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Have you ever felt shame? I know I have. In today's podcast, my guests are Velvette Williams, Megan Sinisi, Amber Dozier, myself, and Me, Sherina Donovan. We are so excited to share with you all that God is showing us in the season that we were not designed for shame; we were designed to live in perfection, and because of that, we struggle to deal with the shame of our lives, the shame of our past or present, and the thought of the future join us today as we encourage you as God has encouraged our heart not to live in the shame, but I understand that in his presence, there is no shame. Today, we will be reading Genesis chapters 2 and 3.
Megan's YouTube channel https://www.youtube.com/@MegansSearchForMeaning
0:00 -introduction
2:10 -Story of Shame
5:56 -Megan
8:59- Sherina
11:41 -Velvette
19:54 -Megan
25:38 -Ending
Megan's YouTube channel https://www.youtube.com/@MegansSearchForMeaning
0:00 -introduction
2:10 -Story of Shame
5:56 -Megan
8:59- Sherina
11:41 -Velvette
19:54 -Megan
25:38 -Ending
Creators & Guests
Host
Guest
Guest
What is Healing from Shame?
Come with me as I gather women from different walks and seasons: who love God together to talk about the shame they have experienced, even if we have caused it ourselves or something outside of God's design brought us shame. Shame can be complicated, but together, let us tell you the secrets God has shown to our hearts to overcome the shame from the past to the present and even the future. We will no longer walk in shame, but we will walk with God, knowing his heart for us and that the Father loves us no matter what we're dealing with.
Welcome to today's podcast. This is Women in Pursuit. I'm your host, Sherina Donavan. In a world that pulls our attention towards it, let us be women who chase after the things of God and the things He has for us. Let's find time to sit together and with the Father.
Speaker 1:May this podcast build your community, enhance your life, and build your understanding that you have a Father who loves you and he passionately pursues you and your heart. Let's get started for today. Hello. Welcome to our podcast. My name is Sherina.
Speaker 1:I'm so glad that you're here. Today, we're gonna be talking about Shame. A little about me, I am a stay at home homeschooling mom of 5 beautiful children. 1st guest I have today is my friend Megan. She has her own YouTube channel.
Speaker 1:Her channel's name is Megan's search for meaning. You should check her out on YouTube. YouTube.
Speaker 2:Hi. I'm Megan, a friend of Sherina's. I am a wife, a homeschool mom, and a therapist, and this is my favorite topic. So
Speaker 1:Also, my next guest is Amber. She is my sister-in-law, and I'm so excited to have her here.
Speaker 3:Sister. I'm a mother of 3 beautiful children that I love so much, a wife and a Jesus lover and follower. I'm happy to be here.
Speaker 1:I'm so glad that Amber's here today, thank you for coming Amber. And lastly but not least, is my bestie, This is Velvette
Speaker 4:Williams. Hey, guys. My name is Velvette. I'm Sherina's best friend, here with my other friends as well. I am a wife.
Speaker 4:I've been married for 13 years. I am a mom of 3 amazing kids. And also a special education teacher.
Speaker 1:All of my guests today are married. We all have children, and we're all pretty much in that season of life together. I'm so glad that you guys are each here to talk about shame today. So let us dive right in and take a look at God's original design for mankind. In the beginning, God created us in His image, and in that image, He created them.
Speaker 1:And sometimes when we look at those words, we just look at them. It's like, oh, cool. I'm in the image of god, but the image is actually like a reflection when you're looking in that mirror. When you're looking in the mirror and you see yourself, god is saying that when he looks upon you, he sees his son. You are made in the image of god.
Speaker 1:And in the very beginning, when god created us, he created us to be able to live in that perfection, that life, that garden that he created for us, and he made us to be able to live without shame. Genesis 2:25 says, Adam and his wife were both naked and they felt no shame. We were designed to be naked and feel no shame. Thinking about the naked of our bodies necessarily, but naked in the fact that we were completely open to God. There was nothing hidden from him.
Speaker 1:He saw it all. He knew it all. There was nothing that we felt like we had to hide. The thing about shame in Genesis 2, when you look it up in the Strong's Concordance, you'll find out that the definition is to put to shame, to be ashamed, to be disappointed, to feel shame, to act shamefully, or to be disappointed by reason of. And that just got me really thinking about shame and how I perceive the word shame.
