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Hosted by Masi Willis and Shannon Scott, Lead Like You Mean It is a leadership podcast for those who want more than inspiration—they want impact. We’ll help you lead from the inside out, with tools that stick and some truth that stretches you.
Everything Made Beautiful (00:02)
Masi Willis. Shannon, Suzanne, Scott. We are here, girl. Here we are. Yeah. Doing the thing that I don't want to over speak here. No, go for it. But that you categorically said on many occasions, I will never do a podcast. Yes. And now here we are. Here we are. How are you feeling about it? Well.
I mean, I'm having to hear my own voice, which is always hard. feel like there's no voice. hate like my own 9 million podcasts out there. So why in the world should I put one out there? So that's the elephant in the room. Who needs another leadership podcast? We don't. Yeah. Yeah. So why this one? Well, because we don't need another leadership podcast and everyone thinks they're that leader that needs to speak. So I kind of want to just break the ice and talk about the hard things.
What would you say, like I wanna get into like who we are and the fun stuff about us, but just to kind of lay the groundwork, what is kind of the gap you see as you coach people and you and I are both certified leadership coaches, like this is what we are passionate about. What is the gap that nobody's really filling or at least not a lot of people are filling in the leadership space? I think it boils down to transformation.
And that might be a simple word, but it really is the change. Like, I believe that people have aha moments. I truly believe that people see things about themselves, but I don't know that we're being equipped to know how to actually transform. Ooh, that's good. Like, I may know things about myself. I just don't know what to do about them. Exactly. I know I have road rage. know that I've had this...
kind of thought process, I'm not enough. I know that's actually generational. It's been passed down in the women. knowing it's one thing, but I don't believe that I've ever been equipped by a leader to know how to change something that might not be great or enhance something that I really should be leaning into. That's good. What do you hope that a leader or even a subordinate who's reporting to a leader, maybe even a difficult leader, what do you hope people
listen to and hear on this podcast and then breathe a sigh of relief over? Wow, that's a good question. Probably hope. We're never out of the world of self-awareness. It will be in existence until we're gone. And so to think I've lost time or I don't have time or I'm too old or too young or that leader's never going to change. it reminds me of like listening to sermons and
hearing pastors preach, like, woo, I sure wish she could hear that. He should hear that. Really, what does it look like to turn it on ourselves and have the hope that I can be a better version of myself? I'm not a bad version. People aren't broken. We can just unlock better things about ourselves. Yeah, that's so good. ⁓ Well, before we jump into just like all leadership all the time,
I think if anybody is listening who has no idea who we are or who one of us is, but not the other, let's just lay some groundwork. Okay, let's do it. We have been friends for going on almost 30 years, over 25. I've been married for 26 years and we've been friends all that time. ⁓ We met when we were both much younger. Yes. And have been friends thick, thin, ride or die.
every season of life. Easy, hard. Easy, hard, all kinds of things. But we also uniquely have watched each other transform as leaders and as people. And that has made us both really passionate about this for other people. Exactly. We want other people to experience what we've experienced. We also want other people to know and understand themselves like we do now. And there's always more to learn and there will be more to learn until we die. But
If I knew then so much of what I know now, the pain I could have avoided, and I think you would say the same thing, I can't even quantify what the experience might have been like. But we're both Jesus-loving women. We love Jesus, He's everything to us. ⁓ We are both tough in our own way. We are both leaders and have spent long decades in leadership in almost every role we've ever had.
We both speak truth, but we speak it differently. And we're Southern at our core. Absolutely. We are fully Southern Georgia girls. me a bull peanut, front porch and some lemonade and we're good. Yeah, SEC football. Now we are frenemies in that way, because I'm a gator and you're a dog. But sadly, I am a...
Good luck charm for the Georgia Bulldogs. If I attend a Florida Georgia game, the Bulldogs will win. We have never won time. Florida has never won a game I've attended. Yes, and we attend the Georgia Florida game because I say Georgia first. And my family is so excited when I bring Shannon because you cause the dogs to win every time. I am decked out in orange and blue sitting in the middle of all this red and black.
