaving my house, and so I think that that is my call as an artist, my calling as an artist. Mm-hmm. Because frankly, I'm not even sure I like art, but I know I love community. Right. Oh man. [00:29:00] Well, the time has come. To ask the Magic eight Ball a question. Oh,
I have so many questions for the Magic eight ball. She's never wrong. She's never wrong. Mm-hmm. I think that, oh, because we're in San Francisco and I do work, um, in the public. Public space as well as in the arts, and we know what's happening on the federal level. It's not good. Uh, we know what's happening on the state level.
It's also not good if you are able to do some research about, um, some of newsom's new policies around the arts, um, I recommend it. I would, I don't have time to get into that here. Um, but I wanna know if, uh, mayor Lurie is going to support the arts. In an impactful way, the artists here, not just a Grateful Dead show.
I'm very looking forward to the Grateful Dead Show, and I heard Billy Strings is opening and I'm so there, but like [00:30:00] is, is the mayoral office, is this regime going to support? Come on ball. Come on. Wait. You read it? Oh, I'm scared. Coming through the blue liquid. My reply is no. Oh, well then more reason to support.
Each other. Yeah, absolutely. I think that's the biggest takeaway from this talk. And like, you know what, just like, don't go out to dinner on a Friday night. Invite a friend over. Mm-hmm. And do like an art project. Cowork, craft craft. Do something, do something, you know, like crochet something together. Make a quilt.
Mm-hmm. Collage, Dood. Collage. Uh, I think that, you know, that is. Maybe gonna be our reality for a while. Mm-hmm. And I'm, I'm okay with that. Also, I was looking into last night, but I don't remember the name now, but I will put it in the show notes. Um, a stained glass studio where you can like rent [00:31:00] space and learn how to make little tiny stain stained glass.
Um, my friend Tamara is doing that. Okay. And they're making incredible, uh, earrings. Oh goodness. Um, shout out. It's Tamara's birthday tomorrow, so, you know. Got that, got that vibe. Uh. But yeah, they've been taking up glass making and she's, uh, she's an incredible photographer, so, okay. Um, you know, expand your practice.
Yeah. Now is the time. Get weird, get funky. There's also a few like metalsmiths and you could do ring making classes together. Yeah. There's, we can pour money. Back into the arts. Yeah. We can do it. And like, here's the thing, if you take a ring making class with my friend Danielle, who used to teach at Mercy Mm.
Full circle here, there we go. Like Danielle is going to go to Happy House mm-hmm. And support somebody there and the Happy House girls, if you haven't been to Happy House in North Beach, it's so fun. Such an incredible little creative space. That's also a retail store, right? Like they're getting, they're they're, they're getting creative, they're getting funky, right?
Yeah. We're, we're in these interstitial spaces. Um. You know, we just gotta pass that same a hundred dollars bill [00:32:00] around. Well thank you so much for coming on the pod and I hope that people feel very uplifted after this conversation and very imaginative. And they go out there and they support the local Bay Area arts community and artists.
Help me. I'm poor and goodnight. Goodnight. Thanks for having me. Thanks for listening to Art Yap. If you enjoyed this episode, the best way to support the show is to leave a rating or review. Share art Yap with a dreamer, a maker, a friend. Because good ideas are better when they don't end. For video trailers and sneak peeks, follow us on Instagram at Art yap underscore podcast.
Until next time, keep imagining. Keep creating and keep yapping.