Speaker 1:Sometimes I think of the word shame and I think of more of an embarrassment, But when they're defining it here, it's more of, I've disappointed someone. I've disappointed myself. I've disappointed others. There's some kind of disappointment. And, see, when we were designed, we were designed to live authentically and not feel ashamed of the life that we get to live.
Speaker 1:But because of the fall, because of what happened next, because of the eating of the apple, they felt shame. So we're gonna move to to the fall of man in Genesis 3. We hear about Eve and Adam, and those are it's really key to understand what happened in the beginning, and I think those are very important. But for today's topic, I really wanna focus on the shame. So we're gonna move to verse 7.
Speaker 1:So Eve and Adam both eat of this apple that they were told not to eat of. And it says in verse 7, then the eyes of both of them were opened and they realized they were naked. So they sewed fig leaves together and made coverings for themselves. When we feel shame, we hide and we cover. And then the next part in the verse 8, then the man and his wife heard the sound of the lord god as he was walking in the garden in the cool of the day, and they hid from the Lord God among the trees of the garden.
Speaker 1:We tend to want to hide what is shameful. When we disappoint others, we wanna hide it. When we disappoint ourselves, we wanna hide it. We try to make excuses for our behaviors and and we try to cover up shame with so many different things. But there have been things that have happened to you, and there have been things that have happened that you might feel that shame.
Speaker 1:And so today, we're really gonna focus on the shame that maybe we have from our childhood, things that have happened to us in
Speaker 2:the past. I just did a YouTube video on this.
Speaker 1:I saw, but I didn't wanna watch it just in case, because I was, like, let me just get this, and then I plan on watching it.
Speaker 2:Yeah. So literally talking about Eve and shame. So shame is, like, this at least in this, like, realm of psychology, shame is this belief that there's something wrong with ourselves. And I I think you see that transition between before when even Adam sinned and to after. Right?
Speaker 2:Because the only place that shame is not mentioned in the Bible, like, they had no shame, was in Genesis 2. Right? And so then there's the temptation. They fail, and they do the the one thing that they weren't supposed to do, and here they are having shame. And so in I try to use that sanctified imagination because, for me, it just helps me identify more with those biblical characters.
Speaker 2:But so I just like, they had this epiphany, you know, of eating this fruit, and then they realized, right, that they're naked. And so they had always been naked. They had they had like, it's not like they were, like, oh, my clothes fell off. Like, they had always been naked. This is the state they had always been in.
Speaker 2:But now they have this belief about that there's something wrong with them, that they that they internally like, they're broken, and they can't be fixed. Right? And so you see that they go, and they try to make their own coverings. They go and they hide and and all of these things, and they can't fix it. The only one who can fix it is God, and you see that happen in Genesis 3.
Speaker 2:And then, obviously, the Bible is this progression of God reconciling us back to him. And so shame is this belief that there's something inherently wrong with us no matter what it is. And I'm we can go around the table and talk about, like, I, you know, have shame about how I look or my weight or the way that I mother or me being, you know, the type of therapist that I am, and, like, we could all have those things. We all have probably several things that we very much like, I have a lot of shame. I feel like I'm broken in that area.
Speaker 2:And I think that that is what fall has done. And for me, personally, like, the world is so broken and evil after the fall, and it just continues to spiral downward. But I feel like the idea of shame of us believing that we are inherently broken instead of believing that we are created in the image of God, that that is the worst part of the fall because that belief is what leads to this evil. Right? Like, if I believe that I'm broken and I feel that you're not broken in that area, like, that's gonna lead me to be, like, jealous and bitter and anger and, like, all of these things which affects our relationship.
Speaker 2:And, you know, that leads me to be sad and, like, it can make me to make choices that, like, hurt other people, and it just is a continual downward spiral that you see in all of human history, and it's really, really sad.
Speaker 1:It really is. And so I think for me, it brought me to a place to realize that there are things in my life that I understand that have happened to me, but necessarily wasn't always God's design. And because it's outside of God's design, it's caused shame, and it's caused hurt. And I've tried to cover that hurt by, eating. I've tried to cover that hurt by being the best friend that I possibly can or being an overachiever or anything to try to cover my shame and the lack that I have.
Speaker 1:And so I wanted to share my story with you guys today about my dad. I've had 3 dads, and I realized recently that not one of them have I ever called dad, because I never had that relationship. And and so I was sharing that story with somebody, and they said, well, kinda have I grieved through that or
Speaker 4:anything like that?