And I get there and people jeer me and poke fun at me. But as soon as they realize what a good luck charm I am, I am the most famous person in the whole Georgia section. we say, y'all, we believe that's proper grammar and we're not sorry about that. We're big Chick-fil-A devotees. We believe that that is the Christian chicken. It is the best chicken. is a food group. Yes. And boiled peanuts. You mentioned it. We just we don't go on a road trip without a big old thing of boiled peanuts. Never.
feel great about it. ⁓ You are an extrovert. I would say a joyful extrovert. ⁓ You have more stories than a front porch swing. You have an analogy for everything. And you are pretty much always wearing fabulous shoes. ⁓ yes. You love a good shoe. I love a good shoe. It's like a door on a house that makes or breaks you. See what I mean? Analogy. There's something about power in shoes too. Yeah. Like it sets the tone for what
Like when I have on heels, I feel like I've got this powerful, very professional, but then sometimes I just want to have on a good pair of tennis shoes and I can get my walk on. I will be honest. I like shoes because they don't fluctuate with my weight. I don't have to throw out all my shoes if I gain or lose weight. So I'm kind of partial to shoes. I, on the other hand, am a deep
feeling introvert. Absolutely. I need a long time to recharge. ⁓ I can be alone for days and be perfectly content, but I will go full mama bear when necessary over my children and my friends for sure. ⁓ We have lived through enough real leadership scenarios and frankly, messes to know what works, what doesn't, and frankly, what makes us want to throw yet another leadership book across a room.
⁓ We've led in church spaces, corporate spaces, nonprofit spaces, creative spaces. We have been the boss. We've also been the burnt out. ⁓ And we have also been bridge builders in difficult environments or difficult seasons for other people. We love to laugh really loud and we love to call things what they are.
hard things to hard-headed people. Yes. We think pretending is exhausting. We're now old enough. Both of us, I'm nearing my 50s, you're in your 50s, and we can't pretend anymore. No. When people talk to me and I don't understand a word, I just say use another one. Yeah.
I don't need to prove anything anymore in my life from that perspective. I don't have to pretend. So yeah, we're just real talk. I like to use big words and you say use a smaller word. I don't know what that means. And I actually like it. And I'm also like, why did I need to use that big word? I don't need to use that. Should we call names of other people that do that? No, we're not calling any names. That's one of our rules. ⁓ We will challenge you. We will cheer for you. And I think
it's worth saying we'll probably at some point on this podcast say something that makes people say, did they just say that out loud? Yes. And I think that's good. I'll be good with that. We also think that Diet Coke is nectar. Yes. Like we love a good Diet Coke. So on a more serious note, how do you answer when someone says, Masi, tell me what you do, because you have done so much. How do you tend to answer that question?
It's a hard one to answer. I'm honest and we look at leadership coaches, it's a hard thing to describe, but I would probably sum it up in, I unlock people's potential. I feel like I help heal or ⁓ let me say that again. What's the word that goes with culture? It starts with an E. Evolve? No. Unleash?
Unleash Performance Unlock Potential
Okay, doesn't matter. I really work with people, teams, because we start with individuals and I unlock their potential and I unleash their performance. It isn't a fixing. I'm not a doctor coming in to fix something that's broken. I really want to come into people in teams and enhance how they live and give them everything that they need to be the best version of themselves or find the best version.
if you're not at that. Yeah, that's so good. Yeah, I mean, I've been in ministry spaces primarily for the better part of 30 years and have led in those spaces for more than 20. And this feels like a different season for me. And I was excited about the opportunity to host this with you because there's just something about age that brings wisdom with it if we'll let it. And so it feels like
You know, we're not by any stretch saying, we're so wise and knowledgeable and you should follow us. But we do have some lived experience in the trenches of this that we'll be talking about. ⁓ You know, when you say that makes me think about wisdom. Today, we think about the younger generation and I want the knowledge of the younger generation. They have the technology out the wazoo. They're smart when it comes to that. There is something to say about living life.