Speaker 1:And I was like, well, I don't know. I understand that it happened, and and wise, Dawn said, well, just because you understand it doesn't mean you've healed from it. And I thought about that, and I was like, that's right. It is true. Just because I understand that I didn't have a dad there, he was he was absent, and it was a good thing.
Speaker 1:It was a it was a good thing that this man was not in my life. It doesn't mean that there weren't scars, and there's this pain there. And my shame comes from that absence of him, and not realizing that there's been years of overcompensating because of that one person not being in my life. And so that's why I felt like I wanted to talk about healing today, as I'm in that place of healing with the Lord, and realizing that it's okay that I'm hurt in that area because it wasn't God's design, and it's okay to look back and say to it, that's not right. And then to move forward in the fact that, but I have a heavenly father who always makes it right, and I just need to keep running to him and not all my I call him my vices, my my eating or any other addictions that I have, especially eating, I've especially as I'm going through this new healing with about my dad, I realized I've been eating a lot more.
Speaker 1:Right? Because it's my self soothing way of handling the thing that I don't want to handle. And so I've got to learn how to give it to God, but there's so much grace by God just going, it's okay, because I understand that you're eating that taco because you're dealing with this, and you don't wanna deal with that, so you eat a taco, and there's not like, oh, there's shame, but it feels shameful, because I know what I'm doing. But I know there's so much grace and mercy, and so I'm trying my best to constantly take that to the Lord. And even though I am going to my vices sometimes, but the times I'm not giving myself that grace and mercy that I didn't.
Speaker 4:Yeah. So last year, I I fell and dislocated and broke my ankle and had to have surgery. And so that process of healing, I was in the early stages of the healing. I was challenged by you to, to, like, ask the questions, like, in in the physical, is anything going on in the spiritual? Through that healing process, you know, you you know, you have surgery, you know, you need medication, the wound, you know, the wound is open or it's covered.
Speaker 4:You know, you have the process of having it splint, having it, casted. Or in my case, I had a boot for quite a while. And then you go to physical therapy, you know, and then you're learning how to walk again, you know, without the boot. And then I still have barely ran. Maybe ran for, like, 2 like, 1 or 2 minutes at at, like, like, at a 4 point pace on the treadmill.
Speaker 4:That was really showing me that, I guess, I I did heal from that injury. Like, it might like, you can you can't see the wound. I have I mean, I have a scar, but can walk. You know, I have a little bit of a limp. And I kinda think of that as in my in my healing journey.
Speaker 4:I don't wanna say, like, I'm healed from, you know, the past and the hurts, you know, that really began in childhood, which I think we can equally all say here at this table, which is, quite interesting that we've all had a lot of childhood trauma. And so, and not dads in our lives, you know, like, I think we've all we all here have experienced absent fathers. And so throughout this past year, it's really opened my my mind and my heart to, like, the healing process can be a lot like wounds, like, actual physical injuries. And there's different stages of injuries, you know. There's level 1 injury, a level 2 injury, a level 3.
Speaker 4:Right? Anything from a paper cut to, you know, like a slice or to a really hard injury where you need, you know, it's, like, all jagged, you know, when it needs a little bit of bandaging. And there's, like, things that might need surgery or it might be, you know, from the inside out. And so there's a lot that I've been dealing with. It caused me to kind of be alone.
Speaker 4:Like, I had a surgery the year before. Then I had the stuff going on with my foot and, it's it's forced me to come to realization or grips with my childhood trauma. You know, stuff that I went through as a kid and, how it's affected me. Like like the things that you were saying, you know, eating, my image, just relationships that I didn't have with my dad. Oh, you know, and like a lot even seeing where my mom's shame was, you know, and how that affected me, especially even after being a believer.
Speaker 4:You know, I became a Christian in my in my early teens. But in my early twenties, I was wild and out. Because I think those wounds, I started to I started to I feel like I'm all over the place. But I feel like I started to, to realize things as you get older. Some things that happened.
Speaker 4:So anyways, this past year I've just been thinking, like, what what kind of wound is this childhood trauma? Like, it's a really deep it's a really internal, really deep, you know, wound that needs surgery. And, I don't that sometimes people will say, oh, you you have a wound, and it's healed. It won't, you know, some, emotionally people say it might not hurt to talk about it as much or, like, the pain will go away. But, many times my ankle will hurt out of nowhere.
Speaker 4:The weather might affect my my foot. It might itch a little bit weird, and, I might still limp. And so I think about my past, you know, like, some hurts that happened, like, with with me not having my dad. A lot of chaos happened where my mom isolated us from our biological father because of her shame and stuff she was going through. So I can talk about it.
Speaker 4:I can I feel like I'm healed from a lot of my broken relationships with, with my mom and not having my dad? Like, I can talk about it, but I feel like, I am still healing. Like, the word he I'm not healed, altogether because some things remind me. Like I can, like, they'll be now that as an adult, you know, watching my husband with with our kids and being a dad or, you know, those kind of things, I can see, like, some things are reminders. So I think about the wound, the the healing process of wounds in the body.
Speaker 4:There's just different stages, and sometimes they get itchy. You know, sometimes a reminder of something might, you know, really get at me. But, ultimately, I know that that Christ sees me. I know that he knows my broken areas and he is the ultimate healer. And I, it still draws me when I when I have those itchinesses or when I have those limps or when I have that aching pain, of reminders of some things in my past.
Speaker 4:It forces me to go to him, you know. And during my healing journey, you know, people are physically with my ankle, you know, families, people are busy and stuff. And so it really those alone times I was sleeping on the couch for a month, you know. At those times at night by myself, it really forced me, it really pushed me to lean into to the Lord more and to come to him with all these different other broken areas. But to, kind of, look at things, look at life, that our wounds can be in different in different stages.
Speaker 4:It could be a stage 1 wound, a 2 wound, you know, like somebody might offend me. Okay. That's a I might need to heal from that. It might be a stage 1 wound or it might be a paper cut. But there's other things that need to be processed and the pain still might be there at times.
Speaker 4:It might not be there every day, but, that's continuing, of us drawing near to to God over and over again. You know, through the different wounds. But just trying to reevaluate, try to see my life or my hurts in those ways, you know, like, even like about my mom, you know, I look back like, okay, I can see why she might have done x, y, and z. You know, she wasn't doing it to purposely hurt me. She wasn't pulling me away from my dad to say, Velvet, when you grow up, you're gonna have all these pains and aches, and you're gonna miss your dad.
Speaker 4:Like, she wasn't doing it to, like, be hurtful. She was going through her own shame, her own hurts. And, like, just thinking about the story of Hagar. Hagar, when she saw when she saw the Lord, like the Christophany. Right?
Speaker 4:Like she she could see him and he saw her. That's why she said Elroy. Right? Like the God who sees. And so God reminds me to kind of like look back into my childhood and my wounds and to see see my family or see my the people who might have hurt me in the long run.
Speaker 4:To see them like how he sees them or to see them like sometimes they really didn't mean to. It doesn't mean that's right or anything. But that even the things I've done, I've done things that are not meant to hurt people or not meant to like I wasn't doing it intentionally. So he's just been showing me a lot that he sees me. He sees me when I'm by myself.
Speaker 4:He sees me when I'm trying to go through all this processing of my past and my hurts. And that I'm a lot of my stuff that I'm those deep wounds have kind of triggered from my childhood. But I'm just now starting to realize it. Because growing up being so busy with life and school and being a kid and a teenager. Like, I'm just starting to deal with that.
Speaker 4:I think a lot of adults now, the topic is more open to talk about childhood trauma. But then just being gentle with myself and allowing to feel that pain. Yeah. You know? Because that's how you have to have pain with the wound.
Speaker 4:You have to work through the pains of walking again, you know, like my broken ankle, you know. But, it's okay to have that pain. It sucks. But that it's I'm can I'm still healing in my ankle. I'm still healing from past traumas.
Speaker 1:What a great analogy that God gave you with your ankle and just being even, even able to see that wound still. And so, you know, it's there, you, you, you're reminded of it, but that continuously healing that God is doing. Megan said, one time about the things that that happened in your life, and you were talking about how you know that it's not gonna be healed on this side, but it will be healed on another side. Were you sure a little bit about that?
Speaker 2:I'm trying to remember when I when I told you that. But, yeah, I'm I think that I have a lot of different thoughts going through my head, but I think that especially in, like, American Christian society, we have this belief that, like, as Christians, if we are not, like, joyful every single day and, like, like, obnoxiously joyful. Like, you know, where you're dancing and singing for the Lord, and you're, like, in your kitchen having a dance. Like, if you're not feeling that every day, like, there's something wrong. And I think that even in American society, we see that.