and the wisdom that comes with it and the maturity to say that was broken then and I've worked really hard to get here now. That's probably the hard thing about me doing this leadership podcast is because I'm putting myself out there for those who have known me to go really she's going to speak on leadership because listen I've been a horrible employee. Same. I've been a great employee. Same. I've had horrible leaders. I've had fantastic leaders. So I don't
I don't pretend to be perfect at this. I'm just willing to say that I've learned what breaks, how it breaks, and when something in an organization or a team or a family could fall apart, how do we just nurture it back into health? You know, we say a lot when we coach other people, we are guides, we are not God. So we are not setting ourselves up as God or up as the experts in all things, but
there's something so important about a guide and often in coaching, we use the analogy of a Sherpa. So unpack that a little bit for people and why we identify with a Sherpa. Yeah, I love that you said that because one of my core values is like, I'm a guide, not God. ⁓ You know, I love living by that. The Sherpa, really, if you don't know much about the Sherpa, they're the person who helps people get up a climber up Mount Everest.
One of the content suppliers that we partner with is called Giant Worldwide and they power ⁓ my content and they did an interview with several Sherpas in... Let me back that up. I'm gonna start over. You know, when you think about it, a Sherpa, I really believe is one of the best examples of a leader. People will say...
different people in history, politicians, maybe thought leaders. But when you look at the Sherpa, if you don't know much about them, they help people get up, climb Mount Everest. And we work alongside and empowered by giant worldwide content. And when the co-founders, Jeremy and Steve interviewed Sherpas, one thing to know is that's their last name. And they are a people group. They were born at 14,000 feet. And so they're predispositioned to
climb that mountain. already acclimated. cannot imagine climbing it. No, I would never climb it. will. That is one thing you can mark your words. I will not do. But the Sherpa, it's when you ask the Sherpa, how many times have you summited Mount Everest? They really don't know. But having been interviewed, one of the guys pulled his belt off and there were 17 notches in his belt. And that's how many people he got up the mountain. So when you think about a Sherpa, they're not only a performer.
but they also have to lead performers. So they have to perform up that mountain to get up there. They have to have all the tools. They have to have really gotten to know me. Masi's got great strong legs, but she has zero strength in her arms. And so the Sherpa really, I love looking at leaders saying, you have to perform your daily function as a CEO or a C-suite in some position, but you've also got to lead everyone else doing the thing that you do.
And so looking at the Sherpa and understanding, you got to acclimate, you got to understand the weather in your organization, you have to understand the climate, you have to understand where are the cracks that you might need a ladder to walk across, a ladder to climb up something, do you need hooks, do you need ropes? When your team enters in or your people enter in, are you a Sherpa? Do you study those people to understand how do I equip them?
while I'm still running this organization. And it's not just the function of all the things that need to get done, but do I have such a knowledge of my people that I'm aware when one is struggling, when we need to slow our pace, when we need to up our pace, because now we're all bored. Yeah, that's so good. Or do we need to pause someone? Like the Sherpa will have some of the people he might be taking up the mountain need to stay at Camp 1 or go back down to base camp and reacclimate and come back up.
they're constantly having to measure where each person is and really as leaders, oftentimes we're performers ⁓ or we become the leaders of performers and stop thinking about, am I helping the performer? We got to do both. Yeah, that's so good. Let's talk about a word we're going to say a lot throughout this podcast, which is transformation. Yes. Now we are in an age where lots of people maybe use that word.
But what do you think sets it apart from words like education or inspiration or motivation, all the other-ations? What makes transformation so profound and why do you use that instead of those other words? Yeah, that's a great question, especially since you and I have been in an event world before and we've attended a gajillion conferences and read all the books. I think education, reading books, having knowledge is awesome.
When you think about inspiration, it's probably the innovation of our future. And you think about motivation, it can get you to the place where you want to. But none of it has behavior tied to it. And when I look at transformation, something has to have moved. I mean, think about a transformer kids used to play with. They had to move the arms or shift things around. it's one thing to be in a moment, and that's a moment.
A conference is a moment in time. It's an event. It's an experience. designed to inspire and motivate. Do all that. But you go to a conference, three people from your organization go out to Vegas and they stay in the five-star hotel and get all the fine dining and they hear all the information. They come back with three bullet points and they sit down at the Monday morning meeting and they're, y'all need to do this and this and this. And then tomorrow's emails come in and no one really remembers the conference and everybody that didn't get to go.
Morale's kind of fresh. Their morale might be a little bit down. There might be some jealousy. There might be some excitement. You've spent tens of thousands of dollars. When transformation is an ongoing process that you have to maintain. Once you transform, you don't just transform and stay forever. You've got to continue to work at transformation. So good.
Why do you think people love consuming leadership content? Because, I mean, that's a billion dollar industry. Everybody's writing about leadership. Everybody's doing a podcast on leadership. Why do we love consuming the content, but then rarely see real change, real transformation? Well, I mean, I have to just think about myself. I love the idea of going to exercise. I love the idea.
of having a personal trainer. But sometimes, or all the time, I don't like the work it takes to stick with it. So having read a book, I think, gives us a false sense that we know, but without an action, what's knowledge with no action? Awareness with no action is just knowledge. You just put it on a shelf. So I think that makes people feel better.
I believe that leaders desire for transformation, but don't know how to get there. Yeah, they're just not equipped. So we're consumers. We're just consumption, right? We just take and take and take. But that's like going and buying all the groceries and never making the cake. Yeah, so good. What do you say to the leader who feels like they have tried literally everything? They've read every book. They can
They know their number, their color, their letters, their whatevers, the birds, the whatever, the leadership test they took, but they still feel stuck. Yeah, it's real. And you're not alone. mean, each leader needs to understand that is so common. And most often the pain points that leaders have are consistent. I don't care what your widget is. I don't care if you're making donuts.
I don't care if you're an accountant or if you're a lawyer or if you're a teacher or you're sitting, I mean, some of my clients, their hospitality, their distributors and manufacturers, it doesn't matter. The thing is is stuck comes because most often there's not a simple, scalable, sustainable product that looks at leadership development. We have all the HR tools. We know the employee benefits. We understand how to hire, how to fire.
onboarding. 90 day reviews. Yes. The tasks and that's what HR used to be and still is. But now when you look at your human assets as your greatest value in your organization and you look at a digital age that really is losing the relationship, we need to put a relational intelligence age next to the digital age.
You look at that and realize you have to develop people. It's not train the task. It's how to develop wisdom because most people go to seminary to be a pastor. They go to the medical school to be a doctor. You go to the VOTEC school to be the electrician. But rarely in that moment alongside do they teach you how to lead people. And every person is different. I see that so.
abundantly in ministry spaces. And I think, I don't know if disadvantage is the right word, but it's the one I want to use, it sometimes feels like ministry leaders are at a disadvantage because we kind of slapped Jesus and the Bible across everything and assumed that that should fully equip us to know how to lead people well without being trained how to first of all know ourselves and lead ourselves, then to know people and lead people.
But we're like, but I should know how to do all that because I love God. It's like, it's still lacking in when you are leading other people, you're not, as you said, leading them to do a task before you're getting to know and understand how to lead them well. That's so good. Well, and you think about your question of like, why a podcast? And there's so many books. And whether you believe the same thing I believe or not, at the end of the day, if you study
the man called Jesus, 2000 years ago, we're still talking about him. And he multiplied his thoughts, his leadership, his ideas, his story, through 12 people. So when we look at leadership, that's probably why I get so frustrated with everyone wanting to be the next thought leader or the next cliche thing. It seems as though we're repeating a lot of what he did.
⁓ and forming it into our own way. Or we hear a great, let's talk about all the great leadership people. You've got the Lindsay Ones, you've got Andy Stanley, you've got John Maxwell, I can name them all. And it's an iteration of all the things they might have said. So I love the thought of us talking about leadership development, not from like concepts of what are new, but looking at what was and has been and has proven to work.
well over 2,000 years and looking at how do we take that and make it applicable. Yeah, that's good. ⁓ One of the reasons I love working with you is that you have such sticky analogies. You're very analogous in how you talk. Yeah. And it's helpful, especially for people who learn most through what they see and what they experience. So let's talk about architecture. OK.