Speaker 2:Right? Like, if if we're just going through the mundane grind of life, like, I'm getting my kids up for and getting them ready for the day, and I had to tell them 15 times to brush their teeth. And, like, then we go into our things, and they're not listening to me and all of these things. Right? Like, we can be like, well, life sucks, so I must be depressed or I must be anxious because I'm not having this constant, like, feeling of endorphin rush.
Speaker 2:And I think, like, that is not how life this side of the fall works. Maybe that's how it was for Adam and Eve before the fall, and it was just this constant dopamine, like, hit all the time. But that's not how it is on this side. And if if we're going through a process of healing, I think that there it's actually 2 pieces. Right?
Speaker 2:Like, it's healing, like like Velvet was saying, like, you know, having the surgery, doing the physical therapy, walking on the ankle, like, strengthening it, and then, like, getting to a place where you don't need the boot. You can live a a pretty normal life. I'm using quotes like pretty normal. Right? Like but there's also a grieving that has to happen.
Speaker 2:Right? Like, your love of dance. Like, there's probably a huge grieving there of, like, I can't dance the way that I used to or that I want to because of my ankle. Right? And, like, so there's a lot of emotion that comes up with that grief.
Speaker 2:Like, well, now I'm mad, and now I'm sad. Now I'm like, all of these things. And a lot of times, we think, well, then I must not be healed. Like, if we get triggered with that emotion, like, I must not be healed because all of this stuff's coming up. Maybe maybe there's still a healing that needs to happen, but I think there's also, like, a grieving.
Speaker 2:Like, you can be healed. Like, you've accepted it. It's a part of your life and and this is what happened. We don't have time travel. We can't go back.
Speaker 2:I can't go back and change, like, the situation with my parents or my dad or the things that happened to my I can't go back and change that. Right? So I've acceptance about it, but there is definitely a grieving that I'm still doing of, like, man, I I wish I wish that I had that relationship with my dad. I wish I had that relationship with my mom. I wish that things were different.
Speaker 2:And, you know, grieving and allowing myself to be sad or even angry about that and processing those feelings gets you to a place of, okay. Now I have a little bit more peace. Because when we talk about salvation, like, when you look up the word salvation in the New Testament in the Greek, it and, like, salvation and it really implies, like, this, like, restoration that, like, God wants to us to be whole. Like, that's what that's what coming to Jesus and being a follower of Jesus is. It's, like, not just cool.
Speaker 2:I get eternal life, and I get to be, like, in the quote, unquote good place, like, when I die. Right? Like, okay. That is really great, but, like, it's so much more. Like, the Bible from Genesis 3 and on is about restoration and reconciliation back to God.
Speaker 2:And so our salvation, that's what it's implying is that our relationship with the Lord and Jesus will restore us to what God's original design is. And for me personally, back to your original question, like, there are definitely some things that I'm going to continue grieving until I get to the other side of eternity. Like, that grief will always be there. And I have the personal belief that grief is the hardest thing humans will walk through because we were not designed to walk through grief. Because we were not designed to have loss.
Speaker 2:Right? Like, we weren't designed to lose anything. We weren't designed to experience death. And so when we grieve and we're walking through that, right, like, there have for me as a therapist and also just the way that I think, like, I have to come into a place of acceptance. Like, I'm going to grieve this until I am in the arms of Jesus.
Speaker 2:And then that's when my restoration and my reconciliation will be healed, like, completely. Right? Like, there are no tears in heaven. There's no grief. There's no sadness.
Speaker 2:Like, that's where it will all finally be healed. And so it's not that the Lord doesn't want us to be healed. It's not that he's not walking us through that healing and restoration. It's just the reality of, like, we live in a really broken world, and it's just the reality of it's not gonna be fixed until we're in his arms. And that's my personal opinion.
Speaker 2:I'm not saying that's, like, theological doctrine. So please don't, like, comment on the podcast that I'm, like, totally wrong. It's totally Megan's personal opinion.
Speaker 1:So whatever shame you're dealing with today, we pray that you would know you weren't designed to deal with shame. So, bring your shame to God. Don't hide from Him. Bring it to Him. He wants to meet with you in the coolness of the day in the garden.
Speaker 1:He wants to soothe your soul. This is just Part 1. We hope that you enjoyed it and until next time when you get to hear from Amber Dozier and the rest of us, we can't wait to share what God is doing to restore the shame in our lives. And that's all we have for today. And until next time, may God keep you safe until we meet again.
Speaker 1:Bye.