⁓ because you have kind of broken down the process of developing people by architectural concepts. So talk a little bit about that. We don't have to dive into every one of them because we're gonna get to them all, but how do you think about that and how do you think about it? And let's just say building a house. How does that work in terms of how you develop people?
Well, it's interesting because my first job out of college, I was a risk management insurance major, was I was a claims adjuster for State Farm. And so at 22 years old, I found myself one year later down in Hurricane Andrew and I had to basically stick build houses on paper because there were no houses down there left after the hurricane. And so there had to be a blueprint. You know, I had to understand what was the foot...
of this house. And I often think about blueprints and leadership people thought process of leadership development is that assessment. It's, we're the blank company. I mean, I'll say them all because they're great. We're the Enneagram company or we're the disc or the strengths or Myers-Briggs or Five Voices or, you know, working genius. Name the assessment. They're out there. That's just the blueprint. You can have a blueprint and never build. It's not a house.
Then you think about the next step is to get all of the materials and to build the foundation, have the studs put up and the roof and put the drywall in. And that's the next phase of going from an assessment to how do I lean in and actually build this organization? Then you look at design. How do I make this culture ours? You know, we're looking at what's the pain? Are we doing wallpaper? All the pretty things. And then finally,
I think about when you're building a house, Do we have an unfinished basement? Do we have an unfinished attic? Could we add on to the house in the future? So I like looking at leadership for people to realize you've got to go through all those steps and continue to go through them because having only the blueprint, having only the material, having all the paint and the decor and having
the option of land actually doesn't put anything into place. That's good. I mean, it's like me carrying a roll of blueprints under my arms and going, I'm going to build a house. I'm going to build a house. I'm going to build a house. I'm going to be a great leader. I'm going to be a great leader. I'm going to be a great leader. But if I never put hammer to nail, nothing's going to be happening. Or I'm a three bedroom, bath on a ranch. I'm a barn with a gambrel roof or I'm a mansion on Malibu doesn't give you the mansion in Malibu or the barn.
That's like saying, I'm a connector creative pioneer, but understanding what that means and how do I show up my best or when triggered, how do I realize what triggers me and handle myself differently? Knowing I'm a connector creative pioneer does nothing for me if I don't know how to actually implement things to help me be the best version of myself so that people on the other side of me know that I know what it looks like.
I want to give people a little preview of what's coming in the next episode and we're going to use another analogy. There will be so many analogies. Well, and the reason I do that, just so that people know, is I do see visuals. I, because I'm an experiential learner, I do better experiencing something, putting together an Ikea
piece of furniture with someone, I can put the rest of them together all day long by myself. Because you've seen it. I've seen it and I've experienced it. So the same thing for me with analogies. Often I'll just get a quick picture and think, oh my gosh, that breaks down completely. Let me compare it to that so that you can kind of see where I'm coming from with a concept. Yeah, that's good. It helps people. You basically are drawing pictures for people to see. next episode, we're going to talk about the greenhouse.
specifically as it relates to people. So don't give away the whole thing. We don't have to dive deep right now. But what is the greenhouse analogy as it relates to developing people? Yeah, it's so funny because I've got a whole thing going on in my garden outside right now as we speak. But I think about the greenhouse as culture. Culture is such a buzzword. People sometimes can think that's ping pong tables in your offices or
the co-working space or how your office is no longer metal desks and cubicles. And that's really not culture. That's actually the greenhouse. And the greenhouse has been built as an organization, there's the analogy, to house the best environment for everything inside of it to thrive. So I want to spend time explaining to leaders really what is true culture.
What's unique to your culture and what do you have to put into place to make sure that everything, everybody inside your organization is a thriving plant? Ooh, that's good. And obviously I already know the content and so I'm excited about that because I really do think it's gonna help people think about people development in a deep way. And in a, ⁓ that makes so much sense. Why have I never thought of that way?
So I think it's a great analogy. We've been talking about transformation. How do you know when someone's ready for transformation? what do they need to be bringing to the table in order to be ready for transformation? Well, you have to have want. You have to want to show up. You can't be a leader of yourself or leader of others and say, hey, go fix all them. That's what a lot of my clients, that's how they come to me.
Can you get my team aligned and just get them to execute more? Well, there's a lot in front of that. We'll unpack that later with the flywheel, but you have to want it. You have to own that you're not really sure what it looks like to be on the other side of yourself. Number two, you gotta have the time. This isn't a one and done. I'm not a quick fixer. You can't go to the gym and work out once and expect to be ripped. Even if you work out for hours. Hours, and guess what?
Mr. America and heavy, you you think about athletes, bless them, they have so much money and they go and spend their NFL, their professional life. And some of them, after they stop working out, stop doing two a days, their bodies change and they go back to a different body style. Same thing. It is a constant work. So you got to have time. And then ultimately,
You've got to money. If you need a coach just like I know, I really want transformation. And the older I get, the more I realize I need to have strength. I need to be willing to that or invest in that personal trainer that will know me, my body, the history of my body, and how to get me healthy. Same thing for a leader. You've got to want to do it yourself, lead your team to do it, have the time, and put the investment into it.
And you know, we believe leaders go first. And so would you be willing to just vulnerably share when your, have to experience transformation moment came that led you on this journey in the first place? Leaders define culture and well, one thing when I started on this journey, COVID happened. So I had the luxury of unemployment and the humility to walk into it.
And I realized that I was consistently having issues with different leaders and not issues. There was a common denominator. And often I wanted to say, well, that person, she did so and so, or he did such and such. And when I started reflecting in 2020 on myself and I looked back over going, you know what? I am 50 years old.
What do you want from me right now? What is my next thing? I was scared that I didn't have time. I was like, you have the rest of your life. So I looked at it and thought, story map yourself. And I did. And I story mapped everything. And when I looked at every one of my jobs, and I am a non-linear career person, that's a whole nother story for a different time, I was the common denominator. And it didn't mean that my leaders weren't broken. They were.
because they triggered me, they didn't lead me how I needed to be led, they led how they would lead. But the common denominator was me. And I thought if I want to be the best version of myself, prior to 2020, I actually worked for a great person. And I remember thinking you have to show up as a better employee for him. And I started showing up the way I knew he wanted me to show up, which was logical, irrational.
impersonal decision maker. And I'm a feeler. I'm a people and at the core values, that's how I make decisions. But when I started showing up the way he needed me to show up, we had a better relationship, but I was still dying on the vine because it wasn't necessarily completely reciprocated back. So that made me really start the journey of saying, you may not be worthy of this. You may not have all the best accolades.
you certainly have had the experience to help someone else maybe avoid the journey I did for 30 years of not being the best version of myself and not knowing what to do with the not so great version of others. Yeah, I would say mine is similar in that I mean, I'm the common denominator in all the leadership challenges I've had. But I had a great leader, her name was Christy and
She, at one point after a meeting, said to me, hey Shannon, can I reflect back to you something that you said, but how it was received in the room? And she was so gracious, but she said, ⁓ when you said this, you meant X, but everybody felt Y. Wow.
And she was able to articulate in a way that I could receive something difficult to hear, but she was such a good leader to me that I realized I want to know all the ways that I say something and mean something and intent doesn't match impact. And so that was what sent me on this journey as well. And so just to reiterate what we said at the top,
We are not coming in here as people who've done it all right. In fact, most of our experience has been painful. ⁓ I shouldn't say most. A lot of painful experiences have led to this, but we believe anything can be redeemed in that sense. Well, pain and promise can exist at the exact same time. And you think about... ⁓
on you just what did we talk about right before I had something I wanted to say I forgot I lost it
What do we just? Christie, she's ⁓ intent and impact. You know, we live most often by the golden rule doing to others. As you would have them do unto you. And you asked me originally, like, what led me to this place? And I had a dear, I have a dear friend, Susanna. I remember she said to me one time when I was frustrated and I was like, why, why do you
Why do you ask me those things? She said, because I know you're going to have a way that you want it done, so I just let you do it that way. And so I just stopped having an opinion and I thought, I don't want to be that friend. What is that like to be on the other side of me? And that was years ago before I had any of this in me. Now, thinking about that, thinking about leadership, it's more of the platinum rule.
do unto others as they want done unto them. A lot of leaders, lot of individuals, families, ⁓ teams, organizations, communities, don't focus on doing to others as they would want done unto them. And when we start thinking that, what you just said, you don't show up, speak, Chrissy didn't speak to you the way she necessarily wanted to speak.
She thought, how is Shannon going to receive this? How do I encourage her as well as give her an opportunity of growth? That's what leadership is, is really looking, how do I lead people where they need to be led? But you've got to know who they are. Yeah, so good. ⁓ So what we're not going to do on this podcast is corporate.
buzzwords and shallow sound bites. We're also not going to leader shame. We're not gonna get on here and air all our dirty laundry of everything that's ever happened to us. Like that just does not benefit the whole. ⁓ But we are gonna call things what they are. We're gonna laugh at ourselves and we're gonna be self-deprecating while being honoring of others. We're gonna tell the truth and hopefully help guide people forward. ⁓
If people listen long enough, would it be fair to say that we want them to have moments where they feel seen, but we also want them to have moments where they feel sharpened? Yes. I love the word. That's another one of my core values, which is hone the edges. When you think about honing, some people think that's to sharpen only, but it's actually to sharpen soft edges or on soft edges to sharpen them both directions. And so when you
look at that, you have to think about, I lost my train of thought. What was your question?
So would you say that it's your hope that if people listen long enough to this, they will have moments where they're like, ⁓ I feel so seen. Nobody's ever put language around that before, but also that they feel sharpened. Yes. I would say I want them to feel sharpened. I want them to feel seen. I want them to say, my goodness, she's like reading my journal and my diary. I also want those that are sharp.
to say, I need to soften there. That's what my spouse needs. Or, wow, that's what my salesperson needs. So I want everyone to hear like I've read your mail, but also to have a hope that whichever direction you need to go in honing your edges, whether it's honing to sharpen or honing to soften, that you're willing to step into it. So good.
⁓ If someone's feeling that spark, even just in this initial conversation of like, okay, I need this, like what is the next best thing that they can do? The next best thing for anyone to do is reach out and have a conversation. That might be scary. I do love to talk and I like communication. I'm a connector, so that makes it easy for me. If going that far and that quick is too fast to have a conversation, you can read more about
what I do on the website, you can follow me on social media. When you choose to have transformation, it's a quick conversation, 30 minutes to understand where you're at and what you want. want to know... And what your pain points are. Yes, I want to know your pain points. What problems have they led to? What are really the gaps? Why can't you fix your turnover problem? Why is it that there is like...
corporate toxicity and gossip and drama happening. Why do you feel like you're in so many meetings and you're getting nothing done? Why is it that you hand things off to your team and then you have to pick them back up? Listen, you're probably all saying, my gosh, she's reading my mail. It's because every leadership problem is pretty consistent across the board. Then I want to set up some goals to look at it and say, what solution can we put in place that meets your needs?
People are like, what's your thing in the box? What's your 90 day plan? There can be all those things. But what I believe sets me apart is listening to your particular situation and understanding what's the best greenhouse that you need me to help you build. Ooh, that sets us up good for the next episode. So that's all the time we've got for today. But we hope to just...
provide something, put something into the world that helps you feel encouraged as a leader, helps you feel hope as a leader. And I hope you'll join us again next week as we talk all about the greenhouse and what it looks like to develop people in that way. It's Masi.
Thank you for taking a leap on your first podcast. I thought you sounded perfectly natural. Thank you. Well, thank you for being my host because there's nobody I could do this with except you. So thank Well, it's my joy. It's my joy. And we will look forward to seeing you guys next time.